Apple refuses to help FBI break into San Bernardino Shooters Phone

[KyrieTheFuture]

http://www.apple.com/customer-letter/

How does ISH feel about Privacy V Safety

[Draz]

Apple needs to continue to fight against this. It's the obvious choice, the only one we should choose. But, in the end, they'll lose. If it's for the sake of fighting against criminals, I'm sure it'll be forced out.

[NumberSix]

Obama

[Knicks102]

Obama
You're a terrible poster

[falc39]

The government is taking an incredibly stupid stance on this, basically going against every tech and security experts' arguments for encryption.

I'm not a fan of Apple products but I am 100% for their stance on this issue.

[Nick Young]

**** Apple.

[Patrick Chewing]

Just get a court order. Apple can suck it.

[fiddy]

i dont believe it

[oh the horror]

This is next level for the American government. Kind of scary

[Jameerthefear]

Good shit Apple

[LJJ]

Let's be real: Apple has already hooked the FBI up and this free publicity is the bureau's thank you to Apple.

[fiddy]

Let's be real: Apple has already hooked the FBI up and this free publicity is the bureau's thank you to Apple.
Its pretty obvious, muriccan humanoids are bitting doe

[falc39]

Let's be real: Apple has already hooked the FBI up and this free publicity is the bureau's thank you to Apple.

They have helped as much as they reasonably can. What the FBI wants is only possible through weakening encryption standards, which is something Apple has not done yet and is making their case here. It's a horrible idea.

[KyrieTheFuture]

So, why do conservatives desperately want government out of their lives, yet support the government monitoring every aspect of their life?

[fiddy]

So, why do conservatives desperately want government out of their lives, yet support the government monitoring every aspect of their life?
:biggums:

[HitandRun Reggie]

So, why do conservatives desperately want government out of their lives, yet support the government monitoring every aspect of their life?

Not all conservatives are backing Obama and the FBI on this. The libertarian wing on the right is definitely on Apple's side. There's only been one poster in thus thread who clearly wants Apole to cave into the government's wishes.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Not all conservatives are backing Obama and the FBI on this. The libertarian wing on the right is definitely on Apple's side. There's only been one poster in thus thread who clearly wants Apole to cave into the government's wishes.
I mistakenly let my FB feed affect my responses in the thread.

[FillJackson]

Just get a court order. Apple can suck it.

They have already turned over any data that they had.

And they way the OP phrased this doesn't show the full issue.

Apple refuses to help FBI break into San Bernardino Shooters Phone

The issue is Apple refuses to build a master-key to unlock all iphones including the phone of the San Bernadino Shooters.



On another note, the NY Times got an NSA report declassifed. Full Report (https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/2712306-Savage-NYT-FOIA-IG-Reports-702-2.html). Article. (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/17/us/report-says-networks-give-nsa-less-data-than-long-suspected.html?_r=0)

Tweet.

Declassified NSA report adds to evidence NSA is not directly rooting through all Internet data to or from Americans http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/17/us/report-says-networks-give-nsa-less-data-than-long-suspected.html …

Basically, the info the government requests under the 702 rules. (http://fas.org/irp/news/2013/06/nsa-sect702.pdf) is targeted only to certain selectors and this filtering happens before it reaches the government. The effect is that the government is collecting less info than previously thought. 702 is the overseas rules while 215 is the domestic rules. (Correct me if I'm wrong on this.)

This makes sense in terms of efficiency. Separating the wheat from the chaff at the source, means that you have less junk to wade through and thus can find what you want quicker.

The report indicates that when the N.S.A. conducts Internet surveillance under the FISA Amendments Act, companies that operate the Internet are probably turning over just emails to, from or about the N.S.A.’s foreign targets — not all the data crossing their switches, as the critics had presumed.

[DeuceWallaces]

They can't force Apple employees to become unwilling agents of the government.

Case closed.

No amount of court orders can change that.

[FillJackson]

Basically, the info the government requests under the 702 rules. (http://fas.org/irp/news/2013/06/nsa-sect702.pdf) is targeted only to certain selectors and this filtering happens before it reaches the government. The effect is that the government is collecting less info than previously thought. 702 is the overseas rules while 215 is the domestic rules. (Correct me if I'm wrong on this.)

Wierd. Just read this on twitter today. I think this is from the same batch of recently declassified documents. This guy concludes they 215 searches were also way less invasive, because while legally they could go to three hops, policy stopped at two and you had to come up with a reason to go to three and get approval from higher ups for three hops.

Electrospaces ‏@electrospaces 9h9 hours ago
Unlike what most people (incl. PCLOB) assumed, NSA rarely went to 3 hops in contact chaining domestic phone numbers:

Also, federated queries make that these #Section215 contact chains are made up of both domestic and foreign numbers:

This means that contact chaining under the #Section215 program, involved far less American phone numbers than often presumed


he goes into tons of detail here on his blog and concludes:
Conclusion

As we have seen, the domestic phone records collected by NSA under Section 215 are used for contact chaining that combines both domestic and foreign identifiers. NSA never explicitly explained this, probably because they didn't want to draw attention to their foreign metadata collection and analysis efforts. But it did became clear from the many documents about the Section 215 program that were declassified by the US government.

These documents showed that NSA rarely went to 3 hops of contact chaining, which is contrary to what most people, including the Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board (PCLOB) assumed. Because of the federated queries, the resulting contact chains were made up of both domestic and foreign identifiers, which means contact chaining under the Section 215 program involved far less American phone numbers than often presumed.

[bladefd]

Can you get a court order that forces them to change their os?

There is no precedent for anything like this. I believe it would reach federal high court with both sides arguing. In the end, I do not know how much power a judge or jury has over this. They cannot force Apple to put up a backdoor. They are not breaking any laws but they would be in direct violation of a court order.

It would have big implications moving forward though when it comes to security. If it gets to court. Would be interesting though -- Apple v. US