When did free speech become a bad thing?

[Nick Young]

What happened that caused lefties all over the world in recent times to be so against freedom of speech and so pro-censorship, specifically artistic censorship?

I was always raised to believe that freedom of speech and expression were some of America's most important values, and one of the things that separated us from the rest of the world.


I have noticed since about 5-6 years ago that suddenly people who self identify as liberal started suddenly trying to censor things and ideas they didn't like, as well as curb freedom of speech. They even use Newspeak tactics like "safe spaces" and "trigger words" and "identity politics" as justification to silence and censor people.


Here is a recent example of a liberal Daily Show producer trying to censor and silence a reporter who is filming them trying to exploit a gay man. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMQv568uz18)


http://www.breitbart.com/california/2016/07/20/the-daily-show-gays-for-trump-breitbart-news/



It is a rising problem and I never remember the pro-censorship anti-freedom of speech contingent being this large in America when I was growing up.


What happened?

[Hotlantadude81]

What happened that caused lefties all over the world in recent times to be so against freedom of speech and so pro-censorship, specifically artistic censorship?

I was always raised to believe that freedom of speech and expression were some of America's most important values, and one of the things that separated us from the rest of the world.


I have noticed since about 5-6 years ago that suddenly people who self identify as liberal started suddenly trying to censor things and ideas they didn't like, as well as curb freedom of speech. They even use Newspeak tactics like "safe spaces" and "trigger words" and "identity politics" as justification to silence and censor people.


Here is a recent example of a liberal Daily Show producer trying to censor and silence a reporter who is filming them trying to exploit a gay man. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMQv568uz18)


http://www.breitbart.com/california/2016/07/20/the-daily-show-gays-for-trump-breitbart-news/



It is a rising problem and I never remember the pro-censorship anti-freedom of speech contingent being this large in America when I was growing up.


What happened?

Progressives don't value free speech.

Of course they'll give you the whole spiel about how freedom of speech only protects you from persecution by the government. While that is technically true, the libs don't really respect the idea of freedom of speech. Not only that, but they have no respect for Freedom of association either. If you don't want to be part of the groups or people that they think you should.... Well, they turn to the same tactics they claim to hate. Such as shaming.

[west_tip]

It's actually a fascinating phenomenon, I'm not sure when exactly liberals went from being relatively tolerant to essentially trying to suppress peoples opinions that they don't agree with and brand people racist or sexist in order to discredit them.

When I was in college in the 90's I certainly identified as a liberal but given ones natural predisposition for moving toward the center/right as you get older and have a family/mortgage combined with the authoritarian and dogmatic behavior of many liberals today I just cannot identify with them. It seems all too many of them are just useful idiots for globalists who care not one jot for humanity, only profits.

[UK2K]

Right around the time we found out you could be offended by, literally, anything.

You could then claim to be offended over something trivial, put down anyone who doesn't agree that you should be offended over something so trivial, and then claim you're being discriminated against because ______ (fill in the blank).

Once people started to catch on, and figured out you could start GoFundMe's for emotional distress, it turned our country's definition of freedom of speech upside down.


"Let’s be honest - @realDonaldTrump is a loser. Count all his failed businesses. See how he cheated people w/ scams like Trump U.," Warren tweeted.


Imagine if Trump had called Elizabeth Warren a loser... he'd be sexist, racist (doesn't she think she's a Native American? or is that the other chick), misogynist.. the list would go on and on.

Go back up to line 1 of this post.

1) Pretend to be offended
2) Convince others you have a right to be offended
3) Use the fact that you were pretend offended to tell someone they can't say that
4) Move on to the next trivial word

[Nick Young]

Right around the time we found out you could be offended by, literally, anything.

You could then claim to be offended over something trivial, put down anyone who doesn't agree that you should be offended over something so trivial, and then claim you're being discriminated against because ______ (fill in the blank).

Once people started to catch on, and figured out you could start GoFundMe's for emotional distress, it turned our country's definition of freedom of speech upside down.
Those are the exact Big Brother tactics used 1984. It is amazing that lefties aren't able to recognize this. They either don't read books or they are completely lacking in self awareness.

[~primetime~]

Some of you don't understand what freedom of speech is...privately owned TV shows and internet sites can censor whatever the fck they want to.

[iamgine]

You can use free speech to attack free speech.

[9erempiree]

Liberals and progressives are both different from another. Libs messed it sll up.

[NumberSix]

Some of you don't understand what freedom of speech is...privately owned TV shows and internet sites can censor whatever the fck they want to.
Yeah, but these people want to implement all types of "hate speech" laws.

