Wait a minute - Kyrie dropped 27/4/4 on 47%?... Pippen never did anything NEAR that

[3ball]

.
Pippen's career high is 24 ppg in a series where Jordan scored 45 ppg (1992 1st Round).. Pip's high in the Finals is 21 ppg.. So Kyrie stepped up and gave Lebron more help.

Ultimately, Lebron has many series where he isn't his team's leading scorer (including an entire playoff run), whereas Jordan was required to lead his team in scoring for every series of his career, by an average of 15.4 ppg (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406920).

The reality is that NO all-time great led their team in scoring for every series of their careers, let alone by 15 ppg like Jordan.

In addition to Jordan's astonishingly goat scoring load, he also led his team in passing, just like Lebron - Jordan led the Bulls in assist percentage for both 3-peats (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11713121&postcount=49), so he assisted on the highest proportion of teammate field goals.. Ultimately, Jordan's goat scoring load, team-leading passing, and best-ever defense at his position is the goat performance and biggest load ever carried.

[Dray n Klay]

Umm... defense? :hammerhead:

[Ben Simmons]

To beat the Greatest team of all time you are gonna need the greatest sidekick performance along with the greatest individual performance ever.

[aj1987]

'91 - 21/9/7/2/1 on 45%
'92 - 21/8/8/2/1 on 48%
'93 - 21/9/8/2/1 on 44%

That with DPOY level defense. Hold this L, 0ball.

[SouBeachTalents]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=12054491&postcount=31

[allball]

Chicago had better 3rd options than Kevin Love. Great performance by Kyrie though.

Long live the King

[aj1987]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=12054491&postcount=31
That reply nearly gave me cancer and super AIDS. I actually tried having a serious conversation with 0ball, but you really can't when the poster doesn't even watch basketball.

[inclinerator]

many cuz jordan took all the shots

[bigkingsfan]

Pippen led a Jordan-less team to 55 wins.

[theaussieguy]

yes because scoring is the only part of the game :|, we need to accept it 3ball, Lebron is the KING.

[Asukal]

That dagger 3 by kyrie saved bran from going 2/7. Hail king Kyrie! :bowdown:

[Ben Simmons]

That dagger 3 by kyrie saved bran from going 2/7. Hail king Kyrie! :bowdown:
Game was tied

[Smoke117]

That reply nearly gave me cancer and super AIDS. I actually tried having a serious conversation with 0ball, but you really can't when the poster doesn't even watch basketball.

That's why he won't just go away...you fools keep humoring him.

[NBAGOAT]

Maybe Pippen only has a series high of 24ppg because of Jordan's suboptimal style. See 3ball I can be a spin doctor too :hammerhead:

[AintNoSunshine]

So fking what? Lebron had to lead everyone in everything. Jordan never had to do that. You know why? Because Jordan never faced a 73-9 team.

[branslowski]

Kyrie should have been Finals MVP honestly, i mean look at game 3, he came ouy like game buster and set the tone early..And then that game 5 in which he dominated the 4th when the game was still close, he had 12pts and the rest of the team had 7pts in that 4th. Then last night the buckets he was making was pretty much godly including the demoralizing series clinching 3 on Curry. That man came to play.

[3ball]

Lebron had to lead everyone in everything.


Jordan had much bigger responsibility in the most important area for #1 options: he SCORED far more in the playoffs and Finals, while only averaging 1 less assist.

Specifically, MJ scored 5-6 more points with better efficiency across the board (ts, fg, and ortg), which is more valuable, requires more energy, and controls the game better than Lebron's 2.5 defensive rebound edge and 1.0 assist edge.. There's never been a #1 option that scored nearly 6 more points on better efficiency that wasn't considered the FAR better player.





Jordan never had to lead in everything like Lebron does


You're forgetting that even though Lebron scores WAY less in the playoffs, he only averages 1 more assist - so could Lebron maintain that tiny assist edge if he was required to lead his team in scoring for every playoff series of his career by an average of 15.4 ppg (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406920), like Jordan did??

Obviously not - Lebron has many series where he wasn't the team's leading scorer (even an entire playoff run).. The reality is that NO all-time great led their team in scoring for every playoff series of their career, let alone by 15 ppg like Jordan (let that sink in).

Btw, in addition to Jordan's goat scoring load, he also led his team in passing, just like Lebron - Jordan led the Bulls in assist percentage for both 3-peats (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11713121&postcount=49), so he assisted on the highest proportion of teammate field goals.. Ultimately, Jordan's goat scoring load, team-leading passing, and best-ever defense at his position is the goat performance and biggest load ever carried.

[Poetry]

Kyrie's GmSc average of 19.1 in the Finals is higher than Pip's highest GmSc of 18.1. He was statistically more productive than Pip ever was in a Finals.

[iamgine]

Yet Pippen was more impactful.

[Meticode]

LeBron averaged nearly 30 a game in the Finals. Irving 27? Guess what was third? J.R. Smith with a hair under 11. Guess who was fourth? Tristan Thompson with a hair over 10. Then Love with 8/7.

[3ball]

Yet Pippen was more impactful.


Nope - Kyrie's achieved 27 ppg on 47%, which utterly destroys Pippen's 15 ppg on 34% in 1996 Finals, or his 15 ppg on 41% in 1998 Finals.

Pippen was a good player, but there's a reason the Bulls needed Jordan to lead them in scoring for every playoff series of his career by an average of 15 ppg (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406920), WHILE STILL leading the team in passing (Jordan led Bulls in assist percentage for both 3-peats (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11713121&postcount=49), so he assisted on the highest proportion of teammate FG's).

Ultimately, Jordan's goat scoring load, team-leading passing, and best-ever defense at his position is the goat performance and biggest load ever carried.

[Meticode]

Kyrie should have been Finals MVP honestly, i mean look at game 3, he came ouy like game buster and set the tone early..And then that game 5 in which he dominated the 4th when the game was still close, he had 12pts and the rest of the team had 7pts in that 4th. Then last night the buckets he was making was pretty much godly including the demoralizing series clinching 3 on Curry. That man came to play.
Without Irving the Cavs don't win it. Without LeBron, the Cavs don't win it. Irving had MVP-type series, but it was clearly LeBron that deserved it to me.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Then why was MJ 2-9 without Pippen?

[bigkingsfan]

Also, has Jordan ever average 30 11 9 2 2 in any series, let alone the finals?

[3ball]

Then why was MJ 2-9 without Pippen?


His supporting cast was one of the worst ever - the numbers tell the story - Jordan's 1989 cast added enough help on top of his 33/8/8 to win 47 games - compare that to Lebron's cast in 2009, which added enough help on top of his 28/8/7 to win 66 games..

The only possible reasons for the Cavs winning 19 more games despite Lebron's inferior production is that his supporting cast was better and/or they played inferior competition.. Obviously, the 19 additional wins isn't ONLY due to inferior competition - it's due to better supporting cast as well.

Brand of basketball isn't an issue - we know Jordan's 1989 team played a better brand of basketball because his brand was more successful in the playoffs.. Jordan's 6th seeded Bulls beat higher seeds in every round and took the champs to 6 games in ECF, while Lebron's heavily-favored 1 seed saw their brand of basketball exposed in the 2nd Round by the Magic.

Also, there's another reason Jordan's cast might've been the worst ever - no all-time great led their team in scoring for every playoff series of their career, let alone by 15 ppg (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406920) like Jordan.. Let that sink in

And Jordan's impact on his horrible cast is clearly evident - in 1989, the 47-win Bulls would've missed the 45-win playoff cut without Jordan's 33/8/8.. So without Jordan, that roster was a LOTTERY roster and headed nowhere going into the 1990 season - but WITH Jordan, they were ECF veterans and about to begin a 6-peat dynasty.. Essentially, Jordan led that same lottery roster from 1989 to a 3-peat beginning 2 seasons later - that's the goat impact on a lottery team.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

His supporting cast was one of the worst ever - the numbers tell the story - Jordan's 1989 cast added enough help on top of his 33/8/8 to win 47 games - compare that to Lebron's cast in 2009, which added enough help on top of his 28/8/7 to win 66 games.. The only possible reasons for the Cavs winning 19 more games despite Lebron's inferior production is that his supporting cast was better and/or they played inferior competition.. Obviously, the 19 additional wins isn't ONLY due to inferior competition - it's due to better supporting cast as well.

Brand of basketball isn't an issue - we know Jordan's 1989 team played a better brand of basketball because his brand was more successful in the playoffs.. Jordan's 6th seeded Bulls beat higher seeds in every round and took the champs to 6 games in ECF, while Lebron's heavily-favored 1 seed saw their brand of basketball exposed in the 2nd Round by the Magic.

Also, there's another reason Jordan's cast might've been the worst ever - no all-time great led their team in scoring for every playoff series of their career, let alone by 15 ppg (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406920) like Jordan.. Let that sink in

And Jordan's impact on his horrible cast is clearly evident - in 1989, the 47-win Bulls would've missed the 45-win playoff cut without Jordan's 33/8/8.. So without Jordan, that roster was a LOTTERY roster and headed nowhere going into the 1990 season - but WITH Jordan, they were ECF veterans and about to begin a 6-peat dynasty.. Essentially, Jordan led that same lottery roster from 1989 to a 3-peat beginning 2 seasons later - that's the goat impact on a lottery team.
LeBron wins at least 9 rings with Jordan's casts.

[Round Mound]

Top 4 in PER 93-94 Season
Top 7 in PER 94-95 Season

While Leading the League In Defensive Rating at the SF Spot.

[3ball]

Also, has Jordan ever average 30 11 9 2 2 in any series, let alone the finals?


in 1993 finals, he averaged 41 9 6 2 1

in 1991 finals, he averaged 33 7 11 2 2

[bigkingsfan]

in 1993 finals, he averaged 41 9 6 2 1

in 1991 finals, he averaged 33 7 11 2 2
Looks like he came up short of Lebron's #'s.

[3ball]

LeBron wins at least 9 rings with Jordan's casts.


For Lebron to go 6/6 like Mike, he would need to lead the Bulls in scoring for every series of his career, BY AN AVERAGE OF 15.4 PPG (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406920), while still leading the team in assist percentage for both 3-peats (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11713121&postcount=49) and being the best defender ever at his position.

Lebron isn't capable of such a heavy a load - the scoring burden is way too much.. The reality is that NO all-time great led his team in scoring for every series of his career, let alone by 15 ppg like Jordan.

Ultimately, Jordan averaged a whopping 5.5 more points on better efficiency in the playoffs, which is more valuable, requires more energy, and controls the game better than Lebron's 2.5 defensive rebound edge and 1.0 assist edge.
.

[yeaaaman]

Without Irving the Cavs don't win it. Without LeBron, the Cavs don't win it. Irving had MVP-type series, but it was clearly LeBron that deserved it to me.

Agreed