Curry or Prime CP3

[Captvic]

Who would you rather have on your team. I'd take Curry cause I honestly believe he is the best and most entertaining PG in the past 15 years

[Wade's Rings]

I prefer CP3.

[feyki]

08 and 09 Cp3 better .

[WorldWarriors]

Curry

[Hopper15]

I still would take Curry. Paul can't take a team to the finals.

[warriorfan]

Curry the Alpha Dog Championship Winner

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Paul.

[TrueBlue89]

Chris Paul is the best PG since Magic but Curry is by far the better closer.

[DaOldLion]

Curry easily

[warriorfan]

If you notice a trend all the Alpha posters are choosing Curry

[TripleA]

Peak Chris Paul is a better all around player but Curry's shooting bends the game to his will. His ability to shoot like that makes him a dominant force of nature despite his size. Paul does not have something like that to make up for his size. Its like asking Kg or Dirk.

So I pick Curry

[Hopper15]

Not to mention Curry will probably win another MVP this year.

Paul isn't coming close to winning one mvp award let alone two.

[DaOldLion]

08 and 09 Cp3 better .

at what?

losing by 60 points at home in the playoffs to a Carmelo led team?

[Wade's Rings]

at what?

losing by 60 points at home in the playoffs to a Carmelo led team?

That was '09 CP3 what about '08 CP3?

[Wade's Rings]

Not to mention Curry will probably win another MVP this year.

Paul isn't coming close to winning one mvp award let alone two.

:oldlol: You don't think '08 CP3 doesn't have a great chance at the MVP last year? What-if '08 CP had a squad like this he doesn't win MVP?

[Hopper15]

:oldlol: You don't think '08 CP3 doesn't have a great chance at the MVP last year? What-if '08 CP had a squad like this he doesn't win MVP?

Shoulda coulda woulda scenarios. No one cares about it.

[AnaheimLakers24]

Curry all day. Cp3 is gay and thus cant get to the wcf. Like he legit has sex with guys

[DaOldLion]

That was '09 CP3 what about '08 CP3?

what about him?

[sd3035]

Curry all day. Cp3 is gay and thus cant get to the wcf. Like he legit has sex with guys


That's a good point. He's obviously a receiver too, therefore not a great leader

[Smoke117]

http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1338/13388005/2389133-4949054815-micha.gif

[feyki]

at what?

losing by 60 points at home in the playoffs to a Carmelo led team?

Remember third game of the last finals Curry against Rabbit .

We must be look total impacts to the game . Single games examples wrong way .

08 Cp3 better than 15 Curry . I check the stats and playoffs series , 15 Curry better than 09 Cp3 , i agree with that .

[Al Thornton]

curry is one of the hardest players to guard of all time. paul is great but it's been proven many times that his play style isn't effective for the playoffs. when he dominates the ball so much his teams don't know what to do if he is getting double teamed. curry can play off the ball and be really good at it.

[DaOldLion]

Remember third game of the last finals Curry against Rabbit .

We must be look total impacts to the game . Single games examples wrong way .

08 Cp3 better than 15 Curry . I check the stats and playoffs series , 15 Curry better than 09 Cp3 , i agree with that .

not trying to be a dick but I can't exactly tell what you're trying to say..

You bring up a single game, and then go on to say we can't use single games to compare players.. :wtf:

and you're thinking of game 2 of last years finals.. the only bad game Curry had all series.. in game three he had 27pts on 50% and lit it up towards the end of the game which set the tone for the rest of the series

08 Paul isn't better than 15 Curry, all around skills wise? Maybe, but definitely not on impact.. the best version of Chris Paul couldn't even get to the second round.. and the Lakers eventually demolished the Spurs and the Lakers were demolished by Boston.. so trying to act like he faced some insurmountable opposition in 08 is off the table

Curry is much better at scoring and demands more defensive attention than Paul ever did, teams double team Curry behind the three point line which opens up the floor for his entire team, his impact on the game is crazy high, he was the best player on the best team in the league who won sixty seven games and won the championship, defeating the team in the WCF that Paul couldn't get over..

Curry's impact and ability to take over the game late, or just rattle off 9 points in three possessions effortlessly, open up the floor for this teammates, be the GOAT shooter while playing good defense is incredible. He hits shots that shouldn't go in which absolutely demoralizes the defense is overlooked too. He just brings more to the game

[game3524]

Peak CP3

Offensively they are about equal, but CP wast the arguably the best defender at the point guard position in his prime.

Granted, Steph isn't liability on defense, but CP was a legit difference maker on D.

[gcvbcat]

LAL DAL game on SonySix. fatass paul looks thin, I did not recognize him.

I will take curry, thank you.

[LakersForlife]

CP3 WOULD lead you to second round think about that:roll: :roll: :roll:

[LakersForlife]

plus cp3 is having anxiety issues in closing minutes lmao

[inclinerator]

cp3>zmc

[houston]

curry

[feyki]

not trying to be a dick but I can't exactly tell what you're trying to say..

You bring up a single game, and then go on to say we can't use single games to compare players.. :wtf:

and you're thinking of game 2 of last years finals.. the only bad game Curry had all series.. in game three he had 27pts on 50% and lit it up towards the end of the game which set the tone for the rest of the series

08 Paul isn't better than 15 Curry, all around skills wise? Maybe, but definitely not on impact.. the best version of Chris Paul couldn't even get to the second round.. and the Lakers eventually demolished the Spurs and the Lakers were demolished by Boston.. so trying to act like he faced some insurmountable opposition in 08 is off the table

Curry is much better at scoring and demands more defensive attention than Paul ever did, teams double team Curry behind the three point line which opens up the floor for his entire team, his impact on the game is crazy high, he was the best player on the best team in the league who won sixty seven games and won the championship, defeating the team in the WCF that Paul couldn't get over..

