All Time Contested/Open Shot percentage/Ratio for Kobe/Lebron/Jordan

[kennethgriffin]

my theory is that Kobe shoots a better Wide Open and Contested percentage for mid range, long range and 3 point extended compared to Lebron and Jordan

only that Kobe takes many more contested opportunities voluntarily to show up other teams. while jordan and lebron both to an extent protect their fg% and shy away from skillful shooting

whether it be due to them knowing their limitations or not we will never truly know. all i can do is look at the games and report the findings


i will research the top 50 or so games viewable on youtube.

i will conduct this test over the course of the next month and report my findings

every youtube link and stat will be recorded by their time placement in the video for reference and proof


contested shots = defender within arms length with a hand up and a realistic chance at altering the offensive players trajectory or blocking his vision


it obviously wont be makes and misses. but rather the percentage of contested makes vs uncontested makes. due to most youtube highlights only showing the made field goals


http://www.sportsonearth.com/assets/images/7/4/6/119465746/cuts/lebron_MJ_kobe_lwzh7sxj_zsst9n1y.jpg


let the games begin

[ZMonkey11]

So...Kobe's IQ is so low, he can't recognize a good shot from a bad shot. BUT, if he did, he would clearly be a better shooter.

Just clarifying what you are trying to prove. Good luck man.. He's clearly a better shooter than LeBron.

Jordan...come the **** on with your hocus pocus, imaginary friend bullshit.

[WayOfWade]

Please deliver, unlike Pauk and his Jordan video

[3ball]

my theory is that Kobe shoots a better Wide Open and Contested percentage for mid range, long range and 3 point extended compared to Lebron and Jordan

only that Kobe takes many more contested opportunities voluntarily to show up other teams. while jordan and lebron both to an extent protect their fg% and shy away from skillful shooting

let the games begin



You're saying Kobe takes more contested shots than Lebron and Jordan... This is irrelevant for 2 reasons... Jordan either:


1) takes jumpshots that Kobe would make look much harder due to his weaker vertical, hangtime, and strength - these things allow Jordan to create space better and make the SAME shots look easier

2) takes shots Kobe can't even attempt, once again due to superior vertical, hangtime and strength (also big hands)


I wouldn't bother looking at Lebron's jumpshots - he's currently the worst shooter in the league and has been since he came in the league, except for literally 2-3 years.

[Sarcastic]

That Jordan pic is alpha af. Kobe pic is beta.

[ZMonkey11]

I'll stop you from wasting anymore of your time right here Mr. Griffin.

Jordan's CAREER FG% IS 49.7%. That is a 50% shooting percentage.

Kobe does not eclipse this number once. Not even his best year.

His best year cannot surpass his idols CAREER SHOOTING PERCENTAGE.

Good luck

[kennethgriffin]

just as an example



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV9CMVdY3dM

Kobe 81 point game

0:08 = Contested Jumper
0:17 = Uncontested Jumper
1:28 = Contested three pointer
1:46 = Contested Jumper
2:23 = Contested Jumper
2:52 = Contested Jumper
3:01 = Contested Jumper
3:12 = Contested three pointer
3:22 = Contested three pointer
3:36 = Uncontested three pointer
3:45 = Contested jumper
3:57 = Contested three pointer
4:54 = Contested jumper
5:02 = Contested jumper
6:14 = Contested three pointer
6:22 = Uncontested three pointer
6:41 = Contested jumper



14 of kobes 17 made jumpshots/three pointers were highly contested




basically 82.3% of the time kobe makes a shot. he should have passed if he was "protecting" his field goal percentage like a lebron james type player

:lol

[tmacattack33]

So... you're going to try to attempt to prove that Kobe wasn't skilled enough to get himself open shots, so instead he took more contested shots than Lebron and Jordan?

