If Lebron retires with two rings

[zoom17]

Where would he rank all time?

[lilteapot]

#8 at least

[Fire Colangelo]

7-10 depending on your preferences.

[AirBonner]

Probably higher than Kobe

[tmacattack33]

Depends on how he well he plays from today until his retirement. LOL.

So probably anywhere from 5 (stays a super-star for 4 more years, and then an all-star for 5 more years after that, but no rings...which would mean he has perfect health and transitions perfectly to full time PF as he slow down...which will be pretty hard to do) to 12 (retires tomorrow)

[outbreak]

10-12

[zeerghit]

12/17 kobe 17/21at least for me

[K Xerxes]

Unless he plays spectacularly well in title runs, it doesn't really matter to me how many he wins. I've seen his prime and peak years, and I think that 10 or 11 spot along with Kobe is the best ranking for him.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

10-12 assuming that he regresses each year, like most players do exiting their prime.

[Smook B]

8-12 Range.

[Fire Colangelo]

Unless he plays spectacularly well in title runs, it doesn't really matter to me how many he wins. I've seen his prime and peak years, and I think that 10 or 11 spot along with Kobe is the best ranking for him.

Define... Spectacularly well?

Say if he averages 25/5/5 on route to 1 or 2 more rings... You don't move him up ahead? I mean, I wouldn't classify 25/5/5 as spectacular but it's pretty damn good.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

8-12 Range.
Agree with this. He'll probably stay at #9 for me.

[Harison]

Unless he plays spectacularly well in title runs, it doesn't really matter to me how many he wins. I've seen his prime and peak years, and I think that 10 or 11 spot along with Kobe is the best ranking for him.
+1

[K Xerxes]

Define... Spectacularly well?

Say if he averages 25/5/5 on route to 1 or 2 more rings... You don't move him up ahead? I mean, I wouldn't classify 25/5/5 as spectacular but it's pretty damn good.

Put it this way, had Love and Kyrie been fit in the finals, they may have ended up winning the whole thing with Bron putting up maybe 25-7-7 or whatever. Does that mean he's a better player than what actually happened when Love and Kyrie went down and he put up 40 point triple doubles on 40% shooting in a loss? No. That's purely down to circumstance. Similarly, is he worse if Allen doesn't hit that season saving three?

I've seen Lebron play for more than a decade now. I have a good idea how good he is. It was of course important that he won to prove that he could get over that hurdle, and that 2012 run was his greatest accomplishment, but nothing I see from now on as he enters his decline is likely to change my view on him as a basketball player. To me he is definitely not better than Jordan, Shaq, Hakeem, Duncan (players I've seen) and I don't believe he's better than Wilt, Russell, Kareem, Bird and Magic from what I've seen and read of them.

[dubeta]

. To me he is definitely not better than Jordan, Shaq, Hakeem, Duncan (players I've seen) and I don't believe he's better than Wilt, Russell, Kareem, Bird and Magic from what I've seen and read of them.


So if not rings, how exactly do you rank players??

[BasedTom]

So if not rings, how exactly do you rank players??
Eye test, you child.

[Nash]

Even if he doesn't win more championships he will still go down with 2 rings, 2 fmvp's, 4 mvps, maybe 2 or 3rd in all time scoring, #1 in all time scoring in playoffs.

[90sgoat]

If he doesn't win anymore rings, then I simply can't put him in the top 10.

In fact, if he doesn't win anymore rings, then I would say he belongs with Malone, Barkley, those guys.

[pauk]

Considering its two championship runs as the alpha/fmvp/mvp/best player in the league during one of the GOAT peaks (both individual talent wise & accolades wise) and ofcourse four mvps and so on and so on...... and considering he by the time he retires will most likely end up #3, #2 or maybe even #1 on the all-time scoring list and be the first non-PG in NBA history to get inside top 10 all-time assist list (he is already the first non-PG to be top 20-25 anyways right now anyways, all above are PGs)... and will have many more all-nba selections and some more all-defensive selections and so on.... perhaps more conference championships/epic finals appearances-performances going his usual 1(scrub casts) vs 11(stacked casts) aswell...

...lets just say he will be ranked higher than he is right now.

[guy]

Obviously it depends on how he plays, but if he doesn't win another I'm going to assume its cause he stayed ball dominant, didn't respect his coach enough, exercised his power too much to his own team's detriment, choked, someone else was better, or a combination of these things. And if that's the case, I'd say he's probably borderline top 10, and it wouldn't surprise me if someone like Curry surpassed him at some point (I don't think it would be crazy for him to keep up his current level for another 4-5 years and win another 2-3 rings in that span).

