Dwyane Wade: "I never thought I'd be Top 100 all time in the NBA" (Q&A)

[Wade's Rings]

It's a long read.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14695748/dwyane-wade-place-nba-history

Scoop: Now I know you don't like putting numbers on things, but who would you say are the greatest players to ever play this game?

Wade: Well, automatically I'm going to say MJ (Michael Jordan), not because that's what the rest of the world thinks or because that's the era I grew up in but because what he did was unprecedented from a basketball standpoint. So he's first.

But this is where for me it gets tricky. A lot of my basketball knowledge starts in the Jordan era. A lot of it before -- Larry Bird, Magic Johnson -- I mean, I look at them and I know what they did and I got a chance to watch and see a little bit of what they did, but I didn't get a chance to really live it, you know? The Bill Russells, the Wilt Chamberlains. So it's so hard for players to name those players that are the best when we're really just going off highlights, going off statistical numbers, going off what people say.

In a sense, I came up watching MJ, but when he got older I was watching Allen Iverson, Kobe Bryant, Tracy McGrady and those guys. And you kinda lean on the players you watched and who you saw with your own two eyes.

Scoop: Do you feel that you belong in those types of conversations?

Wade: You know what ... yes. Now what conversation, I don't know. Do I feel I belong in the Michael Jordan conversation? Hell no! Maybe when I'm done with my career I can look at it as a whole and see, but I'm not going to say right now that I belong in the Jordan, Magic Johnson and those guys conversation.

But the players I grew up watching, the Iversons, the McGradys, those players that I grew up respecting so much and patterning my game after? Yeah, I belong in the conversation with those guys.

Scoop: Some would argue that had injuries not taken a toll on you, that you had a chance to be in that Jordan conversation. Maybe.

Wade: I'll say this: No one at the time had seen anyone do at my size what I was able to do in this game. Now Iverson did from the standpoint that he was smaller and he was a scorer, but if we are talking about a player that is able to score, able to block shots, able to pass, dribble, everything I've been able to do, you know, dunk on anybody like I'm 6-9, all of those things, no one was able to do that.

Now you see Russell Westbrook, who is 6-4 doing it. Then we saw Derrick Rose, when he was healthy doing it at 6-3. You start seeing these guys come in at my height and you start saying, "Wow what these guys are doing is amazing." But wasn't anyone doing that before me.

Scoop: You played like the dude you just passed on the all-time scoring list, Bernard King, who I think should be ranked maybe up there with you on this all-time list.

Wade: See, I've never seen Bernard play! I've seen highlights and heard all of the stories, but I don't even know how his game was. I knew he was a scorer, but I don't know everything that he did on the court.

Scoop: Just talk to Isiah (Thomas) about him. He'll tell you.

Wade: Now there's someone that doesn't get enough credit. Where is he on the list? I have so much respect for him. When people ask me about Chicago, I'm always going to say Isiah is the best player to ever come out of Chicago. I'm always going to say that.

He and I have had conversations and he'll say, "D-Wade, you are the best to ever come out," and I'll always disagree. Obviously there's a respect factor, but I know I wouldn't be where I'm at without Isiah Thomas, but people forget how great Isiah was. I mean, just how great he really, really was. He was ridiculous. Unbelievable.

Scoop: I think I'm going to have to agree. No disrespect to you at all, but Zeke was amazing. Still holds the title as best ever out of Chi. Six more inches and he'd been in the Magic/Bird/Michael conversation.

Wade: And he only played like 11 years, right? He got injured pretty early. [Editor's note: Isiah played 13 years.]

Scoop: I'm glad you mentioned that, I want to get back to that and you. What impact do you feel your injuries have had on your career and the player you had the possibility of becoming?

Wade: Injuries just take away from your game. Like when you have multiple injuries like I have, they take away from what people will say made you special. I've had three knee surgeries, I've had shoulder surgery. Knee surgeries take away from your explosiveness and many other things.

Scoop: Does that bother you? Does it eat at you? Are you sometimes saying, "Damn, if I hadn't had this injury I could have ..."

Wade: Oh man, hell yeah! I honestly do. I looked at Michael Jordan's career and LeBron's career. Now Kobe's career is still amazing with all of the injuries he's had, but I look at Jordan and LeBron and I'm like, they didn't have to deal with many injuries.

And if you have the talent like those guys have, when you don't have to deal with any major injury, you can do amazing things. So yeah, I look at it like: If I didn't have those injuries, if I was equally as healthy throughout my career as say LeBron's been, my career would probably be equally as great.

But because of injuries -- which a lot of players have, Tracy McGrady for one; and no one knows what would have happened with Derrick Rose had he not gotten injured; I mean, Russell Westbrook may be the only one that got injured the way that he did and came back like he never got hurt -- I'll never know. But 85 percent of the league aren't going to be healthy their whole career, so you just look at it as some players just get lucky.

Scoop: Even with the injuries, looking back, any regrets? Would you change anything about how your career played out?

Wade: Naw, man. My career, I didn't plan any of this. This has surpassed any of my wildest dreams of what I thought my basketball career would be like when I picked up that basketball at the age of 5. Everything is a cherry on top with whipped cream. I'm literally living a dream so I can't be mad at anything that's happened because I didn't expect anything to be close to this.

Scoop: It's funny how in your mind when you are growing up you always say that you want to be the best, then when it happens to happen to you it's still unexpected. It's still surprising.

