Bird an Bron at age 30

[colts19]

Bird Bron
28.1 25.3 points
9.2 6.4 rebounds
7.6 7.4 assist
52% 48% fg%
26.4 25.8 per

This is to everyone who forgot how damn good Bird was.

[IllegalD]

LeBron Stanleys avoiding this thread like the plague.

:lol

:hammertime: :hammertime:

[Lebron23]

Lebron was an 18 yrs.old rookie while Bird was 23 turning 24 in his first NBA Season. Let's compare LeBron's 6th and 7th season to Bird 6th and 7th season.

OP is dumber than a rock. Napakabobo mo.

[CuterThanRubio]

LeBron's career average PER is greater than Larry's best year.

Faster pace = Inflated rebound and assist totals

LeBron is better

[Lebron23]

LeBron's 6th and 7th season

2008-09 - 28.4 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 7.4 apg, 1.1 bpg, 1.7 spg, 48.9 FG%

2009-10- 29.7 ppg, 8.6 rpg, 7.4 apg, 1.0 bpg, 1.6 spg, 50.3 FG5

People easily forget how good Lebron was in his 6th and 7th season. Did I just destroyed the OP?

I think so.

LeBron is the greatest small forward of all time.

[Spurs m8]

Just had to post how much this made me laugh earlier hahahah

http://s24.postimg.org/6sf9h658l/ucantbanme.jpg

[Lebron23]

LeBron's career average PER is greater than Larry's best year.

Faster pace = Inflated rebound and assist totals

LeBron is better


Lebron also put up better numbers than Bird from the regular season up to the NBA Finals.

[feyki]

LeBron's career average PER is greater than Larry's best year.

Faster pace = Inflated rebound and assist totals

LeBron is better

PER is scoring based metric . Bird's first seven years rebound numbers is 13 on 100 poss . Lebron's best is 11.1 and 11.2 with smallball Heat . Also , he has only 3 times 10.5+ rebounds (4 with this season ) on 100 poss .

Bird was definitely better rebounder .

[CuterThanRubio]

PER is scoring based metric . Bird's first seven years rebound numbers is 13 on 100 poss . Lebron's best is 11.1 and 11.2 with smallball Heat . Also , he has only 3 times 10.5+ rebounds (4 with this season ) on 100 poss .

Bird was definitely better rebounder .


There were more opportunities for rebounds in the 80s.

It's debatable.

There is no debating who the greater playmaker is, though, LeBron is the best passing forward ever.

Bird didn't even win FMVP in his first title trip, meanwhile LeBron went back 2 back and if he ever wins another ring believe its going to be 3/3.

[colts19]

Calm down all you Bron stans. I didn't say Bird was better or tougher or had a higher BB IQ or was more clutch or was a better shooter or played harder or didn't ever quit on his team. You just read all that into my post.

[colts19]

but we all know bird > lebron right?
What he said

[Lebron23]

Calm down all you Bron stans. I didn't say Bird was better or tougher or had a higher BB IQ or was more clutch or was a better shooter or played harder or didn't ever quit on his team. You just read all that into my post.


You didn't said that. You F*cking queer. You Kobetards have a low basketball IQ. I am not talking about real Kobe fans, but Kobetards who destroyed the quality of posting in this forum.

[GrapeApe]

I must have missed the part where OP said Bird was better than Lebron.

Whether or not that's what he was implying is debatable, but all he did was post numbers that show how great Bird was, and I agree with the premise that a lot of people forget just how great he was before the back issues. He won 3 straight MVP's in a league with, among others, Jordan and Magic. In fact if Bird had remained healthy, those early 90's Celtics may have won a title.

[Lebron23]

Let's compare their accomplishments

Bird is a 3x NBA MVP, and 2x Finals MVP

James is a 4x NBA MVP, and 2x Finals MVP

[stalkerforlife]

No one in their right mind considers Bran as good as Bird.

Only trolls and Branvestites consider them close.

[Straight_Ballin]

Lebron was an 18 yrs.old rookie while Bird was 23 turning 24 in his first NBA Season. Let's compare LeBron's 6th and 7th season to Bird 6th and 7th season.

OP is dumber than a rock. Napakabobo mo.

So you are faulting Bird for going to college? No, let's compare them at the same age, because at that level of play age is significant. At 30 years old, Bron was a lesser player than Bird and it's not even debatable.

[colts19]

Let's compare their accomplishments

Bird is a 3x NBA MVP, and 2x Finals MVP

James is a 4x NBA MVP, and 2x Finals MVP

Damn I missed the part where James was competing against KAJ, Moses, Doctor J, Magic, Hakeem and Jordan for those MVP's.

[aj1987]

Bird Bron
28.1 25.3 points
9.2 6.4 rebounds
7.6 7.4 assist
52% 48% fg%
26.4 25.8 per

This is to everyone who forgot how damn good Bird was.
Since we're doing stats without any context, LeBron and Bird by age 30:

LeBron......Bird
24,913......15,508 Points
6,502......6,579 Rebounds
6,301......3,900 Assists
1,553......1,169 Steals
724......541 Blocks
58%......56.5% TS
2x Rings......3x Rings
2x FMVP......2x FMVP
4x MVP......3x MVP
11x All-NBA......8x All-NBA
6x All-D......3x All-D


:cheers: :cheers:

[stalkerforlife]

Bran plays in the weakest conference in NBA history.

