36/7/8 > 30/9/11 since MJ was 16 ppg over Pip vs. Bron's 2 ppg over Kyrie

[3ball]

.
Jordan averaged 36/7/8 in 1991-1993 Finals, which included 16 ppg more than Pippen and all the game-winning plays, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie with Kyrie making all the game-winning plays..

Jordan's 1997 run was also better for the same reason.. He led Pippen by 12 ppg, while also leading the Bulls in all categories for the entire playoffs - points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks (edit: Rodman averaged 8.3 rebs to Jordan's 7.9).. Jordan also made all the game-winning plays in the Finals (2 game-winners and series winning assist), while Lebron needed Kyrie to make the game-winning plays.
.

[ISHGoat]

Shut the fu.ck up

Nobody cares

[3ball]

Shut the fu.ck up

Nobody cares


Jordan's 1997 run was also better for the same reason..

He led Pippen by 12 ppg, while also leading the Bulls in all categories for the entire playoffs - points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks (edit: Rodman averaged 8.3 rebs to Jordan's 7.9).. Jordan also made all the game-winning plays in the Finals (2 game-winners and series winning assist), while Lebron needed Kyrie to make the game-winning plays.

[Ben Simmons]

Lebron beat the greatest team of all time.

Of course he had a great 2nd option.

73 wins >>>>

[3ball]

Lebron beat the greatest team of all time.

73 wins >>>>


the team with the best record frequently lose in the playoffs, so regular season records don't determine how good a team is

ultimately, MJ averaged 36/7/8 in 1991-1993 Finals, which included a FAR greater scoring load than Lebron had, so his Finals were better

[SouBeachTalents]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg

[Ben Simmons]

the team with the best record FREQUENTLY loses in the playoffs, so regular season records don't determine how good a team is

MJ averaged 36/7/8 in 1991-1993 Finals, which included a FAR greater scoring load than Lebron had, so his Finals were better
The warriors were the greatest team of all time. Lebron had a better 2nd option (in scoring) but he also beat a greater team.

73 wins >>>.

[3ball]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg


^^^^ That's 3rd grade-level thinking

Jordan's 36/7/8 > Lebron's 30/11/9 because Jordan averaged 16 ppg more than Pippen, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie.. It's pretty obvious

[bigkingsfan]

Jordan beat an old man with hiv and a bunch of ringless players who made the finals once.

[3ball]

The warriors were the greatest team of all time.

73 wins >>>.


the team with the best regular season record frequently lose in the playoffs, THEREFORE regular season records don't determine how good a team is

Jordan's 36/7/8 > Lebron's 30/11/9 because Jordan averaged 16 ppg more than Pippen, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie.. It's pretty obvious

[SouBeachTalents]

^^^^ That's 3rd grade-level thinking

Jordan's 36/7/8 > Lebron's 30/11/9 because Jordan averaged 16 ppg more than Pippen, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie.. It's pretty obvious

Lmao, all your threads and posts are third grade thinking. All you say is "So and so scored more, so he was better". Basically insinuating Glen Rice > Pippen & Antawn Jamison > Rodman

[Ben Simmons]

the team with the best regular season record frequently lose in the playoffs, THEREFORE regular season records don't determine how good a team is

Jordan's 36/7/8 > Lebron's 30/11/9 because Jordan averaged 16 ppg more than Pippen, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie.. It's pretty obvious
They do when you win a record 73 times.

Imagine if they played in the shortened 3 point era.

Lebron > Jordan

[3ball]

Jordan beat an old man with hiv


Magic was runner up for MVP in 1991.. try again





and a bunch of ringless players who made the finals once.


Magic won 5 rings and is a top 5 all-time player... Shaq won 4 rings and is a top 10 all-time player - Jordan beat both of these guys, who are better than anyone Lebron has ever FACED, let alone defeated.

Drexler made Finals in 1990, Malone made Finals in 1997

[3ball]

:rolleyes:
.

[bigkingsfan]

Magic was runner up for MVP in 1991.. try again



Magic won 5 rings and is a top 5 all-time player... Shaq won 4 rings and is a top 10 all-time player - Jordan beat both of these guys, who are better than anyone Lebron has ever FACED, let alone defeated.