Wade: Yeah! Like I look at my sons now and my nephew and I remember being their age, I remember being 14 and wanting to be in the NBA and be the best player or whatever, and I said that.

Now I look at them and they want to be what I've become. Their goal in life in basketball is to be one of the greats! I've become one of those! It's crazy!

Scoop: What's crazy is how you put all of the work in for it to happen, to be recognized and looked at as one of the greatest, and when it happens it's like it's not supposed to happen. To the point where you almost don't believe it.

Wade: Yeah. It's kinda like for me ... it's different from LeBron. Everybody knew LeBron had it! He had it, it was just about him doing it. No one knew I had it. I wasn't on the radar to have it. I wasn't born 6-9, 260 (pounds), gifted, you know what I mean? No one looked at me and said, "This guy has it." So for me it's still crazy the things that have happened.

I mean, whenever the rankings come out, wherever I'm at, understand I never thought I'd be Top 100 all time in the NBA. That's something I never dreamed of right then. So I've surpassed whatever number I'm going to be placed at.

You know, I hear some fans of mine getting mad because they've seen me on (other) lists, ranked No. 3 or No. 4 or fifth in the best shooting guards all time. And I'm like, "Do you all understand what number they said that I am?"

Scoop: You mentioned LeBron, in the context of all of us knowing that he was "it" early on. But to me it has to be hard as hell to get labeled great at such an early age and not mess that up. I wonder, if it's harder to not mess that up, to live up to and pass those expectations or come up the way you did, grinding and surpass expectations that weren't even there?

Wade: That's a great question. Man. You know what that's like? That's like a debate over who's the best rapper: 2Pac or Biggie? I don't think anyone will ever have the answer to that because you can make arguments both ways. I'm telling you, that can be a barbershop conversation. That can be an argument all day.

Scoop: I'm looking at Kobe and seeing how he's been respected but never really loved in his career until now. Do you think about how your career is going to end?

Wade: I mean, I don't think it's going to end like his. I don't think it's gonna be a lovefest around the league. But I think when it's all said and done, and I've always said this, I think I will be appreciated more once I'm not playing.

You know what, let me tell you, now that I'm 34 and I'm healthy now for the first time in a while, I think people watching me go through a couple of injury-plagued seasons and watching me be healthy, I think they'll appreciate the player I was and appreciate the player that I am right now. I am seeing a little bit more love and appreciation now that they've seen the difference of when I was in my prime and healthy and now being healthy again and able to do some of the things that they've come to love from a different perspective.

Bolded the parts I found interesting, talking about if he never got injured, mike comparisons, etc.

[Wade's Rings]

(continued)

Scoop: But you don't have an end game in mind. Wait, do you?

Wade: Yes, I have an end game in mind. I do have one.

Scoop: Sharing it or not sharing?

Wade: Not sharing, of course. But I think you have to plan for the end. You have to plan for it. I mean, at this point, I would be a fool not to plan for a possible ending. Who knows if it's going to be right or wrong, but I have to plan for whatever is going to be the possibility of when I feel that I'm ready to walk away from this game. In a perfect world, I'm able to walk out of the door and say this is it for me and I'm not pushed out because of injuries or anything like that. In a perfect world, I can walk off in the end.

[dubeta]

D-Fraud with the excuses :roll: :roll:

[WadeStan]

A mix of humility, respect for the greats, and confidence in his own legacy. Great stuff. :applause:

[plowking]

I know D Wade is being nice about it all, but can anyone actually give me the reason why Isiah is ranked higher than him on the all time lists?

[97 bulls]

I know D Wade is being nice about it all, but can anyone actually give me the reason why Isiah is ranked higher than him on the all time lists?
Lol. Because people look at player CAREER and not 3 games in a series and one season.

[catch24]

Lol. Because people look at player CAREER and not 3 games in a series and one season.

You're not talking about Wade, right?

Because dude was probably better than Isiah ever was in 2005, 2006, 2009, 2010 and 2011.

That's a handful of seasons, not including the playoffs.

[RoseCity07]

Wade at his best was a better player than Kobe.

[GrapeApe]

I know D Wade is being nice about it all, but can anyone actually give me the reason why Isiah is ranked higher than him on the all time lists?

There's no reason, and frankly it's ridiculous.

I don't feel like getting too deeply into it right now, but I'll throw this out there. Isiah's career best PER is nearly 3 points lower than Wade's career average. Isiah's career best playoff PER is equal to Wade's career playoff average. Isiah's best season is a below average season for Wade, and Isiah's best playoff run is comparable to what Wade has done in 150+ career playoff games.

[Wade's Rings]

You're not talking about Wade, right?

Because dude was probably better than Isiah ever was in 2005, 2006, 2009, 2010 and 2011.

That's a handful of seasons, not including the playoffs.

That guy is a dumbass.

[catch24]

Wade at his best was a better player than Kobe.

Maybe, but the debate was so close that Isiah by default shouldn't even be mentioned.

And I have a lot of respect for what he and the Pistons did.

[plowking]

Lol. Because people look at player CAREER and not 3 games in a series and one season.

Exactly. So again, why?

[97 bulls]

[QUOTE=catch24]You're not talking about Wade, right?

Because dude was probably better than Isiah ever was in 2005, 2006, 2009, 2010 and 2011.

That's a handful of seasons, not including the I'd agree if we're comparing Thomas only

[Akhenaten]

You're not talking about Wade, right?

Because dude was probably better than Isiah ever was in 2005, 2006, 2009, 2010 and 2011.