Curry's impact and ability to take over the game late, or just rattle off 9 points in three possessions effortlessly, open up the floor for this teammates, be the GOAT shooter while playing good defense is incredible. He hits shots that shouldn't go in which absolutely demoralizes the defense is overlooked too. He just brings more to the game

Irony .. Why don't understand that ?

Team accomplishments are different thing to individual level . You can't judge players with team accomplishments .

08 Cp3 better on defence , better on playmaking , better on possesions controls(less to , more steals , same ribaunds % ) . 15 Curry better on one points , shooting .

[Mike Armstrong]

Curry. At this point, there are only a select few PGs in NBA history that I take over him.

[Eye Test]

If you notice a trend all the Alpha posters are choosing Curry

This.

Curry.

[Thechosen1]

cp3 before his first knee injury would shit on curry like shit on him

the cp3 we have been watching since 10-15 is a fraudulent version...

[Harison]

Prime CP3 was probably a better overall player, but I still would take Curry over him. AMC has ball of steel and will to win, what does CP3 have mental-wise? Whining and being drama queen?

[bizil]

Typically, I always preferred PG's who were pass first BUT can be great scorers. Guys like Magic, Isiah, and Big O. A peak CP3 falls into that category. And to be frank, this style of PG is becoming RARE THESE DAYS. Plus CP3 is a great defensive PG. So in the ultimate floor general kind of sense, CP3 was the epitome of it.

However, Curry is SUCH A DOMINANT offensive player, that I think he's the superior player. And among the new age score first PG's (Westbrook, Rose, Lillard, Kyrie, etc.), he's the best floor general of that bunch. Steph's handles, vision, and creativity passing are awesome to watch.

Plus he's arguably the greatest shooter of all time. So I think it could come down to preference. BUT IN THIS CASE, give me Curry. Both Curry and Westbrook are redefining the PG position at the same time.

[oarabbus]

They are both such amazing players, that we have to go to ring count as the deciding factor.

How many rings did Prime CP3 have compared to Curry?

[Jameerthefear]

curry atm is better than Paul ever was.

[warriorfan]

Prime CP3 was probably a better overall player, but I still would take Curry over him. AMC has ball of steel and will to win, what does CP3 have mental-wise? Whining and being drama queen?

legit post

[warriorfan]

Typically, I always preferred PG's who were pass first BUT can be great scorers. Guys like Magic, Isiah, and Big O. A peak CP3 falls into that category. And to be frank, this style of PG is becoming RARE THESE DAYS. Plus CP3 is a great defensive PG. So in the ultimate floor general kind of sense, CP3 was the epitome of it.

However, Curry is SUCH A DOMINANT offensive player, that I think he's the superior player. And among the new age score first PG's (Westbrook, Rose, Lillard, Kyrie, etc.), he's the best floor general of that bunch. Steph's handles, vision, and creativity passing are awesome to watch.

Plus he's arguably the greatest shooter of all time. So I think it could come down to preference. BUT IN THIS CASE, give me Curry. Both Curry and Westbrook are redefining the PG position at the same time.

Remember that while CP3 was great offensively in '08 and '09 he was not playing no where near his current level of defense.

There could be an argument made for '08 and '09 CP3 to be equal to current Steph Curry offensively.

There could be no argument made for '08 and '09 CP3 to be equal to current Steph Curry defensively. Steph is hands down a better defender than young CP3.

[Young X]

2009 CP is the GOAT.

Best distributer in the league? Check.
One of the best scorers in the league? Check.
One of the best defenders at his position? Check.
One of the best rebounders at his position? Check.
Ridiculously efficient? Check.

CP is like the PG version of prime KG. Too bad he was on a garbage, injured team that year. He would've been amazing on a team like the Warriors with all the defenders and bench contributions they have.

[DaOldLion]

2009 CP is the GOAT.

Best distributer in the league? Check.
One of the best scorers in the league? Check.
One of the best defenders at his position? Check.
One of the best rebounders at his position? Check.
Ridiculously efficient? Check.

CP is like the PG version of prime KG. Too bad he was on a garbage, injured team that year. He would've been amazing on a team like the Warriors with all the defenders and bench contributions they have.

Led his team to a 60 pt loss at home in the playoffs? Check

Scored 4 points in that game? Check

[bizil]

Remember that while CP3 was great offensively in '08 and '09 he was not playing no where near his current level of defense.

There could be an argument made for '08 and '09 CP3 to be equal to current Steph Curry offensively.

There could be no argument made for '08 and '09 CP3 to be equal to current Steph Curry defensively. Steph is hands down a better defender than young CP3.

MY POINT WAS that CP3 has been an elite defender for his entire career. And the MAIN REASON why I would take Steph over CP3 is scoring. When it comes to defense and passing, CP3 is superior. U are also SLEEPING in CP3's strength over Curry. It allows to defend bigger guards better than Steph.

Plus for ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES, Curry is the perfect combo guard. CP3 is your prototype floor general who can ALSO dominate scoring. Two different but EPIC styles of PG's. For me, its actually more of a matter of preference on who u would take. But if I gotta choose, give my Steph.

[LoneyROY7]

2009 CP is the GOAT.

Best distributer in the league? Check.
One of the best scorers in the league? Check.
One of the best defenders at his position? Check.
One of the best rebounders at his position? Check.
Ridiculously efficient? Check.

CP is like the PG version of prime KG. Too bad he was on a garbage, injured team that year. He would've been amazing on a team like the Warriors with all the defenders and bench contributions they have.

Crazy thing is that in '09 he didn't even make 1st team All-NBA b/c of Wade and Kobe.

[Doranku]

Curry for the simple fact that he consistently plays aggressively when his team needs it. That has always big CP3's biggest problem and it doesn't appear to ever be changing, so if I'm trying to win I'm taking a guy like Curry every time.

