Active shooter at an Oregon college?

[moaz]

Heard it in radio, but nothing on cnn webpage. Anyone from the area?

OK it is confirmed. RIP for the victims>

Just a small statistic to think about:

Between 1966 and 2012, there were 292 mass shootings worldwide, of these 90 in the United States.
The U.S. has 5% of the world's population, but 31% of all public mass shootings.

Mass shootings in this study:

Have four or more victims
Don't include gang killings
Killing that involve the death of multiple family members

[UK2K]

There was a shooter in a ND high school. Shot the principal then the ass principal tackled him.

How embarrassing for that kid.

[longhornfan1234]

Police: Preliminary reports indicate 10 killed, 20 others injured in shooting at Oregon's Umpqua Community College.





New[​IMG]CNN Breaking News ‏@cnnbrk 2m2 minutes ago
Police: Preliminary reports indicate 10 killed, 20 others injured in shooting at Oregon's Umpqua Community College. http://cnn.it/1iORuBk

[moaz]

Police: Preliminary reports indicate 10 killed, 20 others injured in shooting at Oregon's Umpqua Community College.

New[​IMG]CNN Breaking News ‏@cnnbrk 2m2 minutes ago
Police: Preliminary reports indicate 10 killed, 20 others injured in shooting at Oregon's Umpqua Community College. http://cnn.it/1iORuBk

wow that is bad. It wasn't even on their front page 5 min ago.

You have to do something about schools/colleges shootings down there.

[JohnnySic]

Damn, another? :facepalm

[imdaman99]

Dayum :eek:

At least 15 confirmed dead :(

[iamgine]

Will the shooter escape? It seems we never see a school shooter escape. Would be nice to see the first one. Hope he has an exit plan that isn't suicide. From the death toll this seems like a planned and calculated attack by a prepared individual, not just an emotional kid, so there'a a bigger chance he has prepared a way to disappear. Can't wait to see how this turns out.

[Vaniiiia]

I was just thinking the other day that's it been a while since there's been a mass killing that goes nation wide.

In on first page and RIP.

:banghead:

[BasedTom]

"shooter in custody"

They really let that happen? "woops i just murdered 10 people, let me just turn myself in to you officer"

If there's ever a time to use lethal force, I'd say that's a prime example

[UK2K]

Will the shooter escape? It seems we never see a school shooter escape. Would be nice to see the first one. Hope he has an exit plan that isn't suicide. From the death toll this seems like a planned and calculated attack by a prepared individual, not just an emotional kid, so there'a a bigger chance he has prepared a way to disappear. Can't wait to see how this turns out.

Because it was planned doesn't make it a good plan. If anyone was serious about mass murder, they wouldn't be using a gun.

[iamgine]

Because it was planned doesn't make it a good plan. If anyone was serious about mass murder, they wouldn't be using a gun.
I tend to agree, there are more effective ways.

[ISHGoat]

"shooter in custody"

They really let that happen? "woops i just murdered 10 people, let me just turn myself in to you officer"

If there's ever a time to use lethal force, I'd say that's a prime example

Agreed. Police should have just shot that ****er and saved some Americans' tax dollars.

[DonDadda59]

Dayum :eek:

At least 15 confirmed dead :(

Damn, that's a lot...

But nothing will change. We'll just wait on the next massacre.

[ISHGoat]

I hope there's at least one active shooter at any of the Oregon colleges, for their basketball teams' sake at least.

Too soon.

[4 Inches]

R.I.P to all the dead.

[StephHamann]

Probably that kid from the Shari's Berries commercial

[lil jahlil]

Horrible to see him succeed more than other college shooters.

[TripleA]

Heard it in radio, but nothing on cnn webpage. Anyone from the area?

It all over news here in Portland. It happened in southern Oregon so pretty far from Portland.

[BasedTom]

...this might be the shooter

https://archive.moe/r9k/thread/22785073/

[TheMan]

Wow, that's sad.

If we can't ban guns, let's ban white dudes from going to college. It'll cut the mass shootings at schools by 100%

[Rocketswin2013]

Wow, that's sad.

If we can't ban guns, let's ban white dudes from going to college. It'll cut the mass shootings at schools by 100%
:facepalm

[DonDadda59]

Wow, that's sad.

If we can't ban guns, let's ban white dudes from going to college. It'll cut the mass shootings at schools by 100%

Al Craqa strikes again.

Can't go to the movies, school, or church any more thanks to White terrorism.

But let's all freak out about ISIS and the Muslims. :facepalm

[TheMan]

:facepalm
Too soon? :confusedshrug:

[UK2K]

Wow, that's sad.

If we can't ban guns, let's ban white dudes from going to college. It'll cut the mass shootings at schools by 100%
Like we said on P1, there are much more effective ways of mass murder.

Guns just happen to be fun. Video games and all that.

[TheMan]

Like we said on P1, there are much more effective ways of mass murder.

Guns just happen to be fun. Video games and all that.
Forget guns, let's just not let white dudes go to anywhere a lot of people congregate :lol

You hear about a mass killing and you just know a white loser was behind it...like clockwork :facepalm

[longhornfan1234]

Dude posted something like "OK, it's going down tomorrow, if you are in college in the northwest stay home tomorrow" on 4 chan and then everyone else like cheered him on and said how he should do it, gave pointers and shit.



:biggums: :biggums:

[longhornfan1234]

http://boards.4chan.org/r9k/thread/22804991


http://boards.4chan.org/r9k/


These dudes on 4 Chan are scum.

[UK2K]

Link to the archived thread?
https://i.imgur.com/5KYSz7h.jpg

[UK2K]

http://boards.4chan.org/r9k/thread/22804991


http://boards.4chan.org/r9k/


These dudes on 4 Chan are scum.

Shit like this is why when Ahmed brings a clock that looks awfully like a bomb, people freak out.

Cause when you ignore the warning signs, bad shit happens.

Its the world we live in.

[DeuceWallaces]

Not cool.

[UK2K]

Forget guns, let's just not let white dudes go to anywhere a lot of people congregate :lol

You hear about a mass killing and you just know a white loser was behind it...like clockwork :facepalm

He was black dipshit.

That's why we cant have nice things.

[imdaman99]

He was black dipshit.

That's why we cant have nice things.
Why you falling for the race baiting? :biggums: Usually it's you doing it, yet you fall for it :facepalm

[Dbrog]

These are almost always not preventable and are always sad. Before people say, "buh buht gun laws!" Think of this, cops, personal defense, and criminals. Which of these gun users wouldn't be deterred by a law? RIP victims...****ing selfish asshole who did this.

[Vaniiiia]

Wow, that's sad.

If we can't ban guns, let's ban white dudes from going to college. It'll cut the mass shootings at schools by 100%
This has got to be one of the worst posts in the history of ISH. You are nothing but a failure.

[longhornfan1234]

http://i.imgur.com/F90JrJW.jpg


^


Full 4 chan thread



I hope these guys feel like shit.

[Sarcastic]

http://i.imgur.com/F90JrJW.jpg


^


Full 4 chan thread



I hope these guys feel like shit.

They should be prosecuted.

[~primetime~]

just awful...RIP

:(

[longhornfan1234]

They should be prosecuted.
Whoever that 3rd poster is, he knew exactly what was going to happen. He mentions hes 28, not going to a community college, and asked what city it will be in/near. The OP never mentioned if it was a community college, highschool, elementary, or a major university and this guy knew that it was community college. 4Chan has some fvcked up people on it. I don't even know what to think right now

[Dbrog]

http://i.imgur.com/F90JrJW.jpg


^


Full 4 chan thread



I hope these guys feel like shit.

:biggums: :biggums: :biggums:

WTF IS WRONG WITH THESE PEOPLE?! ****ing deepweb shit right there antisocial ****s.

[~primetime~]

odds shooter was taking SSRIs?

Medicated to Death: SSRIs and Mass Killings (https://www.corbettreport.com/medicated-to-death-ssris-and-mass-killings/)



It isn't a gun issue...we had guns in the 60s-70s-80s etc...there wasn't a mass shooting every year back then. UT shooting happened but that was about it. What has changed? SSRIs

[AlphaWolf24]

I'm shocked!


Over it!



Anyone know when beta Battlefront comes out?

[StephHamann]

http://i.imgur.com/AnpsBSJ.png

Damn :biggums: JameertheFEAR

[UK2K]

Why you falling for the race baiting? :biggums: Usually it's you doing it, yet you fall for it :facepalm
Cause he legitimately thought it was a white guy...

But didn't we all? :oldlol:

Just too good to pass up.

[UK2K]

odds shooter was taking SSRIs?

Medicated to Death: SSRIs and Mass Killings (https://www.corbettreport.com/medicated-to-death-ssris-and-mass-killings/)



It isn't a gun issue...we had guns in the 60s-70s-80s etc...there wasn't a mass shooting every year back then. UT shooting happened but that was about it. What has changed? SSRIs

We are, by far, the most medicated country on the planet, ever.

Too many people need pills to get through life instead of their daddies beating their whiney asses.

[TheMan]

This has got to be one of the worst posts in the history of ISH. You are nothing but a failure.
http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/782/020/fad.jpg

[~primetime~]

We are, by far, the most medicated country on the planet, ever.

Too many people need pills to get through life instead of their daddies beating their whiney asses.
yes...SSRI bottles even say things like "may cause suicidal thoughts"

It's been shown that all these school shooters are on them.

https://jeffreysterlingmd.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/antidepressantblackbox.jpg

[TheMan]

Cause he legitimately thought it was a white guy...

But didn't we all? :oldlol:

Just too good to pass up.
It hasn't been officially confirmed by the authorities so you ain't out of the woods yet. :coleman:

[9erempiree]

Is the shooter Muslim?

[TheMan]

I'm shocked!


Over it!



Anyone know when beta Battlefront comes out?
Battlefront or Battlefield?

[~primetime~]

It is a real shame that people's biggest concern here is the race of the shooter.

[BasedTom]

http://boards.4chan.org/r9k/thread/22804991


http://boards.4chan.org/r9k/


These dudes on 4 Chan are scum.
4chan is a huge internet community with multiple boards that are into their own thing...the same people that like anime aren't usually the same type of people discussing fashion or sports or origami

also it's an anonymous website, so unless the authorities contact the site owner (which they probably will) it'll be difficult to get IP addresses or whatever. a few famous people have posted on 4chan, Andrew WK and Deadmau5, who knows how many rappers have gone on the music board...I know for a fact that the guys from Avenged Sevenfold used to fck with it

and every once in a while you get things like this:

http://krautchan.net/files/1443730592001.jpg

[9erempiree]

It is a real shame that people's biggest concern here is the race of the shooter.