That's a handful of seasons, not including the playoffs.

Dude genuinely believes pippen is a greater/better player than Magic Johnson, the guy is a loon.

[tsforthrees]

Great interview between an all time great and a poser. Much respect to D Wade. However, I've always felt like Scoop Jackson is a ****ing joke. Dude is nothing more than a groupie. Doubt many of you will get this reference but he's the Jason Tate of basketball. Just a nut hugger who thinks he's a part of all of it.

[G-Funk]

Wade at his best was a better player than Kobe.
Which lasted longer than Kim's first marriage. It's only impressive when mantain it for 5-10 years, rather than a merely 60 games.

[97 bulls]

Dude genuinely believes pippen is a greater/better player than Magic Johnson, the guy is a loon.
I said that?

[nathanjizzle]

wade is one of the most underrated players of all time. he has 3 championships and people act like he has 1 fluke one that everyone forgot about. all of you can go to hell.

[Hey Yo]

Wade: I'll say this: No one at the time had seen anyone do at my size what I was able to do in this game. Now Iverson did from the standpoint that he was smaller and he was a scorer, but if we are talking about a player that is able to score, able to block shots, able to pass, dribble, everything I've been able to do, you know, dunk on anybody like I'm 6-9, all of those things, no one was able to do that.

If LeBron said the above, this would be a 150 post thread by now.... saying how full of himself he is.

but since Wade isn't a threat to Jordan, Wade gets a pass

[TheBigVeto]

Dwhistle is overrated.
Then again the interviewer is also a dumbass.

[97 bulls]

wade is one of the most underrated players of all time. he has 3 championships and people act like he has 1 fluke one that everyone forgot about. all of you can go to hell.
Underrated? He's ranked in the top 100 all-time. Considering that thousands of players have played in the NBA, that's in the top 5 percent historically.

[Hey Yo]

Wade is considered a slasher who got to the rim at will and got/get's praised for doing so. (especially in his first finals against Dallas)

Yet..... James is going to the rim more often lately, and scoring, yet he gets ridiculed for doing so and should be a better mid-range jump shooter.

LOL @ the hypocrisy

[BasedTom]

Wade: I'll say this: No one at the time had seen anyone do at my size what I was able to do in this game. Now Iverson did from the standpoint that he was smaller and he was a scorer, but if we are talking about a player that is able to score, able to block shots, able to pass, dribble, everything I've been able to do, you know, dunk on anybody like I'm 6-9, all of those things, no one was able to do that.

If LeBron said the above, this would be a 150 post thread by now.... saying how full of himself he is.

but since Wade isn't a threat to Jordan, Wade gets a pass
and Lebron is a threat to Jordan now?

Everyone knows Lebron has a hell of a basketball build... Don't you remember when Kobe stans were accusing him of basically relying entirely on physically abusing opponents with brute force (shitty threads about "If Kobe had Lebron's body, etc)

But nah, in typical insecure dickrider fashion you bring up Lebron in a thread which has very little to do with him, other than Wade acknowledging that everyone knew Lebron would be great from day one.

[ArbitraryWater]

Underrated? He's ranked in the top 100 all-time. Considering that thousands of players have played in the NBA, that's in the top 5 percent historically.

what terrible reasoning.. you're full of shit

[RoseCity07]

Which lasted longer than Kim's first marriage. It's only impressive when mantain it for 5-10 years, rather than a merely 60 games.

Injuries are outside of his control. He didn't just play well. He won a title in his 3rd season and carried Miami. That and what Dirk did in 2011 are the two greatest playoff performances I've ever seen.

[houston]

great interveiw

[TheMarkMadsen]

Which lasted longer than Kim's first marriage. It's only impressive when mantain it for 5-10 years, rather than a merely 60 games.

the funny thing is that the same people who say shit like that are the same people who ridicule anybody for saying Curry is currently playing as good or better than Jordan or whoever else for the reason of "let's see if he can maintain this for years"


hypocritical idiots

[Hey Yo]

and Lebron is a threat to Jordan now?

Everyone knows Lebron has a hell of a basketball build... Don't you remember when Kobe stans were accusing him of basically relying entirely on physically abusing opponents with brute force (shitty threads about "If Kobe had Lebron's body, etc)

But nah, in typical insecure dickrider fashion you bring up Lebron in a thread which has very little to do with him, other than Wade acknowledging that everyone knew Lebron would be great from day one.
Wade is praising himself by saying "no player has ever played like me ....my style has never been seen before"

If James claimed the above, it would cause a huge uproar and he'd be looked as a huge douche bag......FACT!!

[97 bulls]

what terrible reasoning.. you're full of shit
What???!!!! Why is this terrible reasoning?. This is why lists like these are impossible to fairly assess. This is all opinion. Maybe Thomas beating teams led by Bird, Magic, and Jordan holds a lot of weight. Show me an inconsistency. And I'd agree. But an opinion. On something like this? Wade got it right. He's just proud and humbled to be on that list.

[dubeta]

Wade is praising himself by saying "no player has ever played like me ....my style has never been seen before"

If James claimed the above, it would cause a huge uproar and he'd be looked as a huge douche bag......FACT!!

:applause:

[tpols]

Wade is praising himself by saying "no player has ever played like me ....my style has never been seen before"

If James claimed the above, it would cause a huge uproar and he'd be looked as a huge douche bag......FACT!!