[warriorfan]

MY POINT WAS that CP3 has been an elite defender for his entire career.

CP3 was not an elite defender for his entire career

All metrics and eye tests show that CP3 was not an impactful defender until later in his career.

http://www.gotbuckets.com/statistics/rapm/2008-rapm/

Chris Paul 08 DRAPM -0.34
Chris Paul 09 DRAPM 0.51
Chris Paul 10 DRAPM -.33
Chris Paul 11 DRAPM 0.68
Chris Paul 12 DRAPM 0.42
Chris Paul 13 DRAPM -.20
Chris Paul 14 DRAPM 1.73

'08 and '09 Chris Paul were not having the same defensive impact as the Chris Paul we see today.

You cannot mix past Chris Paul's offense with present Chris Paul's defense. That player never existed.

[bizil]

2009 CP is the GOAT.

Best distributer in the league? Check.
One of the best scorers in the league? Check.
One of the best defenders at his position? Check.
One of the best rebounders at his position? Check.
Ridiculously efficient? Check.

CP is like the PG version of prime KG. Too bad he was on a garbage, injured team that year. He would've been amazing on a team like the Warriors with all the defenders and bench contributions they have.

From an all around standpoint on both sides of the ball, I think CP3, Payton, and Frazier are the top three PG's of all time. So when u look at it from an ALL AROUND standpoint on both sides of the rock, I think CP3 has a great case as the best PG of all time.

But some may prefer Payton and Frazier because at 6'4 they could defend bigger SG's and SF's better than CP3. Plus they would have the size advantage most nights on the other PG's.

[bizil]

CP3 was not an elite defender for his entire career

All metrics and eye tests show that CP3 was not an impactful defender until later in his career.

http://www.gotbuckets.com/statistics/rapm/2008-rapm/

Chris Paul 08 DRAPM -0.34
Chris Paul 09 DRAPM 0.51
Chris Paul 10 DRAPM -.33
Chris Paul 11 DRAPM 0.68
Chris Paul 12 DRAPM 0.42
Chris Paul 13 DRAPM -.20
Chris Paul 14 DRAPM 1.73

'08 and '09 Chris Paul were not having the same defensive impact as the Chris Paul we see today.

You cannot mix past Chris Paul's offense with present Chris Paul's defense. That player never existed.

BUT YET, CP3 has made ALL NBA DEFENSE:

2007-08 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2008-09 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2010-11 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2011-12 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2012-13 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2013-14 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2014-15 NBA All-Defensive (1st)

SO AS I SAID, for the majority of CP3's career, HE'S BEEN REGARDED as an elite defender. ELITE DOESN'T MEAN the best EVERY YEAR!! It MEANS u are among the best. Which CP3 HAS PROVEN YEAR IN AND YEAR OUT!!!!!

[DaOldLion]

BUT YET, CP3 has made ALL NBA DEFENSE:

2007-08 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2008-09 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2010-11 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2011-12 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2012-13 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2013-14 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2014-15 NBA All-Defensive (1st)

SO AS I SAID, for the majority of CP3's career, HE'S BEEN REGARDED as an elite defender. ELITE DOESN'T MEAN the best EVERY YEAR!! It MEANS u are among the best. Which CP3 HAS PROVEN YEAR IN AND YEAR OUT!!!!!

Haven't you heard the news? All defensive teams mean nothing :hammerhead:

[DMAVS41]

Haven't you heard the news? All defensive teams mean nothing :hammerhead:

They certainly don't mean more than what actually was happening on the court. Certain fans tend not to understand the rest of us actually care more about reality over voting.

[warriorfan]

BUT YET, CP3 has made ALL NBA DEFENSE:

2007-08 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2008-09 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2010-11 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2011-12 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2012-13 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2013-14 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2014-15 NBA All-Defensive (1st)

SO AS I SAID, for the majority of CP3's career, HE'S BEEN REGARDED as an elite defender. ELITE DOESN'T MEAN the best EVERY YEAR!! It MEANS u are among the best. Which CP3 HAS PROVEN YEAR IN AND YEAR OUT!!!!!

you are a blind lemming that cannot watch basketball and draw your own conclusions and you are starting to have a meltdown at this point

I'm done discussing basketball with you

[bizil]

Haven't you heard the news? All defensive teams mean nothing :hammerhead:

But the BOTTOM LINE is CP3 made those All Defensive teams throughout his career. IF ANYTHING it means u are an ELITE DEFENDER!!! Certain selections can be debated. But I THINK EVERY GUY that is chosen CAN BE CONSIDERED AT LEAST an elite defender!!

[oarabbus]

But the BOTTOM LINE is CP3 made those All Defensive teams throughout his career. IF ANYTHING it means u are an ELITE DEFENDER!!! Certain selections can be debated. But I THINK EVERY GUY that is chosen CAN BE CONSIDERED AT LEAST an elite defender!!


I think he feels the same way as you, dude. He was giving a sarcastic response since people were saying Dirk (back in the day) is a better defender than Kobe based on advanced metrics, but the Kobe fans pointed to his All-Defense selections.

[DMAVS41]

But the BOTTOM LINE is CP3 made those All Defensive teams throughout his career. IF ANYTHING it means u are an ELITE DEFENDER!!! Certain selections can be debated. But I THINK EVERY GUY that is chosen CAN BE CONSIDERED AT LEAST an elite defender!!


you are throwing around the term "elite" far too loosely.

Jason Kidd was an elite defensive guard. CP3 never touches that level...I'd never consider CP3 elite on defense because then what is left for a guy like Kidd? Or Payton?

Super duper super duper elite?

Also, I can assure the player who shall not be named that made many all defensive teams was absolutely not playing elite defense many of the years.

I know this is largely semantics and I'm probably guilty of throwing around certain words too often, but making an all defensive team does absolutely not make one an elite defender.