Nobody cares about his race.

I want to ask if he's Muslim because that can explain his beliefs and idea of the world.

[UK2K]

It is a real shame that people's biggest concern here is the race of the shooter.
Its not, it was a joke. Well, I was joking anyway.

But we all know everyone is waiting to put their own spin on it, depending on what websites and churches the shooter visited and what tv shows he watched and what flag he waves.

[UK2K]

4chan is a huge internet community with multiple boards that are into their own thing...the same people that like anime aren't usually the same type of people discussing fashion or sports or origami

also it's an anonymous website, so unless the authorities contact the site owner (which they probably will) it'll be difficult to get IP addresses or whatever. a few famous people have posted on 4chan, Andrew WK and Deadmau5, who knows how many rappers have gone on the music board...I know for a fact that the guys from Avenged Sevenfold used to fck with it

and every once in a while you get things like this:

http://krautchan.net/files/1443730592001.jpg

I dont know what any of that shit means.

[Fudge]

All white people do is commit mass shootings and post on 4chan.

[9erempiree]

Was this white guy a Muslim?

[Fudge]

http://libertynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Screen-Shot-2015-10-01-at-3.17.58-PM-750x732.png

Pic of the suspected shooter.

Jesus Christ. Why is he so ugly? And of course he's caucasian.

[moaz]

Nobody cares about his race.

I want to ask if he's Muslim because that can explain his beliefs and idea of the world.

The words you wanted to use is confirm my opinion of his

But I like your post, cause following your twisted logic, the nice christian kids who committed 99% of all mass shootings in the US are the best examples to explain their (christian) beliefs and idea of the world. :applause: :applause: :applause:

[BasedTom]

I dont know what any of that shit means.
the taylor swift stuff is just circumstancial stuff

my point is that it isn't any more of a "terrorist hotbed" than ISH is, though the anonymity aspect makes it easier for people to say terrible shit. blaming the site itself is like blaming facebook or twitter every time a criminal has an account there

another guy on the weapons board (again, another separate community than the one the shooter was posting in) is claiming to be a former security guard at the college:

https://i.4cdn.org/k/1443727962027.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/QatBM3R.png

[UK2K]

the taylor swift stuff is just circumstancial stuff

my point is that it isn't any more of a "terrorist hotbed" than ISH is, though the anonymity aspect makes it easier for people to say terrible shit. blaming the site itself is like blaming facebook or twitter every time a criminal has an account there

another guy on the weapons board (again, another separate community than the one the shooter was posting in) is claiming to be a former security guard at the college:

https://i.4cdn.org/k/1443727962027.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/QatBM3R.png

Every college (except a few in Texas) are soft targets.

http://truthaboutguns-zippykid.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Pope-Francis-and-friends-courtesy-marymagdelan.blogspot.com_.jpg

The Pope. Anti-gun. How many guns do you think are within 20 feet of him? Do as I say, not as I do.

[AlphaWolf24]

Battlefront or Battlefield?


Star Wars Battlefront ( beta version).....the new sh!t.

I think it may be available on the 7th or 8th?.....not sure.

http://starwars.ea.com/starwars/battlefront/news/the-star-wars-battlefront-beta-is-coming-october-8th


may just wait for the "Alpha" to drop......juscuz...( that's how I roll)

[BasedTom]

Every college (except a few in Texas) are soft targets.

http://truthaboutguns-zippykid.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Pope-Francis-and-friends-courtesy-marymagdelan.blogspot.com_.jpg

The Pope. Anti-gun. How many guns do you think are within 20 feet of him? Do as I say, not as I do.
don't think it's probably fair to compare the situation in Europe with the USA. We already have guns everywhere so isn't anywhere near as simple as just taking them away and then we can be sure the criminals won't have access to them; if anything it has the chance of backfiring horribly.

then you have countries (Israel comes to mind) where every place, every venue and street is filled with people openly armed...honestly not sure if I'd feel exactly safe there either.

[AlphaWolf24]

http://libertynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Screen-Shot-2015-10-01-at-3.17.58-PM-750x732.png

Pic of the suspected shooter.

Jesus Christ. Why is he so ugly? And of course he's caucasian.


Cot Dam that's F'ed up lookin white dude....

dat Fivehead

[TheMan]

Every college (except a few in Texas) are soft targets.

http://truthaboutguns-zippykid.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Pope-Francis-and-friends-courtesy-marymagdelan.blogspot.com_.jpg

The Pope. Anti-gun. How many guns do you think are within 20 feet of him? Do as I say, not as I do.
The pope himself isn't packing.

I fail to see the hypocrisy

[BasedTom]

pretty sure that guy's not the shooter

also wtf was with the press conference just now? "I don't know, I don't know, can't confirm"

could have just said "He's dead" and have been done with it

[Mike Armstrong]

R.I.P to all the dead.
Yarp.

[AlphaWolf24]

There's no defending the immoral shit that happens on 4chan. Them cheering on murders, shooters, psychopaths, and racists is nowhere comparable to ISH.


there is absolutely a reason to defend freedom of thought or speech on a dam internet forum...

who cares what someone " cheers on about" ???

It's up to the Moderators or the Forum.....if they allow it then you should say whatever the F@ck you want.

[~primetime~]

there is absolutely a reason to defend freedom of thought or speech on a dam internet forum...

who cares what someone " cheers on about" ???

It's up to the Moderators or the Forum.....if they allow it then you should say whatever the F@ck you want.
yep they didn't cause anyone to shoot anyone...only one to blame is the shooter

[BurningHammer]

I dont know what any of that shit means.
Swift has been lurking 4chan, indirectly revealed herself.

[~primetime~]

shooting suspect confirmed dead

[CavaliersFTW]

http://libertynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Screen-Shot-2015-10-01-at-3.17.58-PM-750x732.png

Pic of the suspected shooter.

Jesus Christ. Why is he so ugly? And of course he's caucasian.
Cousin Eddie looking white guy

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/41/b9/11/41b9115fffaa749acbab66a19c4f7bb8.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/0b/f4/3d/0bf43d6813a189121d717741f897401e.jpg

[BurningHammer]

Poor Hiro. He just bought 4chan and within few days he is in trouble.

[BasedTom]

CNN namedropping "beta males"

[~primetime~]

^^^ not confirmed it is him, 4chan just claims it is...so it probably is

[BurningHammer]

Pepe the Feel Bad Man frog is getting an instant fame. :oldlol:

[GIF REACTION]

it's always a white person. Always a white male.

****ing creeps.

[~primetime~]

it's always a white person. Always a white male.

****ing creeps.
http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.2337866!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_198/article-shooter5-0826.jpg

[fiddy]

it's always a white person. Always a white male.

****ing creeps.
You have previously posted a picture of yourself dum dum

[Lebron23]

RIP to the Casualties. Did they revealed the identity of the shooter??

[~primetime~]

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/oI9dCQzYoqI/hqdefault.jpg

asian in the mix too

[GIF REACTION]

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.2337866!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_198/article-shooter5-0826.jpg
It's the white in him

Just look at him

Creme skin lookin brother

[BasedTom]

it's always a white person. Always a white male.

****ing creeps.
earlier they were saying his name was "Deshawn"

[AlphaWolf24]

CNN namedropping "beta males"


lol...

I read that the shooter is following along in the " Beta Male uprising"...just like Elliot Marshal's manifesto...

SMH...the most Beta thing anyone can do is spray and pray a elementary school or college....

dam pinky dic beta males....SMDH

[Trollsmasher]

dumb frogposter

[Xoush]

I just do not understand how someone can encourage such a horrific act AND give advice on how to kill more people.

Wtf is wrong with these nolifers, were they all molested or what?!


I just dont get it.

[UK2K]

I just do not understand how someone can encourage such a horrific act AND give advice on how to kill more people.

Wtf is wrong with these nolifers, were they all molested or what?!


I just dont get it.

It's not real to them. Like the Columbine shooters, its not real, its a game in their minds.

[ThePhantomCreep]

I just do not understand how someone can encourage such a horrific act AND give advice on how to kill more people.

Wtf is wrong with these nolifers, were they all molested or what?!


I just dont get it.

The mind of a sociopath is a truly scary thing...

[Nanners]

Not that it matters, but I would be shocked if the shooter was not a white person. The Roseburg area of Oregon is very rural and almost 100% white. There sure as shit arent any muslims or black people living around there.

[dazzer87]

Not that it matters, but I would be shocked if the shooter was not a white person. The Roseburg area of Oregon is very rural and almost 100% white. There sure as shit arent any muslims or black people living around there.
and all top of that all the girls ive seen on tv look like heavy weight hitters.....All over 250

[Nanners]

and all top of that all the girls ive seen on tv look like heavy weight hitters.....All over 250

yep

fat white rednecks.... welcome to roseburg or

[DonDadda59]

http://libertynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Screen-Shot-2015-10-01-at-3.17.58-PM-750x732.png

Pic of the suspected shooter.

Looks like the love child of Peyton Manning and Tweety Bird.


Jesus Christ. Why is he so ugly? And of course he's caucasian.

Shocking.


Was this white guy a Muslim?

Al Craqa terrorists are strictly Christian.

[Real Men Wear Green]

If everyone is going to insist on focusing on the extremely unimportant issue of what the shooter's race was why not just wait for the facts to come out? Because they will, and it won't even be a long wait.

[BasedTom]

If everyone is going to insist on focusing on the extremely unimportant issue of what the shooter's race was why not just wait for the facts to come out? Because they will, and it won't even be a long wait.
Honestly, it's been nearly a whole day and we still know practically nothing about him besides being a male in his 20s- which isn't exactly earth shattering stuff

I'm not going to say "they're hiding something" (maybe they're withholding details until they're 100% ready to close it up) but it's still odd since it probably wouldn't be too difficult for the police or witnesses to say "White bald male, age 28

[Real Men Wear Green]

Honestly, it's been nearly a whole day and we still know practically nothing about him besides being a male in his 20s- which isn't exactly earth shattering stuff

I'm not going to say "they're hiding something" (maybe they're withholding details until they're 100% ready to close it up) but it's still odd since it probably wouldn't be too difficult for the police or witnesses to say "White bald male, age 28
He was shot to death by cops, right? So they have the body. Sometime soon, maybe at a press conference tomorrow or Monday if they're a little slow and don't do weekends, feel the need to notify the families of the bereaved first, etc., they'll release the guy's identity and one side of our disgusting race war can feel like they've won this round. A bunch of innocent people got shot dead but at least someone of your race that is your cousin a thousand times removed didn't do it, it was that other race that of course is producing all of the violently insane. Yay.