What the fk is he talking about anyway... stating that he was the only all around player @ 6'3, which is factually incorrect, and implying being that height is some big disadvantage? The guy had a monster 6'10 wing span and exceptional athleticism yet he says it like it was a disadvantage..


like he was Iverson lol, who was 160 lbs playing in a league of giants, Wade was 215+ and taller. Stupid comments there from duwayne

[Wade's Rings]

Injuries are outside of his control. He didn't just play well. He won a title in his 3rd season and carried Miami. That and what Dirk did in 2011 are the two greatest playoff performances I've ever seen.

Are you talking about whole Playoff Runs or specific series?

[dubeta]

lol could you imagine LeBron gave an interview like this:

"I was underrated my entire career, nobody at my size ever did what I did before. I was a meek 6'7 kid with average athleticism, and had to maximize my skills to make up for my physical deficiencies"




ISH would have killed LeBron for saying that, but somehow Wade gets a pass??? :lol :lol

[Akhenaten]

What the fk is he talking about anyway... stating that he was the only all around player @ 6'3, which is factually incorrect, and implying being that height is some big disadvantage? The guy had a monster 6'10 wing span and exceptional athleticism yet he says it like it was a disadvantage..


like he was Iverson lol, who was 160 lbs playing in a league of giants, Wade was 215+ and taller. Stupid comments there from duwayne

That's not at all what he said, he enumerated a VERY specific set of skills

A 6'4 player who could avg a block a game along with 8 asts and 30 ppg on 50% FG was and still is unprecedented. There have been many other guards with large wingspans and tremendous athleticism and none ever had the combination of skills at such a prolific level.

Name me another guard player outside of Jordan that lead the league in scoring while avg over 1 block. 2 steals AND 8 assists. He elucidated his point very well, you're an abject cretin if you found what he said to be "stupid".

Either that or you just on some goofy hating shit.

[tpols]

That's not at all what he said, he enumerated a VERY specific set of skills

A 6'4 player who could avg a block a game along with 8 asts and 30 ppg on 50% FG was and still is unprecedented. There have been many other guards with large wingspans and tremendous athleticism and none ever had the combination of skills at such a prolific level.

Name me another guard player outside of Jordan that lead the league in scoring while avg over 1 block. 2 steals AND 8 assists. He elucidated his point very well, you're an abject cretin if found what he said to be "stupid".

Either that or you just on some goofy hating shit.

He named a bunch of criteria he happened to be good at? Could just as easily take a guy like jerry west, who was less physically gifted than dwayne, yet did similar stuff. Wade has blocks, west could shoot. So I guess he could've said I'm the only guy like me who could score shoot pass and defend like I did.. just contrived an untrue especially for Wade given the amount of nba history that came before him. Wade wasn't a generational talent or specimen.. the man never even won an mvp and youre sitting here acting like anything he did has never been done?

[plowking]

He named a bunch of criteria he happened to be good at? Could just as easily take a guy like jerry west, who was less physically gifted than dwayne, yet did similar stuff. Wade has blocks, west could shoot. So I guess he could've said I'm the only guy like me who could score shoot pass and defend like I did.. just contrived an untrue especially for Wade given the amount of nba history that came before him. Wade wasn't a generational talent or specimen.. the man never even won an mvp and youre sitting here acting like anything he did has never been done?

Too f*cking rich coming from a Kobe stan. Holy shit. :oldlol:

Clearly shooting and blocking is equally impressive at 6'4, amirite guys, duh?

[aquaadverse]

He named a bunch of criteria he happened to be good at? Could just as easily take a guy like jerry west, who was less physically gifted than dwayne, yet did similar stuff. Wade has blocks, west could shoot. So I guess he could've said I'm the only guy like me who could score shoot pass and defend like I did.. just contrived an untrue especially for Wade given the amount of nba history that came before him. Wade wasn't a generational talent or specimen.. the man never even won an mvp and youre sitting here acting like anything he did has never been done?

MVP...? You're just a hater. Yep Jerry West has 3 rings, a scoring title etc...

[SpaceJam]

09 MVP should have been Wade's

[dubeta]

09 MVP should have been Wade's

Player Efficiency Rating 2008-2009

LeBron 31.76

Wade 30.46




GTFO :roll: :roll:

[tpols]

Too f*cking rich coming from a Kobe stan. Holy shit. :oldlol:


huh? You do know.. kobe has an MVP right?

[dubeta]

huh? You do know.. kobe has an MVP right?

You do know it was a close race for the 2008 MVP


If Kobe didnt win in that year (very likely), do we stop comparing Kobe to anyone who's ever had an MVP?? :oldlol:


Barkley, Malone >> Kobe in that case

[tpols]

You do know it was a close race for the 2008 MVP


If Kobe didnt win in that year (very likely), do we stop comparing Kobe to anyone who's ever had an MVP?? :oldlol:


Barkley, Malone >> Kobe in that case

It was very likely, that Kobe wouldn't win an award that he won. There was no bail out shot or anything.. he won it, an individual award, but it was very likely he would've lost?

Fk off.

Besides I never said kobe was the first to do anything. The point wasn't to use MVPs as a measuring stick, rather propose a question, has there ever been a generational player talent "never been done before" etc that couldn't win a single MVP award? I'm genuinely curious.

[TheNaturalWR]

One of the things I hate most about Wade. Dude is way too humble and sounds like a bitch sometimes. It's like he doesn't realize just how ****ing good he was.

[Fire Colangelo]

I know D Wade is being nice about it all, but can anyone actually give me the reason why Isiah is ranked higher than him on the all time lists?

