Lebron 2007 Finals vs Lebron 2011 Finals

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2007:

22ppg, 7rpg 7apg....
35% FG, 20% 3PA, 6 TO per game


2011:

18ppg, 7rpg, 7apg
47% FG, 32% 3PA, 60% FT Line

While both performances were catastrophically awful, which performance should be considered worse and why?

[SexSymbol]

Both are horrible and both times bron's teams could easily take the series if he played 10 percent better.

[Black and White]

Did LeBron realistically have a chance in 2007?

The answer is 2011, not even close.

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Did LeBron realistically have a chance in 2007?

The answer is 2011, not even close.

2007 Finals

Game 1
Decided by 9 points

Game 2
Decided by 11 points

Game 3
Decided by 3 points

Game 4
Decided by 1 point

[Lebron23]

Those were Kobe-esque Finals Stats in his first 2 NBA Finals Appearances. But unlike LeBron he played with the Most Dominant Finals Performer in NBA History.

2000 NBA Finals

Shaq- 38 PPG, 17 RPG, 2.5 APG, 2.7 BPG, 61% FG 96/157----6 games
Kobe-16 PPG, 5 RPG, 4 APG, 1.4 BPG, 36% FG%, 33/90----5 games

2001 NBA Finals

Shaq- 33 PPG, 16 RPG, 5 APG, 3.5 BPG, 63/110 57% FG-----5 games
Kobe- 24 PPG, 8 RPG, 6 APG, 1.4 BPG, 44/106 41% FG------5 games

Sad part is they both averaged the same stats in their first 2 trips in the NBA Finals, but LeBron surpassed already Kobe's productions in the NBA Finals.

[SouBeachTalents]

2011 and it's not even close. Stats don't do it justice

[Lebron23]

Kobe is the worst finals performer among the top 10 players of all time.

[brownmamba00]

2007:

22ppg, 7rpg 7apg....
35% FG, 20% 3PA, 6 TO per game


2011:

18ppg, 7rpg, 7apg
47% FG, 32% 3PA, 60% FT Line

While both performances were catastrophically awful, which performance should be considered worse and why?
2011 and it's not even that close

atleast Bron was aggressive in '07 which is evidenced by his 6 TO's a game.

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Kobe is the worst finals performer among the top 10 players of all time.

Thread has nothing to do with Kobe, young grasshopper.

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What makes this such an interesting discussion to me is the fact that in 2007, Lebron came off one of the best individual performances that I can remember in recent history against the Pistons just the series before.

And it's not like the Spurs were some super dominant force during the playoffs either. They were very vulnerable.

[StephHamann]

Kobe is the worst finals performer among the top 10 players of all time.

meltdown

[Lebron23]

What makes this such an interesting discussion to me is the fact that in 2007, Lebron came off one of the best individual performances that I can remember in recent history against the Pistons just the series before.

And it's not like the Spurs were some super dominant force during the playoffs either. They were very vulnerable.


2007 Spurs were a very good team. They just beat a very stacked and talented Suns team in the playoffs.

Although Suns were robbed of an NBA title after Amare and Diaw were suspended.

[BuffaloBill]

2011 was a nightmare. One of the most cringeworthy finals petformances of all time

[kennethgriffin]

2011 is obviously worse. he had a legit shot at a ring if he just accepted wade as the leader


but he pouted and quit/sabotaged the finals by not contributing onpurpose.



thats basically some blacksox scandal type sh*t... rigging a sporting event by manipulating the outcome negatively by purposefully tanking whether it be for gain in money or other value is basically cheating and punishable by a lifetime ban


or atleast it should be.

[Magic 32]

He tried in 2007.

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2007 Spurs were a very good team. They just beat a very stacked and talented Suns team in the playoffs.

Although Suns were robbed of an NBA title after Amare and Diaw were suspended.

Cavs beat a very balanced Pistons team, as well. Let's not forgot that. Neither team had a cakewalk series prior to meeting one another.

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To me, quite honestly, the 35 FG% in the finals makes this much more debatable than some of us want to think. I feel like if any other player in the top 10 shot that kind of % over the course of a series, let alone the finals, then there would be plenty of memes, jokes and endless trolling. Not sure why that standard doesn't apply with that particular performance Lebron had in the 2007 finals.

[SexSymbol]

Kobe is the worst finals performer among the top 10 players of all time.
it's surprising to find out that you don't consider lebron a top 10 player

[SouBeachTalents]

To me, quite honestly, the 35 FG% in the finals makes this much more debatable than some of us want to think. I feel like if any other player in the top 10 shot that kind of % over the course of a series, let alone the finals, then there would be plenty of memes, jokes and endless trolling. Not sure why that standard doesn't apply with that particular performance Lebron had in the 2007 finals.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2000-nba-finals-pacers-vs-lakers.html

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2004-nba-finals-pistons-vs-lakers.html

Shot a fraction better than 35% in two Finals

[Lebron23]

it's surprising to find out that you don't consider lebron a top 10 player

He's a top 8 player of all time.

[Dr Hawk]

I like Lebron, but 2011 was DIRECTLY Lebron's fault. 100%. That should have been the first ring of the big three. It wasn't because Lebron FAILED, and he FAILED HARD.

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http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2000-nba-finals-pacers-vs-lakers.html

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2004-nba-finals-pistons-vs-lakers.html

Shot a fraction better than 35% in two Finals


Not sure how old you are, but using the 2000 Finals is a really bad example. Considering that Jalen Rose admittedly injured Kobe a few minutes within game 2, I'm pretty sure that probably skewed some of those beloved statistics and percentages that you mentioned. It's a miracle that Kobe led that team a few times in the clutch later that series :applause:

[Prime_Shaq]

2011.

[Dresta]

Did LeBron realistically have a chance in 2007?

