ISH's Vote: Top 2 SF Between Bird and Bron

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

After looking at ESPN's list, I'm interested to see your guys' take.

I've posted that while LeBron has greater longevity, Bird's peak and prime were better with less flaws in his game (maybe none if you're taking it to the fundamental level).

So I'll start the vote, with 1-0 in favor of Larry Legend.

What say you?

[Spurs5Rings2014]

Larry Bird.

:applause:

[Angel Face]

Not even debatable, Larry Bird the GOAT SF.

[raprap]

LeBron.

[To4]

Larry fcking Bird!.. Mt Rushmores of Alpha in NBA history..

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Keep it fair boys. No double voting with alts.

Compare the two, debate, give us your pick, and I'll tally the thread later.

[kennethgriffin]

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[Quickening]

LeBron is better, already has better longevity at the top, put up better numbers in peak years and prime.

[Smoke117]

Larry Bird. Most people are just going to go by the fact that they hate Lebron though...too many idiots here.

[outbreak]

Don't see how it is even debatable unless you are stanning. Bird >>>>>>> Lebron easily.

[Nuff Said]

As annoying as that post is watch the ish squad come and quote it.

[Odinn]

I'd take Bird over LeBron.

[raprap]

Don't see how it is even debatable unless you are stanning. Bird >>>>>>> Lebron easily.
Lol at "easily"

Stats and accomplishments are almost identical. :oldlol:

[kennethgriffin]

LeBron is better, already has better longevity at the top as well.


lebrons in his 13th season ( same as what bird played )


for all we know he could rip his achilles or break his back too


dont be so sure about anything


1 minute kobe was a 1st team all nba 28ppg player... the next minute he was a scrub fairwell tour hasbeen

injuries change everything

[Dresta]

Bird.

[Pushxx]

I take Bird.

[AnaheimLakers24]

Larry. Kd will soon be 2nd as always

[Meticode]

Right now it's Bird for me, but his time is limited there. If LeBron brings a ring to Cleveland he's automatically above Bird, even if he does it this year. It doesn't matter anyway, by the end of his career LeBron will be ahead of Bird anyway if he plays another 5 or so years.

Bird is my all-time favorite player by the way he played the game and how tough he was, but there's no denying LeBron is right there.

There is one thing I will say. LeBron will NEVER be as clutch as Bird, ever. Bird had liquid nitrogen flowing through his veins.

[JebronLames]

LeBron

[AnaheimLakers24]

Lol at "easily"

Stats and accomplishments are almost identical. :oldlol:
Moron bitch. Youre on your own it seems :lol
just like in real life

[raprap]

Moron bitch. Youre on your own it seems :lol
just like in real life
Looks like i hit a nerve there, you okay little boy? :oldlol:

[Keno]

lebron took the spot a while ago.

[!@#$%Vectors!@#]

Bird
:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:

[LAKingKobe]

True dat.
But lebron is like a sculpture made out of steel compared to everyone made out of limestone. He is unbreakable.
Bron is probably better more impactful in a stronger era of basketball.

[DMV2]

Big LeBron fan here but I have to give it to Larry Legend.

[LAKingKobe]

The main thing for me is that lebron has had similar team success and slightly better individual accomplishments while playing with a far less complete team. He was good enough to cover those deficiencies with his playmaking.

[ArbitraryWater]

Peak, Prime, Career, Bron on all strikes :cheers:

[Trollsmasher]

objectively LeBron

there's nothing Bird did better other than rebounding (and I think their rebound rates are pretty close)

yeah, he was a better shooter, but LeBron is still a better and more efficient scorer in a better defensive era

[Doranku]

Bird

[Bay Area Baller]

peak Vince Carter is a far superior dunker than both, so for that Wow factor gotta go with Carter

[Odinn]

objectively LeBron

there's nothing Bird did better other than rebounding (and I think their rebound rates are pretty close)

yeah, he was a better shooter, but LeBron is still a better and more efficient scorer in a better defensive era
Bird was better at passing. (LeBron is more of a playmaker in that regard)
Also, Bird was way better off-ball player. He didn't need the ball in his hand to be that good.

Gap is close, much like a coin toss. But bolded part is just wrong.

[bdreason]

Bird.

[Bankaii]

Why is Bird so freaking overrated? Lol at it's not close, that's just ignorant.

Lebron has the better peak, prime, better scorer, on ball and help defender, finisher, and imo a slightly better playmaker(it's close though).
Bird is the better shooter and rebounder and off ball player.
Passing is a wash.

Bird can be argued to have the better career because of having one more ring but Lebron will end up with more MVPs, All-NBA teams, more All-Defense teams, more scoring titles, more All-star appearances, and better career stats and totals.

All he needs is one more ring and it will be pretty clear.

[Bobby13]

Bird easily.

[r0drig0lac]

tie in terms of impact, I choose Bird, but it's close

[Kvnzhangyay]

Bron

As a matter of fact, in terms of peaks, I might even take KD over Bird

[ArbitraryWater]

Bird easily.

hey


Keep it fair boys. No double voting with alts.

Compare the two, debate, give us your pick, and I'll tally the thread later.

:cheers:

[feyki]

Lebron slightly better on offence and Bird slightly better on defence . 1984 Bird best peak of both . Their prime are pretty close . Bird has better career for now . And that isn't close . Bird has 9 times arguably top 2 player of the league . Lebron has 6 times . And 80-88 era far better than 09-15 era to me .


As a result ;

Peak - Bird

Prime - Draw

Career - Bird , not even close for now .

[oarabbus]

I vote Bird, LeBron needs at least 1 more ring minimum for this to change

[La Frescobaldi]

Larry Bird.

[plowking]

Lebron slightly better on offence and Bird slightly better on defence . 1984 Bird best peak of both . Their prime are pretty close . Bird has better career for now . And that isn't close . Bird has 9 times arguably top 2 player of the league . Lebron has 6 times . And 80-88 era far better than 09-15 era to me .


As a result ;

Peak - Bird

Prime - Draw

Career - Bird , not even close for now .

The answer is Bron, and posts like this are why this forum and the majority of its opinions won't be taken seriously.

Career - Bird? Really? Not close? Based on what? The fact Bron has more points, assists, steals, and even blocks soon enough.
Has played more games, and yet still averages higher ppg, spg, apg, etc.
In the playoffs the gap is even bigger in terms of ppg averages. 28 to 24ppg. Bron is even a better 3 point shooter in the playoffs, hitting 1 more three a game on the same percentage.
In the playoffs has more points, steals, blocks and assists once again. Rebounding isn't too far off either.
How about accomplishments? 1 more championship for Bird, yet same amount of FMVP's. Bron has more all NBA teams, more defensive teams and of course, more MVP's in total.

If it isn't even close, than it isn't in Bird's favour.

