Does anybody believe the Cavs will beat the Warriors?

[Duderonomy]

But but but Kyrie and Love were hurt last year.

Since when has Love been a difference maker?

Since when had Kyrie stayed healthy a full season?

Let the excuses keep coming


http://www.explosion.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/2307282-55860__jj_jameson_laughing_meme_1.jpg

[DMAVS41]

If both teams are fully healthy....I think it would be a very close series.

I think the Cavs would have won last year if healthy, but would probably favor the Warriors this year.

But a lot can change.

[JohnnySic]

Yes, they could.

They didn't have Varejao last year in addition to Irving and Love.

Plus, they've added the immortal Mo Williams, the venerable Richard Jefferson, and the quintessential James Jones.

The Cavs are deeper and better on paper.

And they still took 2 games last year despite being very short handed.

[Pushxx]

If both teams are fully healthy....I think it would be a very close series.

I think the Cavs would have won last year if healthy, but would probably favor the Warriors this year.

But a lot can change.

End the thread boys. :applause: We can all go home now.

[HurricaneKid]

If both teams are fully healthy....I think it would be a very close series.

I think the Cavs would have won last year if healthy, but would probably favor the Warriors this year.

But a lot can change.

We haven't even seen what the Cavs look like yet. I am betting they are going to look insanely good once they get their full team back. The Spurs have been historically good and still have a ton of upside as they work out how to integrate LMA and West into their team.

I find it particularly strange that everyone seems to think this season is over before XMas. I thought there was an understanding the the NBA season doesn't even start until XMas.

[JohnnySic]

If both teams are fully healthy....I think it would be a very close series.

I think the Cavs would have won last year if healthy, but would probably favor the Warriors this year.

But a lot can change.
I do too.

[leMVP]

Lebron got this.

[DMAVS41]

We haven't even seen what the Cavs look like yet. I am betting they are going to look insanely good once they get their full team back. The Spurs have been historically good and still have a ton of upside as they work out how to integrate LMA and West into their team.

I find it particularly strange that everyone seems to think this season is over before XMas. I thought there was an understanding the the NBA season doesn't even start until XMas.

I was just going off the OP.

I definitely think the Spurs have a good chance to beat the Warriors. They are playing at one of the slowest paces in the league and will be able to grind out possessions in the half court in the playoffs.

LMA is one of the few players in the league good enough to shoot long 2's effectively...which can really screw up defenses.

The Spurs, if healthy, playing at this level they currently are...would barely even be underdogs to the Warriors in a series. And the ability to play Leonard on Curry in certain key stretches is a huge luxury to have...especially in a slowed down game in which you have a great defender anchoring the paint.

It would be a basketball wet dream to watch those teams play in the playoffs fully healthy.

[leBron Bieber]

Would any team beat the cavs without their 2nd n 3rd best player tho :coleman:

[Fudge]

Meltdown?

https://images.rapgenius.com/e37a18de9fff97ba5196737c9bb7929f.600x336x1.jpg

[Hopper15]

Couldn't agree more on Kevin Love.

He's going to hurt the Cavs defensively when the Warriors go small because he can't switch.

[swagga]

the cavs are actually a bad matchup for the warriors. So are the spurs.
Both teams have big skilled lineups with multiple players that can really hurt the warriors inside through scoring/passing out of the post and/or rebounding. When you look at the lineups both cavs and spurs can put the warriors in some bad situations where they don't have an answer. Ex: do you use bogut against mozgov/love or to keep tristan thompson out the glass? ezeli is a good player but he isn't a playoff caliber contributor.
There is a reason for which the warriors are a low-middle of the pack rated inside defense. Any team that can control the pace and has a scoring big can give the warriors problems: brooklyn and milwaukee are simple examples. There is also a reason for which the warriors lost 2 games to that sorry ass of a cast lebron had last year. These things don't happen by chance you know.

