Tim Duncan: 1000 wins with one team countdown!

[Springsteen]

Most games won with 1 franchise in NBA history:
1. Tim Duncan, Spurs (958 and counting)
2. John Stockton, Jazz (953)
3. Karl Malone, Jazz (919)
4. Kobe Bryant, Lakers (825 and counting)
5. John Havlicek, Celtics (824)

Spurs are currently 7-2.

Will be updating this thread as the season continues.

http://www.carloisles.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/nba-funny-tim-duncan-e1422378578381.jpg

[Dr Hawk]

He is a great playter no doubt, a Top 10 player, but he has had a lot of luck with the coach + teammates

[ninephive]

He is a great playter no doubt, a Top 10 player, but he has had a lot of luck with the coach + teammates
Not really compared to the other greats.

[Dr Hawk]

Not really compared to the other greats.

Hakeem, for instance

[SugarHill]

Kinda weird that he's over Stockton

[feyki]

7th all time after Kareem,Bill,Wilt,Jordan,Mikan,Bird :applause: .

[AnaheimLakers24]

I hope he thanks tony, pop, manu, bowen, robinson, kwahii, and lma

[dhsilv]

He is a great playter no doubt, a Top 10 player, but he has had a lot of luck with the coach + teammates

Certainly there was luck, but a lot of "bad luck" was the result of someone's personality/issues. The spurs were very close to firing Pop early on, Duncan came through and won big games needed to keep Pop. Player conflicts happened with the spurs, but never with Duncan. No rumors of much of anything outside of a brief look at Orlando.

Duncan has been a rock for the spurs and their organization.

[r15mohd]

He is a great playter no doubt, a Top 10 player, but he has had a lot of luck with the coach + teammates


this can be said about any top 10 player...sans Hakeem...to be honest

MJ - Phil, Pippen, Rodman
Magic -Showtime, Riley, weakest conference ever
KAJ - Showtime, Riley, weakest conference ever
Russell - HoF Celtics team, 60s
Bird - McHale, Parish, Ainge, Johnson

:confusedshrug:

[livingby3's]

I hope he thanks tony, pop, manu, bowen, robinson, kwahii, and lma

Yeah, the Tim Duncan era really is the greatest of our generation.
The entire team not having ego issues, being able to stay together as a team with each being great team mates, never throwing each other under the bus, playing smart at a high level consistently, along with great/goat coaching, has certainly contributed to this franchise's success.

Duncan being able to accept a lesser role and giving his younger team mates the touches, and giving the team the financial flexibility to build a winning culture. A legend :applause:

[dhsilv]

Yeah, the Tim Duncan era really is the greatest of our generation.
The entire team not having ego issues, being able to stay together as a team with each being great team mates, never throwing each other under the bus, playing smart at a high level consistently, along with great/goat coaching, has certainly contributed to this franchise's success.

Duncan being able to accept a lesser role and giving his younger team mates the touches, and giving the team the financial flexibility to build a winning culture. A legend :applause:

and parker porking brent barry's hot wife...

But otherwise....what you said.

[SouBeachTalents]

I hope he thanks tony, pop, manu, bowen, robinson, kwahii, and lma


Kobe should thank Shaq for being better than him for 3 consecutive championships

[DaOldLion]

Yeah, the Tim Duncan era really is the greatest of our generation.
The entire team not having ego issues, being able to stay together as a team with each being great team mates, never throwing each other under the bus, playing smart at a high level consistently, along with great/goat coaching, has certainly contributed to this franchise's success.

Duncan being able to accept a lesser role and giving his younger team mates the touches, and giving the team the financial flexibility to build a winning culture. A legend :applause:

you also have to look at how the media portrays him, other players would be heavily scrutinized for this.. or at least Kobe and Lebron would...

