I have to be honest, MJ does lose some credit for ducking Hakeem

[Akrazotile]

So, there's been a lot of speculation about why MJ actually retired initially. Did he gamble? Did he kill his father? Was Pippen's alpha sized member giving him anxiety?

And I honestly dont think any of those had to do with his retirement.

I think he knew that Hakeem finally had a team around him poised to challenge the Bulls like none of the teams they'd faced in a finals had.

And it made me think - what kind of finals challenges did Jordan really face? Lebron faced Duncan and the Spurs in their prime, at the height of their power. He faced a scorching hot Dirk, whom most people rank higher than the likes of Barkley and Malone. Remember, when Jordan faced Magic and the Lakers they were well past their glory days. Magic was guarded by Pippen and shot 43%.

Durant, and some players on the current Warriors (be it Klay, Draymond, MAYBE Curry) will almost certainly end up ranked higher than the likes of Drexler and Gary Payton/Shawn Kemp.

What Im saying is, we cant fairly compare Jordan's bubble bath finals with the grueling gauntlet Lebron has repeatedly faced. If MJ hadnt ducked Hakeem for two straight years, it would be more easy to make a judgement. But as it stands, MJ faced ZERO top 10 players in their prime in an NBA finals - and by my calculation might be the only one IN the top 10 to have that distinction.


At the end of the day, I think it's fair to say the best we can do right now is call them co-GOATs. If Lebron wins this finals, obviously he takes sole control. But right now I think our ability to assess MJ is incomplete. And that does work against him. Lebron has faced the most challenging teams of the most competitive era and has put up numerous god-tier performances.

We simply cannot deny his place any longer. Current co-GOAT. Closing in on singular GOAT.

[Dray n Klay]

Great Post :applause: :rockon: :cheers:

[insidehoops]

:biggums: :crazysam: :biggums:

[Dr Seuss]

well, if anyone knows anything about lack of credit, it would be akrazotile.

[warriorfan]

well, if anyone knows anything about lack of credit, it would be akrazotile.

:roll:

[livinglegend]

ether :applause: :applause:

[FKAri]

Thank you for being honest and coming forward with this information. I am sure it must've hard for you. So brave. Phaggit :lol

[G-train]

So, there's been a lot of speculation about why MJ actually retired initially. Did he gamble? Did he kill his father? Was Pippen's alpha sized member giving him anxiety?

And I honestly dont think any of those had to do with his retirement.

I think he knew that Hakeem finally had a team around him poised to challenge the Bulls like none of the teams they'd faced in a finals had.

And it made me think - what kind of finals challenges did Jordan really face? Lebron faced Duncan and the Spurs in their prime, at the height of their power. He faced a scorching hot Dirk, whom most people rank higher than the likes of Barkley and Malone. Remember, when Jordan faced Magic and the Lakers they were well past their glory days. Magic was guarded by Pippen and shot 43%.

Durant, and some players on the current Warriors (be it Klay, Draymond, MAYBE Curry) will almost certainly end up ranked higher than the likes of Drexler and Gary Payton/Shawn Kemp.

What Im saying is, we cant fairly compare Jordan's bubble bath finals with the grueling gauntlet Lebron has repeatedly faced. If MJ hadnt ducked Hakeem for two straight years, it would be more easy to make a judgement. But as it stands, MJ faced ZERO top 10 players in their prime in an NBA finals - and by my calculation might be the only one IN the top 10 to have that distinction.


At the end of the day, I think it's fair to say the best we can do right now is call them co-GOATs. If Lebron wins this finals, obviously he takes sole control. But right now I think our ability to assess MJ is incomplete. And that does work against him. Lebron has faced the most challenging teams of the most competitive era and has put up numerous god-tier performances.

We simply cannot deny his place any longer. Current co-GOAT. Closing in on singular GOAT.

You are either 13 or just a moron.

[GINOBILI!]

Dumb theory is dumb. Please don't attribute LeBron's characteristic of running to Jordan.

[GrapeApe]

Hakeem had already been in the league for a decade and Jordan was already widely considered the GOAT when he retired in 1993.

[LBJFTW]

Hakeem had already been in the league for a decade and Jordan was already widely considered the GOAT when he retired in 1993.

Why would someone with almost 14,000 posts know that?

[Akrazotile]

Hakeem had already been in the league for a decade and Jordan was already widely considered the GOAT when he retired in 1993.


That's because Jordan finally got a team around him he could win a finals with. Prior to that he was considered by league experts to be just another 1-9 volume shooter.

He won a few chips against mediocre-at-best finals competition, but then noticed Hakeem finally had his own respectable team around him over in the western conference, so MJ decided to get the hell outta dodge for a little bit. It's honestly clear as day.