[warriorfan]

we better be nice to budaddii, he is one meltdown away from pulling shit like this

[TheMan]

UK2K actually believed the shooter wasn't white. :yaohappy:

On MSNBC, a witness described the shooter as a white male.

[CavaliersFTW]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMQK2sVxf2A

Some 4chan user made this :biggums:

WTF is with those cretons

[DonDadda59]

we better be nice to budaddii, he is one meltdown away from pulling shit like this

For real, he threatened to shoot and kill a poster and his family in his last epic meltdown.

If I were a snitch, I'd definitely inform the FBI.

[robert de niro]

this is so ****ed up :biggums:

[Real Men Wear Green]

On MSNBC, a witness described the shooter as a white male.
Maybe it was but MSNBC's agenda wants crazy shooters to all be KK Confederate survivalist nutjobs. On the flip side FOX News wants it to be a gold-toothed shirtless black male that can't be bothered to pull his pants over his ass. Our news media is actually quite shitty.

[TripleA]

Roseburg, Oregon is less than 1 percent black I doubt he was black.

[BasedTom]

Roseburg, Oregon is less than 1 percent black I doubt he was black.
earlier they mentioned that he moved from Seattle, and before that originally from the Midwest

so it IS a possibility, but white seems to be the most likely case

[rezznor]

:biggums: :biggums: :biggums:

WTF IS WRONG WITH THESE PEOPLE?! ****ing deepweb shit right there antisocial ****s.
they are fvcking celebrating after it happened.


fvcking beta scum who hate the world because they've never been laid.

[KNOW1EDGE]

Ish is a racist sh1thole

Somebody post that pic of simon with the funny quotes under it. Warriorfan I think you got em?

[warriorfan]

Ish is a racist sh1thole

Somebody post that pic of simon with the funny quotes under it. Warriorfan I think you got em?

I wanted to but I'm on the phone. I think so nba'd got that

[longhornfan1234]

Shooter's Youtube page.



https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCn1fwrq_QO0WkzBjdIM-8uQ

[KevinNYC]

earlier they mentioned that he moved from Seattle, and before that originally from the Midwest

so it IS a possibility, but white seems to be the most likely case


Was that picture of the white dude several pages back not him?

[CavaliersFTW]

Shooter's Youtube page.



https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCn1fwrq_QO0WkzBjdIM-8uQ
*alleged*

This has yet to be officially confirmed.

4chan is throwing that guy under the bus... but he could just be their regular punching bag.

[KNOW1EDGE]

Was that picture of the white dude several pages back not him?

No.

They have not confirmed who the shooter is, or if he is alive or dead.

The local sheriff has confirmed 10 dead and 7 injured (3 of which are in critical condition).

News conference set for 7:15pm local time where sheriff will address the public.

[Bigsmoke]

The killer

http://i1072.photobucket.com/albums/w364/MATW88/IMG_20151001_202123_zpsziwe53ok.jpg (http://s1072.photobucket.com/user/MATW88/media/IMG_20151001_202123_zpsziwe53ok.jpg.html)

[longhornfan1234]

https://myspace.com/344765151/photos

[longhornfan1234]

He looks like a mulatto.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQRn1nSU8AA7c7b.png:large

[Derka]

http://i.imgur.com/F90JrJW.jpg

Full 4 chan thread

I hope these guys feel like shit.
What I find distressing is the language in that thread that is similar to a lot of what the usual shitheads around here throw around. Cuck, beta, etc. we have those same pieces of shit floating around here on multiple alts all the damn time.

[warriorfan]

For real, he threatened to shoot and kill a poster and his family in his last epic meltdown.

If I were a snitch, I'd definitely inform the FBI.

Jeff needs to watch that shit or ish is gonna be on the news when budaddii goes bad

[bluechox2]

what else is new...kids need to arm themselves in school

[SugarHill]

of course the killer is black
:whatever:

[BasedTom]

5 foot 9?

well we've found a motive

[iamgine]

What's the total death toll? Does he beat V-tech shooter?

[Kungfro]

CNN namedropping "beta males"
4chan also managed to convince everyone for several hours that "eggman" was the suspect and that an extremely vague post on /r9k/ about something happening in the Northwest was connected to this, which is likely just a coincidence. Leave it to the media to just run with anything they can find instead of waiting for any actual evidence to surface.

[Megabox!]

What I find distressing is the language in that thread that is similar to a lot of what the usual shitheads around here throw around. Cuck, beta, etc. we have those same pieces of shit floating around here on multiple alts all the damn time.
This. I mean ISH can be pretty shitty most of the time and there's a lot of shitty trolling going around but it's 100 times better than 4Chan. Reading through that thread was just down right despicable. RIP to those who lost their lives today

[BlakFrankWhite]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQRn1nSU8AA7c7b.png:large

[SCREWstonRockets]

it says his political views are conservative republican. interesting...

[~primetime~]

Witness says he attacked Christians, he told everyone to get down, only stand up if you are Christian, then he killed the Christians.

[9erempiree]

Witness says he attacked Christians, he told everyone to get down, only stand up if you are Christian, then he killed the Christians.

Could be Muslim but I will see if they find anything or letter about his motives.

[red1]

I am reserving judgement till everything comes out.

So far everything poins to Islam.
reported

[~primetime~]

And yeah, he described himself as "mixed race"

Looks half black, half white.


Not that it matters but maybe now people can shush about that like it's a fckin competition between the races.

[DonDadda59]

And yeah, he described himself as "mixed race"

Looks half black, half white.


Not that it matters but maybe now people can shush about that like it's a fckin competition between the races.

It's clear his White half was responsible for this.

[chosen_one6]

So about that federal gun control law...

[DonDadda59]

So about that federal gun control law...

:whatever:

Guns don't kill people.

[9erempiree]

And yeah, he described himself as "mixed race"

Looks half black, half white.


Not that it matters but maybe now people can shush about that like it's a fckin competition between the races.

Lets not assume he's half black because of dark skin tone.

There are many people with dark skin tone....below are only examples of how other people are dark skin tone and not just blacks.

http://joshuaproject.net/profiles/photos/p14715.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3371/3497600338_2112e60499.jpg

[9erempiree]

reported

You guys assume he's black because of 'mix race'.

I am assuming he's Arab because of 'mix race'..:confusedshrug:

[SCREWstonRockets]

:whatever:

Guns don't kill people.
Killer was probably pro-gun though. Watch your people!

[AlphaWolf24]

People that try to defend 4chan users on this subject basically approve, encourage, and celebrate the murder of innocent civilians. **** all of them.

No Fallen Angel......................It's actually all my fault...

as I was the one who spearheaded the "Alpha" vs " Beta" ( nearly 10 years ago on Yahoo and YT then here)

all I was trying to do was to "help others apply themselves instead of Hating on thy brothers"

many years ago some preteen read my comments ....and now everything has spread outta control into this " Beta male uprising"

I would never approve killing innocent civilians.....

these shooters aren't "crazy" or "evil"......they are H8Z......who haven't learnt to apply themselves.

http://i.imgur.com/tXLefZd.gif

[KevinNYC]

Man this is sad

Bronte Hart lived below 26-year-old Chris Harper Mercer in the community of Winchester. She said Mercer would "sit by himself in the dark in the balcony with this little light."

Hart said a woman she believed to be Mercer's mother also lived upstairs and was "crying her eyes out" Thursday night.

A lot of this going on tonight.

[Patrick Chewing]

What's this, I hear rumblings he was Muslim? I'm in this thread now.

[KevinNYC]

An ABC reporter tweeted this.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQRU31VUAAA6Ksm.jpg

[Nanners]

CNN on beta males - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LU4W0ef2654

[Lebron23]

Man this is sad


A lot of this going on tonight.


The guy was mentally ill. His mom should have put him in the psychiatric hospital.

[Lebron23]

CNN on beta males - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LU4W0ef2654

:oldlol: :roll: :oldlol:

Poor Eggman.

[Lebron23]

Here in my country you can be arrested as an Accessories if you supported a guy who's planning to commit an act of terrorism in some Public forums.

The NBI here hired some hackers aka White Knight Hackers to detect their IP Addresses.

[TonyMontana]

It says on this image he is mixed race, and he is obviously half black. Why are people trying to point him as white?

This kid is no different than all the other recent mass shooters. They ALL have the same syptoms.
-They are young guys finishing their schooling years. (usually early to mid 20s).
-spend an excessive amount of time on their computers/internet.
-They live with a single mother(dad isn't in their life and parents are divorced).
-They dont have a real job, no real friends,
-no gf(prolly a virgin).
-Identify problems(being mixed race doesn't help things...just like that elliot rodgers guy)

they always have the majority of these traits.

Basically it is as if these young men do not even exist. Many of them do this for some sort of recognition for once in their life. Recognition that they never got. 50 years ago before mass media, these kind of guys would just hang themselves in their basement, but now they see an outlet for attention.

more and more young men are failing out of life, with women and out of the workforce, yet the discussion will once again be about guns rather than a problem which is much more common.








https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQRn1nSU8AA7c7b.png:large

[Lebron23]

He kinda look like B-Low before he lifts some weights.

[9erempiree]

It says on this image he is mixed race, and he is obviously half black. Why are people trying to point him as white?

This kid is no different than all the other recent mass shooters. They ALL have the same syptoms.
-They are young guys finishing their schooling years. (usually early to mid 20s).
-spend an excessive amount of time on their computers/internet.
-They live with a single mother(dad isn't in their life and parents are divorced).
-They dont have a real job, no real friends,
-no gf(prolly a virgin).
-Identify problems(being mixed race doesn't help things...just like that elliot rodgers guy)

they always have the majority of these traits.

Basically it is as if these young men do not even exist. Many of them do this for some sort of recognition for once in their life. Recognition that they never got. 50 years ago before mass media, these kind of guys would just hang themselves in their basement, but now they see an outlet for attention.

more and more young men are failing out of life, with women and out of the workforce, yet the discussion will once again be about guns rather than a problem which is much more common.

