Lebron is #1 reason the Heat's D was worst of any Spurs foe in 2014 PO

[3ball]

.
.
Dallas and OKC hold Kawhi to 11 ppg and ~45%


Result: competitive series


Heat and Portland let Kawhi score 17 ppg on ~55%


Result: Massacre


If Lebron could've held Kawhi to 11 ppg like DAL and OKC did, the series would've been more competitive - now if he adds the offensive aggression AS WELL like he did in 2015 Finals (which won 2 games with worse supporting cast against better team), the Heat win.

Clearly, the Spurs were a much better team when Kawhi was a bigger part of the offense.. In the Heat's case, Lebron's poor defense enabled Kawhi to be the best Spur for the first time in the playoffs, which unlocked the Spurs' optimal chemistry that we didn't see against other Spurs opponents, even Portland.

The Heat actually played good defense in Game 1 (until Lebron cramped up) and also Game 2 (Spurs only had a 112 ORtg in Game 2 and lost).

But the Heat didn't have the heart and determination it took to KEEP UP THE EFFORT.. This starts with Lebron's lack of leadership on 2 fronts:


1) allowing Kawhi to have abnormally high stats (shown above) and be THE pivotal player/FMVP for the Spurs

2) inability to hold teammates accountable - it's kind of hard to do that when you're carried off the court yourself in Game 1
.

[riseagainst]

he also was grabbing mad rebounds, offensively too in games 4 and 5.

[FrobeShaw]

curry is the best now. no use tearing down lebron anymore, chump

[TommyGriffin]

LeBron used to be a good defender in 2009 but he has steadily declined on the defensive end since then. In 2014 LeBron was barley a positive impact on the defensive side.

[tpols]

the Heat just gave up.. it was a total lack of leadership. You would think getting your ass kicked on national stage by a nobody (relative to bron at the time) would get you angry, aggressive.. Bron didn't look like he cared.. picked and chose his spots to get a nice line and called it a day.. straight opposite of what he did last year.

[fpliii]

He's definitely a big reason for me. Spurs made 55 threes (!!!) in that series, and LeBron was responsible for a lot of late closeouts/missed rotations.

[rmt]

Spurs just played out of their minds those last 3 games. Not many teams would have beaten them.

According to Basketball-Reference, the Spurs scored 120.8 points per 100 possessions in the 2014 Finals, the highest rate since Basketball-Reference began tracking such data in 1985-86.

NBA.com player tracking data determined the Spurs passed the ball 472 more times than the Heat in the 2014 Finals. The disparity was even more evident in Games 3-5, when they averaged 157 more passes per game. And, as Popovich had assumed, that crisp, quick passing led to efficient scoring from multiple contributors. For further proof, look no further than San Antonio's true shooting percentage as a team through those final three games: an astounding 65.1 percent. The individual season champion, Kyle Korver, shot 65.3 percent. "We would have had to play the greatest Games 3, 4 and 5 to overcome that," Battier says.

How radical had the offensive redesign been? In San Antonio's 2014 first-round series with the Mavericks, it had averaged 18.3 3-point attempts per game, which accounted for just 23.6 percent of its field goal attempts. In the second round against Portland, the Spurs had taken an average of 19.2 3-point attempts, for 21.7 percent of its offense. According to ESPN Stats & Information research, San Antonio's 3-point shooting in the 2014 Finals accounted for 32.6 percent of its total offense. The Spurs had attempted an average of 23.6 3-pointers a game in the Finals, second in Finals history, and made 44.8 percent.

San Antonio dominated Miami in just about every conceivable category in those final three games: overall shooting percentage (54.2 percent to 45.2 percent), 3-point shooting percentage (44.8 percent to 38.2 percent), field goal percentage in the paint (65.6 percent to 53 percent). The Spurs dished the ball out for 71 assists to Miami's 44. They outrebounded the Heat 113-94. They even shot more free throws (80-71).

According to Basketball-Reference, the Spurs' offensive rating for Games 3-5 of the Finals (124.9) is the best on record for the past 29 seasons. The 1999-2000 Pacers (120.2) and the 1986-87 Celtics (120.2), each of whom lost the title in the years referenced, were tied for second.

