Creatine - What kind of results did you see?

[jongib369]

I know it's well studied, can help but it's not a miracle drug and all that jazz...But Im just wondering about your expierence with it. Any non responders?

[MMKM]

I think it is one of few supplements on the market worth buying. I think weight and strength gains will be relative to your current frame and muscle mass (i.e. If you're 6'6 you'll gain more total weight than someone who is 5'6.). It isn't like steroids or anything close to that, but it can definitely help you bust through plateaus.

[plowking]

You gain a bunch of weight, and you push more weight. I saw my strength stay with me after I got off it.

Drink a heap of water though. You'll find you might feel dehydrated more so than usual, so you'll be drinking more water anyway, but drink even more than that.

You'll look puffy too. If that bothers you, then don't go on it, but I go up and down in weight every 3 months cutting and bulking so I don't mind.
I haven't actually used it in forever, since I'm happy maintaining at the moment and don't really feel the need to get bulkier or stronger anymore.

[jongib369]

You gain a bunch of weight, and you push more weight. I saw my strength stay with me after I got off it.

Drink a heap of water though. You'll find you might feel dehydrated more so than usual, so you'll be drinking more water anyway, but drink even more than that.

You'll look puffy too. If that bothers you, then don't go on it, but I go up and down in weight every 3 months cutting and bulking so I don't mind.
I haven't actually used it in forever, since I'm happy maintaining at the moment and don't really feel the need to get bulkier or stronger anymore.
Thanks for the responses guys.. This is directed at both of you...What do you do if your squat is stalling? I got my deadlift to 350 at 175 after 4 mo ths, but my squat is still at a beginner level. I can probably do more ..But with deadlifts starting light it got easy....While starting low with squats it's just felt the same so far. Been trying to eat better lately so I expect that will help...But it's still frustrating how quick my deadlift went up when I had chicken legs and zero posterior chain to start with. Been doing hamstring curls after squats the last few times, hopefully that helps

[MMKM]

Thanks for the responses guys.. This is directed at both of you...What do you do if your squat is stalling? I got my deadlift to 350 at 175 after 4 mo ths, but my squat is still at a beginner level. I can probably do more ..But with deadlifts starting light it got easy....While starting low with squats it's just felt the same so far. Been trying to eat better lately so I expect that will help...But it's still frustrating how quick my deadlift went up when I had chicken legs and zero posterior chain to start with. Been doing hamstring curls after squats the last few times, hopefully that helps

Most people's squats stalling has nothing to do with leg strength. Case in point, you could probably leg press 4x what you squat. The weak link is the core and lower back. Try mixing in some heavy good mornings. Those will thicken up your trunk while simultaneously strengthening the glutes and hams. Also heavy dumbbell side bends. Unfortunately the cornerstone of a great squat is a super strong core, and that doesn't mean 20 inch waist with 6 pack abs...

[GIF REACTION]

Most people's squats stalling has nothing to do with leg strength. Case in point, you could probably leg press 4x what you squat. The weak link is the core and lower back. Try mixing in some heavy good mornings. Those will thicken up your trunk while simultaneously strengthening the glutes and hams. Also heavy dumbbell side bends. Unfortunately the cornerstone of a great squat is a super strong core, and that doesn't mean 20 inch waist with 6 pack abs...
It depends what squat style/stance they are using

A low bar, forward lean style is going to emphasize the posterior chain, with a lack of true leg development that one would achieve with an olympic or front bar form.

[MMKM]

It depends what squat style/stance they are using

A low bar, forward lean style is going to emphasize the posterior chain, with a lack of true leg development that one would achieve with an olympic or front bar form.

Yup. Can't argue with that. For true leg development and athleticism, I'd go front squat and lunge variations all day. But if you're just trying to hit numbers on the back squat, low
bar it and hit the core hard

[GIF REACTION]

I'm going to try an olympic lifting style combination of squats and pulls

Deep high bar squats and just some conventional deadlifts

Feel like its a better balance than low bar and conventional deadlift exclusively

[MMKM]

I'm going to try an olympic lifting style combination of squats and pulls

Deep high bar squats and just some conventional deadlifts

Feel like its a better balance than low bar and conventional deadlift exclusively

What are you training for?

[jongib369]

Most people's squats stalling has nothing to do with leg strength. Case in point, you could probably leg press 4x what you squat. The weak link is the core and lower back. Try mixing in some heavy good mornings. Those will thicken up your trunk while simultaneously strengthening the glutes and hams. Also heavy dumbbell side bends. Unfortunately the cornerstone of a great squat is a super strong core, and that doesn't mean 20 inch waist with 6 pack abs...
I definitely have a weak core, so I need to strengthen that. As of this moment I only do high bar, with full range of motion. Ass to grass

[jongib369]

Also do you guys go down on your deadlifts slow and in control, or do you just drop it?

[MMKM]

Also do you guys go down on your deadlifts slow and in control, or do you just drop it?

I always included the negative in the exact reverse motion as the concentric (upward) phase. I figure, the eccentric phase of any lift is where you actually break down and build the most muscle (hypertrophic), so why would you skip the phase that develops the muscles you are trying to build? So I was always a controlled negative "touch and go" type of deadlifter.....

Another reason I would advise doing the negative is that for beginners/intermediate it definitely helps keep you in a better "groove" technique wise. Most bar droppers I see round over and go hunchback up, then just drop and repeat. A strict neg will help teach you to keep the dish in your low back through the full movement.