[SouBeachTalents]

Do LeBron & Kobe's Finals Game 7's

[kennethgriffin]

That Jordan pic is alpha af. Kobe pic is beta.


well shit man who do you think made that picture. jordans pic is in the middle. so obviously a jordan fan who cared what the pic was and kobes was obviously the 1st one that popped up


:oldlol:

http://i66.tinypic.com/10wjfvp.jpg


^ this is a more alpha image than jordan ever created

[3ball]

just as an example

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV9CMVdY3dM

Kobe 81 point game

0:08 = Contested Jumper
0:17 = Uncontested Jumper
1:28 = Contested three pointer
1:46 = Contested Jumper
2:23 = Contested Jumper
2:52 = Contested Jumper
3:01 = Contested Jumper
3:12 = Contested three pointer
3:22 = Contested three pointer
3:36 = Uncontested three pointer
3:45 = Contested jumper
3:57 = Contested three pointer
4:54 = Contested jumper
5:02 = Contested jumper
6:14 = Contested three pointer
6:22 = Uncontested three pointer
6:41 = Contested jumper

14 of kobes 17 made jumpshots/three pointers were highly contested

basically 82.3% of the time kobe makes a shot. he should have passed if he was "protecting" his field goal percentage like a lebron james type player

:lol
Kobe was a lot like MJ - he could drop 40, 50, and 60+ points on nearly all jumpshots - but MJ did it more often... A LOT (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11918938&postcount=12) more often.

[SouBeachTalents]

well shit man who do you think made that picture. jordans pic is in the middle. so obviously a jordan fan who cared what the pic was and kobes was obviously the 1st one that popped up


:oldlol:

http://i66.tinypic.com/10wjfvp.jpg


^ this is a more alpha image than jordan ever created


Nah, this is

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4101/4920970629_7fb8758dbc_b.jpg

[kennethgriffin]

Do LeBron & Kobe's Finals Game 7's



the funny thing is you dont even realize that shows lebrons ability to only make wide open shots most of the time


that game 7 vs sanantonio was basically the spurs daring him to shoot the entire game. it was the most wide open ive ever seen a guy. and he finally started hitting them in the 7th game after ray allen bailed his ass out in game 6

while kobes game vs boston was one of the most highly contested defensive battles in nba history and put kobes off night in perspective


so this entire topic basically flew right over your head

:lol

[kennethgriffin]

Nah, this is

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4101/4920970629_7fb8758dbc_b.jpg


"i was pissed when kobe got #5. i was like damn! he got me. i lost" - Shaquille oneal

[SouBeachTalents]

the funny thing is you dont even realize that shows lebrons ability to only make wide open shots most of the time


that game 7 vs sanantonio was basically the spurs daring him to shoot the entire game. it was the most wide open ive ever seen a guy. and he finally started hitting them in the 7th game after ray allen bailed his ass out in game 6

while kobes game vs boston was one of the most highly contested defensive battles in nba history and put kobes off night in perspective


so this entire topic basically flew right over your head

:lol

Lol, it really didn't. Since you're doing this project, I was actually curious how many contested/open jumpshots each player had in the biggest game of their careers

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe was a lot like MJ - he could drop 40, 50, and 60+ points on nearly all jumpshots - but MJ did it more often... A LOT (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11918938&postcount=12) more often.


no he didnt


half of jordans points routinely came from drives.. he was much more like prime wade

jordans jumpers were routinely 12-15 feet

kobes were more around 18-20 feet

[kennethgriffin]

Lol, it really didn't. Since you're doing this project, I was actually curious how many contested/open jumpshots each player had in the biggest game of their careers


the biggest games of kobes career were in 2009. since that was him proving he could win without shaq

the biggest games of lebrons career were in 2015. since that was him trying to prove he could win without wade and bosh



2010 was icing on the cake for kobe. and 2013 was a voided useless asterisk for lebron regardless


kobe dominated 2009 in every aspect

lebron choked like a b*tch shooting 27% beyond 5 feet in 2015

[kennethgriffin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6szZ4hbumT0

Lebron 2013 Finals game 7

0:28 = Uncontested three pointer
0:58 = Uncontested three pointer
1:15 = Uncontested three pointer
1:50 = Uncontested three pointer
2:07 = Contested three pointer
2:23 = Uncontested jumper
2:58 = Uncontested jumper
3:05 = Uncontested jumper
3:29 = Uncontested jumper




lebron only made one single jump shot or three point shot the entire game in which the defender wasnt daring him to shoot and could actually inhibit lebrons shot in any way

[catch24]

If OP is being 100% genuine I really don't see the problem :confusedshrug:

Should be interesting to see the data permitting its backed with links of course.

[IMObjective]

As a Kobe fan, I can appreciate what Kenneth's going for here, but putting the fun and games aside Kobe should have put in more of an effort to make the right play every time. The way I see it, LeBron and Kobe is similar in that they both could have been greater than how they actually turned out, but both of them had mental issues that put a cap on their potential.