He isnt.

Isiah Thomas is not a better basketball than Dwyane Wade, period. Wade is approaching Isiah in longevity, and he was an equally good if not better (leaning towards the latter) in his prime/peak as well as the hardware to back it up.

No sane person would take Isiah over Wade, none.

[plowking]

huh? You do know.. kobe has an MVP right?

I doubt anyone on here would have to search more than 5 minutes to find you calling it a useless media award when Bron and Kobe are being compared. :oldlol:

That is the irony buddy. :oldlol:

[Akhenaten]

. . the man never even won an mvp and youre sitting here acting like anything he did has never been done?

Nash got two, what's your point? Drose got one, at his very best he's not 2/3 the player prime/peak Wade is, ditto with Iverson (who I LOVE btw, but I digress)

what he did in 09 has never been done before or since, that season was unprecedented. Not that that's the criteria for what makes a guy a generational talent anyway, I'm sure you dont consider Tiny Archibald a generational talent.

Wade is absolutely a generational talent though, that's not even up for discussion, all you have to do is have watched the games. I'm not a huge numbers guy but this dude has the numbers AND the eye test.

How many perimetre players have lead the league in scoring and finished at least 3rd in DPOY? LeBRAWN is unanimously considered a generational talent and Wade had virtually identical stats through the first 8 seasons of their career.

You talking about Wade like he's just some dude:biggums:
the level of disrespect

[tpols]

I doubt anyone on here would have to search more than 5 minutes to find you calling it a useless media award when Bron and Kobe are being compared. :oldlol:

That is the irony buddy. :oldlol:

Difference is I'm not saying kobe was > Wade because of an MVP. I simply made a statement.. how can a guy missing that accolade in its entirety be what he claims himself to be. You seem insecure about this based on the smilies.

[plowking]

I
Besides I never said kobe was the first to do anything. The point wasn't to use MVPs as a measuring stick, rather propose a question, has there ever been a generational player talent "never been done before" etc that couldn't win a single MVP award? I'm genuinely curious.

Patrick Ewing, Dwyane Wade, Jerry West, etc.

These are all generational talents that never won an MVP.

[dubeta]

Nash got two, what's your point? Drose got one, at his very best he's not 2/3 the player prime/peak Wade is, ditto with Iverson (who I LOVE btw, but I digress)

what he did in 09 has never been done before or since, that season was unprecedented. Not that that's the criteria for what makes a guy a generational talent anyway, I'm sure you dont consider Tiny Archibald a generational talent.

Wade is absolutely a generational talent though, that's not even up for discussion, all you have to do is have watched the games. I'm not a huge numbers guy but this dude has the numbers AND the eye test.

How many perimetre players have lead the league in scoring and finished at least 3rd in DPOY? LeBRAWN is unanimously considered a generational talent and Wade had virtually identical stats through the first 8 seasons of their career.

You talking about Wade like he's just some dude:biggums:
the level of disrespect

No he doesnt, Wade has noticeably worse stats across the board except in blocks

[SouBeachTalents]

No he doesnt, Wade has noticeably worse stats across the board except in blocks

He has much better Finals stats during that time frame though

[plowking]

Difference is I'm not saying kobe was > Wade because of an MVP. I simply made a statement.. how can a guy missing that accolade in its entirety be what he claims himself to be. You seem insecure about this based on the smilies.

You bought an arbitrary requirement out of no where which has nothing to do with what he claimed... What am I supposed to elaborate on?

Same shit if Rodman said no guy did what I did at my size, then you came in here with your stupid MVP talk. It has nothing to do with anything in regards to what is being discussed...

The smilies are actually because I'm laughing at how stupid you are. You probably misinterpreted it due to your stupidity. It is a vicious cycle you really can't get out of.

[tpols]

Wade is absolutely a generational talent though, that's not even up for discussion, all you have to do is have watched the games. I
You talking about Wade like he's just some dude:biggums:
the level of disrespect

We just have different definitions of generational talents then.. shaq is generational, LeBron, jordan, wilt etc. Freaks. Wade is in a group clearly below the generational freaks of his time, but I guess the whole height criteria is the only place he can peg successfully to differentiate himself. I never said he was just some dude.

[dubeta]

He has much better Finals stats during that time frame though

20 FTs/Game does that to anyone

[tpols]

Patrick Ewing, Dwyane Wade, Jerry West, etc.

These are all generational talents that never won an MVP.

West is close.. Ewing is an lol as far as "generational" goes.

Generational implies like.. once in a generation, or for nba's sake we can shorten that to 10 years or so, average career length.. Wade isn't generational and Ewing is nowhere near generational considering there were a handful of centers better than him while he played not even counting other positions.

[ROCSteady]

http://images.sportsline.com/u/photos/basketball/nba/img10013097.jpg

Shoulder Injury

[Akhenaten]

No he doesnt, Wade has noticeably worse stats across the board except in blocks

Wade 04-05 to 10-11 27/7/5 49% 1.8 stl, 1.1 blk (19 FGA)

BRAWN 04-05 to 10-11 29/7/7 49% 1.7 stl, .9 blk (21 FGA)

[dubeta]

Wade 04-05 to 10-11 27/7/5 49% 1.8 stl, 1.1 blk (19 FGA)

BRAWN 04-05 to 10-11 29/7/7 49% 1.7 stl, .9 blk (21 FGA)

dismissed their rookie seasons I see :oldlol:

[Akhenaten]

West is close.. Ewing is an lol as far as "generational" goes.