[GIF REACTION]

Keep the negatives for romanian deadlifts for accessories

[sunsfan1357]

Thanks for the responses guys.. This is directed at both of you...What do you do if your squat is stalling? I got my deadlift to 350 at 175 after 4 mo ths, but my squat is still at a beginner level. I can probably do more ..But with deadlifts starting light it got easy....While starting low with squats it's just felt the same so far. Been trying to eat better lately so I expect that will help...But it's still frustrating how quick my deadlift went up when I had chicken legs and zero posterior chain to start with. Been doing hamstring curls after squats the last few times, hopefully that helps

Squat more. Eat more. Sleep more.

[MMKM]

Squat more. Eat more.Sleep more.

Critical.

[jongib369]

Critical.
Probably a big part of it, trying to fix that. Been eating a lot of brown rice, egg whites, sardines, Sweet potatoes and all that jazz the last few days.

[sunsfan1357]

Probably a big part of it, trying to fix that. Been eating a lot of brown rice, egg whites, sardines, Sweet potatoes and all that jazz the last few days.
That's what you're eating, now how much you're eating. Egg whites and sardines are cool and everything, but not very dense in calories. What's your caloric intake? Macros? Have you tried tracking to at least have an idea of what your baseline is? You don't have to eat in abundance if gaining weight isn't your goal, but at least eat enough to fuel heavy workloads.

You also need to be more specific with your programming in order for people to actually give advice on how to break a plateau. Are you squatting once a week? Twice? What kind of intensities?

[MMKM]

Probably a big part of it, trying to fix that. Been eating a lot of brown rice, egg whites, sardines, Sweet potatoes and all that jazz the last few days.

If you are good with lactose, whole milk is a good way to kick up your calories and it also contains casein which helps boost IGF-1 production. Strangely enough, in studies nonfat and 2% milk do not show increases in IGF, but whole milk does. Whole milk was a dietary secret weapon for Arnold Schwarzenegger and also Aleksandar Karelin (if you don't know who Karelin is, google him. Possibly the biggest badass in the history of sports). Anyway, good caloric boost plus helps with the hormones.

[jongib369]

That's what you're eating, now how much you're eating. Egg whites and sardines are cool and everything, but not very dense in calories. What's your caloric intake? Macros? Have you tried tracking to at least have an idea of what your baseline is? You don't have to eat in abundance if gaining weight isn't your goal, but at least eat enough to fuel heavy workloads.

You also need to be more specific with your programming in order for people to actually give advice on how to break a plateau. Are you squatting once a week? Twice? What kind of intensities?
**** man...Hit post, had a nice long response for ya but it logged out, and all the shit got deleted XD

I'm about to go to bed, I'll get back to you on that in a day or two

[hateraid]

Technically the main purpose of creatine is to create ATP fuel which is the primary source of fuel used for short bursts or energy. It is not necessarily a "weight gain" product. You could very well lose weight while on creatine. It's all relevant on how you train and what you eat.
Because creatine creates a ton of waste product I would suggest to take creatine HCL as most of it will be converted into usable ATP. And ideally you want to take AFTER your workout when ATP is at it's lowest. Use creatine to gain strength, not size.

[MMKM]

Technically the main purpose of creatine is to create ATP fuel which is the primary source of fuel used for short bursts or energy. It is not necessarily a "weight gain" product. You could very well lose weight while on creatine. It's all relevant on how you train and what you eat.
Because creatine creates a ton of waste product I would suggest to take creatine HCL as most of it will be converted into usable ATP. And ideally you want to take AFTER your workout when ATP is at it's lowest. Use creatine to gain strength, not size.

All things being equal (meaning if you don't change your diet or exercise routine) you will gain weight on creatine. Most people will gain 5 lbs in a few weeks just from more water being drawn into the muscle cells. Personally I typically gain 10 lbs or more if I take creatine due to a bigger frame with more muscle cells than the average person. So a lot of it is based on your genetics but your muscle cells will retain more water, thus a decent weight gain. The more cells you happen to have, the more noticeable the gain.

[hateraid]

All things being equal (meaning if you don't change your diet or exercise routine) you will gain weight on creatine. Most people will gain 5 lbs in a few weeks just from more water being drawn into the muscle cells. Personally I typically gain 10 lbs or more if I take creatine due to a bigger frame with more muscle cells than the average person. So a lot of it is based on your genetics but your muscle cells will retain more water, thus a decent weight gain. The more cells you happen to have, the more noticeable the gain.

That could be negated by drinking more water so you retain less. But in any cause yes under normal circumstances you will retain water in most cases. Although you can lose weight by building more lean muscle while training in conjunction to your diet. I've put many people on creatine even on a weight loss program.
My point is the primary intention to use creatine is to create more ATP to gain strength. Gaining size is more technically a side effect due to water retention but not necessarily a given.

[MMKM]

That could be negated by drinking more water so you retain less. But in any cause yes under normal circumstances you will retain water in most cases. Although you can lose weight by building more lean muscle while training in conjunction to your diet. I've put many people on creatine even on a weight loss program.
My point is the primary intention to use creatine is to create more ATP to gain strength. Gaining size is more technically a side effect due to water retention but not necessarily a given.

Yeah mos def

[GIF REACTION]

Just lift OP

Creatine is negligible at best. It's a minute difference at best

Stop focusing on products and just do it

[jongib369]

Don't know my average calorie, or protein intake so I'll track everything \from now on with myfitness pal. Pretty cool how you can just scan shit, big mistake on my part for not doing this sooner.