[UK2K]

Some of you don't understand what freedom of speech is...privately owned TV shows and internet sites can censor whatever the fck they want to.

Yep, that's how it starts.


A major theme of Nineteen Eighty-Four is censorship, especially in the Ministry of Truth, where photographs are modified and public archives rewritten to rid them of "unpersons" (i.e., persons who have been arrested, whom the Party has decided to erase from history). On the telescreens figures for all types of production are grossly exaggerated (or simply invented) to indicate an ever-growing economy, when the reality is the opposite.

Sounds like our government, doesn't it?

[Long Duck Dong]

Not just that, they've started to push for things like racial segregation, racial preference/discrimination, purposely flooding the nation with cheap labor and hurting American worker's wages. All things they used to fight against.

The thing about the left, is you can't pin them down anymore with a particular set of purpose or ideals. They will fight against anything they think has become part of the establishment or mainstream/common sense thinking simply for the sake of change, and the chance to demonstrate for something...anything.

[Nick Young]

Some of you don't understand what freedom of speech is...privately owned TV shows and internet sites can censor whatever the fck they want to.
I am not just talking about what happens on privately owned TV shows and internet sites.

[Nick Young]

Not just that, they've started to push for things like racial segregation, racial preference/discrimination, purposely flooding the nation with cheap labor and hurting American worker's wages. All things they used to fight against.

The thing about the left, is you can't pin them down anymore with a particular set of purpose or ideals. They will fight against anything they think has become part of the establishment or mainstream/common sense thinking simply for the sake of change, and the chance to demonstrate for something...anything.
I am glad that everyone is starting to realize how pro-segregation modern lefties in America have become.

It's extremely disturbing to me. 10 years ago BLM would have been universally condemned by both the left and right as the racist pro-segregationist hate movement that it is.

Nowadays you have about 50% of the country supporting that shit:facepalm

[Facepalm]

Some of you don't understand what freedom of speech is...privately owned TV shows and internet sites can censor whatever the fck they want to.
Exactly.

Meanwhile, if Trump becomes President he wants to make it easier to sue news outlets.




[QUOTE]Donald Trump's latest threat against the media came Friday at a rally in Texas. Once elected president, Trump promised, he will "open up" federal libel laws to make it easier to sue news outlets like The Washington Post and New York Times

[west_tip]

Not just that, they've started to push for things like racial segregation, racial preference/discrimination, purposely flooding the nation with cheap labor and hurting American worker's wages. All things they used to fight against.

Yes, I agree with you. There have been a number of black charter schools established in my local area and whilst I understand that they have been started for all the right reasons (to improve educational achievement amongst black kids, get them college ready and so) I can't help thinking that their establishment goes against the Brown v Board desegregation that people fought for. Furthermore I read an article a few months back that said a Congressional study found that our schools are now more segregated than in times past and to me that is a worrying trend.

It seems like we are becoming a more polarized, racially segregated society which is not good.

[UK2K]

Exactly.

Meanwhile, if Trump becomes President he wants to make it easier to sue news outlets.

If you print lies...

[Nick Young]

It seems like we are becoming a more polarized, racially segregated society which is not good.


https://i.sli.mg/XgKy2f.jpg

[west_tip]

https://i.sli.mg/XgKy2f.jpg

Also, there is one component that is not addressed on that chart that forms an important part of the social control model in the US: Identity politics pushed 24/7 in the news media and in academia to create tension and distrust amongst races. It's just good old divide and conquer by getting everyone to think and act along tribal lines.

[UK2K]

Also, there is one component that is not addressed on that chart that forms an important part of the social control model in the US: Identity politics pushed 24/7 in the news media and in academia to create tension and distrust amongst races. It's just good old divide and conquer by getting everyone to think and act along tribal lines.

A very key component.


Demoralize a public with depressing news in the mainstream media, plunging the nation into serious debt using controlled and manipulated recessions and depressions, low-income jobs and high unemployment, evermore controlling new laws and regulations that are increasingly intrusive to all citizens.

Destabilize a population by pitting groups against each other, i.e. Democrats vs. Republicans or pro-choice vs. anti-abortion or gun owners vs. anti-gun citizens, in pitched battle. And when The First Sphere of Influence (TFSI; The Jesuits) can’t corral those elusive holdouts who subscribe to no party or religion or group, TFSI creates even further “false opposition,” i.e. those people and groups who purport to be friends of We The People and who allegedly oppose TFSI, echoing their pro-We The People sentiments in high public places. The grim reality is that those final holdouts among We The People are cleverly being pulled into a black hole of false security by all the false opposition and controlled opposition.