Generational implies like.. once in a generation, or for nba's sake we can shorten that to 10 years or so, average career length.. Wade isn't generational and Ewing is nowhere near generational considering there were a handful of centers better than him while he played not even counting other positions.

Do you consider kobe generational? i noticed all the guys you listed are physical freaks.

[jongib369]

Any names with an * next to it is adjusted for assists that led to a 3 per game.

PRF= Points+points from assists.

None of the 'totals include FGA or FG%



*Wade 09 PRF- 47.1 FG% .491 (22 FGA)
Blocks- 1.3
Steals-2.2
Rebounds- 5
Fouled-9.8
Free Throws made- 7.5

(Total 1 all. Total 2 without FTA. Total 3 without any free throw data.)
Total 1= 72.9
Total 2=63.1
Total 3=55.6

Isiah 85 PRF-49 -- FG%.458 (17.4 FGA)
Blocks- 0.3
Steals-2.3
Rebounds-4.5
Fouled-6.1
Free Throws made-4.9

(Total 1 all. Total 2 without FTA. Total 3 without any free throw data.
Total 1=67.1
Total 2=61
Total 3=56.1

[Akhenaten]

dismissed their rookie seasons I see :oldlol:

13 FGA to 19 FGA

One guy was allowed to do what he wants (funny the more things change the more they stay the same), the other guy had a governor on him.

My overarching point is if Lebron is considered a unanimous generational talent then what do you consider a guy who was his statistical equal for the lionshare of their primes?

[tpols]

Do you consider kobe generational? i noticed all the guys you listed are physical freaks.

Thats what Wade was.. a physical freak. But a physical freak below that of generational physical freaks simply because it takes a whole lot, like lottery luck just to be at Wades level much less above it. I simply took issue with him downplaying his height like he was at disadvantage to do what he did.. when his game was so predicated on his natural physical gifts, he just seems dishonest and ignorant of all the facets of having a physical advantage.. height is the most overrated component of athleticism especially for a guard.


As far as kobe, he had a generational career, and worked his way from a scrawny mid first round pick to a top 10 player all time.. he was in no way a generational talent or specimen coming up,

[plowking]

West is close.. Ewing is an lol as far as "generational" goes.

Generational implies like.. once in a generation, or for nba's sake we can shorten that to 10 years or so, average career length.. Wade isn't generational and Ewing is nowhere near generational considering there were a handful of centers better than him while he played not even counting other positions.

You clearly don't know much about Ewing then. :oldlol:

Baylor is another you can add to the list.

[catch24]

MVPs are overrated as phuck. Shaq and Kobe both only have 1. Wade has zero... They mean very little, IMO



That's a handful of seasons, not including the I'd agree if we're comparing Thomas only

What are you saying? :confusedshrug:

[Akhenaten]

You clearly don't know much about Ewing then. :oldlol:



Nah he's on the money about Ewing, Ewing was a very good player bordering on great, he certainly was not generational though. His 94 Finals performance was HORRIFIC. Cant remember if that was pre or post knee injury but still, shooting 35% as a freaking centre in a Finals series http://www.live2hustle.net/fam/images/smilies/new/nasty.gif

[Akhenaten]

As far as kobe, he had a generational career

and Wade didnt?

What did Kobe do that was unprecedented?

[catch24]

and Wade didnt?

What did Kobe do that was unprecedented?

Rocking that avatar and asking this question?

C'mon bro.. You're playing right now :oldlol:

[Smoke117]

Lol. Because people look at player CAREER and not 3 games in a series and one season.

You're an idiot if you think Isiah Thomas is a better/greater basketball player than Dwyane Wade. There is very few players as overrated as Isiah Thomas.

[plowking]

Nah he's on the money about Ewing, Ewing was a very good player bordering on great, he certainly was not generational though. His 94 Finals performance was HORRIFIC. Cant remember if that was pre or post knee injury but still, shooting 35% as a freaking centre in a Finals series http://www.live2hustle.net/fam/images/smilies/new/nasty.gif

Ewing was a generational talent. The scouting and expectations coming out of college were insane. Absolutely insane. You need to go back and read up about it if you don't believe. Then he went ahead and had a pretty fantastic career.

[97 bulls]

MVPs are overrated as phuck. Shaq and Kobe both only have 1. Wade has zero... They mean very little, IMO



What are you saying? :confusedshrug:
Sorry. I messed up that post. I'd agree that Thomas shouldn't be ranked over Wade. But Wade is obviously just happy to be in the conversation. And he's not that much more accomplished than Thomas.

[97 bulls]

You're an idiot if you think Isiah Thomas is a better/greater basketball player than Dwyane Wade. There is very few players as overrated as Isiah Thomas.
It's about accomplishments and circumstances. I don't know what criteria the voters used to make this list. Maybe they put a lot of weight into who beat who. Thomas Pistons beat Magic, Bird, and Jordan. When all had relatively great teams behind them. Can the same be said for Wade?

[Ocks]

Good read.. I'd say Steve Francis and Baron Davis were precursors to Wade, Rose, Westbrook etc tho

[Wade's Rings]

It's about accomplishments and circumstances. I don't know what criteria the voters used to make this list. Maybe they put a lot of weight into who beat who. Thomas Pistons beat Magic, Bird, and Jordan. When all had relatively great teams behind them. Can the same be said for Wade?


Wade didn't have a team like the Bad Boys outside of '12 & '13. Wade is also simply the better player than Isiah.