I rank players based on who I would want to build around with the objective of winning titles, with some accounting for era. As far as talent goes, he's easily top 5. But he just seems to get in his own way way too much. His playing style and need for control makes it relatively hard to actually have an elite GM and coach i.e. people that would probably know better then Lebron, implement a vision of a great team built around Lebron. I'd much rather have Duncan despite arguably not being nearly as talented or individually dominant as Lebron.

[Black and White]

Depends on how he plays, context will be huge, will he win another MVP award?

I reckon anywhere from 8-12 all-time.

[GrapeApe]

Considering its two championship runs as the alpha/fmvp/mvp/best player in the league during one of the GOAT peaks (both individual talent wise & accolades wise) and ofcourse four mvps and so on and so on...... and considering he by the time he retires will most likely end up #3, #2 or maybe even #1 on the all-time scoring list and be the first non-PG in NBA history to get inside top 10 all-time assist list (he is already the first non-PG to be top 20-25 anyways right now anyways, all above are PGs)... and will have many more all-nba selections and some more all-defensive selections and so on.... perhaps more conference championships/epic finals appearances-performances going his usual 1(scrub casts) vs 11(stacked casts) aswell...

...lets just say he will be ranked higher than he is right now.

What? :oldlol:

He's only had "scrub casts" in 2 of his 6 finals appearances. How epic was his finals performance in 2011? If you want to call the 2014 Heat a scrub cast because they under performed in the finals, fine, but 2011 essentially cancels that out.

[Bandito]

Unless he plays spectacularly well in title runs, it doesn't really matter to me how many he wins. I've seen his prime and peak years, and I think that 10 or 11 spot along with Kobe is the best ranking for him.
I agree with this. Pick who you want at 10 though, I think both are interchangeable but looking at resume Lebron should be 10 as he has 4 MVP's. But if someone looked at them play that spot #10 could be any of them.

[Bandito]

Considering its two championship runs as the alpha/fmvp/mvp/best player in the league during one of the GOAT peaks (both individual talent wise & accolades wise) and ofcourse four mvps and so on and so on...... and considering he by the time he retires will most likely end up #3, #2 or maybe even #1 on the all-time scoring list and be the first non-PG in NBA history to get inside top 10 all-time assist list (he is already the first non-PG to be top 20-25 anyways right now anyways, all above are PGs)... and will have many more all-nba selections and some more all-defensive selections and so on.... perhaps more conference championships/epic finals appearances-performances going his usual 1(scrub casts) vs 11(stacked casts) aswell...

...lets just say he will be ranked higher than he is right now.
But 2011 happened though...he didn't just lose or chucked to lose, he was mentally and physically owned by the Mavs, specially 6'2'' Jason Terry.

[coin24]

Classic pauk:lol

From his quitting on cavs, to 2011, all his choking, fleeing back when the cavs had a better roster and now being a known coach killer.. Not to mention 2/6.. That's a lot of shit stains on ones resume

No more rings, no top 10. That's a winners club

[Black and White]

Considering its two championship runs as the alpha/fmvp/mvp/best player in the league during one of the GOAT peaks (both individual talent wise & accolades wise) and ofcourse four mvps and so on and so on...... and considering he by the time he retires will most likely end up #3, #2 or maybe even #1 on the all-time scoring list and be the first non-PG in NBA history to get inside top 10 all-time assist list (he is already the first non-PG to be top 20-25 anyways right now anyways, all above are PGs)... and will have many more all-nba selections and some more all-defensive selections and so on.... perhaps more conference championships/epic finals appearances-performances going his usual 1(scrub casts) vs 11(stacked casts) aswell...

...lets just say he will be ranked higher than he is right now.

I usually ignore your posts, but I'm negging you for this.

[Hey Yo]

But 2011 happened though...he didn't just lose or chucked to lose, he was mentally and physically owned by the Mavs, specially 6'2'' Jason Terry.
How was he owned by Terry?

You suggesting Jet was LeBron's primary defensive assignment for the entire series?

Who was Wade and Bibby guarding?

[raprap]

#6 max

[COnDEMnED]

Where would he rank all time?
Somewhere below Wade and people like James Worthy. Between top 100-200.