If Kobe and Lebron were winning rings as the 3rd or 4th best player on the team then the media would make it clear that these rings aren't on par with Jordans (as they actually have attempted in the past with Kobe and Lebron) yet with Duncan it's all about ring count and totals. The media keeps propping this guy up for winning as a glorified role player while a guy like Lebron would have to win 6 FMVP's to get that serious Jordan comparison.

but since Timmy is a big the Jordanites don't feel as threatened.

Because honestly, the Spurs have been at their absolute best since Duncan actually stopped having his elite 20+/10+ seasons and slowly transitioned into a defensive role player.. and that should tell you something about the amount of talent this guy plays with while somehow still getting 100% credit for everything his great team does now..

[Springsteen]

Because honestly, the Spurs have been at their absolute best since Duncan actually stopped having his elite 20+/10+ seasons and slowly transitioned into a defensive role player.. and that should tell you something about the amount of talent this guy plays with while somehow still getting 100% credit for everything his great team does now..

Are you saying the Spurs are BETTER without prime Duncan? :biggums:

[ralph_i_el]

you also have to look at how the media portrays him, other players would be heavily scrutinized for this.. or at least Kobe and Lebron would...

If Kobe and Lebron were winning rings as the 3rd or 4th best player on the team then the media would make it clear that these rings aren't on par with Jordans (as they actually have attempted in the past with Kobe and Lebron) yet with Duncan it's all about ring count and totals. The media keeps propping this guy up for winning as a glorified role player while a guy like Lebron would have to win 6 FMVP's to get that serious Jordan comparison.

but since Timmy is a big the Jordanites don't feel as threatened.

Because honestly, the Spurs have been at their absolute best since Duncan actually stopped having his elite 20+/10+ seasons and slowly transitioned into a defensive role player.. and that should tell you something about the amount of talent this guy plays with while somehow still getting 100% credit for everything his great team does now..

He hasn't really become a defensive role player. his scoring per minute hasn't really decreased much from his prime. In his prime he was between 20-23 pp-36. The last few seasons he was between 17-20 per-36. This season has him at 15 pp-36, but that's to be expected playing alongside LMA.

He's just played less minutes and taken more games of rest as he's aged.

[bukowski81]

you also have to look at how the media portrays him, other players would be heavily scrutinized for this.. or at least Kobe and Lebron would...

If Kobe and Lebron were winning rings as the 3rd or 4th best player on the team then the media would make it clear that these rings aren't on par with Jordans (as they actually have attempted in the past with Kobe and Lebron) yet with Duncan it's all about ring count and totals. The media keeps propping this guy up for winning as a glorified role player while a guy like Lebron would have to win 6 FMVP's to get that serious Jordan comparison.

but since Timmy is a big the Jordanites don't feel as threatened.

Because honestly, the Spurs have been at their absolute best since Duncan actually stopped having his elite 20+/10+ seasons and slowly transitioned into a defensive role player.. and that should tell you something about the amount of talent this guy plays with while somehow still getting 100% credit for everything his great team does now..

Duncan has never won a ring has the 3rd or 4th best player...

[dhsilv]

He hasn't really become a defensive role player. his scoring per minute hasn't really decreased much from his prime. In his prime he was between 20-23 pp-36. The last few seasons he was between 17-20 per-36. This season has him at 15 pp-36, but that's to be expected playing alongside LMA.

He's just played less minutes and taken more games of rest as he's aged.

A lot of his missed games were due to injuries earlier in his career. his late years honestly he's missing less games and playing extremely well. Sure he's had his minute limited but he's had less limits than Parker and Manu....

[Springsteen]

Make that 959.

#andCOUNTING

[dhsilv]

Make that 959.

#andCOUNTING

yep, he's coming at karl malone. What is this 1000 talk again? Bad math?

[T_L_P]

Duncan has never won a ring has the 3rd or 4th best player...

Exactly...we're talking about Kobe and LeBron...when Duncan was the unquestioned best player on three title teams (99, 03, 07), which is more than both of them.

