US Military Gave Intel to Assad, While CIA Funded & Armed ISIS

[Nick Young]

There is currently a media blackout in the US trying to stop this story from going mainstream.

Before you go discrediting the source, know that the journalism was done by Pulitzer prize winner Seymour Hersh. Here is a link to his article from the London Review of Books. (http://www.lrb.co.uk/v38/n01/seymour-m-hersh/military-to-military)


TL;DR The military is rebelling against Obama. If Obama had his way, we would be giving full support to Al Quaeda aka "moderate rebels", and Syria becomes the next Libya.

Joint Chiefs of Staff Official – US Military Gave Intel to Assad, While CIA Funded & Armed ISIS


Washington, DC – The Pentagon’s Joint Chiefs of Staff (JCS) have been indirectly providing intelligence on the Islamic State to the government of Syrian President Bashar Assad, in direct contrast to the Obama administration’s agenda of regime change, in an effort to stop Syria from becoming another failed state from which terrorists can operate.

A recent investigation by renowned journalist Seymour Hersh provides clear evidence of a massive disconnect between President Obama’s White House and the U.S. military regarding the handling of the Syrian situation.

The awkward situation stems from the Obama administration’s insistence that there are “moderate rebel” groups to arm that are capable of defeating Assad, and the subsequent decision to provide weapons to these jihadist groups through a covert CIA program.

In spite of the “Assad must go” pledge made by President Obama and covert CIA program, the U.S. JCS instead opted to feed intelligence on the Islamic State to the Syrian government through a number of intermediary governments, the unidentified former senior advisor to the JCS told Hersh.

“Our policy of arming the opposition to Assad was unsuccessful and actually having a negative impact,” the former JCS adviser told Hersh.

“The Joint Chiefs believed that Assad should not be replaced by fundamentalists. The administration’s policy was contradictory. They wanted Assad to go but the opposition was dominated by extremists. So who was going to replace him? To say Assad’s got to go is fine, but if you follow that through – therefore anyone is better. It’s the “anybody else is better” issue that the JCS had with Obama’s policy,” the unnamed JCS advisor said.

According to a report by Hersh, published in The London Review of Books:

The Joint Chiefs felt that a direct challenge to Obama’s policy would have ‘had a zero chance of success’. So in the autumn of 2013 they decided to take steps against the extremists without going through political channels, by providing US intelligence to the militaries of other nations, on the understanding that it would be passed on to the Syrian army and used against the common enemy, Jabhat al-Nusra and Islamic State.

The impetus behind the military’s action was a highly classified Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) report, which made clear that if Assad were to be deposed, Syria would fall into chaos and provide an easy target for Islamic extremists to gain a strong foothold similar to Libya.

According to the report by Hersh:

A former senior adviser to the Joint Chiefs told me that the document was an ‘all-source’ appraisal, drawing on information from signals, satellite and human intelligence, and took a dim view of the Obama administration’s insistence on continuing to finance and arm the so-called moderate rebel groups. By then, the CIA had been conspiring for more than a year with allies in the UK, Saudi Arabia and Qatar to ship guns and goods – to be used for the overthrow of Assad – from Libya, via Turkey, into Syria. The new intelligence estimate singled out Turkey as a major impediment to Obama’s Syria policy. The document showed, the adviser said, ‘that what was started as a covert US programme to arm and support the moderate rebels fighting Assad had been co-opted by Turkey, and had morphed into an across-the-board technical, arms and logistical programme for all of the opposition, including Jabhat al-Nusra and Islamic State. The so-called moderates had evaporated and the Free Syrian Army was a rump group stationed at an airbase in Turkey.’ The assessment was bleak: there was no viable ‘moderate’ opposition to Assad, and the US was arming extremists.

Lieutenant General Michael Flynn, director of the DIA between 2012 and 2014, confirmed that his agency had sent a constant stream of classified warnings to the civilian leadership about the dire consequences of toppling Assad. The jihadists, he said, were in control of the opposition. Turkey wasn’t doing enough to stop the smuggling of foreign fighters and weapons across the border. ‘If the American public saw the intelligence we were producing daily, at the most sensitive level, they would go ballistic,’ Flynn told me. ‘We understood Isis’s long-term strategy and its campaign plans, and we also discussed the fact that Turkey was looking the other way when it came to the growth of the Islamic State inside Syria.’ The DIA’s reporting, he said, ‘got enormous pushback’ from the Obama administration. ‘I felt that they did not want to hear the truth.’

The reality created by the CIA program to arm the “moderate rebels” is harrowing, as arms were handed to virtually any group opposing Assad’s military, including terrorist organizations such as Jabhat al-Nusra and the Islamic State.

In stark contrast to the White House and CIA, the U.S. military’s assessment was extremely realistic: moderate opposition to Assad is a complete myth and the U.S. was arming the same Islamic extremists it had just got done fighting in both Afghanistan and Iraq.