We've seen both of these things recently.

[Nick Young]

Also, there is one component that is not addressed on that chart that forms an important part of the social control model in the US: Identity politics pushed 24/7 in the news media and in academia to create tension and distrust amongst races. It's just good old divide and conquer by getting everyone to think and act along tribal lines.
Identity politics are the class warfare part.



Rule 8) can be summarized in modern terms as "check your privilege"

[BoutPractice]

I'm not an Alinsky fan by any means, but where is the source for this text? It seems suspiciously relevant to contemporary controversies...

You probably got it off some right wing website.

[Nick Young]

I'm not an Alinsky fan by any means, but where is the source for this text? It seems suspiciously relevant to contemporary controversies...

You probably got it off some right wing website.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/62/Rules_for_Radicals.png
:cheers:

[rufuspaul]

It's actually a fascinating phenomenon, I'm not sure when exactly liberals went from being relatively tolerant to essentially trying to suppress peoples opinions that they don't agree with and brand people racist or sexist in order to discredit them.

When I was in college in the 90's I certainly identified as a liberal but given ones natural predisposition for moving toward the center/right as you get older and have a family/mortgage combined with the authoritarian and dogmatic behavior of many liberals today I just cannot identify with them. It seems all too many of them are just useful idiots for globalists who care not one jot for humanity, only profits.


This

[UK2K]

I'm not an Alinsky fan by any means, but where is the source for this text? It seems suspiciously relevant to contemporary controversies...

You probably got it off some right wing website.

'Rules for Radicals'


Despite the effective nature of the lessons passed down in Rules for Radicals, Alinsky has received some criticism for the methods and ideas he presented. First, it has been noted that much of his instruction has only been effective in urban, low-income areas.[7] This has led some social scientists, such as Robert Pruger and Harry Specht, to criticize his broad statement that Rules for Radicals is a tool for organizing all low-income people.

^This^ means 'steps to control poor black folks' but it's much more PC to say 'low-income urban areas'.

[QUOTE]Alinsky would find an external antagonist to turn into a "common enemy" for the community within which he was operating. Often, this would be a local politician or agency that had some involvement with activity concerning the community. Once the enemy was established, the community would come together in opposition of it. This management of conflict heightened awareness within the community as to the similarities its members shared as well as what differentiated them from those outside of their organization.[3] The use of conflict also allowed for the goal of the group to be clearly defined. With an established external antagonist, the community

[Nick Young]

BLM, blocking interstate roadways for example? Which only works because police go in with strict orders not to be too mean. We all know if I was out blocking traffic on the interstate, I'd be arrested in a heartbeat but....
Yes. Or blocking ambulances with patients inside. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUVfuTYrtC0)

[Facepalm]

If you print lies...
What lies about Trump did the Washington Post print?

[9erempiree]

Yes. Or blocking ambulances with patients inside. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUVfuTYrtC0)

Holy shit.

:facepalm

Wtf has this world come to.

[9erempiree]

Leftists are not going to like where this is heading. :lol

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

It's not a bad thing when the populace is educated and mannered.

It is harmful for the well being of the individual to let loose the tongue without certain restraints

[Long Duck Dong]

It is harmful for the well being of the individual to let loose the tongue without certain restraints

Sounds like something Mao or Stalin might have said.

[Nick Young]

It's not a bad thing when the populace is educated and mannered.

It is harmful for the well being of the individual to let loose the tongue without certain restraints

http://izquotes.com/quotes-pictures/quote-wherever-they-burn-books-they-will-also-in-the-end-burn-human-beings-heinrich-heine-306669.jpg

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

Sounds like something Mao or Stalin might have said.

:rolleyes: Hey, if I can get others to link this guy with communists who practice genocide, surely his comments will be drained of worth! Ugh.

There are certain things one should have learned growing up, irregardless of location.

"Open mouth catches no flies"
"Silence is golden"
"Better to have people think you are a fool, then open your mouth and confirm it"
etc.

Derivatives of wisdom from ALL Cultures, spanning from Confucian China to Industrial Revolution America.

Whether you like it or not, there are consequences for saying stupid, offensive, worthless, lying things of conjecture Long Duck Dong. Not from the corrupt government either. Talking about an infinitely greater Force. Like having unsuspecting innocents come across similar opinions in preliminary stages of life, then foolishly reaffirming them and further misguiding people.

And if it's tyranny you fear, understand that the pen/paper and organized action are far, far, far superior to any worthless unfruitful protests.