The answer is 2011, not even close.
Yes, he did - if Lebron had played even average all the games would have been close (bar maybe 1). Not to mention that getting swept like that in the NBA finals is pretty damn embarrassing.

Sill not as bad as the 2011 sulk/sabotage, but pretty damn bad.

[feyki]

2007 . Lebron played good in some 2011 Finals games . His every games were terrible at 2007 finals .

[Straight_Ballin]

He's a top 8 player of all time.

He could have been, but the collusion and finals losses puts him just out of reach of the top 10.

[ScalsFan21]

I like Lebron, but 2011 was DIRECTLY Lebron's fault. 100%. That should have been the first ring of the big three. It wasn't because Lebron FAILED, and he FAILED HARD.

Indeed. The one true stain on his illustrious career.

[Smoke117]

Kobe is the worst finals performer among the top 10 players of all time.

That's not true...since he's not top 10.

[Kvnzhangyay]

He could have been, but the collusion and finals losses puts him just out of reach of the top 10.

Anyone that was old enough to watch the NBA since the 70's has told me Lebron is top 5 all-time.

It seems young people these days rank Lebron worse than people they've never even saw play :roll:

[24-Inch_Chrome]

2011.

'07 Cavs were outclassed. Bron didn't play well but SA was a better team.

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2011.

'07 Cavs were outclassed. Bron didn't play well but SA was a better team.


Lol.

38 year old kobe not shooting well + turnovers = "he's trash. He's not a great player"

22 year old Lebron not shooting well + turnovers = "he was outmatched. No biggie".


:lol :lol :lol

This board is hilarious. So easy to pick apart arguments.

[SexSymbol]

He's a top 8 player of all time.
joke of the year candidate.

[Straight_Ballin]

Anyone that was old enough to watch the NBA since the 70's has told me Lebron is top 5 all-time.

It seems young people these days rank Lebron worse than people they've never even saw play :roll:

Might want to speak to some older people that don't live in Cleveland......
I've heard the exact opposite.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Lol.

38 year old kobe not shooting well + turnovers = "he's trash. He's not a great player"

22 year old Lebron not shooting well + turnovers = "he was outmatched. No biggie".


:lol :lol :lol

This board is hilarious. So easy to pick apart arguments.
Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit.

2011.

'07 Cavs were outclassed. Bron didn't play well but SA was a better team.
Unless you're here to argue that the 2007 Cavs were a better team than the 2007 Spurs, you can **** right off. Bron played poorly. No denying that. But SA was a better team.

Go ahead, pick that apart. :rolleyes:

[warriorfan]

Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit.

Unless you're here to argue that the 2007 Cavs were a better team than the 2007 Spurs, you can **** right off. Bron played poorly. No denying that. But SA was a better team.

Go ahead, pick that apart. :rolleyes:

So no one has ever been able to beat a better team before?




:yaohappy:




THe games were close, LeBron played poor.

If LeBron stepped it up just a little bit they could of won.

These are the facts.

Live with them.

[Straight_Ballin]

So no one has ever been able to beat a better team before?




:yaohappy:




THe games were close, LeBron played poor.

If LeBron stepped it up just a little bit they could of won.

These are the facts.

Live with them.

He can't because then he has to admit that if Lebron did enough, then his team would have won.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Did I say that a worse team has never been able to beat a better one? No. Unless you're going to argue that a) LeBron didn't play poorly or b) Cleveland was a better team than SA, there is nothing that I said to take issue with.

If you're looking to start some kind of an argument, look elsewhere. I made two points. Both are accurate. That's all I have said and all that I will say.

[warriorfan]

He can't because then he has to admit that if Lebron did enough, then his team would have won.

lebron fans will excuse a loss even if the opposing team is even slightly better


lebron is only expected to whip on lesser opponents


what a champion


:facepalm

[Straight_Ballin]

lebron fans will excuse a loss even if the opposing team is even slightly better


lebron is only expected to whip on lesser opponents


what a champion


:facepalm

Honestly if you are going to collude and CHOOSE on who your teammates are going to be after hopping teams twice, and you wind up with a supporting cast good enough to get you to the finals 5 times in a row, you damn well better have more than 2/5 to show for it. What other players on the top 10 list left their 50+ win teams twice to play for an even more stacked team?

"but... but... but... he's more mature now!"
"he didn't know any better back then!"

Excuses excuses. That's all his stans ever give for this guy.

[AnaheimLakers24]

Both are pathetic embarrassing performences.
top 2 worst series ever by a nba player. No surprise it was accomplished by this gay bitc.h

Joke of a player.
2/6

[SouBeachTalents]

Both are pathetic embarrassing performences.
top 2 worst series ever by a nba player. No surprise it was accomplished by this gay bitc.h

Joke of a player.
2/6

Kobe's '00 & '04 Finals were just as bad

[Kvnzhangyay]

Might want to speak to some older people that don't live in Cleveland......
I've heard the exact opposite.

I used to volunteer at a retirement home in the Bay (Bae) Area before I moved full time to ny

[VIP2000]

The 2011 finals was worse mainly because if LeBron played up to standards, the Heat could have realistically won.

LeBron didn't play well in 2007, but his team was severely overmatched, not to mention he was being guarded by an all-time GOAT defender (Bowen). Even if he did play well, the Spurs would have just focused on shutting everyone else down. It's not like the rest of the Cavs squad (Big Z, Hughes, Gooden, Vujacic) played well in spite of LeBron.

If the Cavs actually beat the championship-experienced Spurs with Poppovich as coachin 07, it would have been one of the biggest upsets in NBA history.

[Showtime2001]

Kobe is the worst finals performer among the top 10 players of all time.
Meltdown.

2011 LeBron is the worst finals performer of all time.