Kyrie being hella underrated cuz of Bran

[sundizz]

Kyrie had as much to do with the Cavs winning game 6 & 7 as Bron Sid if not far far far more. Without Kyrie's shooting they never would of had the opportunity for Bran to be a front runner and dominate. Bran is the ultimate confidence player - he simply needs someone else on his team to be dominating and he gathers up confidence and momentum and feasts on it.

But let's be real. Kyrie has been the difference. He's the true Finals MVP (thus far). He's the difference between a 4-2 beat down on low percentages and going to game 7.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Youre talking to the same tards that discredit Kobe for the 3 peat :lol

[CTbasketball92]

Kyrie might be being somewhat underrated in the sense that people are still acting as if he's the 2016 Steve Francis, but I think a lot of people recognize his contributions. Up until he was slightly hurt in Game 6, I'd say he was a reasonable contender for finals MVP. It just so happens that LeBron turned in another absolutely transcendent effort in Game 6, and Kyrie was slowed by his foot tweaking, and so his numbers were depressed.

But make so mistake, 25.2 ppg on 47% FG% and 44% 3p FG% 5 assists and 2 steals with only 2.5 turnovers and a 30% Usage rate are superstar numbers. Pretty sure if you look back at Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, Carmelo, Tony Parker ... those sort of perennial all star/superstar players playoff runs, none of them have numbers quite as impressive as those. Kyrie has a 24.8 PER this playoffs in 20 games, and it could go up a bit next game. He also has a 28 PER for the NBA finals compared to Steph's 20.

I hope he can carry this over to Game 7 and the regular season, because then there won't be more talk about trading him.

[Bankaii]

If you're being serious this is one of the worst threads so far.

First off, they haven't played a game 7 yet dipshit.

And Lebron was the best player in game 6 and it isn't even debatable. Period.
Game 5 they were about even but for the entirety of this series Lebron has been the FMVP.

Dude is leading both teams in points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks while being the best defender for the Cavs and people are still trying to argue he hasn't been the best.:roll:

[SexSymbol]

If you're being serious this is one of the worst threads so far.

First off, they haven't played a game 7 yet dipshit.

And Lebron was the best player in game 6 and it isn't even debatable. Period.
Game 5 they were about even but for the entirety of this series Lebron has been the FMVP.

Dude is leading both teams in points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks while being the best defender for the Cavs and people are still trying to argue he hasn't been the best.:roll:
it's definitely debatable.
Kyrie was leading the cavs throughout the first half to the big blowout margin.
There's a difference in being guarded by a healthy klay thompson and Iggy who can't move out there

[Doranku]

Kyrie's performance in game 5 might be the most impressive finals performance I've ever watched live.

He's not the finals MVP though. LeBron is on some otherwordly type shit right now. The man is leading the finals in every f*cking stat. There's maybe a handful of other players in NBA history capable of replicating that production.

Win or lose, LeBron deserves the finals MVP in all honesty. I really hope the Cavs win though, would be really shitty to see him win finals MVP in a losing effort.

[Bobcats2013]

bron scored the quietest 41 ever compared to kyrie in game 5 and in game 3 kyrie was the reason they went on that run very early on

kyrie was carrying bron before game 6, its fact nikkas just wanna look at the stat sheets and not the timely shots

[West-Side]

bron scored the quietest 41 ever compared to kyrie in game 5 and in game 3 kyrie was the reason they went on that run very early on

kyrie was carrying bron before game 6, its fact nikkas just wanna look at the stat sheets and not the timely shots

Ah, let's jerk off to LeBron's stats per usual. Yet down 0-2, where was LeBron? It was Kyrie who won them the game. Do people not understand that despite Bron's great stats, he would have been swept already? He looked horrible in game 3. He was missing everything and the entire forum including Bron fans were destroying the guy. It was Kyrie who prevented the sweep. He extended this opportunity for them.

Again, please go re-watch game 3. James had like 7 straight misses at one point, bricking layups. Kyrie took it upon himself to provide the offense.

James played brilliantly game 5&6, and will obviously be chosen as the FMVP because of his stats. But to me a real MVP is the guy that elevates his game when the team really needs them. Plus Kyrie's stats are impressive as hell as well.

[El Gato Negro]

The sad thing is kyrie has been playing this way since he was a rookie. People just didn't think he could do it in the playoffs. Now they say it's because LeBron, but this is just who Kyrie is and always has been.

[ArbitraryWater]

Kyrie had as much to do with the Cavs winning game 6 & 7 as Bron Sid if not far far far more. Without Kyrie's shooting they never would of had the opportunity for Bran to be a front runner and dominate. Bran is the ultimate confidence player - he simply needs someone else on his team to be dominating and he gathers up confidence and momentum and feasts on it.