Because Chris forgot to reserve his tongue (or keyboard) and neglected his intellect, you carry on his nonsensical theory about "liberals" built on crap premises. I'm sorry your eyes had to witness so much stupidity on these boards, dude, you deserve much higher quality as does everyone else.


"Liberals fight against mainstream/common sense thinking?" Really? These are synonymous, now? So, now the remarks of Thomas Paine, Einstein's "Human Stupidity is infinite" and Mark Twains "Common sense is not so common" take a backseat to your take on things? Okay...

Then you are psychoanalyzing a vague group of a great deal people and claiming the motives of thousands of these folks to be "change" and "a chance to demonstrate for something..anything" (ostentation?). How on earth could you possibly know the psychology of people who are different than you?

[UK2K]

What lies about Trump did the Washington Post print?

Never said they did...

And if they think they are printing stories on the up and up, then they should have no opposition to the proposal, would they?

[Facepalm]

Never said they did...

And if they think they are printing stories on the up and up, then they should have no opposition to the proposal, would they?
There are already laws against libel. Do you really want to restrict freedom of the press?

[UK2K]

There are already laws against libel. Do you really want to restrict freedom of the press?

There are lots of laws.

Making it easier to sue a media outlet for libel isn't restricting free speech... its making it easier to sue a media outlet for libel.

If they aren't guilty of it, then they don't need to worry about it.

[DukeDelonte13]

Yeah, but these people want to implement all types of "hate speech" laws.


what the f*ck does that even matter. Who cares that some people want to make a law. Does that mean the law would even happen? Does that mean if the law were to get passed it would survive judicial scrutiny?

[DukeDelonte13]

Progressives don't value free speech.

Of course they'll give you the whole spiel about how freedom of speech only protects you from persecution by the government. While that is technically true, the libs don't really respect the idea of freedom of speech. Not only that, but they have no respect for Freedom of association either. If you don't want to be part of the groups or people that they think you should.... Well, they turn to the same tactics they claim to hate. Such as shaming.


It's technically true because it is absolutely true.

You want small government, and you want businesses to be ran by the business owners. If the business want to censor something, they should have the right to do so. If you don't agree with it, don't support them.

[Long Duck Dong]

:rolleyes: Hey, if I can get others to link this guy with communists who practice genocide, surely his comments will be drained of worth! Ugh.

There are certain things one should have learned growing up, irregardless of location.

"Open mouth catches no flies"
"Silence is golden"
"Better to have people think you are a fool, then open your mouth and confirm it"
etc.

Derivatives of wisdom from ALL Cultures, spanning from Confucian China to Industrial Revolution America.

Whether you like it or not, there are consequences for saying stupid, offensive, worthless, lying things of conjecture Long Duck Dong. Not from the corrupt government either. Talking about an infinitely greater Force. Like having unsuspecting innocents come across similar opinions in preliminary stages of life, then foolishly reaffirming them and further misguiding people.

And if it's tyranny you fear, understand that the pen/paper and organized action are far, far, far superior to any worthless unfruitful protests.

Because Chris forgot to reserve his tongue (or keyboard) and neglected his intellect, you carry on his nonsensical theory about "liberals" built on crap premises. I'm sorry your eyes had to witness so much stupidity on these boards, dude, you deserve much higher quality as does everyone else.


"Liberals fight against mainstream/common sense thinking?" Really? These are synonymous, now? So, now the remarks of Thomas Paine, Einstein's "Human Stupidity is infinite" and Mark Twains "Common sense is not so common" take a backseat to your take on things? Okay...

Then you are psychoanalyzing a vague group of a great deal people and claiming the motives of thousands of these folks to be "change" and "a chance to demonstrate for something..anything" (ostentation?). How on earth could you possibly know the psychology of people who are different than you?

You know what, maybe you're right. Maybe the FBI should pay you a visit and haul your azz off for all the terrorist sympathizing bullshit you post on here.

[Facepalm]

There are lots of laws.

Making it easier to sue a media outlet for libel isn't restricting free speech... its making it easier to sue a media outlet for libel.

If they aren't guilty of it, then they don't need to worry about it.

So you want less government intrusion unless it's Trump who wants more government intrusion. Got it.

[UK2K]

So you want less government intrusion unless it's Trump who wants more government intrusion. Got it.

I don't believe suing someone in court for libel is what most people would consider 'government intrusion' since it's a case between two non-government entities...

But whatever.

[poido123]

It's not a bad thing when the populace is educated and mannered.

It is harmful for the well being of the individual to let loose the tongue without certain restraints


So we can end up like other Islamic countries full of harsh rules, homophobia, sexism and violence that are followed by extreme punishments? Surely that's not your idea of an ideal world.