If Lebron makes his 6th straight Finals...

[JT123]

Is he automatically consensus top 2 all time? :confusedshrug:
Think about the odds he's overcoming.

1. A midseason coaching change and being unfairly blamed for it.
2. A second option who is only worried about his brand and wants out.
3. A 3rd option who can't shoot and plays no defense. The bad defense was expected, but what good are players like him if they can't shoot either? :facepalm

If Lebron can get this group to the Finals his legacy as top 2 all time is officially locked in, period.

[Ranked 12th]

I'm a HUGE Kobe fan, but if LeBron makes 6 straight finals I'll have no choice but to call him GOAT

[JT123]

I'm a HUGE Kobe fan, but if LeBron makes 6 straight finals I'll have no choice but to call him GOAT
An objective poster, we don't have many of those round here. Welcome to ISH new guy. :cheers:

[imnew09]

And lose fken 4 of them. Damn son

[poido123]

At some point, he needs to win right?


Or are we cutting him slack to measure him up against just mediocre?


If that's the case, he's definitely a candidate for my top 30.

[stalkerforlife]

Most any top 15-20 player of all time would go to the finals every year in the east with the most stacked team in the NBA.

You know that, though.

[Ranked 12th]

An objective poster, we don't have many of those round here. Welcome to ISH new guy. :cheers:

Thanks bud :cheers:

And thanks for taking a leadership position as CEO of the Simon Family, hopefully we can follow in the footsteps of the prestigious LeBron Family, and carve out a group similar in stature. :applause:

[JT123]

16-6 :cry: :cry:
:(

[JT123]

At some point, he needs to win right?


Or are we cutting him slack to measure him up against just mediocre?


If that's the case, he's definitely a candidate for my top 30.
He's already won twice :wtf:

[CarlosBoozer]

He's already won twice :wtf:
He got that kobe fg % doe :facepalm

[Ranked 12th]

He's already won twice :wtf:

poido's been exposed as a terrorist, don't pay him any attention

[imdaman99]

When you wanna be on Mount Rushmore of NBA players, you're gonna need to win more than 2 of those

[Hey Yo]

And lose fken 4 of them. Damn son
That's how many Magic lost and he had the easiest path to the Finals for like 7 of them.

[tmacattack33]

It will definitely be pretty impressive.

It loses its impressiveness due to the weak East, but then when you factor in Bosh's injury in 2012 and Love/Irving's injuries in 2015, along with the fact that his supporting cast in 2007 was very weak period, it regains its impressiveness.

[tmacattack33]

Most any top 15-20 player of all time would go to the finals every year in the east with the most stacked team in the NBA.

You know that, though.

Like Wade (only got there once without Lebron)?

Or KG (only got there twice, despite being in the East from 2008-2015...the last two years are unfair to count against him, so let's make that 2008-2013...six years, and he only got to the Finals twice).

[TheMarkMadsen]

Like Wade (only got there once without Lebron)?

Or KG (only got there twice, despite being in the East from 2008-2015...the last two years are unfair to count against him, so let's make that 2008-2013...six years, and he only got to the Finals twice).


this dude is seriously comparing 34 and 35 year old year KG to prime Lebron :oldlol: :oldlol:

[Ranked 12th]

this dude is seriously comparing 34 and 35 year old year KG to prime Lebron :oldlol: :oldlol:

No, but a completely Prime Kobe missed the playoffs in 2005

[JT123]

No, but a completely Prime Kobe missed the playoffs in 2005
Ouch :(

[Fudge]

Top 2 GOAT family, here we come!!!!!

[Ranked 12th]

HOLY, the Simon Family RUNS this forum :banana:

[JT123]

Top 2 GOAT family, here we come!!!!!
:banana:

[Ranked 12th]

Simon.

[Hey Yo]

Like Wade (only got there once without Lebron)?

Or KG (only got there twice, despite being in the East from 2008-2015...the last two years are unfair to count against him, so let's make that 2008-2013...six years, and he only got to the Finals twice).
But....but..... Riley is the Godfather. He's the wizard who knows how to weave his magic by getting Miami to one Finals(and winning that one) in the 15yrs before LeBron came on board.

[poido123]

He's already won twice :wtf:


It's been such a long resume full of failures, I sometimes forget that he actually won two rings with Wade.


Another finals appearance. Another loss. Rinse and repeat.



What a champion :oldlol:

[Bandito]

Lebron our Lord Saviour...:bowdown:

We are not worthy!!!

[retaxis]

Not really

If your not first your last

[JT123]

But....but..... Riley is the Godfather. He's the wizard who knows how to weave his magic by getting Miami to one Finals(and winning that one) in the 15yrs before LeBron came on board.
:lol

[Wade's Rings]

Like Wade (only got there once without Lebron)?

Or KG (only got there twice, despite being in the East from 2008-2015...the last two years are unfair to count against him, so let's make that 2008-2013...six years, and he only got to the Finals twice).

What stacked teams in the "weak" east did Wade have pre-Bron?

KG was hurt in '09 and he was much older than Bron.

[Ranked 12th]

What stacked teams in the "weak" east did Wade have pre-Bron?

KG was hurt in '09 and he was much older than Bron.

What about now?


Bosh, Amare, Dragic, Whiteside, Winslow not enough for little Wade? :(




Wade has more help than LeBron this season

[IllegalD]

Simons still holding those life Ls. :lol

At this point it's just sad and pathetic to watch a young man waste away his youth like this. :(

[Wade's Rings]

What about now?


Bosh, Amare, Dragic, Whiteside, Winslow not enough for little Wade? :(




Wade has more help than LeBron this season

I didn't realize the Playoffs have already happened.

[JT123]

What about now?


Bosh, Amare, Dragic, Whiteside, Winslow not enough for little Wade? :(




Wade has more help than LeBron this season
Bingo! And we already know that Bosh will be returning, so I don't want to hear any excuses from Wade fan boys if the Heat get bounced by the Cavs. Time for Wade to put up or shut up.

[tmacattack33]

this dude is seriously comparing 34 and 35 year old year KG to prime Lebron :oldlol: :oldlol:

Name me another top 20 player besides Lebron that played in the East over the past 10 years.

There's only been two, Wade and KG. So I had to use KG or else we would only have one player to look at here.

[kamil]

And lose fken 4 of them. Damn son

3 of them in a row as well. That will be LeBrons* only three-peat, haha.

[pauk]

And lose fken 4 of them. Damn son

So you would rather portray choking / less impact / will to win by losing earlier and/or even missing playoffs... clearly more prestigious...

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/19/199fc1991d79d23592e4d467d3fd605721d7f238e9ffabc68e 558542819e9a85.jpg

[34-24 Footwork]

So you would rather portray choking / less impact / will to win by losing earlier and/or even missing playoffs... clearly more prestigious...

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/19/199fc1991d79d23592e4d467d3fd605721d7f238e9ffabc68e 558542819e9a85.jpg

It's about him not being able to deliver more than 2 rings in the worst conference of all time despite stacking the deck in his favor. It's pretty pathetic

[ballinhun8]

So you would rather portray choking / less impact / will to win by losing earlier and/or even missing playoffs... clearly more prestigious...

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/19/199fc1991d79d23592e4d467d3fd605721d7f238e9ffabc68e 558542819e9a85.jpg


Alot of people look it that way. The NBA is the easiest sport to take over single handedly.




And lebron has been the best player in the Finals series at least 5 out of 7 times. (TD, Curry). So he should have been able to deliver more when it was expected of him.

[BlazerRed]

2/7

[TheMarkMadsen]

Name me another top 20 player besides Lebron that played in the East over the past 10 years.

There's only been two, Wade and KG. So I had to use KG or else we would only have one player to look at here.


by only being able to name two superstars in the east, one which Lebron played with and the other who was past his prime the entire time you're just furthering our point of how pathetically bad the east has been for some time now

[Lebronxrings]

So you would rather portray choking / less impact / will to win by losing earlier and/or even missing playoffs... clearly more prestigious...

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/19/199fc1991d79d23592e4d467d3fd605721d7f238e9ffabc68e 558542819e9a85.jpg
dam, ether. Pauk stays winning.

[SamuraiSWISH]

It's both impressive, and not impressive at the same time. He did it in an extremely weak east, on hand picked teams he hopped on with, which featured a littany of super talent. He did face some adversity with injuries and declines to Wade, Bosh, Love, and Kyrie. But not the extent that the road to the Finals ever became truly difficult given the quality level within his own conference.

[pauk]

Alot of people look it that way. The NBA is the easiest sport to take over single handedly.




And lebron has been the best player in the Finals series at least 5 out of 7 times. (TD, Curry). So he should have been able to deliver more when it was expected of him.

So you would deliberately quit earlier and/or even deliberately miss playoffs just to protect your Finals win% because you damn sure know your supporting cast is not good enough....

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/19/199fc1991d79d23592e4d467d3fd605721d7f238e9ffabc68e 558542819e9a85.jpg

...as far as Lebron goes he did deliver, he delivered more than anybody he faced in the Finals except for 2011 Finals (which is the only Finals performance he underperformed, i give him a pass for 2007).... Lebron playing up to his standards is not a problem, the problem is that this is a team game... the problem is that you can be the greatest player to ever lace em up, average 50-10-10-10-10 and end up completely ringless BECAUSE this is a team game BECAUSE of lack of supporting cast to overcome the opposing team.... BECAUSE the best team wins the championship, not the best player....

Jordan didnt win his 1st championship because HE got better, but because his TEAM got better.
Lebron didnt win his 1st championship because HE got better, but because his TEAM got better.
Shaq......
Russell....
Wilt...
Kareem...
list is long...

ALL you can ask from ONE player is to play up to his standards, the rest is completely out of his hands (how well his teammates defend, rebound, shoot, pass, score, dribble etc.)....

This is a 100% team accomplishment... this is not tennis... 1vs1... if it was, Lebron would have never lost a Finals...

[PsychoBe]

bran choked in '15 finals by shooting 30%. if kobe ever shot that low he'd be vilified.

and in the '14 finals he put up 8 points in the second half in two games before statpadding near the end.

of course we all know about the '11 finals.

and in the '07 finals his team lost by single digits yet bran's putrid performance is what enabled the spurs to sweep him.

another embarrassing finals loss will force me to put him in the bottom half of the top 25.

[PsychoBe]

please defend this pauk


He was hurt and not supposed to be playing. Bron statpadded his numbers in '14.

Game 3
Lebron had 14 points and 0 TO in first quarter, then 8 points and 7 TOs for the last 3 quarters. LeBron had 22-5-7-5 with 7 TOs on 64%, Wade had 22-4-2-2 with 5 TOs on 67%.

But over the last 3 quarters, LeBron had 8 points and 7 TOs to Wades 20 points and 3 TOs. The Heat cut the lead from 15 to 9 without LeBron, after Wade subbed in for him, from the 5:00 to 1:00 mark of the 3rd quarter, but even with that help LeBron still lost.

Game 4
Lebron had 9 points in first half and the Heat were blown out by 19 at halftime. He padded his stats from there, and he did not score on Leonard in the first half.

Game 5
Lebron had 1 FG in 2nd quarter (2:30 mark) to bring the Heat within 5. Then he did not score again until the Heat were down 21 with 4:40 in the 3rd. LeBron shot 1-6 against Leonard this game according to the ESPN article MVP Leonard Does it All (and according to the same article Leonard shot 65% on LeBron for the series)

[ballinhun8]

So you would deliberately quit earlier and/or even deliberately miss playoffs just to protect your Finals win% because you damn sure know your supporting cast is not good enough....

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/19/199fc1991d79d23592e4d467d3fd605721d7f238e9ffabc68e 558542819e9a85.jpg

...as far as Lebron goes he did deliver, he delivered more than anybody he faced in the Finals except for 2011 Finals (which is the only Finals performance he underperformed, i give him a pass for 2007).... Lebron playing up to his standards is not a problem, the problem is that this is a team game... the problem is that you can be the greatest player to ever lace em up, average 50-10-10-10-10 and end up completely ringless BECAUSE this is a team game BECAUSE of lack of supporting cast to overcome the opposing team.... BECAUSE the best team wins the championship, not the best player....

Jordan didnt win his 1st championship because HE got better, but because his TEAM got better.
Lebron didnt win his 1st championship because HE got better, but because his TEAM got better.
Shaq......
Russell....
Wilt...
Kareem...
list is long...

ALL you can ask from ONE player is to play up to his standards, the rest is completely out of his hands (how well his teammates defend, rebound, shoot, pass, score, dribble etc.)....

This is a 100% team accomplishment... this is not tennis... 1vs1... if it was, Lebron would have never lost a Finals...


No, see you're wrong here. As much as if is a team accomplishment, one guy can simply make such an impact that he elevated not only his game but everyone around him. You wanna give him a pass for 07? No, it doesn't work that way. He underachieved in that series woefully. Did he deliver in 11? No he did not, he constantly deferred and shied away from the clutch. Did he deliver in 14? Stats wise say yes, impact says no. 15? Yea his team was injured but nobody was questioning thst with a 2-1 series lead and game 4 at home.

The fact of the matter is, he played up to his standards. That's what you're saying. But guess what. Playing up to your standards is not what is going to win you championships. Playing and performing at another level is what makes you a great winner and champion. Look at Jordan in 93. Ridiculous impact because he took his game to outer worldly heights. And this is after back to back ships. You'd think maybe he got bored or tired but no, he played arguably better than the first two championship series and that's saying a damn lot.



That's "Logic".


Not the sh*t you spew

[PsychoBe]

No, see you're wrong here. As much as if is a team accomplishment, one guy can simply make such an impact that he elevated not only his game but everyone around him. You wanna give him a pass for 07? No, it doesn't work that way. He underachieved in that series woefully. Did he deliver in 11? No he did not, he constantly deferred and shied away from the clutch. Did he deliver in 14? Stats wise say yes, impact says no. 15? Yea his team was injured but nobody was questioning thst with a 2-1 series lead and game 4 at home.

The fact of the matter is, he played up to his standards. That's what you're saying. But guess what. Playing up to your standards is not what is going to win you championships. Playing and performing at another level is what makes you a great winner and champion. Look at Jordan in 93. Ridiculous impact because he took his game to outer worldly heights. And this is after back to back ships. You'd think maybe he got bored or tired but no, he played arguably better than the first two championship series and that's saying a damn lot.



That's "Logic".


Not the sh*t you spew

this. especially the bolded.

no way in hell does bran get a "pass" for his second worst finals performance and the absolute worst finals showcase in the 21st century (embarrassingly swept).

i might actually make a thread about this. the games were a lot closer than people think and it was all literally bran's fault as to why his team lost.

[Gileraracer]

He lost 72% of them :lol