[dubeta]

Wade didn't have a team like the Bad Boys outside of '12 & '13. Wade is also simply the better player than Isiah.

Nope

[Prime_Shaq]

Robbed of the 2009 MVP.

[ArbitraryWater]

MVPs are overrated as phuck. Shaq and Kobe both only have 1. Wade has zero... They mean very little, IMO



What are you saying? :confusedshrug:

So what, the only one of those 3 deserving of any more MVP claims IS Shaq, and he wasn't exactly known for his regular season intensity 'I recover injury time on company time' (horrible recollection of his exact words), the missed games killed him, Shaq brought it in the playoffs... only year he was really robbed was 2001.

Kobe and Wade were never robbed. If anyone was, it was Dirk in '06.

[SouBeachTalents]

Robbed of the 2009 MVP.

Statistically it was almost a draw, you could give Wade a very slight edge. But when one players team wins 66 games, and the other players wins 43, it'd be hard to give MVP to the latter in that scenario

[Wade's Rings]

So what, the only one of those 3 deserving of any more MVP claims IS Shaq, and he wasn't exactly known for his regular season intensity 'I recover injury time on company time' (horrible recollection of his exact words), the missed games killed him, Shaq brought it in the playoffs... only year he was really robbed was 2001.

Kobe and Wade were never robbed. If anyone was, it was Dirk in '06.

You could argue '05 for Shaq even though Nash getting it wasn't an issue IMO.

You could definitely argue Wade was the '09 MVP especially given how shit his team was.

[Young X]

If Wade would've had a healthy MVP type season in 2007 he wouldn't be as underrated as he is today.

I always say it, but his injuries in 2007 and 2008 are what hurts him the most not the 2011 finals.

Another great season for him and Miami in 2007 riding the momentum of the 2006 championship and I bet you he would be viewed in a much higher light.

Wade was playing like the best in the league but Miami was mediocre and he got injured after all-star break. Then had another injury plagued mediocre season in 2008. Damn shame. Those were the 2 years he could've maybe won an MVP.

He has the peak and he has the rings but he doesn't have the amount of full seasons of elite play that he should.

[catch24]

So what, the only one of those 3 deserving of any more MVP claims IS Shaq, and he wasn't exactly known for his regular season intensity 'I recover injury time on company time' (horrible recollection of his exact words), the missed games killed him, Shaq brought it in the playoffs... only year he was really robbed was 2001.

Kobe and Wade were never robbed. If anyone was, it was Dirk in '06.

Shaq had killer regular seasons where he should've gotten more recognition. 2005 and 1998 off the top.

Kobe could have been MVP along with Wade given their averages, and who they carried to the playoffs.

I hate the way MVP is awarded. Its too circumstantial and TEAM based.

[Jacks3]

Wade is overrated.

--Shitty superstar longevity. Only had five real super-elite seasons.
--Weak durability. He had so many seasons/post-seasons where he killed his team with his inability to stay healthy. 2005 ECF. 07 reg season+ playoffs. 08 season. Much of the 2012 post-season. Entire 2013 post-season where he was historically bad. Missed a ton of games and had to be on a maintenance plan in 2014, which definitely contributed to LBJ leaving.
--Mediocre shooter throughout his prime.
--Never as impact defensively as his stans think or even close.
--O MVPs. Never the best in the game.

The idea that he's top 20 all-time and the 3rd best SG in history is a ****ing joke.

:oldlol:

[SwayDizzle]

nice post OP, much respect for D Wade, one hell of a player

[dubeta]

Wade is overrated.

--Shitty superstar longevity. Only had five real super-elite seasons.
--Weak durability. He had so many seasons/post-seasons where he killed his team with his inability to stay healthy. 2005 ECF. 07 reg season+ playoffs. 08 season. Much of the 2012 post-season. Entire 2013 post-season where he was historically bad. Missed a ton of games and had to be on a maintenance plan in 2014, which definitely contributed to LBJ leaving.
--Mediocre shooter throughout his prime.
--Never as impact defensively as his stans think or even close.
--O MVPs. Never the best in the game.

The idea that he's top 20 all-time and the 3rd best SG in history is a ****ing joke.

:oldlol:


:applause: :applause:

[Young X]

Wade is a legend.

[BasedTom]

Wade is overrated.

--Shitty superstar longevity. Only had five real super-elite seasons.
--Weak durability. He had so many seasons/post-seasons where he killed his team with his inability to stay healthy. 2005 ECF. 07 reg season+ playoffs. 08 season. Much of the 2012 post-season. Entire 2013 post-season where he was historically bad. Missed a ton of games and had to be on a maintenance plan in 2014, which definitely contributed to LBJ leaving.
--Mediocre shooter throughout his prime.
--Never as impact defensively as his stans think or even close.
--O MVPs. Never the best in the game.

The idea that he's top 20 all-time and the 3rd best SG in history is a ****ing joke.

:oldlol:
kill yourself.

[SouBeachTalents]

Wade is overrated.

--Shitty superstar longevity. Only had five real super-elite seasons.
--Weak durability. He had so many seasons/post-seasons where he killed his team with his inability to stay healthy. 2005 ECF. 07 reg season+ playoffs. 08 season. Much of the 2012 post-season. Entire 2013 post-season where he was historically bad. Missed a ton of games and had to be on a maintenance plan in 2014, which definitely contributed to LBJ leaving.
--Mediocre shooter throughout his prime.
--Never as impact defensively as his stans think or even close.
--O MVPs. Never the best in the game.