Both cavs and spurs are stacked talent wise, they aren't gimmick teams like the clippers or rockets, and they aren't going all out to get RS wins, but they still have great records. They are excellently built to attack GSW: lots of skilled inside scorers, PGs that will make curry work on the defensive end, lots of depth, exceptional iso scorers, pace control. Tbh many reasonable basketball fans already see this, but you can keep on believing the hype. Imo the warriors are in for a rude awakening .. maybe not in the RS but most certainly in the playoffs.

[HurricaneKid]

I was just going off the OP.

I definitely think the Spurs have a good chance to beat the Warriors. They are playing at one of the slowest paces in the league and will be able to grind out possessions in the half court in the playoffs.

LMA is one of the few players in the league good enough to shoot long 2's effectively...which can really screw up defenses.

The Spurs, if healthy, playing at this level they currently are...would barely even be underdogs to the Warriors in a series. And the ability to play Leonard on Curry in certain key stretches is a huge luxury to have...especially in a slowed down game in which you have a great defender anchoring the paint.

It would be a basketball wet dream to watch those teams play in the playoffs fully healthy.

I know. I just brought up the Spurs because if they take out GSW Cle wouldn't even need to beat them to win a title.

Disagree about the long 2s being an efficient shot. It still isn't. He is a REALLY good mid range shooter to be sure. But he has led the NBA in 2pt FGAs the last three years and shot:

340/854
439/1047
326/767

From 10ft-3 pt line the last three years. Which is WELL below league avg scoring efficiency.

But I would LOVE to watch Danny Green and especially Kawhi come after those guys defensively.

[CavaliersFTW]

So we're assuming curry will remain injury free this year?

[DukeDelonte13]

I do.

Cavs have 3 excellent perimeter defenders in Iman, Lebron, and Delly.

JR is no slouch either on the defensive end.

TT is an excellent defender and Mozzy is starting to get back into form.


Cavs have to do what they did last year. Slow the pace down to a snail's crawl and limit their long shots to prevent fast break opportunities on defensive rebounds. Defend the 3 point line at all costs even if it means giving up easy 2's.


The cavs match up really well against the warriors.

[tmacattack33]

Why are you overlooking the Spurs? I think they're gonna take out Golden State..and everyone will then forget about this crazy regular season Golden State is having and look back on it like those Mavericks teams with their empty great records

[jayfan]

Yes, if they're healthy.

And that wasn't easy for me to say.





.

[DMAVS41]

I know. I just brought up the Spurs because if they take out GSW Cle wouldn't even need to beat them to win a title.

Disagree about the long 2s being an efficient shot. It still isn't. He is a REALLY good mid range shooter to be sure. But he has led the NBA in 2pt FGAs the last three years and shot:

340/854
439/1047
326/767

From 10ft-3 pt line the last three years. Which is WELL below league avg scoring efficiency.

But I would LOVE to watch Danny Green and especially Kawhi come after those guys defensively.

I wasn't saying that long 2's in general were efficient...or even that LMA is efficient overall in shooting them, but he is one of very few players that you actually don't want shooting open mid range shots.

What that does to defenses can be dramatic as most defenses want to force that shot...LMA can make them efficiently enough in a way that you won't want that to be the shot you give up over the course of a series.

A lot of the data above is LMA taking fade aways in the wing post and contested shots....Pop wouldn't have him doing that in a playoff series. He won't have to do that with the Spurs because they have so many options.

[Dr Hawk]

I don't

[Derka]

If the Spurs can't beat the Warriors 4 games out of 7, no one in this Association can.

[JerrySeinfeld]

The Warriors are composed of dynamic 2 way players.

Cleveland got closer to their level when Irving and Love went down, in all honesty.

[Spurs m8]

If the Spurs can't beat the Warriors 4 games out of 7, no one in this Association can.

This.

Cleveland ain't that good tbh

[ShawkFactory]

The Warriors are composed of dynamic 2 way players.

