If team accomplishment didn't factor in

[Marchesk]

How would the top 10 look? Not everyone gets to play with a Shaq, a Magic, or 10 HOFers.

Possibly as important, not everyone gets to play for a Phil, a Red or a Spurs organization.

[dubeta]

It gets ranked by Career PER


so


#1-2 LeBron - Jordan tossup


#3 Shaq


#4 Robinson


etc

[Marchesk]

It gets ranked by Career PER


so


#1-2 LeBron - Jordan tossup


#3 Shaq


#4 Robinson


etc

Lebron hasn't hit the downside of his career yet, which will likely pull down that PER average. I prefer WS/48:

Kareem
Wilt
K. Malone

etc.

[feyki]

Lebron hasn't hit the downside of his career yet, which will likely pull down that PER average. I prefer WS/48:

Kareem
Wilt
K. Malone

etc.
WSs48 top 3 ; Jordan-Admiral-CP3 .

[T_L_P]

I don't think it would change. My top 10 is the list of players I'd take first in an all-time draft.

That said, it does get a little tricky because I put so much stock into Playoff performance. Naturally, more championships means more Playoff games, so I get to see a larger sample size.

Can't really do anything about it though. Garnett only got to play like 35 Playoff games in his prime years, and those 35 games weren't impressive enough for me to rank him as a top 10 player ever, so he isn't for me. :confusedshrug:

[Marchesk]

WSs48 top 3 ; Jordan-Admiral-CP3 .

Whoops, I meant WS. Whichever puts Wilt in the top 2.

[DonDadda59]

Whoops, I meant WS. Whichever puts Wilt in the top 2.

You slick motherf*cker :coleman:

[dubeta]

I don't think it would change. My top 10 is the list of players I'd take first in an all-time draft.

That said, it does get a little tricky because I put so much stock into Playoff performance. Naturally, more championships means more Playoff games, so I get to see a larger sample size.

Can't really do anything about it though. Garnett only got to play like 35 Playoff games in his prime years, and those 35 games weren't impressive enough for me to rank him as a top 10 player ever, so he isn't for me. :confusedshrug:

And you still rank Duncan top 5-6? :roll:


Have you seen how many times:


-Duncan lost with HCA?

- Got SWEPT with HCA?

-Lost in the 1st round? (2009-2011) (2015)?

- Averaged 40% in a finals series (2005)?

Lost to an 8th seed as the 1st seed (2011)?

:biggums:


Outside of 2003, Duncan has been underwhelming throughout his career (especially playoffs)

[feyki]

Whoops, I meant WS. Whichever puts Wilt in the top 2.
You must be yours list brother. Win shares good scale but can't calculate a lot of things.

[Marchesk]

You must be yours list brother. Win shares good scale but can't calculate a lot of things.

No one advanced stat can. Not even the almighty PER, (with all due respect to Chris Paul).

[feyki]

No one advanced stat can. Not even the almighty PER, (with all due respect to Chris Paul).
Yeah , it's true. Per is greatest laughable advanced stat of all time :D . Ball hog metric .

[dubeta]

PER X MVPS is probably the best overall statistic




It weeds out the CP3's and D-Wades who werent really that dominant (hence no MVPs)

[T_L_P]

And you still rank Duncan top 5-6? :roll:


Have you seen how many times:


-Duncan lost with HCA?

- Got SWEPT with HCA?

-Lost in the 1st round? (2009-2011) (2015)?

- Averaged 40% in a finals series (2005)?

Lost to an 8th seed as the 1st seed (2011)?

:biggums:


Outside of 2003, Duncan has been underwhelming throughout his career (especially playoffs)

Funny, going by your criteria (PER), Duncan is top 7, and really top 5 if you don't include Mikan (didn't play with a shot-clock) or Paul (is still young). :facepalm


And you're talking about shooting under 40% in a Finals? LeBron has done that twice. :oldlol:

Have you seen how many times LeBron has:

Lost Finals MVP to an opposing SF (2014, 2015)

Missed the Playoffs (2004, 2005)

Bitched out of a game because of dehydration

Shown micro ***** on live TV

Promised titles without delivering

[dubeta]

Funny, going by your criteria (PER), Duncan is top 7, and really top 5 if you don't include Mikan (didn't play with a shot-clock) or Paul (is still young). :facepalm


And you're talking about shooting under 40% in a Finals? LeBron has done that twice. :oldlol:

Have you seen how many times LeBron has:

Lost Finals MVP to an opposing SF (2014, 2015)

Missed the Playoffs (2004, 2005)

Bitched out of a game because of dehydration

Shown micro ***** on live TV

Promised titles without delivering


You're reaching hard with your points and you know it :roll:

Missing the playoffs while being a teenagers?