Literally every metric points to Bron, but we're going to listen to a bunch of people on here who don't even know much about Bird, or actually took the time to watch him about who was better.

[plowking]

I vote Bird, LeBron needs at least 1 more ring minimum for this to change

Is there a reason?

You're actually one of the reasonable posters on here, so I was wondering why a championship is the difference maker.

[La Frescobaldi]

Is there a reason?

You're actually one of the reasonable posters on here, so I was wondering why a championship is the difference maker.

i can't figure that one out either. it approaches non-sensical.

[Lebronxrings]

lebron james easily

[WayOfWade]

peak Vince Carter is a far superior dunker than both, so for that Wow factor gotta go with Carter
WTF?!
As for the OP, Bird by a slight margin, next year I'll probably say Bron though

[Asukal]

Bird easily. Leborn is a midget hearted colluding overrated pos. :lebroncry:

[bizil]

GOAT wise, Bron is gonna pass Bird by FOR SURE! He arguably ALREADY has as it is. Peak wise, I think I would lean narrowly to Bron. Don't get me wrong, Bird is the better alpha dog. BUT Bron is the most versatile player of all time. I prefer Bron's combination of great scoring AND versatility over Bird's blend of the two. To be frank, I think the Bird vs. Bron argument is the CLOSEST GAP for the #1 spot among all the other positions. Peak and GOAT wise AT THIS POINT.

[tontoz]

I am going to have to sit this one out. I have an era bias towards the 80s and don't care for Lebrons flopping/check my stats/collusion/king mindset.

[90sgoat]

Bird.

[Kobe_6/8]

LeBron.

5 year Peaks (per 100 possessions)

LeBron 09-13
O-Rating 120
D-Rating 100
38.6/10.6/10.1

Playoffs
O-Rating 118
D-Rating 100
36.5/11.5/8.3

Bird 84-88
O-Rating 119
D-Rating 102
33.6/12.0/8.3

Playoffs
O-Rating 118
D-Rating 107
30.2/11.2/7.7

Very close, but I give the edge to LeBron for being a better playmaker and superior athlete. Bird is more alpha and a better leader.

[Marchesk]

How about this guy:

Points: 30,026
Rebounds: 10,525
Assists: 5,176
Steals: 2,272
Blocks: 1,941

MVPs: 4
Championships: 3
All-Star: 16

Inspired: the GOAT

[La Frescobaldi]

LeBron.

5 year Peaks (per 100 possessions)

LeBron 09-13
O-Rating 120
D-Rating 100
38.6/10.6/10.1

Playoffs
O-Rating 118
D-Rating 100
36.5/11.5/8.3

Bird 84-88
O-Rating 119
D-Rating 102
33.6/12.0/8.3

Playoffs
O-Rating 118
D-Rating 107
30.2/11.2/7.7

Very close, but I give the edge to LeBron for being a better playmaker and superior athlete. Bird is more alpha and a better leader.

not a better playmaker.

[SyRyanYang]

Larry Legend over a beta choker? Easiest decision ever made

[leMVP]

LeGOAT

[Bobby13]

hey



:cheers:

hey?

[fsvr54]

Bird.

[Showtime2001]

Bird easily.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

The majority of ISH will go with Bird, and I agree with them...but this poll is full of shit-posters on both sides. Tough to get an accurate read as far as %.

[TheBigVeto]

Bird.

[TheImmortal]

Bird is ahead by at least 2 spots and a whole tier above. This is fairly easy.

[WorldWarriors]

Bird. He was just much tougher. Stats don't tell the whole story. Those guys were taking 2 piece specials from their opponents night in and night out.

LEBRON is still great though. Bird is the only SF I would put over him.

[Ray22]

Bird

[Mr. Jabbar]

Larry Pajaro

[Black and White]

Bird

[Kblaze8855]

nobody... & I do mean nobody without a single exception... seems like a more effective basketball player than Larry Bird since I started watching.

you start breaking it down piece by piece & looking at accolades and all the things we look at you can argue some people were greater but just me sitting down and watching people play?

Larry Bird was the personification of Larry Brown talking about playing the right way.

if I have to start a team around bird or LeBron I would take bird and it wouldn't be some long drawn out decision. It's not that bird is miles better.... there comes a point when there isn't great separation between the greats and both of them are somewhere in that area.... but that doesn't mean it would be a tough choice.

bird was the midpoint between the ass hole ridiculously talented teammate alienating guys like Jordan Kobe and Oscar Robertson who lead by being so great teammates played hard not to disappoint them and the overwhelmingly talented but not as aggressive as you would like guys like LeBron, Dr. J, and magic who fostered chemistry but left a little on the table in terms of taking over games at times.

He could realistically score 50, have 15 assists, have 15 rebounds or whatever you need and while LeBron could accumulate those numbers he has to visibly change his game to do it.

is kind of hard to explain if you weren't around watching him do it but there are times Larry Bird scores 40 and you feel like he has 18. maybe the best in the flow of the game scorer I've ever seen but he had the talent to make it all about himself and prove a point.

Larry Bird was so good that you can't explain it without sounding like you're exaggerating. People start talking like he's a mythical creature or something and people who didn't see him at his best will just never understand.

dude was just starving to win but his aggression almost never translated into taking anything away from his teams ability to perform as a whole.

That is rare.

He's the only player I've ever seen have 50 and agree that he was the worst player on his team that night.

it wasn't oh I had 50 and we lost because nobody helped out. It was I had 50 and I took too much from my teammates.

Larry Bird was every bit as much of an egotistical jerk as guys who get hated on for it like Kobe but he somehow contained that in a game that was every bit as unselfish as Tim Duncan.

He just really didn't make sense.

the guys I will take over him if I had to build a functioning team and go try to win a ring are few and there are people not on it that arguably had better careers.

LeBron is one of them.

[warriorfan]

I'll make a long story short here

LeBron is probably better overall if you do an individual category run down between the two of them

The problem is LeBron has weaknesses that are easier to exploit than Larry Bird

That is why I'm going with Bird


Good post by Kblaze by the way

[VengefulAngel]

Lebron. Just because I want to make this closer.

[Done_And_Done]

nobody... & I do mean nobody without a single exception... seems like a more effective basketball player than Larry Bird since I started watching.

you start breaking it down piece by piece & looking at accolades and all the things we look at you can argue some people were greater but just me sitting down and watching people play?

Larry Bird was the personification of Larry Brown talking about playing the right way.

if I have to start a team around bird or LeBron I would take bird and it wouldn't be some long drawn out decision. It's not that bird is miles better.... there comes a point when there isn't great separation between the greats and both of them are somewhere in that area.... but that doesn't mean it would be a tough choice.

bird was the midpoint between the ass hole ridiculously talented teammate alienating guys like Jordan Kobe and Oscar Robertson who lead by being so great teammates played hard not to disappoint them and the overwhelmingly talented but not as aggressive as you would like guys like LeBron, Dr. J, and magic who fostered chemistry but left a little on the table in terms of taking over games at times.