Drexler made Finals in 1990, Malone made Finals in 1997

1991-1993, make up your mind. :facepalm

[3ball]

1991-1993, make up your mind. :facepalm


hey bro - show me where Lebron DOMINATED another all-time great in a playoff series

Jordan dominated Magic (31/7/11 on 56% versus 19/7/12 on 43%)..... and he dominated Drexler (36 ppg on 52% versus 25 ppg on 41%).

[Ben Simmons]

hey bro - show me where Lebron DOMINATED another all-time great in a playoff series

Jordan dominated Magic (31/7/11 on 56% versus 19/7/12 on 43%)..... and he dominated Drexler (36 ppg on 52% versus 25 ppg on 41%).
Curry > Drexler

73 wins >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[bigkingsfan]

hey bro - show me where Lebron DOMINATED another all-time great in a playoff series

Jordan dominated Magic (31/7/11 on 56% versus 19/7/12 on 43%)..... and he dominated Drexler (36 ppg on 52% versus 25 ppg on 41%).
He dominated an entire team.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg

[3ball]

Curry > Drexler

73 wins >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
they weren't matched up heads-up and you know it

lebron has NEVER dominated another all-time great in a playoff series

whereas Jordan dominated Magic (31/7/11 versus 19/7/12) and Drexler (36 ppg on 52% versus 25 ppg on 41%).

[3ball]

He dominated an entire team


36/7/8 dominates a team more than 30/11/9 because Jordan averaged 16 ppg more than Pippen while making all the game-winning plays, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie with Kyrie making all the game-winning plays..

It's pretty obvious

Also, Lebron averaged 24 ppg and 6 turnovers thru 4 games (3-1 deficit), and then came back by averaging 36 ppg in the final 3 games.. But if he averaged 36 ppg for the ENTIRE SERIES like Jordan did in 1991-1993 Finals, then he wouldn't need a 7th game..
.

[bigkingsfan]

36/7/8 dominates a team more than 30/11/9 because Jordan averaged 16 ppg more than Pippen while making all the game-winning plays, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie with Kyrie making all the game-winning plays..

It's pretty obvious

Also, Lebron averaged 24 ppg and 6 turnovers thru 4 games (3-1 deficit), and then came back by averaging 36 ppg in the final 3 games.. But if he averaged 36 ppg for the ENTIRE SERIES, like Jordan did in 1991-1993 Finals, then he wouldn't need a 7th game..
.

Pretty obvious dominating a team is better than dominating an individual.

[3ball]

Pretty obvious dominating a team is better than dominating an individual.


36/7/8 dominates a team more than 30/11/9 because Jordan averaged 16 ppg more than Pippen and made all the game-winning plays, compared to Lebron's 2 ppg over Kyrie with Kyrie making all the game-winning plays..

It's pretty obvious

Also, Lebron averaged 24 ppg and 6 turnovers thru 4 games (3-1 deficit), and came back by averaging 36 ppg in the final 3 games.. But if he averaged 36 ppg for the ENTIRE SERIES like Jordan did in 1991-1993 Finals, then he wouldn't need a 7th game... MJ was much >>

[bigkingsfan]

wouldn't need a 7th game..
Agreed, Jordan would have been eliminated before that, we have seen him VS superior team.

[tmacattack33]

Player X is better than Player Y because his second option is a better scorer. Terrible logic.

[aj1987]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg

[K.dot ShowTime]

3ball is a legend.

But after his finals performances LeBron > Jordan . not even close

[3ball]

Agreed, Jordan would have been eliminated before that, we have seen him VS superior team.


Jordan was the biggest reason the Bulls defeated every team they faced in the Finals (6/6), even though they were underdogs in 1991 and 1998.

Ask yourself "would Lebron would have his tiny 1 assist advantage if he was required to lead his team in scoring for every playoff series of his career by an average margin of 15.4 ppg (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406920) like Jordan?

The reality is that no all-time great led their team in scoring for every series of their careers, let alone by a margin of 15 ppg like Jordan (with all the game-winning plays).