I essentially do a variation of stronglifts 5X5, or starting strength 3X5 depending on my energy. I like starting off with a 5X5 squat, overhead press, then a 1-3X5 deadlift depending how I feel. Or, I start off doing a 3-5X5 deadlift, bench, then a 1-3X5 squat. Both of which have been followed up by hamstring curls on a machine, or reverse lunges the last week or so

When I started lifting I couldn't squat do to my situation at home, not having a rack. So I did deficit deadlifts, and overhead press for the first 2 months before getting a gym membership. Doing them 3-4 days a week like stronglifts would have you do squats every exercise. My legs ended up incredibly quad dominant....So I suspect I might not be eating enough, and possibly my imbalances got to the point the weaknesses aren't getting the load they should

[KyrieTheFuture]

Are you an athlete or competitive lifter? If not, there's not much reason to take supps beyond protein

[jongib369]

Are you an athlete or competitive lifter? If not, there's not much reason to take supps beyond protein
My goal is to squat, and deadlift 400+ weighing between 175 and 190. Not sure if I want to stay 175. Deadlift is my favorite exercise, and doing 600 someday would be \ awesome. But I'm not setting my sites on that yet until I see how my body reacts to 450+. Considering I started with chicken legs, and no posterior chain I was pretty happy getting it to 350 in 4 months or w/e it was

[KyrieTheFuture]

My goal is to squat, and deadlift 400+ weighing between 175 and 190. Not sure if I want to stay 175. Deadlift is my favorite exercise, and doing 600 someday would be \ awesome. But I'm not setting my sites on that yet until I see how my body reacts to 450+. Considering I started with chicken legs, and no posterior chain I was pretty happy getting it to 350 in 4 months or w/e it was
Worth it, those are lofty goals that will be very, very difficult to achieve naturally. Idk how tall you are but 175 will most likely be too light.

[jongib369]

Worth it, those are lofty goals that will be very, very difficult to achieve naturally. Idk how tall you are but 175 will most likely be too light.
Well if the doctor scale I've got at my house is right, I'm shorter than I thought. And so is my wingspan. Just got it not too long ago...All these years I thought I was 5'8 or 9....Turns out I'm only "5.7250656", with a wingspan a little over 6'0 1/2. Size 30 jean length, 31 if I wore them properly. I've got high hips/short torso so my body is somewhat suited for the deadlift.

https://41.media.tumblr.com/e1adaf31c2f559aa04a8020796d85fdc/tumblr_o01t28xuQf1td15w4o1_1280.jpg

Not as strong as I got, but stronger than I am now after work got in the way. Night shift 50 hours a week really ****s up your lifting schedule lol

[jongib369]

Still 175 is probably too light, unless I really hit the lottery with my genetics. Otherwise, I don't mind gaining more than a few pounds


http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/DeadliftStandards.html


I just want to get to "elite" like my girlfriend was at 135, deadlifting 300. She gives me shit for that to motivate me :lol

[KyrieTheFuture]

Still 175 is probably too light, unless I really hit the lottery with my genetics. Otherwise, I don't mind gaining more than a few pounds


http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/DeadliftStandards.html


I just want to get to "elite" like my girlfriend was at 135, deadlifting 300. She gives me shit for that to motivate me :lol
:bowdown: :bowdown:

[HeatFanSince88]

Nearly all supplements are a waste of money. "Supplements" are just a lame ass fad thats been plopped up by talentless f@gs who want to make a living off "lifting".

"Yeah man buy this supplement and you'll look like me".

Creatine is so ****ing cheap it doesn't really matter though. I personally think it's just sugar, carbs, and calories. nothing you cant get elsewhere. i don't take it anymore, because I noticed when I stopped taking literally nothing changed.

more likely people that get results from creatine is placebo related. If your mind believes it works, then it will. Your mind is more powerful than any supp.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Nearly all supplements are a waste of money. "Supplements" are just a lame ass fad thats been plopped up by talentless f@gs who want to make a living off "lifting".

"Yeah man buy this supplement and you'll look like me".

Creatine is so ****ing cheap it doesn't really matter though. I personally think it's just sugar, carbs, and calories. nothing you cant get elsewhere. i don't take it anymore, because I noticed when I stopped taking literally nothing changed.

more likely people that get results from creatine is placebo related. If your mind believes it works, then it will. Your mind is more powerful than any supp.
........what?

[tmacattack33]

It helps you lift a little more (creatine is an energy molecule in your cells basically) or do a few more reps. Which can be big if you are plateuing.

If I can do 80 lbs for 10 reps normally on some lift...on creative i would probably do 80 lbs for like 14 reps.

[jongib369]

It helps you lift a little more (creatine is an energy molecule in your cells basically) or do a few more reps. Which can be big if you are plateuing.

If I can do 80 lbs for 10 reps normally on some lift...on creative i would probably do 80 lbs for like 14 reps.
Only a few days into loading so hopefully I'm a responder...That bit of extra work is exactly what I'm looking for, ontop of eating better I'm hoping for the best.

Just weird that my deadlift would increase the way it would, and not squat

[jongib369]

:bowdown: :bowdown:
Woman is goofy, yet chill as ****. Loves video games(and is good at them), smart as a whip, and has an ass like you wouldn't believe.