Losing to far superior teams??

..??

thats all you got? :oldlol:





Deep down, you know what I said about Duncan is 100% true, and its upsetting you since you yourself cant really explain to yourself Duncans flameouts

[T_L_P]

You're reaching hard with your points and you know it :roll:

Missing the playoffs while being a teenagers?

Losing to far superior teams??

..??

thats all you got? :oldlol:





Deep down, you know what I said about Duncan is 100% true, and its upsetting you since you yourself cant really explain to yourself Duncans flameouts

Top of the thread:

Top career PER is all that matters

Duncan has a top 7 PER, really top 5 if you don't include a milkman and Chris Paul.

Looks like you're backtracking.

How about LeBron's under 40% shooting and giving away Finals MVPs to guys he's supposed to be guarding? :oldlol:

Also, haven't you made a million threads about the East being the tougher conference?

[dubeta]

Top of the thread:

Top career PER is all that matters

Duncan has a top 7 PER, really top 5 if you don't include a milkman and Chris Paul.

Looks like you're backtracking.

How about LeBron's under 40% shooting and giving away Finals MVPs to guys he's supposed to be guarding? :oldlol:

Also, haven't you made a million threads about the East being the tougher conference?


http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/per_career.html


Its 13th but nice try :roll:

[Marchesk]

PER X MVPS is probably the best overall statistic

It weeds out the CP3's and D-Wades who werent really that dominant (hence no MVPs)

PER X MVPS X (WS/48 + [TS% - TOV%]) / (ORTG + DRTG + PTS_PER_100_POS) * (USG% + FMVP_POS_OPP_TEAM%^2)

[feyki]

PER X MVPS X (WS/48 + [TS% - TOV%]) / (ORTG + DRTG + PTS_PER_100_POS) * (USG% + FMVP_POS_OPP_TEAM%^2)

http://nbatitlechase.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/andrew-wiggins-smiling.png

[kennethgriffin]

#1 Wilt
#2 Kareem
#3 Shaq
#4 Oscar
#5 Baylor


its amazing what logic can do to an all time ranking

its almost as if theres more to it than stats

[ShaqTwizzle]

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Shaq
4. Russell (maybe too high?)
5. Magic
6. Duncan
7. Hakeem
8. Lebron (will be higher in the future)
9. Bird
10. Wilt
11. Kobe

[kennethgriffin]

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Shaq
4. Russell (maybe too high?)
5. Magic
6. Duncan
7. Hakeem
8. Lebron (will be higher in the future)
9. Bird
10. Wilt
11. Kobe


lol wtf.. you actually think russell, magic, duncan, bird would be that high without their accomplishments?

:oldlol:

[ShaqTwizzle]

lol wtf.. you actually think russell, magic, duncan, bird would be that high without their accomplishments?

:oldlol:

Russ maybe not but he isn't easily judged.

Magic is maybe the offensive GOAT.

Duncan has great longevity, defense and pretty nice offense.
His career value is pretty high.

Bird is kinda overrated career wise but had a nasty Peak and he had amazing skill/intangibles/leadership.
Having him at #9 is lower then most I would think especially here.
Surprised that would bother you.

Who would you have over those guys?
Baylor was an inefficient chucker who lacked longevity.
He was pretty mediocre after the weak ultra fast paced early 60's.

Wilt was nice in the reg-season but his offensive stats in the playoffs aren't very impressive, he usually played bad in elimination series and he was by many accounts mentally weak.

Oscar... I dunno. Maybe you can justify a higher ranking for him here.

Who else?

[LoneyROY7]

OP, how can you continue to titillated by a player who's last game in the NBA was 40 years ago?

Are you that old, or are you just fascinated by grainy youtube clips?

[Marchesk]

OP, how can you continue to titillated by a player who's last game in the NBA was 40 years ago?

Are you that old, or are you just fascinated by grainy youtube clips?

Criticize him all you like for 2/6, no other player did what he did in the history of the game. But I have Jordan as GOAT, so ...

[dubeta]

no other player did what he did in the history of the game.

What? half his ppg from the regular season to the Finals?


Reduce his ppg every postseason of his career?


Check himself out of a Finals Game 7, just to cry to get back in once his replacement was actually outplaying him

[Im so nba'd out]

Big time kobe fan here. i wish this was the case.It would actually catapult kobe into the all time top 10.He would no longer have the stains of 3 backpackshaq rings like the 1st one where he averaged 12 ppg in the finals and big fella put up a whooping 40 ppg.Them Robin rings really just ruins any case he has to be in the same class as the goat MJ