But perhaps the most impressive stat is the bluntest of all: Over the previous three seasons, a span of 293 regular-season and playoff games, the Heat had not once lost three straight games in regulation with LeBron in the lineup. The Spurs not only won the last three games of the 2014 Finals but beat the Heat by an average of more than 19 points a game.


http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2015/story/_/page/PresentsSpursHeat/how-spurs-2014-finals-performance-changed-nba-forever

[Wade's Rings]

His Defense was horrible that series.

[Trollsmasher]

http://puu.sh/mkTnY/4411cfedc8.png

Wade lost that series by himself, just like in 2011

[ArbitraryWater]

His Defense was horrible that series.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IakSy1cO9ss

http://thebiglead.com/2014/06/13/dwyane-wade-has-been-lazy-and-indifferent-on-defense-in-the-nba-finals-and-this-video-shows-just-how-bad/

http://www.sbnation.com/2014/6/17/5806896/dwyane-wade-miami-heat-future-nba-2014

It really was.. probably the worst of any Heat player named James Jones.

[DMV2]

His Defense was horrible that series.
I'd say the entire Heat defense was horrible.

I forgot which game it was, either Game 3 or Game 4, where both Leonard and Green were slashing the paint on LeBron at ease. He was definitely the worst defense in that particular game. But overall in the series, Miami flat out got schooled! Whatever defense they had was just overwhelmed by that Spurs offense.

[3ball]

Spurs made 55 threes (!!!) in that series, and LeBron was responsible for a lot of late closeouts/missed rotations.


It's amazing isn't it - the Spurs didn't do that to any other team - only the Heat..

Not coincidentally, Lebron's poor defense and effort not only permeated the team, but it allowed Kawhi to be the best Spur for the first time in those playoffs, which allowed the Spurs to find the optimal offensive flow you speak of.





He's definitely a big reason for me.


Ultimately, his lack of defense and FIGHT permeated the team... Perhaps the best example of his lack of fight was the 17 shots per game he took on offense..

His passivity on offense exerted zero control over the game - this was a stark contrast to a year later, when he literally doubled his shot attempts vs. Warriors and it was night and day difference - instead of record defeat, he controlled pace and flow and WON 2 games with a worse supporting cast against a better team..

THAT'S how much of a difference aggression and fight from the team leader can make - teammates are galvanized and follow that kind of leadership.. Who knows what would've happened if he did the same thing in 2014 against a worse team, with a better supporting cast..

Btw, I don't think Lebron's lack of aggression and fight just started in the 2014 Finals - he was like that the entire 2014 season (as was the entire team) - it only revealed itself in the Finals when he faced a real team from the West.

[Smoke117]

1-9

[fpliii]

Reposting this, since it looks like you edited your post and it was below mine.

THAT'S how much of a difference aggression and fight from the team leader can make.. Who knows what would've happened if he did the same thing in 2014 against a worse team, with a better supporting cast..

Btw, I don't think Lebron's lack of aggression and fight just started in the 2014 Finals - he was like that the entire 2014 season (as was the entire team) - it only revealed itself in the Finals when he faced a real team from the West.
.
They'd still lose in 2014 even if he was more aggressive (assuming he and the team played the same defense), but the games would be closer.

That was one of the one of the only two years (2013 and 2014) when he had a legitimate jump shot. Every other year (including 2015 as well as this year obviously) he hasn't been able to consistently make shots.

[NBASTATMAN]

http://puu.sh/mkTnY/4411cfedc8.png

Wade lost that series by himself, just like in 2011


They got beat cuz they were flat.. Looks like Lebrons' defensive rating was the best on his team... They couldnt defend at all that season and The Spurs were just hot... Even during the first game when Lebron went out with cramps the Spurs were unstoppable... Obviously Lebron's defense was bad but his defense still rated the best on his team

[Hey Yo]

His passivity on offense exerted zero control over the game - this was a stark contrast to a year later, when he literally doubled his shot attempts vs. Warriors and it was night and day difference - instead of record defeat, he controlled pace and flow and WON 2 games with a worse supporting cast against a better team..
Yet, if LeBron did that in 2014, you would say he was being selfish and should having been utilizing 3X champion Wade and 10X all-star Bosh more. Then you'd guarantee if LeBron did that, Heat would have won the series.