Bird played in the toughest conference and era in NBA history.

Bran colluded twice to build super teams that absolutely no team in the east could compete with.

[aj1987]

Bran plays in the weakest conference in NBA history.

Bird played in the toughest conference and era in NBA history.

Bran colluded twice to build super teams that absolutely no team in the east could compete with.

All that and still 9 spots higher than Chokebe on the all time list. :oldlol:

[mr4speed]

There were more opportunities for rebounds in the 80s.

It's debatable.

There is no debating who the greater playmaker is, though, LeBron is the best passing forward ever.

Bird didn't even win FMVP in his first title trip, meanwhile LeBron went back 2 back and if he ever wins another ring believe its going to be 3/3.

Bird not winning the 81 FMVP is a lame argument. He outplayed Maxwell for the series. Before you chime in on the "back to back" 8 point games routine, remember Maxwell's game 2 of 6 points, 4 rebounds and 2 assists?
Bird was 15.3 pts, 15.3 reb and 7 assists for that series vs Maxwell's 17.7 pts, 9.5 reb, and 2.8 assists.
Lebron spends a lot more time playing the PG position than Bird ever did - so the assist total is going to favor Lebron. Bird did more with the ball in less time. Its apples and oranges, rules changes, and 30 years difference!

[Spurs m8]

whats the story behind that? lol we finally going to ban the people who derail threads with ***** size?

User -Ucan'tBandMe started a thread wondering why his thick pet name for LeBron wasn't included on his profile or some rubbish hahah Went on a spiel about users wanting to talk about thickness lol

[stalkerforlife]

All that and still 9 spots higher than Chokebe on the all time list. :oldlol:

I don't care about the BS propaganda.

You're the sheep and i'm the one laughing at you.

Real basketball aficionados know the deal.

[colts19]

Since we're doing stats without any context, LeBron and Bird by age 30:

LeBron......Bird
24,913......15,508 Points
6,502......6,579 Rebounds
6,301......3,900 Assists
1,553......1,169 Steals
724......541 Blocks
58%......56.5% TS
2x Rings......3x Rings
2x FMVP......2x FMVP
4x MVP......3x MVP
11x All-NBA......8x All-NBA
6x All-D......3x All-D


:cheers: :cheers:

How was my post stats without context. The context was when they were both 30 years old and playing NBA Basketball, those were the stats they had that year. It's not really that hard if you just follow along.

Again, I wasn't putting James down in any way. I was actually paying him a complement by using him a the measuring stick. No one else currently playing could have provided the same level of Greatness to compare him against. Happy Now.:confusedshrug:

[Lebron23]

Since we're doing stats without any context, LeBron and Bird by age 30:

LeBron......Bird
24,913......15,508 Points
6,502......6,579 Rebounds
6,301......3,900 Assists
1,553......1,169 Steals
724......541 Blocks
58%......56.5% TS
2x Rings......3x Rings
2x FMVP......2x FMVP
4x MVP......3x MVP
11x All-NBA......8x All-NBA
6x All-D......3x All-D


:cheers: :cheers:


Aj1987 just ended this thread. All the LeBron Haters. I got two words for you "Suck It."

[GrapeApe]

Bird not winning the 81 FMVP is a lame argument. He outplayed Maxwell for the series. Before you chime in on the "back to back" 8 point games routine, remember Maxwell's game 2 of 6 points, 4 rebounds and 2 assists?
Bird was 15.3 pts, 15.3 reb and 7 assists for that series vs Maxwell's 17.7 pts, 9.5 reb, and 2.8 assists.
Lebron spends a lot more time playing the PG position than Bird ever did - so the assist total is going to favor Lebron. Bird did more with the ball in less time. Its apples and oranges, rules changes, and 30 years difference!

Bird probably deserved FMVP, but regardless he was still the best player on the team, similar to Curry last season. Bird was his team's best player for all 3 titles.

[Lebron23]

Damn I missed the part where James was competing against KAJ, Moses, Doctor J, Magic, Hakeem and Jordan for those MVP's.


He competed against Allen, Garnett, Pierce, Durant, Duncan, Ginobili, Leonard, Carmelo Anthony, Curry, Westbrook, Ben Wallace, Rose, Butler, Thomson, and Green. Some of those guys are first ballot hall of famers.

[90sgoat]

Just had to post how much this made me laugh earlier hahahah

http://s24.postimg.org/6sf9h658l/ucantbanme.jpg

Awesome, please tell me that was to Simon:roll:

GTFO Simon to Pornhub.

[stalkerforlife]

He competed against Allen, Garnett, Pierce, Durant, Duncan, Ginobili, Leonard, Carmelo Anthony, Curry, Westbrook, Ben Wallace, Thomson, and Green.

:roll:

[Lebron23]

:roll:

Ginobili is a hall of famer. Same with Melo Anthony who's the dominique wilkins of his era. Thompson, Green, Westbrook are having solid seasons. Ben Wallace is a future hall of famer.

[colts19]

He competed against Allen, Garnett, Pierce, Durant, Duncan, Ginobili, Leonard, Carmelo Anthony, Curry, Westbrook, Ben Wallace, Rose, Butler, Thomson, and Green. Some of those guys are first ballot hall of famers.

Really, Your list has 1 top ten player of all time. My list has 3 or 4.

[Lebron23]

Really, Your list has 1 top ten player of all time. My list has 3 or 4.