LeBron is mentally fragile in high pressure situations and Kobe has a strange obsession with attaining personal glory. He's like always trying to play out a fantasy in his head, and has been this way since high school (stories about how he would purposely keep games close so he could play hero ball at the end, a recent example being that comeback video he made a few years ago right before coming back from injury, lol, how many players would have gone through the trouble to make that?). Both of them had moments where they overcame these deficiencies and won some chips.

LeBron, I don't give a shit about of course, but it makes me sad when I think about how much greater Kobe could have been. Imagine if he had been a much more willing passer, especially out of double teams, and opponents didn't know that he was going to shoot no matter what (most applicable during buzzer beaters). Scoring would have been even easier as a result. Nowadays there are people who actually think he is a bad shooter when that couldn't be further from the truth.

[kennethgriffin]

As a Kobe fan, I can appreciate what Kenneth's going for here, but putting the fun and games aside Kobe should have put in more of an effort to make the right play every time. The way I see it, LeBron and Kobe is similar in that they both could have been greater than how they actually turned out, but both of them had mental issues that put a cap on their potential.

LeBron is mentally fragile in high pressure situations and Kobe has a strange obsession with attaining personal glory. He's like always trying to play out a fantasy in his head, and has been this way since high school (stories about how he would purposely keep games close so he could play hero ball at the end, a recent example being that comeback video he made a few years ago right before coming back from injury, lol, how many players would have gone through the trouble to make that?). Both of them had moments where they overcame these deficiencies and won some chips.

LeBron, I don't give a shit about of course, but it makes me sad when I think about how much greater Kobe could have been. Imagine if he had been a much more willing passer, especially out of double teams, and opponents didn't know that he was going to shoot no matter what (most applicable during buzzer beaters). Scoring would have been even easier as a result. Nowadays there are people who actually think he is a bad shooter when that couldn't be further from the truth.



i think protecting his fg% caused allot of the problems associated with lebron

i.e. = looking at someone that shys away from pressure situations. relies too heavily on teammates to hit the last shot.. etc..

and when lebron couldnt get his highly efficient shots due to great defenders like andre iguodala in 2015. he settled for the types of shots he usually hesitated with his entire career. and he didnt know how to hit them.

if however lebron was more prepared for highly contested midrange shooting. then maybe he hits over 27% and the cavs win the 2015 finals

who knows

2 for 6 might be due to lebrons elevated fg% from "playing the right way"


the defensive attention usually goes up during the playoffs. so you better learn how to hit difficult shots

[3ball]

no he didnt


half of jordans points routinely came from drives.. he was much more like prime wade

jordans jumpers were routinely 12-15 feet

kobes were more around 18-20 feet


You don't know Jordan's game AT ALL if you think he played anything like prime wade, who was s ball-dominant fool... Jordan shot mostly jumpers:

54 in 1992 ECF vs. Knicks - literally all jumpshots in the biggest game of year (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoVMIZWS_-A&t=0m53s)
64 vs. Shaq's 1993 Magic only 4 non-jumpshots - easiest-looking 60 point game in history (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzsmqlJhT58&t=0m33s).
46 pts in Game 3 of 1992 Finals - almost all jumpshots (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIZ3d0pnY1U&t=1m40s).


And in Jordan's 63 point game, 14 of his 22 made FG's were jumpshots:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsRu0x_bQeY

[andgar923]

So let me get this straight OP.

MJ gets penalized for being better at creating better opportunities for himself.:confusedshrug:

Yeah... you really know basketball :rolleyes:

[kennethgriffin]

So let me get this straight OP.

MJ gets penalized for being better at creating better opportunities for himself.:confusedshrug:

Yeah... you really know basketball :rolleyes:


did shawn bradly just "know how to create better opportunities" by only taking shots he knew he could make?

or was it just his own ineptitude talent wise and he knew his limitations


maybe* the reason jordan couldnt take as many ridiculous shots as kobe is because if he tried he wouldnt be anywhere near as effective.

and kobe can take them and still pump out a points per shot ratio that of equal to MJ ( 1.30 )

[andgar923]

did shawn bradly just "know how to create better opportunities" by only taking shots he knew he could make?

or was it just his own ineptitude talent wise and he knew his limitations


maybe* the reason jordan couldnt take as many ridiculous shots as kobe is because if he tried he wouldnt be anywhere near as effective.

and kobe can take them and still pump out a points per shot ratio that of equal to MJ ( 1.30 )
you can't be this f*ckin stupid.