I just think it's pretty striking how MJ never really played against elite players in the finals (Magic was heavy and slow by '91.) He had a couple chances but deliberately side stepped them in favor of playing minor league baseball for the white sox??? Doesnt add up, unless you accept that just based on the evidence, he was almost surely avoiding playing Hakeem in the finals.

It's just hard to call someone a GOAT with that sort of lack of a competitive spirit.

[sportjames23]

You are either 13 or just a moron.

Or both.

[scuzzy]

So, there's been a lot of speculation about why MJ actually retired initially. Did he gamble? Did he kill his father? Was Pippen's alpha sized member giving him anxiety?

And I honestly dont think any of those had to do with his retirement.

I think he knew that Hakeem finally had a team around him poised to challenge the Bulls like none of the teams they'd faced in a finals had.

And it made me think - what kind of finals challenges did Jordan really face? Lebron faced Duncan and the Spurs in their prime, at the height of their power. He faced a scorching hot Dirk, whom most people rank higher than the likes of Barkley and Malone. Remember, when Jordan faced Magic and the Lakers they were well past their glory days. Magic was guarded by Pippen and shot 43%.

Durant, and some players on the current Warriors (be it Klay, Draymond, MAYBE Curry) will almost certainly end up ranked higher than the likes of Drexler and Gary Payton/Shawn Kemp.

What Im saying is, we cant fairly compare Jordan's bubble bath finals with the grueling gauntlet Lebron has repeatedly faced. If MJ hadnt ducked Hakeem for two straight years, it would be more easy to make a judgement. But as it stands, MJ faced ZERO top 10 players in their prime in an NBA finals - and by my calculation might be the only one IN the top 10 to have that distinction.


At the end of the day, I think it's fair to say the best we can do right now is call them co-GOATs. If Lebron wins this finals, obviously he takes sole control. But right now I think our ability to assess MJ is incomplete. And that does work against him. Lebron has faced the most challenging teams of the most competitive era and has put up numerous god-tier performances.

We simply cannot deny his place any longer. Current co-GOAT. Closing in on singular GOAT.:applause: :applause: :bowdown:

[Height Freak]

What Im saying is, we cant fairly compare Jordan's bubble bath finals with the grueling gauntlet Lebron has repeatedly faced.

And what do you call Lebron being carried by higher I.Q. /alpha teammates into 4 straight finals in a stacked team?

[Prime_Shaq]

Hakeem had 6 years to meet Jordan at the top.

[Spurs m8]

OP is a clueless f*ggot

[Kvnzhangyay]

Hakeem's peak was short for some reason

I do think the Rockets woulda beat the Bulls even if jordan played in 94, however (keeping in mind that Jordan lost to the magic in 95)

[GrapeApe]

That's because Jordan finally got a team around him he could win a finals with. Prior to that he was considered by league experts to be just another 1-9 volume shooter.

He won a few chips against mediocre-at-best finals competition, but then noticed Hakeem finally had his own respectable team around him over in the western conference, so MJ decided to get the hell outta dodge for a little bit. It's honestly clear as day.


I just think it's pretty striking how MJ never really played against elite players in the finals (Magic was heavy and slow by '91.) He had a couple chances but deliberately side stepped them in favor of playing minor league baseball for the white sox??? Doesnt add up, unless you accept that just based on the evidence, he was almost surely avoiding playing Hakeem in the finals.

It's just hard to call someone a GOAT with that sort of lack of a competitive spirit.

Jordan beat a 60 win Knicks and 62 win Suns in 1993, both of whom had better records than the 1994 Rockets. The Rockets weren't even the #1 seed. Barkley was the MVP in 1993, whom Jordan beat in the finals. Hakeem had never won an MVP in his career. Jordan also beat the 1997 MVP Karl Malone in the finals. In every one of Jordan's championship seasons he either beat the MVP or was himself the MVP.

[diamenz]

oh god.

*heads over to realgm*

[GrapeApe]

Hakeem's peak was short for some reason

I do think the Rockets woulda beat the Bulls even if jordan played in 94, however (keeping in mind that Jordan lost to the magic in 95)

The Knicks would have beat the Rockets if not for a historically bad shooting performance, and the Bulls nearly beat the Knicks without Jordan. In fact they probably should have. The 1994 Bulls with Jordan would have been an all-time great team. Prime Jordan and peak Pippen. I think burnout would have caught up to them in 1995, but they might have won 70 in 1994.

[Old Man River]

:coleman: :coleman:

[groovemachine]

MJ's first game back against the Rockets (Jan. 3, 1996) he went for 38/8/5/3 against the 2-time reigning world champions and the Bulls won the game. I don't think anyone ever intimidated Michael on the court to the point that he would retire out of fear. You clearly never watched the man play basketball.