The list is going to change in the next few years. And Bird had a superior team in the 1980's. He won't be beating Jordan's Bulls in the 1990's.

[feyki]

Mad fanboys :lol .

[Papaya Petee]

Hey look, a dumbass saw a Facebook meme with 0 context and decided to put it on ISH.

[colts19]

The list is going to change in the next few years. And Bird had a superior team in the 1980's. He won't be beating Jordan's Bulls in the 1990's.

Anyone who thinks the 86 Celtics couldn't have beaten several of those 90's Bulls teams if not all of them is crazy.

[Lebron23]

Anyone who thinks the 86 Celtics couldn't have beaten several of those 90's Bulls teams if not all of them is crazy.


Jordan is undefeated in the NBA Finals while Bird is 3/5. Jordan >>>> Bird.

[colts19]

Hey look, a dumbass saw a Facebook meme with 0 context and decided to put it on ISH.

What is with all this context bullsh*t. I'll try again. Please read this slowly.

The context is that 2 people were playing NBA basketball at the age of 30 and I posted their stats for that year.
Once again, it wasn't a put down of James, it was just reminding people that Larry Joe Bird was a damn good player himself.

[colts19]

Jordan is undefeated in the NBA Finals while Bird is 3/5. Jordan >>>> Bird.
I didn't say Jordan wasn't better. I said the 86 Celtics were better than most if not all of the 90's Bulls teams. My God people pay attention.

[IllegalD]

Jordan is undefeated in the NBA Finals while Bird is 3/5. Jordan >>>> Bird.


Maybe because Bird played teams like the Showtime Lakers in the Finals and not chokers like Malone/Stockton who never won any championships...? :confusedshrug:

[Lebron23]

Maybe because Bird played teams like the Showtime Lakers in the Finals and not chokers like Malone/Stockton who never won any championships...? :confusedshrug:


Basketball is a team sports. When Pippen elevated his game into the next level. The Bulls started winning multiple titles.

[GrapeApe]

The list is going to change in the next few years. And Bird had a superior team in the 1980's. He won't be beating Jordan's Bulls in the 1990's.

If not for Bird's back problems I think those early 90's Celtics could have given the Bulls a run for their money.

The interesting thing in the Bird/Lebron debate is that most all-time rankings still have Bird ranked higher, despite Lebron being considered by many to be the superior overall player. I think Lebron's longevity will eventually lead to him surpassing Bird, but as of right now it seems like Bird is generally regarded as the greater player.

[warriorfan]

Just had to post how much this made me laugh earlier hahahah

http://s24.postimg.org/6sf9h658l/ucantbanme.jpg

:roll: :roll:

[The Iron Fist]

Jordan is undefeated in the NBA Finals while Bird is 3/5. Jordan >>>> Bird.
Derek Fisher is 5-2. Clearly better at running the point than lbron, who is 2-4.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Boiled down

Bird 3/5
Bron 2/6

Ouch

[Lebron23]

Boiled down

Bird 3/5
Bron 2/6

Ouch


Great Logic. I doubt you even play basketball in real life. Anyway to answer your stupid post Bird had better teams than LeBron in his first 7 seasons in the NBA, and in the 2015 NBA Finals.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Great Logic. I doubt you even play basketball in real life. Anyway to answer your stupid post Bird had better teams than LeBron in his first 7 seasons in the NBA, and in the 2015 NBA Finals.
Can u boil it down please?

[Lebron23]

Can u boil it down please?


Uhmm

Mchale, Parish, and Dennis Johnson > Jamison, Williams, and Shaq.

[Blue&Orange]

Bird is a better basketball player than Lebron in every aspect of the game and in every metric but statpading and choking.

Bird didn't play in the weakest era since the 60's like Lebron.

[mr4speed]

Great Logic. I doubt you even play basketball in real life. Anyway to answer your stupid post Bird had better teams than LeBron in his first 7 seasons in the NBA, and in the 2015 NBA Finals.

Its the same idiotic logic you just used on your previous post saying Jordan 6 0f 6 while Bird 3 of 5 so Jordan > Bird.
You can't have it both ways.
Ring counting isn't the only measure of greatness, it is part of the equation and nobody on this site can ever agree on what the equation really should be without trying to slant it toward their favorite player.

[CuterThanRubio]

Bird is a better basketball player than Lebron in every aspect of the game and in every metric but statpading and choking.

Bird didn't play in the weakest era since the 60's like Lebron.


The 80s were the weakest era.

You had teams averaging 120+ for entire seasons.

ZERO DEFENSE!

[Lebron23]

Its the same idiotic logic you just used on your previous post saying Jordan 6 0f 6 while Bird 3 of 5 so Jordan > Bird.
You can't have it both ways.
Ring counting isn't the only measure of greatness, it is part of the equation and nobody on this site can ever agree on what the equation really should be without trying to slant it toward their favorite player.


Cause Jordan my former favorite NBA player is a superior player than Larry Bird. He's the complete Package. And I trust his teams more than Bird's teams.

[jlip]

Wasn't this thread made last year?

Edit: Something like it.
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=384278

[Lebron23]

And Bird's team losses to the 1982-83 Milwaukee Bucks despite being the superior team.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MIL/1983.html

The Don Nelson Bucks swept them. Please learn some basketball history. Bird and Magic were very fortunate they played in the pre internet era.

