More valuable, Wade on the 12-14 Heat, Or Rodman to the 96-98 Bulls?

[dubeta]

Who had more overall impact on team success? 12-14 Wade or 96-98 Rodman?

[SouBeachTalents]

Wade

[Fire Colangelo]

Wade in the Pacer series alone was more valuable than anything Rodman did in those 3 years.

2012 against the Pacers: 26/6/3 on 54% TS

Put up 30/9/6 on 59% TS in a crucial Game 4
28/3/2 on 62% TS in game 5
41/10/3 on 72% TS to close them out in game 6

23/6/5 on 52% TS in the Finals that year as well.

Yes, LeBron was fantastic and put up even better numbers. But Wade was just as important.

Wade was shit in 2013 (by his standards) but he still showed up in the most important series against the Spurs.

20/4/5/ on 51% TS are more than respectful for a 2nd option.

[Smoke117]

Wade. Rodman wasn't even that good in 97 and 98. His defense fell of a lot.

[dubeta]

Wade. Rodman wasn't even that good in 97 and 98. His defense fell of a lot.

And? Wade offense fell off a lot in the 2013, 2014 playoffs

[Smoke117]

And? Wade offense fell off a lot in the 2013, 2014 playoffs


Wade's knee was ailing in the 2013 playoffs and he was barely even shooting in the first two series vs the Pacers and Bucks in the 2013 playoffs anyway. He had a poor overall showing vs the Pacers, but he played well vs the Spurs. He was much, much better vs the Spurs in 2013 than Rodman was vs the Jazz in 97...that's for sure.

[knicksman]

OP is a 2/6 stan

[La Frescobaldi]

Rodman by a pretty good amount. Even in his declining days he was an amazing player.

Wade couldn't finish a season a lot of times and was dragging himself along on the court a lot in playoffs

[guy]

Jeez the "lebron never has help" discussion has gotten so ridiculous. You idiots make it to the point that he's basically incapable of having any help.

[dubeta]

Jeez the "lebron never has help" discussion has gotten so ridiculous. You idiots make it to the point that he's basically incapable of having any help.

When has he EVER had help?

[GIF REACTION]

Rodman

[SouBeachTalents]

When has he EVER had help?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2011-nba-finals-mavericks-vs-heat.html

[dubeta]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2011-nba-finals-mavericks-vs-heat.html

So lebron only had help 1 series in his entire career??

[SouBeachTalents]

So lebron only had help 1 series in his entire career??

No, pretty much every playoff series in 2011. Wade was a very good second option in 2012, and had some big games in the Finals in 2013

[buddha]

Rodman's always been overrated. Rebounding is the most worthless stat of all the recorded stats. Rodman wouldn't even be a role player in today's era. nobody would give him minutes.

[ArbitraryWater]

When has he EVER had help?

2011 (irony).. besides that his help has been sluggish and coasting alot seemingly, with Bosh's 2012 injury and Wade banged up all the time.

[SouBeachTalents]

Rodman's always been overrated. Rebounding is the most worthless stat of all the recorded stats. Rodman wouldn't even be a role player in today's era. nobody would give him minutes.

Let's just pretend he wasn't a great defender also who won 2 DPOY

[Smoke117]

Let's just pretend he wasn't a great defender also who won 2 DPOY

While I admit he was a great defensive player...he wasn't even close to as dominant as Hakeem in 1990 (his best defensive year) or Robinson in 91 when he was given those DPOY awards. Hakeem is especially a shame...he averaged 4.6bpg and 2.1spg and the Rockets were the best defensive team in the league. You could legit say that's the most dominant defensive season in the modern era. Rodman had absolutely no business getting the DPOY over him.

[guy]

When has he EVER had help?

:oldlol: thanks for making my point.

[GrapeApe]

Wade in the Pacer series alone was more valuable than anything Rodman did in those 3 years.

2012 against the Pacers: 26/6/3 on 54% TS

Put up 30/9/6 on 59% TS in a crucial Game 4
28/3/2 on 62% TS in game 5
41/10/3 on 72% TS to close them out in game 6

23/6/5 on 52% TS in the Finals that year as well.

Yes, LeBron was fantastic and put up even better numbers. But Wade was just as important.

Wade was shit in 2013 (by his standards) but he still showed up in the most important series against the Spurs.

20/4/5/ on 51% TS are more than respectful for a 2nd option.

Well said. The Heat were also without Bosh for most of the Indiana series. 2012 is probably Wade's most underrated season. He was great in the playoffs and he's the only second option in history to have a top 3 PER for the season.