I've been with a lot of women, first 4 years after highschool I averaged 13.33 women per year, shooting 97% on the first date on 40 attempts. Curry aint got shit on me, even Wilt would be like

http://www.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/cheers_leonardo_dicaprio.gif


....I've had girls that could suck a nail out a goddamn coffin, yet this woman is irreplaceable. Life is good fam

:cheers:

[alenleomessi]

its all in your head.. you are taking some supplement paying for that shit and your brain pushes your body for one or two more reps and suddenly you think the supplement is magic and you tell all your buddies about it.. thats how hateraid makes a living :cheers:

supplements are just an accessory man.. to make your daily food intake a bit more versatile and attractive

i cringe when i hear some kids talking about creatine and how it made them gain 10+lbs in few days.. its the 2 gallons per day you've been drinking idiots :oldlol:

[jongib369]

Just realized I am the height I thought I was. 5'9 in the morning, 5'8 at night haha. Don't know how I forgot that 5.7250656 isn't "5'7"

:banghead:

:lol

I'm an idiot sometimes

[GIF REACTION]

its all in your head.. you are taking some supplement paying for that shit and your brain pushes your body for one or two more reps and suddenly you think the supplement is magic and you tell all your buddies about it.. thats how hateraid makes a living :cheers:

supplements are just an accessory man.. to make your daily food intake a bit more versatile and attractive

i cringe when i hear some kids talking about creatine and how it made them gain 10+lbs in few days.. its the 2 gallons per day you've been drinking idiots :oldlol:
This

shits a waste of money if you ask me

if you want some sups that really work, just buy some test and var

[jongib369]

This

shits a waste of money if you ask me

if you want some sups that really work, just buy some test and var
A few extra reps even if you don't gain weight is pretty huge IMO. I won't say it had nothing to do with 'believing it'd help, but it has been shown to work better than a placebo. It's been pretty well studied from what I gather after looking it up a bit more, but how big these studies were, and well they went about gathering theit data is something I don't know as of this moment

[JohnnySic]

Supplements are the last 1-2% of the equation. Its mainly eat, rest, and train hard.

Most supplements are bs though.

[GIF REACTION]

Trust me

Those creatine "benefits" will not make you any stronger or gain any more muscle in the long run

Stop focusing on the wrong things

Just Eat sleep lift

Simple

[GIF REACTION]

The only "sups" that are actually of any real value are shit like SARMS or pro hormones which is essentially just a weak ass version of steroids... They'll still **** with your hpta system just like steroids though

[hateraid]

I'm going to explain this one last time and hopefully the majority of you will "get it".

ALL supplements work. Creatine works. Protein is essentially food so it works. All the preworkout, aminos, and test boosters, they all work. If you claim they don't then you are completely misguided in what you think they do. Saying supplements don't work, all you got to do is eat right, is a very blanketed and ignorant statement.

First off, anyone with actual knowledge about supplements are never going to claim this is what gave me the results I wanted. It's the dumb noobs who buy this stuff expecting far fetched results based on what they read in advertising. Don't judge the industry based on that category of people. People who get realty and take supplements are well aware that it takes hard work, descipline, consistency, and dedication. Supplements are the last piece to that equation. ALL fitness competitors, gym rats, athletes, and body builders I know take a supplement in one form or another. If 2 people are training the exact same, managing their diet responsibly, the one who takes supplements will always get the better results.

Supplements are intended to fill nutritional gaps. Hence the term "supplement", which is to complement. Not to replace. That is where the ignorance lies. People who are against it is in the mindset that supplements are being used to replace food. Again, any knowledgeable person in my industry will tell you this.

The whole very aspect of supplements is based on a holistic principle. EVERYTHING you put into your body WILL alter it in one way or another. The problem is EXPECTATIONS are generally skued. Take for example, people who take creatine. They expect to get huge. Creatine is used to create ATP fuel which your body uses for short bursts of energy. This is a biological fact. But somehow it's interpreted as a weight gainer. The side effect is your body will expand in a dunk tank, but the primary use is to create strength.

If supplements didn't work then why do they use certain ones in medical practices or even daily use? People drink caffeine every day for energy. Arginine is commonly used to treat high blood pressure. Glutamine is used in IV drips for muscle wasting patience. Creatine is used to treat certain brain disorders. It all depends on application. So why wouldn't it work for people who train? Those aspects are there to gain results.

People add products to cars to improve performance. So why doesn't it apply to us? Food to humans is like oil and gas to a car. Nobody is going to tell you not to use gas or oil. Supplements are like NOS or engine additives. They help the performance. Again, nobody is telling you to replace oil and gas with these products.

ALL supplements unless synthetically made come from a food or herb source. Creatine is a byproduct of red meat. Are we saying now food doesn't work?

So all in all people need to undestand and educate themselves before making a blanket statement. I'm not telling everyone to go out and get the latest supplement fad, but they shouldn't knock what they don't know.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Woman is goofy, yet chill as ****. Loves video games(and is good at them), smart as a whip, and has an ass like you wouldn't believe.

I've been with a lot of women, first 4 years after highschool I averaged 13.33 women per year, shooting 97% on the first date on 40 attempts. Curry aint got shit on me, even Wilt would be like

http://www.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/cheers_leonardo_dicaprio.gif


....I've had girls that could suck a nail out a goddamn coffin, yet this woman is irreplaceable. Life is good fam

:cheers:
Bruh your girl is my dream girl, no offense meant

[KyrieTheFuture]

Why is no one talking about the fact that 1) Heat fan thought "calories" were an ingredient and 2) talked shit about creatine without knowing it's made naturally in your body

[JohnnySic]

I'm going to explain this one last time and hopefully the majority of you will "get it".

ALL supplements work. Creatine works. Protein is essentially food so it works. All the preworkout, aminos, and test boosters, they all work. If you claim they don't then you are completely misguided in what you think they do. Saying supplements don't work, all you got to do is eat right, is a very blanketed and ignorant statement.

First off, anyone with actual knowledge about supplements are never going to claim this is what gave me the results I wanted. It's the dumb noobs who buy this stuff expecting far fetched results based on what they read in advertising. Don't judge the industry based on that category of people. People who get realty and take supplements are well aware that it takes hard work, descipline, consistency, and dedication. Supplements are the last piece to that equation. ALL fitness competitors, gym rats, athletes, and body builders I know take a supplement in one form or another. If 2 people are training the exact same, managing their diet responsibly, the one who takes supplements will always get the better results.