Read more at http://thefreethoughtproject.com/white-house-cia-supply-terrorists-weapons-topple-assad-u-s-military-feeds-syrian-govt-intel-isis/#vTJudM4dGV3UbYEo.99

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/white-house-cia-supply-terrorists-weapons-topple-assad-u-s-military-feeds-syrian-govt-intel-isis/

[DCL]

here comes KevinNYC in 3, 2, 1...

[Nick Young]

here comes KevinNYC in 3, 2, 1...
There is no way he can defend this. Obama's purposefully vague policies were designed to destabilize Syria and prolong the Civil War.


There is irrefutable evidence that Obama has been supplying Al Quaeda and ISIS with tax payer funded weapons.


THANK YOU JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF. I am proud the US military has been doing the right thing and standing up against the bullshit limpwristed Obama administration.

[ShaqTwizzle]

Obama also used to fund ISIS but back then it was called ISEL.
Anyway our whole Government (and all major media) is a joke completely or mostly rigged & controlled by rich globalist monsters with no loyalty to our country and Obama is their current puppet.

Who is next in line?
Hillary Clinton who's biggest political donor is Mr. Soros the ultimate globalist and a guy who has publically said he wants to collapse the US dollar and that America is his current enemy and biggest obstacle to his dreams (he also funded BLM groups etc...).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDFhgpidzNA

[Nick Young]

Hillary Clinton aka Obama Reign part 2 with more warmongery:facepalm

[poido123]

It's not the muslims fault. It's not Obama's fault.


It's everyone else for questioning them. Stop being racist.

[Giaodollo]

I think everyone with half a brain and with their mouth not halfway to teabagging obamas nuts knew they were doing fishy stuff. I don't mean to hate on Obama, because I don't even think he has a say on matters like this.

I created a thread about Us supplying weapons to ISIS two years ago, and everyone was saying it was stupid. Well...

[oh the horror]

I think everyone with half a brain and with their mouth not halfway to teabagging obamas nuts knew they were doing fishy stuff. I don't mean to hate on Obama, because I don't even think he has a say on matters like this.

I created a thread about Us supplying weapons to ISIS two years ago, and everyone was saying it was stupid. Well...



It's hardly stupid. The United States government operates like a shady mafia. We do what we think will work toward our own benefits, create Blackfoot deals with enemies (that we create) constantly. The president is a figurehead. I'm not even sure why people bother to vote

[Nick Young]

I think everyone with half a brain and with their mouth not halfway to teabagging obamas nuts knew they were doing fishy stuff. I don't mean to hate on Obama, because I don't even think he has a say on matters like this.

I created a thread about Us supplying weapons to ISIS two years ago, and everyone was saying it was stupid. Well...
That ****ing excuse again:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

Of course the President of United States has a say in forming his own policy. Obama is far from an innocent pawn.

His own military generals have turned against him and are directly violating his policy. That shows you all you need to know about Obama's leadership.

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

What is the glue to bind one nation together?

[KyrieTheFuture]

This is what happens when all of our security organizations have no communication and their own agendas. Free Thought Project is a pretty garbage website though

[Nick Young]

This is what happens when all of our security organizations have no communication and their own agendas. Free Thought Project is a pretty garbage website though
Is Seymour Hersh a "pretty garbage" journalist?

I posted the summarized version of the article because I know how few of you will take the time to read the direct source.


Here it is. It's a brilliant read written by a Pulitzer prize winning journalist.
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v38/n01/seymour-m-hersh/military-to-military

[DonDadda59]

:facepalm

Stopped reading at Seymour Hersh.

Check your sauces, bruh (https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/the-deceits-of-seymour-hersh/).

This is the same fool who said the Bush administration was going to start a war in Iran, that Iran was not attempting to develop nuclear technology, and that the Bin Laden hit was a hoax... Among other things.

Poor gullible Nick. First Putin pulled the wool over your eyes, now you got Hershed. :(

[KyrieTheFuture]

Is Seymour Hersh a "pretty garbage" journalist?

I posted the summarized version of the article because I know how few of you will take the time to read the direct source.


Here it is. It's a brilliant read written by a Pulitzer prize winning journalist.
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v38/n01/seymour-m-hersh/military-to-military
Nah he's a great journalist, but his article on the Osama raid is a little unbelievable

[Nick Young]

:facepalm

Stopped reading at Seymour Hersh.

Check your sauces, bruh (https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/the-deceits-of-seymour-hersh/).

This is the same fool who said the Bush administration was going to start a war in Iran, that Iran was not attempting to develop nuclear technology, and that the Bin Laden hit was a hoax... Among other things.

Poor gullible Nick. First Putin pulled the wool over your eyes, now you got Hershed. :(
Mr. Pulitzer has exposed Obama for the active ISIS supporter that he is.

The Joint Chiefs of Staff are actively working against him.

Obama has failed.

Thank god we have smart people in positions of power willing to make the united stand against him.


When you don't like the message, shoot down the messenger. Even if that messenger is a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seymour_Hersh)

[DonDadda59]

Mr. Pulitzer has exposed Obama for the active ISIS supporter that he is.

The Joint Chiefs of Staff are actively working against him.

Obama has failed.

Thank god we have smart people in positions of power willing to make the united stand against him.


When you don't like the message, shoot down the messenger. Even if that messenger is a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist.

:lol

Read the entirety of the article I posted bruh. This isn't the first time Seymour was duped by unnamed sources into writing stories that turned out to be complete hoaxes. It isn't even the first time this year.

His report is based on a friend of a friend with no name telling him all this.

Back in '07 when he was writing about the imminent nuclear strike that Bush was going to order on Iran, he claimed that Jewish money was being funneled in NY to Hilary Clinton to make sure Iran was destroyed.

[INDENT][I]"Money. A lot of the Jewish money from New York. Come on, let's not kid about it. A significant percentage of Jewish money, and many leading American Jews support the Israeli position that Iran is an existential threat. And I think it's as simple as that. When you're from New York and from New York City, you take the view of

[Nick Young]

http://www.offthegridnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/military-signs-Syrian-Civil-War-400x358.jpg
#HOAX

[Terahite]

People just now realizing all this. :facepalm

Was anyone following the news in 2011 when our zionist-controlled government & media conspired to depose Gaddafi? He like Assad was not a NATO puppet and so was portrayed as a "strongman dictator" by our paid disinformation agents like Anderson Cooper (CIA) and Wolf Blitzer (Jerusalem).

I remember listening to NPR who was a major player in spreading agitation propaganda about Libya, running story after story about rocks being thrown at synagogues etc (it's the same shit world-round, then they moved on to Syria the following year) conditioning the minds of bleeding-heart dummies to hate Gaddafi.

Now let's remember the Obama regime began arming rebel groups to go in and... destabilize the country. Anyone see the pattern here?

After Gaddafi was beaten to death in the street by these western-backed murder squads (which Hilary Clinton bragged about openly) I suppose these very same "liberating armies" went back to work at Dillards and not for the same paid handlers in Syria, Iraq etc. and going under the name "ISIS" among others. :facepalm

Please use your common sense and memory. This didn't even start with Libya. And please examine the Israel connection closely.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51NmVYFr-kL._SX311_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

Where did the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) come from? How did this terrorist group go from an unknown phantom to seizing vast stretches of territory in Syria and Iraq in less than a year? Who is sponsoring ISIS and for what purpose? In a series of hard-hitting articles, Canadian writer Brandon Martinez uncovers the hidden hand of Israel and the West behind the meteoric rise of ISIS and the underlying Zionist destabilization agenda that it serves. Martinez cuts through mainstream media hype and disinformation which seeks to confound the masses about ISIS's true origins as well as whitewash the critical role of the United States, Saudi Arabia and Israel in spawning the Takfiri militants who have besieged both Iraq and Syria. Martinez traces the roots of the conspiracy back to Israel's Oded Yinon plan which aims to fracture and balkanize the Middle East.

:biggums:

[DonDadda59]

Concerning his Bin Laden hoax article from earlier this year.

The Many Problems with Seymour Hersh's Bin Laden Conspiracy Theory (http://www.vox.com/2015/5/11/8584473/seymour-hersh-osama-bin-laden)

3 Reasons to be Skeptical of Seymour Hersh's Account of the Bin Laden Raid (http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2015/05/11/3-reasons-to-be-skeptical-of-seymour-hershs-account-of-the-bin-laden-raid/)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B7ftQ0uCYAIPrpM.jpg

[Nick Young]

People just now realizing all this. :facepalm

Was anyone following the news in 2011 when our zionist-controlled government & media conspired to depose Gaddafi? He like Assad was not a NATO puppet and so was portrayed as a "strongman dictator" by our paid disinformation agents like Anderson Cooper (CIA) and Wolf Blitzer (Jerusalem).

I remember listening to NPR who was a major player in spreading agitation propaganda about Libya, running story after story about rocks being thrown at synagogues etc (it's the same shit world-round, then they moved on to Syria the following year) conditioning the minds of bleeding-heart dummies to hate Gaddafi.

Now let's remember the Obama regime began arming rebel groups to go in and... destabilize the country. Anyone see the pattern here?

After Gaddafi was beaten to death in the street by these western-backed murder squads (which Hilary Clinton bragged about openly) I suppose these very same "liberating armies" went back to work at Dillards and not for the same paid handlers in Syria, Iraq etc. and going under the name "ISIS" among others. :facepalm

Please use your common sense and memory. This didn't even start with Libya. And please examine the Israel connection closely.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51NmVYFr-kL._SX311_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

Where did the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) come from? How did this terrorist group go from an unknown phantom to seizing vast stretches of territory in Syria and Iraq in less than a year? Who is sponsoring ISIS and for what purpose? In a series of hard-hitting articles, Canadian writer Brandon Martinez uncovers the hidden hand of Israel and the West behind the meteoric rise of ISIS and the underlying Zionist destabilization agenda that it serves. Martinez cuts through mainstream media hype and disinformation which seeks to confound the masses about ISIS's true origins as well as whitewash the critical role of the United States, Saudi Arabia and Israel in spawning the Takfiri militants who have besieged both Iraq and Syria. Martinez traces the roots of the conspiracy back to Israel's Oded Yinon plan which aims to fracture and balkanize the Middle East.

:biggums:
WTF? Israel and "Zionism" have nothing to do with this.

[DonDadda59]

WTF? Israel and "Zionism" have nothing to do with this.

:no:

The Pulitzer prize says Zionism and Israel are the driving forces.


"Money. A lot of the Jewish money from New York. Come on, let's not kid about it. A significant percentage of Jewish money, and many leading American Jews support the Israeli position that Iran is an existential threat. And I think it's as simple as that. When you're from New York and from New York City, you take the view of – right now, when you're running a campaign, you follow that line. And there's no other explanation for it, because she's smart enough to know the downside."

-Seymour Hersh


Seymour Hersh: Jewish Money Controls Presidential Candidates (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4ZDabT6r3w)

http://www.troll.me/images/patronizing-wiggum/wheres-your-messiah-now-thumb.jpg

[Terahite]

WTF? Israel and "Zionism" have nothing to do with this.

You're wrong.

http://www.4thmedia.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/baghdadi-mossad-trained-450x250.jpg

http://www.4thmedia.org/2015/11/americas-coalition-of-treachery-isis-and-israels-intelligence-service-mossad-have-been-deeply-integrated-for-years/

[DonDadda59]

You're wrong.

http://www.4thmedia.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/baghdadi-mossad-trained-450x250.jpg

http://www.4thmedia.org/2015/11/americas-coalition-of-treachery-isis-and-israels-intelligence-service-mossad-have-been-deeply-integrated-for-years/

http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/hercules-nutty-professor-o.gif

Hercules! Hercules! Hercules! :banana:

Named sources and documents?! The Jewish/Zionist conspiracy is confirmed. :pimp:

[Nick Young]

When you can't shoot down the message, shoot down the messenger.

[DonDadda59]

When you can't shoot down the message, shoot down the messenger.

What are your feelings on Edward Snowden? :confusedshrug:

[KyrieTheFuture]

You're wrong.

http://www.4thmedia.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/baghdadi-mossad-trained-450x250.jpg

http://www.4thmedia.org/2015/11/americas-coalition-of-treachery-isis-and-israels-intelligence-service-mossad-have-been-deeply-integrated-for-years/
Thank you for joining this site you will provide me many chuckles with your posts

[Dresta]

:facepalm

Stopped reading at Seymour Hersh.

Check your sauces, bruh (https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/the-deceits-of-seymour-hersh/).

This is the same fool who said the Bush administration was going to start a war in Iran, that Iran was not attempting to develop nuclear technology, and that the Bin Laden hit was a hoax... Among other things.

Poor gullible Nick. First Putin pulled the wool over your eyes, now you got Hershed. :(
It's not only Hersh that thinks this. It really is a well-established fact, and has been known for months by anyone who knows anything about the region (you only don't know about it because you will follow Obama regardless of how despicable a person he is); the complicity of the Obama administration in arming and enabling Islamist rebels (including IS and Al-Qaeda) is well-documented, and i have posted this documentation on here in the past, but you of course have ignored it (even though US intelligence documents completely contradict the lies Obama was telling the US public at the time).

Your willingness to defend Obama like some pathetic lackey or lap-dog over these disgraceful actions really undermines any moral credibility you could have had. He would've been impeached by now if the American citizenry were informed enough to know what this man has been up to. His bombing campaign in Libya was illegal, and he has used weapons stolen from that country to arm Islamic terrorists.



What is the glue to bind one nation together?
Unfortunately, in Syria, it was the Assad regime. One needs only to look at the turbulent history of the region before Assad's father took power, to recognise this very simple fact.

Now, because of the impudence of Obama and his allies, Syria and Libya are wastelands, and millions of people have had their lives needlessly ruined by ideological fanatics (of which Obama is one). Not only that, but an ancient and beautiful country - one of the most historically important in the world - has been completely decimated. If Obama had been willing to compromise with Assad instead of arming rebels, IS could never have taken Palmyra, much of which is now rubble.

US foreign policy makers really know f-all about the Middle East, and yet they've been so quick to destabilise various parts of it, while pretending that they're carrying out some noble mission - tis disgraceful.

[BasedTom]

WTF? Israel and "Zionism" have nothing to do with this.
Is it not interesting that ISIS has operations all over the middle east, with members in europe and even mass attacks in Paris and Southern California...but they seem to have no imperative towards Israel?

I mean if we agree that most of the mideast hates Israel, and that Iran wants to nuke them into oblivion, and we agree that ISIS is worse than all those groups together...why is Israel seemingly off the hook? Is it not a more treasured prize in establishing the legitimacy of a upstart caliphate than say...Spain or Britain? Hezbollah gained a ton of PR from their supposed victory against Israel, so it's not as if there is no precedent.

they've beheaded a japanese man of all people :facepalm

[Blue&Orange]

WTF? Israel and "Zionism" have nothing to do with this.



The Pulitzer prize says Zionism and Israel are the driving forces.

It's so funny to see dumb young constantly being owned left right center.

The guy that travels the world from his mom's basement.

[Blue&Orange]

It's not only Hersh that thinks this. It really is a well-established fact, and has been known for months by anyone who knows anything about the region (you only don't know about it because you will follow Obama regardless of how despicable a person he is); the complicity of the Obama administration in arming and enabling Islamist rebels (including IS and Al-Qaeda) is well-documented, and i have posted this documentation on here in the past, but you of course have ignored it (even though US intelligence documents completely contradict the lies Obama was telling the US public at the time).

Your willingness to defend Obama like some pathetic lackey or lap-dog over these disgraceful actions really undermines any moral credibility you could have had. He would've been impeached by now if the American citizenry were informed enough to know what this man has been up to. His bombing campaign in Libya was illegal, and he has used weapons stolen from that country to arm Islamic terrorists.

Unfortunately, in Syria, it was the Assad regime. One needs only to look at the turbulent history of the region before Assad's father took power, to recognise this very simple fact.

Now, because of the impudence of Obama and his allies, Syria and Libya are wastelands, and millions of people have had their lives needlessly ruined by ideological fanatics (of which Obama is one). Not only that, but an ancient and beautiful country - one of the most historically important in the world - has been completely decimated. If Obama had been willing to compromise with Assad instead of arming rebels, IS could never have taken Palmyra, much of which is now rubble.

US foreign policy makers really know f-all about the Middle East, and yet they've been so quick to destabilise various parts of it, while pretending that they're carrying out some noble mission - tis disgraceful.
Yeah that would be all fine and dandy, if it wasn't the fact that it was SYRIANS that started fighting Assad. Know what a civil war is? Syrians wanted Assad out. Minor thing i guess not worth mentioning :lol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Spring

Oh yeah what a novelty, US meddling in other countries affairs, and ending up arming the wrong people.

So i guess if you think Obama administration is wrong, you are backing up Putin? right? I got be one or the other.

[Dresta]

Yeah that would be all fine and dandy, if it wasn't the fact that it was SYRIANS that started fighting Assad. Know what a civil war is? Syrians wanted Assad out. Minor thing i guess not worth mentioning :lol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Spring

Oh yeah what a novelty, US meddling in other countries affairs, and ending up arming the wrong people.

So i guess if you think Obama administration is wrong, you are backing up Putin? right? I got be one or the other.
Syrians? How about a foreign army of Islamists, backed and supported by foreign states (little more than a proxy invasion to remove a regime not liked by the US or the Gulf States) - because that would be a more accurate description. To pretend this is a grassroots uprising is to ignore everything we know about Syria, and the people fighting the Assad regime (a load of Iraqis, and an international coalition of mujahideen from all over the world, filtered through the border of their neighbour Turkey, who has been aiding and supplying their insurgency). What about the Arab Spring exactly? That has been a largely Islamist-driven movement throughout - only in Tunisia was it not wholly that.

And despite all the foreign efforts to dislodge him, Assad still has more support in Syria than any other group, and America and co. have torpedoed any chance of a settlement by refusing, time and again, to deal with Assad.

https://gowans.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/syria-poll-table-1.jpg

Putin has a viable aim and a coherent idea of how to bring about an end to hostilities; Obama's plans have been thoroughly nonsensical, focused on the chimera of arming 'moderate' groups that don't exist; he's spent a fortune training these people, and there aren't enough of them to make up a football team, let alone to fight Assad and the Islamists - tis just a ludicrous presupposition on his part, and it is contradicted by all the intelligence the US has on the conflict.

[Nick Young]

What are your feelings on Edward Snowden? :confusedshrug:
He's a commie.

[UK2K]

http://www.offthegridnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/military-signs-Syrian-Civil-War-400x358.jpg
#HOAX

They hide their faces cause they know if word got out to their unit they were giant *******, they'd be exiled.

[FillJackson]

If Hersh is right on this, other reporters will get this story like what happened with the Abu Gharib scandal.

If Hersh is wrong, his stories will stand alone, just like his recent pieces on the Sarin attack at Ghouta, the Bin Laden raid, etc.


There has been sustained criticism of Hersh's use of anonymous sources.[54][64][65] Critics, including Edward Jay Epstein and Amir Taheri, I would not use Epstein or Taheri as evidence without other verification. Taheri, especially just seems like a liar. (If Hersh was wrong about Bin Laden in 2011, Taheri said he was dead in 2002.)

Reading Epstein is like entering a hall of mirrors, you never know what is the right picture and what is the reflection. But he seems to sincerely believe what he writes. He was very close to James Jesus Angleton, the CIA official who became so paranoid that actual KGB defectors weren't believed. Epstein apparently thought Glasnost was an epic deception by Gorbachev back in the day.


LOL at OP's media blackout.

[LJJ]

Yeah that would be all fine and dandy, if it wasn't the fact that it was SYRIANS that started fighting Assad. Know what a civil war is? Syrians wanted Assad out. Minor thing i guess not worth mentioning :lol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Spring

Oh yeah what a novelty, US meddling in other countries affairs, and ending up arming the wrong people.

So i guess if you think Obama administration is wrong, you are backing up Putin? right? I got be one or the other.

I think most people who look at it independently and rationally simply want to back the Syrian people. They want an end to the violence.

The western block led by the US (which includes Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Turkey as the main players) are doing everything in their power to achieve the opposite. They want to increase and prolong the violence as long as is needed to install a government of their liking in Syria. No matter the collateral damage to the country and the civilians.

It's not really about supporting Putin or Assad. It's about supporting the innocent Syrian people. Who for the vast majority don't support the violent, genocidal, Islamist maniacs that are IS and the FSA/Al-Qaeda/Islamic Front coalition.

[NumberSix]

What is the glue to bind one nation together?
Leftists never seem to understand that it's the people, not the borders that make a nation.

Their ideology works like this. A house of people is a family for no other reason than they live in the same house. If you shove a bunch of other random people into the house, they'll all be part of the family too. Those of us with common sense understand fully well that this is not how family works.

[Nick Young]

Is it not interesting that ISIS has operations all over the middle east, with members in europe and even mass attacks in Paris and Southern California...but they seem to have no imperative towards Israel?

I mean if we agree that most of the mideast hates Israel, and that Iran wants to nuke them into oblivion, and we agree that ISIS is worse than all those groups together...why is Israel seemingly off the hook? Is it not a more treasured prize in establishing the legitimacy of a upstart caliphate than say...Spain or Britain? Hezbollah gained a ton of PR from their supposed victory against Israel, so it's not as if there is no precedent.

they've beheaded a japanese man of all people :facepalm
You probably don't follow Israeli news.

ISIS has been trying to form terrorist cells in Israel and Palestine. Many of them get snuffed out by Mossad and the IDF very quickly before they have time to fester. There are still some in Gaza but it's hard for them to operate because the wall that protects Israel from Gaza terrorists and the check point system.


Also, Mossad knows their shit. Israel is a tiny country but it's well protected. The citizenry also aren't as down to harbor ISIS as other middle eastern countries are.


You don't hear about ISIS running wild in Jordan either. Why not?:confusedshrug:

Not every country's citizens are happy to host ISIS insanity shenanigans.

[Nick Young]

Yeah that would be all fine and dandy, if it wasn't the fact that it was SYRIANS that started fighting Assad. Know what a civil war is? Syrians wanted Assad out. Minor thing i guess not worth mentioning :lol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Spring

Oh yeah what a novelty, US meddling in other countries affairs, and ending up arming the wrong people.

So i guess if you think Obama administration is wrong, you are backing up Putin? right? I got be one or the other.
It was Syrian+foreign EXTREMIST REBELS who started fighting Assad. The majority of Syrians were happy with Assad in power and the majority of Syrians today would like Assad to be back in power.

[Derka]

Is it not interesting that ISIS has operations all over the middle east, with members in europe and even mass attacks in Paris and Southern California...but they seem to have no imperative towards Israel?

I mean if we agree that most of the mideast hates Israel, and that Iran wants to nuke them into oblivion, and we agree that ISIS is worse than all those groups together...why is Israel seemingly off the hook? Is it not a more treasured prize in establishing the legitimacy of a upstart caliphate than say...Spain or Britain? Hezbollah gained a ton of PR from their supposed victory against Israel, so it's not as if there is no precedent.

they've beheaded a japanese man of all people :facepalm
ISIS is crazy but not stupid. You can get away with terror attacks in the West because the West doesn't have the political resolve to respond in kind...mostly because the majority of the citizens out here, especially the ones in government, don't understand the kind of enemy we're facing. They know that a huge chunk of Americans don't have the stomach to see dead Syrian women and children on their television screens and Facebook feeds. Israelis don't have that particular aversion. You try shooting up a concert venue in Tel Aviv, the Mossad will find out who you are and the IDF will blow your town/village right off the face of the earth and not give a f*ck what the rest of the world thinks about collateral damage.

[Nick Young]

Yes. ISIS knows not to **** with Israel because Israel will not ***** foot around the situation and the IDF and Mossad have the resolve, resources and experience to wipe ISIS out of existence if they wanted to. Israel is also not a country like Iraq or Afghanistan where the citizenry will welcome ISIS in with open arms, and unquestioningly follow their rule.

[FillJackson]

What's the evidence Hersh gives? Does he have anything detailed?
It seems like the he interviews some folks on the record, and that stuff is fairly well known.

Is the controversial stuff from a report? Or anonymous sources?

[Dresta]

I think most people who look at it independently and rationally simply want to back the Syrian people. They want an end to the violence.

The western block led by the US (which includes Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Turkey as the main players) are doing everything in their power to achieve the opposite. They want to increase and prolong the violence as long as is needed to install a government of their liking in Syria. No matter the collateral damage to the country and the civilians.

It's not really about supporting Putin or Assad. It's about supporting the innocent Syrian people. Who for the vast majority don't support the violent, genocidal, Islamist maniacs that are IS and the FSA/Al-Qaeda/Islamic Front coalition.
Exactly, and this war, and the deliberate playing into sectarian divisions that America and its Gulf allies have enabled, has made it so these people may never be able to live together again.


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/syria-and-iraq-ethnic-cleansing-by-sunni-and-shia-jihadis-is-leading-to-a-partition-of-the-middle-a6787731.html


Sectarian and ethnic cleansing by all sides in Syria and Iraq is becoming more intense, ensuring that there are few mixed areas left in the two countries and, even if the war ends, many refugees will find it too dangerous to return to their homes.

Communities which once lived together in peace are today so frightened of each other after years of savage warfare that the more powerful sect or ethnic group is forcing out the weaker one. This pattern is repeating itself everywhere from the Sunni towns captured by Shia militiamen in provinces around Baghdad to Christian enclaves in central Syria under threat from Isis, and in Turkmen villages just south of the Syrian-Turkish border being bombed by Russian aircraft.

The Sunni Arab tribes in Raqqa province in Syria issued a statement earlier this month accusing Kurdish forces, the People’s Protection Units (YPG), of displacing Arabs from the Tal Abyad town on the border crossing with Turkey. It says that “no YPG fighter can enter the Arab areas where our fighters are present”. The YPG denies that it has forced Arabs to leave Tal Abyad, but Syrian Kurds often see Sunni Arabs as Isis collaborators.

Smaller communities such as the Christians in Iraq and Syria are being eliminated. In the village of Sadad, once a home to 5,000 Syriac Orthodox Christians off the highway linking Damascus and Homs, people are leaving because there is only a few hours of electricity a day and prices are very high, but above all because villagers are terrified of being slaughtered by Isis. Two years ago extreme Sunni jihadis, this time led by the al-Qaeda affiliate Jabhat al-Nusra, captured Sadad and held it for 10 days, killing 45 Christians and destroying or looting 14 churches before being driven out by the Syrian army. (btw, which one of these two groups has Obama been arming? The ones massacring Christians, unsurprisingly :rolleyes:)

The mass flight and expulsion taking place is on the scale of that in India and Pakistan at the time of Partition in 1947 or in Germany at the end of the Second World War. “Efforts at local ethnic cleansing are already making Syria’s de facto partition more and more irremediable,” says Professor Fabrice Balanche of the Washington Institute for Near East Policy in a study called Ethnic Cleansing Threatens Syria’s Unity. He adds that “sectarian diversity is disappearing in many areas of the country”.

The takeover of a whole area by a single sect, ethnic group or political affiliation tends to be difficult to reverse because houses are distributed to new owners who do not want to give them up.

The Sunni Arabs have been at the heart of the uprising against President Bashar al-Assad since 2011 and likewise see non-Sunni communities as supporters of Assad, and hence the targeting of Sunni districts by government artillery and bombing. Whole districts of Damascus and Homs once under rebel control are today a sea of ruins with every building shattered by explosives. But the Sunni community is also split, often along social lines, with the better-off and better-educated siding with Assad against the poorer, more rural and tribal Sunnis.


Thanks Obama and Cameron :applause: - the Syrian people are very grateful for your intervention. A reasonably nice society, with diverse peoples mixing and living together, quickly turned into a sectarian wasteland, and for what? The removal of Assad? The only person who has demonstrated an ability to hold these diverse factions together, and keep them living together somewhat harmoniously, and without fear of sectarian persecution.