Good post BTW....

Since people are speculating that he's black because of 'mix race'....I am going to go and say he looks mix with Arab. Possibly a Muslim.

[ToniDaBum]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OeFGthzqF6M

[Town's Town]

This is so messed up.

[TonyMontana]

Good post BTW....

Since people are speculating that he's black because of 'mix race'....I am going to go and say he looks mix with Arab. Possibly a Muslim.

Yeah he could be. he was born in England which has lots of arabs/middle easterners.

He chose his targets by telling everyone to get down except for the Christians.

[BoutPractice]

Probably a Muslim, seriously?

A self-professed "conservative Republican" with a Nazi obsession who calls himself "spiritual, not religious" and you still can't help bringing your prejudiced bs in there somehow.

If you're trying to use this to make a political point about Muslims, odds are you picked the wrong guy, I'm afraid.

[9erempiree]

Probably a Muslim, seriously?

A self-professed "conservative Republican" with a Nazi obsession who calls himself "spiritual, not religious" and you still can't help bringing your prejudiced bs in there somehow.

If you're trying to use this to make a political point about Muslims, odds are you picked the wrong guy, I'm afraid.
:facepalm

So this lunatic shoots up a bunch of people and you are going to believe what he put on his profile? His profile is non-existent in my opinion. I can't believe what a mass murdering terrorist says on his profile.

I do find it odd that people immediately assume he's black when we know there are other dark skin ethnicity out there.

Also, the dead giveaway is the execution of Christians at that school. Its saddening to think what those people witnessed.

If he was truly a 'conservative' wouldn't he be a bible thumper? I mean why would he kill his own kind in America?

We will never know his true motive.

[StephHamann]

Witnesses say the 26-year-old asked victims their religion before shooting those who identified themselves as Christian in the head.


#NOTALLMUSLIMS

[TheMan]

Chris Harper Mercer is the name being reported.

Yeah, definitely sounds like a Muslim name.
Dave Chappelle is Muslim :confusedshrug:

I'm not saying this loser is but you can't conclude someone isn't Muslim because they're not named Abdul or Sayeed...

[Lebron23]

He's half white, half black....

Done a mass shooting.... his white side definitely triggered this.


:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[TheMan]

Nah, whities and blackies, both hold the L on this one, one for each. :facepalm

Meanwhile, hispanics and asians stay winning. :applause:

We the only sane ones :rockon:


:banana:

[NumberSix]

Nah, whities and blackies, both hold the L on this one, one for each. :facepalm

Meanwhile, hispanics and asians stay winning. :applause:

We the only sane ones :rockon:


:banana:
Hispanics are white. Mestizos aren't Hispanic. They're part Hispanic, part Amerindian.

[HitandRun Reggie]

Whatever happened to the "one drop rule"? :lol:

If we have to take responsibility for this guy's actions, then we also share in the accomplishments that basically every African American has done. Not too many pure blooded sub-Saharan Africans achieving great feats around here.

[9erempiree]

Yeah because 9er and his kind are attacking black converted Muslims.
:facepalm

Do you guys even read the threads?

Nobody is attacking Blacks. I am actually defending them because people are quick to say it's the 'Black in him' that made him shoot all these people up.

Instead of labeling him Black why don't you guys find out if he's Muslim first because he targeted Christians.

Blacks are not targeting Christians.

[UK2K]

Probably a Muslim, seriously?

A self-professed "conservative Republican" with a Nazi obsession who calls himself "spiritual, not religious" and you still can't help bringing your prejudiced bs in there somehow.

If you're trying to use this to make a political point about Muslims, odds are you picked the wrong guy, I'm afraid.

A conservative, Republican who singled out Christians to shoot them in the head....

Seems.... odd.

The former president, who retired in June, said the discussion of whether or not to hire 'armed' security guards was a hot topic.

They decided against it, and had one unarmed security guard on staff, which does nothing and is as good as a mall cop.

[Patrick Chewing]

Chris Harper Mercer is the name being reported.

Yeah, definitely sounds like a Muslim name.


Is it a requirement to have a Muslim name to be Muslim? What's a Muslim name consist of? A few El's, and Al's?

[longhornfan1234]

We need more guns in good guys hands. I have a piece on my hip waiting for something to happen.

[longhornfan1234]

"We need to stop people from drinking contaminated water."

"I know, let's add more poison to the water!"


Would this guy shoot up a school full of teachers, security guards, and students who are armed? We don't know, but I bet he chooses an easier path and goes to free gun zone school.

[DonDadda59]

Would this guy shoot up a school full of teachers, security guards, and students who are armed? We don't know, but I bet he chooses an easier path and goes to free gun zone school.

Would this guy shoot up any school if he didn't have access to a gun? We don't know, but I bet he chooses to use his fingers and make 'pow pow' noises.

[Dbrog]

Would this guy shoot up any school if he didn't have access to a gun? We don't know, but I bet he chooses to use his fingers and make 'pow pow' noises.

He could get a gun if he wanted one regardless of law

[GIF REACTION]

He dindu muffin!!!

[DonDadda59]

He could get a gun if he wanted one regardless of law

You know this how?

[NumberSix]

Would this guy shoot up any school if he didn't have legal access to a gun?
Fixed your question. And the answer is probably yes.

[UK2K]

You know this how?
Our government hands them out in Mexcio apparently.

[DeuceWallaces]

Fixed your question. And the answer is probably yes.

The answer is probably no. National gun ownership rates and gun related-homicide rates in developed nations have an extremely tight relationship. Semi and fully automatic weapons should be completely outlawed and it should be an incredibly difficult and arduous process for civilians to obtain shotguns and rifles meant for hunting.

Such a stupid debate to have and these coward Republicans have to pander to their idiot hillbilly constituents in the face of semi-annual massacres.

[~primetime~]

33,000 deaths in the US every year by firearm...but it's the 10 that died yesterday that take it over the top...smh


There should be no "gun-free zones" in the US...criminals and nut bags don't give the slightest shit about a "gun-free zone"...Chicago is "gun-free"

Making areas "gun free" ONLY removes guns from responsible gun owners.

[~primetime~]

Guns aren't the issue with school shootings though...there weren't school shootings in the 70s-80s-90s and there were plenty of guns.

It's SSRI meds...all these shooters have been linked to them, I guarantee this shooter was on them...you know, the meds that "WARNING may cause suicidal thoughts"

[imdaman99]

Chris Harper Mercer is the name being reported.

Yeah, definitely sounds like a Muslim name.
:wtf: Who's saying he's Muslim? Have to be a special kind of stupid to think that. But since we can't get all the details...they might be inventing a backstory about him about how he recently converted, and than we find a facebook with idiotic death to Christian posts :oldlol:

I already predicted this. For people we don't know much about, and will never get in an interview or shot to death, they are going to be recent converts smh

[moaz]

Guns aren't the issue with school shootings though...th

Absolutely agree.
Everyone should have a gun, so that the can defend themselves and their families.
You also don't know what can go wrong during an argument with your neighbor or in brawl between drunk college kids. The only thing you would know in such situations that the others have guns.

And if everyone should carry a gun, I am for all American blacks and Muslims also carrying guns openly. I would like to see a group of heavily armed young black men march into a Walmart somewhere in Florida, or 20 Hispanic American patrol in Arizona. What I definitely want to see is a group of Muslim Americans open carry assault weapons when they go to say goodbye to a friend in an airport (preferably with traditional Muslim attire)

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/06/03/19/294CADF700000578-3107765-Jim_Cooley_pictured_with_his_daughter_claims_he_wa s_harassed_by_-m-16_1433356258811.jpg

[Lebron23]

They need to have a psychiatric test before they allow your citizens to purchase some guns.

He may not be a Muslim, but he looks like a crazy person.

[niko]

Guns aren't the issue with school shootings though...there weren't school shootings in the 70s-80s-90s and there were plenty of guns.

It's SSRI meds...all these shooters have been linked to them, I guarantee this shooter was on them...you know, the meds that "WARNING may cause suicidal thoughts"
It might not be the root cause but Japan has similar issues (suicides, overmedication, etc.) and they also have people in schools lately acting out on things. The difference is they don't have guns, can't get automatic weapons. So people attack ONE classmate, or try to stab some people, or try to do something elaborate that's difficult and get caught. Same in China. Recently there was a very similar situation but the guy was stabbing people. 1 died, 18 hurt. It just makes it harder.

The ease that people can get guns gives these crazy people an easy way to kill a lot of people quickly. Countries you can't get guns, this doesn't happen.

[DeuceWallaces]

Guns aren't the issue with school shootings though...there weren't school shootings in the 70s-80s-90s and there were plenty of guns.

It's SSRI meds...all these shooters have been linked to them, I guarantee this shooter was on them...you know, the meds that "WARNING may cause suicidal thoughts"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States

Take a couple hours and read through them all. You're also an idiot to think it was just yesterday. It's one of multiple heavily publicized public shootings this year alone.

[NumberSix]

They need to have a psychiatric test before they allow your citizens to purchase some guns.
That's not possible. You would have to get a constitutional amendment for that. The right to keep and bear arms is a constitutional right. You can't have a test on it just like you can't have a test for the right to vote.

[~primetime~]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States

Take a couple hours and read through them all. You're also an idiot to think it was just yesterday. It's one of multiple heavily publicized public shootings this year alone.
You must have misread...

"MASS" school shootings...not just someone at school shooting someone else

they are much more frequent the past decade


here you go, school shooting deaths:

http://joeleider.com/wp-content/uploads/3-school-shooting-distro.jpg

[HitandRun Reggie]

They are saying the shooter is non-religious but is linked to man with radical Islamic stances including murderous intentions towards Jews. Lots of question marks so far.

[NumberSix]

They are saying the shooter is non-religious but is linked to man with radical Islamic stances including murderous intentions towards Jews. Lots of question marks so far.
Why are people obsessively trying to find out if he has some kind of racial/religious hatred? The dude was clearly insane. That's why he did it. He was nuts.

[KevinNYC]

That's not possible. You would have to get a constitutional amendment for that. The right to keep and bear arms is a constitutional right. You can't have a test on it just like you can't have a test for the right to vote.
The right to keep and bear arms like the right of free speech is not a total right and there are many restrictions currently in place and they are constitutionally sound.

[Nanners]

charlie booker on mass shootings in 2009 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PezlFNTGWv4)

compare that with

CNN on the oregon shooting yesterday (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5U_XD4kDJ4)


****ing cnn, especially mind boggling how they follow up the guys name with a quote of the shooter saying "The more people you kill the more limelight you get" :facepalm:

[Dbrog]

You know this how?

People already do it :confusedshrug:

Gun shows/markets sell people guns with no background checks all the time. It's not legal but it's incredibly easy to do.

[UK2K]

The answer is probably no. National gun ownership rates and gun related-homicide rates in developed nations have an extremely tight relationship. Semi and fully automatic weapons should be completely outlawed and it should be an incredibly difficult and arduous process for civilians to obtain shotguns and rifles meant for hunting.

Such a stupid debate to have and these coward Republicans have to pander to their idiot hillbilly constituents in the face of semi-annual massacres.

Its not now, it wouldn't be if guns were outlawed tomorrow.

We should outlaw cocaine and meth too. Oh wait, we did that.

And gun ownership and gun homicides is a tight relationship when it fits your agenda, because there are many South American and African countries with strict gun laws that have the highest gun homicide rates in the world.

[iamgine]

That's not possible. You would have to get a constitutional amendment for that. The right to keep and bear arms is a constitutional right. You can't have a test on it just like you can't have a test for the right to vote.
Even if it is a constitutional right, there's still requirement right? For example, you cannot be intoxicated when buying a gun. Or, you must register in order to vote. Well the psychiatry test can be just another requirement.

[senelcoolidge]

Yesterday was a weird day. This shooting and than another shooting not even a mile from where I live. A cop was shot in the leg..too bad the criminals survived and were taken into custody.
Was this guy one of those lowly bitter atheists? Because I heard about the shooting Christians in the head deal.

[Nick Young]

CNN acting like massive ***** here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5U_XD4kDJ4:facepalm

[TheMan]

Its not now, it wouldn't be if guns were outlawed tomorrow.

We should outlaw cocaine and meth too. Oh wait, we did that.

And gun ownership and gun homicides is a tight relationship when it fits your agenda, because there are many South American and African countries with strict gun laws that have the highest gun homicide rates in the world.
Mexico's gun homicide rates perfectly correlate to it's drug crime. You just don't see many gun deaths between people who aren't related to the drug business. If you're not involved with a cartel, it's very hard to get a gun, and if the cops find you with one, it is a very serious crime.

BTW, thanks to 'Murrica for the influx of guns :rolleyes:

Basically, if you aren't messing with the drug cartels, the probability of you being shot to death is almost nil. You just don't see these types of senseless shootings in schools, movie theaters or churches in Mexico.

[Nick Young]

Mexico's gun homicide rates perfectly correlate to it's drug crime. You just don't see many gun deaths between people who aren't related to the drug business. If you're not involved with a cartel, it's very hard to get a gun, and if the cops find you with one, it is a very serious crime.

BTW, thanks to 'Murrica for the influx of guns :rolleyes:

Basically, if you aren't messing with the drug cartels, the probability of you being shot to death is almost nil. You just don't see these types of senseless shootings in schools, movie theaters or churches in Mexico.
Mexico had guns before America had guns, fool. . :facepalm

[NumberSix]

The right to keep and bear arms like the right of free speech is not a total right and there are many restrictions currently in place and they are constitutionally sound.
Right, but the restrictions on free speech are not restrictions on WHO has the right of free speech. There are a few restrictions that apply to everybody.

In theory, I'm not against restricting mentally ill people from owning guns, but from a legal standpoint, it's just not possible. With the 2nd and 14th amendments, citizens have a right to have guns and the constitution has to be applied to equally protect all people. It's just not possible to say "you have 2nd amendment rights, but you don't."

Surely, you wouldn't suggest that it's possible to deny free speech rights, religious rights, marriage rights,etc... to people with mental illnesses? Remember, we're speaking from strictly a legal standpoint. I know that YOU probably draw a distinction between gun rights or those other rights, but the constitution doesn't. They're rights. Plain and simple.

[TheMan]

Mexico had guns before America had guns, fool. . :facepalm
:facepalm

[Nick Young]

:facepalm
It's true dumbass. Mexico brought gun culture to the USA. Absolutely disgraceful behavior from the Mexicans back in the day:facepalm

[ThePhantomCreep]

Its not now, it wouldn't be if guns were outlawed tomorrow.

We should outlaw cocaine and meth too. Oh wait, we did that.

And gun ownership and gun homicides is a tight relationship when it fits your agenda, because there are many South American and African countries with strict gun laws that have the highest gun homicide rates in the world.


They're also developing nations with the kind of grinding poverty you could only imagine. Comparing them to the richest nation on Earth is pointless. Check the gun homicide rate of Western Europe, it's a fraction of ours.

The UK, with 63 million people, had 44 gun-related homicides in 2014. You read that correctly 44.

Why are we not dining on the same table as them? Oh yeah, 300+ million guns in circulation. :facepalm

[UK2K]

Mexico's gun homicide rates perfectly correlate to it's drug crime. You just don't see many gun deaths between people who aren't related to the drug business. If you're not involved with a cartel, it's very hard to get a gun, and if the cops find you with one, it is a very serious crime.

BTW, thanks to 'Murrica for the influx of guns :rolleyes:

Basically, if you aren't messing with the drug cartels, the probability of you being shot to death is almost nil. You just don't see these types of senseless shootings in schools, movie theaters or churches in Mexico.

Is that so.....

A more accurate statement would be, the vast majority of gun violence in Mexico is a result of gang violence. In which case, my response would be, same thing here.

As I said earlier, the president of the college, who retired in June, mentioned they had been debating whether or not to hire armed security. They didn't, they just put up 'gun free zone' signs instead. Guess the shooter didn't give a shit.

Also, as I said earlier, if he really wanted to inflict mass casualties, he wouldn't have been using a handgun, which to me suggests he was going to carry out mass murder whether he had a gun or not.

You see this shooting on the news and think 'OMG holy phuck murders everywhere' when in fact, they are extremely rare. You probably heard people spouting off about how many 'mass shootings' there have been in this country since 20XX (whatever makes the agenda sound best), but even then, the odds of a gun being used in a mass shooting is very, very, very rare. As in, odds of winning the powerball type rare.

[HitandRun Reggie]

Why are people obsessively trying to find out if he has some kind of racial/religious hatred? The dude was clearly insane. That's why he did it. He was nuts.


Insane or not, it's human nature to seek out some semblance of a motive, especially in a situation like this where it appears a specific demographic was targeted. Even insane people have motives. There's nothing wrong with too much information.

[NumberSix]

They're also developing or third world nations with the kind of grinding poverty you could only imagine. Comparing them to the richest nation on Earth is pointless. Check the gun homicide rate of Western Europe, it's a fraction of ours.

The UK, with 63 million people, had 44 gun-related homicides in 2014. You read that correctly, 44.

Why are we not dining on the same table as them? Oh yeah, 300+ million guns in circulation. :facepalm
Meaning what? They're poor, so of course murder more? Well, if that's the argument, doesn't the United States have more poor people than the entire population of the UK? The majority of gun-murders in the United States are gang members in ghetto Neighborhoods. So, wouldn't they fall into the "caused by poverty" logic you're pushing.... hence, not about guns? :confusedshrug:

[UK2K]

They're also developing nations with the kind of grinding poverty you could only imagine. Comparing them to the richest nation on Earth is pointless. Check the gun homicide rate of Western Europe, it's a fraction of ours.

The UK, with 63 million people, had 44 gun-related homicides in 2014. You read that correctly 44.

Why are we not dining on the same table as them? Oh yeah, 300+ million guns in circulation. :facepalm

Way to use one statistic, immediately claim its directly related to another, and then spout off.

Tell me, how many gang members does the UK have? Tell me, how many people in England are medicated above and beyond what they should be prescribed?

There's a lot of reasons why our gun violence is the way it is, but the one statistic you need to remember is, the odds of being a victim of a gun related homicide in the UK is .5/100,000 whereas, the odds of being a victim of a gun related homicide in the US (including the million plus gang members slaughtering each other in the thousands) is 3.55/100,000.

Or, a difference of, 3/100,000. HOLY PHUCKING SHIT BATMAN!!1!

A gun cannot shoot someone on its own. It takes a mentally unstable (or piece of shit gang banger) to pull the trigger. Unfortunately, the US has a lot, if not the most, of both of those.

[KevinNYC]

Right, but the restrictions on free speech are not restrictions on WHO has the right of free speech. There are a few restrictions that apply to everybody.

In theory, I'm not against restricting mentally ill people from owning guns, but from a legal standpoint, it's just not possible. With the 2nd and 14th amendments, citizens have a right to have guns and the constitution has to be applied to equally protect all people. It's just not possible to say "you have 2nd amendment rights, but you don't."
Restrictions on who can own guns currently exist as law. What do you think background checks are about?

Restrictions on types of guns are currently law.


As an aside, I seem to remember something about the words "well-regulated militia."
Regulations are mentioned right in the Amendment.
The 14th?

[Nick Young]

They're also developing nations with the kind of grinding poverty you could only imagine. Comparing them to the richest nation on Earth is pointless. Check the gun homicide rate of Western Europe, it's a fraction of ours.

The UK, with 63 million people, had 44 gun-related homicides in 2014. You read that correctly 44.

Why are we not dining on the same table as them? Oh yeah, 300+ million guns in circulation. :facepalm
UK is an island. It is difficult to sneak guns there.

Check out the homicide gun rates in South Africa. Stop making excuses and justifying violence and infantilizing people "DURR DURR theyd on't know any better doe because they're from a developing nation, they have no choice but to shoot people down at that rate, durrr durrr"

[lil jahlil]

CNN is telling it how it is, these dudes are crazy losers that look for infamy.

That's the culture on 4chan, majority of them are one step away from becoming a mass shooter.
And ISH is one step away from 4chan :eek:

[ThePhantomCreep]

Meaning what? They're poor, so of course murder more? Well, if that's the argument, doesn't the United States have more poor people than the entire population of the UK? The majority of gun-murders in the United States are gang members in ghetto Neighborhoods. So, wouldn't they fall into the "caused by poverty" logic you're pushing.... hence, not about guns? :confusedshrug:

You're seriously comparing US poverty with Africa/South America poverty? They're not in the same stratosphere.

