Oscar Robertson vs Russell Westbrook

[iamgine]

Ok clearly Oscar had the better career and rank a lot higher all time.

But who's the better basketball player? Prime Oscar or current Russ?

[INDI]

I was talking with a old man last week who said he used to watch Oscar play in his prime. He said that the closest thing he's ever seen in comparison to Oscar is James Harden but with defense. I thought it was a interesting comparison and it's coming from someone who actually watched him in person not just highlight clips.

Good comparison with Westbrook though cause that's who I think Oscar would be most similar too. I also call him a point guard version of lebron

[bizil]

Best player-peak wise, I think these are the top 5 PG's of all time:

Magic
Big O
Curry
Westbrook
Isiah

I think all five of these guys revolutionized the PG position. The Big O was a pass first PG who ALSO averaged 30 points a night. And was a walking triple double. Westbrook does many of the same things from a score first mentality at the PG. Even though Russ is a beast, I would choose Big O. Oscar was the ULTIMATE combo of floor generalship, versatility, and alpha dog scoring.

[feyki]

Oscar and not even close .

[IncarceratedBob]

Is this a joke? Russell Westbrook is a million times the basketball player at Oscar war. It's just human evolution. Oscar in today's NBA would get his little bitch ass beat down in a minute, too slow, too stupid.

[ShawkFactory]

Is this a joke? Russell Westbrook is a million times the basketball player at Oscar war. It's just human evolution. Oscar in today's NBA would get his little bitch ass beat down in a minute, too slow, too stupid.
Humans don't evolve like that in 50 years, wtf?

[feyki]

Humans don't evolve like that in 50 years, wtf?

Yes , a million year at least . But television colors can ..

[jimmybball]

Oscar easily.

[IncarceratedBob]

Humans don't evolve like that in 50 years, wtf?
Lol, first of all you're an idiot.

Next, lets look at the purest sport of them all. Track and field. You think Jesse Owens is faster than Bolt? Uh, yeah NO. Bolt would shit on Owens. It's called EVOLUTION in athletes. Diet, training, techniques have evolved SO much.

Are we arguing who was GREATER or who was BETTER? Greater is relative to your own generation of players meanwhile better simple breaks down your skills/talent to another player w/o taking into account generation/era. Oscar is a GREATER player than Westbrook, he dominated his era in a way that Westbrook can't. But to simply compare Russell Westbrook and Oscar Robertson, having watched them both play and to say that Oscar was a better basketball player than Westbrook is beyond stupid and truly ignorant.

Basically, Oscar was a Homo Erectus meanwhile Russell is a modern Homo Sapien. No shame in that for Oscar.

[ShawkFactory]

Lol, first of all you're an idiot.

Next, lets look at the purest sport of them all. Track and field. You think Jesse Owens is faster than Bolt? Uh, yeah NO. Bolt would shit on Owens. It's called EVOLUTION in athletes. Diet, training, techniques have evolved SO much.

Are we arguing who was GREATER or who was BETTER? Greater is relative to your own generation of players meanwhile better simple breaks down your skills/talent to another player w/o taking into account generation/era. Oscar is a GREATER player than Westbrook, he dominated his era in a way that Westbrook can't. But to simply compare Russell Westbrook and Oscar Robertson, having watched them both play and to say that Oscar was a better basketball player than Westbrook is beyond stupid and truly ignorant.

Basically, Oscar was a Homo Erectus meanwhile Russell is a modern Homo Sapien. No shame in that for Oscar.
You said human evolution. Humans don't evolve in 50 years. You should have said the athletic field has grown tremendously.

Jesse Owens was basically the first black guy to run track. Now there's millions of them.

There were guys as fast as Bolt 80 years ago, or at least could have been. They just didn't run track.

Perhaps Oscar wouldn't dominate this era. But perhaps...with year-round training and the mindset athletes have now, who knows.

[90sgoat]

I was talking with a old man last week who said he used to watch Oscar play in his prime. He said that the closest thing he's ever seen in comparison to Oscar is James Harden but with defense. I thought it was a interesting comparison and it's coming from someone who actually watched him in person not just highlight clips.

Good comparison with Westbrook though cause that's who I think Oscar would be most similar too. I also call him a point guard version of lebron

Not really sure about that, Harden is a 3 and layup guy, but from the clips I've watched from Oscar he strikes me as a guy who mainly dominated with mid range jumpers from his strong penetration.

In that respect I'd say he is indeed more like Westbrook if he had a brain and could play in the half court, but maybe the better comparison is Dwyane Wade if Wade had continued to play point guard (as he did coming into league).

Watch some highlights here, seems more like a big strong guard with post game and midrange:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPdQ7EhCYa8

[jongib369]

Not really sure about that, Harden is a 3 and layup guy, but from the clips I've watched from Oscar he strikes me as a guy who mainly dominated with mid range jumpers from his strong penetration.

In that respect I'd say he is indeed more like Westbrook if he had a brain and could play in the half court, but maybe the better comparison is Dwyane Wade if Wade had continued to play point guard (as he did coming into league).

Watch some highlights here, seems more like a big strong guard with post game and midrange:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPdQ7EhCYa8
I'm hoping Cavs busts out his, and Russells highlights soon. As great as this little one is, it's not enough

[ISHGoat]

You said human evolution. Humans don't evolve in 50 years. You should have said the athletic field has grown tremendously.

Jesse Owens was basically the first black guy to run track. Now there's millions of them.

There were guys as fast as Bolt 80 years ago, or at least could have been. They just didn't run track.

Perhaps Oscar wouldn't dominate this era. But perhaps...with year-round training and the mindset athletes have now, who knows.

This is ****ing nonsense.

[ShawkFactory]

This is ****ing nonsense.
So of aaaaallllll the tens of billions of people that have been alive since 1930 or so, you're saying that it's nonsense to believe that the sport of track and field hasn't found the absolute fastest person?

[senelcoolidge]

I think Westbrook would be a difficult assignment in the open court for Robertson. Westbrook attacks the basket like few others have. But Robertson was bigger and stronger. So in the half court game Robertson has the edge. Robertson was also a better rebounder a pass first point guard with elite mid range. Robertson wins.

[72-10]

It would be interesting to know Robertson's turnover numbers. Too bad we don't have them.

[senelcoolidge]

It would be interesting to know Robertson's turnover numbers. Too bad we don't have them.

I know they played at a higher pace in those days. But if you have watched Robertson he played kind of slow. Not fancy at all. Very good in the half court set. He probably didn't have a lot of TO's in comparison to other all time assists guys. But who knows.

[72-10]

I know they played at a higher pace in those days. But if you have watched Robertson he played kind of slow. Not fancy at all. Very good in the half court set. He probably didn't have a lot of TO's in comparison to other all time assists guys. But who knows.

It sounds like his statistical output might be similar to MJ's then. If it's true, I think Robertson is underrated on a lot of these lists I see.

[senelcoolidge]

It sounds like his statistical output might be similar to MJ's then. If it's true, I think Robertson is underrated on a lot of these lists I see.

I bet.

[jongib369]

It sounds like his statistical output might be similar to MJ's then. If it's true, I think Robertson is underrated on a lot of these lists I see.

(Info will be updated as new information comes. Feel free to correct, or contribute with different players.)

PRF= Points+points from assists.

Any names with an * next to it is adjusted for assists that led to a 3 per game. Any stats from this season doesn't include the very last game the played

For players with the *, after the : will be that PRF stat calculated like every player before 97

In order from what I've gathered so far WITH the 3 advantage


Tiny 73- 56.8

Wilt 62- 55.2

Oscar 62- 53.6

Oscar 66- 53.5

Oscar 64- 53.4 | Oscar 65- 53.4

Oscar 67- 51.9

Wilt 63- 51.6

Oscar 61- 49.9

*LeBron 10- 49.6 : 46.84

Isiah 85- 49

Oscar 68- 48.6

Jordan in 89- 48.5

Magic 87- 48.3

Magic 89- 48.1

*Paul 09- 47.67 : 44.88

*Paul 08-47.63 : 44.22

Baylor in 62- 47.5

*Wade 09- 47.18 : 45.12

*Curry PER36 16- 47.03 : 45.2

Wilt 64- 46.9

*LeBron 08- 46.71 : 44.38

Jordan 87- 46.3

Stockton 90- 46.2 | West 70- 46.2

*Kobe 06- 45.83 : 44.4

*Nash 07-45.41 : 41.86

West 72- 45.2

Curry 16- 44.43 : 42.4

*Durant 14- 44.39 : 42.98

Oscar 69- 44.3

Kareem 72- 44

*Harden 15-43.81 : 41.36

Bird 87- 43.3

*Wall 16- 42.43 : 39.1

Wilt in 68- 41.5

*Curry 14- 41 : 40:8

*LeBron 16- 40.53 : 37.68

*Jordan 97- 39.24 : 38.18

*Shaq 00- 38.11 : 37.26

*Stockton 97-36.42 : 35.38

Didn't do his total as I'm not sure what range I should adjust his rebounds too...For Wilt it was a tad easier to guess he'd fall between Love and Rodman...But regardless, with PRF Oscar is among the best. At most Oscar shot 22.9 shots per game in a season, he could get that today. And I didn't adjust assists, if I'm not mistaken it was 1 step=no assist back in the 60s. Kind of a natural adjustment for pace...Though I'm open ears about that

http://i.usatoday.net/communitymanager/_photos/game-on/2010/10/22/1ablog-oscarrobertsonx-large.jpg

http://oi66.tinypic.com/2i97f3d.jpg

http://oi67.tinypic.com/33uzspf.jpg

http://oi64.tinypic.com/30ldvyr.jpg

http://oi63.tinypic.com/ap8idv.jpg

http://oi66.tinypic.com/20h0dbd.jpg

[Lebron23]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CHgv50mUMAAgwEt.jpg

[jongib369]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CHgv50mUMAAgwEt.jpg
Does Oscar, Baylor, and West pass your eye test? Saw your prediction about Curry on the College board haha

[tmacattack33]

I have clue about Oscar, but i do know Westbrook's bball IQ is so low that I'm sure Oscar was better.

[jongib369]

I have clue about Oscar, but i do know Westbrook's bball IQ is so low that I'm sure Oscar was better.

:lol

[SOD 21]

I have Oscar Robertson ranked as the 12 best player of all time, at least on my own personal list, and I don't mean when I'm about to say to be disrespectful about him.

But his numbers are somewhat inflated and doesn't necessarily translate well to this era because of pace and the absured number of minutes played back in the early 60's. The pace of play in the NBA in the early 60's was about 18% faster than today, which obviously means more possessions and more chances to score.

In addition to more possessions back in the early 60s due to a faster pace, Oscar also averaged nearly 46 minutes per game over the time that he averaged a triple double. His durability probably impresses me more than anything over that time.

But anyone can do the math on what Russell Westbrook would be doing with 18% more possessions and an additional 12 minutes per game. Those two factors would make his numbers this year something like 36 points, 11 rebounds and 15 assist per game.