[DaOldLion]

I think he feels the same way as you, dude. He was giving a sarcastic response since people were saying Dirk (back in the day) is a better defender than Kobe based on advanced metrics, but the Kobe fans pointed to his All-Defense selections.

yeah we have stats showing Paul as a negative on defense in a certain year, he still made the all nba defensive team over Wade that year (HOW DARE HE :cry: ) and then he brings up all defensive selections to justify Paul being a great defender..

now take Paul's name and replace you know who and he gets written off as an idiot and multiple posters would be on his ass.. I'm not even a fan of Kobe, I don't dislike him, just indifferent. But on my short time on ISH seeing this dude get held to the weirdest double standard is making this place hard to take seriously

at least rational discussion can be had here, just not involving Kobe and Lebron to an extent although I haven't seen him talked about as much this year so far as guys like Kobe and Curry

[bizil]

you are a blind lemming that cannot watch basketball and draw your own conclusions and you are starting to have a meltdown at this point

I'm done discussing basketball with you

Then go SUCK A DICK BITCH!! U are the one who responded to my initial post ANYWAY!! Once u disagree with me, I'M ENTITLED to respond back to u with FACTS!! U may disagree!! Which is FINE!! But the BOTTOM LINE IS i'm a hoops junkie!! I know the game very well!!! I've had some of the BEST POSTERS on this site PM me and give me props. EVEN WHEN WE DISAGREE!! So who the **** ARE U to knock my hoops intellect!!!

[bizil]

I think he feels the same way as you, dude. He was giving a sarcastic response since people were saying Dirk (back in the day) is a better defender than Kobe based on advanced metrics, but the Kobe fans pointed to his All-Defense selections.

I hear ya! But my point was that during the duration of his career that CP3 has been considered an elite defender. Not just for a year or two. BUT FOR MOST of his career, Paul has been an elite defender. That was my point. Even if he had an off year or two, MOST of his career Paul has been an elite defender.

[warriorfan]

Then go SUCK A DICK BITCH!! U are the one who responded to my initial post ANYWAY!! Once u disagree with me, I'M ENTITLED to respond back to u with FACTS!! U may disagree!! Which is FINE!! But the BOTTOM LINE IS i'm a hoops junkie!! I know the game very well!!! I've had some of the BEST POSTERS on this site PM me and give me props. EVEN WHEN WE DISAGREE!! So who the **** ARE U to knock my hoops intellect!!!

Saying that '08 CP3 is a better defender than current Curry because he was selected to a 2nd NBA defensive team is not a fact.

I will say that I have read your posts and you are usually a pretty good poster. just go smoke a joint or some shit, not even trying to be a dick about it but you are having an epic meltdown right now

[bizil]

you are throwing around the term "elite" far too loosely.

Jason Kidd was an elite defensive guard. CP3 never touches that level...I'd never consider CP3 elite on defense because then what is left for a guy like Kidd? Or Payton?

Super duper super duper elite?

Also, I can assure the player who shall not be named that made many all defensive teams was absolutely not playing elite defense many of the years.

I know this is largely semantics and I'm probably guilty of throwing around certain words too often, but making an all defensive team does absolutely not make one an elite defender.


Disagree BIG TIME!!! For starters, I think Payton and Kidd are better defenders than CP3. They are bigger and CAN DEFEND PG's, SG's, and SF's. Secondly there is a DIFFERENCE between ELITE AND THE BEST!!! When did i EVER say CP3 was the best defensive PG of all time? Or the BEST in today's game??? But I DO FEEL that CP3 had done enough to be considered an elite defensive PG. Ive heard the analysts THROUGHOUT THE YEARS in the NBA circles SAY THE SAME!! So I THINK I WILL TAKE THEIR OPINIONS OVER YOURS!!!!!

[24-Inch_Chrome]

bizil is lowkey one of the best posters on this site. Always respectful, never hates on players, quality poster through and through. This is the first time I've seen a troll elicit an irritated response.

[warriorfan]

bizil is lowkey one of the best posters on this site. Always respectful, never hates on players, quality poster through and through. This is the first time I've seen a troll elicit an irritated response.

no one is trolling you autistic canadian loser go back to the BTE and post about japanese cartoons

[DMAVS41]

Disagree BIG TIME!!! For starters, I think Payton and Kidd are better defenders than CP3. They are bigger and CAN DEFEND PG's, SG's, and SF's. Secondly there is a DIFFERENCE between ELITE AND THE BEST!!! When did i EVER say CP3 was the best defensive PG of all time? Or the BEST in today's game??? But I DO FEEL that CP3 had done enough to be considered an elite defensive PG. Ive heard the analysts THROUGHOUT THE YEARS in the NBA circles SAY THE SAME!! So I THINK I WILL TAKE THEIR OPINIONS OVER YOURS!!!!!

Seems semantical

Regardless, pg defense should not be used as a determining factor between CP3 and other guards unless said other guard is one of the worst defenders ever because CP3's (elite or not) defense never made the kind of big impact it would have to...in order to argue it as a big factor

[bizil]

bizil is lowkey one of the best posters on this site. Always respectful, never hates on players, quality poster through and through. This is the first time I've seen a troll elicit an irritated response.

Thanks for the props! I dig your posts a lot too! The APPEAL of this site for me are:

- Posting about hoops with people who are students of the game

- Learning about aspects I wasn't aware of

- Having great debates and disagreements. When done respectfully, it's FUN AS HELL! I can disagree with a poster AND STILL give them props for their basketball acumen

But where warriorfan went wrong was responding to me like this:

"you are a blind lemming that cannot watch basketball and draw your own conclusions and you are starting to have a meltdown at this point

I'm done discussing basketball with you"

At that point, he made shit personal. There was no need for that type of approach. When i was just disagreeing with his opinion. When it gets to that kind of shit, IT SHOWS the lame sensitive side of a poster. Sad sad sad....

