Wiggins too stiff in hips to be elite?

[CTbasketball92]

I saw a workout video of Andrew Wiggins and Zach Lavine (https://www.facebook.com/nba/videos/bc.Abpk4suAlUmArKIcK5oJ6lf8tZPRgNu-FDzkVsjhLX1An-rkmubYz7gM-GGwsOrGZFpUEtAOuP4Xa0accnt7GchU6KlkG2Lum211BsTbmCq 8C7pBzFhb9wQuGTdPJrNd-XOgWIXx0hJ2r0PRhmTKNP0y2FJHiunOVvwOe1bSZrewAQ/10154152000178463/?type=2&opaqueCursor=AbqMkGKFgogqRmBY6h3VssEYpIL7AONXE9g2H _jQbqdQaMEflMb_nlwH_nj1RMNsp1bVXbLUZSuDfUh_YBwqO5Q dAZLykZ_HP9VHrqkRAw126VnsBhwECk3K2ikFdgL679B6dE-w-9DhzS_HS7Jc-8Eh_eOqyt5IW0vrFaKyAxD2adwG4mW9_qLYVp-EjxCP-M-U3dPRoSEwfpB1_gAtD74B2Jm8--1bvxCeGt7eIcTWHU6fY-lPLcCGIb1M5EWisufTivdX7VdvWMGdOpzF1cqn7gYAeU3ZvfPv 1YkKozAdfeO3Q-mKw8CWhEucZuwThniV6cszlc9aHAkfzceBkdcdqxc8KN2EMRtS HrOx-0YO9Q&theater)the other day. Wiggins' handle looks just fine, but his hips/legs are so stiff coming out of his dribble and he's so upright that I kind of doubt he'll ever be anything close to a primary ballhandler. He has a super quick first step, but everytime he comes out of a crossover he has to reset, where his most frequent comparison -- paul george -- doesn't. Paul George isn't as quick or bouncy imo, but he's much more natural handling the ball and he just looks much more fluid when he explodes to the rim.

With that said, I still say Wiggins can become a top 20 player as soon as 2019.

[JohnMax]

agreed

[ClipperRevival]

He is primarily a 2 foot leaper and needs that gather to be at his most explosive which takes time but he's fluid enough. I have issues with his mindset. His rpg, apg and spg numbers are a joke. That tells me he isn't engaged in a lot of the action and kind of day dreaming out there. But he has special athleticism.

[Ben Simmons]

His projection is more Carmelo than Lebron if that's what you mean.

But on that Timberwolves team is more than enough

[FKAri]

His projection is more Carmelo than Lebron if that's what you mean.

But on that Timberwolves team is more than enough
A smaller, weaker, less skilled Melo? :lol

[Lebron23]

A smaller, weaker, less skilled Melo? :lol


What's his pre draft measurements? It wasn't even revealed in draftexpress.

[theaussieguy]

he has a 44 inch vert, nuff said. There is NOTHING a 40 + inch vert CANNOT overcome.

[CTbasketball92]

His projection is more Carmelo than Lebron if that's what you mean.

But on that Timberwolves team is more than enough

I think people are forgetting how great Melo was at his peak. NY Knicks had the second best record in 2013 (i think) even though JR smith was the second best player. Melo also took teams deep into the western conference playoffs in the mid 2000s'. Melo would, in my opinion, be the third or fourth best wing today behind lebron, durant for sure, and maybe behind kawhi. With that in mind, I seriously doubt Wiggins will ever be better than Melo. He's really explosive, but he isn't nearly as smooth as melo off the dribble and right now he's a mediocre shooter who could become a good one. Melo wasn't as athletics, but his first step was killer and he didn't have to reset his hips when coming out of his crossover like Wiggins. I've never seen wiggins deceive a defender with a hesitation move or a crossover and explode to the rim and make a reverse layup, for instance. That to me indicates a certain amount of stiffness that isn't conducive to being a true superstar wing player like a KD, LeBron or Prime Melo. He looks even more unguard like than Kawhi Leonard, which is pretty telling.

[CuterThanRubio]

I think people are forgetting how great Melo was at his peak. NY Knicks had the second best record in 2013 (i think) even though JR smith was the second best player. Melo also took teams deep into the western conference playoffs in the mid 2000s'. Melo would, in my opinion, be the third or fourth best wing today behind lebron, durant for sure, and maybe behind kawhi. With that in mind, I seriously doubt Wiggins will ever be better than Melo. He's really explosive, but he isn't nearly as smooth as melo off the dribble and right now he's a mediocre shooter who could become a good one. Melo wasn't as athletics, but his first step was killer and he didn't have to reset his hips when coming out of his crossover like Wiggins. I've never seen wiggins deceive a defender with a hesitation move or a crossover and explode to the rim and make a reverse layup, for instance. That to me indicates a certain amount of stiffness that isn't conducive to being a true superstar wing player like a KD, LeBron or Prime Melo. He looks even more unguard like than Kawhi Leonard, which is pretty telling.