Supplements are intended to fill nutritional gaps. Hence the term "supplement", which is to complement. Not to replace. That is where the ignorance lies. People who are against it is in the mindset that supplements are being used to replace food. Again, any knowledgeable person in my industry will tell you this.

The whole very aspect of supplements is based on a holistic principle. EVERYTHING you put into your body WILL alter it in one way or another. The problem is EXPECTATIONS are generally skued. Take for example, people who take creatine. They expect to get huge. Creatine is used to create ATP fuel which your body uses for short bursts of energy. This is a biological fact. But somehow it's interpreted as a weight gainer. The side effect is your body will expand in a dunk tank, but the primary use is to create strength.

If supplements didn't work then why do they use certain ones in medical practices or even daily use? People drink caffeine every day for energy. Arginine is commonly used to treat high blood pressure. Glutamine is used in IV drips for muscle wasting patience. Creatine is used to treat certain brain disorders. It all depends on application. So why wouldn't it work for people who train? Those aspects are there to gain results.

People add products to cars to improve performance. So why doesn't it apply to us? Food to humans is like oil and gas to a car. Nobody is going to tell you not to use gas or oil. Supplements are like NOS or engine additives. They help the performance. Again, nobody is telling you to replace oil and gas with these products.

ALL supplements unless synthetically made come from a food or herb source. Creatine is a byproduct of red meat. Are we saying now food doesn't work?

So all in all people need to undestand and educate themselves before making a blanket statement. I'm not telling everyone to go out and get the latest supplement fad, but they shouldn't knock what they don't know.
Some supplements are useful if used right, but there is a lot of useless crap out there.

[hateraid]

Why is no one talking about the fact that 1) Heat fan thought "calories" were an ingredient and 2) talked shit about creatine without knowing it's made naturally in your body

Exactly. He said sugar, carbs, and calories which are pretty much one in the same. He represents the misguided opinions that people have against the supplement industry

[hateraid]

Some supplements are useful if used right, but there is a lot of useless crap out there.

In what sense? Have you personally seen conclusive data that backs what you are saying? Are these people using it correctly? You seem to have missed my whole point. A lot of it is based on expectations. 99% is extracted from a herb or food. So you telling me food is bogus? Not trying to insult you, but I don't think you quite grasped what I posted. You've pretty much formed your opinion and are going to stand by it

[KyrieTheFuture]

In what sense? Have you personally seen conclusive data that backs what you are saying? Are these people using it correctly? You seem to have missed my whole point. A lot of it is based on expectations. 99% is extracted from a herb or food. So you telling me food is bogus? Not trying to insult you, but I don't think you quite grasped what I posted. You've pretty much formed your opinion and are going to stand by it
When I was in highschool I was pretty cool with the "bro" crew. Shit was so funny, they all had like 6-7 different sups but worked out like 3 times a week on arms only. What a waste of money. People like that are the ones who complain about results usually

[hateraid]

When I was in highschool I was pretty cool with the "bro" crew. Shit was so funny, they all had like 6-7 different sups but worked out like 3 times a week on arms only. What a waste of money. People like that are the ones who complain about results usually
See that's just a small sample size of the industry yet people seem to gauge the whole industry based on that picture.
True, the bro crew is just as misguided as the people who judge the industry.
It just reminds me of how the world works. People are experts on subjects the know maybe 5% about

[KyrieTheFuture]

See that's just a small sample size of the industry yet people seem to gauge the whole industry based on that picture.
True, the bro crew is just as misguided as the people who judge the industry.
It just reminds me of how the world works. People are experts on subjects the know maybe 5% about
Never seen ISH described so well

[oarabbus]

When I was in highschool I was pretty cool with the "bro" crew. Shit was so funny, they all had like 6-7 different sups but worked out like 3 times a week on arms only. What a waste of money. People like that are the ones who complain about results usually


:roll:

High schoolers though, I won't blame em for being that dumb unless they continued to do it afterwards.

"Carbs sugar and calories" my god that guy is so dumb, he shouldn't be allowed to reproduce.

[jongib369]

Bruh your girl is my dream girl, no offense meant
Hahaha XD

No offense taken man, unfortunately for me she might not be long term. But I'm working on positioning myself for it.

She was able to squat the same too ;)

[jongib369]

Given my proportions/weight what goals do you think would be realistic? Just taking it one day at a time, not thinking about 400, 500+?

[jongib369]

:roll:

High schoolers though, I won't blame em for being that dumb unless they continued to do it afterwards.

"Carbs sugar and calories" my god that guy is so dumb, he shouldn't be allowed to reproduce.
I was one of those. Bench and curl about 4 days a week in high school. Had absolutely no idea wtf I was doing...Chicken legs, no posterior chain.....But my arms were stronger than some of the lineman on the football team who were a shit ton bigger/heavier. What a waste haha

[KyrieTheFuture]

Hahaha XD

No offense taken man, unfortunately for me she might not be long term. But I'm working on positioning myself for it.

She was able to squat the same too ;)
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[KyrieTheFuture]

Given my proportions/weight what goals do you think would be realistic? Just taking it one day at a time, not thinking about 400, 500+?
What kind of goals? Like in a month? A year? End game?

[jongib369]

What kind of goals? Like in a month? A year? End game?
1-2 years what would be a realistic goal to set? It's all about putting in the work with correct form, not weight....But it would be nice for instance to deadlift 500 pounds oneday weighing between 175 and 190.