[Lebron23]

Wasn't this thread made last year?

I am getting sick and tired of it. I just annihilated a bunch of low iq basketball fans.

[k0kakw0rld]

LeBron Stanleys avoiding this thread like the plague.

:lol

:hammertime: :hammertime:
You realize you only answered 2 minutes after posted was created?

People have a life, I don't know about you. :facepalm
Pathetic loser, #nolifegang

[Blue&Orange]

This was Lebron biggest threat for a while:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BmZ221hCAAAn7Yu.jpg:large


lol Lebrontards writing essays and whining how players couldn't jump vertically to contest a shot!

Do you guys remember that? :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Lebron23]

This was Lebron biggest threat for a while:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BmZ221hCAAAn7Yu.jpg:large


lol Lebrontards writing essays and whining how players couldn't jump vertically to contest a shot!

Do you guys remember that? :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


What do you have in common with Roy Hibbert? He's a garbage player while you are a garbage poster.

[Lebron23]

Bird's Celtics got cuckolded by the 1983 Milwaukee Cucks.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/1983-nba-eastern-conference-semifinals-bucks-vs-celtics.html

4-0


MIL @ BOS 116 - 95
MIL @ BOS 95 - 91
BOS @ MIL 99 - 107
BOS @ MIL 93 - 107

[Lebron23]

3 > 6

Nos. 1-5: 1. Jordan | 2. Kareem | 3. LeBron | 4. Magic | 5. Wilt
Nos. 6-10: 6. Bird | 7. Russell | 8. Duncan | 9. Shaq | 10. Hakeem

[AngelEyes]

Lebron was an 18 yrs.old rookie while Bird was 23 turning 24 in his first NBA Season. Let's compare LeBron's 6th and 7th season to Bird 6th and 7th season.

OP is dumber than a rock. Napakabobo mo.

Bird turned 23 his rookie season. He turned 24 in his second season.

[mr4speed]

And Bird's team losses to the 1982-83 Milwaukee Bucks despite being the superior team.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MIL/1983.html

The Don Nelson Bucks swept them. Please learn some basketball history. Bird and Magic were very fortunate they played in the pre internet era.

Did you forget Bird missed game 2 with the flu and was still sick for game 3? Yes, Celtics should have beaten them, but Fitch had ground them down with film and criticism and too many minutes.
Bird and Magic could play in any era, if you can't see or understand that - we have nothing to talk about.

[ballinhun8]

3 > 6

Nos. 1-5: 1. Jordan | 2. Kareem | 3. LeBron | 4. Magic | 5. Wilt
Nos. 6-10: 6. Bird | 7. Russell | 8. Duncan | 9. Shaq | 10. Hakeem



So believe everything ESPN tells you? They are your bible that you go by?


And stop saying you destroyed posters here, nobody here takes you seriously so please stfu and stay away from the NBA part of this board.

[Lebron23]

Did you forget Bird missed game 2 with the flu and was still sick for game 3? Yes, Celtics should have beaten them, but Fitch had ground them down with film and criticism and too many minutes.
Bird and Magic could play in any era, if you can't see or understand that - we have nothing to talk about.


Same with LeBron whom you hated.

[Lebron23]

So believe everything ESPN tells you? They are your bible that you go by?


And stop saying you destroyed posters here, nobody here takes you seriously so please stfu and stay away from the NBA part of this board.


STFU Clown. I never respond to your posts cause you are austistic.

[Prime_Shaq]

LeBron23 can finally get riled up now that rep isn't involved

[ballinhun8]

STFU Clown. I never respond to your posts cause you are austistic.



But you just did moron.


And you deflected what I said because it makes you look normal (and normal you is a stupid you to everyone else).

[Spurs5Rings2014]

LeBron23 can finally get riled up now that rep isn't involved

:lol

[SpaceJam]

LeBron23 can finally get riled up now that rep isn't involved

:oldlol: :oldlol:

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

LeBron23 can finally get riled up now that rep isn't involved
:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Gileraracer]

Bird > Lebron

Water is wet

[FreezingTsmoove]

LeBron23 can finally get riled up now that rep isn't involved

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[PickernRoller]

Kobe > Bird > Bron.

Simple logic. Not much to discuss.

[aj1987]

How was my post stats without context. The context was when they were both 30 years old and playing NBA Basketball, those were the stats they had that year. It's not really that hard if you just follow along.

Again, I wasn't putting James down in any way. I was actually paying him a complement by using him a the measuring stick. No one else currently playing could have provided the same level of Greatness to compare him against. Happy Now.:confusedshrug:
Good for you, kid. I'll post this again.

LeBron and Bird by age 30:

LeBron......Bird
24,913......15,508 Points
6,502......6,579 Rebounds
6,301......3,900 Assists
1,553......1,169 Steals
724......541 Blocks
58%......56.5% TS
2x Rings......3x Rings
2x FMVP......2x FMVP
4x MVP......3x MVP
11x All-NBA......8x All-NBA
6x All-D......3x All-D


:cheers: :cheers:

[colts19]

Good for you, kid. I'll post this again.

LeBron and Bird by age 30:

LeBron......Bird
24,913......15,508 Points
6,502......6,579 Rebounds
6,301......3,900 Assists
1,553......1,169 Steals
724......541 Blocks
58%......56.5% TS
2x Rings......3x Rings
2x FMVP......2x FMVP
4x MVP......3x MVP
11x All-NBA......8x All-NBA
6x All-D......3x All-D


:cheers: :cheers:

Now there is a post that needs context.
Bird had played less years because he went to college for 4 years. If Bird had gone strait to the NBA those numbers would look much different. I am shocked that Bird still had more rebounds in 5 less years.