He could realistically score 50, have 15 assists, have 15 rebounds or whatever you need and while LeBron could accumulate those numbers he has to visibly change his game to do it.

is kind of hard to explain if you weren't around watching him do it but there are times Larry Bird scores 40 and you feel like he has 18. maybe the best in the flow of the game scorer I've ever seen but he had the talent to make it all about himself and prove a point.

Larry Bird was so good that you can't explain it without sounding like you're exaggerating. People start talking like he's a mythical creature or something and people who didn't see him at his best will just never understand.

dude was just starving to win but his aggression almost never translated into taking anything away from his teams ability to perform as a whole.

That is rare.

He's the only player I've ever seen have 50 and agree that he was the worst player on his team that night.

it wasn't oh I had 50 and we lost because nobody helped out. It was I had 50 and I took too much from my teammates.

Larry Bird was every bit as much of an egotistical jerk as guys who get hated on for it like Kobe but he somehow contained that in a game that was every bit as unselfish as Tim Duncan.

He just really didn't make sense.

the guys I will take over him if I had to build a functioning team and go try to win a ring are few and there are people not on it that arguably had better careers.

LeBron is one of them.

Very cool post KB

[Gileraracer]

Bird, no question. Better rebounding, much better shooter, better leader and alpha as phuck :applause:

[24-Inch_Chrome]

nobody... & I do mean nobody without a single exception... seems like a more effective basketball player than Larry Bird since I started watching.

you start breaking it down piece by piece & looking at accolades and all the things we look at you can argue some people were greater but just me sitting down and watching people play?

Larry Bird was the personification of Larry Brown talking about playing the right way.

if I have to start a team around bird or LeBron I would take bird and it wouldn't be some long drawn out decision. It's not that bird is miles better.... there comes a point when there isn't great separation between the greats and both of them are somewhere in that area.... but that doesn't mean it would be a tough choice.

bird was the midpoint between the ass hole ridiculously talented teammate alienating guys like Jordan Kobe and Oscar Robertson who lead by being so great teammates played hard not to disappoint them and the overwhelmingly talented but not as aggressive as you would like guys like LeBron, Dr. J, and magic who fostered chemistry but left a little on the table in terms of taking over games at times.

He could realistically score 50, have 15 assists, have 15 rebounds or whatever you need and while LeBron could accumulate those numbers he has to visibly change his game to do it.

is kind of hard to explain if you weren't around watching him do it but there are times Larry Bird scores 40 and you feel like he has 18. maybe the best in the flow of the game scorer I've ever seen but he had the talent to make it all about himself and prove a point.

Larry Bird was so good that you can't explain it without sounding like you're exaggerating. People start talking like he's a mythical creature or something and people who didn't see him at his best will just never understand.

dude was just starving to win but his aggression almost never translated into taking anything away from his teams ability to perform as a whole.

That is rare.

He's the only player I've ever seen have 50 and agree that he was the worst player on his team that night.

it wasn't oh I had 50 and we lost because nobody helped out. It was I had 50 and I took too much from my teammates.

Larry Bird was every bit as much of an egotistical jerk as guys who get hated on for it like Kobe but he somehow contained that in a game that was every bit as unselfish as Tim Duncan.

He just really didn't make sense.

the guys I will take over him if I had to build a functioning team and go try to win a ring are few and there are people not on it that arguably had better careers.

LeBron is one of them.
Great post as usual. Always interesting to read.

[aj1987]

I vote Bird, LeBron needs at least 1 more ring minimum for this to change
I don't get this logic. This is why most people are picking Bird, I assume?

Compare their career accolades.

LeBron:

2x NBA Champ
2x FMVP
4x NBA MVP
10X All-NBA First
2x All-NBA Second
5x All-Defensive First
1x All-Defensive Second

Bird:

3x NBA Champ
2x FMVP
3x NBA MVP
9x All-NBA First
1x All-NBA Second
3x All-Defensive Second

The accolades are pretty close, but LeBron blows him away in All-Def selections. Not only that, but LeBron has significantly better than Bird stats wise. Why exactly does LeBron need a ring to surpass Bird? If rings are end all be all, shouldn't Hondo be in the top 5? Shaq and Duncan should be MUCH higher as well, but most people rank Bird 3-4 spots higher than them.


Anyways, my pick is LeBron.

[SwayDizzle]

Bird

who knows, things might change down the line if LBJ goes to therapy, but as of right now Bird is a tier higher and a much greater winner

[bizil]

I don't get this logic. This is why most people are picking Bird, I assume?

Compare their career accolades.

LeBron:

2x NBA Champ
2x FMVP
4x NBA MVP
10X All-NBA First
2x All-NBA Second
5x All-Defensive First
1x All-Defensive Second

Bird:

3x NBA Champ
2x FMVP
3x NBA MVP
9x All-NBA First
1x All-NBA Second
3x All-Defensive Second

The accolades are pretty close, but LeBron blows him away in All-Def selections. Not only that, but LeBron has significantly better than Bird stats wise. Why exactly does LeBron need a ring to surpass Bird? If rings are end all be all, shouldn't Hondo be in the top 5? Shaq and Duncan should be MUCH higher as well, but most people rank Bird 3-4 spots higher than them.


Anyways, my pick is LeBron.

Good post! GOAT wise, Bron has the resume to be the top SF of all time. The accolades you laid out prove that. But Bird has the resume to lay claim to that title too. But as the years go on, Bron is gonna create more distance between him and Bird GOAT wise.

In my opinion, the peak value-better player argument will always be a closer debate as time goes on. I can't argue with anybody choosing Bird over Bron in this realm. Bird was that EPIC! But, I go with Bron peak wise narrowly.

Bron's two way ability and overall versatility are the reasons why. And even though Bron isn't as alpha as Bird, Bron STILL QUALIFIES as an alpha dog. He has the 4th highest scoring average in NBA history.

[Relinquish]

Gotta go with Bron. He has almost the same accolades/more and his career isn't over yet.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Im taking the wig ger on this one m8's

[knicksman]

I don't get this logic. This is why most people are picking Bird, I assume?

Compare their career accolades.

LeBron:

2x NBA Champ
2x FMVP
4x NBA MVP
10X All-NBA First
2x All-NBA Second
5x All-Defensive First
1x All-Defensive Second

Bird:

3x NBA Champ
2x FMVP
3x NBA MVP
9x All-NBA First
1x All-NBA Second
3x All-Defensive Second

The accolades are pretty close, but LeBron blows him away in All-Def selections. Not only that, but LeBron has significantly better than Bird stats wise. Why exactly does LeBron need a ring to surpass Bird? If rings are end all be all, shouldn't Hondo be in the top 5? Shaq and Duncan should be MUCH higher as well, but most people rank Bird 3-4 spots higher than them.