Cleveland got closer to their level when Irving and Love went down, in all honesty.
:yaohappy:

[PJR]

I do.
JR is no slouch either on the defensive end.

He most certainly is a slouch. What have you been watching?

[JerrySeinfeld]

:yaohappy:

laugh it off, I'm just saying, the Warriors don't have a key contributor that doesn't defend. Let alone their 2nd and 3rd options like is the case with Cleveland.

Cleveland would have been better off keeping Wiggins and sliding LeBron up to the 4 instead of getting Love. I'd give them a much better shot then.

[Dro]

If both teams are fully healthy....I think it would be a very close series.

I think the Cavs would have won last year if healthy, but would probably favor the Warriors this year.

But a lot can change.
This. Cavs were up 2-1 with injuries. I think its safe to assume they would have won last year. Warriors are better this year though.

[eeeeeebro]

i dont believe team USA could beat warriors

[ShawkFactory]

laugh it off, I'm just saying, the Warriors don't have a key contributor that doesn't defend. Let alone their 2nd and 3rd options like is the case with Cleveland.

Cleveland would have been better off keeping Wiggins and sliding LeBron up to the 4 instead of getting Love. I'd give them a much better shot then.
What does that have to do with Cleveland supposedly being better off without two of their three best offensive players?

Actually, two of the only three consistent offensive threats.

[sd3035]

Cavs are certainly more stacked but I think it comes down to how their leaders perform under pressure

Curry thrives while Lebron shrivels

[CavaliersFTW]

Cavs are certainly more stacked but I think it comes down to how their leaders perform under pressure

Curry thrives while Lebron shrivels
Kyrie thrives though.

[JerrySeinfeld]

What does that have to do with Cleveland supposedly being better off without two of their three best offensive players?

Actually, two of the only three consistent offensive threats.

Who is the last team to win a championship with two one way players in their big 3?

That's all I'm getting at.

[sd3035]

Kyrie thrives though.

True, but will Lebald let Kyrie lead them to glory, or hog the ball and go 2/7?

[!@#$%Vectors!@#]

So we're assuming curry will remain injury free this year?

Are u trying to jinx Steph?

Hes been injury free since 2012

:lol :lol
Mods!

[HurricaneKid]

I wasn't saying that long 2's in general were efficient...or even that LMA is efficient overall in shooting them, but he is one of very few players that you actually don't want shooting open mid range shots.

What that does to defenses can be dramatic as most defenses want to force that shot...LMA can make them efficiently enough in a way that you won't want that to be the shot you give up over the course of a series.

A lot of the data above is LMA taking fade aways in the wing post and contested shots....Pop wouldn't have him doing that in a playoff series. He won't have to do that with the Spurs because they have so many options.

But thats always been LMAs bugaboo. He doesn't JUST shoot the open looks. He takes more contested 2s than anyone in the league not named Kobe, and in all likelihood probably even more than even the Mamba.

His .523 TS% is 11th on the team and only Danny Green and his awful shooting slump is shooting < that in terms of rotation players. He really hasn't been worked into the offense as well as I believe he will be by the end of the season which is a big reason why I think SAS still have a lot of room for growth. He leads the team in FGAs which can't continue with him making such a low rate.

[Duderonomy]

Another thing to consider is Bron has played in 5 straight finals so fatigue or injury is very likely I'm not cursing the man just going by what has happened to most players in history after runs (Shaq, Bird, etc)

[Uncle Drew]

Some people really believe the Cavs were better off without the guy who did this?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id=&match=game&year_min=1997&year_max=&age_min=0&age_max=99&team_id=&opp_id=SAS&is_playoffs=N&round_id=&game_num_type=&game_num_min=&game_num_max=&game_month=&game_day=&game_location=&game_result=&is_starter=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=50&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=pts

[MellowYellow]

Some people really believe the Cavs were better off without the guy who did this?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id=&match=game&year_min=1997&year_max=&age_min=0&age_max=99&team_id=&opp_id=SAS&is_playoffs=N&round_id=&game_num_type=&game_num_min=&game_num_max=&game_month=&game_day=&game_location=&game_result=&is_starter=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=50&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=pts

of course, because steph woulda had games like that every game being defended by kyrie instead of delly and Love instead of TT defending down low.