[aj1987]

Now there is a post that needs context.
Bird had played less years because he went to college for 4 years. If Bird had gone strait to the NBA those numbers would look much different. I am shocked that Bird still had more rebounds in 5 less years.
Finally you get it. LeBron by the end of last season played 911 games and 35,796 minutes. More what Bird played in his entire career. 128 games and 5,413 minutes in the PO's for Bird vs 178 and 7,561 for LeBron. Basically 4 more seasons worth of basketball. This doesn't include LeBron's international play, BTW.

If you go by seasons, LeBron in his 13th season is averaging 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS and Bird averaged 20/10/7/1/1 on 55% TS.

[colts19]

Finally you get it. LeBron by the end of last season played 911 games and 35,796 minutes. More what Bird played in his entire career. 128 games and 5,413 minutes in the PO's for Bird vs 178 and 7,561 for LeBron. Basically 4 more seasons worth of basketball. This doesn't include LeBron's international play, BTW.

If you go by seasons, LeBron in his 13th season is averaging 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS and Bird averaged 20/10/7/1/1 on 55% TS.

Once again, all I said was that Bird was a damn good player also. I felt the best way to show that was to show a typical year in their prime and show how close the number were.

Your the one posting crap without context. I post something showing how close they were in their prime. You post 2 things without context. Of course Lebron was better in his 13th year, he wasn't playing with a broken back. What a dumbass.

[aj1987]

Once again, all I said was that Bird was a damn good player also. I felt the best way to show that was to show a typical year in their prime and show how close the number were.

Your the one posting crap without context. I post something showing how close they were in their prime. You post 2 things without context. Of course Lebron was better in his 13th year, he wasn't playing with a broken back. What a dumbass.
Retard, you're comparing basically Bird's 8th season to LeBron's 13th. Again, I haven't said anywhere that it was a bad season or anything of the sort, but if you're comparing seasons, make sure that both the players at the least played a similar number of games or minutes.

It's like comparing LeBron's 13th season to Birds' 13th. Completely retarded. Just like yourself.

[Lebron23]

AJ1987 is winning this debate.

[Blue&Orange]

LeBron23 can finally get riled up now that rep isn't involved
When rep is involved he gets riled up on his other dozen accounts, such a loser. Like anyone gives a shit about his Lebron23 account :roll:

[colts19]

Retard, you're comparing basically Bird's 8th season to LeBron's 13th. Again, I haven't said anywhere that it was a bad season or anything of the sort, but if you're comparing seasons, make sure that both the players at the least played a similar number of games or minutes.

It's like comparing LeBron's 13th season to Birds' 13th. Completely retarded. Just like yourself.

You can't use the same number of games or same number of years unless your comparing 2 players who came out after high school or 2 players who came out after 4 years of college. It just distorts things to much. The only way you do that is if you have an agenda.

So now your going to tell me that btw the ages of 19 and 23 James just destroys Bird because he had more points rebounds assist steals and blocks because Bird didn't have any in those years.

OK, now I get it Agenda noted. Have a good day.

[Jasper]

Bird Bron
28.1 25.3 points
9.2 6.4 rebounds
7.6 7.4 assist
52% 48% fg%
26.4 25.8 per

This is to everyone who forgot how damn good Bird was.

Bird was considered the best SF in the history of the league.
Having Lebron's stats comparable to Bird , says alot about Bron.

:applause: :applause: :applause:

[Jasper]

Now there is a post that needs context.
Bird had played less years because he went to college for 4 years. If Bird had gone strait to the NBA those numbers would look much different. I am shocked that Bird still had more rebounds in 5 less years.

Bird played more low post paint defense , While Bron is in an era where 90% of SF's are on the perimeter.

[pauk]

Yup Bird had his absolute best season (statistically at least) at age 30-31, for some reason, the back snapped after that & wasnt the same forever after.

He played 41 mins at age 30 tho (compared to Lebron 36 mins), which was his highest... Per 36 minutes (or per 41 mins or per any minutes) Birds/Lebrons stats looked very similar at age 30.... Lebron averaged a bit more PPG & APG, Bird more RPG... and again, stats aside, Lebron was still a better defender...

[aj1987]

You can't use the same number of games or same number of years unless your comparing 2 players who came out after high school or 2 players who came out after 4 years of college. It just distorts things to much. The only way you do that is if you have an agenda.
Unless they're past their primes, why not?


So now your going to tell me that btw the ages of 19 and 23 James just destroys Bird because he had more points rebounds assist steals and blocks because Bird didn't have any in those years.
:facepalm :facepalm

Dat reading comprehension doe... :facepalm

[PP34Deuce]

If Lebron can help Cleveland get to the championship and win, I think you see a lot of debates go away.

I believe you see him creep up in the top 3 all time. (I have him at 8)

[feyki]

I think there are a lot of people thinks Lebron more than their family .

I have great feels on Dirk , but I'm not obsessed . Relaxxx ..

[Prime_Shaq]

If Lebron can help Cleveland get to the championship and win, I think you see a lot of debates go away.

