Is Empathy A Lost Art?

[hateraid]

I was going to share a personal experience, but I think I'll refrain from doing so as to not derail the thread. Apparently my personal experiences causes a rise out of certain posters

Have we as humans lost the ability to empathize? I find through traits like self preservation, lack of accountability, and acts of trolling (to act in a manner to get a rise out of an individuals for ones self entertainment) we fail to recognize what it's like to be in another man's shoes. When was the last time you've passed judgements on others but empathized once you've attemted to feel that person's hurts or pains. I know I'm guilty of doing this. As a species as a whole is this a lost art? Are we going to become more selfish as the generations pass?

[Graviton]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCsvJe3dGVk

[Nick Young]

I am extremely empathetic in real life. On ISH I am empathetic towards everyone but I mask my empathy with sarcasm and trolling. And sometimes the trolling is too hilarious so I have to go that way even if someones feelings get hurt. Too bad they don't make a band-aid for feelins.

[DonD13]

I am extremely empathetic in real life. On ISH I am empathetic towards everyone but I mask my empathy with sarcasm and trolling. And sometimes the trolling is too hilarious so I have to go that way even if someones feelings get hurt. Too bad they don't make a band-aid for feelins.

that would be great!

that way you wouldn't have to report posts and cry to Jeff all the time :applause:

[hateraid]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCsvJe3dGVk

Wow! That was really cool and interesting. It didn't quite relate to what I had intended in the OP. But it still somehow has a small correlation.

The laughter ackward threw me off. I'll watch this again and would love to disect it. Thanks for sharing

[gigantes]

i saw this comment the other day... thought it was pretty interesting. if it's too long, just read the 2nd paragraph.

i gather his reaction is the way a lot of ppl feel these days. feeling angry about it is difficult for me to understand since i'm kind of a bleeding heart myself.




Originally Posted by Too_Many_Packets

Before even looking through this thread, I already figured most of the things people list here would be something that, while seemingly specific and unique, would actually be relatable to most people. Most feel self-conscious, awkward, and unsuccessful. I think that's just how we are.

But, this is the first thing I've seen, and related to, that I didn't think anyone else experienced. I know about loss, anxiety, pain, and fear. But, when I see it in someone else, I get angry. How dare they make me care about their problems? This isn't how I had planned things going down today. Now I have to think about this person's loss, or that person's worries? I get angry at the person who's suffering. I don't want to, and it's not like I hate them. I feel bad for them. Even so, I'm still angry. I hope I don't show it most of the time, but sometimes, I'm sure I do.

I don't know why this is. I can't make any sense out of it. I care about my friends, family, even people I've barely met. I'd do anything for anyone, just because that's the kind of person I am. I'm not trying to boast or anything. I'm simply saying that it's not in my nature to do any less than go out of my way for anyone I see in need. But, damn them all for making me think about their problems. I can't fix everything. I can't feel all their shit every day.

I went to a memorial yesterday. I barely knew the family from when I was a teenager a long time ago. My memory lately isn't so good for some reason. I don't even remember anything about them except their names sounded familiar. But, their friends and family were so torn up. So many people hurt, so many plans and futures ruined, and hearts broken. I don't think I could fully know what such a tragedy could do to someone so close to that family, but that doesn't stop me from doing my best trying to imagine what it must be like. It doesn't keep me from spending all day at work thinking about it, or running thoughts through my head about how I should be the one to suffer, and not them, nor the people they lost.

Still, I try to remind myself that it's not about me. It's not about what I want to feel. As much as I hate it, I feel this way because I care about people, and I don't like to see them suffering. It might just be that I've been misinterpreting my own feelings. I don't know, though.

I just want to tell you that maybe it's not normal to feel the way you do about empathy, but maybe it's not a bad thing either. And, maybe withdrawing, ultimately, will not be the best way to go. Maybe others need people like you to get so emotional about their problems so that they know they can rely on you for support. Because, others will say, "Sorry for your pain and/or loss," give a pat on the back or say some shit about how everything will be okay someday, and then go back to their comfortable lives where the only time they have to give a shit is when they are the ones suffering.

One thing is sure though. If you withdraw, it doesn't mean you'll never have to deal with it. Empathy has ways of finding you, whether it be rumors or the news (seriously, **** the news for this). You will hear about someone's suffering, and whether you want to or not, you will care.

[hateraid]

i saw this comment the other day... thought it was pretty interesting. if it's too long, just read the 2nd paragraph.

i gather his reaction is the way a lot of ppl feel these days. feeling angry about it is difficult for me to understand since i'm kind of a bleeding heart myself.




Originally Posted by Too_Many_Packets

Before even looking through this thread, I already figured most of the things people list here would be something that, while seemingly specific and unique, would actually be relatable to most people. Most feel self-conscious, awkward, and unsuccessful. I think that's just how we are.

But, this is the first thing I've seen, and related to, that I didn't think anyone else experienced. I know about loss, anxiety, pain, and fear. But, when I see it in someone else, I get angry. How dare they make me care about their problems? This isn't how I had planned things going down today. Now I have to think about this person's loss, or that person's worries? I get angry at the person who's suffering. I don't want to, and it's not like I hate them. I feel bad for them. Even so, I'm still angry. I hope I don't show it most of the time, but sometimes, I'm sure I do.

I don't know why this is. I can't make any sense out of it. I care about my friends, family, even people I've barely met. I'd do anything for anyone, just because that's the kind of person I am. I'm not trying to boast or anything. I'm simply saying that it's not in my nature to do any less than go out of my way for anyone I see in need. But, damn them all for making me think about their problems. I can't fix everything. I can't feel all their shit every day.

I went to a memorial yesterday. I barely knew the family from when I was a teenager a long time ago. My memory lately isn't so good for some reason. I don't even remember anything about them except their names sounded familiar. But, their friends and family were so torn up. So many people hurt, so many plans and futures ruined, and hearts broken. I don't think I could fully know what such a tragedy could do to someone so close to that family, but that doesn't stop me from doing my best trying to imagine what it must be like. It doesn't keep me from spending all day at work thinking about it, or running thoughts through my head about how I should be the one to suffer, and not them, nor the people they lost.

Still, I try to remind myself that it's not about me. It's not about what I want to feel. As much as I hate it, I feel this way because I care about people, and I don't like to see them suffering. It might just be that I've been misinterpreting my own feelings. I don't know, though.

I just want to tell you that maybe it's not normal to feel the way you do about empathy, but maybe it's not a bad thing either. And, maybe withdrawing, ultimately, will not be the best way to go. Maybe others need people like you to get so emotional about their problems so that they know they can rely on you for support. Because, others will say, "Sorry for your pain and/or loss," give a pat on the back or say some shit about how everything will be okay someday, and then go back to their comfortable lives where the only time they have to give a shit is when they are the ones suffering.

One thing is sure though. If you withdraw, it doesn't mean you'll never have to deal with it. Empathy has ways of finding you, whether it be rumors or the news (seriously, **** the news for this). You will hear about someone's suffering, and whether you want to or not, you will care.

Now this is exactly what I was eluding to! I find most people are the angry guy shaming those who are trying to share their pain.
Great post

[Dresta]

Everyone has their own pain, and the truth is, that there's nothing easier to endure than the pain of others, and nothing easier to exaggerate than our own pain and discomfort - this has been true of human beings since like forever.

I'm reminded of this fable:


Our discussions here have brought to my recollection that beautiful apologue, or fable, of Addison's, where he represents the whole human race as summoned by Jupiter into one assembly. The God listens to their various complaints, and then gives permission to each to lay down his own grievance, and take up any that he chose to select among those deposited by his neighbours. A very handsome, well-made man lays down a disease under which he labours, and takes up the deformity which a hump-backed man had thrown off; a mother brings her undutiful son; a wife her bad husband. A husband comes with his shrew of a wife, and selects another partner, who, as he believes, will suit him better. All were anxious to make the change; for it is human nature, Sir, to view all the miseries of others as very easy to be endured; yes, Sir, nothing is so easy as to endure other people's evils unless it be to spend other people's money. The assembly broke up well-pleased, and each returned to his home to try his altered situation. But, Sir, what was the issue? In a little time, they all came back again. The once handsome man came to be set free from his hump; the diseased man to take it back again. The lady brought her new husband, and the man, who had before brought his shrew of a wife, came back to seek her again: declaring that long habit and intimacy had so cemented their union that the old woman was the best companion after all.’

I mean look at the guy quoted above: "arrggh my empathy makes me feel so bad, why don't people feel empathic like me, argghh" (a reductionism, i know) - the truth is that most do, they simply express it in a different way, some hide it with aggression, and so on; it is rare to find a person that isn't something of a fragile child on the inside, no matter how base their exterior. In a way, the guy is being self-indulgent regarding his own feelings, which is often counterproductive and unhelpful, and actually creates more needless suffering--sometimes you just need to develop a shell and hold it up high, sometimes it is about not appearing shaken for the sake of other people, to give them something more solid to lean on and draw strength from.

This is why i have a problem with many liberals: I personally, rarely doubt the sincerity of their arguments, I just think them mistaken; but with myself, and most others, in the eyes of these people, it is our motives that are black, and the only humane opinion to hold is one that coincides with their own. From whence comes the overweening arrogance of these fanatics who would sit in judgment of the human heart? - who made these people the searchers of hearts, and who gave them the right to blacken the motives of all who dare to disagree with them? Some are so busy being the censor morum for the rest of the world that they forget about the rightness and wrongness of their own conduct, and who they hurt or help in their own lives. I quite often find that an abstracted worship of justice coincides with a loss of just behaviour in personal lives; i'm sure everyone knows a left-winger, who despite his political pretences, is a complete arse in their actual lives; as have I met people who would be classified on here as 'right-wing nut' and found them to be both generous and to put the safety of others ahead of their own (dangerous situations tend to bring the true character out of people).

This idea that political opinion defines characters is completely depraved, and is part of why the country is so polarized - it is also a poisonous Marxist offshoot that ought to be stamped on before it's too late, and the American cultural divide becomes irreparable.

[masonanddixon]

Technology and liberalism have profoundly disrupted our ability to be humane.

[TommyGriffin]

Cuckolds keep it alive and well.

[9erempiree]

Technology and liberalism have profoundly disrupted our ability to be humane.

This is very true.

In today's liberal society, it is all about 'identity' politics. People are forced to pick and choose to identify themselves to a certain group. You are either LGBT, Minority, Feminist or White...etc...etc.

Rather than focusing on 'EQUALITY' today's society love to identify themselves as a group. By identifying yourself to a group, it means you are throwing 'equality' out the window. Identity is distinguishing and separating yourself from others.

Without digressing here....yes it is a lost art.

[Bosnian Sajo]

Hateraid, share your personal experience bro. Sure, deuce might not like it, but I find your stories/threads a good read.

[Bosnian Sajo]

that would be great!

that way you wouldn't have to report posts and cry to Jeff all the time :applause:

I mean I understand why he does, just the other day someone reported me and nick to Jeff for posting those truck pics in a Kobe bashing thread, and got banned for 3 days :oldlol:

[UK2K]

I was going to share a personal experience, but I think I'll refrain from doing so as to not derail the thread. Apparently my personal experiences causes a rise out of certain posters

Have we as humans lost the ability to empathize? I find through traits like self preservation, lack of accountability, and acts of trolling (to act in a manner to get a rise out of an individuals for ones self entertainment) we fail to recognize what it's like to be in another man's shoes. When was the last time you've passed judgements on others but empathized once you've attemted to feel that person's hurts or pains. I know I'm guilty of doing this. As a species as a whole is this a lost art? Are we going to become more selfish as the generations pass?

I am empathetic to everyone that has something to be empathetic about.

For everyone who doesn't give a shit about their lives, I don't care about them.

I've said before on here, you'd be hard pressed to find someone who gives as much time and money (proportionally, because I don't make shit) as I do for the less fortunate. I spent more money on Christmas presents for people I don't personally know (cleaning ladies in our office, the drive-thru guy at Wendy's, veterans programs, toys for tots, etc.) then I spent for my own family.

But those people are people I respect and think they need to be recognized for their dedication to a better life. So, I help them out with whatever I can.

Everyone else..... well, whatever.

[knickballer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCZ1YteCv5M

[FillJackson]

Technology and liberalism have profoundly disrupted our ability to be humane.
Yeah, liberalism is so profoundly anti-empathy.


How profoundly do you need to be up your ass to believe that?

[Dresta]

Yeah, liberalism is so profoundly anti-empathy.


How profoundly do you need to be up your ass to believe that?
Liberalism, its classical and modern variants, both tend to encourage the growth of inhuman practices because they (by definition) emphasise material prosperity over all other things--hence why the dogma of liberalism is so-well epitomised by the routine worship of the GDP statistic.

In the end it is still a hollow encouragement of grasping avarice, which is inherently anti-moral in its effects, whatever its professions and pretences.

[tontoz]

Yes, especially on this board.

[nathanjizzle]

Liberalism, its classical and modern variants, both tend to encourage the growth of inhuman practices because they (by definition) emphasise material prosperity over all other things--hence why the dogma of liberalism is so-well epitomised by the routine worship of the GDP statistic.

In the end it is still a hollow encouragement of grasping avarice, which is inherently anti-moral in its effects, whatever its professions and pretences.

Shut Up.

[navy]

It's amazing how you idiots manage to turn everything into political disussions about liberals and onservatives. Look at the unnecessary pretentious manner in which Dresta went on a silly anti liberal tirade. :oldlol:

This is exactly what's wrong with the country and politics. Stop boxing yourself in and letting yourself be defined and overly influence by ideology of any kind.

[Nanners]

to answer your question OP, i dont think empathy is a lost at all.

there are plenty of assholes and selfish people in the world, but there are a lot of really good folks too. dont let your experiences with the former make you lose sight of the latter.

[dunksby]

Studies have shown that trolls are apathetic, Internet is full of trolls; case closed.

[ArbitraryWater]

UK2K hates this thread

[ROCSteady]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCsvJe3dGVk

This was an excellent way to look at the tediousness of life.

The originator of these words killed himself.

Just goes to show how complex the mind is, even when you seemingly have found a personal perspective to bring peace, it's not the full story.

[Tarik One]

People who work in customer service pretty much have to be empathetic or learn to be really fast because you will being dealing with people who "just want to be heard".

It's a very useful quality to have in developing friendships with all kinds of women. Women for the most part wear their emotions on their sleeves and want someone who "understand her situation/what she is going through"

You learn to do that, you got them hooked.

[hateraid]

Hateraid, share your personal experience bro. Sure, deuce might not like it, but I find your stories/threads a good read.

Lol, thanks bud. I'll share it a little later. I just didn't wan the thread to be derailed by a hateraid vs.......... So far this thread has been going great.
I seem to be butting heads with a lot of folk lately.

[DeuceWallaces]

Lol, the self-righteous, self-inflated, self-appointed ISH Father Of The Year and undisputed Social Media Drama Queen makes posts based on his anticipation of my response?

Holy shit, that is rent free if I've ever heard of it. Don't be so flattered. No one gives a shit about what you think.

[DonD13]

Technology and liberalism have profoundly disrupted our ability to be humane.

at least "technology" is not going anywhere

you might as well... you know... call it day

[masonanddixon]

at least "technology" is not going anywhere

you might as well... you know... call it day

I don't know what this post even means.

Technology does not equal progress. It's simply a change. Almost all of new technology is detrimental to society and to the earth.

[DonD13]

I don't know what this post even means.

Technology does not equal progress. It's simply a change. Almost all of new technology is detrimental to society and to the earth.

how?

[masonanddixon]

how?

Everything created by Google is intrusive and a danger to society and the earth. Anyone can find out exactly where you live and kill you. Anyone can find out exactly when and at what times endangered animals will be at the ocean and kill them. Overfishing. Overhunting. Etc. Etc.

Pretty much everything created by Apple has ruined intellectual property and artistic creativity.

Twitter/Facebook etc. have made us more inhumane than society has ever been in any point in time. Very rarely do people communicate face to face and in person anymore.

[Akrazotile]

Everything created by Google is intrusive and a danger to society and the earth. Anyone can find out exactly where you live and kill you. Anyone can find out exactly when and at what times endangered animals will be at the ocean and kill them. Overfishing. Overhunting. Etc. Etc.

Pretty much everything created by Apple has ruined intellectual property and artistic creativity.

Twitter/Facebook etc. have made us more inhumane than society has ever been in any point in time. Very rarely do people communicate face to face and in person anymore.


Yep.

Technology like telephones and cars are far more helpful than they are hurtful, but most 'interactive' technology like tv, internet, social media etc. gets abused far more than it gets utilized beneficially.

If I could press a button and destroy all camera phones and social media websites (not withstanding message boards where fully developed thoughts can be typed out and exchanged) I would absolutely do it in a second.

[DonD13]

Everything created by Google is intrusive and a danger to society and the earth. Anyone can find out exactly where you live and kill you. Anyone can find out exactly when and at what times endangered animals will be at the ocean and kill them. Overfishing. Overhunting. Etc. Etc.

Pretty much everything created by Apple has ruined intellectual property and artistic creativity.

Twitter/Facebook etc. have made us more inhumane than society has ever been in any point in time. Very rarely do people communicate face to face and in person anymore.

that's not true, that's just you

[masonanddixon]

Yep.

Technology like telephones and cars are far more helpful than they are hurtful, but most 'interactive' technology like tv, internet, social media etc. gets abused far more than it gets utilized beneficially.

If I could press a button and destroy all camera phones and social media websites (not withstanding message boards where fully developed thoughts can be typed out and exchanged) I would absolutely do it in a second.

Yeah I totally forgot about camera phones and the ilk. You can essentially ruin someone's life or career by filming one mistake of theirs. It's incredible. And it also creates incentives for idiots to destroy or harm natural beauty so they can upload their 'accomplishments' for their friends to view. I see this shit all the time.

[masonanddixon]

that's not true, that's just you

When was the last time you wrote a letter to a friend?

[DonD13]

When was the last time you wrote a letter to a friend?

a letter?? that's not "face to face"

you're confused. nobody gives a **** about letters and why should they

[masonanddixon]

a letter?? that's not "face to face"

you're confused. nobody gives a **** about letters and why should they

I think you're no older than 12 years old.

[Dresta]

It's amazing how you idiots manage to turn everything into political disussions about liberals and onservatives. Look at the unnecessary pretentious manner in which Dresta went on a silly anti liberal tirade. :oldlol:

This is exactly what's wrong with the country and politics. Stop boxing yourself in and letting yourself be defined and overly influence by ideology of any kind.
Silly boy...you say i do something, and then basically rehash the exact point I made in more childish language:


This idea that political opinion defines characters is completely depraved, and is part of why the country is so polarized

That was from my post ^^^. So yeah, this is about morality and ethics, not politics. That you couldn't even notice this only goes to show how much politics and political culture dominates your thinking. The only one talking about politics here is you: i am referring to dominant attitudes to life, which are obviously relevant to the topic at hand. You said nothing about the topic, and instead launched an ad hominem attack on myself for political propaganda purposes (while pretending not to be political). This has nothing to do with partisan politics: the 'liberal' worldview is very much the consensus among both so-called liberals and so-called conservatives, it is the established consensus all throughout the western world. Changing morality reflects this change in worldview; the tendency to be selfish, self-obsessed, introspective, and so on, is encouraged by this view, which teaches that the self is the centre of the universe, and that the indulgence of the self is the definition of happiness. When the world is run according to the dictates of personal material gratification, then it is not surprising that empathy should take a back seat to other things.

If you can't see how any economy intently focused on GDP and wealth accumulation will become expedience based and thus inhumane, then that's a failing of your intellect and your intellect alone. A climate where everyone has endless "rights" with no corresponding duties, where everyone is encouraged to "embrace their true self" (whatever that means) is an endorsement for licentiousness, and consequently destroys self-restraint; if you can't see the tendency of this worldview (which is the consensus) to make people self-centred and (as a result) unsympathetic, that is again your own blindness, not anyone else's.


a letter?? that's not "face to face"

you're confused. nobody gives a **** about letters and why should they
No, i wouldn't expect an emotionally stunted man-child to understand the value of letter-writing and of a medium of correspondence that develops both skills and feelings of intimacy; no doubt the text message is as intimate as written communication gets for someone like you.

The modern temperament is cursed with a flippancy and irreverence that people like you so-well embody. And it is no doubt a consequence of this "been there, done that" attitude that is inculcated by technological advances, and the fact people are "plugged in" to some kind of monitor or screen for all hours of the day. This is part of what makes modern youth so conceited: their constant ability to access all things gives them a veneer of intelligence and understanding that carries with it the arrogant dismissal of their elders, of tradition, and of authority. You let everyone be a "rebel" from the comfort of their parent's basements, and the consequences are clear for all to see (children who never grow up, and never get over the infantile opinions of their youth).

[DonD13]

No, i wouldn't expect an emotionally stunted man-child to understand the value of letter-writing and of a medium of correspondence that develops both skills and feelings of intimacy; no doubt the text message is as intimate as written communication gets for someone like you.

The modern temperament is cursed with a flippancy and irreverence that people like you so-well embody. And it is no doubt a consequence of this "been there, done that" attitude that is inculcated by technological advances, and the fact people are "plugged in" to some kind of monitor or screen for all hours of the day. This is part of what makes modern youth so conceited: their constant ability to access all things gives them a veneer of intelligence and understanding that carries with it the arrogant dismissal of their elders, of tradition, and of authority. You let everyone be a "rebel" from the comfort of their parent's basements, and the consequences are clear for all to see (children who never grow up, and never get over the infantile opinions of their youth).

oh the irony :oldlol:

go write a letter instead of being plugged in to your computer trying to insult people

[Levity]

read up on empaths, op. it's a rare breed, but theyre certainly out there. :rockon:

if you know anything about the myers-briggs personality traits, empaths would most likely fall under INFP, maybe J

[HenryGarfunkle]

OP lacks intelligence

[Levity]

It's a very useful quality to have in developing friendships with all kinds of women. Women for the most part wear their emotions on their sleeves and want someone who "understand her situation/what she is going through"

You learn to do that, you got them hooked.

this is 100% true, as sleezeballish as that sounds

[Levity]

I am empathetic to everyone that has something to be empathetic about.



that sounds more sympathetic than empathetic

[mlh1981]

Read any comment section on a news story. People are brutal, and nothing is of limits.

[Nanners]

Read any comment section on a news story. People are brutal, and nothing is of limits.

i dont really think anonymous internet comments are a good way to judge humanity :oldlol:

[ILLsmak]

I don't think people understand what empathy is... selective empathy exists, but it's not really empathy. A psychopath can do that, too. Selective empathy is like... trying to put yourself in someone else's shoes.

Real empathy is kind of like imagination. If your imagination is strong enough, someone could say certain things around you and it would mess with you. It's like I was just reading about how many mob assassins used to use ice picks to kill people, and how one guy preferred to put it thru the person's ear and into their brain. For that moment, you get a sensation of that. Or watching a predator eat something. You are filled with the feelings of what it would be like to be attacked, subdued, and eaten alive.

That's very rare in people. Many people would say it's not an evolutionary advantage because you actually have to deal with other people's drama... and it even makes you easier to appeal to (because you won't leave even your worst enemy to suffer.) However, the upside is that in that empathetic bubble, you can draw people in at eye contact. You can create a sort of secret world between you and someone else more easily.

That's why there are also people who are empaths that are evil. Some may even get a sick joy, instead of repulsion, out of said visions. It really depends on your nature, but I feel like that is the core of empathy. And we're talking a very small percentage of people.

However! Anger is kind of like a repression of said feelings. Maybe empathy is something we all have if we cultivate it, but I believe some people are inherently more empathetic... and it allows you to connect on a deeper level. Of course, there is also more pain.


-Smak

[Levity]

^^^ wonderfully put. and truthfully, im pretty impressed you understand that

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

Jesus commanded all of mankind to:

a) Love thy Lord, God, with ALL your heart, mind, body, and soul.

b) Love thy neighbor as your self

Master these two rules and we won't need this discussion.

[Dresta]

oh the irony :oldlol:

go write a letter instead of being plugged in to your computer trying to insult people
I do like to write letters, or at least in letter-form, in most cases. It is you who writes always in text-speak, and then mocks people for wanting to write to each other in a more serious way. Not hard to understand why empathy is absent in people like that, really, is it?

Your de facto setting is one of blas