[inclinerator]

of course, because steph woulda had games like that every game being defended by kyrie instead of delly and Love instead of TT defending down low.
lol ur underrating kyrie's defense

[Hey Yo]

Who is the last team to win a championship with two one way players in their big 3?

That's all I'm getting at.
2011 Mavs

[Nash]

laugh it off, I'm just saying, the Warriors don't have a key contributor that doesn't defend. Let alone their 2nd and 3rd options like is the case with Cleveland.

Cleveland would have been better off keeping Wiggins and sliding LeBron up to the 4 instead of getting Love. I'd give them a much better shot then.
that is such a stupid thing to say.
All of those defenders you talk about will still be there, the only difference now is that you'll actually add two elite offensive weapons into the equation.

[Hopper15]

So we're assuming curry will remain injury free this year?

Why wouldn't we? He's only missed 10 games over the last 3 years and that's playoffs included.

[CavaliersFTW]

Why wouldn't we? He's only missed 10 games over the last 3 years and that's playoffs included.
Target on his back? Glass ankles? Freak accident?

[sd3035]

Another thing to consider is Bron has played in 5 straight finals so fatigue or injury is very likely I'm not cursing the man just going by what has happened to most players in history after runs (Shaq, Bird, etc)

Lebald is probably due for an injury, he's been quite durable other than fake injuries and menstrual cramps

[!@#$%Vectors!@#]

Target on his back? Glass ankles? Freak accident?


:lol :lol
Mods Ban the fakkit.

[KirbyPls]

Yeeeeesssssssss, twist that ankle, little boy.

Your jinx attempt likely turned the Warriors into a GOAT juggernaut. :facepalm

[DMAVS41]

But thats always been LMAs bugaboo. He doesn't JUST shoot the open looks. He takes more contested 2s than anyone in the league not named Kobe, and in all likelihood probably even more than even the Mamba.

His .523 TS% is 11th on the team and only Danny Green and his awful shooting slump is shooting < that in terms of rotation players. He really hasn't been worked into the offense as well as I believe he will be by the end of the season which is a big reason why I think SAS still have a lot of room for growth. He leads the team in FGAs which can't continue with him making such a low rate.

I agree about his efficiency issues....yet you can't leave him open on the mid range shot though. That was and remains my point.

And in the half court...that is a very valuable weapon to have to throw at defenses.

Now, if the Spurs let him take contested long two's in that series...it won't matter, but I just can't imagine Pop won't have that fixed by the playoffs.

[rmt]

What do you all think about the Cavs vs Spurs (should the Spurs come out of the West which is a big task)?

DMAVS, disagree on the Leonard on Curry. Should be Danny Green.

[DMAVS41]

What do you all think about the Cavs vs Spurs (should the Spurs come out of the West which is a big task)?

DMAVS, disagree on the Leonard on Curry. Should be Danny Green.

I was talking certain situations. You'd rather have Danny Green on Curry the least 2 minutes of the game?

Can't agree with that at all.

[inclinerator]

I was talking certain situations. You'd rather have Danny Green on Curry the least 2 minutes of the game?

Can't agree with that at all.
danny green is better than kawhi lateral movement wise so yea i would have green on curry

[rmt]

I was talking certain situations. You'd rather have Danny Green on Curry the least 2 minutes of the game?

Can't agree with that at all.

Yes, I don't think Leonard should defend PGs like Curry or Paul ever. He does better guarding iso, bigger players - not chasing little ones over screens.

[DMAVS41]

Yes, I don't think Leonard should defend PGs like Curry or Paul ever. He does better guarding iso, bigger players - not chasing little ones over screens.