Anyways, my pick is LeBron.

Because youre a dumbass aj. Thats why youre a bran stan coz you dont know eye test. accolades arent created equal my friend just like there are skillsets more important than the others or else pgs would have equal representation in the top 10 as scorers. But as ive said, youre a dumbass so its no surprise that you think brans defensive shit is more valuable than birds 1 ring advantage. And were not taking into account collusion here yet. If we take that into account, bran becomes several levels below bird that its not even funny anymore my friend

[warriorfan]

knicksman is one of my favorite posters around I'm surprised no one has accused us of being the same. posts the exact same shit I do everytime and that aint no dis

good lookin homie :cheers:

[knicksman]

knicksman is one of my favorite posters around I'm surprised no one has accused us of being the same. posts the exact same shit I do everytime and that aint no dis

good lookin homie :cheers:

:cheers:

[SuperCereal]

Bird!

[Mr Feeny]

knicksman is one of my favorite posters around I'm surprised no one has accused us of being the same. posts the exact same shit I do everytime and that aint no dis

good lookin homie :cheers:

Why waste our time, jabbar. Yawn
Curry > Kobe any day of the weak.
2016 curry better than any version of the 44% career shooter.


Peace:rockon:

[dhsilv]

nobody... & I do mean nobody without a single exception... seems like a more effective basketball player than Larry Bird since I started watching.

you start breaking it down piece by piece & looking at accolades and all the things we look at you can argue some people were greater but just me sitting down and watching people play?

Larry Bird was the personification of Larry Brown talking about playing the right way.

if I have to start a team around bird or LeBron I would take bird and it wouldn't be some long drawn out decision. It's not that bird is miles better.... there comes a point when there isn't great separation between the greats and both of them are somewhere in that area.... but that doesn't mean it would be a tough choice.

bird was the midpoint between the ass hole ridiculously talented teammate alienating guys like Jordan Kobe and Oscar Robertson who lead by being so great teammates played hard not to disappoint them and the overwhelmingly talented but not as aggressive as you would like guys like LeBron, Dr. J, and magic who fostered chemistry but left a little on the table in terms of taking over games at times.

He could realistically score 50, have 15 assists, have 15 rebounds or whatever you need and while LeBron could accumulate those numbers he has to visibly change his game to do it.

is kind of hard to explain if you weren't around watching him do it but there are times Larry Bird scores 40 and you feel like he has 18. maybe the best in the flow of the game scorer I've ever seen but he had the talent to make it all about himself and prove a point.

Larry Bird was so good that you can't explain it without sounding like you're exaggerating. People start talking like he's a mythical creature or something and people who didn't see him at his best will just never understand.

dude was just starving to win but his aggression almost never translated into taking anything away from his teams ability to perform as a whole.

That is rare.

He's the only player I've ever seen have 50 and agree that he was the worst player on his team that night.

it wasn't oh I had 50 and we lost because nobody helped out. It was I had 50 and I took too much from my teammates.

Larry Bird was every bit as much of an egotistical jerk as guys who get hated on for it like Kobe but he somehow contained that in a game that was every bit as unselfish as Tim Duncan.

He just really didn't make sense.

the guys I will take over him if I had to build a functioning team and go try to win a ring are few and there are people not on it that arguably had better careers.

LeBron is one of them.

This is a classic case of nostalgia clouding one's judgement.

[Harison]

Other than James stans (or Bird haters), nobody in their right mind would pick Bron over Bird.

[SexSymbol]

Bird by a landslide

[Quickening]

Other than James stans (or Bird haters), nobody in their right mind would pick Bron over Bird.

Yes it would be ridiculous to put somebody who has better stats across the board in total and per game, more MVPs, same amount of FMVPs, better defense :lol :banana:

[Prime_Shaq]

It close but I'm still gonna have to go with Bird for now, might change in the next few years though.

[sdot_thadon]

I go back and forth on this one, and wouldn't really argue either opinion. Honestly too close to be definitive either way. Bird was obviously the better shooter but not to the point where it separates them offensively, we all know lebron is a goat tier finisher and is as unique as they come in terms of size/skillset. Passing I'd say at worst bird is slightly better but it's real close. Career accolades are pretty even aside from all defense teams. In terms of intangibles bird is superior when you factor in things like bball iq, fitting in to any situation, killer mentality and so forth and even with that lebron is no slouch in the all time sense , but bird is better.

Two thing that I can't shake though:

Lebron at his best is unpredictable, he's just as likely to block a center at the rim as he is to hit a stepback 3 or get in the passing lane and setup a teammate for a 3. He's one of the few players ever that is capable of literally any basketball play on the floor at any given time.

Birds defense has to impact his standing, while not horrible there's a huge chasm between the 2. I can't feel right about calling someone best all time at a position they couldnt guard consistently. My main qualm with legend.

I got lebron as of now, but it's not a clear thing. If everything goes according to plan he should edge bird in longevity soon and it'll be an even bigger case for Lebron overall.

[Rolando]

4th quarter, game 7 of the Finals. You can choose to put in Lebron or Bird. Who you going to put on the court?

Bird.

[Quickening]

I got lebron as of now, but it's not a clear thing. If everything goes according to plan he should edge bird in longevity soon and it'll be an even bigger case for Lebron overall.

Lebron already has better longevity, played more games throughout his career in playoffs and regular season, higher in career totals.

[red1]

James

[La Frescobaldi]

if i counted right so far it's 42-19 in favor of Larry Bird

[pauk]

Wrong troll/Lebron hater infested forum & time to get mostly impartial / objective answers on this.... i bet if you started a Kawhi vs Lebron thread i wouldnt be surprised if Kawhi would win here....

Bird & Lebron are neck & neck accolades/accomplishments/peak etc. wise i think and the only one who has any microscopical edge there is arguably Lebron if not now then by the time he retires definitely.... you better prepare for that, you cant just keep acting like everything Lebron did/does didnt happen, im sorry... both are in my top 10 and ranked right next to eachother...

As far as basketball ability goes, i prefer Larry Bird, its a shooter a thing, doesnt mean i think he is better, i mean i would take even Reggie Miller over Lebron.... its just my acquired taste... if i want to win, if i want impact... then i really do think a safer bet would be Lebron over Bird, offensively they did it differently but Lebron did it more productively and it DID translate to great team success based on what he had to work with around him, same for Bird.... but then comes the defense part in which there is a big difference where at the end of the day whether you refuse to accept it or not gives Lebron the edge as the somewhat better overall talent than Bird....

[feyki]

The answer is Bron, and posts like this are why this forum and the majority of its opinions won't be taken seriously.