[Young X]

Seems semantical

Regardless, pg defense should not be used as a determining factor between CP3 and other guards unless said other guard is one of the worst defenders ever because CP3's (elite or not) defense never made the kind of big impact it would have to...in order to argue it as a big factorIt's not a large factor, but it does matter and does make a difference (not saying you said otherwise).

If you put Nash or Magic on CP3's Hornets/Clippers teams, they'd go from being mediocre/decent defensive teams to a bottom level ones. That matters in discussions like this.

[DMAVS41]

It's not a large factor, but it does matter and does make a difference (not saying you said otherwise).

If you put Nash or Magic on CP3's Hornets/Clippers teams, they'd go from being mediocre/decent defensive teams to a bottom level ones. That matters in discussions like this.

Completely agree.

[notatop29pg]

I remember watching a lot of CP3 during his early years and i noticed that his man always got past him BUT only when going baseline. As i have never played anything but local hoops before, i just assumed he was playing bad defense. Until it hit me one day that he was giving them the baseline, as he knew Chandler was there waiting for them.

So i think there are two types of defenders:

1. The guy that just hounds and hounds and won't let you move until you get rid of the ball (Bradley,Allen).

2. The type of guy that will give you an out, while trusting that his teammate (chandler, DJ etc) will be aware of the plan and will be ready to block the shot or help create the turnover.

I have no doubt that CP3 could play like option number 1.. but it would drain a lot more energy and get him in foul trouble far more often. Unfortunately it is the Allen/Bradley type defenders that get all the attention.

[Heavincent]

Curry

[Heavincent]

2009 CP is the GOAT.

Best distributer in the league? Check.
One of the best scorers in the league? Check.
One of the best defenders at his position? Check.
One of the best rebounders at his position? Check.
Ridiculously efficient? Check.

CP is like the PG version of prime KG. Too bad he was on a garbage, injured team that year. He would've been amazing on a team like the Warriors with all the defenders and bench contributions they have.

GOAT of what? Isn't that the year he scored 4 points in a 58 point loss at home in the playoffs?

[T_L_P]

In terms of a full season, I'd still take 08 or 09 Paul over last year's Curry.

However, if Curry can keep this up (or even stay remotely close to it), it's gotta be him. He's doing stuff I've never seen before.

[tpols]

what does paul do better besides dribble a little more ?

[Foster5k]

what does paul do better besides dribble a little more ?
flop
bitch
:cry:
yell at teammates

[Heavincent]

Chris Paul has literally never won a meaningful NBA game despite playing with some respectable talent. By meaningful, I mean a game that occurs after the second round.

Very good player, but he's overrated as shit.

[tpols]

flop
bitch
:cry:
yell at teammates

was asking positives, but word. lol

[DMAVS41]

what does paul do better besides dribble a little more ?

I'd probably argue he manages a game a bit better and defends better...at least he did in his prime.

But those things just aren't more valuable than what Curry does.

These two are a good example of how a lot of us tend to "over-rate" the more complete player.

Sometimes the transcendent offensive shooter / scorer is just more valuable like in the case of Kobe vs KG imo. I used to think KG was more valuable back in the day...now I don't. Curry vs Paul is like that for me...10 years ago I would have over valued some of the things Paul does...

[Heavincent]

David West was a 20/8 guy in New Orleans. Blake Griffin has a career average of 22/10/4 (!!).

Please stop acting like Paul has been playing with crap.

[notatop29pg]

I'd probably argue he manages a game a bit better and defends better...at least he did in his prime.

But those things just aren't more valuable than what Curry does.

These two are a good example of how a lot of us tend to "over-rate" the more complete player.

Sometimes the transcendent offensive shooter / scorer is just more valuable like in the case of Kobe vs KG imo. I used to think KG was more valuable back in the day...now I don't. Curry vs Paul is like that for me...10 years ago I would have over valued some of the things Paul does...

But its always like that.

10yrs from now some dude might come along and average 5pts 20 assists and he'll be a winner, and we'll be saying 20assists>>>>Curry.

What Curry does now is extremely valuable in todays game, that doesnt mean that what Paul/Rose/Rondo etc did in their primes wasnt equally as valuable at that time.

[DMAVS41]

But its always like that.

10yrs from now some dude might come along and average 5pts 20 assists and he'll be a winner, and we'll be saying 20assists>>>>Curry.

What Curry does now is extremely valuable in todays game, that doesnt mean that what Paul/Rose/Rondo etc did in their primes wasnt equally as valuable at that time.

I'm not saying Paul wasn't valuable...far from it.

I just think historically we have under-rated what all time great shooting/scoring does to other teams.

And those other guards you listed simply can't make up that gap the way a Duncan could by being great on the glass and on offense...while also dominating games on defense. It's going to be very hard for another guard to replicate the impact Curry is currently having.

I really think he could go down as the 2nd best pg for me if he has a long career. This level of dominance is insane...and he's so versatile that he can dominate without the ball in his hands...which is absurd for a ****ing pg. It's transcendent stuff.

[warriorfan]

Thanks for the props! I dig your posts a lot too! The APPEAL of this site for me are:

- Posting about hoops with people who are students of the game

- Learning about aspects I wasn't aware of

- Having great debates and disagreements. When done respectfully, it's FUN AS HELL! I can disagree with a poster AND STILL give them props for their basketball acumen

But where warriorfan went wrong was responding to me like this:

"you are a blind lemming that cannot watch basketball and draw your own conclusions and you are starting to have a meltdown at this point

I'm done discussing basketball with you"

At that point, he made shit personal. There was no need for that type of approach. When i was just disagreeing with his opinion. When it gets to that kind of shit, IT SHOWS the lame sensitive side of a poster. Sad sad sad....

my bad I honestly didn't mean to troll you so badly

I was getting frusturated because I honestly believe that CP3 was not a good defender in '08 or '09. I watched a lot of basketball in '08 and '09 and CP3 was not a great defender. He was lighting fast and could get steals all day but he wasn't a flawless defender consistently play in and play out like he is today. On top of this I gave some advanced stat data that shows that CP3 wasn't having a great impact defensively early in his career as well. then in response to this you just go like "he was selected to 2nd all nba defense team, he was elite defender" That shit is annoying. It's well known that All-NBA team selections can be heavily influenced by player politics and star players can get much more love from the NBA teams that is actually deserved.