Just like when you said the way LeBron played in last seasons Finals, his ball hogging caused his teammates to not be able to get into a shooting rhythm and not surprised that 3 or 4 of the starters went scoreless in the series when James was not on the floor.

[3ball]

2013 and 2014 were the only two years when he had a legitimate jump shot.

Every other year (including 2015 as well as this year obviously) he hasn't been able to consistently make shots.


^^^^^ You're speaking euphemistically so Lebron doesn't look that bad... But here's the reality:

Lebron is currently the worst shooter in the league outside the paint and he's been near the bottom since he entered the league (except for the 2 years you mentioned).

For example, it's statistical fact that his horrific efficiency in 2007 Finals wasn't due to the 65.7% he shot at the rim (nearly 40% of shot attempts) - it was due to him shooting 14.8% from midrange and 20.0% from three (52% of his shot attempts).

And we know the Spurs' jumpshooting defense wasn't prohibitive, because many other players shot excellently against them and consequently, had great efficiency:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=12009238&postcount=77
.

[kamil]

curry is the best now. no use tearing down lebron anymore, chump

LeBron* ******gers aren't going to like this.

[livinglegend]

He had the 2nd best defensive rating after Birdman.


/ thread.

[3ball]

He had the 2nd best defensive rating after Birdman.

/ thread.


It doesn't matter that Lebron's DRtg was 2nd on the team, when the entire team had horrific DRtg's.

Lebron's poor defense and effort not only permeated the team, but it enabled Kawhi to be the best Spur for the first time in the playoffs, which allowed the Spurs to find the optimal offensive flow and chemistry that we didn't see against other Spurs opponents.

The Spurs wouldn't have that same chemistry if Kawhi averaged 11 ppg on ~45% like did did against the DAL and OKC.. But unfortunately, Kawhi's 18 ppg on 61% was the lynchpin for their superior chemistry in the Finals.

If Lebron prevents optimal Spurs chemistry by holding Kawhi to 11 ppg like DAL and OKC did, AND if he was aggressive offensively, the Heat win easily.. But Lebron was in "give-up" mode on both sides of the ball, which permeated the team, particularly on defense.

But in the 2015 Finals, his 33 FGA showed he wasn't in "give-up" mode, and consequently, neither was the team.. Lebron led a different mindset in 2015, so instead of record defeat like 2014, Lebron's team won 2 games with a worse supporting cast against a better team.

[LAKingKobe]

Yes one man was the reason for the team making fifty five threes. Not the useless coach who didn't make any defensive adjustments during the game and the series. Want to really spank the crap out of 3ball.

[LAZERUSS]

MJ would not have won a ring with that broken down, POS roster in '14 either.

Maybe they lose 4-2, but as badly as Lebron's supporting cast played, I don't think MJ could have made up 18 ppg above what Lebron gave them.

[Rocketswin2013]

Stupid opinion. I remember him anchoring the defense but not sustaining it. Mainly after Game 3.

SA made more shots with a defender contesting than they did when wide-open. Close outs and good defense were not effective against SA.

On top of this, people expect him to shooting 65 - 67 TS% on high volume. The "aggressiveness" argument was always funny, it linked the "scored when down___ points". You expect this guy to have a GOAT scoring stretch while anchoring a defense against a team like 2014 SA.

I don't know if these expectations are trolling, or just genuine belief on how good LeBron was, but no one is that good.

[3ball]

On top of this, people expect him to shooting 65 - 67 TS% on high volume.


You don't understand how the game works - he didn't HAVE to shoot high efficiency.

The Heat shot the best against the Spurs of any Spurs opponent (DAL, POR, OKC), but the high efficiency did NOTHING for them... It was raw production that made teams more competitive with the Spurs in 2014 playoffs.