[bigkingsfan]

The reality is that no all-time great led their team in scoring for every series of their careers, let alone by a margin of 15 ppg like Jordan (with all the game-winning plays).
The reality is no all time great would lose to the same team in three consecutive years.

[3ball]

3ball is a legend.

But after his finals performances LeBron > Jordan . not even close
36/7/8 while scoring 16 ppg more than 2nd option and making all the game-winning plays


>


30/11/9 while scoring 2 ppg more than 2nd option and the 2nd option makes the game-winning plays


Also, Lebron averaged 24 ppg and 6 turnovers thru 4 games (3-1 deficit), and came back by averaging 36 ppg in the final 3 games.. But if he averaged 36 ppg for the ENTIRE SERIES like Jordan did in 1991-1993 Finals, then he wouldn't need a 7th game... MJ was much >>

[3ball]

The reality is no all time great would lose to the same team in three consecutive years.


Jordan was never the favorite like Lebron was in 2009-2011 playoffs - and that's all that matters.

The only time Jordan lost in the playoffs was when he was a severe underdog.

[bigkingsfan]

Jordan was never the favorite like Lebron was in 2009-2011 playoffs - and that's all that matters.

The only time Jordan lost in the playoffs was when he was a severe underdog.
See 2016 finals severe underdog. Lebron comes out on top. Why can't Jordan?

[Ben Simmons]

The only time Jordan lost in the playoffs was when he was a severe underdog.
Lebron just won a ring as the severe underdog.

He's better than Jordan

[3ball]

See 2016 finals severe underdog. Lebron comes out on top. Why can't Jordan?



Anyone who watched in 1991 Finals knows that the Bulls were severe underdogs, which NBA.com documents in their history archives:


the Bulls were considered big underdogs to the Lakers in the Finals and the vast majority of media "experts" predicted an easy Lakers' victory.

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/top-20-moments-1990-91-season.html/


The Bulls were also underdogs in 1998 Finals - Utah had homecourt, plus they had SWEPT Shaq's 4 all-star Lakers and Popovich/Duncan's 56-win Spurs.. So everyone thought they would beat the Bulls, who were weary and had barely squeaked by Indiana in 7 games in ECF.. You would know this if you watched back then.

[bigkingsfan]

Anyone who watched in 1991 Finals knows that the Bulls were severe underdogs, which NBA.com documents in their history archives:


the Bulls were considered big underdogs to the Lakers in the Finals and the vast majority of media "experts" predicted an easy Lakers' victory.

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/top-20-moments-1990-91-season.html/


The Bulls were also underdogs in 1998 Finals - Utah had homecourt, plus they had SWEPT Shaq's 4 all-star Lakers and Popovich/Duncan's 56-win Spurs.. So everyone thought they would beat the Bulls, who were weary and had barely squeaked by Indiana in 7 games in ECF.. You would know this if you watched back then.
Bulls had comecourt vs old Lakers and just beat Jazz the year before, but somehow severe underdog. :roll:
No one picked Cavs to win period.

[3ball]

Bulls had comecourt vs old Lakers and just beat Jazz the year before, but somehow severe underdog. :roll:
No one picked Cavs to win period.


Despite your efforts to revise history, the facts are what they are - the Bulls were big underdogs going into the 1991 Finals (documented in previous post), and solid underdogs against the 98' Jazz.

More importantly, Jordan never lost as the favorite like Lebron did in 2009-2011 playoffs - that's the most important thing.. The only time Jordan lost in the playoffs was when he was a severe underdog.

You probably don't realize that the Bulls would've won the championship in 1990 if Pippen didn't have his legendary choke in Game 7 of ECF (2 pts, 1-10, famous (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqC74bv46Z8&t=1h22m15s) "migraine" headache).. The Bulls would've beaten the Blazers in the Finals, since the Pistons beat Blazers in 5 easy games, but needed 7 tough games and Pippen's choke to beat the Bulls.. The margin in ORtg was massive between Pistons/Blazers, but razor-thin vs. Bulls.