So when I give my take that I've seen with my own eyes and researched the data to back it up and you tell me that I'm wrong because some other assholes messed up and voted CP3 to some 2nd all defense teams in 08...that shit is mad annoying

[Milbuck]

One thing that gets criminally underrated about Curry's game is his decision making and court vision.

Dude has made MASSIVE improvements as a floor general since entering the league. It gets overlooked by his video game-like shooting/scoring skills but he has such a unique knack for dishing through the tightest gaps in the defense, making the right play even through his crazy dribble moves (similar to how a guy like Wall can make brilliant passes despite playing at such a high speed). It's not obvious right away because he doesn't dominate the ball like a traditional PG and specifically look to pass all the time, but his ability to read defenses as a playmaker and scorer simultaneously, handle the ball and move without the ball equally well makes him one of the most portable offensive players ever and elevates his teammates just as much as any PG this side of Magic ever has.

[Young X]

what does paul do better besides dribble a little more ?This forum man...

CP3 is a MUCH better distributor/passer.
Better ballhandler who takes much better care of the ball.
Better midrange jumpshooter (last season at least).
Better defender.
More efficient (not shooting wise but running an overall offense).
Smarter decision maker/shot selection.

He does so many things better than Curry. Curry's only real advantage is shooting (obviously a clear advantage and it somewhat makes up for all the things Paul does better) and it's not like CP isn't a great shooter himself.

*This is just based off of their level of play up to the 2015 season. What Curry is doing so far this season is insane and no version of Paul even comes close to how good he's been so far but it's still early.

[notatop29pg]

I'm not saying Paul wasn't valuable...far from it.

I just think historically we have under-rated what all time great shooting/scoring does to other teams.

And those other guards you listed simply can't make up that gap the way a Duncan could by being great on the glass and on offense...while also dominating games on defense. It's going to be very hard for another guard to replicate the impact Curry is currently having.

I really think he could go down as the 2nd best pg for me if he has a long career. This level of dominance is insane...and he's so versatile that he can dominate without the ball in his hands...which is absurd for a ****ing pg. It's transcendent stuff.

No doubt.

I hate saying it, but another 2-3 seasons like this or last and he is right up there.

As it stands for me though - Last season was excellent... this season is shaping up to be out of this world. But its currently 1 elite season and 8 outrageous games out of 6 full seasons, which CURRENTLY puts him slightly ahead of Rose/Rondo in their best season.

Hopefully he doesn't vanish like those guys have.

[DMAVS41]

No doubt.

I hate saying it, but another 2-3 seasons like this or last and he is right up there.

As it stands for me though - Last season was excellent... this season is shaping up to be out of this world. But its currently 1 elite season and 8 outrageous games out of 6 full seasons, which CURRENTLY puts him slightly ahead of Rose/Rondo in their best season.

Hopefully he doesn't vanish like those guys have.

Yes...totally agree.

Part of being a great basketball player is doing it for well over a decade.

I will say though...since Curry came back from that 12 injury...he's been pretty ****ing consistently good and has developed into all time great stud these last 2 years. So he's got 4 damn good years including this one in the bag.

[Fire Colangelo]

When was the last time a point guard was widely considered as the best player in the league?

CP3 was the best point guard, but never best player in the league.

Nash? Meh, you could argue that Nash was the most valuable (I'd argue that actually), but was he really a better basketball player than Duncan, KG, Kobe, LeBron, or Dirk in his MVP seasons?

Rose? He was good, but he sure as hell isn't doing what Curry's doing right now.

Kidd? Payton? Stockton? Nah

Only Magic Johnson.

That's great company to be in imo. If Curry continues what he's doing right now, he'd have an argument for the GOAT peak all time when it's all said and done. Up there with MJ and Shaq.

That's pretty incredible.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Oscar falls into that category too.

[FKAri]

When was the last time a point guard was widely considered as the best player in the league?

CP3 was the best point guard, but never best player in the league.

Nash? Meh, you could argue that Nash was the most valuable (I'd argue that actually), but was he really a better basketball player than Duncan, KG, Kobe, LeBron, or Dirk in his MVP seasons?

Rose? He was good, but he sure as hell isn't doing what Curry's doing right now.

Kidd? Payton? Stockton? Nah

Only Magic Johnson.

That's great company to be in imo. If Curry continues what he's doing right now, he'd have an argument for the GOAT peak all time when it's all said and done. Up there with MJ and Shaq.

That's pretty incredible.

https://media.giphy.com/media/6J9EYB2Z27Qg8/giphy.gif

[Marchesk]

Only Magic Johnson.

Oscar Robertson won an MVP during prime Russell and Chamberlain years.

[tpols]

CP3 is a MUCH better distributor/passer.
Better ballhandler who takes much better care of the ball.
Better midrange jumpshooter (last season at least).
Better defender.
More efficient (not shooting wise but running an overall offense).
Smarter decision maker/shot selection.
.

disagree on all these except better distributor.. but tbh, that works to paul's detriment in the playoffs and when it matters most, so its barely even a positive.


Paul dribbles more, doesn't have necessarily better handles.. curry has absolutely insane dribbling skills/coordination + better off ball play. Curry's midrange is fine, but he doesn't need to over dribble into that shot when he can wet a 25+ footer with ease more in the flow of the game. Defense is a wash.. neither is a true game changer on that end.