I believe you see him creep up in the top 3 all time. (I have him at 8)
Hmm I'll say that's fair

[ralph_i_el]

lol when Bird was putting up those numbers in the 80's games had ~10% more possessions per game

[fiddy]

Brantards making retarded excuses, nothing new.

[3ball]

when Bird was putting up those numbers in the 80's games had ~10% more possessions per game


3-pointers need to be more open than 2-pointers, so today's teams need to run more offense, resulting in slower pace and less PPG.

Otoh, 2-pointers have always been more contested, so eras that took mostly 2-pointers settled for one contested 2-pointer after another, without needing to run as much offense.

Essentially - pace was faster in Bird's era, but shots were more contested - most of Bird's shot attempts would be considered horrible looks in today's game.





Lebron had played 45k minutes heading into this season


That's the same minutes that Jordan had played heading into 1998 playoffs - so let's compare OLD Jordan's 1998 playoff stats to PRIME Lebron's 2016 regular season stats:

MJ. 1998 PLAYOFFS: 32.4 ppg.. 1.6 oreb.. 3.8 dreb.. 3.5 apg.. 2.1 tov.. 1.5 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 46.2 fg.. 54.5 ts.. 117 ORtg.. 28.1 PER
LBJ 2016 REG SEAS: 25.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 6.0 dreb.. 6.8 apg.. 3.2 tov.. 1.4 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 51.2 fg.. 57.9 ts.. 115 ORtg.. 27.1 PER


No comparison - old Jordan's stats were much better than prime Lebron's, and against much better competition (playoff comp)..

[RRR3]

Are we still pretending Bird is better than LeBron?

[Gileraracer]

Are we still pretending Bird is better than LeBron?

At least Bird could shoot. So yeppp

[aj1987]

That's the same minutes that Jordan had played heading into 1998 playoffs - so let's compare OLD Jordan's 1998 playoff stats to PRIME Lebron's 2016 regular season stats:

MJ. 1998 PLAYOFFS: 32.4 ppg.. 1.6 oreb.. 3.8 dreb.. 3.5 apg.. 2.1 tov.. 1.5 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 46.2 fg.. 54.5 ts.. 117 ORtg.. 28.1 PER
LBJ 2016 REG SEAS: 25.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 6.0 dreb.. 6.8 apg.. 3.2 tov.. 1.4 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 51.2 fg.. 57.9 ts.. 115 ORtg.. 27.1 PER


No comparison - old Jordan's stats were much better than prime Lebron's, and against much better competition (playoff comp)..
No one's talking about MJ, you brain-dead shit stain.

LeBron is better, BTW.

RS Per 36

LeBron - 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS 115 ORTG 102 DRTG
MJ - 27/5/3/2/1 on 53% TS 114 ORTG 100 DRTG

[RRR3]

At least Bird could shoot. So yeppp
LeBron could shoot too. The player he is now doesn't reflect the player he was at his best. Shooting doesn't really mean shit when LeBron was a clearly superior scorer in both the regular season and playoffs.

[senelcoolidge]

I thought Bird was some unathletic white guy yet he was a better shooter, rebounder, just as good a passer that played off the ball, and scorer. hmmm.

[3ball]

RS Per 36

LeBron - 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS 115 ORTG 102 DRTG
MJ - 27/5/3/2/1 on 53% TS 114 ORTG 100 DRTG


Lebron carries much smaller load:


..........Percentage of team points scored while player was on floor


.........................RS.....RS 4th.... PO....PO 4th....Finals.. Finals 4th


JORDAN 1997... 36.0 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 40.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 37.7 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 46.3 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 40.9 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 50.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&PORound=4) <--- links to nba.com data
JORDAN 1998... 36.3 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 42.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 39.7 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 48.8 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 43.6 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 49.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&PORound=4)

LEBRON 2016... 31.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/2544/stats/usage/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 36.8 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/2544/stats/usage/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)



Also, the Bulls were pursuing a 3-peat and half-assing the regular season, just like 1993 - that's why Jordan's playoff stats were so much better than his RS in those years.

Otoh, Lebron is pursuing his first ring in Cleveland and is playing much harder - his playoff stats will be the same as RS and much worse than MJ's obviously - here's their stats thru 45k minutes:

MJ. 1998 PLAYOFFS: 32.4 ppg.. 1.6 oreb.. 3.8 dreb.. 3.5 apg.. 2.1 tov.. 1.5 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 46.2 fg.. 54.5 ts.. 117 ORtg.. 28.1 PER
LBJ 2016 REG SEAS: 25.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 6.0 dreb.. 6.8 apg.. 3.2 tov.. 1.4 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 51.2 fg.. 57.9 ts.. 115 ORtg.. 27.1 PER

[aj1987]

Lebron carries much smaller load:


..........Percentage of team points scored while player was on floor


.........................RS.....RS 4th.... PO....PO 4th....Finals.. Finals 4th


JORDAN 1997... 36.0 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 40.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 37.7 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 46.3 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 40.9 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 50.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&PORound=4) <--- links to nba.com data
JORDAN 1998... 36.3 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 42.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 39.7 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 48.8 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 43.6 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 49.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&PORound=4)

LEBRON 2016... 31.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/2544/stats/usage/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 36.8 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/2544/stats/usage/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)



Also, the Bulls were pursuing a 3-peat and half-assing the regular season, just like 1993 - that's why Jordan's playoff stats were so much better than his RS in those years.