[bigkingsfan]

Despite your efforts to revise history, the facts are what they are - the Bulls were big underdogs going into the 1991 Finals (documented in previous post), and solid underdogs against the 98' Jazz.

More importantly, Jordan never lost as the favorite like Lebron did in 2009-2011 playoffs - that's the most important thing.. The only time Jordan lost in the playoffs was when he was a severe underdog.

You probably don't realize that the Bulls would've won the championship in 1990 if Pippen didn't have his legendary choke in Game 7 of ECF (2 pts, 1-10, famous "migraine" headache).. The Bulls would've beaten the Blazers in the Finals, since the Pistons beat Blazers in 5 easy games, but needed 7 tough games and Pippen's choke to beat the Bulls.. The margin in ORtg was massive between Pistons/Blazers, but razor-thin vs. Bulls.
Since you like facts, then back to :
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg

[bigkingsfan]

^^^ That's 3rd grade logic though

36/7/8 over THREE Finals while scoring 16 ppg more than 2nd option and making all the game-winning plays


>


30/11/9 in ONE Finals while scoring 2 ppg more than 2nd option and the 2nd option making the game-winning plays


Also, Lebron averaged 24 ppg and 6 turnovers thru 4 games (3-1 deficit), and came back by averaging 36 ppg in the final 3 games.. But if he averaged 36 ppg for the ENTIRE SERIES like Jordan did in 1991-1993 Finals, then he wouldn't need a 7th game... MJ was much >>
Leading both team in all stat is 3rd grade logic, but cherry picking points isn't. :roll:

[3ball]

Since you like facts, then back to Lebron being only player to lead his team in all categories


^^^ That's 3rd grade logic though

36/7/8 over THREE Finals while scoring 16 ppg more than 2nd option and making all the game-winning plays

>

30/11/9 in ONE Finals while scoring 2 ppg more than 2nd option and NOT making the game-winning plays


Also, Lebron averaged 24 ppg and 6 turnovers thru 4 games (3-1 deficit), and came back by averaging 36 ppg in the final 3 games.. But if he averaged 36 ppg for the ENTIRE SERIES like Jordan did in 1991-1993 Finals, then he wouldn't need a 7th game... MJ was much >>

[3ball]

Leading both team in all stat is 3rd grade logic, but cherry picking points isn't. :roll:


Scoring is the most important thing a #1 option does

You'd gladly trade Lebron's 1 extra assist and 4 defensive rebounds for Jordan's 6 more points on better efficiency and clutch dominance..

Jordan's scoring requires more energy and controls the game far more.. Let some unskilled big grab the defensive rebounds... :rolleyes:... Lebron's skillsets are redundant (rebounding steps on bigs toes... his ball-dominance steps on PG's toes)

[bigkingsfan]

So Lebron is the better overall player, and MJ the scorer. Gotcha

[3ball]

So Lebron is the better overall player, and MJ the scorer. Gotcha
No, Jordan's scoring load was far greater, yet he only averaged ONE less assist (with far less turnovers).

You'd gladly trade Lebron's 1 extra assist and 3 defensive rebounds for Jordan's 6 more points on better efficiency and clutch dominance..

Jordan's scoring requires more energy and controls the game far more.. Let some unskilled big grab the defensive rebounds... :rolleyes:... Lebron's skillsets are redundant (his rebounding infringes on his bigman's duties... his ball-dominance steps on PG's duties... hence 3/8 mediocre record vs 6/6 goat)

[bigkingsfan]

No, Jordan's scoring load was far greater, yet he only averaged ONE less assist (with far less turnovers).

You'd gladly trade Lebron's 1 extra assist and 3 defensive rebounds for Jordan's 6 more points on better efficiency and clutch dominance..

Jordan's scoring requires more energy and controls the game far more.. Let some unskilled big grab the defensive rebounds... :rolleyes:... Lebron's skillsets are redundant (his rebounding infringes on his bigman's duties... his ball-dominance steps on PG's duties... hence 3/8 mediocre record vs 6/6 goat)
You're just agreeing me at this point, points goes to Jordan, Assist/Rebounds Lebron.
Never forget
http://insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=382056

[3ball]

You're just agreeing me at this point, points goes to Jordan, Assist/Rebounds Lebron.