[jongib369]

https://media.giphy.com/media/WubfXcmcBfP1u/giphy.gif
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Oh might I add it was a 300 pound ass to grass squat In just over a year of lifting...While cycling about 50 miles a day at a fast pace.

; D

[KyrieTheFuture]

1-2 years what would be a realistic goal to set? It's all about putting in the work with correct form, not weight....But it would be nice for instance to deadlift 500 pounds oneday weighing between 175 and 190.
Is this a deadlift weight goal? Max? Or reps? I've only set weight goals (as in my body) for myself as that kind of strength doesn't appeal to me. I'm far weaker than you are, but I'd say I know a decent amount of info. You said you do 350 now right? The hardest thing about strength gains like that is actually outside the gym. If you have an active life where your legs aren't pretty much resting unless you're deadlifting, and you don't eat right, sleep etc, you won't be able to get much farther than where you are (from what I've seen). Most of the guys I know pulling that kind of weight don't do anything that isn't a squat or deadlift variant, and are able to do that because they work in a gym. So they're either working out, standing/sitting around, and sleeping.

Also if you deadlift 350 in a normal stance you could probably get 400+ Sumo style.

[sunsfan1357]

Is this a deadlift weight goal? Max? Or reps? I've only set weight goals (as in my body) for myself as that kind of strength doesn't appeal to me. I'm far weaker than you are, but I'd say I know a decent amount of info. You said you do 350 now right? The hardest thing about strength gains like that is actually outside the gym. If you have an active life where your legs aren't pretty much resting unless you're deadlifting, and you don't eat right, sleep etc, you won't be able to get much farther than where you are (from what I've seen). Most of the guys I know pulling that kind of weight don't do anything that isn't a squat or deadlift variant, and are able to do that because they work in a gym. So they're either working out, standing/sitting around, and sleeping.

Also if you deadlift 350 in a normal stance you could probably get 400+ Sumo style.


Wut? People don't automatically deadlift more sumo. My conventional max is 550, I dedicated about 8 months to sumo and my best was 525. It depends on leverages. At some point he should try sumo, but when to try it is up to him.

As for goals, you should really set smaller goals and focus on hitting those. If you're at 350, aim for 400. When you're at 400 aim for 450. Having a huge number in mind is nice, but ultimately pointless because you have other numbers to hit first. He doesn't have to work in the gym or live at the gym to put up those numbers. I know plenty of people in the 165-190 range deadlifting 500-600+ and they're mostly regular people with every day jobs.

[KyrieTheFuture]

[/B]

Wut? People don't automatically deadlift more sumo. My conventional max is 550, I dedicated about 8 months to sumo and my best was 525. It depends on leverages. At some point he should try sumo, but when to try it is up to him.

As for goals, you should really set smaller goals and focus on hitting those. If you're at 350, aim for 400. When you're at 400 aim for 450. Having a huge number in mind is nice, but ultimately pointless because you have other numbers to hit first. He doesn't have to work in the gym or live at the gym to put up those numbers. I know plenty of people in the 165-190 range deadlifting 500-600+ and they're mostly regular people with every day jobs.
It's a shorter lift and almost everyone I know can lift heavier on it, but everyone's body is different.

[jongib369]

I think sumo suits people with short arms, short legs, and a long torso. While conventional it's long legs, short torso, long arms. The latter being more so my body type except for the legs

[sunsfan1357]

I think sumo suits people with short arms, short legs, and a long torso. While conventional it's long legs, short torso, long arms. The latter being more so my body type except for the legs
That's more of a misnomer, look atguys like Layne Norton who has an awesome sumo pull and you'd think he would be a conventional lifter. Like I said it's great to train both and see what you're stronger at. Maybe not 8 months like me, but maybe something like 8 weeks. Although sumo is a shorter ROM it is also a more technically difficult lift, slower off the ground and faster at lockout. Also depending on how you squat you'd really want to take care of your hips with mobility stuff.

[HeatFanSince88]

Exactly. He said sugar, carbs, and calories which are pretty much one in the same. He represents the misguided opinions that people have against the supplement industry

what a surprise. Someone who works in the supplement industry defending it....I'm sure there's no bias there.

how about you actually contribute to society instead of your job literally being just promoting bullshit to sell kids/noobs.

supplement industry is one of the biggest scams there is against young guys. id say 90% of guys who go to the gym take at least one supplement, and of course 90% STILL look like shit.

Animals take no supplements and look healthier than almost every human does. Almost every human I see is fat/ugly/deformed while every animal I see looks like it's ideal version.

And lol @ the guy who said "creatine lets me get 12 reps instead of 10 bro!". Ok and what practically does that have to your life? You don't look better(you'll be bloated). only chubby autistic "powerlifting" wannabes would give a shit.


Why is no one talking about the fact that 1) Heat fan thought "calories" were an ingredient and 2) talked shit about creatine without knowing it's made naturally in your body

I guarantee your fat/overweight, and dont even have a sixpack.

[KyrieTheFuture]

what a surprise. Someone who works in the supplement industry defending it....I'm sure there's no bias there.

how about you actually contribute to society instead of your job literally being just promoting bullshit to sell kids/noobs.

supplement industry is one of the biggest scams there is against young guys. id say 90% of guys who go to the gym take at least one supplement, and of course 90% STILL look like shit.

Animals take no supplements and look healthier than almost every human does. Almost every human I see is fat/ugly/deformed while every animal I see looks like it's ideal version.

And lol @ the guy who said "creatine lets me get 12 reps instead of 10 bro!". Ok and what practically does that have to your life? You don't look better(you'll be bloated). only chubby autistic "powerlifting" wannabes would give a shit.