The idea that he's top 20 all-time and the 3rd best SG in history is a ****ing joke.

:oldlol:

It really isn't at all. Wade's a consensus top 20-30 player of all time based on numerous lists (ESPN, ISH, RealGM, PSD, Simmons), and depending on what position you consider West, Wade would be the 3rd greatest SG of all time, 4th if West is included. And if you want to play the MVP/best player in the game card, that argument would go against West as well. Wade probably had a better argument as best player in the world in '06 & '09 than West ever did, ditto the vast majority of players outside the top 10 of all time

[ArbitraryWater]

You could argue '05 for Shaq even though Nash getting it wasn't an issue IMO.

You could definitely argue Wade was the '09 MVP especially given how shit his team was.

On the contrary, Wade's and Bron's stats were nearly identical, but LeBron's team won 22 more games, so thats REALLY hard to argue.

I agree with 2005, Nash getting it was a non issue.


Shaq had killer regular seasons where he should've gotten more recognition. 2005 and 1998 off the top.

Kobe could have been MVP along with Wade given their averages, and who they carried to the playoffs.

I hate the way MVP is awarded. Its too circumstantial and TEAM based.

Yeah, but Nash's turnaround of the 2005 Suns was even BIGGER.

Kobe didn't set himself apart as a player that year from Dirk or most, he wasn't MJ like dominant over the rest of the league, so it would be kind of unreasonable suddenly handing out MVP's to players on 47 win teams or whatever it was, when Dirk fit the perfect criteria, and had it all going.

You hate it because you don't like the fact Kobe's gotten few of them, but if you go back, the only years you can pick out as rather clearly 'wrong' since the millenium are 2001, 2006, and for me (but apparently not that many others) 2011.

--

^^ Young X, he definitely wasn't winning '07 MVP with that record, with Dirk being on one of ten 67+ win teams ever. Pretty impossible in '08 as well with the team they had.

[SouBeachTalents]

On the contrary, Wade's and Bron's stats were nearly identical, but LeBron's team won 22 more games, so thats REALLY hard to argue.

I agree with 2005, Nash getting it was a non issue.



Yeah, but Nash's turnaround of the 2005 Suns was even BIGGER.

Kobe didn't set himself apart as a player that year from Dirk or most, he wasn't MJ like dominant over the rest of the league, so it would be kind of unreasonable suddenly handing out MVP's to players on 47 win teams or whatever it was, when Dirk fit the perfect criteria, and had it all going.

You hate it because you don't like the fact Kobe's gotten few of them, but if you go back, the only years you can pick out as rather clearly 'wrong' since the millenium are 2001, 2006, and for me (but apparently not that many others) 2011.

--

^^ Young X, he definitely wasn't winning '07 MVP with that record, with Dirk being on one of ten 67+ win teams ever. Pretty impossible in '08 as well with the team they had.

AW I'm assuming you'd pick Shaq & Dirk for '01 & '06? Out of curiosity, who would you pick for '05 & '08

[Young X]

^^ Young X, he definitely wasn't winning '07 MVP with that record, with Dirk being on one of ten 67+ win teams ever. Pretty impossible in '08 as well with the team they had.Yeah his injuries and the teams mediocrity hurt him.

Those 2 years are the difference. He would be viewed in a higher light had those years been more successful for him and Miami.

[ArbitraryWater]

AW I'm assuming you'd pick Shaq & Dirk for '01 & '06? Out of curiosity, who would you pick for '05 & '08

Probably Nash and Kobe.. like it was. Paul has an argument in '08 as well, so does Bron, KG, but this one can get to Kobe, for sure his best case.

In '05 Shaq and Dirk have a case IMO, but Nash played a big role in being responsible for the biggest record transition that year, so I'm fine with it.

[Wade's Rings]

On the contrary, Wade's and Bron's stats were nearly identical, but LeBron's team won 22 more games, so thats REALLY hard to argue.

I agree with 2005, Nash getting it was a non issue.

Mo & Delonte were better than pretty much any body Wade had.

[TheBigVeto]

Wade is overrated.

The idea that he's top 20 all-time and the 3rd best SG in history is a ****ing joke.

:oldlol:

Correct.

[BasedTom]

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj309/Mr_Jesus_666/GIF2/tard.gif~original
kill yourself

[aj1987]

kill yourself
That's what I expect him and Jacks look like IRL. :oldlol:

tpols is just being a butthurt crybaby ITT.

[sportjames23]

D-Fraud with the excuses :roll: :roll:


This man literally cannot stop being a douche. :facepalm

[Dresta]

Wade is praising himself by saying "no player has ever played like me ....my style has never been seen before"

If James claimed the above, it would cause a huge uproar and he'd be looked as a huge douche bag......FACT!!
Not really--Wade usually comes across as rather humble (especially in his early career), Lebron, on the other hand, comes across as a megalomaniac. BIG difference. There's plenty of times in that interview when he's clearly self-deprecatory.

No player at 6'4 has ever played like Wade: that is a fact.

You're full of shit as usual, you pathetic Lebron stan. Get a life already.

[Wade's Rings]

Not really--Wade usually comes across as rather humble (especially in his early career), Lebron, on the other hand, comes across as a megalomaniac. BIG difference. There's plenty of times in that interview when he's clearly self-deprecatory.

No player at 6'4 has ever played like Wade: that is a fact.

You're full of shit as usual, you pathetic Lebron stan. Get a life already.

:applause: