What great playoff runs did Wade/Kobe have post-2012?

[dubeta]

Discuss.

[sd3035]

2/7 looms

[dubeta]

2/7 looms


Kobe's FMVP ratio is already intact

[aj1987]

Not great series, but Wade had a couple of good ones.

'13 Finals - 20/4/5/2/1 on 51%
'14 ECF - 20/4/5/2 on 62%

[Bosnian Sajo]

What a dumb question lol, what great playoff runs did Shaq have after 2008? Jordan after 1999? Olajuwon after 1999? :facepalm

[JT123]

None for Wade. Kobe didn't have any post 2010.

[GoatBoy]

:facepalm

[CurryOverLebron]

Curry is the best post-2012 player

[HOoopCityJones]

2/7

[DMAVS41]

Wade was actually pretty darn good in the finals....but he's been pretty awful in the playoffs overall since 12.

Kobe hasn't been in the playoffs so of course none.

Not sure the point...they've both been hurt. More defensible in Kobe's case as he's had about as long a career as possible while also playing all out in virtually every game he's ever played.

While I think Kobe's 13 season tends to get over-rated here, it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely great.

I used to be a lot higher on Wade overall as a player than I am now. I still hold my opinions on him at the time, but he's fallen off a cliff at a young age in terms of his health and play in some key times since 12. Hopefully this year he and the Heat bounce back because they actually have the tools to be an elite team.

[WayOfWade]

What do you mean by runs? Like a string of games or an entire series or an entire playoffs?

I'm not too versed in Kobe's playoff performances, but I do know that Kobe has not played a single playoff game post 2012, so that means 0, so I'll just do Wade.
As I think aj said, he had a couple of good series, but not great. He did have a 4 game stretch over the latter half of the 2013 finals That included games of 32/6 and 6 steals, 25/11 assists, and 23/11 rebounds
And why are you specifically asking post 2012?

[GrapeApe]

Wade was actually pretty darn good in the finals....but he's been pretty awful in the playoffs overall since 12.

Kobe hasn't been in the playoffs so of course none.

Not sure the point...they've both been hurt. More defensible in Kobe's case as he's had about as long a career as possible while also playing all out in virtually every game he's ever played.

While I think Kobe's 13 season tends to get over-rated here, it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely great.

I used to be a lot higher on Wade overall as a player than I am now. I still hold my opinions on him at the time, but he's fallen off a cliff at a young age in terms of his health and play in some key times since 12. Hopefully this year he and the Heat bounce back because they actually have the tools to be an elite team.

He's got no cartilage in his knee, and I think the bolded is a bit of an exaggeration. From 2012-2015 (since turning 30) he's averaged 21/5/5 on 50% with a 23.5 PER. That's hardly falling off a cliff, especially for a 30+ year old guard. I fact, his 2013 regular season may be the most underrated of his career. 21/5/5/1.9/0.8 on 52% and a 24 PER, as a second option. He was the most efficient guard in the league, had the highest PER of any second option in the league, and was excellent defensively. He was still a 26/7/5 on good efficiency type first option.

I've always maintained that his days of being a consistent superstar ended when he suffered the bone bruise injury late in 2013. Though still an all-star player on the court, he's battled injuries and inconsistent play ever since. He had a great finals in 2103, especially games 4-7 where he averaged 24/6/5/2/2 on 49%. His overall playoff run in 2014 was at a solid all-star level at 18/4/4/2 on 50%, but he was bad in the finals.

As for OP's question, very few SG's not named Jordan have ever had great playoff runs at Wade and Kobe's age. It's called father time, and if you look throughout history almost all SG's experience a drop in play once they reach their early 30's.

[kennethgriffin]

Kobes played one season past 2012

His era was 2000 to 2010

Hense his player of the decade awards


2012 and beyond is like saying what did jordan do in the 2000's

[Wade's Rings]

He's got no cartilage in his knee, and I think the bolded is a bit of an exaggeration. From 2012-2015 (since turning 30) he's averaged 21/5/5 on 50% with a 23.5 PER. That's hardly falling off a cliff, especially for a 30+ year old guard. I fact, his 2013 regular season may be the most underrated of his career. 21/5/5/1.9/0.8 on 52% and a 24 PER, as a second option. He was the most efficient guard in the league, had the highest PER of any second option in the league, and was excellent defensively. He was still a 26/7/5 on good efficiency type first option.

I've always maintained that his days of being a consistent superstar ended when he suffered the bone bruise injury late in 2013. Though still an all-star player on the court, he's battled injuries and inconsistent play ever since. He had a great finals in 2103, especially games 4-7 where he averaged 24/6/5/2/2 on 49%. His overall playoff run in 2014 was at a solid all-star level at 18/4/4/2 on 50%, but he was bad in the finals.