[rmt]

Exactly...we're talking about Kobe and LeBron...when Duncan was the unquestioned best player on three title teams (99, 03, 07), which is more than both of them.

Are you totally dismissing that defense is half of the game with regard to Duncan being the best player in 05? If you rate TD and Manu evenly offensive-wise, Duncan has a huge defensive edge. There is no way Manu was the best player in 05.

2005 Playoffs
Duncan 23.6 pts 12.4 rebs 2.7 asst 2.3 blks
Manu 20.8 pts 4.2 asst

[T_L_P]

Are you totally dismissing that defense is half of the game with regard to Duncan being the best player in 05? If you rate TD and Manu evenly offensive-wise, Duncan has a huge defensive edge. There is no way Manu was the best player in 05.

2005 Playoffs
Duncan 23.6 pts 12.4 rebs 2.7 asst 2.3 blks
Manu 20.8 pts 4.2 asst

In the 05 Playoffs, Manu was our best offensive player no question - his scoring efficiency and passing was more valuable than Duncan's screen-setting, Offensive Rebounding and the defensive attention he garnered. And, as much as we might contest it, good offense is more valuable than good defense (even for the Spurs who've predicated themselves on playing good defense for two decades).

They were 1a/1b for that run imo which is why I left Duncan's name out. Even if you think it's Duncan the best, then Manu, I don't think you can see it was clear-cut (like Kobe-Pau in 2010).

My post was simply talking about the unquestioned best players on a title team (which for Duncan was 99, 03 and 07). :confusedshrug:

[rmt]

In the 05 Playoffs, Manu was our best offensive player no question - his scoring efficiency and passing was more valuable than Duncan's screen-setting, Offensive Rebounding and the defensive attention he garnered. And, as much as we might contest it, good offense is more valuable than good defense (even for the Spurs who've predicated themselves on playing good defense for two decades).

They were 1a/1b for that run imo which is why I left Duncan's name out. Even if you think it's Duncan the best, then Manu, I don't think you can see it was clear-cut (like Kobe-Pau in 2010).

My post was simply talking about the unquestioned best players on a title team (which for Duncan was 99, 03 and 07). :confusedshrug:

I respectfully disagree. Their offense was virtually equal and even if you give that edge to Manu, there was a huge difference in their defense. I'll also remind you of who drew the double-teams and opened up the 3 pters in game 7 of the Finals.

[feyki]

I respectfully disagree. Their offense was virtually equal and even if you give that edge to Manu, there was a huge difference in their defense. I'll also remind you of who drew the double-teams and opened up the 3 pters in game 7 of the Finals.

I think Duncan was best player on 2005 Spurs too , but let's talk reals ;

Gino - 20.8 pts , 4.2 ast , %65.2 TS , 124 ortg

Duncan - 23.6 pts , 2.7 ast , %52.6 TS , 111 ortg

Gino clearly better on offence .


Gino - 1.2 stl , 0.3 blk , 104 drtg

Duncan - 0.3 stl , 2.3 blk , 101 drtg

Duncan better on defence .

Duncan also better on ribaunds .

Total impacts goes to Duncan , but it's close

[guy]

you also have to look at how the media portrays him, other players would be heavily scrutinized for this.. or at least Kobe and Lebron would...

If Kobe and Lebron were winning rings as the 3rd or 4th best player on the team then the media would make it clear that these rings aren't on par with Jordans (as they actually have attempted in the past with Kobe and Lebron) yet with Duncan it's all about ring count and totals. The media keeps propping this guy up for winning as a glorified role player while a guy like Lebron would have to win 6 FMVP's to get that serious Jordan comparison.

but since Timmy is a big the Jordanites don't feel as threatened.

Because honestly, the Spurs have been at their absolute best since Duncan actually stopped having his elite 20+/10+ seasons and slowly transitioned into a defensive role player.. and that should tell you something about the amount of talent this guy plays with while somehow still getting 100% credit for everything his great team does now..