[Old Man River]

The Knicks would have beat the Rockets if not for a historically bad shooting performance, and the Bulls nearly beat the Knicks without Jordan. In fact they probably should have. The 1994 Bulls with Jordan would have been an all-time great team. Prime Jordan and peak Pippen. I think burnout would have caught up to them in 1995, but they might have won 70 in 1994.
Yeah Rockets struggled with the knicks, it went to game 7. Knicks only won east cuz of no Jordan. If you struggle with the knicks, you'd get swept by Jordan.

[bigkingsfan]

MJ's first game back against the Rockets (Jan. 3, 1996) he went for 38/8/5/3 against the 2-time reigning world champions and the Bulls won the game. I don't think anyone ever intimidated Michael on the court to the point that he would retire out of fear. You clearly never watched the man play basketball.
He shot 7-26 next game.

Go back to MJ 92-93 when both in their absolute prime. Houston won twice and they didn't even have Drexler.

[IMObjective]

:biggums: :crazysam: :biggums:you see a lot of crazy stupid threads made here every day, but it's never enough to make Jeff come out of hiding to let the op know how stupid their thread is. This thread on the other hand...

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

You know you have too much time on your hands writing paragraphs of bullshit nobody SANE would actually believe.

Strange muthafukas on this forum...

[beastee]

well, if anyone knows anything about lack of credit, it would be akrazotile.
http://static2.gamespot.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_medium/619/6199714/2425185-5536979159-23742.gif

:applause: :applause:

[sportjames23]

Someone take OP out in the field and put him out of his misery.

[Nilocon165]

Someone take OP out in the field and put him out of his misery.
:lebronamazed: chill

[Dray n Klay]

Someone take OP out in the field and put him out of his misery.

1-9

[Nilocon165]

1-9
2/7 with handpicked teams :lebronamazed:

Haha!!!

[sportjames23]

2/7 incoming


I know, child. I know.

[IllegalD]

:biggums: :crazysam: :biggums:


You allow this to go on. :facepalm :no:

[AirFederer]

https://media.giphy.com/media/CYMux4dXxJedq/giphy.gif

[SpaceJam]

https://media.giphy.com/media/ZucpMoYuuqn9C/giphy.gif

[sportjames23]

http://img.pandawhale.com/post-47705-michael-jordan-shaking-head-no-PinG.gif

[AirFederer]

So, there's been a lot of speculation about why MJ actually retired initially. Did he gamble? Did he kill his father? Was Pippen's alpha sized member giving him anxiety?

And I honestly dont think any of those had to do with his retirement.

I think he knew that Hakeem finally had a team around him poised to challenge the Bulls like none of the teams they'd faced in a finals had.

And it made me think - what kind of finals challenges did Jordan really face? Lebron faced Duncan and the Spurs in their prime, at the height of their power. He faced a scorching hot Dirk, whom most people rank higher than the likes of Barkley and Malone. Remember, when Jordan faced Magic and the Lakers they were well past their glory days. Magic was guarded by Pippen and shot 43%.

Durant, and some players on the current Warriors (be it Klay, Draymond, MAYBE Curry) will almost certainly end up ranked higher than the likes of Drexler and Gary Payton/Shawn Kemp.

What Im saying is, we cant fairly compare Jordan's bubble bath finals with the grueling gauntlet Lebron has repeatedly faced. If MJ hadnt ducked Hakeem for two straight years, it would be more easy to make a judgement. But as it stands, MJ faced ZERO top 10 players in their prime in an NBA finals - and by my calculation might be the only one IN the top 10 to have that distinction.


At the end of the day, I think it's fair to say the best we can do right now is call them co-GOATs. If Lebron wins this finals, obviously he takes sole control. But right now I think our ability to assess MJ is incomplete. And that does work against him. Lebron has faced the most challenging teams of the most competitive era and has put up numerous god-tier performances.

We simply cannot deny his place any longer. Current co-GOAT. Closing in on singular GOAT.

https://media.giphy.com/media/l4Ki2obCyAQS5WhFe/giphy.gif

[Chokefree]

ban this fakkit :facepalm :facepalm

[r0drig0lac]

:biggums: :crazysam: :biggums:
:applause:

[Dragonyeuw]

He won a few chips against mediocre-at-best finals competition, but then noticed Hakeem finally had his own respectable team around him over in the western conference, so MJ decided to get the hell outta dodge for a little bit. It's honestly clear as day.




So if Hakeem having a decent team around him is what prompted him to leave, what prompted him to return in 95 when Hakeem was widely considered the best player in the league, the Rockets were established as Champs, the Bulls were barely over .500, Grant had bolted for Orlando leaving their frontline paper-thin, and the Magic had established themselves as the team of the future? All those circumstances should have kept MJ away.....right?

[ZMonkey11]

And Jordan decided to duck Hakeem again in 1995, when Hakeem had the greast 47-35 team, right?

Jordan just returning to the Bulls, looking at the Magic and Shaq, decides in his head "Go ahead young fella, you try to take Hakeem. Let me lay dormant one more year, then dominate the rest of the league for the next three."