Otoh, Lebron is pursuing his first ring in Cleveland and is playing much harder - his playoff stats will be the same as RS and much worse than MJ's obviously - here's their stats thru 45k minutes:

MJ. 1998 PLAYOFFS: 32.4 ppg.. 1.6 oreb.. 3.8 dreb.. 3.5 apg.. 2.1 tov.. 46.2 fg.. 54.5 ts.. 117 ORtg.. 28.1 PER
RS Per 36

LeBron - 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS 115 ORTG 102 DRTG
MJ - 27/5/3/2/1 on 53% TS 114 ORTG 100 DRTG

[3ball]

RS Per 36

LeBron - 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS 115 ORTG 102 DRTG
MJ - 27/5/3/2/1 on 53% TS 114 ORTG 100 DRTG



Lebron had played 43k minutes entering this season, which corresponds with Jordan entering 1998 playoffs:


MJ. 1998 PLAYOFFS: 32.4 ppg.. 1.6 oreb.. 3.8 dreb.. 3.5 apg.. 2.1 tov.. 1.5 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 46.2 fg.. 54.5 ts.. 117 ORtg.. 28.1 PER
LBJ 2016 REG SEAS: 25.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 6.0 dreb.. 6.8 apg.. 3.2 tov.. 1.4 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 51.2 fg.. 57.9 ts.. 115 ORtg.. 27.1 PER


After 43k minutes, old Jordan's stats were much better against playoff teams than prime Lebron's are against regular season teams.

[aj1987]

Lebron had played 43k minutes entering this season, which corresponds with Jordan entering 1998 playoffs:


MJ. 1998 PLAYOFFS: 32.4 ppg.. 1.6 oreb.. 3.8 dreb.. 3.5 apg.. 2.1 tov.. 1.5 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 46.2 fg.. 54.5 ts.. 117 ORtg.. 28.1 PER
LBJ 2016 REG SEAS: 25.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 6.0 dreb.. 6.8 apg.. 3.2 tov.. 1.4 spg.. 0.6 bpg.. 51.2 fg.. 57.9 ts.. 115 ORtg.. 27.1 PER


After 43k minutes, old Jordan's stats were much better against playoff teams than prime Lebron's are against regular season teams.

RS Per 36

LeBron - 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS 115 ORTG 102 DRTG
MJ - 27/5/3/2/1 on 53% TS 114 ORTG 100 DRTG

[3ball]

LeBron is better, BTW.


:biggums:

Imagine if your favorite player scored 5-7 more ppg in the playoffs on better efficiency across the board - that's what MJ did in comparison to Lebron:



Career Playoffs - PER GAME:

JORDAN: 33.4 ppg.. 1.7 oreb.. 4.7 dreb.. 5.7 apg.. 3.1 tov.. 2.1 spg.. 0.9 blk.. 48.7 fg.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg
LEBRON: 28.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 7.2 dreb.. 6.7 apg.. 3.5 tov.. 1.7 spg.. 0.9 blk.. 47.3 fg.. 56.5 ts.. 114 ORtg


Career Playoffs - PER 100 POSSESSIONS:

JORDAN:. 43.3 pts.. 2.2 oreb.. 6.1 dreb.. 7.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 2.7 stl.. 1.1 blk.. 48.7 fg.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg
LEBRON:. 36.5 pts.. 2.0 oreb.. 9.3 dreb.. 8.6 ast.. 4.5 tov.. 2.2 stl.. 1.2 blk.. 47.3 fg.. 56.5 ts.. 114 ORtg


Career Finals - PER GAME:

JORDAN: 33.6 ppg.. 6.0 rpg.. 6.0 apg.. 2.8 tov.. 1.8 spg.. 0.65 bpg.. 48.1 fg
LEBRON: 26.4 ppg.. 9.6 rpg.. 6.9 apg.. 4.0 tov.. 1.8 spg.. 0.54 bpg.. 44.6 fg


There's never been a number 1 option that scored 5-7 more ppg on better efficiency that wasn't considered the FAR better player.

Jordan's massive scoring edge on superior efficiency is far more valuable than Lebron's 1.0 assist edge (with more turnovers) and 2.5 def rebound edge (MJ had more offensive rebounds).

Lebron's assist edge is particularly meaningless considering he achieves his assists by lowering his TEAMMATES' assists and playmaking, as the stats show (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11709473&postcount=1).

Furthermore, Jordan scored 10 more ppg than his 2nd option for every playoff series of his career AND led the team in passing (MJ led the Bulls in assist percentage for both 3-peats (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11713121&postcount=49))... Lebron was never required to do that - he has several series where he wasn't even the team's leading scorer.
.

[Nash]

Just had to post how much this made me laugh earlier hahahah

http://s24.postimg.org/6sf9h658l/ucantbanme.jpg
:roll: :roll:
thread?