Career - Bird? Really? Not close? Based on what? The fact Bron has more points, assists, steals, and even blocks soon enough.
Has played more games, and yet still averages higher ppg, spg, apg, etc.
In the playoffs the gap is even bigger in terms of ppg averages. 28 to 24ppg. Bron is even a better 3 point shooter in the playoffs, hitting 1 more three a game on the same percentage.
In the playoffs has more points, steals, blocks and assists once again. Rebounding isn't too far off either.
How about accomplishments? 1 more championship for Bird, yet same amount of FMVP's. Bron has more all NBA teams, more defensive teams and of course, more MVP's in total.

If it isn't even close, than it isn't in Bird's favour.

Literally every metric points to Bron, but we're going to listen to a bunch of people on here who don't even know much about Bird, or actually took the time to watch him about who was better.

Answer is Bird and i don't take you seriously . Sounds familian?

Bird was arguably top 2 player of the league 9 times . Lebron has 6 times . And 80-88 far better competitive era than 09-15 .

And Bird had far better impacts against great competitions than Lebron at careers .




BTW , I forgot Lebron's 09 in my post. Lebron has best peak with his 09 .

[Quickening]

Answer is Bird and i don't take you seriously . Sounds familian?

Bird was arguably top 2 player of the league 9 times . Lebron has 6 times . And 80-88 far better competitive era than 09-15 .

And Bird had far better impacts against great competitions than Lebron at careers .




BTW , I forgot Lebron's 09 in my post. Lebron has best peak with his 09 .

What a shit post :lol

[Showtime80']

For God's sake LeBron's only titles have come from his bolting to play alongside two other all-stars in Miami in one of the weakest conferences in recent memory!

Larry Bird MADE the Boston Celtics from day one ti'll he RETIRED AS A CELTIC and had to deal with Magic, Moses, Dr J, Dominique, Kareem, Olajuwon, Isiah and Jordan to get his titles!!!

Who did LeBron beat again after JOINING TWO OTHER ALL-STARS IN MIAMI!

[feyki]

What a shit post :lol


Such a f.g poster :lol

[SpaceJam]

Bird

[ArbitraryWater]

Answer is Bird and i don't take you seriously . Sounds familian?

Bird was arguably top 2 player of the league 9 times . Lebron has 6 times . And 80-88 far better competitive era than 09-15 .

And Bird had far better impacts against great competitions than Lebron at careers .




BTW , I forgot Lebron's 09 in my post. Lebron has best peak with his 09 .

http://a.fod4.com/images/GifGuide/michael_scott/Michael-What-the-office-10400786-400-226.gif

[Nash]

4th quarter, game 7 of the Finals. You can choose to put in Lebron or Bird. Who you going to put on the court?

Bird.
Why would I not choose the guy who has the highest ppg in the history of the NBA, Lebron James?

You guys just keep contradicting yourselves all the time without even knowing it. :lol

If you want to win this argument, stop mentioning stuff that support Lebron's case.

[Showtime80']

Larry Bird's scalp count on the way to win his titles:

Magic
Kareem
Dr. J
Moses
Isiah
Jordan
Dominique
Moncrief
Olajuwon
Barkley

Stacked period for the league and Bird dominated! Bring up LeBald's list again of victims on his way to his two titles in a sh!t conference and league after JUMPIN SHIP TO MIAMI!

[feyki]

http://a.fod4.com/images/GifGuide/michael_scott/Michael-What-the-office-10400786-400-226.gif


Explain what's wrong with my post for you ? Let's debate , we're here for this .

[Nash]

Larry Bird's scalp count on the way to win his titles:

Magic
Kareem
Dr. J
Moses
Isiah
Jordan
Dominique
Moncrief
Olajuwon
Barkley

Stacked period for the league and Bird dominated! Bring up LeBald's list again of victims on his way to his two titles in a sh!t conference and league after JUMPIN SHIP TO MIAMI!
Seriously? You want to play this game? Ok.


Durant
Westbrook
Harden
Paul George
Pierce
Garnett
Rose
Melo
Duncan

Some of the players that Lebron had to beat.

[tpols]

Seriously? You want to play this game? Ok.


Durant
Westbrook
Harden
Paul George
Pierce
Garnett
Rose
Melo
Duncan

Some of the players that Lebron had to beat.


that's a sorry ass list compared to the one the other guy posted.. especially when you consider ages of garnett and Duncan when he beat them.

[feyki]

Seriously? You want to play this game? Ok.


Durant
Westbrook
Harden
Paul George
Pierce
Garnett
Rose
Melo
Duncan

Some of the players that Lebron had to beat.

Do you really think those players better ?

[Showtime80']

What a sorry list of players when compared to Bird's!

Not to mention the little fact HE BOLTED TO PLAY WITH TWO ALL-STARS IN MIAMI!

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Alright. So far I've counted 45-19 in Larry Bird's favor.

There are a few votes I'm not sure on though (kblaze and pauk). Pauk thinks Bird has better basketball ability and would rather start a team with him, but believes LeBron might have more impact. Who's had the better career pauk?

Kblaze had a nice post describing Bird's game. He said he would start a team with Larry, but later claimed LeBron arguably has a better career. Gun to your head, Blaze, who has had the better career?

[StephHamann]

Bird

[d.bball.guy]

LeBird.

[Kblaze8855]

This is a classic case of nostalgia clouding one's judgement.

Feel free to explain the problems you have. I wouldn't take everyone from that time over LeBron. I will take Larry Bird. That isn't nostalghia that's deciding which basketball player you prefer.


As for this:


"Kblaze had a nice post describing Bird's game. He said he would start a team with Larry, but later claimed LeBron arguably has a better career. Gun to your head, Blaze, who has had the better career?"


it's about even right now with bird having the extra title and LeBron the extra MVP. I'm sure there's some all such and such teams and stats in LeBrons favor but when we are talking careers the extra ring means an awful lot. One would have to assume that in the next five to seven years LeBron will fully eclipse Birds accomplishments and he will have had the better career. but that doesn't decide who plays basketball better.

[sd3035]

Bird obviously

[Captvic]

lebron hate is real

Lebron is the best NBA player ever behind Jordan so of course he's better than White boy Bird

[Naero]

Legacy-wise, Larry Bird still holds the slight upper-hand IMO, but it's not going to be much longer until he's surpassed—barring the off-chance that one of the most durable players in NBA history in LeBron James is injury-derailed anytime soon.

LeBron slightly outranks the Celtics Legend on the BOAT scale; as such, he's bound to accumulate a better legacy with more proven longevity, which is just a formality waiting to materialize in 2-3 years—even without any more of the major accolades on his resume, such as MVPs, Finals MVPs, championships led, and so on.

One can only envision how much more daunting Bird's legacy would be had his back pain not been onset at that age. Before the back pain started to deterioratingly flaring up, was still in the stratosphere of his prime in his early-30s; with 2-3 more seasons at that level, he may have secured his outranking spot against LeBron, too.