I guarantee your fat/overweight, and dont even have a sixpack.
Lol 6 packs are such a horrendous indicator of fitness. If I was fat you already covered the 6 pack...unless you thinks someone can be fat and have a 6 pack? Idk what you believe, anything is possible with you. Sorry you're upset over being about as wrong as humanely possible about something. But yea 6'1 180 is soooooo fat.

[TheNaturalWR]

what a surprise. Someone who works in the supplement industry defending it....I'm sure there's no bias there.

how about you actually contribute to society instead of your job literally being just promoting bullshit to sell kids/noobs.

supplement industry is one of the biggest scams there is against young guys. id say 90% of guys who go to the gym take at least one supplement, and of course 90% STILL look like shit.

Animals take no supplements and look healthier than almost every human does. Almost every human I see is fat/ugly/deformed while every animal I see looks like it's ideal version.

And lol @ the guy who said "creatine lets me get 12 reps instead of 10 bro!". Ok and what practically does that have to your life? You don't look better(you'll be bloated). only chubby autistic "powerlifting" wannabes would give a shit.



I guarantee your fat/overweight, and dont even have a sixpack.

You realize 12 reps instead of 10 is more overload on the muscle right? Which leads to more growth...Not to mention most people don't even get bloated as long as they drink enough water.

[HeatFanSince88]

Lol 6 packs are such a horrendous indicator of fitness. If I was fat you already covered the 6 pack...unless you thinks someone can be fat and have a 6 pack? Idk what you believe, anything is possible with you. Sorry you're upset over being about as wrong as humanely possible about something. But yea 6'1 180 is soooooo fat.

the lifting community is full of ugly, socially awkward, bloated, unathletic guys who are overweight and never played a real competitive sport in their youth so they think "lifting big weights" in college/their 20s will make up for it. the kind of f@gs that think they actually look good just because they squat 300 pounds. :roll:

"fat" might be too harsh a word, but they are indeed overweight. they look like shit and are overweight by healthy standards. i see these guys at the gym a lot and i can pick them out from a mile away. :roll:

[KyrieTheFuture]

the lifting community is full of ugly, socially awkward, bloated, unathletic guys who are overweight and never played a real competitive sport in their youth so they think "lifting big weights" in college/their 20s will make up for it. the kind of f@gs that think they actually look good just because they squat 300 pounds. :roll:

"fat" might be too harsh a word, but they are indeed overweight. they look like shit and are overweight by healthy standards. i see these guys at the gym a lot and i can pick them out from a mile away. :roll:
This is all true, and has nothing to do with the fact you have no idea what the **** you are talking about when it comes to creatine or fitness. You know less than the people you are making fun of.

[hateraid]

what a surprise. Someone who works in the supplement industry defending it....I'm sure there's no bias there.

how about you actually contribute to society instead of your job literally being just promoting bullshit to sell kids/noobs.

supplement industry is one of the biggest scams there is against young guys. id say 90% of guys who go to the gym take at least one supplement, and of course 90% STILL look like shit.

Animals take no supplements and look healthier than almost every human does. Almost every human I see is fat/ugly/deformed while every animal I see looks like it's ideal version.

And lol @ the guy who said "creatine lets me get 12 reps instead of 10 bro!". Ok and what practically does that have to your life? You don't look better(you'll be bloated). only chubby autistic "powerlifting" wannabes would give a shit.



I guarantee your fat/overweight, and dont even have a sixpack.

Here we go again. Another uneducated blowhard who knows nothing about health and fitness trying to attack me.
Go back to my post and read it again. Where am I trying to sell something?

I can tell by your post about 90% of the guys take supplements comment that you have never set foot in a gym and you pulled that statistic out of your ass. Another "smart" individual with unfounded statistics.

And your comparison with humans to animals has nothing to do with supplementing, it has to do with the fact that the majority of humans over indulge and eat like shit. Animals don't eat fast or processed food, junk food, and alcohol. Don't you think that contributes to the comparison? On the flip side many societies give their animals "supplements" to enhance performance and give them better physiques. Indian tribes used to give their elephants Ashwaghanda to help improve focus. The pet industry has supplements to keep animals healthy. Horses in horse racing are given supplements to help improve their conditioning. Hell, they run experiments on rats to prove effectiveness before it goes into production. So your comment in that regard in bogus and irrelevant and it's based on an assumption that every human on earth is taking a supplement.

If you think all I do is "sell supplements" you know nothing about what I do or the industry in itself. Like I keep on posting over and over you're one of those noobs who's mind has already been set in it's ways and blindly defends it. You're one of those people who knows 5% of what he's talking about and claims to be an expert

[GIF REACTION]

That sounds like pharmaceutical grade shit

Where do you draw the line between supplement and drug

If it's effective, call it a drug, right?

[hateraid]

That sounds like pharmaceutical grade shit

Where do you draw the line between supplement and drug

If it's effective, call it a drug, right?

A supplement is used to fill nutritional gaps and improve performance. It makes your food intake more efficient and/or increase physical output

A drug is used to treat or suppress a condition

[GIF REACTION]

A supplement is used to fill nutritional gaps and improve performance. It makes your food intake more efficient and/or increase physical output

A drug is used to treat or suppress a condition
But we both know the line is crossed by many

[hateraid]

But we both know the line is crossed by many
Not really. In the the context I explained it is exactly it. One is for nutritional gaps, hence the term supplement. The other is to treat.

Give me an example outside of steroids and HGH.

[GIF REACTION]

Not really. In the the context I explained it is exactly it. One is for nutritional gaps, hence the term supplement. The other is to treat.