Jordan was a better passer than Lebron since he averaged only 1 less assist despite his team needing him to score far more - and the 1 assist is cancelled out by turnovers anyway.

You think that Lebron pounding the rock until he gets an assist is better than Jordan getting the same assists WITHOUT pounding the rock forever, while undertaking a larger scoring load.. One method yields 3/8, and the other yields 6/6... but Lebron is a better passer... :rolleyes:... so dumb





Never forget
http://insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=382056


I bumped that thread, because I was right - now that Durant has evened the playing field by team-hopping like Lebron did, Lebron has no cheating advantage anymore - so he won't win shit ever again.. sorry bud

[bigkingsfan]

I bumped that thread, because I was right - now that Durant has evened the playing field by team-hopping like Lebron did, Lebron has no cheating advantage anymore - so he won't win shit ever again.. sorry bud
Never wins a ring again, even though he did this year, nice logic. :oldlol:

[aj1987]

I bumped that thread, because I was right - now that Durant has evened the playing field by team-hopping like Lebron did, Lebron has no cheating advantage anymore - so he won't win shit ever again.. sorry bud
You made that thread in '15, you little bitch. LeBron averaged 30/11/9 on 50% and won a ring the season after you made the thread.

[Smoke117]

Lebron > Kareem > MJ

[Elosha]

Lebron played a great 2016 Finals and earned a hard fought come from behind victory. However, a main reason they were down 3-1 was because he played mediocre in 3 of the first 4 games. Further, GS turned out to be nowhere close to as good of a team as their 73 wins would suggest. This is why they could not close out Cleveland, even though they had every opportunity to do it in Game 5, even without Green. Step and Klay made stupid comments about Lebron after game 4, and clearly were overconfident with their lead. All in all, Cleveland beat a team nowhere near as good as the greatest team of all time.

Lebron played very well overall, give him his props. However, a greater team like the 2013 and 2014 Spurs would have closed his ass out easily in game 5. Warriors were severely overrated.

All of the comparisons to Jordan are simply the media being prisoners of the moment. Jordan was on an entirely higher level than Lebron has ever played at. Lebron has had a historically easy Eastern Conference run since basically 2012 (2011 Bulls were decent team), which explains his continued Finals appearances. This year's Eastern opponents were simply cannon fodder. But make no mistake, Golden State gave away this Finals more than Lebron and Cleveland took it. Any other historically great team would have crushed the Cavs in the same scenario.

[aj1987]

Lebron played a great 2016 Finals and earned a hard fought come from behind victory. However, a main reason they were down 3-1 was because he played mediocre in 3 of the first 4 games. Further, GS turned out to be nowhere close to as good of a team as their 73 wins would suggest. This is why they could not close out Cleveland, even though they had every opportunity to do it in Game 5, even without Green. Step and Klay made stupid comments about Lebron after game 4, and clearly were overconfident with their lead. All in all, Cleveland beat a team nowhere near as good as the greatest team of all time.

Lebron played very well overall, give him his props. However, a greater team like the 2013 and 2014 Spurs would have closed his ass out easily in game 5. Warriors were severely overrated.

All of the comparisons to Jordan are simply the media being prisoners of the moment. Jordan was on an entirely higher level than Lebron has ever played at. Lebron has had a historically easy Eastern Conference run since basically 2012 (2011 Bulls were decent team), which explains his continued Finals appearances. This year's Eastern opponents were simply cannon fodder. But make no mistake, Golden State gave away this Finals more than Lebron and Cleveland took it. Any other historically great team would have crushed the Cavs in the same scenario.
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Elosha]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Laugh all you want. Have you forgotten how the 2014 Spurs crushed the Heat in 5 games after being up 3 to 1? That was just one example. No really great team is ever letting a team down 3-1 come back. That's the antithesis of a historically great team. Do you think the Cavs are coming back from being down 3-1 against the 96 Bulls, 86 Celtics or 88 Lakers? Please...