As for OP's question, very few SG's not named Jordan have ever had great playoff runs at Wade and Kobe's age. It's called father time, and if you look throughout history almost all SG's experience a drop in play once they reach their early 30's.

:applause:

[DMAVS41]

He's got no cartilage in his knee, and I think the bolded is a bit of an exaggeration. From 2012-2015 (since turning 30) he's averaged 21/5/5 on 50% with a 23.5 PER. That's hardly falling off a cliff, especially for a 30+ year old guard. I fact, his 2013 regular season may be the most underrated of his career. 21/5/5/1.9/0.8 on 52% and a 24 PER, as a second option. He was the most efficient guard in the league, had the highest PER of any second option in the league, and was excellent defensively. He was still a 26/7/5 on good efficiency type first option.

I've always maintained that his days of being a consistent superstar ended when he suffered the bone bruise injury late in 2013. Though still an all-star player on the court, he's battled injuries and inconsistent play ever since. He had a great finals in 2103, especially games 4-7 where he averaged 24/6/5/2/2 on 49%. His overall playoff run in 2014 was at a solid all-star level at 18/4/4/2 on 50%, but he was bad in the finals.

As for OP's question, very few SG's not named Jordan have ever had great playoff runs at Wade and Kobe's age. It's called father time, and if you look throughout history almost all SG's experience a drop in play once they reach their early 30's.

I don't think you understood the bold. I clearly said he's fallen off a cliff in terms of his health and his play in certain moments.

Not sure how one could refute that. Dude has been chronically injured since the 12 finals and his play, in certain spots, has been dreadful. For example:

He had a 14/7/6 45% TS playoff series in 13
He had a 13/3/5 53% TS playoff series in 13
He had a 15/5/4 49% TS playoff series in 13

He had a 15/4/3 50% TS Finals series in 14

And he's missed what? Like 65 games over the last 3 seasons and has been routinely hurt in the playoffs...

Maybe you think less of Wade as a player than I do in his prime, but that is absolutely falling off hugely in certain key moments...just like I said...and is exactly why I phrased it the way I did.

And I like Wade...hell, I love Wade. Would take Wade over Kobe from 05 through 12 as a player. Used to argue Wade over Kobe during those years all the time. But since 12...his career ranking has taken a bit of a hit because he needed to age better than he has. Still an all time great player with an all time great career, and maybe he sees health and a nice finish to his career (I hope so), but the last 3 years have not been good for him after his injury problems throughout his career prior to that.

[BasedTom]

well one managed to win a ring as a second option...

[AnaheimLakers24]

Wade was actually pretty darn good in the finals....but he's been pretty awful in the playoffs overall since 12.

Kobe hasn't been in the playoffs so of course none.

Not sure the point...they've both been hurt. More defensible in Kobe's case as he's had about as long a career as possible while also playing all out in virtually every game he's ever played.

While I think Kobe's 13 season tends to get over-rated here, it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely great.

I used to be a lot higher on Wade overall as a player than I am now. I still hold my opinions on him at the time, but he's fallen off a cliff at a young age in terms of his health and play in some key times since 12. Hopefully this year he and the Heat bounce back because they actually have the tools to be an elite team.

years later, kobe still runs your life

[GrapeApe]

I don't think you understood the bold. I clearly said he's fallen off a cliff in terms of his health and his play in certain moments.

Not sure how one could refute that. Dude has been chronically injured since the 12 finals and his play, in certain spots, has been dreadful. For example:

He had a 14/7/6 45% TS playoff series in 13
He had a 13/3/5 53% TS playoff series in 13
He had a 15/5/4 49% TS playoff series in 13

He had a 15/4/3 50% TS Finals series in 14

Maybe you think less of Wade as a player than I do in his prime, but that is absolutely falling off hugely in certain key moments...just like I said...and is exactly why I phrased it the way I did.

Perhaps I did misinterpret what you said to some degree. You're a solid, objective poster. I think the "young age" part was my main issue, as the decline you referenced didn't really begin until he was 31. That's not exactly a geriatric, but most SG's start to fall off at that age. Unfortunately, Wade's health problems accelerated the process, especially in terms of the inconsistency you noted. As great as Wade was in his prime, I suppose it's fair to say his play has fallen off considerably from that level. No argument there. In terms of what I said about his 2013 regular season, his injury plagued playoff run tends to overshadow what was otherwise an outstanding year. Again, no argument that he struggled in the first 3 rounds.

Part of my point wasn't really directed at you. I think Wade's decline is exaggerated in that a lot of people make it sound as if he can't play. His health will always be an issue, but at 33/34 years old he's still among the most productive SG's in the league. If he can have a few more solid all-star caliber seasons and maybe even a deep playoff run, all things considered that would be a nice "twilight" of his career. His knee has been a ticking time-bomb since college, so the fact that he's still able to play at a high level at this stage in his career is impressive. A lot of people insisted that once he lost his athleticism he'd be completely ineffective, but that has proven not to be the case. His skill is and has always been highly underrated.