It's sad how low we have to set the bar in order to justify having 300+ million guns circulating throughout the US. The NRA should make a dopey meme out of that:

"Merica! At least we're safer than Honduras!"

I doubt UK's poverty rate is much lower ours, but their gun homicide rate sure as hell is. Spain had a poverty rate over 27% just a few years ago, practically a depression, yet their gun-homicide rate during that span was 0.15. Virtually non-existent.

[UK2K]

You're seriously comparing US poverty with Africa/South America poverty? They're not in the same stratosphere.

It's sad how low we have to set the bar in order to justify having 300+ million guns circulating throughout the US. The NRA should make a dopey meme out of that:

"Merica! At least we're safer than Honduras!"

I doubt UK's poverty rate is much lower ours, but their gun homicide rate sure as hell is. Spain had a poverty rate over 27% just a few years ago, practically a depression, yet their gun-homicide rate during that span was 0.15. Virtually non-existent.

And in the US, it's 3.55/100,000, virtually non existent. May as well be playing the lottery. About the same odds as being struck by lightning.

HOLY PHUCK EVERYONE SHOOTIN ERRRRONE!11!1

The vast majority of homicides are gang member killing each other.

[ThePhantomCreep]

UK is an island. It is difficult to sneak guns there.

Check out the homicide gun rates in South Africa. Stop making excuses and justifying violence and infantilizing people "DURR DURR theyd on't know any better doe because they're from a developing nation, they have no choice but to shoot people down at that rate, durrr durrr"

Haven't heard this dopey excuse before. I'll be sure to add it to the list:

Let's look at non-islands, shall we:

Austria - 0.22
Bulgaria - 0.23
Croatia - 1.1
Czech Republic - 0.12
Denmark - 0.22
France - 0.22
Germany - 0.20
Greece - 0.59 (perennially on the verge of economic collapse)
Hungary - 0.11
Italy - 0.36
Estonia - 0.30
Georgia - 0.66
Poland - 0.02 :applause:
Norway - 0.04
Romania - 0.04

United States - 3.55 (2013)

How sad is it that every nation in the former Soviet Bloc has a much lower homicide rate than us ? These are countries that not too long ago were under the rule of a police state (as opposed to the fantasy police state paranoid right-wingers think we live under), economically depressed for decades, yet they're almost completely devoid of mass shootings and inner city crime.

Do ya think the relative lack of firearms might be the reason for their low numbers? :hammerhead:

[NumberSix]

Restrictions on who can own guns currently exist as law. What do you think background checks are about?

Restrictions on types of guns are currently law.


As an aside, I seem to remember something about the words "well-regulated militia."
Regulations are mentioned right in the Amendment.
The 14th?
To see if people are criminals:hammerhead:

Try actually reading the constitution. Convicts are the only people that the constitution allows taking rights away from.

[NumberSix]

As an aside, I seem to remember something about the words "well-regulated militia."
Yeah, but that doesn't mean what illiterate lefties try to "interpret" it as meaning.

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

Meaning.... It's necessary that citizens have the right to own guns in case a militia needs to be formed, the people forming it will have arms. It doesn't mean you have to form a militia and THEN you are allowed to get some guns. Only a retard would think it means that.

[Sarcastic]

To see if people are criminals:hammerhead:

Try actually reading the constitution. Convicts are the only people that the constitution allows taking rights away from.

The Constitution used to allow taking of rights from slaves. Until they, you know, Amended it.

Point is, the Constitution was meant to be changed.

[ThePhantomCreep]

And in the US, it's 3.55/100,000, virtually non existent. May as well be playing the lottery. About the same odds as being struck by lightning.

HOLY PHUCK EVERYONE SHOOTIN ERRRRONE!11!1

The vast majority of homicides are gang member killing each other.

That's still 10x higher than your typical European nation. There's no excuse for that. This is the richest country in the world--we should be dining with France and Germany, not Chile and Argentina.

You think inner-cities in the former Yugoslavia don't have their rough and tumble areas? Greece? The former USSR? Of course they do, but their firearm-related deaths are still a fraction of ours.

[UK2K]

That's still 10x higher than your typical European nation. There's no excuse for that. This is the richest country in the world--we should be dining with France and Germany, not Chile and Argentina.

You think inner-cities in the former Yugoslavia don't have their rough and tumble areas? Greece? The former USSR? Of course they do, but their firearm-related deaths are still a fraction of ours.

10x higher!! Ahh!!! TEN TIMES AS MUCH!!

You know, 10 degrees is ten times as hot as 1 degree. When you are dealing with such small numbers (3.55/100,000), it doesnt take much to be ten times as much.

The difference between 3.55/100,000 and .55/100,000 is 3/100,000... or about .00003% (check me, KNYC pointed out I suck at math). Like the odds of being struck by lightning, like I said.

PHUCKING GUNS SHOOTERS EVERYWHERE MASS MURDER AND KILLING!

[9erempiree]

Crime also has been on the decline for quite some time now.

We are at our lowest.

[bladefd]

Crime also has been on the decline for quite some time now.

We are at our lowest.

You should tell Fox News that. Fox News has been throwing out propaganda for years that crime is worst it has ever been and that we need easy ways to get more guns on the streets. I saw some idiot on there from NRA say that all background checks needs to be dropped for the gun buyers because he said more guns is the answer to crime control. Of course, more gun buyers means more money in his pocket :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

Not sure how more guns on the street helps lessen crime or that fewer guns on the street equals more crime.

[UK2K]

You should tell Fox News that. Fox News has been throwing out propaganda for years that crime is worst it has ever been and that we need easy ways to get more guns on the streets. I saw some idiot on there from NRA say that all background checks needs to be dropped for the gun buyers because he said more guns is the answer to crime control. :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

Not sure how more guns on the street helps lessen crime or that fewer guns on the street equals more crime.

http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/08/25/detroit-police-chief-less-crime-home-invasions-way-down-amid-rising-gun-ownership

Like this.


The Detroit police chief has called on the law-abiding people of his community to arm themselves.

Now, James Craig says his city has seen a drop in crime of 12%, as Detroit moves lower on the list of America's deadliest cities.

In 2014, the Detroit police department issued more than 1,100 handgun permits, while more than 8,100 guns were registered in the city.

The number of shootings and robberies dropped from 2013. Home invasions are down 17% so far this year, Craig said, following a drop of 38% last year.

Craig noted that in a survey of 1,800 felons, the respondents pointed to "armed citizens" as the thing they were most afraid of.

[NumberSix]

The Constitution used to allow taking of rights from slaves. Until they, you know, Amended it.

Point is, the Constitution was meant to be changed.
That's what I just said. You would need a constitutional amendment.

[UK2K]

Haven't heard this dopey excuse before. I'll be sure to add it to the list:

Let's look at non-islands, shall we:

Austria - 0.22
Bulgaria - 0.23
Croatia - 1.1
Czech Republic - 0.12
Denmark - 0.22
France - 0.22
Germany - 0.20
Greece - 0.59 (perennially on the verge of economic collapse)
Hungary - 0.11
Italy - 0.36
Estonia - 0.30
Georgia - 0.66
Poland - 0.02 :applause:
Norway - 0.04
Romania - 0.04

United States - 3.55 (2013)

How sad is it that every nation in the former Soviet Bloc has a much lower homicide rate than us ? These are countries that not too long ago were under the rule of a police state (as opposed to the fantasy police state paranoid right-wingers think we live under), economically depressed for decades, yet they're almost completely devoid of mass shootings and inner city crime.

Do ya think the relative lack of firearms might be the reason for their low numbers? :hammerhead:

By the way, where is Sweden on your list? Didn't fit your agenda so they didn't make the cut?

Here, I'll help you out...

0.19/100,00 gun homicide rate.

But how could that be? The 9th highest gun ownership per capita in the world? Something is wrong. What about Switzerland, the fourth highest gun ownership in the world? 0.23/100,000.

It seems your cause/effect theory is off somewhat.

Let's make it simple and say 'the white, civilized countries in the world have a low gun homicide rate' and leave it at that. No sense in trying to make it seem anything more than that. Yes, there are exceptions, in both directions, but for the most part, white, cultured countries are safer than the rest of the world. Shocker.

And by the way, France has the 11th highest gun ownership in the world, Austria is 13th, and they made your list, so you're an idiot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

Just say it. White, cultured, civilized countries are generally safer than other countries in the world, no matter the laws.

[Dbrog]

:bowdown: :applause: :rockon: :pimp:

Dem gun ownership stats. Wish they would show up in the media when everyone's talkin about how more guns and big guns = more horrific gun violence. Hell, each person in Switzerland has a ROCKET LAUNCHER or other extremely high powered weapons from being in the military (ya, I know...they fight so much :rolleyes: ). Why aren't they blowing the shit out of mountainsides or something? It's cultural and related to mental health.

[~primetime~]

You don't think 33k is enough?
enough for what?

I think you missed my point

[KevinNYC]

To see if people are criminals:hammerhead:

Try actually reading the constitution. Convicts are the only people that the constitution allows taking rights away from.
Have you read about background checks? Do you actually know what is in current law? Because it goes beyond criminals. You're sometimes really arrogant about your ignorance.
Yeah, but that doesn't mean what illiterate lefties try to "interpret" it as meaning.

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

Meaning.... It's necessary that citizens have the right to own guns in case a militia needs to be formed, the people forming it will have arms. It doesn't mean you have to form a militia and THEN you are allowed to get some guns. Only a retard would think it means that.There's a difference between "the right of the people" and an individual person's right to bear arms and this has been part of the discussion of the 2nd Amendment even before it was drafted. The right of the people to bear could mean that states could maintain armories for the use of the people. In fact the Supreme Court only declared an individual right to bear arms is part of the second amendment just 5 years ago.
Back in the day state constitutions had very different concepts of what bearing arms meant. PA specifically mentioned a right of personal defense and VA was more heavily tilted towards maintaining order via the militia mentions "defence of the state." Neither of these wound up being the language in the Bill of Rights. This is VA's language.
A well-regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defence of a free State

And the 2nd Amendment is not the only place the militia is spoken of in the Constitution. Article 1, is already mentioning the militia and talks about arming the militia.


Clause 15:

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

Clause 16:

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;.

In James Madison's early drafts he spoke about the first amendment this way


The people shall not be deprived or abridged of their right to speak, to write, or to publish their sentiments; and the freedom of the press, as one of the great bulwarks of liberty, shall be inviolable.