[Cali Syndicate]

Seriously? You want to play this game? Ok.


Durant
Westbrook
Harden
Paul George
Pierce
Garnett
Rose
Melo
Duncan

Some of the players that Lebron had to beat.

You shouldn't have posted this.

[Asukal]

lebron hate is real

Lebron is the best NBA player ever behind Jordan so of course he's better than White boy Bird

You know what else is real? LeCollude went 2/6 and is about to go 2/7. :oldlol: :lol :roll:

[Showtime80']

I'll post Bird's list of victims again:

Magic
Kareem
Dr. J
Moses
Isiah
Jordan
Dominique
Moncrief
Olajuwon
Barkley

Won ALL of this titles with the team that drafted him and would NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS! join any of those guys on their teams.

[bizil]

Wrong troll/Lebron hater infested forum & time to get mostly impartial / objective answers on this.... i bet if you started a Kawhi vs Lebron thread i wouldnt be surprised if Kawhi would win here....

Bird & Lebron are neck & neck accolades/accomplishments/peak etc. wise i think and the only one who has any microscopical edge there is arguably Lebron if not now then by the time he retires definitely.... you better prepare for that, you cant just keep acting like everything Lebron did/does didnt happen, im sorry... both are in my top 10 and ranked right next to eachother...

As far as basketball ability goes, i prefer Larry Bird, its a shooter a thing, doesnt mean i think he is better, i mean i would take even Reggie Miller over Lebron.... its just my acquired taste... if i want to win, if i want impact... then i really do think a safer bet would be Lebron over Bird, offensively they did it differently but Lebron did it more productively and it DID translate to great team success based on what he had to work with around him, same for Bird.... but then comes the defense part in which there is a big difference where at the end of the day whether you refuse to accept it or not gives Lebron the edge as the somewhat better overall talent than Bird....

Awesome post! When it comes to great players, its often a matter of taste when it comes to who u would choose. It's NOT ABOUT saying guys are overrated. It's about both guys are great, but some prefer Bird over Bron. Or vice versa.

And is a sense, Bird and Bron are ACTUALLY very similar in a lot of ways. I view those two and Magic as THE BRIDGE between the perimeter and big man positions. Unlike MJ, Kobe, West, Big O, Doc, etc., they can play the PF position. Which can REALLY be valuable as they age. Magic and Bird BOTH played more as PF's late in their careers. I could see Bron possibly doing the same. When it comes to IQ and versatility as a package, Bird, Bron, and Magic are the big three!

[hateraid]

Don't see how it is even debatable unless you are stanning. Bird >>>>>>> Lebron easily.

How so? I think it's quite the opposite. People will more vote Bird in protest to Lebron over Lebron stans.

I've been watching NBA since the 80's. I had full comprehension of basketball when Bird was around. I would take Lebron over Bird. Lebron has a better case to be the most dominant player of his era whereas Bird may have been for one or two years. I have Magic over Bird in his era.

Lebron for me. These threads though are futile because you get these ignorant adults who won't respect what you say because they have their heads so far stuck up their ass or the ass of another player IE Kobe/Jordan.

[hateraid]

I'll post Bird's list of victims again:

Magic
Kareem
Dr. J
Moses
Isiah
Jordan
Dominique
Moncrief
Olajuwon
Barkley

Won ALL of this titles with the team that drafted him and would NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS! join any of those guys on their teams.

You mean Bird with McHale, Parrish, DJ, and a plethora of Dynamic role players beat the Sixers, Lakers, and a series of weak teams with 1 superstar?
Bird is great, but didn't win on his own. His teams was stacked and had a great coach

[nba_55]

I'll post Bird's list of victims again:

Magic
Kareem
Dr. J
Moses
Isiah
Jordan
Dominique
Moncrief
Olajuwon
Barkley

Won ALL of this titles with the team that drafted him and would NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS! join any of those guys on their teams.

Not shit! He had one of the most stacked teams ever.

[SexSymbol]

Think about it.
Bird's a better scorer, rebounder and passer.
LeBron's probably the better defender because of his peak years defensively.
Bird has had better finals opponents, legendary level and has three rings
LeBron finals competition wasn't as great and he has 2 rings with a clear losing record.

Lebron is a great player, but Bird is a top 5 overall and it's hard to put bron into top 10

[nba_55]

Think about it.
Bird's a better scorer, rebounder and passer.
LeBron's probably the better defender because of his peak years defensively.
Bird has had better finals opponents, legendary level and has three rings
LeBron finals competition wasn't as great and he has 2 rings with a clear losing record.

Lebron is a great player, but Bird is a top 5 overall and it's hard to put bron into top 10

:biggums:

[hateraid]

Think about it.
Bird's a better scorer, rebounder and passer.
LeBron's probably the better defender because of his peak years defensively.
Bird has had better finals opponents, legendary level and has three rings
LeBron finals competition wasn't as great and he has 2 rings with a clear losing record.

Lebron is a great player, but Bird is a top 5 overall and it's hard to put bron into top 10

Team accomplishments. Switch Larry and Nique. would Bird have those same accolades? Not by a long shot. Lebron has proved he can carry just about any team, even minus the "Collusion".
Not taking away from Bird as I respect him, but comparing team accomplishments is not a good measuring stick given Bird's stacked team

[TheMan]

After looking at ESPN's list, I'm interested to see your guys' take.

I've posted that while LeBron has greater longevity, Bird's peak and prime were better with less flaws in his game (maybe none if you're taking it to the fundamental level).

So I'll start the vote, with 1-0 in favor of Larry Legend.

What say you?
I agree

It's really close though...

LeBron is the better scorer, slasher, finisher and man defender

Larry is the better passer, shooter, rebounder, team leader and clutch player.

Bran is obviously the superior athlete but Bird shits on Bran in fundamentals...

The better career, longevity = Bran

Peak/prime = Bird

It's kind of a coin flip but my vote is for Larry Legend because he has 3 chips to Bran's 2 so far...

[feyki]

Not shit! He had one of the most stacked teams ever.

Mchale - Sixthman until 1986
Parish - Zero All star selections before Bird
Archibald and Maxwell - without Bird 28 wins


Yes , most stacked .

[Nash]

You shouldn't have posted this.
Why not? Those are the equivalent stars of this era.

[SexSymbol]

Team accomplishments. Switch Larry and Nique. would Bird have those same accolades? Not by a long shot. Lebron has proved he can carry just about any team, even minus the "Collusion".
Not taking away from Bird as I respect him, but comparing team accomplishments is not a good measuring stick given Bird's stacked team
There's no "at least you tried" awards in sports.
It's a team game that is dominated by superstars. You play the game to win, that is by definition the only thing that matters in basketball.
You have to measure who the superstar played against and how he performed if you want to see his actual place in history.

[feyki]

I agree

It's really close though...