[3ball]

Imagine if your favorite player scored 5-7 more ppg in the playoffs on better efficiency across the board - that's what MJ did in comparison to Lebron:



Career Playoffs - PER GAME:

JORDAN: 33.4 ppg.. 1.7 oreb.. 4.7 dreb.. 5.7 apg.. 3.1 tov.. 2.1 spg.. 0.9 blk.. 48.7 fg.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg
LEBRON: 28.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 7.2 dreb.. 6.7 apg.. 3.5 tov.. 1.7 spg.. 0.9 blk.. 47.3 fg.. 56.5 ts.. 114 ORtg


Career Playoffs - PER 100 POSSESSIONS:

JORDAN:. 43.3 pts.. 2.2 oreb.. 6.1 dreb.. 7.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 2.7 stl.. 1.1 blk.. 48.7 fg.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg
LEBRON:. 36.5 pts.. 2.0 oreb.. 9.3 dreb.. 8.6 ast.. 4.5 tov.. 2.2 stl.. 1.2 blk.. 47.3 fg.. 56.5 ts.. 114 ORtg


Career Finals - PER GAME:

JORDAN: 33.6 ppg.. 6.0 rpg.. 6.0 apg.. 2.8 tov.. 1.8 spg.. 0.65 bpg.. 48.1 fg
LEBRON: 26.4 ppg.. 9.6 rpg.. 6.9 apg.. 4.0 tov.. 1.8 spg.. 0.54 bpg.. 44.6 fg


There's never been a number 1 option that scored 5-7 more ppg on better efficiency that wasn't considered the FAR better player.

Jordan's massive scoring edge on superior efficiency is far more valuable than Lebron's 1.0 assist edge (with more turnovers) and 2.5 def rebound edge (MJ had more offensive rebounds).

Lebron's assist edge is particularly meaningless considering he achieves his assists by lowering his TEAMMATES' assists and playmaking, as the stats show (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11709473&postcount=1).

Furthermore, Jordan scored 10 more ppg than his 2nd option for every playoff series of his career AND led the team in passing (MJ led the Bulls in assist percentage for both 3-peats (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11713121&postcount=49))... Lebron was never required to do that - he has several series where he wasn't even the team's leading scorer.



^^^^ this silenced aj1987


https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Hw-RnyLuNx8/UoySMCQz9OI/AAAAAAAACiI/TVOlbEcJ-Yc/w426-h284/my%2Bwork%2Bhere%2Bis%2Bdone.gif

[TYCRO]

^^^^ this silenced aj1987


https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Hw-RnyLuNx8/UoySMCQz9OI/AAAAAAAACiI/TVOlbEcJ-Yc/w426-h284/my%2Bwork%2Bhere%2Bis%2Bdone.gif
Dude isn't even logged in. You have to give some time while they are logged in before accusing them of not responding. Not his fault it takes you 7 minutes to copy and paste from your bookmarked threads.

[3ball]

Imagine if your favorite player scored 5-7 more ppg in the playoffs on better efficiency across the board - that's what MJ did in comparison to Lebron:



Career Playoffs - PER GAME:

JORDAN: 33.4 ppg.. 1.7 oreb.. 4.7 dreb.. 5.7 apg.. 3.1 tov.. 2.1 spg.. 0.9 blk.. 48.7 fg.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg
LEBRON: 28.2 ppg.. 1.5 oreb.. 7.2 dreb.. 6.7 apg.. 3.5 tov.. 1.7 spg.. 0.9 blk.. 47.3 fg.. 56.5 ts.. 114 ORtg


Career Playoffs - PER 100 POSSESSIONS:

JORDAN:. 43.3 pts.. 2.2 oreb.. 6.1 dreb.. 7.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 2.7 stl.. 1.1 blk.. 48.7 fg.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg
LEBRON:. 36.5 pts.. 2.0 oreb.. 9.3 dreb.. 8.6 ast.. 4.5 tov.. 2.2 stl.. 1.2 blk.. 47.3 fg.. 56.5 ts.. 114 ORtg


Career Finals - PER GAME:

JORDAN: 33.6 ppg.. 6.0 rpg.. 6.0 apg.. 2.8 tov.. 1.8 spg.. 0.65 bpg.. 48.1 fg
LEBRON: 26.4 ppg.. 9.6 rpg.. 6.9 apg.. 4.0 tov.. 1.8 spg.. 0.54 bpg.. 44.6 fg


There's never been a number 1 option that scored 5-7 more ppg on better efficiency that wasn't considered the FAR better player.

Jordan's massive scoring edge on superior efficiency is far more valuable than Lebron's 1.0 assist edge (with more turnovers) and 2.5 def rebound edge (MJ had more offensive rebounds).

Lebron's assist edge is particularly meaningless considering he achieves his assists by lowering his TEAMMATES' assists and playmaking, as the stats show (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11709473&postcount=1).

Furthermore, Jordan scored 10 more ppg than his 2nd option for every playoff series of his career AND led the team in passing (MJ led the Bulls in assist percentage for both 3-peats (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11713121&postcount=49))... Lebron was never required to do that - he has several series where he wasn't even the team's leading scorer.




Dude isn't even logged in. You have to give some time while they are logged in before accusing them of not responding.


That post killed ALL Lebron fans who think he holds a candle to the GOAT

[TYCRO]

That post killed ALL Lebron fans who think he holds a candle to the GOAT
You realize this thread wasn't even about Jordan right? Most people tend to agree with you on this stuff, but you are too insecure to see that, so you talk about Jordan comparisons all the time anyway. You are the one who really loses in these scenarios.

[aj1987]

^^^^ this silenced aj1987

I have a life unlike you, mouth breathing retard.

RS Per 36

LeBron - 25/8/7/2/1 on 58% TS 115 ORTG 102 DRTG
MJ - 27/5/3/2/1 on 53% TS 114 ORTG 100 DRTG