[kennethgriffin]

you can't be this f*ckin stupid.


well its absolutely retarded to just assume a guy can do something but he just doesnt want to



because kobe in place of jordan also claims 6 titles ( maybe more without the baseball garbage )

and kobe also wins finals mvp every time since scottie pippen would never stand in kobes way.

the only difference being that the 90s bulls would have been way funner to watch since kobe would have been taking way more difficult shots and still producing that much needed 27-30ppg average on 1.30 PPS


so the reason jordan played more within his element wasnt the fact that its just the smart thing to do

its because he knew his limitations

otherwise jordan would never have attempted fadeaways and reverse layups or other high difficulty maneuvers


he did them because he too enjoyed showing up the opponent


he just never did the falling out of bounds fading threes over 2 guys shots because he couldnt... period

kobe did it and could hit 34% still... thats the difference

[stalkerforlife]

kenneth's right.

Kobe is the most skilled player of all time.

[K Xerxes]

well its absolutely retarded to just assume a guy can do something but he just doesnt want to


because kobe in place of jordan also claims 6 titles ( maybe more without the baseball garbage )

and kobe also wins finals mvp every time since scottie pippen would never stand in kobes way.

the only difference being that the 90s bulls would have been way funner to watch since kobe would have been taking way more difficult shots and still producing that much needed 27-30ppg average on 1.30 PPS

Speaking of retarded assumptions...

Jordan averaged 33.4ppg on 49% in the playoffs. Kobe's average is 25.6ppg on 45% in the playoffs.

Just to break down what this difference actually means to your dumbass mind, that's like comparing Kobe to a player who averages 17.8ppg on 41% in the playoffs. Which would be like LeBron performing at his Dallas level every game for his playoff career, but with even worse efficiency (at least he managed 48%). Even you must realise what an inane comparison this is, yet this is essentially the difference between Jordan and your idol.

There's no comparison between Jordan and Kobe. Absolutely zero. Jordan produces higher scoring output on better efficiency in his career because A) He can physically create better shots and B) He is more intelligent than Kobe not to settle for dumb shots like fadeaway threes over three defenders.

You can assume what you like if Jordan was in Kobe's place, but it holds no substance. The fact is that Jordan has more rings, more FMVPs, more MVPs and better stats across the board (except for, what, 3 point shooting and FT?). And that's with Kobe playing with a far superior player than Jordan ever played with for 6 years of his career, and he can't even get more rings. :oldlol:

[JohnMax]

Jordan's explosiveness allows him to do Kobe's moves alot quicker and get more elevation.

[kennethgriffin]

Speaking of retarded assumptions...

Jordan averaged 33.4ppg on 49% in the playoffs. Kobe's average is 25.6ppg on 45% in the playoffs.

Just to break down what this difference actually means to your dumbass mind, that's like comparing Kobe to a player who averages 17.8ppg on 41% in the playoffs. Which would be like LeBron performing at his Dallas level every game for his playoff career, but with even worse efficiency (at least he managed 48%). Even you must realise what an inane comparison this is, yet this is essentially the difference between Jordan and your idol.

There's no comparison between Jordan and Kobe. Absolutely zero. Jordan produces higher scoring output on better efficiency in his career because A) He can physically create better shots and B) He is more intelligent than Kobe not to settle for dumb shots like fadeaway threes over three defenders.

You can assume what you like if Jordan was in Kobe's place, but it holds no substance. The fact is that Jordan has more rings, more FMVPs, more MVPs and better stats across the board (except for, what, 3 point shooting and FT?). And that's with Kobe playing with a far superior player than Jordan ever played with for 6 years of his career, and he can't even get more rings. :oldlol:


jordan attempted 25.1 shots and 9.9 free throws per game in the playoffs

kobe attempted 20.5 shots and 7.4 free throws per game in the playoffs


kobe averages 7.8 more points if he takes nearly 5 more shots and nearly 3 more free throws a game


volume is the reason for jordans elevated averages due to

a) kobe coming out of highschool

b) kobe coming to a team with an allstar in his prime at his position

c) kobe coming to a team with a prime future hall of famer demanding 30ppg

d) kobe coming to a team that actually needed a winning record to make the playoffs





not everyone can get free trips to the playoffs on 30 win teams and chuck 40 shots a game to build a great career average

so shut the **** up

[kennethgriffin]