Really disagree with this...never putting Leonard on Curry in an entire game would be a mistake.

Not saying he should spend the majority of the game on him by any means, but damn...an elite defender like Leonard not ever being put on Curry...just to change it up and get physical with him on and off the ball? I feel like that would be a pretty big mistake.

[JerrySeinfeld]

that is such a stupid thing to say.
All of those defenders you talk about will still be there, the only difference now is that you'll actually add two elite offensive weapons into the equation.

Are you a Heat fan?

Do you remember the series your team had against the Thunder? The team where everyone was like "Oh, it's okay that Sefolosha and Perkins are bad at offense, they have Westbrook and Durant!" and meanwhile Miami's balanced attack and two-way starting 5 of Chalmers, Wade, Bron, Battier, Bosh smoked OKC's starting 5.

You are acting as if you are adding the two offensive options of Love and Irving comes with no drawbacks just because they provide an offensive spark... That playing two bad defenders 35+ minutes a game in the finals isn't going to hurt their team vs an offense like Golden State or San Antonio. But really, it's absurd to think that.

I mean yeah, it'd be cool if they could play 2 guys and take up 1 spot, have Shumpert do the defending for Irving, have Thompson tag in for Love on defense, but it doesn't work that way.

Spurs, Golden State, Miami (past champions) all had a good collection of dynamic players that played both ends of the floor. Teams like Cleveland and OKC have failed to win it all because they went the direction of getting guys who do one or the other and just hoping that they could just win on talent and star power alone.

Cleveland screwed up bad letting Bron back without a contingency that he has absolutely 0 power in making the roster decisions for that team (which he clearly is). Trading Wiggins for Love and then giving TT nearly max money was straight dumb.

[Cocaine80s]

Are you a Heat fan?

Do you remember the series your team had against the Thunder? The team where everyone was like "Oh, it's okay that Sefolosha and Perkins are bad at offense, they have Westbrook and Durant!" and meanwhile Miami's balanced attack and two-way starting 5 of Chalmers, Wade, Bron, Battier, Bosh smoked OKC's starting 5.

You are acting as if you are adding the two offensive options of Love and Irving comes with no drawbacks just because they provide an offensive spark... That playing two bad defenders 35+ minutes a game in the finals isn't going to hurt their team vs an offense like Golden State or San Antonio. But really, it's absurd to think that.

I mean yeah, it'd be cool if they could play 2 guys and take up 1 spot, have Shumpert do the defending for Irving, have Thompson tag in for Love on defense, but it doesn't work that way.

Spurs, Golden State, Miami (past champions) all had a good collection of dynamic players that played both ends of the floor. Teams like Cleveland and OKC have failed to win it all because they went the direction of getting guys who do one or the other and just hoping that they could just win on talent and star power alone.

Cleveland screwed up bad letting Bron back without a contingency that he has absolutely 0 power in making the roster decisions for that team (which he clearly is). Trading Wiggins for Love and then giving TT nearly max money was straight dumb.
Right because Cavs dont have good defensive players like Shumpert, Thompson, Mozgov, Delly :facepalm

[JerrySeinfeld]

Right because Cavs dont have good defensive players like Shumpert, Thompson, Mozgov, Delly :facepalm

Yes, Cleveland is stacked. What's your point?

[knicksman]

it depends if irving could stand toe to toe against steph in the clutch. If not then its over.

[knicksman]

having love and irving is great if theyre willing to play off the bench. But honestly, last year cavs starting 5 in the finals is better. They fit much better.

[Rocketswin2013]

Are you a Heat fan?

Do you remember the series your team had against the Thunder? The team where everyone was like "Oh, it's okay that Sefolosha and Perkins are bad at offense, they have Westbrook and Durant!" and meanwhile Miami's balanced attack and two-way starting 5 of Chalmers, Wade, Bron, Battier, Bosh smoked OKC's starting 5.