Duncan doesn't get scrutinized as much as Kobe and Lebron because first off, he's also not nearly as hyped as them despite being on the same level historically. Second, he's always been about just being a loyal and good teammate first. He's never focused on individual greatness, never complained about not being showcased enough, never ran teammates/coaches out of town, never had public feuds with teammates/coaches, never wanted the spotlight and attention, never talked about or implied he is or wanted to be the GOAT, never left his team or complained that he didn't have enough help, never demanded a trade, never been a player that players didn't want to play with, etc. You combine those two things with the fact that he's had one of the best NBA careers ever, and obviously he's not going to get the same level of scrutiny as those two, nor SHOULD he.

And you're crazy if you think Duncan's legacy is all about ring count. He's not even compared to Jordan at all, so I don't understand the Lebron reference. I don't hear anyone saying that if the Spurs win another title, he's going to be on the same level as Jordan or Kareem. In fact, Duncan's contribution to his rings get underrated if anything. His contribution gets undermined because people think he didn't deserve FMVP in 05, he didn't win FMVP in 07 which doesn't change the fact that he was their best player for that year overall, and because he didn't get FMVP in 2014 despite deserving it over Kawahi who was basically a nonfactor in those first 2 games. That's not even taking into account the fact that he's been the main reason they've been able to build those teams the way that they have. He's been the best player on literally all 5 of his championship teams. Nobody can say they have been the best player on 5 championship teams except Jordan and Russell. Not Wilt, not Kareem, not Magic, not Bird, not Shaq, not Kobe, not Lebron, etc. Of course, I'm not saying that means his level of being the best player is the same as someone like Jordan's on average since Duncan's teams were a lot more balanced, but what he's done is still remarkable.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

If Kobe and Lebron were winning rings as the 3rd or 4th best player on the team then the media would make it clear that these rings aren't on par with Jordans (as they actually have attempted in the past with Kobe and Lebron) yet with Duncan it's all about ring count and totals.

Thankfully he has never been the 3rd or 4th best player on his team for a championship. Best player for 4 out of 5 championships and 2nd best for the 5th as far as the finals. There's actually a case to be made that he was the best in all 5 when looking at the entire run.

[Legends66NBA7]

You could honestly argue Duncan has been best player on all his finals teams.

[kwajo]

You could honestly argue Duncan has been best player on all his finals teams.
I always do argue that. He was clearly the defensive heart of all of them, was basically the core of their offensive sets every year they won, and was either the top scorer or 2nd highest scorer and best rebounder. As someone that watched all of the Spurs Finals games since 1999, if you actually watch what allowed them to win, it was Duncan's play.

[houston]

You could honestly argue Duncan has been best player on all his finals teams.


No you can't if that the case he should won Finals MVP in every series. Duncan is the Bill Russell of his generation cause dude played with a HOF all through his career. Never really had to play high minutes because of this. If it wasn't for Manu and Parker Duncan career would been over by now.

[Odinn]

In 2005 playoffs, Duncan was the main weapon. He was the main focus of opposite team's defense. Getting doubled and tripled.
Here's why Duncan meant more than Manu;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5Tv1mlM8fA
Watch especially the last 1 min of the video.

[Odinn]

No you can't if that the case he should won Finals MVP in every series. Duncan is the Bill Russell of his generation cause dude played with a HOF all through his career. Never really had to play high minutes because of this. If it wasn't for Manu and Parker Duncan career would been over by now.
If it wasn't for Duncan, Parker and Manu's careers would be without a ring.
And in 2003, none of his teammates played like a HoF'er.

[houston]

If it wasn't for Duncan, Parker and Manu's careers would be without a ring.
And in 2003, none of his teammates played like a HoF'er.


Dude had a HOF on that team in Robinson and one of the best wing defenders in the game in Bowen. Robinson even though past his prime was still a starter and second on the team with rebounds and blocks. Him with Duncan average 5 blocks a game.

If it wasn't for Robinson Duncan wouldn't have a ring and would left for the Orlando Magic. Teammates stuff goes both ways.


Duncan just did what Hakeem did in 94. Both had a strong all-star quality frontline with clutch role players that respective year.


Duncan had great help all through his career and it should be acknowledge.

[Springsteen]

Duncan had great help all through his career and it should be acknowledge.

You think it's not acknowledged? What NBA hall of famer didn't have some kind of help? :biggums:

[houston]

You think it's not acknowledged? What NBA hall of famer didn't have some kind of help? :biggums:


of course but people give duncan too much credit

[rmt]

Dude had a HOF on that team in Robinson and one of the best wing defenders in the game in Bowen. Robinson even though past his prime was still a starter and second on the team with rebounds and blocks. Him with Duncan average 5 blocks a game.

If it wasn't for Robinson Duncan wouldn't have a ring and would left for the Orlando Magic. Teammates stuff goes both ways.


Duncan just did what Hakeem did in 94. Both had a strong all-star quality frontline with clutch role players that respective year.


Duncan had great help all through his career and it should be acknowledge.

It's disingenuous to refer to DRob as a HOF when he was 38 years old with a bad back and certainly not contributing in his last year like a HOF. Face it, Duncan's primary help (2nd, 3rd, 4th options) were a rookie and a couple of 2nd year players. And similar to DRob, even though 2 of them will eventually end up as HOFs, they weren't playing as such in 2003.

[DMAVS41]

From the jump...Tim Duncan was an elite two way player that was a great teammate on and off the floor. He's put the team and franchise first throughout his career. He's shown the ability to carry average casts to great heights and he's shown the ability to make things work while playing with elite help.

He's been consistent and durable throughout his career.

Generally in these discussions I feel like his actual level of play and impact gets under-rated as everyone is either talking about how much help he had (just not true early on in his career) or how great a coach Pop was. Now, Duncan has had great help and Pop is a great coach, but that doesn't take away from the player he's been.

He is approaching the short list of best longevity ever, best intangibles ever (don't usually like this argument, but with Duncan it's impossible to deny his leadership and the chemistry he creates being on the team), one of the best two way players ever, absurdly good and long prime, great peak only surpassed by some of the greatest players ever...etc.

If you are starting a NBA franchise and get to take your first pick and you can pick anyone in NBA history. There are only a handful of guys, at most, that you'd take over Duncan at this point.

[guy]

No you can't if that the case he should won Finals MVP in every series. Duncan is the Bill Russell of his generation cause dude played with a HOF all through his career. Never really had to play high minutes because of this. If it wasn't for Manu and Parker Duncan career would been over by now.

So Iggy > Curry? :rolleyes:

[houston]

It's disingenuous to refer to DRob as a HOF when he was 38 years old with a bad back and certainly not contributing in his last year like a HOF. Face it, Duncan's primary help (2nd, 3rd, 4th options) were a rookie and a couple of 2nd year players. And similar to DRob, even though 2 of them will eventually end up as HOFs, they weren't playing as such in 2003.


Dude is a HOF that was starting on a championship team. It not being disingenuous cause it true. Of course he was pass his prime but he was still vital for the Spurs team success. That just like Saying Jason Kidd in 2011 with Mavs wasn't a HOF cause he was a pass his prime. You always judge players during their prime/peak of their careers. We seen both players at their max levels so that still with common sense they was still good enough as starters on the team to win championships.

All you need to win is 2 all-star quality talents that being vital for team success. That how it always been in the NBA.


As for Parker and Manu stuff they were all-nba/all-star quality players due to their international accomplishments they will make BASKETBALL HOF. But their the reason why Duncan have this long career. Same way Stockton did for Malone same Magic did for Kareem etc....

[Real14]

He is a great playter no doubt, a Top 10 player, but he has had a lot of luck with the coach + teammates

Great post except for tha top 10 part:applause:

[Real14]

of course but people give duncan too much credit

Ether.

[dhsilv]

No you can't if that the case he should won Finals MVP in every series. Duncan is the Bill Russell of his generation cause dude played with a HOF all through his career. Never really had to play high minutes because of this. If it wasn't for Manu and Parker Duncan career would been over by now.

The finals MVP doesn't go to teh best player on the team. It goes to who the media thinks was more valuable in what could be just 4 games where the other team never had any chance to start with (2007).

[Real14]

Dude had a HOF on that team in Robinson and one of the best wing defenders in the game in Bowen. Robinson even though past his prime was still a starter and second on the team with rebounds and blocks. Him with Duncan average 5 blocks a game.

If it wasn't for Robinson Duncan wouldn't have a ring and would left for the Orlando Magic. Teammates stuff goes both ways.


Duncan just did what Hakeem did in 94. Both had a strong all-star quality frontline with clutch role players that respective year.


Duncan had great help all through his career and it should be acknowledge.

Yea especially with help from Elliott and avery Johnson too.

[dhsilv]

In 2005 playoffs, Duncan was the main weapon. He was the main focus of opposite team's defense. Getting doubled and tripled.
Here's why Duncan meant more than Manu;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5Tv1mlM8fA
Watch especially the last 1 min of the video.

Great video.

Duncan drew the entire defense's attention every time he got in position, let alone when he had the ball in hand. Manu was HUGE in that series, but Duncan sure as hell made his life easier.

[houston]

The finals MVP doesn't go to teh best player on the team. It goes to who the media thinks was more valuable in what could be just 4 games where the other team never had any chance to start with (2007).


I know that but saying Duncan was the best player during the Finals is the problem.


Finals MVP is a major award but it just step above all-star mvp.

[dhsilv]

Dude is a HOF that was starting on a championship team. It not being disingenuous cause it true. Of course he was pass his prime but he was still vital for the Spurs team success. That just like Saying Jason Kidd in 2011 with Mavs wasn't a HOF cause he was a pass his prime. You always judge players during their prime/peak of their careers. We seen both players at their max levels so that still with common sense they was still good enough as starters on the team to win championships.

All you need to win is 2 all-star quality talents that being vital for team success. That how it always been in the NBA.


As for Parker and Manu stuff they were all-nba/all-star quality players due to their international accomplishments they will make BASKETBALL HOF. But their the reason why Duncan have this long career. Same way Stockton did for Malone same Magic did for Kareem etc....

Kidd was REALLY and I mean REALLY good in 2011. I'm not sure the stats jump out like they should, but he was far more than a role player that year. Robinson was at times solid defensively, and I will admit he kinda found his groove in the playoffs, but he was FAR from 2011 Jason Kidd.

[dhsilv]

I know that but saying Duncan was the best player during the Finals is the problem.


Finals MVP is a major award but it just step above all-star mvp.

And the all star mvp is what a step up from that participation ribbon I got in elementary school in the jump rope contest? Or is it a step down, a few of those kids were trying to win I think.

[houston]

And the all star mvp is what a step up from that participation ribbon I got in elementary school in the jump rope contest? Or is it a step down, a few of those kids were trying to win I think.


At least you have to be all-star win all-star MVP while Finals MVP you can just be role player. But a ring is the thing.

[dhsilv]

At least you have to be all-star win all-star MVP while Finals MVP you can just be role player. But a ring is the thing.

I mean Kobe got credit for being an allstar last year. So I'm not sure that really is a thing of pride.

[rmt]

I mean Kobe got credit for being an allstar last year. So I'm not sure that really is a thing of pride.

Not to mention the all-starts that Yao Ming got from the China vote.

[Springsteen]

960.

http://thewondrous.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Fat-People-Dancing-12.gif

[24-Inch_Chrome]

At least you have to be all-star win all-star MVP while Finals MVP you can just be role player. But a ring is the thing.

FMVP >>> All-Star MVP. One of these things actually matters, one of these things is an award for a meaningless game.