The people shall not be restrained from peaceably assembling and consulting for their common good; nor from applying to the Legislature by petitions, or remonstrances, for redress of their grievances.
and then the 2nd amendment this way.

The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed; a well armed and well regulated militia being the best security of a free country; but no person religiously scrupulous of bearing arms shall be compelled to render military service in person.Notice also how you can opt and "military service."

I would be curious to see a scholar discuss the background here.

Anyway, my early post wasn't about an individual's right vs the people's right....I was talking about the regulated part. That's white you can own a gun but you can't own a machine gun, the government still can regulate aspects of gun ownership.

[~primetime~]

I read that as you 'smh-ing' at the idea that 10 more people is a big deal.

If you meant that as in there's already a f*ckload and we should deal with it, my bad.
I meant it as 100 people are dying daily in the US from guns, but people only care about gun control when 10 die from the same shooter.

[NumberSix]

Anyway, my early post wasn't about an individual's right vs the people's right....I was talking about the regulated part. That's white you can own a gun but you can't own a machine gun, the government still can regulate aspects of gun ownership.
1. You're ascribing modern day use of the word "regulated" to something written more than 200 years ago.

2. Even if we used your definition of "regulated", that word is applied to the militia, not the weaponry of the citizens.

3. Most importantly, a fundamental misunderstanding that I see people constantly making here. The constitution doesn't only say what is literally written on it. It also says what it has been defined as saying. The Supreme Court has defined it as saying that individuals have a right to own guns, so that's what it say. It's not open for reinterpretation. There's no mental gymnastics arguing that you think it says something else. It has been defined.

[ThePhantomCreep]

By the way, where is Sweden on your list? Didn't fit your agenda so they didn't make the cut?

Here, I'll help you out...

0.19/100,00 gun homicide rate.

But how could that be? The 9th highest gun ownership per capita in the world? Something is wrong. What about Switzerland, the fourth highest gun ownership in the world? 0.23/100,000.

It seems your cause/effect theory is off somewhat.

Let's make it simple and say 'the white, civilized countries in the world have a low gun homicide rate' and leave it at that. No sense in trying to make it seem anything more than that. Yes, there are exceptions, in both directions, but for the most part, white, cultured countries are safer than the rest of the world. Shocker.

And by the way, France has the 11th highest gun ownership in the world, Austria is 13th, and they made your list, so you're an idiot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

Just say it. White, cultured, civilized countries are generally safer than other countries in the world, no matter the laws.

It's not an exact science, but lower gun ownership and stricter laws for the most part correlate to low rates of firearm homicide.

Like a dumbass, you use outliers to throw out the baby with the bathwater, while touring the greatness of whites, forgetting that the homicide rate among non-hispanic whites in the US is still several times higher than almost all European nations.

Even with their mandatory military training, Switzerland has half the guns per capita we do, Sweden has 33%. The amount of households with a firearm in countries like France and Austria a fraction of our own.

[KevinNYC]

1. You're ascribing modern day use of the word "regulated" to something written more than 200 years ago.

2. Even if we used your definition of "regulated", that word is applied to the militia, not the weaponry of the citizens.

3. Most importantly, a fundamental misunderstanding that I see people constantly making here. The constitution doesn't only say what is literally written on it. It also says what it has been defined as saying. The Supreme Court has defined it as saying that individuals have a right to own guns, so that's what it say. It's not open for reinterpretation. There's no mental gymnastics arguing that you think it says something else. It has been defined.
1. What else would regulated mean in that sentence? Regulated meant curbed or controlled back then. In the case of a militia, it well practiced and drilled. Also regulated as in laws which they had a lot of: (http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/amendment-don-article-1.1223900)[QUOTE]Militias were tightly controlled organizations legally defined and regulated by the individual colonies before the Revolution and, after independence, by the individual states. Militia laws ran on for pages and were some of the lengthiest pieces of legislation in the statute books. States kept track of who had guns, had the right to inspect them in private homes and could fine citizens for failing to report to a muster.

These laws also defined what type of guns you had to buy

[GIF REACTION]

Staunch Republicans hate him!

[KevinNYC]

One of the dead was a cousin of a US Senator, Jeff Merkley.

[NumberSix]

BTW, I think it's amusing that on this issue, the Supreme Court has spoken and it's defined and there is no further reinterpretation, but on birthright citizenship everything is still up in the air.
Yeah, because the Supreme Court has never heard a case on whether children born to illegals are citizens. They have never defined one way or the other on that particular issue. The closest thing they have ever decided is that the children of LEGAL guest workers are citizens.

The Supreme Court still exist, hence, there are issues that have still not been decided.


Nothing is the Constitution is crystal clear and the Supreme Court has overturned cases like Dred Scott and Plessy v Ferguson. People are always going to be arguing about things.
Do you not understand what an amendment is? The dred Scott decision was before the existence of the 13th and 14th amendments.

[KevinNYC]

Yeah, because the Supreme Court has never heard a case on whether children born to illegals are citizens. They have never defined one way or the other on that particular issue. The closest thing they have ever decided is that the children of LEGAL guest workers are citizens.

The Supreme Court still exist, hence, there are issues that have still not been decided.


Do you not understand what an amendment is? The dred Scott decision was before the existence of the 13th and 14th amendments.
You're right on Dred Scott, I didn't look that up, but the point stand with the example of Plessy. The Supreme Court can be wrong and be overturned by a modern court. The point on Dred Scott was the Supreme Court turned in a bad decision.

You're wrong on birthright citizenship. Congress understood as it debated the language of the 14th Amendments that it would make children of foreigners in the United States such as Germans, Gypsies, Chinese all US citizens at birth. Some opposed the Amendment for that reason. They lost.
The "guest worker" status is a canard

[NumberSix]

You're right on Dred Scott, I didn't look that up, but the point stand with the example of Plessy. The Supreme Court can be wrong and be overturned by a modern court. The point on Dred Scott was the Supreme Court turned in a bad decision.

You're wrong on birthright citizenship. Congress understood as it debated the language of the 14th Amendments that it would make children of foreigners in the United States such as Germans, Gypsies, Chinese all US citizens at birth. Some opposed the Amendment for that reason. They lost.
The "guest worker" status is a canard
That's your opinion. And them not being eligible for citizenship is my opinion. But our opinions don't really matter. Until the Supreme Court makes a decision on it, it's not settled. Nobody has ever actually tried to deny citizenship to children of illegals born in America. If that eventually happens and the people being denied citizenship file a lawsuit that makes its way up to the Supreme Court, then it will finally be decided whether such a law is constitutional or not. It really doesn't matter what either of us claim that congress intended with the 14th amendment. It's not me or you who decides that. The Supreme Court does, and they have yet to do so.

This is probably something that will not be in the near future though. It would probably take first... a law actually being enacted that denies citizenship to the children of illegals, then second... One of those children actually growing up and filing a lawsuit claiming they believe they are entitled to the citizenship that they were denied. These things take time. Remember, it was only just this year that somebody won a case in front of the Supreme Court for being denied a gay marriage license. It was only recently that the SC defined whether money counts as speech. It could be another hundred years before a case of this exact issue appears before the Supreme Court.

[dunksby]

Dude was a religious nut, asked people their religion before shooting them.

[9erempiree]

Dude was a religious nut, asked people their religion before shooting them.

His belief leans towards Islam if he's wiping out Christians.

[KevinNYC]

That's your opinion. And them not being eligible for citizenship is my opinion. But our opinions don't really matter. Until the Supreme Court makes a decision on it, it's not settled.
It's not my opinion and it is settled. Your argument rested on what jurisdiction meant in the 14th Amendment. In a related case, that went 5-4, the Supreme Court ruled on jurisdiction 9-0. In Plyler v. Doe, the Court said:
"no plausible distinction with respect to Fourteenth Amendment 'jurisdiction' can be drawn between resident aliens whose entry into the United States was lawful, and resident aliens whose entry was unlawful." and the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment applies to aliens who, after their illegal entry into this country, are indeed physically 'within the jurisdiction' of a state."

The meaning of subject to the jurisdiction thereof means the laws of the state apply to them. That is if you cross the border and you can't break laws with impunity. That jurisdiction affects virtually every person on US soil.

That a person born on US soil has been stated as fact by the Supreme.
INS v. Rios-Pineda, was a case where the parents of a child born in America were going to be deported. It deal precisely with the issue you raise. The facts of the case state
By that time, respondent wife had given birth to a child, who, born in the United States, was a citizen of this country.

You don't seem to understand that this is settled law and, in fact
has been codified into currnet US law (https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1401)

[I]8 U.S. Code

[KevinNYC]

Dude was a religious nut, asked people their religion before shooting them.
Or he could have been an anti-religious nut.

supposedly that was his myspace page filled with photos of IRA guerrillas. Presumably he would have realized they were Christians.

[NumberSix]

[QUOTE=KevinNYC]It's not my opinion and it is settled. Your argument rested on what jurisdiction meant in the 14th Amendment. In a related case, that went 5-4, the Supreme Court ruled on jurisdiction 9-0. In Plyler v. Doe, the Court said:

The meaning of subject to the jurisdiction thereof means the laws of the state apply to them. That is if you cross the border and you can't break laws with impunity. That jurisdiction affects virtually every person on US soil.

That a person born on US soil has been stated as fact by the Supreme.
INS v. Rios-Pineda, was a case where the parents of a child born in America were going to be deported. It deal precisely with the issue you raise. The facts of the case state

You don't seem to understand that this is settled law and, in fact
has been codified into currnet US law (https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1401)

[I]8 U.S. Code

[KevinNYC]

Lol. Nice little slight of hand switch there. I bet you thought I wouldn't notice the difference between the language of "within its jurisdiction" and "subject to the jurisdiction thereof".I might not have written up clearly, but there's no sleight of hand. Here's the language of the case. (https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/457/202) The Court is clearly rejecting the argument you're making.


Use of the phrase "within its jurisdiction" thus does not detract from, but rather confirms, the understanding that the protection of the Fourteenth Amendment extends to anyone, citizen or stranger, who is subject to the laws of a State, and reaches into every corner of a State's territory. That a person's initial entry into a State, or into the United States, was unlawful, and that he may for that reason be expelled, cannot negate the simple fact of his presence within the State's territorial perimeter. Given such presence, he is subject to the full range of obligations imposed by the State's civil and criminal laws. And until he leaves the jurisdiction -- either voluntarily, or involuntarily in accordance with the Constitution and laws of the United States -- he is entitled to the equal protection of the laws that a State may choose to establish.
.....