You are acting as if you are adding the two offensive options of Love and Irving comes with no drawbacks just because they provide an offensive spark... That playing two bad defenders 35+ minutes a game in the finals isn't going to hurt their team vs an offense like Golden State or San Antonio. But really, it's absurd to think that.

I mean yeah, it'd be cool if they could play 2 guys and take up 1 spot, have Shumpert do the defending for Irving, have Thompson tag in for Love on defense, but it doesn't work that way.

Spurs, Golden State, Miami (past champions) all had a good collection of dynamic players that played both ends of the floor. Teams like Cleveland and OKC have failed to win it all because they went the direction of getting guys who do one or the other and just hoping that they could just win on talent and star power alone.

Cleveland screwed up bad letting Bron back without a contingency that he has absolutely 0 power in making the roster decisions for that team (which he clearly is). Trading Wiggins for Love and then giving TT nearly max money was straight dumb.

Love has been playing stellar defense lately, and exactly what the hell kind of role could Wiggins have on the current Cavs? :oldlol:

A mediocre iso scorer, who does nothing else particularly well except..defend at thier strongest defnesive spots(SG/SF)?

Current Delly is a better player than Wiggins. Love is several levels above him.

[Hey Yo]

having love and irving is great if theyre willing to play off the bench. But honestly, last year cavs starting 5 in the finals is better. They fit much better.
as usual......DUMB

:cletus:

[knicksman]

as usual......DUMB

:cletus:

stans rooting for a 2/6=dumber:lol

[VengefulAngel]

stans rooting for a 2/6=dumber:lol

You just admitted you are as dumb as a rock...


You're right for once. :applause: :applause:

[!@#$%Vectors!@#]

Yeeeeesssssssss, twist that ankle, little boy.

have your mom get hit by a car Fudge

[VengefulAngel]

have your mom get hit by a car Fudge

STFU warriorfan.


You're a little bitch.

[stalkerforlife]

If fully healthy, the Cavs are the most stacked team in NBA history.

You can't compete with a team full of cowards set out to guarantee a championship by eliminating all the competition.

[knicksman]

STFU warriorfan.


You're a little bitch.

youre a loser brah. In this forum and in real life so its you that should shut up

[Megabox!]

youre a loser brah. In this forum and in real life so its you that should shut up
The irony is strong

[diamenz]

cavs = great players, average team.

warriors = great players, great team.

[!@#$%Vectors!@#]

STFU warriorfan.


You're a little bitch.

:rolleyes:

[dhsilv]

Really disagree with this...never putting Leonard on Curry in an entire game would be a mistake.

Not saying he should spend the majority of the game on him by any means, but damn...an elite defender like Leonard not ever being put on Curry...just to change it up and get physical with him on and off the ball? I feel like that would be a pretty big mistake.

Unless the goal is to chase him from the 3 in a big moment, I'd be ok picking curry up on a switch but beyond that I'm not sure. Especially now that he has offensive responsibilities.

[dhsilv]

I agree about his efficiency issues....yet you can't leave him open on the mid range shot though. That was and remains my point.

And in the half court...that is a very valuable weapon to have to throw at defenses.

Now, if the Spurs let him take contested long two's in that series...it won't matter, but I just can't imagine Pop won't have that fixed by the playoffs.

I agree with your long 2's statement.

I think one of his real value adds is that he's the guy who takes the hard shots and he's ok at it. Thus making other more efficient around him. I saw this some with the blazers last year, still not really sure I'm seeing it on the spurs but I see the potential.

[Hopper15]

Target on his back? Glass ankles? Freak accident?

Apparently you're still stuck in 2011.

[IGOTGAME]

I like the idea of Leonard on Draymond Green because it can neutralize there most postent lineup for periods of time. It turns curry into a pocket passer around two good defenders and if there is a switch then you end up with Leonard on Curry (fine), Pop will figure out the back rotations and the pressure on the pass will be intense.

[scuzzy]

:roll: :roll: