Gordon Hayward is a top 10 player

[masonanddixon]

Playing elite defense, getting to the line AT WILL, and incredibly clutch.

[dannywpt]

yes, but no

[Cocaine80s]

Top 10 in the Western Conference.... maybe

[SouBeachTalents]

Why would a white supremacist fakkit like OP even watch basketball when like 90% of the league is black? You want to prop up white athletes, you literally picked the worst possible sport to do so

[Fudge]

He might not even be the best player on his team.

Favors and Gobert are arguably better.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Goes to show this season is part of a weak era

Cant wait for the young players of today to grow up and take over the league

[feyki]

Favors
Harden
Gobert
Butler
Westbrook
Durant
Lebron
Love
Dirk
Chris Paul
Curry
Klay
Dray
Dru
Lowry
Derozan
Isiaih
George
Wade
Whiteside
Wall
Kawhi
Aldridge
Davis
Cousins
Deandre

These are better .


Edit ;

Plus , Lilliard,Horford,Teague,Millsap,Pau,Kemba .

Not in top 30 .

[GrapeApe]

20/4/5/1.2/0.3 on 43%, 18.5 PER on a 35-36 team.

Good player. Top 10? Not even close.

[masonanddixon]

20/4/5/1.2/0.3 on 43%, 18.5 PER on a 35-36 team.

Good player. Top 10? Not even close.

How is a guy like Paul George any better?

[masonanddixon]

Favors
Harden
Gobert
Butler
Westbrook
Durant
Lebron
Love
Dirk
Chris Paul
Curry
Klay
Dray
Dru
Lowry
Derozan
Isiaih
George
Wade
Whiteside
Wall
Kawhi
Aldridge
Davis
Cousins
Deandre

These are better .


lol Isaiah Thomas? Come on man. Deandre? Wall?

And who the hell is Dru?

[Gotterdammerung]

Never mind the blatant trolling or naked racism, Gordon Hayward has a promising future, and will be an All-Pro if his career trajectory continues unabated, making the top 10-15. He is fundamentally sound and aggressive, and will be an All-Star once his team gets in the playoffs and starts contending. :cheers:

[feyki]

lol Isaiah Thomas? Come on man. Deandre? Wall?

And who the hell is Dru?

All star players . Hayward has opposite .

[masonanddixon]

Never mind the blatant trolling or naked racism, Gordon Hayward has a promising future, and will be an All-Pro if his career trajectory continues unabated, making the top 10-15. He is fundamentally sound and aggressive, and will be an All-Star once his team gets in the playoffs and starts contending. :cheers:

Yes the anti-white racists disgust me

[GrapeApe]

How is a guy like Paul George any better?

Better raw stats, better advanced stats, better defender, better team record? Pretty much all the ways in which a player is judged? George has also twice led a team to the conference finals.

Hayward is nice, but I think he's more suited as a 2nd guy.

[DonDraper]

Better raw stats, better advanced stats, better defender, better team record? Pretty much all the ways in which a player is judged? George has also twice led a team to the conference finals.

Hayward is nice, but I think he's more suited as a 2nd guy.

Haywards getting better stats than Wade

[GrapeApe]

Haywards getting better stats than Wade

Not really, but nobody is calling Wade a top 10 player.

Wade: 19/5/4/1/.5 on 45%, 20.5 PER

[masonanddixon]

Better raw stats, better advanced stats, better defender, better team record? Pretty much all the ways in which a player is judged? George has also twice led a team to the conference finals.

Hayward is nice, but I think he's more suited as a 2nd guy.

They are both best suited as second options and I don't think George is a better defender. They are both elite on that side of the ball.

[You Cant Ban Me]

Gordon Hayward = yalls lebron and by yall you know what i mean

you can rate him whereever you want in your top 100 list...have fun rofl

[FireDavidKahn]

Top 10 white guy

[SchrOEder]

Better raw stats, better advanced stats, better defender, better team record? Pretty much all the ways in which a player is judged? George has also twice led a team to the conference finals.

Hayward is nice, but I think he's more suited as a 2nd guy.


hayward is underrated but not a top10 player

paul george is overrated and not a top 20 player

its haywards 6th year....if he doesnt push his stats to like 22 ppg/6reb on consistently 45-46% with PER over 20 you are right. I do not think that he can be a real franchise player like wade, kobe, duncan, dirk, garnett, melo, lebron, durant etc. But he can be like a "second tier" type of franchise player. Surrounded by a talented team, hawyard can be the key player for a succesful franchise.
Look at the hawks for example....

[Xiao Yao You]

He might not even be the best player on his team.

Favors and Gobert are arguably better.

and now Mack

[SchrOEder]

and now Mack

cmon. hayward is the most versatile player on the jazz. he can create his own shot, plays good defense, can shoot, dribble and drive to the basket.

he is the complete package....just not at an all-nba level yet. he struggled this year with his shot, but he is def. fringe-AS material.

[pastis]

give me hayward over melo and paul george

[Fallen Angel]

^ Neither are Top 15 players, that's not saying much in conjunction to this thread.

[90sgoat]

Hayward is only held back by his ability and dicipline to follow a team concept unlike moronic neck tattoo 'stars' like Melo.

Let Hayward play like Melo on the same NY team and he easily gets 25ppg a game.

[MiseryCityTexas]

He is a 100 times better version of Chandler Parsons.

[pastis]

He is a 100 times better version of Chandler Parsons.

yep. would be a huge improvement for the mavs if they swap parsons with hayward.

[jayfan]

Hayward is the best player on his team. Hood is second best.






.

[MellowYellow]

Durant
Leonard
Lebron
Melo
George
Batum
Hayward

I guess he is a top 10 sf

[Xiao Yao You]

Hayward is the best player on his team. Hood is second best.






.

You haven't seen them play much I take it.

[90sgoat]

You haven't seen them play much I take it.

If you really think Hood is better than Hayward then you're retarded and nothing you say should be considered:lol

[Lebron23]

Maybe in the KKK Party. You stupid white supremacist.

[masonanddixon]

Maybe in the KKK Party. You stupid white supremacist.

Settle down. I'm allowed to have opinions.

[WayOfWade]

Hayward is the best player on his team. Hood is second best.






.
What planet are you living on? Gobert is more important than Hayward, and as of late Mack has played better although I believe Hayward to be the better player. You could even argue Favors as being better than Hayward, but that's a harder argument; he's definitely better than Hood though.


and now Mack
I feel like your personal disdain for how much more preferred Hayward is in Utah compared to Gobert might be clouding your judgement. Mack is playing better now, but Hayward is better player and once he's cured of that plantar fasciitis it'll show much more clearly

[WayOfWade]

If you really think Hood is better than Hayward then you're retarded and nothing you say should be considered:lol
He isn't referring to Hood being better than Hayward, he's referring to Hood being their second best player, which he isn't

[masonanddixon]

What planet are you living on? Gobert is more important than Hayward, and as of late Mack has played better although I believe Hayward to be the better player. You could even argue Favors as being better than Hayward, but that's a harder argument; he's definitely better than Hood though.


I feel like your personal disdain for how much more preferred Hayward is in Utah compared to Gobert might be clouding your judgement. Mack is playing better now, but Hayward is better player and once he's cured of that plantar fasciitis it'll show much more clearly

Mack is terrible, man.

I know you have a hard-on for Gobert but he's a non-factor on offense, basically an Alonzo Mourning type player. A great defensive anchor but you can't build around him.

edit: I meant this for the Xiao Xo guy who is obsessed with Rudy.

[BasedTom]

dragic just dunked, mason. just thought you should know

[masonanddixon]

dragic just dunked, mason. just thought you should know

First dunk of the season?

[BasedTom]

First dunk of the season?
heat announcers just confirmed it

[WayOfWade]

Mack is terrible, man.

I know you have a hard-on for Gobert but he's a non-factor on offense, basically an Alonzo Mourning type player. A great defensive anchor but you can't build around him.

edit: I meant this for the Xiao Xo guy who is obsessed with Rudy.
Ok, I was confused for a second. And Mack isn't terrible, with the Jazz he's averaging 12.5/3.8/5.6 on 45% shooting and 43% from 3, you can't call that terrible coming from a former 3rd string point guard. Will he drop back down to earth? Probably but hopefully not, but he is arguably the best deadline acquisition in the league

[Fudge]

Hayward is like, barely a top 10 player at his position. Never mind top 10 player in the league. :lol

Durant
LeBron
Leonard
George
Melo
Antetekounmpo
Batum
Wiggins
Crowder
Hayward?

[masonanddixon]

Hayward is like, barely a top 10 player at his position. Never mind top 10 player in the league. :lol

Durant
LeBron
Leonard
George
Melo
Antetekounmpo
Batum
Wiggins
Crowder
Hayward?

LMAO. Crowder, Wiggins, Batum, Giannis? Get the hell out of here.

[Lebron23]

Settle down. I'm allowed to have opinions.


No, You're Not Entitled To Your Opinion. Hayward is a good player, but he's not a top 10 player in this league. Maybe a top 6-7 player at the small forward position.

[Fudge]

LMAO. Crowder, Wiggins, Batum, Giannis? Get the hell out of here.
Haha, yup. Crowder and Batum are better players. Giannis is MUCH better. It's not even close actually.

[Fudge]

No, You're Not Entitled To Your Opinion. Hayward is a good player, but he's not a top 10 player in this league. Maybe a top 6-7 player at the small forward position.
I just listed 9 SF's that are easily better than him. Top 6-7 SF is reaching.

[DonDraper]

LMAO. Crowder, Wiggins, Batum, Giannis? Get the hell out of here.

u mad bruh? :roll:

[WayOfWade]

Hayward is like, barely a top 10 player at his position. Never mind top 10 player in the league. :lol

Durant
LeBron
Leonard
George
Melo
Antetekounmpo
Batum
Wiggins
Crowder
Hayward?
Just wow Fudge, I didn't think you were this mentally retarded before. Hayward is better offensively than Batum, Wiggins, and Crowder, and is also better defensively than Giannis, Wiggins and Batum. Don't get me wrong those guys are good and there's a good chance they'll be better than him eventually, but as for now Hayward sits at around #6

[Fudge]

Just wow Fudge, I didn't think you were this mentally retarded before. Hayward is better offensively than Batum, Wiggins, and Crowder, and is also better defensively than Giannis, Wiggins and Batum. Don't get me wrong those guys are good and there's a good chance they'll be better than him eventually, but as for now Hayward sits at around #6
Definitely better than all of them last year.

Not this year.

Definitely not better than Giannis. Not better defensively OR offensively, outside of shooting. Maybeeeee better than Wiggins, only because he doesn't really bring anything else to the table other than score.

He was supposed to take that leap to the Paul George's and Melo's of the league this year, but dude regressed. :lol How does that happen? Looks to be in the best shape of his life. One one of the best defensive teams in the league coming into the year. Everything seemed like it was coming together, and he takes a step backward. Sorry af.

[DonDraper]

Definitely better than all of them last year.

Not this year.

Definitely not better than Giannis. Not better defensively OR offensively, outside of shooting. Maybeeeee better than Wiggins, only because he doesn't really bring anything else to the table other than score.

He was supposed to take that leap to the Paul George's and Melo's of the league this year, but dude regressed. :lol How does that happen? Looks to be in the best shape of his life. One one of the best defensive teams in the league coming into the year. Everything seemed like it was coming together, and he takes a step backward. Sorry af.

#rekt :lol

[WayOfWade]

Definitely better than all of them last year.

Not this year.

Definitely not better than Giannis. Not better defensively OR offensively, outside of shooting. Maybeeeee better than Wiggins, only because he doesn't really bring anything else to the table other than score.

He was supposed to take that leap to the Paul George's and Melo's of the league this year, but dude regressed. :lol How does that happen? Looks to be in the best shape of his life. One one of the best defensive teams in the league coming into the year. Everything seemed like it was coming together, and he takes a step backward. Sorry af.
I have never seen such ignorance in my life. How the crap is 20/5/4 a regression from 19/5/4? If anything he's improved seeing as he's had to carry half a carcass this year with all the injuries the Jazz have had. And since you are so misinformed, just know that Alec Burks (one of the leading bench scorers in the league) has been out nearly 45 games, Derrick Favors has missed nearly 20 games with assorted injuries, Rudy Gobert missed even more than that with a sprained MCL, starting PG Dante Exum tore his ACL, putting even more defensive pressure on Hayward. Tell me again how he has regressed? His %'s are down, but I have already provided ample evidence that shows that is not regression, but lack of a good team surrounding him (Jeff Withey, Trevor Booker, and Chris Johnson were his fellow starters at one point :facepalm)
Is he in Paul George or Melo's territory? No, but he is far and away better than that role-player Crowded, currently is better than Antetekounmpo, Wiggins can jump higher than Hayward, and that's it. And Batum?! HA! Batum cannot lead a team, bottom line, he cannot be a #1 option (nor can Crowder).
Now please post something intelligent and well thought out, although judging by all your posts there isn't a high chance of that ever actually happening

[stalkerforlife]

Love Hayward, but his passiveness hinders his potential.

Dude has too much talent to be so passive.

[WayOfWade]

Love Hayward, but his passiveness hinders his potential.

Dude has too much talent to be so passive.
Repped, accurate post, hit the nail right on the head although a lot of his passiveness comes from the system

[stalkerforlife]

Repped, accurate post, hit the nail right on the head although a lot of his passiveness comes from the system

:cheers:

[Fudge]

I have never seen such ignorance in my life. How the crap is 20/5/4 a regression from 19/5/4? If anything he's improved seeing as he's had to carry half a carcass this year with all the injuries the Jazz have had. And since you are so misinformed, just know that Alec Burks (one of the leading bench scorers in the league) has been out nearly 45 games, Derrick Favors has missed nearly 20 games with assorted injuries, Rudy Gobert missed even more than that with a sprained MCL, starting PG Dante Exum tore his ACL, putting even more defensive pressure on Hayward. Tell me again how he has regressed? His %'s are down, but I have already provided ample evidence that shows that is not regression, but lack of a good team surrounding him (Jeff Withey, Trevor Booker, and Chris Johnson were his fellow starters at one point :facepalm)
Is he in Paul George or Melo's territory? No, but he is far and away better than that role-player Crowded, currently is better than Antetekounmpo, Wiggins can jump higher than Hayward, and that's it. And Batum?! HA! Batum cannot lead a team, bottom line, he cannot be a #1 option (nor can Crowder).
Now please post something intelligent and well thought out, although judging by all your posts there isn't a high chance of that ever actually happening
Eye test, homie.

He wasn't as good as he was last year. That's regression. This was supposed to be his year to be with the best of them, but he isn't. He flat out wet the bed. Simple as that.

He has a GREAT team around him, you imbecile. Outside of Gobert missing some games, they aren't really missing the rest of those scrubs that are on the shelf.

Batum hasn't lead a team, because he hasn't had the chance to. Bet if you have the both of them switch roles, the Jazz would have locked up the 5 seed already. Same can be said with Giannis.

Crowder is an anchor type of player. A glue guy. A very very very good glue guy. Almost elite. And depending on the players I have on my team already, i'd probably still take Crower 9 times out of 10. The defense, the edge, the energy, the shooting, the versatility. Not even a question.

Wiggins...mm yeah. I'll give you that. Right now, Hayward is probably better.

But starting a team right now? Factoring in age and everything. I'd take Wiggins, and the rest of those guys over Gordy.

I live in SLC, homie. I watch Jazz games a lot. Do you?

[DonDraper]

Eye test, homie.

He wasn't as good as he was last year. That's regression. This was supposed to be his year to be with the best of them, but he isn't. He flat out wet the bed. Simple as that.

He has a GREAT team around him, you imbecile. Outside of Gobert missing some games, they aren't really missing the rest of those scrubs that are on the shelf.

Batum hasn't lead a team, because he hasn't had the chance to. Bet if you have the both of them switch roles, the Jazz would have locked up the 5 seed already. Same can be said with Giannis.

Crowder is an anchor type of player. A glue guy. A very very very good glue guy. Almost elite. And depending on the players I have on my team already, i'd probably still take Crower 9 times out of 10. The defense, the edge, the energy, the shooting, the versatility. Not even a question.

Wiggins...mm yeah. I'll give you that. Right now, Hayward is probably better.

But starting a team right now? Factoring in age and everything. I'd take Wiggins, and the rest of those guys over Gordy.

I live in SLC, homie. I watch Jazz games a lot. Do you?


Damn, dropping knowledge.

[Fudge]

Damn, dropping knowledge.
:pimp: :cheers:

[WayOfWade]

Eye test, homie.

He wasn't as good as he was last year. That's regression. This was supposed to be his year to be with the best of them, but he isn't. He flat out wet the bed. Simple as that.

He has a GREAT team around him, you imbecile. Outside of Gobert missing some games, they aren't really missing the rest of those scrubs that are on the shelf.

Batum hasn't lead a team, because he hasn't had the chance to. Bet if you have the both of them switch roles, the Jazz would have locked up the 5 seed already. Same can be said with Giannis.

Crowder is an anchor type of player. A glue guy. A very very very good glue guy. Almost elite. And depending on the players I have on my team already, i'd probably still take Crower 9 times out of 10. The defense, the edge, the energy, the shooting, the versatility. Not even a question.

Wiggins...mm yeah. I'll give you that. Right now, Hayward is probably better.

But starting a team right now? Factoring in age and everything. I'd take Wiggins, and the rest of those guys over Gordy.

I live in SLC, homie. I watch Jazz games a lot. Do you?
This was actually a fantastic post, will rep tomorrow when I can. I completely agree with you on Wiggins, he'll definitely be better for a franchise to build on, I'd just take Hayward to win me a single game today.
Also, I love Crowder, both he and Hayward are better suited for supporting rolls which Crowder is currently in and Hayward is forced out of. I can understand that argument though, Crowder is a great player.
But how can you say that Hayward has a great team around him when half of it has been MIA? Like I said, rolling with Booker and Withey starting for large chunks of time won't get you anywhere. Since you watch games all the time I assumed you might know that, but apparently not. And Batum would not lead this team to a 5 seed or anywhere near it, dude is a bonafide role player and can't get his own shot; is very versatile, but cannot carry a team like Hayward can.
As for Giannis... I concede he might do a better job, dude is a freak but sadly is leading an under-achieving and healthy Bucks team which hurts him. I'll also give you eye-test, I watched zero Jazz games last year (or the year before) de to a two-year hiatus I took in Ecuador.
I do watch almost all Jazz games though, except last night's game, I was out balling

[DonDraper]

This was actually a fantastic post, will rep tomorrow when I can. I completely agree with you on Wiggins, he'll definitely be better for a franchise to build on, I'd just take Hayward to win me a single game today.
Also, I love Crowder, both he and Hayward are better suited for supporting rolls which Crowder is currently in and Hayward is forced out of. I can understand that argument though, Crowder is a great player.
But how can you say that Hayward has a great team around him when half of it has been MIA? Like I said, rolling with Booker and Wothey starting for large chunks of time won't get you anywhere. Since you watch games all the time I assumed you might know that, but apparently not. And Batum would not lead this team to a 5 seed or anywhere near it, dude is a bonafide role player and can't get his own shot; is very versatile, but cannot carry a team like Hayward can.
As for Giannis... I concede he might do a better job, dude is a freak but sadly is leading an under-achieving and healthy Bucks team which hurts him. I'll also give you eye-test, I watched zero Jazz games last year (or the year before) de to a two-year hiatus I took in Ecuador.
I do watch almost all Jazz games though, except last night's game, I was out balling

:cheers:

[Fudge]

This was actually a fantastic post, will rep tomorrow when I can. I completely agree with you on Wiggins, he'll definitely be better for a franchise to build on, I'd just take Hayward to win me a single game today.
Also, I love Crowder, both he and Hayward are better suited for supporting rolls which Crowder is currently in and Hayward is forced out of. I can understand that argument though, Crowder is a great player.
But how can you say that Hayward has a great team around him when half of it has been MIA? Like I said, rolling with Booker and Withey starting for large chunks of time won't get you anywhere. Since you watch games all the time I assumed you might know that, but apparently not. And Batum would not lead this team to a 5 seed or anywhere near it, dude is a bonafide role player and can't get his own shot; is very versatile, but cannot carry a team like Hayward can.
As for Giannis... I concede he might do a better job, dude is a freak but sadly is leading an under-achieving and healthy Bucks team which hurts him. I'll also give you eye-test, I watched zero Jazz games last year (or the year before) de to a two-year hiatus I took in Ecuador.
I do watch almost all Jazz games though, except last night's game, I was out balling
Thanks, bro.

Sorry for calling you an imbecile.

We can agree to disagree, pretty much.

To me, he just hasn't taken advantage of his tools. He has the potential to be a Paul George type player. Probably even better. The shooting, the passing, the offense and defense. It's all there. But he just hasn't taken that next step in my eyes. Not this year anyways. Next year, maybe. Still remains to be seen.

Those guys have taken that next step. They're playing out of their minds, and they're all around the same age, except Giannis and Wiggins of course.

Everything i'm saying about Hayward applies to Chandler Parsons, too. An even more sorry ass player.

[WayOfWade]

Thanks, bro.

Sorry for calling you an imbecile.

We can agree to disagree, pretty much.

To me, he just hasn't taken advantage of his tools. He has the potential to be a Paul George type player. Probably even better. The shooting, the passing, the offense and defense. It's all there. But he just hasn't taken that next step in my eyes. Not this year anyways. Next year, maybe. Still remains to be seen.

Those guys have taken that next step. They're playing out of their minds, and they're all around the same age, except Giannis and Wiggins of course.

Everything i'm saying about Hayward applies to Chandler Parsons, too. An even more sorry ass player.
True, he has the tools but lacks the mentality (and the system) to really reach that potential. We'll probably see more of the same next year, and if he decides to leave then we will see his overall potential and if he can reach it.
As for Parsons I never really saw too much potential in him, his injuries certainly don't help. Nice post though :cheers:

[Xiao Yao You]

What planet are you living on? Gobert is more important than Hayward, and as of late Mack has played better although I believe Hayward to be the better player. You could even argue Favors as being better than Hayward, but that's a harder argument; he's definitely better than Hood though.


I feel like your personal disdain for how much more preferred Hayward is in Utah compared to Gobert might be clouding your judgement. Mack is playing better now, but Hayward is better player and once he's cured of that plantar fasciitis it'll show much more clearly

The sample size is small but he is putting up similar numbers while leading the offense better than anyone has since Deron. Rudy leads the D.


Mack is terrible, man.

He's been anything but. Needs to cut the turnovers but hopefully that is just his adjustment to a new team and bigger role.


I know you have a hard-on for Gobert but he's a non-factor on offense, basically an Alonzo Mourning type player. A great defensive anchor but you can't build around him.

Zo and Gobert non factors offensively? Gobert is a big part of their offense. Need to look beyond stats sometimes. They were one of the worst teams in the league last December when Rudy emerged. This year without him they were back to that team. He's definitely the guy you build around. With him you can have a top defense. Without him good luck.


How the crap is 20/5/4 a regression from 19/5/4?

and his d is better


He has a GREAT team around him, you imbecile. Outside of Gobert missing some games, they aren't really missing the rest of those scrubs that are on the shelf.

They have seemed to miss Exum despite his horrid offensive game. Burks and Favors were/are certainly missed. As has Withey but that's on the coach.

[FillJackson]

just looking at some "single all purpose" stats

Gordon

is not top 50 in PER

He is #30 in both
Value Added
Estimated Wins Added

He is #42 in Wins Produced

His Wins Produced per 48 min is lower than last year's which was his career best.

He is second best on Utah in Wins Produced to Gobert despite playing many more minutes

[MiseryCityTexas]

Maybe in the KKK Party. You stupid white supremacist.

Lol you remind me of a Coli message board forum poster.

[joshwake]

Eye test, homie.

So.... basically, completely subjective. Not sure why you feel the need to shove your opinion down everyone's throat.

I'm not a big Hayward guy, in fact as a Jazz fan I would like to see him traded and get some value out of him. I don't think he is going to be worth the price he will soon fetch and I would prefer to get more play time in for Ly and Hood. But you are severely underrating Hayward.

[Captain Hooker]

Probably a top 10 in his position but overall? I think not

[Xiao Yao You]

So.... basically, completely subjective. Not sure why you feel the need to shove your opinion down everyone's throat.

I'm not a big Hayward guy, in fact as a Jazz fan I would like to see him traded and get some value out of him. I don't think he is going to be worth the price he will soon fetch and I would prefer to get more play time in for Ly and Hood. But you are severely underrating Hayward.

So when does the tanking stop? Hood is at 32 minutes a game. Not sure his body can take much more.