Jordan's explosiveness allows him to do Kobe's moves alot quicker and get more elevation.



jordan never attempted let alone ever made shots like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQd2h4X0O2E

[julizaver]

well its absolutely retarded to just assume a guy can do something but he just doesnt want to

because kobe in place of jordan also claims 6 titles ( maybe more without the baseball garbage )

and kobe also wins finals mvp every time since scottie pippen would never stand in kobes way.

the only difference being that the 90s bulls would have been way funner to watch since kobe would have been taking way more difficult shots and still producing that much needed 27-30ppg average on 1.30 PPS


so the reason jordan played more within his element wasnt the fact that its just the smart thing to do

its because he knew his limitations

otherwise jordan would never have attempted fadeaways and reverse layups or other high difficulty maneuvers


he did them because he too enjoyed showing up the opponent


he just never did the falling out of bounds fading threes over 2 guys shots because he couldnt... period

kobe did it and could hit 34% still... thats the difference

Trying difficult low percentage shots time and time again over 2-3 guys instead of finding a teamate is the against the team concept of basketball. It is terribly wrong. I am laughing at people saying there is something Kobe could do which Jordan couldn't. As a leader and player he is not on par with Jordan.
Anyway go with your research as it will be interesting to show the results.

[kennethgriffin]

Trying difficult low percentage shots time and time again over 2-3 guys instead of finding a teamate is the against the team concept of basketball. It is terribly wrong. I am laughing at people saying there is something Kobe could do which Jordan couldn't. As a leader and player he is not on par with Jordan.
Anyway go with your research as it will be interesting to show the results.

which is what makes kobe that much more appreciable based on his success

he went against the normalcy of nba history

he spat in the face of logic

he treated the game like it was playstation

and he dominated it that way


this is what makes kobe unique. he played the way he did to show people up while he was winning

if he was a loser like lebron with a 2 for 7 finals record or some shit.. THEN you can talk shit

[andgar923]

jordan never attempted let alone ever made shots like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQd2h4X0O2E

he has

[kennethgriffin]

he has


dude.. the only time jordan shot threes was when he was mostly wide open. i dont remember a single time jordan took a stand still three with a guy in his face after he picked up his dribble


i dont ever remember jordan taking the type of shots kobe took


kobe basically took what jordan was known for in and around 10-12 feet and extended it to 4-5 feet beyond the arc

[andgar923]

dude.. the only time jordan shot threes was when he was mostly wide open. i dont remember a single time jordan took a stand still three with a guy in his face after he picked up his dribble


i dont ever remember jordan taking the type of shots kobe took


kobe basically took what jordan was known for in and around 10-12 feet and extended it to 4-5 feet beyond the arc
:facepalm

[andgar923]

dude.. the only time jordan shot threes was when he was mostly wide open. i dont remember a single time jordan took a stand still three with a guy in his face after he picked up his dribble


i dont ever remember jordan taking the type of shots kobe took


kobe basically took what jordan was known for in and around 10-12 feet and extended it to 4-5 feet beyond the arc

I've seen Curry, Harden, Wade, James, George, and a number of other people take the same shot you keep bragging about.

Hell, I've seen James make many tough shots with a man in his face, fallaways at the 3pt line on 2 defenders, does that make him better?

I've seen Curry this season take shots Kobe attempts but misses much more often.

At least Bron fans have some sort of legit concrete argument when they make one, Kobe stans have yet again shown why they're the laughing stock of the sports world.

[Nash]

to you its to "protect FG%" but to the rest of us its not taking bad shots.

[kennethgriffin]

I've seen Curry, Harden, Wade, James, George, and a number of other people take the same shot you keep bragging about.

Hell, I've seen James make many tough shots with a man in his face, fallaways at the 3pt line on 2 defenders, does that make him better?

I've seen Curry this season take shots Kobe attempts but misses much more often.