:facepalm

[Nick Young]

Syria was one of the few relatively moderate countries left in the Middle East. The people were pretty happy under Assad. The country was relatively peaceful. People of different religious denominations lived side by side in relative harmony.

Assad goes away, US arms some "moderates" and the country goes to shit.


Now only Jordan, Israel and Lebanon remain as the three countries left that haven't devolved in to insanity yet.

[NumberSix]

I've been telling y'all for a long time now. Every situation Obama chooses to insert himself in results in jihadists taking over. Every situation where he chooses to not interfere and let it play out, jihadists take over. The guy is always in favor of Islamist regimes and always against secular dictators.

[Nick Young]

This whole Arab spring that everyone was celebrating a few years ago as a sign that the people in the Middle East wanted progressive freedom and democracy was a joke too.

It turns out it was all orchestrated by radical Islamic fundamentalists:facepalm

Every country in the Arab Spring apart from Tunisia has fallen under Islamic fundamentalist rule.

[KyrieTheFuture]

They hide their faces cause they know if word got out to their unit they were giant *******, they'd be exiled.
Thank you Jesus I was waiting for you to come in here. MARINES (I got you UK my bad) opinions are the only ones I care about something like this. They're essentially deserting, but too scared to do it. You follow orders as a soldier. That's why everyone hates Bowe Bergdahl but that story is very fascinating.

[LJJ]

This whole Arab spring that everyone was celebrating a few years ago as a sign that the people in the Middle East wanted progressive freedom and democracy was a joke too.

It turns out it was all orchestrated by radical Islamic fundamentalists:facepalm

Every country in the Arab Spring apart from Tunisia has fallen under Islamic fundamentalist rule.

Prevented at the last possible moment in Egypt.

The counter revolution against the brutal Islamist dictator Morsi was indeed unequivocally condemned by the US regime.

[Dresta]

Prevented at the last possible moment in Egypt.

The counter revolution against the brutal Islamist dictator Morsi was indeed unequivocally condemned by the US regime.
No surprises there. Obama was a big fan of the Muslim Brotherhood, and their brand of 'democracy'

:banghead:

[Norcaliblunt]

**** Obama and how his administration has handled Syria. **** his blind followers. But imagine if Romney was president? It would be a full throttle boots on the ground war probably.

[KyrieTheFuture]

**** Obama and how his administration has handled Syria. **** his blind followers. But imagine if Romney was president? It would be a full throttle boots on the ground war probably.
That's kinda my problem with rating Obama as a president. He's not great, but Mitt Romney and McCain would hardly be much better. They would excel and suck at different areas though.

[Dresta]

**** Obama and how his administration has handled Syria. **** his blind followers. But imagine if Romney was president? It would be a full throttle boots on the ground war probably.
Sad, but true; Romney and McCain were god-awful options. But that seems the choice in almost all western democracies nowadays: a choice between two terrible options that most people don't want; says a lot about the current state of western democracy, and makes me wonder how on earth anyone could be keen to export it.

The 17th Amendment was a big, big mistake - democracy is no panacea, and now it's actually been made illegal in the UK to be 'anti-democratic.' We're governed by squalid oligarchs, and yet are compelled to grant them supposed legitimacy through the farce of voting. Modern politics just turns my stomach, but it's so hard to get away from.

[Blue&Orange]

What about the Arab Spring exactly? That has been a largely Islamist-driven movement throughout - only in Tunisia was it not wholly that.
Well it's an arab movement so yeah.


Numerous factors led to the protests, including issues such as dictatorship or absolute monarchy, human rights violations, political corruption (demonstrated by Wikileaks diplomatic cables),[45] economic decline, unemployment, extreme poverty, and a number of demographic structural factors,[46] such as a large percentage of educated but dissatisfied youth within the entire population.[47][48] Catalysts for the revolts in all Northern African and Persian Gulf countries included the concentration of wealth in the hands of autocrats in power for decades, insufficient transparency of its redistribution, corruption, and especially the refusal of the youth to accept the status quo.

[Terahite]

LOL at people in this thread still downplaying or ignoring the fact that ISIS is a creation of Israeli/Western intelligence when the evidence is right there for you to see. Stop characterizing this diabolical conspiracy as a failure of the Obama puppet regime and look at the bigger picture. This plan has been in the works since the 90's when zionists in our own government concocted the "Clean Break" report for a foreign leader by the name of Benjamin Netanyahu calling for destabilization of Iraq, Iran, and Syria through the use of, among other things, proxy warfare. Why? To destroy Israel's "enemies" of course. :lol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Clean_Break:_A_New_Strategy_for_Securing_the_Rea lm

We can only thank our lucky stars they haven't succeeded in destroying Iran yet, but God knows they are trying.