But let's be real. Kyrie has been the difference. He's the true Finals MVP (thus far). He's the difference between a 4-2 beat down on low percentages and going to game 7.

this guy wants to betaken seriously as objective poster, lol

[ArbitraryWater]

Ah, let's jerk off to LeBron's stats per usual. Yet down 0-2, where was LeBron? It was Kyrie who won them the game. Do people not understand that despite Bron's great stats, he would have been swept already? He looked horrible in game 3. He was missing everything and the entire forum including Bron fans were destroying the guy. It was Kyrie who prevented the sweep. He extended this opportunity for them.

Again, please go re-watch game 3. James had like 7 straight misses at one point, bricking layups. Kyrie took it upon himself to provide the offense.

James played brilliantly game 5&6, and will obviously be chosen as the FMVP because of his stats. But to me a real MVP is the guy that elevates his game when the team really needs them. Plus Kyrie's stats are impressive as hell as well.

You guys are not to be helped man.... :oldlol:

Shits sad.

[aj1987]

Ah, let's jerk off to LeBron's stats per usual. Yet down 0-2, where was LeBron? It was Kyrie who won them the game. Do people not understand that despite Bron's great stats, he would have been swept already? He looked horrible in game 3. He was missing everything and the entire forum including Bron fans were destroying the guy. It was Kyrie who prevented the sweep. He extended this opportunity for them.

Again, please go re-watch game 3. James had like 7 straight misses at one point, bricking layups. Kyrie took it upon himself to provide the offense.

James played brilliantly game 5&6, and will obviously be chosen as the FMVP because of his stats. But to me a real MVP is the guy that elevates his game when the team really needs them. Plus Kyrie's stats are impressive as hell as well.
tl;dr - Pau deserved FMVP's in '09 and '10. :cheers:

[ArbitraryWater]

tl;dr - Pau deserved FMVP's in '09 and '10. :cheers:

cant believe how accurate that is given what he imagines the MVP to be :oldlol:

[Straight_Ballin]

I don't recall Pippen doing what Kyrie did.

This game 7 boils down to one thing.

Can Lebron do enough.

Can he do as Jordan did.

There are no excuses.

We will either see a man slowly start to approach Jordan's greatness, or we will continue to see a bitch continue to be a bitch.

[Dray n Klay]

I don't recall Pippen doing what Kyrie did.

This game 7 boils down to one thing.

Can Lebron do enough.

Can he do as Jordan did.

There are no excuses.

We will either see a man slowly start to approach Jordan's greatness, or we will continue to see a bitch continue to be a bitch.


I recall Pippen being an MVP candidate and carrying the Bulls to the same record without MJ in 1994, Once MJ quit from basketball like a coward :confusedshrug:



Meanwhile Kyrie has never even made the playoffs without Lebron

[Straight_Ballin]

I recall Pippen being an MVP candidate and carrying the Bulls to the same record without MJ in 1994, Once MJ quit from basketball like a coward :confusedshrug:



Meanwhile Kyrie has never even made the playoffs without Lebron

None of that matters. What matters is finals performances and Pippen has never done what Kyrie did this series.

Lebron has all the help he needs but the bond with him and Kyrie isn't as strong as Pippen and Jordan. You can't get any stronger of a bond as having one player mold another player. Kyrie was already ballin when James joined the Cavs.

No excuses

No "oh well GSW home crowd is too much" or any of that shit. Either this guy shows us that he is on his way to MJ's greatness, or he crumbles and doesn't do enough. It really is that simple.

[Dray n Klay]

None of that matters. What matters is finals performances and Pippen has never done what Kyrie did this series.

.


Using that argument, nothing Jordan did in a Finals game was as good as Kyrie in Game 5.

Are you saying Kyrie >> MJ?

[Straight_Ballin]

Using that argument, nothing Jordan did in a Finals game was as good as Kyrie in Game 5.

Are you saying Kyrie >> MJ?

We now know how much help lebron has. He actually needs a guy who did better than MJ in the finals to have a chance at winning.

No excuses

[Dray n Klay]

We now know how much help lebron has. He actually needs a guy who did better than MJ in the finals to have a chance at winning.

No excuses

Except MJ wasnt really a great finals performer.



You forgot '96? When MJ allowed Gary Payton to mentally abuse him and almost choked a 3-0 series lead while shooting 41% from the field?

[Straight_Ballin]

Except MJ wasnt really a great finals performer.



You forgot '96? When MJ allowed Gary Payton to mentally abuse him and almost choked a 3-0 series lead while shooting 41% from the field?


it's been well documented that those 2 games were lost on purpose so that MJ could celebrate on his own court. You're talking about a guy who shit on Payton at will and never allowed a 7 game series.

[DirkNowitzki41]

Lets reiterate, LBJ is leading the finals in all major stats and is the best defender of either team.

[sundizz]

Lets reiterate, LBJ is leading the finals in all major stats and is the best defender of either team.

Kinda sad when people only look at stats. Literally, the only game Lebron was better in the entire series was game 6.



Let's put it in perspective:
Game 3 - Kyrie absolutely took over in the first half and Bron followed up.

Game 5 - Kyrie absolutely took over. Bran played sporadically decent (missed 7 straight at one point) and then turned into beast mode once confidence kicked in. Kyrie had one of the best finals performances ever. A lot of Brans stat stuffer points etc came when the game was pretty much decided. Kyrie did all his damage when the game was tight on 70% shooting.


Game 6 - Both played amazing and Bran was better. One of the best finals performances I've seen.

[Nuff Said]

it's been well documented that those 2 games were lost on purpose so that MJ could celebrate on his own court. You're talking about a guy who shit on Payton at will and never allowed a 7 game series.
That's the dumbest shit I ever heard. The ultimate competitor Jordan decided to risk it and lose on purpose?

[NBAGOAT]

it's been well documented that those 2 games were lost on purpose so that MJ could celebrate on his own court. You're talking about a guy who shit on Payton at will and never allowed a 7 game series.

and let me guess, you think MJ had a bad game vs the Jazz game 5 1998 because he wanted to celebrate on their court :oldlol:

[Pointguard]

Kinda sad when people only look at stats. Literally, the only game Lebron was better in the entire series was game 6.



Let's put it in perspective:
Game 3 - Kyrie absolutely took over in the first half and Bron followed up.

Game 5 - Kyrie absolutely took over. Bran played sporadically decent (missed 7 straight at one point) and then turned into beast mode once confidence kicked in. Kyrie had one of the best finals performances ever. A lot of Brans stat stuffer points etc came when the game was pretty much decided. Kyrie did all his damage when the game was tight on 70% shooting.


Game 6 - Both played amazing and Bran was better. One of the best finals performances I've seen.
Without Lebron's rebounding, assist and passing they are swept, without question. Kyrie got to start affecting the game in other ways to be on Lebron's level. But I love exciting players and Kyrie is the most exciting player out there. But he's got a ways to go to be the best.

[RedBlackAttack]

I recall Pippen being an MVP candidate and carrying the Bulls to the same record without MJ in 1994, Once MJ quit from basketball like a coward :confusedshrug:



Meanwhile Kyrie has never even made the playoffs without Lebron
I'm going to ask a straightforward question to whomever is reading this and I'd actually like an answer, since this is the default criticism that people always fall back on. I will point out a couple of things and set the stage before I get to the question, because the situation and circumstances of Kyrie Irving leading the 2012-2014 Cavs were not your average team in your average situation.

1. Kyrie was 19-21 years old while trying to lead these teams to what would have been pretty improbable playoff berths, even in the East (which is actually not weak in seeds 5-8).

2. The Cavaliers were actively not even trying to make the playoffs until his final year before LBJ came back (2014), so it is preposterous that it would be used against him. They went as far as holding Kyrie out for weeks at a time during his first two years. They were also very public about a "three-year plan" in the years after LeBron left, meaning they were willing to put up with losing for three years if it meant being a part of the draft lottery system, which worked out really well for thr organization in retrospect.

So, all that beinf said, we can only focus on one season during Kyrie's first three years in the league where the franchise made a concerted effort to help him make a postseason push.

Now, getting to the matter at hand, let's look at the 2014 Cavaliers, which Kyrie Irving failed so terribly to lead to a playoff.

First of all, they made a coaching change heading into the season, firing Byron Scott who had been there for Kyrie's first two seasons, for Mike Brown. The Cavs GM at the time -- Chris Grant -- was extremely close with Brown and he staked his job in the front office (which Grant lost later that season) to Brown's ability to guide a team lead by Kyrie Irving to the playoffs in his third season, which is exactly what he had done with LeBron eight years earlier.

Offseason UFA Acquisitions: Andrew Bynum, Jarrett Jack, Earl Clark
Draft Acquisitions: Anthony Bennett, Carrck Felix

Roster
PG: Kyrie Irving
SG: Dion Waiters
SF: Earl Clark
PF: Tristan Thompson
C: Andrew Bynum

Bench
Jarett Jack
Anderson Varejao
CJ Miles
Tyler Zeller
Anthony Bennett
Matthew Dellavedova
Sergey Karasev
Carrick Felix


That was the roster at the start of the season and through the first couple months. There were a few changes as the season wore on. They added Luol Deng and Spencer Hawes at the deadline, after which the team improved dramatically and made a late-season push for the 8 seed. But, those guys played less than a third of the season. Not that they're any great shakes anyway.


So, there you have... that's the roster a 21-year-old Kyrie Irving "failed" to lead to the playoffs. It's easy to indict the guy for his accomplishments pre-LeBron, but look at that roster. Look at that startijg lineup, and keep in mind Mike Brown was the head coach.

My question is, which players in the NBA could you replace Kyrie Irving with and that would be a playoff team?

The secondary question is which players 21 and under could lead that roster to a postseason berth if you replaced Kyrie with them?

[Ben Simmons]

Lebron haters have been trying to prop up Kyrie all series. He's not being underrated at all.

At what point do you acknowledge that Lebron is the best offensive and defensive player in the series on both teams?

[RedBlackAttack]

Lebron haters have been trying to prop up Kyrie all series. He's not being underrated at all.

At what point do you acknowledge that Lebron is the best offensive and defensive player in the series on both teams?
You really don't have to "prop someone up" when they're averaging 27/5/3/2.5 on 49/41/92 while going against Steph Curry. The numbers speak for themselves.

[Ben Simmons]

You really don't have to "prop someone up" when they're averaging 27/5/3/2.5 on 49/41/92 while going against Steph Curry. The numbers speak for themselves.
You do when when you are arguing against someone averaging 30/11/8.5 while leading both teams in all categories.

Not saying Kyrie isnt playing great. He is. Not taking anything away from him.

But Lebron has quite literally left the planet in what is expected of a player.

[FireDavidKahn]

Kyrie had as much to do with the Cavs winning game 6 & 7 as Bron Sid if not far far far more. Without Kyrie's shooting they never would of had the opportunity for Bran to be a front runner and dominate. Bran is the ultimate confidence player - he simply needs someone else on his team to be dominating and he gathers up confidence and momentum and feasts on it.

But let's be real. Kyrie has been the difference. He's the true Finals MVP (thus far). He's the difference between a 4-2 beat down on low percentages and going to game 7.
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[FireDavidKahn]

it's definitely debatable.
Kyrie was leading the cavs throughout the first half to the big blowout margin.
There's a difference in being guarded by a healthy klay thompson and Iggy who can't move out there
Only if you're an idiot. If the Cavs win LeBron will sweep the FMVP votes and rightfully so.

People are just creaming for Kyrie because Kyrie is someone else to vote for. :facepalm

[FireDavidKahn]

Lets reiterate, LBJ is leading the finals in all major stats and is the best defender of either team.
No kidding.

[FireDavidKahn]

Without Lebron's rebounding, assist and passing they are swept, without question. Kyrie got to start affecting the game in other ways to be on Lebron's level. But I love exciting players and Kyrie is the most exciting player out there. But he's got a ways to go to be the best.
Not to mention Kyrie only plays half a game out there.

[livinglegend]

Kinda sad when people only look at stats. Literally, the only game Lebron was better in the entire series was game 6.



Let's put it in perspective:
Game 3 - Kyrie absolutely took over in the first half and Bron followed up.

Game 5 - Kyrie absolutely took over. Bran played sporadically decent (missed 7 straight at one point) and then turned into beast mode once confidence kicked in. Kyrie had one of the best finals performances ever. A lot of Brans stat stuffer points etc came when the game was pretty much decided. Kyrie did all his damage when the game was tight on 70% shooting.


Game 6 - Both played amazing and Bran was better. One of the best finals performances I've seen.

Lebron was better games 1, 2,3, 5 and 6. Game 4, it was Kyrie.

[The_Yearning]

Warriors would have swept if it were not for Kyrie.

[moongaze]

Lebron was better games 1, 2,3, 5 and 6. Game 4, it was Kyrie.

Disagree. Kyrie was better in games 3 and 5 also. He had the biggest impact on the two most important quarters of the season. Game 3 was basically the cavs season on the line. Theyd lost 7 straight to the warriors and were mentally shell shocked. Kyrie coming in and putting his foot down and throwing the first punch at this Golden state team put the fight back in the cavs and showed them they can hurt this team. That quarter changed the complexion of the series. Not to mention lebron started that game off bad and was bad till the secobd half. It it weren't for Kyrie,warriors would have kept up the momentum from the 7 straight and the game might have been blown open early and we'd be looking at a potential sweep instead of a 7 game series.

Game 5 4th quarter was do or die on the road. Cavs had blown the 4th quarter of the previous game and were in danger of doing the same in game 5 up against a hostile crowd. Kyrie's 12 points sealed the deal and it gave the warriors big doubt as Cleveland showed it has the two best players in the series and when they dominate, it's over.

Not to mention Kyrie shot 70 percent from the field and 71 percent from three. If he shot the same percentage as lebron did that game it would have been a much closer game and the warriors might have had a slight lead from time to time