In appellants' view, persons who have entered the United States illegally are not "within the jurisdiction" of a State even if they are present within a State's boundaries and subject to its laws. Neither our cases nor the logic of the Fourteenth Amendment support that constricting construction of the phrase "within its jurisdiction." [n10] We have never suggested that the class of persons who might avail themselves of the equal protection guarantee is less than coextensive with that entitled to due process. To the contrary, we have recognized [p212] that both provisions were fashioned to protect an identical class of persons, and to reach every exercise of state authority.

Here's the footnote on bolded part.


Although we have not previously focused on the intended meaning of this phrase, we have had occasion to examine the first sentence of the Fourteenth Amendment, which provides that "[a]ll persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States. . . ." (Emphasis added.) Justice Gray, writing for the Court in United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898), detailed at some length the history of the Citizenship Clause, and the predominantly geographic sense in which the term "jurisdiction" was used. He further noted that it was impossible to construe the words "subject to the jurisdiction thereof," in the opening sentence [of the Fourteenth Amendment], as less comprehensive than the words "within its jurisdiction," in the concluding sentence of the same section; or to hold that persons "within the jurisdiction" of one of the States of the Union are not "subject to the jurisdiction of the United States."

Id. at 687.

Justice Gray concluded that

[e]very citizen or subject of another country, while domiciled here, is within the allegiance and the protection, and consequently subject to the jurisdiction, of the United States.

Id. at 693. As one early commentator noted, given the historical emphasis on geographic territoriality, bounded only, if at all, by principles of sovereignty and allegiance, no plausible distinction with respect to Fourteenth Amendment "jurisdiction" can be drawn between resident aliens whose entry into the United States was lawful, and resident aliens whose entry was unlawful. See C. Bouve, Exclusion and Expulsion of Aliens in the United States 425-427 (1912).

[NumberSix]

I might not have written up clearly, but there's no sleight of hand. Here's the language of the case. (https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/457/202) The Court is clearly rejecting the argument you're making.



Here's the footnote on bolded part.
1. Again, this is a case about the equal protection clause. It has nothing to do with the citizenship clause. Also, this is a case specifically about state governments, not the federal government.

2. Actually read the first section of the 14th amendment. It makes a clear distinction between citizens and persons. It's specifically says no state shall abridge the the privileges and immunities of citizens and then goes on to say that no state shall deprive any person within its jurisdiction (the state's physical jurisdiction) equal protection of the law. Nobody is arguing this. You keep going on about it, but you're the only person engaged in this conversation.

Even at that though, it's not an absolute. It's clearly understood that within reason, the equal protection clause still allows somewhat unequal treatment. For instance, children and adults are not treated the same. Men and women can be treated differently within reason (e.g. Government buildings can have gender segregated bathrooms). But this is really all a moot point because we are not talking about the equal protection clause.

3. You seem to not really understand how a commonlaw judicial system works and how the concept of "precedent" is applied. You're wasting your time by posting opinions written by judges. Those are just that. Opinions. These are no more binding than the dissenting opinions of the judges that voted against a given decision. Judgements are what set precedent, not written opinions. Opinions and intent of course can be considered, but they are not binding like case law.

Just accept it already. There has been no decision by the court on whether the children of illegals are constitutionally entitled to citizenship. There hasn't been a judgment on it. You can argue all you want that if that case ever does go before the court that you think it will go your way. That's fine. But stop dishonestly arguing that the court has somehow already ruled on this matter. It hasn't. Until it does, it's still open for debate.

[lil jahlil]

Or he could have been an anti-religious nut.

supposedly that was his myspace page filled with photos of IRA guerrillas. Presumably he would have realized they were Christians.
Myspace?

[lil jahlil]

Lol. Nice little slight of hand switch there. I bet you thought I wouldn't notice the difference between the language of "within its jurisdiction" and "subject to the jurisdiction thereof".

Yes, if you are inside the United States, you are physically within its jurisdiction. This is obvious. The children of ambassadors are also "within its jurisdiction" but not "subject to the jurisdiction thereof", right? I mean, you would agree that those children are in fact not subject to United States jurisdiction although being born physically "within its jurisdiction", wouldn't you?

That is a case about the equal protection clause not the citizenship clause. They just happen to be in the same section of the same amendment, just like how the establishment clause and freedom of the press are written together. "Within its jurisdiction" is in the equal protection clause. "Subject to the jurisdiction thereof" is in the citizenship clause. This is NOT a case argued on the grounds of the citizenship clause. It has nothing to do with this case.

http://www.debbieschlussel.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/diplomaticimmunity.jpg

[KevinNYC]

Just accept it already. There has been no decision by the court on whether the children of illegals are constitutionally entitled to citizenship. There hasn't been a judgment on it. You can argue all you want that if that case ever does go before the court that you think it will go your way. That's fine. But stop dishonestly arguing that the court has somehow already ruled on this matter. It hasn't. Until it does, it's still open for debate.Accept what?

That the United States is a Jus Soli (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jus_soli) country that provides citizenship by the "right of the soil?"

That this has been the case since the 1860's and even after the immigration laws of the 1920's were passed?

That even with new immigration laws, for the past nearly 100 years the United States routinely provides citizenship to babies of aliens born on US soil?

That this fact informs our current Immigration and Deportation Laws? I mean have you checked any immigration law website?

That every time a congressman wants to pass a law modifying birthright citizenship, the Congressional Research Service indicates it would take an amendment to Constitution?

Do you know how many millions of American citizens had parents without proper documents over all that time?

The argument you are repeating is not the law of the land. It's a tendentious legal argument created in the 1980's by those who wanted to alter the law of the land without having to amend the Constitution. It's a tendentious reading the multiple jurisdiction clauses and it's been rejected already by the Supreme Court.

Basically if there was a Venn diagram of "within the jurisdiction" and "subject to the jurisdiction" there would be very nearly a perfect circle.

There's literally millions of instances of children born here automatically becoming citizens and thus plenty opportunities for the Court Case you talk about, but there haven't been, because your argument is relying on an incorrect definition of jurisdiction that the Supreme Court rejected in 1898. Its for this reason these cases aren't heard.

You accuse me of dishonesty, but you seem ingore decades and decades and decades of American history. You basically say this is all rests on a mistaken reading of the 14th Amendment. Meanwhile the legal establishment, the Congressional Research Service, thousands of lawyers on both sides of the immigration argument indicate it is you who is mistaken.

[KevinNYC]

Myspace?
Yeah, I was surprised by that too. But it's been widely reported. Dunno if they confirmed or not.

https://www.google.com/search?q=myspace+ira&safe=off&espv=2&biw=1853&bih=995&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAGoVChMIyMjJtuepyAIVSBg-Ch1kdAmV&dpr=1

[plowking]

If only it was like the wild west days and everyone had guns to protect themselves. None of this would have happened.

[KevinNYC]

If only it was like the wild west days and everyone had guns to protect themselves. None of this would have happened.
Most folks in the Wild West did not carry guns and gun control laws were pretty common.

[NumberSix]

Accept what?

That the United States is a Jus Soli (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jus_soli) country that provides citizenship by the "right of the soil?"

That this has been the case since the 1860's and even after the immigration laws of the 1920's were passed?

That even with new immigration laws, for the past nearly 100 years the United States routinely provides citizenship to babies of aliens born on US soil?

That this fact informs our current Immigration and Deportation Laws? I mean have you checked any immigration law website?

That every time a congressman wants to pass a law modifying birthright citizenship, the Congressional Research Service indicates it would take an amendment to Constitution?

Do you know how many millions of American citizens had parents without proper documents over all that time?

The argument you are repeating is not the law of the land. It's a tendentious legal argument created in the 1980's by those who wanted to alter the law of the land without having to amend the Constitution. It's a tendentious reading the multiple jurisdiction clauses and it's been rejected already by the Supreme Court.

Basically if there was a Venn diagram of "within the jurisdiction" and "subject to the jurisdiction" there would be very nearly a perfect circle.

There's literally millions of instances of children born here automatically becoming citizens and thus plenty opportunities for the Court Case you talk about, but there haven't been, because your argument is relying on an incorrect definition of jurisdiction that the Supreme Court rejected in 1898. Its for this reason these cases aren't heard.

You accuse me of dishonesty, but you seem ingore decades and decades and decades of American history. You basically say this is all rests on a mistaken reading of the 14th Amendment. Meanwhile the legal establishment, the Congressional Research Service, thousands of lawyers on both sides of the immigration argument indicate it is you who is mistaken.
I'm not remotely claiming it's not the law. It is the law that people born in the United States regardless of their parents status are citizens at birth. We all understand that this is the law.

[KevinNYC]

I'm not remotely claiming it's not the law. It is the law that people born in the United States regardless of their parents status are citizens at birth. We all understand that this is the law.
What are you claiming then? That this is not rooted in the 14th Amendment?

Because I'm claiming it is the law as per the 14th Amendment and it would require a Consitutional Amendment to change that law.

[NumberSix]

What are you claiming then? That this is not rooted in the 14th Amendment?

Because I'm claiming it is the law as per the 14th Amendment and it would require a Consitutional Amendment to change that law.
I'm claiming that if the law did get changed and there was a case brought before the Supreme Court challenging the new law, I think the the court would rule that the new law can stand.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Unfortunately she was wrong. (http://www.salon.com/2015/10/05/oregon_shooters_mother_was_an_avid_gun_enthusiast_ who_stockpiled_weapons_for_fear_of_confiscation/)

[Megabox!]

I never understood why people have soo much weaponry in their homes. Having 2 or 3 of them is fine but having nearly 20 guns just laying around in your home is kinda red-flaggish.

[NumberSix]

I never understood why people have soo much weaponry in their homes. Having 2 or 3 of them is fine but having nearly 20 guns just laying around in your home is kinda red-flaggish.
What about people who collect stamps? Is that red flaggish too? I mean, nobody needs to send that many letters, right?

[Megabox!]

What about people who collect stamps? Is that red flaggish too? I mean, nobody needs to send that many letters, right?
:facepalm did you really just compare stamps to f*cking guns?

[DeuceWallaces]

:facepalm did you really just compare stamps to f*cking guns?

I swear he's not a real person. Just a scientific experiment where a computer learns to debate politics on message boards.