At least Bron fans have some sort of legit concrete argument when they make one, Kobe stans have yet again shown why they're the laughing stock of the sports world.


curry and durant are literally the only 2 guys in the league right now that can or will take kobe style off balance threes voluntarily and even then theyre more likely to look for an open shot by creating a step back or pull up maneuver

kobe literally invites the defense. stands still. and rises over them without a dribble

kobe is the only guy i've seen do that type of shot on a consistent basis


and did you really face palm me saying jordan didnt take those types of shots?

i dare you to post a video of jordan doing shit like that

you f*cking god damn delusional f*ggot

jordan ****tards rewrite history on a daily basis

[kennethgriffin]

to you its to "protect FG%" but to the rest of us its not taking bad shots.



is it a bad shot if you hit it 33-34% of the time?


that equates to 100+ points per 33 shots

which is the same as 50% on 2's


kobe takes the most ridiculous threes ive ever seen and he makes it efficient

[kennethgriffin]

never in jordans wildest dreams could he ever think of doing shit like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIqhVfsB1n8

[VengefulAngel]

never in jordans wildest dreams could he ever think of doing shit like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIqhVfsB1n8

I thought you were actually going to provide some statistics, but as always you're useless.

[kennethgriffin]

I thought you were actually going to provide some statistics, but as always you're useless.



i'm arguing with someone right now about style/difficulty/defense/distance and you want me to just post some box scores


this right here ladies and gents ... is a typical ISH member

[VengefulAngel]

i'm arguing with someone right now about style/difficulty/defense/distance and you want me to just post some box scores


this right here ladies and gents ... is a typical ISH member

Isn't that the basis of this thread? In order to have a discussion you need evidence behind it, showing one box score won't paint an accurate representation, so we need you to cumulate it by season.

I could help you compile the statistics, but I'm not sure you want me to bother.

[ISHGoat]

You fcking tard the whole point of basketball is to create open looks. Not take high difficulty shots.

[kennethgriffin]

You fcking tard the whole point of basketball is to create open looks. Not take high difficulty shots.


and did i not say kobe decided to take more difficult looks onpurpose as a way to demoralize the opponent?


obviously kobe should have a warning lable that says "do not try this at home"


because hes the only guy whos capable of it in a way that is capable of winning



i'm not saying jordan or lebron should have tried his style... i'm saying thats what made kobe one of a kind


people always said hes just a jordan replica. but half the shots ive seen kobe make were on a level that jordan couldnt even dream of




kobe is playstation personified

he truly is the most talented offensive player of all time

[ISHGoat]

and did i not say kobe decided to take more difficult looks onpurpose as a way to demoralize the opponent?


obviously kobe should have a warning lable that says "do not try this at home"


because hes the only guy whos capable of it in a way that is capable of winning



i'm not saying jordan or lebron should have tried his style... i'm saying thats what made kobe one of a kind


people always said hes just a jordan replica. but half the shots ive seen kobe make were on a level that jordan couldnt even dream of




kobe is playstation personified

he truly is the most talented offensive player of all time

:roll:

[kennethgriffin]

:roll:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvvVd74-OxY


i dare you to watch this whole video

[sekachu]

and did i not say kobe decided to take more difficult looks onpurpose as a way to demoralize the opponent?


obviously kobe should have a warning lable that says "do not try this at home"


because hes the only guy whos capable of it in a way that is capable of winning



i'm not saying jordan or lebron should have tried his style... i'm saying thats what made kobe one of a kind






people always said hes just a jordan replica. but half the shots ive seen kobe make were on a level that jordan couldnt even dream of




kobe is playstation personified

he truly is the most talented offensive player of all time



not really, MJ is capable to do what kobe has done if he wanted to. Indeed, MJ did make these kinds of shots like kobe but just not as many which utterly unnecessary for him.

[ShawkFactory]

Not even gonna pretend to read this entire thread.

OP is a top 5 f@g of all time though.

[DMV2]

Not even gonna pretend to read this entire thread.

OP is a top 5 f@g of all time though.
:roll:

[stalkerforlife]

No horse in this race...but kenneth is really logical and is making a lot of people look silly.

[Nuff Said]

Looks like ish falls for the "just wait for it" shtick yet again.

[julizaver]

which is what makes kobe that much more appreciable based on his success

he went against the normalcy of nba history

he spat in the face of logic

he treated the game like it was playstation

and he dominated it that way


this is what makes kobe unique. he played the way he did to show people up while he was winning

if he was a loser like lebron with a 2 for 7 finals record or some shit.. THEN you can talk shit

OK, probably you have never watched MJ play (and I don't mean his Wizzards days) and Kobe's your favourite player, which is understandable - I also liked Kobe as a promising youngster as he was very exciting and had a hell of a potential. But let me tell you this:

- Kobe modeled his game on MJs game. So as I have watched both players in their respective primes I can asure you that Kobe wasn't more spectacular than Jordan. Jordan was such an athlete and had such a plays that exceeded Kobe's best plays. Just look for them on youtube.