It's actually very intuitive that higher raw ppg makes a team more competitive - Dallas scored the most ppg vs. Spurs, and the Spurs advantage in ORtg was the smallest... OKC scored the 2nd highest ppg vs. Spurs, and the Spurs advantage in ORtg was the 2nd smallest... Ditto with Portland, who scored the 3rd highest PPG and had the 3rd smallest differential... And Miami scored the least, so the Spurs ORtg against them was the largest.

Furthermore, Lebron PROVED in the 2015 Finals that disregarding efficiency and going for raw production makes a team more competitive.. His Cavs won 2 games with a far worse supporting cast, against a better team.

As Flpiii said - the games would've been closer if Lebron was more aggressive offensively, although they'd still lose (assuming he and the team played the same defense) - which is why Lebron needed to be more aggressive offensively AND hold Kawhi to 11 ppg on 45% like OKC and DAL did (instead of letting him get 18 ppg on 61%).

With more aggressive offense AND better defense, the Heat win.

But that didn't happen - Lebron was passive offensively, and his poor defense enabled Kawhi to be the best Spur for the first time in the playoffs, which unlocked the Spurs' optimal chemistry that we didn't see against other Spurs opponents.
.

[3ball]

In 2014 Finals, the games would've been closer if Lebron was more aggressive offensively, but they'd still lose (assuming he and the team played the same defense)


Exactly - the games would be closer if Lebron was more aggressive offensively.

And obviously, if he plays better defense on Kawhi, the team defense would be much better - when Kawhi scored only 11 ppg vs. DAL and OKC, the series were competitive.. But when he scored 17 ppg on 55% vs. Heat and Portland, the series were massacres.

In the Heat's case, they let Kawhi go off the most, and therefore were blown out far worse than Portland - Lebron's poor defense enabled Kawhi to be the best Spur for the first time in the playoffs, which unlocked the Spurs' optimal chemistry that we didn't see against other Spurs opponents.

Clearly, with more aggressive offense AND better defense from Lebron, the Heat win.
.

[Wade's Rings]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IakSy1cO9ss

http://thebiglead.com/2014/06/13/dwyane-wade-has-been-lazy-and-indifferent-on-defense-in-the-nba-finals-and-this-video-shows-just-how-bad/

http://www.sbnation.com/2014/6/17/5806896/dwyane-wade-miami-heat-future-nba-2014

It really was.. probably the worst of any Heat player named James Jones.

So you showed Wade playing bad defense? Congratulations now address Lebron.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKUCE_5H7Iw

Also, Kawhi shot 69% through the last 3 Games of the series, read somewhere that he shot 67% when being guarded by Bron and Bron had poor closeouts/rotations.

Good thing he statpadded his Offensive numbers to look good.


I'd say the entire Heat defense was horrible.

I forgot which game it was, either Game 3 or Game 4, where both Leonard and Green were slashing the paint on LeBron at ease. He was definitely the worst defense in that particular game. But overall in the series, Miami flat out got schooled! Whatever defense they had was just overwhelmed by that Spurs offense.

Yeah the Heat as a whole sucked but that doesn't excuse Lebron's poor defense.

[3ball]

.
Dallas and OKC hold Kawhi to 11 ppg and ~45%


Result: competitive series


Heat and Portland let Kawhi score 17 ppg on ~55%


Result: Massacre


If Lebron could've held Kawhi to 11 ppg like DAL and OKC did, the series would've been more competitive - now if he adds the offensive aggression AS WELL like he did in 2015 Finals (which won 2 games with worse supporting cast against better team), the Heat win.

Clearly, the Spurs were a much better team when Kawhi was a bigger part of the offense.. In the Heat's case, Lebron's poor defense enabled Kawhi to be the best Spur for the first time in the playoffs, which unlocked the Spurs' optimal chemistry that we didn't see against other Spurs opponents, even Portland.

[AnaheimLakers24]

Kobe on that heat team would sweep the gay boy duncan