[DMAVS41]

disagree on all these except better distributor.. but tbh, that works to paul's detriment in the playoffs and when it matters most, so its barely even a positive.


Paul dribbles more, doesn't have necessarily better handles.. curry has absolutely insane dribbling skills/coordination + better off ball play. Curry's midrange is fine, but he doesn't need to over dribble into that shot when he can wet a 25+ footer with ease more in the flow of the game. Defense is a wash.. neither is a true game changer on that end.

Paul was definitely a better defender in his prime...currently it's probably a wash, but at his peak Paul was better.

Now, like I said, how much that actually means at the guard position might not be that much, but Paul was better on defense.

[tpols]

Paul was definitely a better defender in his prime...currently it's probably a wash, but at his peak Paul was better.

Now, like I said, how much that actually means at the guard position might not be that much, but Paul was better on defense.

it doesn't offset everything else though.. and neither are guys you'd watch for their defense.

[Fire Colangelo]

https://media.giphy.com/media/6J9EYB2Z27Qg8/giphy.gif

Keyword: If he keeps it up.

If he keeps 32/5/6 on 70% TS while winning the next 2 championships....

You don't think his peak is up there with MJ and Shaq?


Oscar Robertson won an MVP during prime Russell and Chamberlain years.

I never really considered prime Oscar to be better players than Russell and Wilt at any point of his career. But my point still stands:

Magic Johnson
Oscar Robertson

That's some elite company to be in..... To be seen as the best player in the NBA as a point guard.

[Heavincent]

Curry has a more positive impact on his teammates than Paul, due to drawing much more defensive attention.

[Young X]

disagree on all these except better distributor.. but tbh, that works to paul's detriment in the playoffs and when it matters most, so its barely even a positive.


Paul dribbles more, doesn't have necessarily better handles.. curry has absolutely insane dribbling skills/coordination + better off ball play. Curry's midrange is fine, but he doesn't need to over dribble into that shot when he can wet a 25+ footer with ease more in the flow of the game. Defense is a wash.. neither is a true game changer on that end.I don't care about who has flashier "handles". CP is the better ball handler and has better much better ball security/is less turnover prone.

CP is more efficient individually and he has run better offenses. These are facts.

And no way is their defense a "wash". CP has been an elite defender for his position while Curry has been above average on that end. Curry isn't even assigned to opposing PG's at times, he has Klay do that for him. Paul doesn't have that luxury.

It's one thing to say you prefer Curry, but to make it seem like Paul doesn't do anything better? That's stupid.

[Marchesk]

I never really considered prime Oscar to be better players than Russell and Wilt at any point of his career. But my point still stands:

Magic Johnson
Oscar Robertson

That's some elite company to be in..... To be seen as the best player in the NBA as a point guard.

It is, and Curry is having an incredible start. But I don't think he's actually better than Lebron, as witnessed in the finals when it mattered. Lebron has no reason to go all out in the regular season anymore. I doubt winning another MVP is all that important to him.

[warriorfan]

I don't care about who has flashier "handles". CP is the better ball handler and has better much better ball security/is less turnover prone.

CP is more efficient individually and he has run better offenses. These are facts.

And no way is their defense a "wash". CP has been an elite defender for his position while Curry has been above average on that end. Curry isn't even assigned to opposing PG's at times, he has Klay to do that for him. Paul doesn't have that luxury.


It's one thing to say you prefer Curry, but to make it seem like Paul doesn't do anything better? That's stupid.

Curry is running the best pick and roll in the league with Draymond fuccing Green.

CP3 has ran pick and roll with David West and BLake Griffin his whole life. Put CP3 with Draymond Green and they would suck dicc.

[Draz]

Chris Paul is a fcking loser.

[Young X]

Curry is running the best pick and roll in the league with Draymond fuccing Green.

CP3 has ran pick and roll with David West and BLake Griffin his whole life. Put CP3 with Draymond Green and they would suck dicc.CP was just fine running screen & roll with Blake injured last season. He averaged around 21/12 in the month without Blake.

I could easily flip this on you and say he never got to play with a SG even close to being as good as Klay was/is. An all-star wing player who can take his toughest assignments and allow him to be hidden on defense.

[Fire Colangelo]

It is, and Curry is having an incredible start. But I don't think he's actually better than Lebron, as witnessed in the finals when it mattered. Lebron has no reason to go all out in the regular season anymore. I doubt winning another MVP is all that important to him.

Agreed, Curry obviously has to keep this up (this is a huge if) before being crowned the best player in the league. Whether that happens or not remains to be seen.

LeBron is having a lowkey great season himself, but like you said he's still coasting. Whether he can still turn it on or not, remains to be seen.

For now, I have Curry as the best player in the world unless he cools down, or someone else heats up.

[warriorfan]

CP was just fine running screen & roll with Blake injured last season. He averaged around 21/12 in the month without Blake.

I could easily flip this on you and say he never got to play with a SG even close to being as good as Klay was/is. An all-star wing player who can take his toughest assignments and allow him to be hidden on defense.

Klay Thompson is J J Reddick

[FashionIssues]

curry has surpassed him in skill, stardom, and a ring.

[notatop29pg]

Klay Thompson is J J Reddick

Only 4/5 inches taller.

[Young X]

Klay Thompson is J J ReddickHe's been trash this season but last year he was easily better than Redick just off defense alone. As much as I like Redick he's never been an all-star caliber player and he relies on others to get him the ball.

Thompson was on another level and easily better than any SG CP has ever played with (Redick, Crawford, Rasual Butler, Mo Pete, Randy Foye, etc).

So much talk about all the things Curry does when CP has ran better offenses and is more efficient overall offensively. This WHILE being a better defender.

[DMAVS41]

He's been trash this season but last year he was easily better than Redick just off defense alone. As much as I like Redick he's never been an all-star caliber player and he relies on others to get him the ball.