- Kobe won 3 of his 5 titles alongside the best player in the league Shaq, not that he is guilty for it, and if his overall record 5 from 7 is a measure of sucess it hardly beats Jordan's record of 6 from 6.

- I am agree that "he went against the normalcy of nba history, he spat in the face of logic, he treated the game like it was playstation" - but he never dominate the game like MJ did.

And I am sure that most of people here who are Kobe's fans would be a die-hard Jordan's fans if they had grow up watching him play. MJ was not my favourite player at the time, but he was unquestionably the best and people were watching basketball only because of him back then. It is not a rule that your favourite player shall be the best and and some posters here trying to props their favs looks funny in my eyes.

[Hey Yo]

OK, probably you have never watched MJ play (and I don't mean his Wizzards days) and Kobe's your favourite player, which is understandable - I also liked Kobe as a promising youngster as he was very exciting and had a hell of a potential. But let me tell you this:

- Kobe modeled his game on MJs game. So as I have watched both players in their respective primes I can asure you that Kobe wasn't more spectacular than Jordan. Jordan was such an athlete and had such a plays that exceeded Kobe's best plays. Just look for them on youtube.

- Kobe won 3 of his 5 titles alongside the best player in the league Shaq, not that he is guilty for it, and if his overall record 5 from 7 is a measure of sucess it hardly beats Jordan's record of 6 from 6.

- I am agree that "he went against the normalcy of nba history, he spat in the face of logic, he treated the game like it was playstation" - but he never dominate the game like MJ did.

And I am sure that most of people here who are Kobe's fans would be a die-hard Jordan's fans if they had grow up watching him play. MJ was not my favourite player at the time, but he was unquestionably the best and people were watching basketball only because of him back then. It is not a rule that your favourite player shall be the best and and some posters here trying to props their favs looks funny in my eyes.
Sure he is.

Kobe camp said on draft day it was the Lakers or playing in Italy. The memo was sent out...."if you're not the Lakers, don't draft me cause I won't sign"

He wanted the easy way right from the beginning.

[SouBeachTalents]

:lol OP actually thinks Kobe was better than Jordan

[Cali Syndicate]

Argument is based off highlight reels, I guarantee it. Kobes definitely has some very aesthetic highlight reels. He amongst the most skilled of all-time and with the modern age, they've been able to capture his game from a multitude of different angles and shots. With that said, op doesn't take into account that every amazing shot kobes made, he has 2 or 3 that has clanked.

[34-24 Footwork]

Kenneth, not many people on this board will admit that Kobe takes and makes more contested jumpers than probably anyone in the history of basketball...regardless of what the metrics say.

And if the metrics say that Kobe does indeed make more contested jumpers than these two (which he did and does according to the eye test), they won't see it as a positive thing for basketball.

[34-24 Footwork]

Argument is based off highlight reels, I guarantee it. Kobes definitely has some very aesthetic highlight reels. He amongst the most skilled of all-time and with the modern age, they've been able to capture his game from a multitude of different angles and shots. With that said, op doesn't take into account that every amazing shot kobes made, he has 2 or 3 that has clanked.

Lol. What?

Lebron shooting 23% outside of 5ft leading his team to another finals loss is "heroic"


Kobe shooting 45% on contested jumpers his whole career is null because he's missed a few.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kenny threads never fail to deliver

http://replygif.net/i/750.gif

[julizaver]

Kenneth, not many people on this board will admit that Kobe takes and makes more contested jumpers than probably anyone in the history of basketball...regardless of what the metrics say.

And if the metrics say that Kobe does indeed make more contested jumpers than these two (which he did and does according to the eye test), they won't see it as a positive thing for basketball.

Kobe probably (while proven otherwise) took more contested jumpers than Jordan, but I bet my money that MJ made more than Kobe. MJ in the 90s relied on his jumpshot and most of them were contested. I am waiting for the stats ... and hope for fair play ... :)

I really hope that Kenneth will post the numbers when his research is done - even if it is in MJ's favour.

[SexSymbol]

Sure he is.

Kobe camp said on draft day it was the Lakers or playing in Italy. The memo was sent out...."if you're not the Lakers, don't draft me cause I won't sign"

He wanted the easy way right from the beginning.
historically not true.