[DMAVS41]

Perhaps I did misinterpret what you said to some degree. You're a solid, objective poster. I think the "young age" part was my main issue, as the decline you referenced didn't really begin until he was 31. That's not exactly a geriatric, but most SG's start to fall off at that age. Unfortunately, Wade's health problems accelerated the process, especially in terms of the inconsistency you noted. As great as Wade was in his prime, I suppose it's fair to say his play has fallen off considerably from that level. No argument there. In terms of what I said about his 2013 regular season, his injury plagued playoff run tends to overshadow what was otherwise an outstanding year. Again, no argument that he struggled in the first 3 rounds.

Part of my point wasn't really directed at you. I think Wade's decline is exaggerated in that a lot of people make it sound as if he can't play. His health will always be an issue, but at 33/34 years old he's still among the most productive SG's in the league. If he can have a few more solid all-star caliber seasons and maybe even a deep playoff run, all things considered that would be a nice "twilight" of his career. His knee has been a ticking time-bomb since college, so the fact that he's still able to play at a high level at this stage in his career is impressive. A lot of people insisted that once he lost his athleticism he'd be completely ineffective, but that has proven not to be the case. His skill is and has always been highly underrated.

Yep. Any Wade that is remotely healthy is still an all star level player. I completely agree with that.

To me, age 31 to start the decline we have seen...especially with a player that didn't enter the NBA until age 22....and missed a lot of time throughout his career....is early. But that wasn't my real point or anything...

It was simply that the last 3 years haven't been very good overall for Wade...and thus where I would place him historically now (or would have assuming health) has taken a bit of a hit...and rightfully so.

We'll see how the remainder of his career goes, but it's just been an injury riddled career at this point. I don't think it was fair to say that after the 11 season...maybe even the 12 season...but at this point it's just been too large a chunk of his career battling injuries that kept him off the court or impacted him on it. He's spent a good portion of 6 years of his career battling injuries...that is half of his career going into this year.

[dubeta]

His era was 2000 to 2010




So you're saying....


He spent the first 1/3rd of his era getting carried

The middle 1/3rd of his era missing the playoffs/losing in the 1st round

The last 1/3 of his era being the 2nd best player on a championship team?

:confusedshrug:

[kennethgriffin]

So you're saying....


He spent the first 1/3rd of his era getting carried

The middle 1/3rd of his era missing the playoffs/losing in the 1st round

The last 1/3 of his era being the 2nd best player on a championship team?

:confusedshrug:


i dunno about all that

all i know is he won all the player of the decade awards

tnt, dime, SI, sporting news


the same people who voted your boi MVP 4 times said that kobe was the best of the 2000's



you can say shaq was better in 2000...but that doesnt change kobes all decade status


funny thing is lebron won't have an all decade award... the 2010s will more than likely belong to anthony davis or steph curry

[SouBeachTalents]

What championships/good Finals performances did LeBron have pre-2012?

[dubeta]

What championships/good Finals performances did LeBron have pre-2012?

1 good finals performance 22/9/7

:confusedshrug:

[kennethgriffin]

1 Championship + 3 good finals performances


:confusedshrug:


this f*ggot doesn't even know what "pre-2012" means



http://img.pandawhale.com/179505-Jacksonville-Jaguars-wtf-guy-g-d9yu.gif

[KembaWalker]

When LeBron Stans are still threatened by a 37 year old post-achilles tear Kobe Bryant :roll:

[GrapeApe]

Yep. Any Wade that is remotely healthy is still an all star level player. I completely agree with that.

To me, age 31 to start the decline we have seen...especially with a player that didn't enter the NBA until age 22....and missed a lot of time throughout his career....is early. But that wasn't my real point or anything...

It was simply that the last 3 years haven't been very good overall for Wade...and thus where I would place him historically now (or would have assuming health) has taken a bit of a hit...and rightfully so.

We'll see how the remainder of his career goes, but it's just been an injury riddled career at this point. I don't think it was fair to say that after the 11 season...maybe even the 12 season...but at this point it's just been too large a chunk of his career battling injuries that kept him off the court or impacted him on it. He's spent a good portion of 6 years of his career battling injuries...that is half of his career going into this year.

That's a fair assessment. Injuries and missed games are the main blemish on an otherwise stellar career. It's an unfortunate reality and frustrating as a Heat fan, but it is what it is. Hopefully he can put together few more productive seasons and at least one more good, healthy playoff run. Depending on his health and how long he wants to play, I could see him finishing his career with a Ginobli type role as a 6th man.