So wait.. Lebron's only statistical advantage over MJ is... defensive rebs??

[3ball]

.
Jordan got more offensive rebounds, so the only area where Lebron leads is defensive rebounds, since Jordan averaged more points with better efficiency, and only 1 less assist with less turnovers.


Career playoff and Finals stats:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=12530265&postcount=7

[lilteapot]

SO

IN
SEC
URE

:lol :lol :lol

[ShawkFactory]

Jesus Christ dude

[Nash]

SO

IN
SEC
URE

:lol :lol :lol
DON'T

KNOW
WHAT
FOR

[ScalsFan21]

Truth is, just reading between the lines it's obvious 3ball views LeBron as destined to finish his career as undisputed Top 2 all-time, and is rapidly losing faith in the gap between #1 and #2 being as big as he once argued that it was.

1. Jordan
2. LeBron

Within a couple seasons, every credible all-time list will begin that way.

[warriorfan]

Not only that, but LeBron has been proven to stat pad, including defensive rebounds.

Game 4 of the 2016 Finals

LeBron's team was down by 7 with under a minute remaining and he goes for a layup

LeBron's team was down by 7 with 24 seconds remaining and he goes for another layup

LeBron's team was down by 7 with 14 seconds remaining and he goes for another layup


Reference:
https://s32.postimg.org/p7m8ilodh/Le_Bron_Stat_Padding2016.jpg


Cleveland could have only won by 3's. Everyone knew this including the announcers, the fans, and LeBron.


Sacrificing your chances to win in order to accumilate more statistics is the very definition of stat padding

[Trollsmasher]

eh, don't forget RPM which is objectively considered to be the best and most accurate statistic in basketball

LeBron has a clear lead on MJ both in RS and playoffs (a difference big enough to put them into separate player tiers)

[3ball]

Truth is, just reading between the lines it's obvious 3ball views LeBron as destined to finish his career as undisputed Top 2 all-time, and is rapidly losing faith in the gap between #1 and #2 being as big as he once argued that it was.

1. Jordan
2. LeBron

Within a couple seasons, every credible all-time list will begin that way.
Right bro, Lebron will pass Jordan on the basis of his defensive rebounding.. :rolleyes:

I make these threads to show you that Lebron will NEVER pass Jordan.. :hammerhead:

[ShawkFactory]

Not only that, but LeBron has been proven to stat pad, including defensive rebounds.

Game 4 of the 2016 Finals

LeBron's team was down by 7 with under a minute remaining and he goes for a layup

LeBron's team was down by 7 with 24 seconds remaining and he goes for another layup

LeBron's team was down by 7 with 14 seconds remaining and he goes for another layup


Reference:
https://s32.postimg.org/p7m8ilodh/Le_Bron_Stat_Padding2016.jpg


Cleveland could have only won by 3's. Everyone knew this including the announcers, the fans, and LeBron.


Sacrificing your chances to win in order to accumilate more statistics is the very definition of stat padding
You'd think Kyrie would have taken a 3 too.

I know that's not a part of the agenda here but he fvcked up and stat-padded there too. According to your argument at least.

[K.dot ShowTime]

:applause: :applause: :applause:

OP with ANOTHER great point

[warriorfan]

You'd think Kyrie would have taken a 3 too.

I know that's not a part of the agenda here but he fvcked up and stat-padded there too. According to your argument at least.

You have completely missed the entire point

Kyrie attempting 3 pointers while Cleveland was down by 7 with one minute left wouldn't of been stat padding, that is called trying to win the game!

The only way it was possible for Cleveland to come back in that scenario was through 3 point shots, everyone in the building and even the people watching at home knew it.

So instead of attempting to come back and win the game with 3 point shots...LeBron chose to wave off the open men, refuse to attempt any 3's, and just chose to lay it up over and over, thus exchanging any chance of the Cavaliers winning for a few easy points.

Do you now understand?

[bigkingsfan]

Not only that, but LeBron has been proven to stat pad, including defensive rebounds.

The only player who got a defensive rebound is Stephen Curry

[Hey Yo]

These are the stats that matter

MJ at age 31
3MVP's, 3 rings and 3FMVP's

LeBron at age 31
4MVP's, 3 rings and 3 FMVP's

[3ball]

Jordan faced greater defensive attention because he scored 15-20 ppg more than his 2nd option, compared to 1 ppg for Lebron.