Give me an example outside of steroids and HGH.
Peptides, EPO

The only real stuff worth it's weight in gold are what we just mentioned

[fiddy]

Peptides, EPO

The only real stuff worth it's weight in gold are what we just mentioned
HGH = peptide

[GIF REACTION]

HGH = peptide
True but there is so many more peptides

[hateraid]

Peptides, EPO

The only real stuff worth it's weight in gold are what we just mentioned

Peptides refers to a bonding of amino acids so no, it doesn't fall into a category. That's a bad example.
Your over reaching trying to link a supplement and a drug. Any cross over is just a small sample size and an obvious gray area. But this a totally different subject matter all together.

Like I said, supplements are to fill gaps in nutrition. It's as simple as that and shouldn't tried to be dissected. Once people do their opinions get clouded and you get ignorant people like HearFanSince2009

[JohnnySic]

Peptides refers to a bonding of amino acids so no, it doesn't fall into a category. That's a bad example.
Your over reaching trying to link a supplement and a drug. Any cross over is just a small sample size and an obvious gray area. But this a totally different subject matter all together.

Like I said, supplements are to fill gaps in nutrition. It's as simple as that and shouldn't tried to be dissected. Once people do their opinions get clouded and you get ignorant people like HearFanSince2009
Hateraid, what's your opinion of Muscle Milk?

[hateraid]

Hateraid, what's your opinion of Muscle Milk?

I haven't had it in a long time. But I thought it was delicious. Especially their RTD's. They use too much fat though for my liking. But it contributes to the taste and texture. Cytosport really dropped off as a company though. They went mass market and never looked back

[jongib369]

I haven't had it in a long time. But I thought it was delicious. Especially their RTD's. They use too much fat though for my liking. But it contributes to the taste and texture. Cytosport really dropped off as a company though. They went mass market and never looked back
Considering I'm 5'8/9 175....Lifting 3 days a week at the gym, ome day at home doing deficet deadlifts, what would you recommend my daily intake be on days I lift, and don't. Calories, protein, etc etc

Also what foods do you recommend, or any other tips you could think of

[verylegit]

I haven't had it in a long time. But I thought it was delicious. Especially their RTD's. They use too much fat though for my liking. But it contributes to the taste and texture. Cytosport really dropped off as a company though. They went mass market and never looked back
Their muscle milk protein tasted very similar to chocolate milk lol. Best protein I've ever consumed.

[falc39]

Hey so I play a lot of soccer and flag football and I mainly lift for athletic reasons, not big on looks and stuff if it isn't functional. I've been trying to decide if to go with creatine or not.

The two options I've read is to do a loading phase and then consistent amount after. Or just start with consistent amount all the way through. I do not want bloating and the whole loading phase with 20g seems a bit much. I was thinking of starting with 3g a day. Any benefits to not doing the loading? I like to take it slow and cautious when introducing major changes to my body/diet.

[oarabbus]

Hey so I play a lot of soccer and flag football and I mainly lift for athletic reasons, not big on looks and stuff if it isn't functional. I've been trying to decide if to go with creatine or not.

The two options I've read is to do a loading phase and then consistent amount after. Or just start with consistent amount all the way through. I do not want bloating and the whole loading phase with 20g seems a bit much. I was thinking of starting with 3g a day. Any benefits to not doing the loading? I like to take it slow and cautious when introducing major changes to my body/diet.


Over a long period (over a couple weeks) of time, it doesn't matter if you loaded or not. The loading is only necessary if you want to see benefits quickly.

[hateraid]

Considering I'm 5'8/9 175....Lifting 3 days a week at the gym, ome day at home doing deficet deadlifts, what would you recommend my daily intake be on days I lift, and don't. Calories, protein, etc etc

Also what foods do you recommend, or any other tips you could think of

Well rule of thumb with supplementing is always take protein after your workout. It's fundamental. Protein powders are ideal beacaue of the absorption, cost, and convenience.

The optimal calorie intake for the day is 40% protein, 50% carbs and 10% fat. Or course opinions vary, I just took this information off my University of Florida textbook. Start with 70% weight should be grams of protein. To determine that times your weight by .7. You should consume 122.5 grams of protein daily, not including your post workout shake.
So by the formula

Protein = 122.5 grams x 4 = 490 calories
Carbs = 152.5 grams x 4 = 610 calories
fat = 30.5 grams x 9 = 275 calories

That's 1375 calories daily.

That's just an ideal blue print. Of course tweek according to your goals

[hateraid]

Hey so I play a lot of soccer and flag football and I mainly lift for athletic reasons, not big on looks and stuff if it isn't functional. I've been trying to decide if to go with creatine or not.

The two options I've read is to do a loading phase and then consistent amount after. Or just start with consistent amount all the way through. I do not want bloating and the whole loading phase with 20g seems a bit much. I was thinking of starting with 3g a day. Any benefits to not doing the loading? I like to take it slow and cautious when introducing major changes to my body/diet.

Creatine has come a long way my friend. Look into a creatine HCL or Krealkalyn. No loading, no bloating. Most importantly no waste product.

And for those who are going to accuse me of being a salesman, Dymatize Nutrition does not make this so I do not benefit from endorsing this.

[TheNaturalWR]

Considering I'm 5'8/9 175....Lifting 3 days a week at the gym, ome day at home doing deficet deadlifts, what would you recommend my daily intake be on days I lift, and don't. Calories, protein, etc etc

Also what foods do you recommend, or any other tips you could think of

I'm 5'9 170, lift 6-7 days a week and only consume around 3000-3200 calories a day for roughly a .5lb a week weight again. You can use that for reference. On the rare occurrences that I rest, I consume 2800-2900, which is probably my maintenance.