[1987_Lakers]

I don't think people realize Rodman was coming off the bench by the time Chicago won their last title. After the '96 season his game fell off.

[3ball]

I don't give a shit how good Wade's defense is - if he averaged 3 ppg and 8 rpg for a series or playoffs, the Heat lose their ass.

Rodman did that (3/8) in the 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals...

And Rodman wasn't even a starter in the 1998 playoffs - Phil benched him - that's how bad he was.

[97 bulls]

Its clear you guys have nothing but an agenda. Especially 3ball and 87 Lakers. I sent you two videos showing Rodmans contributions in 98. He shut down Malone. I mean damn that donf account for something? He minimized the oppositions best player.

As far as 96, George Karl said Rodman was the Bulls MVP. That says a lot seeing as how he was the Bulls opponent in the 96 Finals.

And he was hurt in 97

[97 bulls]

I don't think people realize Rodman was coming off the bench by the time Chicago won their last title. After the '96 season his game fell off.
What does it matter. He always finished the games. Thats whats most important

[Dresta]

Bran would've flunked out against Indiana in 2012 and never recovered if Wade didn't string together a monster 3 game performance that swung the series. Nor would he have won against the Spurs if Wade hadn't sparked the Miami turn-around in Game 4, while playing on one knee.

Be more grateful you worthless Lebron-loving ****.

[dubeta]

Bran would've flunked out against Indiana in 2012 and never recovered if Wade didn't string together a monster 3 game performance that swung the series. Nor would he have won against the Spurs if Wade hadn't sparked the Miami turn-around in Game 4, while playing on one knee.

Be more grateful you worthless Lebron-loving ****.


Or Miami would have swept the Pacers if Wade didn't resemble a D-League player the first 3 games

[Dresta]

Or Miami would have swept the Pacers if Wade didn't resemble a D-League player the first 3 games
More rubbish. He resembled a D-League player only in game 3, which was the one where Miami got blown out by 20 odd points - that just tells you even more about his undeniable importance in respect to Lebron's successes on the big stage.

[Papaya Petee]

Who was more valuable

LeBron in 2011 playoffs
Adam Morrison in 2009 playoffs

both had the same impact in the finals IMO
Morrison maybe better.

[3ball]

I sent you two videos showing Rodmans contributions in 98. He shut down Malone.


You only sent videos for 2 games - Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% in the 1998 Finals.. He destroyed Rodman.

Also, do you realize that Rodman didn't start 1 game in the 1998 Finals and wasn't a starter in the 1998 playoffs?.. Phil benched him because he was playing so bad.

So what planet are you living on where Rodman shut down Malone???.. Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% and Rodman wasn't even a starter

[LBJFTW]

Can I make excuses for any of Lebron's losses with Wade since MJ had Rodman and won in 96-98?

No you can't. Big bran fan here but he is 10x the lesser player than Jordan.

[97 bulls]

You only sent videos for 2 games - Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% in the 1998 Finals.. He destroyed Rodman.

Also, do you realize that Rodman didn't start 1 game in the 1998 Finals and wasn't a starter in the 1998 playoffs?.. Phil benched him because he was playing so bad.

So what planet are you living on where Rodman shut down Malone???.. Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% and Rodman wasn't even a starter
No. I sent game 1,2,3, and 4. Malone did just about all his damage on Luc Longley. It's on YouTube. Even the announcers noted how well Rodman played Malone. How can you ignore this?

[3ball]

No. I sent game 1,2,3, and 4. Malone did just about all his damage on Luc Longley. It's on YouTube. Even the announcers noted how well Rodman played Malone. How can you ignore this?


You're delusional - Rodman didn't start in the 1998 playoffs or Finals - he wasn't playing well enough to start... Can you comprehend that???.. Rodman wasn't a starter in 1998 playoffs, while Wade was.

And Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% in the 1998 Finals - he got his and played very well.

But more importantly, Rodman averaged 3/8 in 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - I don't give a shit how good Wade's defense is - if he averaged 3/8 for a series or playoffs, the Heat lose their ass...

And that's the difference between a role player like Rodman, and an elite 2nd option like Wade.. Bit role players like Rodman can average 3/8 and the team still wins... If a 2nd option does that, it's over.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers - however, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 when he averaged 3/8, but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating.

[dubeta]

No. I sent game 1,2,3, and 4. Malone did just about all his damage on Luc Longley. It's on YouTube. Even the announcers noted how well Rodman played Malone. How can you ignore this?


Ether :applause:

[3ball]

Ether :applause:
You think 4 games of defense off the BENCH is more valuable than Wade?... How dumb are you guys?

Rodman didn't start in the 1998 playoffs or Finals - he wasn't playing well enough to start... Can you comprehend that???.. Rodman wasn't a starter in 1998 playoffs, while Wade was.. And Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% in the 1998 Finals - he got his and played very well.

But more importantly, Rodman averaged 3/8 in 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - I don't give a shit how good Wade's defense is - if he averaged 3/8 for a series or playoffs, the Heat lose their ass...

And that's the difference between a role player off the bench like Rodman, and an elite 2nd option like Wade.. Bit role players like Rodman can average 3/8 and the team still wins... If a 2nd option does that, it's over.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers - however, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 when he averaged 3/8, but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating.

[dubeta]

You think 4 games of defense off the BENCH is more valuable than Wade?... How dumb are you guys?

Rodman didn't start in the 1998 playoffs or Finals - he wasn't playing well enough to start... Can you comprehend that???.. Rodman wasn't a starter in 1998 playoffs, while Wade was.. And Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% in the 1998 Finals - he got his and played very well.

But more importantly, Rodman averaged 3/8 in 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - I don't give a shit how good Wade's defense is - if he averaged 3/8 for a series or playoffs, the Heat lose their ass...

And that's the difference between a role player off the bench like Rodman, and an elite 2nd option like Wade.. Bit role players like Rodman can average 3/8 and the team still wins... If a 2nd option does that, it's over.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers - however, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 when he averaged 3/8, but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating.


Wade averaged 15 ppg on 45% in the 2013 playoffs with no defense



And 12 ppg on 33% in the last 3 games of the 2014 finals with 0 defense



Rodman was FAR FAR better than Wade ever was, just if you factor in his rebounding

[3ball]

Wade averaged 15 ppg on 45% in the 2013 playoffs with no defense


And if Wade averaged 3/8 like Rodman, the Heat would lose their ass.

/thread

[1987_Lakers]

Its clear you guys have nothing but an agenda. Especially 3ball and 87 Lakers. I sent you two videos showing Rodmans contributions in 98. He shut down Malone. I mean damn that donf account for something? He minimized the oppositions best player.

As far as 96, George Karl said Rodman was the Bulls MVP. That says a lot seeing as how he was the Bulls opponent in the 96 Finals.

And he was hurt in 97

I have an agenda because I stated a fact? lol, Ok.

[3ball]

Wade's PER:

2012: 26.3
2013: 24.0
2014: 21.4


That's worth a lot more than a bench player like Rodman who averaged 3/8 in 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - Rodman wasn't even a starter in 1998 playoffs or Finals.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers.. However, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 playoffs when he averaged 3/8 and got benched by Phil - but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating...

1996 was rodman's last year as a good player.. And in reality, he hadn't made an all-star team since 1992, whereas Wade makes it every year - again, by being a top 12 player in his conference, Wade's all-star status makes him far better than Rodman, relative to their competition.

[dubeta]

Wade's PER:

2012: 26.3
2013: 24.0
2014: 21.4


That's worth a lot more than a bench player like Rodman who averaged 3/8 in 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - Rodman wasn't even a starter in 1998 playoffs or Finals.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers.. However, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 playoffs when he averaged 3/8 and got benched by Phil - but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating...

1996 was rodman's last year as a good player.. And in reality, he hadn't made an all-star team since 1992, whereas Wade makes it every year - again, by being a top 12 player in his conference, Wade's all-star status makes him far better than Rodman, relative to their competition.

What about playoffs?

[3ball]

What about playoffs?


D WADE 2012-2014 PO (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/wadedw01.html#2012-2014-sum:playoffs_per_game): 18.9 ppg.. 4.6 rpg.. 4.1 apg.. 1.6 spg.. 0.9 bpg.. 47.5% fg.. 19.9 PER
RODMAN 1996-1998 PO (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/rodmade01.html#1996-1998-sum:playoffs_per_game): 5.4 ppg.. 11.3 rpg. 1.8 apg.. 0.7 spg.. 0.4 bpg.. 41.1% fg.. 11.1 PER


Wade destroys Rodman.. Rodman averaged 3/8 for the entire 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - Rodman wasn't even a starter in 1998 playoffs or Finals.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers.. However, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 playoffs when he averaged 3/8 and got benched by Phil - but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating...

1996 was rodman's last year as a good player.. And in reality, he hadn't made an all-star team since 1992, whereas Wade makes it every year - again, by being a top 12 player in his conference, Wade's all-star status means he was far better than Rodman relative to their competition.
.

[dubeta]

Wade's playoffs stats destroy Rodman's.

Rodman averaged 3/8 for the entire 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - Rodman wasn't even a starter in 1998 playoffs or Finals.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers.. However, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 playoffs when he averaged 3/8 and got benched by Phil - but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating...

1996 was rodman's last year as a good player.. And in reality, he hadn't made an all-star team since 1992, whereas Wade makes it every year - again, by being a top 12 player in his conference, Wade's all-star status means he was far better than Rodman relative to their competition.

What were Wades in 2013 and 2014

[SouBeachTalents]

3ball literally made the same post FIVE times on this page alone. Dude is ****ing crazy

[97 bulls]

You're delusional - Rodman didn't start in the 1998 playoffs or Finals - he wasn't playing well enough to start... Can you comprehend that???.. Rodman wasn't a starter in 1998 playoffs, while Wade was.
What does it matter? He had a huge impact on the game. Point blank. You can't just dismiss the fact that Rodman shut down arguably the second best player in the league at the time.


And Malone averaged 25/11/4 on 50% in the 1998 Finals - he got his and played very well.
And as I've shown you, who did he get "his" on??? Maybe Jackson should've started and played Rodman mode minutes.


But more importantly, Rodman averaged 3/8 in 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - I don't give a shit how good Wade's defense is - if he averaged 3/8 for a series or playoffs, the Heat lose their ass...
You're comparing stats. And I don't see how you can seeing as how they had much different roles. I'm looking at impact. A lot of people feel Rodman deserved the MVP in 96 and he played huge roles in shutting down the oppositions best players during the Bulls run. Including Shaq, Mourning, and Malone.


And that's the difference between a role player like Rodman, and an elite 2nd option like Wade.. Bit role players like Rodman can average 3/8 and the team still wins... If a 2nd option does that, it's over.
Cut the shit. Rodman and Wade played entirely different roles for their team. Trying to compare them in a vacuum is dumb. Could Wade stop Malone in the post? He'll no. And that's not an indictment against Wade. It shows the impact of Rodman.

[SouBeachTalents]

D WADE 2012-2014 PO (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/wadedw01.html#2012-2014-sum:playoffs_per_game): 18.9 ppg.. 4.6 rpg.. 4.1 apg.. 1.6 spg.. 0.9 bpg.. 47.5% fg.. 19.9 PER
RODMAN 1996-1998 PO (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/rodmade01.html#1996-1998-sum:playoffs_per_game): 5.4 ppg.. 11.3 rpg. 1.8 apg.. 0.7 spg.. 0.4 bpg.. 41.1% fg.. 11.1 PER


Wade destroys Rodman.. Rodman averaged 3/8 for the entire 1997 playoffs and 1998 Finals - Rodman wasn't even a starter in 1998 playoffs or Finals.

Also, people simply forget - Rodman was washed up and DONE in 1999 when he played for the Lakers.. However, he was actually washed-up in 1997 and 1998 playoffs when he averaged 3/8 and got benched by Phil - but no one noticed because the Bulls were 3-peating...

1996 was rodman's last year as a good player.. And in reality, he hadn't made an all-star team since 1992, whereas Wade makes it every year - again, by being a top 12 player in his conference, Wade's all-star status means he was far better than Rodman relative to their competition.

Make it 6 :lol

[97 bulls]

I have an agenda because I stated a fact? lol, Ok.
It's the context that matters.

[HiphopRelated]

Arguing this foolishness only legitimizes it

[diamenz]

When has he EVER had help?


http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2011-nba-finals-mavericks-vs-heat.html


So lebron only had help 1 series in his entire career??

LoL - dubeta you're awful.

[72-10]

Rodman couldn't play offense and played like half a season one year, so yeah, I think I'll go with Wade, who is one of the most skilled players ever.

[Papaya Petee]

It's a shame Wade started breaking down after carrying LeBron in the 2011 playoffs.

[dubeta]

It's a shame Wade started breaking down after carrying LeBron in the 2011 playoffs.


Yet LeBron carried Wade for 3 years and still didn't break down


No excuses

[greatest-ever]

This is a clear agenda thread. I don't know why so many people are feeding into it. Wade was clearly better and more valuable during that stretch, 2012 Wade was much better than Rodman was during any of those seasons, and I'm not sure that Rodman was even a top 3 player on the Bulls over that stretch.