[aj1987]

Laugh all you want. Have you forgotten how the 2014 Spurs crushed the Heat in 5 games after being up 3 to 1? That was just one example. No really great team is ever letting a team down 3-1 come back. That's the antithesis of a historically great team. Do you think the Cavs are coming back from being down 3-1 against the 96 Bulls, 86 Celtics or 88 Lakers? Please...
That Heat team wasn't even remotely close to being as good as this Cavs team. Offensively and defensively.

[32jazz]

they weren't matched up heads-up and you know it

lebron has NEVER dominated another all-time great in a playoff series

whereas Jordan dominated Magic (31/7/11 versus 19/7/12) and Drexler (36 ppg on 52% versus 25 ppg on 41%).

Jordan whined off Magic after losing game 1 ( How am I supposed to guard Magic & carry offensive load" to paraphrase him) & Pippen guarded Magic the rest of the way with double help.


Your obsession with Jordan is beyond weird.

[Elosha]

That Heat team wasn't even remotely close to being as good as this Cavs team. Offensively and defensively.

That's because the 2014 Spurs wouldn't let them come back. Their defense and offensive continuity made Lebron (largely empty garbage time stats), Wade, and Bosh look hopeless. They would have easily done the same to this year's Cavs. That Spurs team was locked in, unlike the incredibly inconsistent Warriors this year. Again, Cavs and Lebron played well, but Golden State lost the series more than the Cavs won it. Had Curry and Klay even played average for games 5-7, the series would be over. Hell, they had a 3-1 lead with Curry and Klay only playing one good game in game 4.

Golden State's ineptitude made Lebron and Cavs look better than what they were. Great teams don't blow a 3-1 lead.

If you could have this series 10 times, GS would probably win 8 out of 10. But they got overconfident, overrated their own abilities, and then Curry had an epic choke. (as did Klay) If Curry even plays average in Games 5 or 7, GS wins easily. He just missed wide open shots he had hit all year. Same with Klay. Even Green, with his epic Game 7, had a very quiet game in Game 6. After game 4, the Warriors just fell apart. It didn't help that they had injuries, but there's no excuse for blowing that lead, especially when they had done it to OKC in the previous round. They should have known no lead is safe. Golden State proved they were not a historically great team. Great teams don't go 15-9 in the playoffs and lose the championship, no matter how many games they win in the regular season.

[Hey Yo]

Jordan was a better passer than Lebron since he averaged only 1 less assist despite his team needing him to score far more - and the 1 assist is cancelled out by turnovers anyway.

You think that Lebron pounding the rock until he gets an assist is better than Jordan getting the same assists WITHOUT pounding the rock forever, while undertaking a larger scoring load.. One method yields 3/8, and the other yields 6/6... but Lebron is a better passer... :rolleyes:... so dumb



I bumped that thread, because I was right - now that Durant has evened the playing field by team-hopping like Lebron did, Lebron has no cheating advantage anymore - so he won't win shit ever again.. sorry bud
No cheating advantage anymore???....:oldlol:

Jordan took almost 2yrs off cause he needed rest. Then came back with 17 games left in the season to try to win a ring the cheapest way possible....via sneak in the backdoor and try to take all the credit.

LOL @ MJ stan saying another player cheated and got advantages.

[Elosha]

Jordan whined off Magic after losing game 1 ( How am I supposed to guard Magic & carry offensive load" to paraphrase him) & Pippen guarded Magic the rest of the way with double help.


Your obsession with Jordan is beyond weird.

That's actually not even close to true. You must not have watched the series. Jordan guarded Magic for the majority of the time, and did a pretty good job on him, given Magic's atrocious shooting percentage. Pippen also guarded Magic for substantial stretches and did arguably an even better job than Jordan. Pippen was longer and taller, and thus could disrupt Magic even better than Jordan could. But Magic was still primarily Jordan's defensive responsibility and he did an admirable job on him.

[dankok8]

The whole "Warriors didn't play at 73-win level" is probably true but it still doesn't change the fact that the Warriors were overwhelming favorites in the series. Even before Game 7, 80-90% of the people still picked them to win. Somehow discrediting the Cavaliers is the wrong way to go. They won as a heavy underdog. That's the bottom line. People have to remember that these Cavaliers weren't some kind of juggernaut... They won 57 games, had a pedestrian +5 SRS for a contender. Love got hurt in the playoffs and played below his level and somehow that never gets mentioned.

Meanwhile for the Warriors, Klay played a bit below his level, Green played a bit above. Role players for the most part played ok. Curry is the one who dropped the ball but part of that was the Cavs' defense and being forced to defend Kyrie on the other end.

[Elosha]

The whole "Warriors didn't play at 73-win level" is probably true but it still doesn't change the fact that the Warriors were overwhelming favorites in the series. Even before Game 7, 80-90% of the people still picked them to win. Somehow discrediting the Cavaliers is the wrong way to go. They won as a heavy underdog. That's the bottom line. People have to remember that these Cavaliers weren't some kind of juggernaut... They won 57 games, had a pedestrian +5 SRS for a contender. Love got hurt in the playoffs and played below his level and somehow that never gets mentioned.

Meanwhile for the Warriors, Klay played a bit below his level, Green played a bit above. Role players for the most part played ok. Curry is the one who dropped the ball but part of that was the Cavs' defense and being forced to defend Kyrie on the other end.

I'm not trying to discredit the Cavs. It's admirable what they did. They didn't give up and Lebron and Irving spearheaded their comeback. Lebron played overall extremely well in all 4 of their wins (but mediocre in their 3 losses). The Cavs peaked at the right time and played great defense for the final 3 games.

Still, I would say Curry and Klay both played subpar for the entire series. Not sure I'd agree with your assessment on Green. He had two great games, four relatively quiet/mediocre games, and was disqualified for game 5. I wouldn't say he played above his level, although he came close to almost singlehandedly winning game 7. I will say that he very well may have been Finals MVP had Golden State won game 7.

And yes, Curry may have been bothered by Cavs defense and guarding Irving but there's no disputing he missed tons of wide open looks. If he had just played average, instead of well below average, almost unquestionably Golden State would have won.

[dankok8]

I'm not trying to discredit the Cavs. It's admirable what they did. They didn't give up and Lebron and Irving spearheaded their comeback. Lebron played overall extremely well in all 4 of their wins (but mediocre in their 3 losses). The Cavs peaked at the right time and played great defense for the final 3 games.

Still, I would say Curry and Klay both played subpar for the entire series. Not sure I'd agree with your assessment on Green. He had two great games, four relatively quiet/mediocre games, and was disqualified for game 5. I wouldn't say he played above his level, although he came close to almost singlehandedly winning game 7. I will say that he very well may have been Finals MVP had Golden State won game 7.

And yes, Curry may have been bothered by Cavs defense and guarding Irving but there's no disputing he missed tons of wide open looks. If he had just played average, instead of well below average, almost unquestionably Golden State would have won.

Thompson was epic in Game 5 especially the first half but he barely ever go the ball after. Green was epic in Game 7 and barely got the ball. Curry as the playmaker has to know to feed the hot hand.

I agree with most of what you say.

[juju151111]

Jordan whined off Magic after losing game 1 ( How am I supposed to guard Magic & carry offensive load" to paraphrase him) & Pippen guarded Magic the rest of the way with double help.


Your obsession with Jordan is beyond weird.
Mj guarded Magic that series actually.

[dankok8]

I watched the 1991 Finals and it was mostly Pippen on Magic. Even NBA.com says so: http://www.nba.com/bulls/history/pippen10_1991.html

[QUOTE]In the Chicago

[SecondTake]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClYUvAdUYAAiRj9.jpg

Yeah, but the standard for rebounds and steals was pretty low

[aj1987]

That's because the 2014 Spurs wouldn't let them come back.
They couldn't comeback, because they were a terrible team in the Finals. Completely gassed and just stalled. Bosh, Wade, Rio, etc. couldn't score for shit.


Their defense and offensive continuity made Lebron (largely empty garbage time stats), Wade, and Bosh look hopeless.
Garbage time stats? Literally everyones stats were "garbage time" stats. After G2, all games were pretty much decided by halftime.



They would have easily done the same to this year's Cavs.
Nope. Not even close. Heck, replace '14 Wade with this seasons Wade and Miami would do better. Wade was just flat out garbage in the Finals. Offensively he was subpar. His defense was worse than Harden's. Irving, JR, Love, TT, etc. are all massive upgrades over what Miami had in those Finals. Not to mention the fact that LeBron was DPOY level in these Finals.


That Spurs team was locked in, unlike the incredibly inconsistent Warriors this year.
The Warriors absolutely murdered the Rockets and Blazers, even without Curry. Remove Kawhi from that team and they're not getting past the Mav's.


Again, Cavs and Lebron played well, but Golden State lost the series more than the Cavs won it. Had Curry and Klay even played average for games 5-7, the series would be over. Hell, they had a 3-1 lead with Curry and Klay only playing one good game in game 4.
That makes no sense. The Cavs were locked in defensively and shutdown Curry and Klay. LeBron and Kyrie absolutely murdered them on the offensive end as well. More like the Cavs played passive AF and decided to turn it up just as they were about to get eliminated. Gotta give JR, TT, LeBron, etc. massive props for their defense. Kyrie's clutch heroics were also just mind boggling.


Golden State's ineptitude made Lebron and Cavs look better than what they were. Great teams don't blow a 3-1 lead.
When you're facing a once in a generation player like LeBron and amazing players like Irving, TT, etc., they do.


If you could have this series 10 times, GS would probably win 8 out of 10.
If we're starting the series at 3-1, I'd say the Warriors win it about 70% of the time. Even with GP/MJ/Pip guarding him at their best, Curry won't be cold for that long.


But they got overconfident, overrated their own abilities, and then Curry had an epic choke. (as did Klay) If Curry even plays average in Games 5 or 7, GS wins easily.
That would mean that the Cavs would have to play shit defense. Look at some of the shots Curry was forced to take. Even for him, they were terrible shots. How do you think the Spurs would do against a defense like this. Manu and TP would be curled up in a corner and Kawhi sure as shit would average 18 PPG on 75% TS. Duncan would've struggled against TT as well.

Also, Curry put up 25/7/3 on 55% TS. Klay had 37/3/1 on 77% TS. LeBron and Kyrie were on GOAT level shit in that game. 41/16/7/3/3 on 61% TS and 41/3/6/2/1 on 82% TS. They eviscerated the Warriors in that game.


He just missed wide open shots he had hit all year. Same with Klay.
Not really. They were taking a ton of retarded shots. The law of averages worked out and they missed them.


Even Green, with his epic Game 7, had a very quiet game in Game 6.
Again, you fail to give the Cavs defense any sort of credit for their defense.


but there's no excuse for blowing that lead, especially when they had done it to OKC in the previous round.
Please see how KD and WB performed in those last 3 games and compare it to Irving/LeBron. Lets also not forget that the Cavs were a much better team than the Thunder.


Golden State proved they were not a historically great team. Great teams don't go 15-9 in the playoffs and lose the championship, no matter how many games they win in the regular season.
Winning 73 games is not a fluke. Putting up 30/5/7/2 on 67% in just 34 minutes is not a fluke. The Warriors were injured and also ran into a Cavs team, who decided that they were going to go out swinging. In the end, the Cavs played incredible defense to shut down the Warriors. LeBron also found his jumpshot in games 5 and 6.


Yeah, but the standard for rebounds and steals was pretty low
'91 - 9.4 Reb 2.8 Stl 2.4 Blk
'92 - 8.7 Reb 1.8 Stl 2.3 Blk
'93 - 13.0 Reb 2.0 Stl 2.2 Blk
'96 - 14.7 Reb 2.3 Stl 2.0 Blk
'97 - 10.3 Reb 2.0 Stl 1.8 Blk
'98 - 10.5 Reb 2.0 Stl 1.2 Blk

'16 - 11.3 Reb 2.6 Stl 2.3 Blk

Looks like LeBron would lead both teams 4 times in rebounds and Blocks and 5 times in steals.