[3ball]

:rolleyes:

[3ball]

.
Stats thru 31 years old:



JORDAN. PLAYOFFS (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html#1985-1993-sum:playoffs_per_game):. 34.7 ppg.. 6.7 rpg.. 6.6 apg.. 2.3 spg.. 1.0 bpg.. 50.1 fg.. 58.1 ts.. 119 ortg.. 29.6 PER.. 0.258 ws/48
LEBRON. PLAYOFFS (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jamesle01.html):. 28.0 ppg.. 8.8 rpg.. 6.8 apg.. 1.8 spg.. 0.9 bpg.. 47.8 fg.. 56.7 ts.. 115 ortg.. 27.7 PER.. 0.238 ws/48


JORDAN FINALS:. 36.3 ppg.. 6.6 rpg.. 7.9 apg.. 2.4 tov.. 2.0 spg.. 0.8 bpg.. 52.6 fg
LEBRON FINALS:. 27.0 ppg.. 9.9 rpg.. 7.2 apg.. 4.0 tov.. 1.9 spg.. 0.8 bpg.. 45.4 fg



Jordan scores 25-33% more on better efficiency, while averaging more assists with less turnovers.. It's not even CLOSE.

[Dragonyeuw]

These are the stats that matter

MJ at age 31
3MVP's, 3 rings and 3FMVP's

LeBron at age 31
4MVP's, 3 rings and 3 FMVP's

Duncan at 31
2MVPs, 4 rings, 3FMVPs

Magic at 31
3MVPs, 5 rings, 3 FMVPs

Bird at 31
3MVPs, 3 rings, 2 FMVPs

Shaq at 31
1 MVP, 3 rings, 3FMVPs

Kobe at 31
1MVP, 4 rings, 2FMVPs

Most of the all-time greats have 'comparable' accolades by the time they're 30( the outliers being Shaq and Kobe's relatively paltry MVP count given their historical greatness). It's what Jordan did from 33-35 that ultimately separated him from the herd.

[Trollsmasher]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/bpm_career.html

whoa

the difference between LeBron and MJ is greater than the difference between MJ and 7th Larry

LeBeast is simply unrivaled

[Hey Yo]

.
Stats thru 31 years old:



JORDAN. PLAYOFFS (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html#1985-1993-sum:playoffs_per_game):. 34.7 ppg.. 6.7 rpg.. 6.6 apg.. 2.3 spg.. 1.0 bpg.. 50.1 fg.. 58.1 ts.. 119 ortg.. 29.6 PER.. 0.258 ws/48
LEBRON. PLAYOFFS (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jamesle01.html):. 28.0 ppg.. 8.8 rpg.. 6.8 apg.. 1.8 spg.. 0.9 bpg.. 47.8 fg.. 56.7 ts.. 115 ortg.. 27.7 PER.. 0.238 ws/48


JORDAN FINALS:. 36.3 ppg.. 6.6 rpg.. 7.9 apg.. 2.4 tov.. 2.0 spg.. 0.8 bpg.. 52.6 fg
LEBRON FINALS:. 27.0 ppg.. 9.9 rpg.. 7.2 apg.. 4.0 tov.. 1.9 spg.. 0.8 bpg.. 45.4 fg



Jordan scores 25-33% more on better efficiency, while averaging more assists with less turnovers.. It's not even CLOSE.
These are the stats that matter

MJ at age 31
3MVP's, 3 rings and 3FMVP's

LeBron at age 31
4MVP's, 3 rings and 3 FMVP's

[Dragonyeuw]

These are the stats that matter

MJ at age 31
3MVP's, 3 rings and 3FMVP's

LeBron at age 31
4MVP's, 3 rings and 3 FMVP's

Duncan at 31
2MVPs, 4 rings, 3FMVPs

Magic at 31
3MVPs, 5 rings, 3 FMVPs

Bird at 31
3MVPs, 3 rings, 2 FMVPs

Shaq at 31
1 MVP, 3 rings, 3FMVPs

Kobe at 31
1MVP, 4 rings, 2FMVPs

Most of the all-time greats have 'comparable' accolades by the time they're 30( the outliers being Shaq and Kobe's relatively paltry MVP count given their historical greatness). It's what Jordan did from 33-35 that ultimately separated him from the herd.

[ScalsFan21]

Right bro, Lebron will pass Jordan on the basis of his defensive rebounding.. :rolleyes:

I make these threads to show you that Lebron will NEVER pass Jordan.. :hammerhead:

I wasn't arguing that doe. I didn't say he was going to pass Jordan. I said that you're beginning to doubt the claims you made about how you're here to prove that not only is MJ the GOAT, but that it's literally night and day and almost an insult to draw comparisons. To "educate" us on that. But deep down you KNOW that the gap between Jordan and LeBron is close enough to apparently be worth all these threads, despite the double digit difference in playoff series scoring totals between Mike and the second-leading scorer, and all the strongside floods, and every other argument.