Thompson was on another level and easily better than any SG CP has ever played with (Redick, Crawford, Rasual Butler, Mo Pete, Randy Foye, etc).

So much talk about all the things Curry does when CP has ran better offenses and is more efficient overall offensively. This WHILE being a better defender.

How are you defining more efficient overall offensively?

[Young X]

How are you defining more efficient overall offensively?Managing/maximizing possessions.

[DMAVS41]

Managing/maximizing possessions.

Okay...just didn't know what you meant by personally more efficient.

Yea...I think it would surprise people that Paul has 6 seasons of offensive ratings higher than Curry's last year...and 8 equal to or higher.

I still think Curry's shooting and off ball impact trump Paul's advantages, but it's close.

[Milbuck]

Managing/maximizing possessions.
You could argue that Curry's ability to play equally well off the ball as he does on the ball maximizes the capabilities of his teammates, particularly as playmakers. It's one of those 3ball references but it actually applies here. Curry is one of the most portable offensive players in history because he can operate as a traditional point guard, a scoring combo guard, and an off-ball 2 guard whenever he wants to. And that is the biggest reason why Golden State ran one of the most high powered and efficient offenses of all time last year and this year.

The Warriors were at about league average in turnovers while being #1 in pace by almost a full 2 points, and #3 in field goals attempted. Also #1 in TS% and eFG%.

[DMAVS41]

You could argue that Curry's ability to play equally well off the ball as he does on the ball maximizes the capabilities of his teammates, particularly as playmakers. It's one of those 3ball references but it actually applies here. Curry is one of the most portable offensive players in history because he can operate as a traditional point guard, a scoring combo guard, and an off-ball 2 guard whenever he wants to. And that is the biggest reason why Golden State ran one of the most high powered and efficient offenses of all time last year and this year.

The Warriors were at about league average in turnovers while being #1 in pace by almost a full 2 points, and #3 in field goals attempted. Also #1 in TS% and eFG%.

Yea...that off ball impact is so key here. There is so much hidden value to Curry.

Whereas everything Paul contributes on the court is pretty much picked up by stats.

[Young X]

Okay...just didn't know what you meant by personally more efficient.

Yea...I think it would surprise people that Paul has 6 seasons of offensive ratings higher than Curry's last year...and 8 equal to or higher.

I still think Curry's shooting and off ball impact trump Paul's advantages, but it's close.Not only that, but he's had the #1 on-court offensive rating since 2012 since he's gotten to the Clippers. If you extend it to 2008 he's 2nd behind Nash.

And his teams completely dropoff horribly when he sits on the bench. Last season for example, they were +19.9 pts better on offense when he played vs. when he sat. That's the biggest dropoff ever recorded.

[knicksman]

Its curry and its not even close. Curry is a scorer while cp3 is a pg. And the last time pgs has won was in the 80's And just look at the top 10 ATG, its dominated by scorers coz scorers>>pgs.

[Jacks3]

Curry easily. Best offensive player of the post-jordan era (in terms of peak play).

[HenryGarfunkle]

Curry easily. Best offensive player of the post-jordan era (in terms of peak play).
not even close.

shaq, lebron, durant, wade, mcrgrady, kobe, etc.

[bizil]

You could argue that Curry's ability to play equally well off the ball as he does on the ball maximizes the capabilities of his teammates, particularly as playmakers. It's one of those 3ball references but it actually applies here. Curry is one of the most portable offensive players in history because he can operate as a traditional point guard, a scoring combo guard, and an off-ball 2 guard whenever he wants to. And that is the biggest reason why Golden State ran one of the most high powered and efficient offenses of all time last year and this year.

The Warriors were at about league average in turnovers while being #1 in pace by almost a full 2 points, and #3 in field goals attempted. Also #1 in TS% and eFG%.

Good points! Peak or best player wise AS WELL AS GOAT WISE, I wouldn't be surprised if these are the top three PG's of all time eventually:

Magic
Big O
Steph

As great as Isiah was, I could EASILY see Steph passing him by. Peak or better player wise, I would take Steph over Isiah ALREADY! And that's saying A LOT!! Its just GOAT status where Isiah has the edge at this point.

[Marchesk]

Good points! Peak or best player wise AS WELL AS GOAT WISE, I wouldn't be surprised if these are the top three PG's of all time eventually:

Magic
Big O
Steph

As great as Isiah was, I could EASILY see Steph passing him by. Peak or better player wise, I would take Steph over Isiah ALREADY! And that's saying A LOT!! Its just GOAT status where Isiah has the edge at this point.

Tiny Archibald did lead the league in scoring and assists one season.

[DoctorP]

Curry. He makes the game a lot easier for the whole team.

[atljonesbro]

Curry and it's not even close

[bizil]

Tiny Archibald did lead the league in scoring and assists one season.

I'm aware of that. But I would still take Steph over Tiny! Tiny was a beast NO DOUBT! But give me Steph! Only PG's FOR SURE I would take over Steph better player wise are Magic and Big O. I think Steph AS WELL as Westbrook are gonna shake up the all time PG rankings if they stay healthy. The thing that Magic, Big O, Curry, and Westbrook ALL HAVE IN COMMON is the fact that they are matchup nightmares in terms of their scoring ability among PG's. Magic and Big O due to size(the biggest LONG TERM PG's ever) . Westbrook in terms of his freakish athletic ability (most freakish athletic PG ever). And Curry because of his shooting ability (greatest shooter ever).

[Anaximandro1]

Curry

[Dragonyeuw]

bizil is lowkey one of the best posters on this site. Always respectful, never hates on players, quality poster through and through. This is the first time I've seen a troll elicit an irritated response.

Agree, I like his posts too. Quietly one of the best posters here IMO.

[sportjames23]

AMChris Paul