Is that what he was thinking when he saw the monster of a 6th seed waiting in the West?


This thread is sorely lacking. You probably need a couple of months to plan a proper troll thread. Now is the best time, though. We are about to go into the off-season. That is when the finals are over. After the finals, we don't play anymore more real basketball until October. There is also a summer league. Maybe you have heard of it? Before the regular season, there is a pre-season.

I just wanted to update you on how the NBA works because you already showed a low IQ in it, so I'm going to help you speed things up!

You're welcome!!!

[LBJFTW]

Yawn.... OP is to easy to dismiss with a simple wave of hand.

I have to be honest, Hakeem does lose some credit for winning when MJ was gone.

[sekachu]

So, there's been a lot of speculation about why MJ actually retired initially. Did he gamble? Did he kill his father? Was Pippen's alpha sized member giving him anxiety?

And I honestly dont think any of those had to do with his retirement.

I think he knew that Hakeem finally had a team around him poised to challenge the Bulls like none of the teams they'd faced in a finals had.

And it made me think - what kind of finals challenges did Jordan really face? Lebron faced Duncan and the Spurs in their prime, at the height of their power. He faced a scorching hot Dirk, whom most people rank higher than the likes of Barkley and Malone. Remember, when Jordan faced Magic and the Lakers they were well past their glory days. Magic was guarded by Pippen and shot 43%.

Durant, and some players on the current Warriors (be it Klay, Draymond, MAYBE Curry) will almost certainly end up ranked higher than the likes of Drexler and Gary Payton/Shawn Kemp.

What Im saying is, we cant fairly compare Jordan's bubble bath finals with the grueling gauntlet Lebron has repeatedly faced. If MJ hadnt ducked Hakeem for two straight years, it would be more easy to make a judgement. But as it stands, MJ faced ZERO top 10 players in their prime in an NBA finals - and by my calculation might be the only one IN the top 10 to have that distinction.


At the end of the day, I think it's fair to say the best we can do right now is call them co-GOATs. If Lebron wins this finals, obviously he takes sole control. But right now I think our ability to assess MJ is incomplete. And that does work against him. Lebron has faced the most challenging teams of the most competitive era and has put up numerous god-tier performances.

We simply cannot deny his place any longer. Current co-GOAT. Closing in on singular GOAT.


wtf is this theory? So MJ back to nba because he knew hakeem time was over after winning 2 titles? lol

[Robalvarez2010]

So, there's been a lot of speculation about why MJ actually retired initially. Did he gamble? Did he kill his father? Was Pippen's alpha sized member giving him anxiety?

And I honestly dont think any of those had to do with his retirement.

I think he knew that Hakeem finally had a team around him poised to challenge the Bulls like none of the teams they'd faced in a finals had.

And it made me think - what kind of finals challenges did Jordan really face? Lebron faced Duncan and the Spurs in their prime, at the height of their power. He faced a scorching hot Dirk, whom most people rank higher than the likes of Barkley and Malone. Remember, when Jordan faced Magic and the Lakers they were well past their glory days. Magic was guarded by Pippen and shot 43%.

Durant, and some players on the current Warriors (be it Klay, Draymond, MAYBE Curry) will almost certainly end up ranked higher than the likes of Drexler and Gary Payton/Shawn Kemp.

What Im saying is, we cant fairly compare Jordan's bubble bath finals with the grueling gauntlet Lebron has repeatedly faced. If MJ hadnt ducked Hakeem for two straight years, it would be more easy to make a judgement. But as it stands, MJ faced ZERO top 10 players in their prime in an NBA finals - and by my calculation might be the only one IN the top 10 to have that distinction.


At the end of the day, I think it's fair to say the best we can do right now is call them co-GOATs. If Lebron wins this finals, obviously he takes sole control. But right now I think our ability to assess MJ is incomplete. And that does work against him. Lebron has faced the most challenging teams of the most competitive era and has put up numerous god-tier performances.

We simply cannot deny his place any longer. Current co-GOAT. Closing in on singular GOAT.
I'm sorry, I know that I don't know you but you are just an idiot. When did you start watching basketball 2005! This Era is nowhere near as challenging or as competitive as the 90's. Jordan has faced better competition in the playoffs and finals then lebron has. Jordan has faced Isiah, Kemp, magic, bird, Clyde, Barkley, Shaq, Kemp, penny, Malone, Patrick, Reggie , iverson ect. and the list goes on. Plus they played more physical, not this hand checking or flopping that goes on in today's game. Lets just put it this way, 99% of the players today would not be able to handle the physicality of the 90's, but the players from the 90's would have a field day in todays game. Also that statement you made that if lebron wins the finals this year that it should surpass jordan, remember jordan 6 for 6 and lebron would be 3 for 7 if he wins.