You and all the other doubters should just admit to yourselves this at least: you think LeBron as an individual player is Top 2 ever and is the closest thing you've seen to a player with MJ's overall on-court impact. That even legends like Magic, Kareem, Shaq and the rest don't hold a candle to him in your mind. That Michael is the only guy above him all-time. It's okay man, don't fight it. :confusedshrug:

[Hey Yo]

Duncan at 31
2MVPs, 4 rings, 3FMVPs

Magic at 31
3MVPs, 5 rings, 3 FMVPs

Bird at 31
3MVPs, 3 rings, 2 FMVPs

Shaq at 31
1 MVP, 3 rings, 3FMVPs

Kobe at 31
1MVP, 4 rings, 2FMVPs

Most of the all-time greats have 'comparable' accolades by the time they're 30( the outliers being Shaq and Kobe's relatively paltry MVP count given their historical greatness). It's what Jordan did from 33-35 that ultimately separated him from the herd.
That's because those listed above had great teammates mostly from the beginning of their careers.

James played with 0 All-NBA players and only 1 All-Star his first 7yrs

[Dragonyeuw]

That's because those listed above had great teammates mostly from the beginning of their careers.

James played with 0 All-NBA players and only 1 All-Star his first 7yrs

MJ didn't get his first all-star until Pippen in 90, and played 4 less years by the age of 31. :confusedshrug:

[Hey Yo]

MJ didn't get his first all-star until Pippen in 90, and played 4 less years by the age of 31. :confusedshrug:
That's why he didn't succeed in the postseason until Pippen evolved.

Big Z wasn't doing that for Cleveland.

Plus can't fault that James was qualified to come right out of H.S and MJ wasn't.

[CuterThanRubio]

Skewing assist numbers AGAIN?

Don't make me do this anymore lol

You are relentless and you should be banned for spamming false information so often, can't live without one of your terrible threads on the first page?



:hammerhead:

[Smoke117]

Seriously...what the hell is wrong with you? There's no way you can be oblivious to the fact that...NOBODY ****ING CARES ANYMORE. Nobody cares what you have to say yet you just keep going and going and going...is something not firing off in your brain right? Have you been off your ****ing meds for the last 2 years?

[Dragonyeuw]

That's why he didn't succeed in the postseason until Pippen evolved.



Do you think Lebron's Cavs have the same level of success against the Celtics and Pistons of the 80's? Or that MJ's Bulls circa 1989 or 90 wouldn't make the finals when you're playing teams like the Wizards and Kirk Himrich Bulls? Not exactly a path of great resistance in the mid 2000's.

[AintNoSunshine]

Lebron goes up against Kawhi Leonard, Durant, Jimmy Butler, Paul George and the likes on a nightly basis. Any of which would have given MJ problem.

[riseagainst]

here is the advantage Lebron has over MJ:

he is a better player

[CuterThanRubio]

LeBron averages 1.6 more APG than Jordan did, 6.9 to 5.3 to be exact, so in actuality rounding things by .4 to 7 and 5 makes much more sense mathematically than 3ball reducing by .6, increasing the true deficit between them to 2 APG, things aren't looking so good for Jordan anymore!

LeBron has 1,182 more assists in 85 less games!


Also, Turnovers DO NOT cancel out assists, and not every TO directly leads to a scoring opportunity for the opposing team.

LeBron also maintains a higher shooting percentage from all areas of the floor besides FT shooting and is a superior rebounder and defender.

Jordan only won championships after expansion had softened the competition league-wide, and he was lucky enough to experience this TWICE, not to mention the shortened three point line era that should be erased from the history books entirely.

[3ball]

LeBron averages 1.6 more APG than Jordan did, 6.9 to 5.3 to be exact,



MJ got more offensive rebounds, so the only area where Lebron leads is defensive rebs, since MJ averaged more points and only 1 less assist with less turnovers.




Playoffs (Per Game):

JORDAN:. 33.4 ppg.. 1.7 oreb.. 4.7 dreb.. 5.7 apg.. 3.1 tov.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg.. 28.6 PER
LEBRON:. 27.9 ppg.. 1.6 oreb.. 7.2 dreb.. 6.8 apg.. 3.5 tov.. 56.7 ts.. 115 ORtg.. 27.7 PER


Playoffs (Per 100 Possessions):

JORDAN:. 43.3 pts.. 2.2 oreb.. 6.1 dreb.. 7.4 ast.. 4.0 tov.. 56.8 ts.. 118 ORtg.. 28.6 PER
LEBRON:. 36.4 pts.. 2.1 oreb.. 9.4 dreb.. 8.8 ast.. 4.6 tov.. 56.7 ts.. 115 ORtg.. 27.7 PER


Finals (Per Game):

JORDAN:. 33.6 ppg.. 6.0 rpg.. 6.0 apg.. 2.8 tov.. 1.8 spg.. 0.7 bpg.. 48.1 fg
LEBRON:. 27.0 ppg.. 9.9 reb.. 7.2 apg.. 4.1 tov.. 1.9 spg.. 0.8 bpg.. 45.1 fg