LeBron is the better scorer, slasher, finisher and man defender

Larry is the better passer, shooter, rebounder, team leader and clutch player.

Bran is obviously the superior athlete but Bird shits on Bran in fundamentals...

The better career, longevity = Bran

Peak/prime = Bird

It's kind of a coin flip but my vote is for Larry Legend because he has 3 chips to Bran's 2 so far...

I think Bird better man to man defender , cause his hustle and nasty plays more effective than Lebron's defence .

Bird is better passer , specially in transition . But I think Lebron had better playmaking . Lebron's half court vision and passing more effective to me .

[hateraid]

There's no "at least you tried" awards in sports.
It's a team game that is dominated by superstars. You play the game to win, that is by definition the only thing that matters in basketball.
You have to measure who the superstar played against and how he performed if you want to see his actual place in history.

Key words right there.
like I said, switch Larry and Nique, would the outcome of Larry's career be any different? Would he even have a championship? Heck, could he even reach the finals?
Lebron has proven to be a winner on any team he's been on. On an individual standpoint he has more impact to his team.
Having said all that you have to take that into account when comparing TEAM accomplishments, in which you did.

[tpols]

Bird


Lets see why..

Larry developed all of his guys, stuck with them and led them from pretty much nothing to be perrenial contenders with his off ball style, high IQ, and toughness.

Lebron didn't develop his teammates to near the same extent, but was a better individual wrecking ball. This was great for regular season success but always came down crashing in the playoffs.

In response to constant defeat, Lebron decides to join with a fellow top 3 player in the world (possibly 1 or 2 depending on who you ask), as well as an all star PF... They would play in a conference devoid of any other stars save for Derrick Rose/Paul George and the garbage men, and an aging Celtics cast. They end up going 2/4 after promising some super dynasty, and get destroyed in record breaking fashion before Lebron decides jump ship again to get him self a fresh new set of all star guards and big men.


One player developed what was given to him and always played optimal team ball, was an example of how skill, toughness and heart can overcome a lack of natural talent.. while the other jumped ship when the going got tough not just once, but TWICE. People don't respect quitters as much as guys who fight through it.. has nothing to do with bron stans

[Showtime80']

Bird had a stacked team in stacked era

LeBron had weak and stacked team in a WEAK ERA!

Advantage Bird!

LOL at guys like Rose, Westbrook, George and Harden! These guys are a full tier below ALL of the guys from Bird's rampage!

[Lebron23]

Lebron James

[La Frescobaldi]

Bird had a stacked team in stacked era

LeBron had weak and stacked team in a WEAK ERA!

Advantage Bird!

LOL at guys like Rose, Westbrook, George and Harden! These guys are a full tier below ALL of the guys from Bird's rampage!

Not sure....... Westbrook okay he's so stupid it's a wonder he even gets to the arenas. If they benched for stupid plays in game he'd spend a lot of time sitting on the wood.
But Paul George? Dude is for real beyond question
Derrick Rose who can say? Before his knee blew he was elite by any measure

[hateraid]

Bird had a stacked team in stacked era

LeBron had weak and stacked team in a WEAK ERA!

Advantage Bird!

LOL at guys like Rose, Westbrook, George and Harden! These guys are a full tier below ALL of the guys from Bird's rampage!
Stacked how? It's all relevant in any era.
Really you could say there were only 3 or 4 stacked teams. All other teams could be argued they consist of 1 superstar or borderline superstar and a bunch of mediocre players.

Outside of the Sixers, Lakers, and later the Pistons, who was really stacked. You could argue only the Lakers had a stacked team in that time period as the Sixers fell off a couple of years after their playoff run. It wasn't as stacked as you think.

You could even argue Duncan and Kobe were better than any player in the 85-90 era outside of Magic and Bird. Again, it's all pretty relevant.

[Genaro]

Larry Bird

[TheMan]

Seriously? You want to play this game? Ok.


Durant
Westbrook
Harden
Paul George
Pierce
Garnett
Rose
Melo
Dunca

Some of the players that Lebron had to beat.
That is a shit list compared to the players Bird beat :lol

[Showtime80']

Really bad example bringing Nique in comparison to Bird and saying they would've had different careers had they switched places, BULLSh!T!!!

Larry Bird turned a 29 win team into a 61 win conference finalist in his ROOKIE YEAR before Parish, McHale, DJ, Walton or Ainge even dreamt of being Celtics!

Dominique took 4 years before he even won 50 games!!!

Guys like Magic and Larry understood the game and played in a way that would've NEVER allowed them to be on teams that won less than 50 to 55 games and be a consistent threat. They turned EVERYBODY on their teams into weapons and that's the primary quality that made them absolutely LETHAL! That comes into play even more when you have 4 to 5 all star players surrounding you like Bird did later on

Would a score first juggernaut like Dominique been able to maximize those 80's Celtics potential like Larry did! Highly doubtful!
Guys like Dominique

[Showtime80']

LeBron never beat Kobe!

And are you telling me the Duncan of 2013 is at the level of the 80's Magic, Isiah, Dr J, Moses, King or Dominique?!? HELL NO!!!

[Lebron23]

LeBron never beat Kobe!

And are you telling me the Duncan of 2013 is at the level of the 80's Magic, Isiah, Dr J, Moses, King or Dominique?!? HELL NO!!!


2012 and 2013 Heat would have beaten the 2009 and 2010 Lakers. Mr. 41 FG% in the NBA Finals would have been shutdown by the Heat's defense.

And 2012 OKC > 2009 Magic

And 2013 Spurs > 2010 Celtics.

[Showtime80']

Would've, should've, DIDN'T HAPPEN!

[Lebron23]

Would've, should've, DIDN'T HAPPEN!

Lebron still beat Kobe in their career head to head match up in the regular season.

And he also outplayed him statistically.

[kennethgriffin]

2012 and 2013 Heat would have beaten the 2009 and 2010 Lakers. Mr. 41 FG% in the NBA Finals would have been shutdown by the Heat's defense.



the 2010 lakers beat 4 hall of famers

theyve proven they can beat a colluded stacked roster



has lebron proven he can beat anyone other than an unproven thunder team or an over the hill duncan

[TheMan]

Stacked how? It's all relevant in any era.
Really you could say there were only 3 or 4 stacked teams. All other teams could be argued they consist of 1 superstar or borderline superstar and a bunch of mediocre players.

Outside of the Sixers, Lakers, and later the Pistons, who was really stacked. You could argue only the Lakers had a stacked team in that time period as the Sixers fell off a couple of years after their playoff run. It wasn't as stacked as you think.

You could even argue Duncan and Kobe were better than any player in the 85-90 era outside of Magic and Bird. Again, it's all pretty relevant.
MJ played from 85-90...