:coleman:

How many Wolves games have you watched total?

Probably zero

Just wait until next season, he's training and improving right now while you are inaccurately retroactively assessing his game.

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/YmlYGh_EB0yh9F2vkUldUl_Pb7Q=/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/4158502/WigginsStepBack.0.gif

He's too "stiff"

http://s1.totalprosports.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/wiggins-posterizes-gobert-1-andrew-wiggins-GIFs.gif

Posterizes the best paint protector in the league off the dribble with ease on multiple occasions, yeah, he is way too stiff, (RETARD!)


I suggest you stop posting until further notice, just because you haven't seen it, because you do not watch Wolves games, doesn't mean it isn't happening.

:hammerhead:

[CTbasketball92]

:coleman:

How many Wolves games have you watched total?

Probably zero

Just wait until next season, he's training and improving right now while you are inaccurately retroactively assessing his game.

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/YmlYGh_EB0yh9F2vkUldUl_Pb7Q=/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/4158502/WigginsStepBack.0.gif

He's too "stiff"

http://s1.totalprosports.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/wiggins-posterizes-gobert-1-andrew-wiggins-GIFs.gif

Posterizes the best paint protector in the league off the dribble with ease on multiple occasions, yeah, he is way too stiff, (RETARD!)


I suggest you stop posting until further notice, just because you haven't seen it, because you do not watch Wolves games, doesn't mean it isn't happening.

:hammerhead:

That defender clearly tripped on that "crossover" wiggins did in your first gif. In both of your other Gifs, wiggins is literally driving in a straight line to the basket. He's really strong, has a great first step, great length and a 44 inch vertical BUT I can never see him doing anything like this

https://youtu.be/dic-CL5mF9k

or this

https://youtu.be/XoiBMud94c0

Just look how Kobe slithers through the tiniest of creases in the defense and maneuvers in midair to get off clean shots. DWade, TMac, Vince Carter, hell, even ray allen were way better at creating off the dribble than wiggins is now, and they could all initiate an offense. I think Wiggins will be a top 20 player, but his lack of ability to really breakdown a defense will keep him from being a true all star SG/SF, along with his mediocre jumpshot. He's a great athlete, but he's missing the fluidity/change of direction to be superstar wing in my opinion. He'll be a jimmy butler, which is great, but at the same time, not nearly as good as a james harden.

[CuterThanRubio]

Are you seriously using Kobe, one of the greatest players ever, as a measuring stick?

Wiggins has a completely different skill set, but that doesn't mean he won't be successful, he can dunk on any big man in the league and his step back is already untouchable, if he improves his shooting percentage he will be a 25ppg player easily, and how many wings are better than that?

Why would Wiggins initiate offense on a team with Ricky Rubio at pg?

Seriously, put it together!


Prepare to change your tune next season.

[CTbasketball92]

Are you seriously using Kobe, one of the greatest players ever, as a measuring stick?

Wiggins has a completely different skill set, but that doesn't mean he won't be successful, he can dunk on any big man in the league and his step back is already untouchable, if he improves his shooting percentage he will be a 25ppg player easily, and how many wings are better than that?

Why would Wiggins initiate offense on a team with Ricky Rubio at pg?

Seriously, put it together!


Prepare to change your tune next season.

My point is, if you're going to be an elite offensive player through athleticism alone, you're going to need the refined sort of athleticism like Kobe. Kobe had that and the ability to shoot, pass and cross the shit out of anyone to create good looks for himself and score 20 straight points at any point in a game. Wiggins has athleticism/size. That is literally it, but he's got heart and I think expectations will push him to be a repeat all star and top 20 player, but not truly elite. 25 ppg with KAT? That might not even be a good thing unless his TS% 55>.

[FireDavidKahn]

Wiggins' hips are plenty fluid.

I've tested them out myself, if you know what I mean.:D

[CuterThanRubio]

My point is, if you're going to be an elite offensive player through athleticism alone, you're going to need the refined sort of athleticism like Kobe. Kobe had that and the ability to shoot, pass and cross the shit out of anyone to create good looks for himself and score 20 straight points at any point in a game. Wiggins has athleticism/size. That is literally it, but he's got heart and I think expectations will push him to be a repeat all star and top 20 player, but not truly elite. 25 ppg with KAT? That might not even be a good thing unless his TS% 55>.