[tpols]

the 2010 lakers beat 4 hall of famers

theyve proven they can beat a colluded stacked roster



has lebron proven he can beat anyone other than an unproven thunder team or an over the hill duncan

an even that took a miracle.. that was completely out of his hands.

[Showtime2001]

2010 Celtics > 2013 Spurs.

[Lebron23]

the 2010 lakers beat 4 hall of famers

theyve proven they can beat a colluded stacked roster



has lebron proven he can beat anyone other than an unproven thunder team or an over the hill duncan


LeBron, Bosh, and Wade trio were much better than the 2010 Celtics.

[Lebron23]

2010 Celtics > 2013 Spurs.


The 2013 Spurs were as good as the 2014 Spurs. Wade and Bosh didn't play to their full potential in the 2014 NBA Finals., and the Spurs bench outplayed, and out hustled the Heat's bench.

[Showtime80']

1984>>>>> Anything LeBron has or will ever face!!!

Probably the most stacked lineup the Lakers had the entire decade!

Magic
Kareem
Wilkes
McAdoo
Worthy
Scott
Cooper
Rambis
Kupchak

That was a different beast altogether and Bird killed it!

[kennethgriffin]

LeBron, Bosh, and Wade trio were much better than the 2010 Celtics.


the celtics werent just

- future hall of famer Kevin Garnett
- future hall of famer Paul Pierce
- future hall of famer Ray Allen
- future hall of famer Rajon Rondo

they also had

Defensive Stopper - Kendrick Perkins
Defensive legend - Tony Allen
Boarderline hall of famer - Rasheed Wallace
Great role player - Glen Davis
Great role player - Nate Robinson
Former Allstar - Michael Finley





but feel free to keep boasting about how much help lebron had ... i always enjoy a good self sabotage

:applause:

[AnaheimLakers24]

Lebron is a mental mudget fagggot just like his fna swho are philipino midgets :lol ****en losers

[TheMan]

Rajon Rondo is now a future HOFer? :lol

[ShawkFactory]

the celtics werent just

- future hall of famer Kevin Garnett
- future hall of famer Paul Pierce
- future hall of famer Ray Allen
- future hall of famer Rajon Rondo

they also had

Defensive Stopper - Kendrick Perkins
Defensive legend - Tony Allen
Boarderline hall of famer - Rasheed Wallace
Great role player - Glen Davis
Great role player - Nate Robinson
Former Allstar - Michael Finley





but feel free to keep boasting about how much help lebron had ... i always enjoy a good self sabotage

:applause:
:roll: :roll:

We know you do buddy

[raprap]

1984>>>>> Anything LeBron has or will ever face!!!

Probably the most stacked lineup the Lakers had the entire decade!

Magic
Kareem
Wilkes
McAdoo
Worthy
Scott
Cooper
Rambis
Kupchak

That was a different beast altogether and Bird killed it!
Bird played with a stacked team aswell. :oldlol:

[Bernie Nips]

Larry Bird.

[JohnFreeman]

LeBron would shit on people in the 80s

Old white man defense

[Showtime80']

Better than the "young dumbed down black basketball" being played today!

See how that works!

LeBron would've tasted the hardwood plenty of times in the 1980's with the packed in the paint physical defenses, none of this modern rule altered red carpet towards the basket BS you see today where even low IQ boneheads like Russell Westbrook can become bonafied stars.

Men played in the 80's where top rookies led their teams to immediate turarounds, not the present day wait and see in 3 to 4 year projects you have today!

Magic and Larry were tussling with the NBA's elite for the championship from the first year in the league to their last!

[Showtime80']

The 1984 Lakers were more talented than the 84' Celtics, there is no two ways around that!

Bird just took the Lakers heart in that series, simple as that! LeBron would've been out of his element in the 1984 series, too physical, psycological and just plain nasty in a way modern players can't even begin to understand.

LeBron's biggest rival, the Spurs and Duncan are some of the nicest players and all around teams in NBA history. No intimidation factor going on there whatsoever.

[mr4speed]

nobody... & I do mean nobody without a single exception... seems like a more effective basketball player than Larry Bird since I started watching.

you start breaking it down piece by piece & looking at accolades and all the things we look at you can argue some people were greater but just me sitting down and watching people play?

Larry Bird was the personification of Larry Brown talking about playing the right way.

if I have to start a team around bird or LeBron I would take bird and it wouldn't be some long drawn out decision. It's not that bird is miles better.... there comes a point when there isn't great separation between the greats and both of them are somewhere in that area.... but that doesn't mean it would be a tough choice.

bird was the midpoint between the ass hole ridiculously talented teammate alienating guys like Jordan Kobe and Oscar Robertson who lead by being so great teammates played hard not to disappoint them and the overwhelmingly talented but not as aggressive as you would like guys like LeBron, Dr. J, and magic who fostered chemistry but left a little on the table in terms of taking over games at times.

He could realistically score 50, have 15 assists, have 15 rebounds or whatever you need and while LeBron could accumulate those numbers he has to visibly change his game to do it.

is kind of hard to explain if you weren't around watching him do it but there are times Larry Bird scores 40 and you feel like he has 18. maybe the best in the flow of the game scorer I've ever seen but he had the talent to make it all about himself and prove a point.

Larry Bird was so good that you can't explain it without sounding like you're exaggerating. People start talking like he's a mythical creature or something and people who didn't see him at his best will just never understand.

dude was just starving to win but his aggression almost never translated into taking anything away from his teams ability to perform as a whole.

That is rare.

He's the only player I've ever seen have 50 and agree that he was the worst player on his team that night.

it wasn't oh I had 50 and we lost because nobody helped out. It was I had 50 and I took too much from my teammates.

Larry Bird was every bit as much of an egotistical jerk as guys who get hated on for it like Kobe but he somehow contained that in a game that was every bit as unselfish as Tim Duncan.

He just really didn't make sense.

the guys I will take over him if I had to build a functioning team and go try to win a ring are few and there are people not on it that arguably had better careers.

LeBron is one of them.
Great post and insight into the intangible things a player can bring to his team that cannot be measured by stats. I also saw that 50 point game = a loss vs the Dallas Mavericks and unless you see the game - the description of his play doesn't make sense because it is too easy to get caught up in the numbers.

[LAZERUSS]

Peak Bird, ... career Lebron.

[aj1987]

Because youre a dumbass aj. Thats why youre a bran stan coz you dont know eye test. accolades arent created equal my friend just like there are skillsets more important than the others or else pgs would have equal representation in the top 10 as scorers. But as ive said, youre a dumbass so its no surprise that you think brans defensive shit is more valuable than birds 1 ring advantage. And were not taking into account collusion here yet. If we take that into account, bran becomes several levels below bird that its not even funny anymore my friend
Please stop posting, dude. Otherwise, do it on one account.

Also, your post.... :facepalm I'm 100% sure than you have a sub 60 IQ.