Wiggins has greater athletic abilities than Kobe, 44 inch vertical, already averaging 20 in his second year and you are doubting his potential because you think he is "stiff"

Ridiculous

https://www.instagram.com/p/BHiHP7ag__I/?taken-by=22wiggins&hl=en

[CTbasketball92]

Wiggins has greater athletic abilities than Kobe, 44 inch vertical, already averaging 20 in his second year and you are doubting his potential because you think he is "stiff"

Ridiculous

https://www.instagram.com/p/BHiHP7ag__I/?taken-by=22wiggins&hl=en

We'll see dude. I'm rooting for him, but he simply looks more like a forward than a guard. Looking back, kobe drastically improved as a shooter between 2001 and 2007, in 2006 he became an excellent midrange shooter percentage wise, so if wiggins can shoot 44% on those shots, he can definitely average 25 ppg on a good team. That's a rare sort of improvement, but he has the work ethic, and if he keeps getting better as a shooter, he'll be a top 10-15 player i think because he already finishes extremely well at the rim, and he'll only get stronger. I

[Prime_Shaq]

I'm stiff just watching him.

[CuterThanRubio]

We'll see dude. I'm rooting for him, but he simply looks more like a forward than a guard. Looking back, kobe drastically improved as a shooter between 2001 and 2007, in 2006 he became an excellent midrange shooter percentage wise, so if wiggins can shoot 44% on those shots, he can definitely average 25 ppg on a good team. That's a rare sort of improvement, but he has the work ethic, and if he keeps getting better as a shooter, he'll be a top 10-15 player i think because he already finishes extremely well at the rim, and he'll only get stronger. I


:hammerhead:

That's because he is a small forward, not a guard!

Comparing him to SG's isn't fair or logical since that isn't his position

Wiggins has played 2 seasons, just chill, he's going to be around for a while!

I recommend streaming a few games next year, you could learn a thing or two

[Goofsta Knicca]

It's all in the hips (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PbRZ5QMAs0)

[Thunderfan86]

This nikka said he too stiff in the hips :roll: :roll: :roll:

I don't why, but that shit sounded funny as hell when I said it in my head :lol

[BarberSchool]

He weighs in the 190's.

Its not necessarily that his hips are stiff, it's that he has extremely narrow, rotationally weak hips/body, genetically. He is much more of a straight line athlete, a sprinter per se. So his body structure will limit him in a game like basketball, which requires constant angle adjustment and rotation per step with coordination while handling and shooting.

His body and pelvis and hips are all extremely small and with no lateral or rotational strength/grace. He is a very skinny SPRINTER. It doesn't matter that he has good muscle definition in his delts, the rest of him is weak and not fluid or coordinated, despite being very quick.

Plus, being knock kneed makes him an injury scare due to angle of pronation.

[Nastradamus]

Rudy Gay with elite D

[CarlosBoozer]

He got some sweet moves but they look very robotic abd awkward at times

[CTbasketball92]

He weighs in the 190's.

Its not necessarily that his hips are stiff, it's that he has extremely narrow, rotationally weak hips/body, genetically. He is much more of a straight line athlete, a sprinter per se. So his body structure will limit him in a game like basketball, which requires constant angle adjustment and rotation per step with coordination while handling and shooting.

His body and pelvis and hips are all extremely small and with no lateral or rotational strength/grace. He is a very skinny SPRINTER. It doesn't matter that he has good muscle definition in his delts, the rest of him is weak and not fluid or coordinated, despite being very quick.

Plus, being knock kneed makes him an injury scare due to angle of pronation.

Yeah I could see how this could be true, though I wouldn't say Wiggins is weak. He's really strong, defenders bounce off him a bit when he drives and he explodes through contact. He's not nearly the ballhandler that Paul George is and he's not as guardlike ... but he is a much better finisher. But yeah, I definitely see limitations in his athleticism applied to basketball.

[CuterThanRubio]

Yeah I could see how this could be true, though I wouldn't say Wiggins is weak. He's really strong, defenders bounce off him a bit when he drives and he explodes through contact. He's not nearly the ballhandler that Paul George is and he's not as guardlike ... but he is a much better finisher. But yeah, I definitely see limitations in his athleticism applied to basketball.

http://cdn-s3.si.com/s3fs-public/[current-date:custom:Y]/[current-date:custom:m]/[current-date:custom:d]/dunk-9.jpg

Lmao, what?

Give it a rest!

Paul George didn't average 20ppg until his third season and was atrocious from inside the arc last year, Wiggins is on track to be much better than him, you don't know what you are talking about, this thread is terrible!

[PP34Deuce]

I agree. He's not as agile. He's a fast explosive guy but he can't stop on a dime and and take off again.

I think people think the OP is dissing Wiggings but it's valid.

James Harden is not as fast, but he slithers in the lane.