Wade vs Kyrie vs Kobe

[Lebronxrings]

Battle of the sidekicks. Who do you take to compliment your 1a option? 3,2,1 GO!

[GrapeApe]

Kobe 2001
Kobe 2002
Wade 2012
Kyrie 2016
Wade 2013
Kobe 2000

Probably this.

[Lebronxrings]

Kobe 2001
Kobe 2002
Wade 2012
Kyrie 2016
Wade 2013
Kobe 2000
kyrie should be much higher tbbh...

[SamuraiSWISH]

1) Kobe 2001 29/7/6
2) Kobe 2002 27/6/5

I can see the debate between these two

3) Wade 2012 23/5/4 (defense)
4) Kyrie 2016 25/3/5

5) LeBron 2011 24/8/6 (defense)

[GrapeApe]

1) Kobe 2001 29/7/6
2) Kobe 2002 27/6/5

I can see the debate between these two

3) Wade 2012 23/5/4 (defense)
4) Kyrie 2016 25/3/5

5) LeBron 2011 24/8/6 (defense)

I suppose Irving could be argued above 2012 Wade, but Wade was pretty damn good that season. 2nd team all-NBA, 3rd best PER, 23/5/4/2/1 in the playoffs, and excellent defensively. He could impact a game in more ways than Irving. I think Wade's 2-way play gives him a slight edge over Irving's small scoring advantage.

[Bankaii]

1) Kobe 2001 29/7/6
2) Kobe 2002 27/6/5

I can see the debate between these two

3) Wade 2012 23/5/4 (defense)
4) Kyrie 2016 25/3/5

5) LeBron 2011 24/8/6 (defense)
If You're talking about the entire season, you're a jackass.
Lebron was the best player in the RS, and 3/4 rounds of the postseason (the Boston series is debatable) for the Heat.
Aside from the Finals he was the best player in the league, and even so Wade was just as bad in the ECF if that's your reasoning for calling Bron a sidekick.

And 2016 Kyrie > 2012 Wade.

[GrapeApe]

If You're talking about the entire season, you're a jackass.
Lebron was the best player in the RS, and 3/4 rounds of the postseason (the Boston series is debatable) for the Heat.
Aside from the Finals he was the best player in the league, and even so Wade was just as bad in the ECF if that's your reasoning for calling Bron a sidekick.

And 2016 Kyrie > 2012 Wade.

The Boston series isn't debateable. Wade was the best player in that series. Lebron was slightly better overall in the RS, Wade slightly better overall in the playoffs. Neither Lebron or Wade were sidekicks that season. That was about as close to true co-first options as you'll ever see (I called it 1a/1aa).

As for 2012 Wade vs 2016 Irving, Wade had the better overall season. Better numbers in the RS (raw and advanced), all-star and all-NBA, better defense, and comparable playoff production.

[SamuraiSWISH]

The Boston series isn't debateable. Wade was the best player in that series. Lebron was slightly better overall in the RS, Wade slightly better overall in the playoffs. Neither Lebron or Wade were sidekicks that season. That was about as close to true co-first options as you'll ever see (I called it 1a/1aa).

As for 2012 Wade vs 2016 Irving, Wade had the better overall season. Better numbers in the RS (raw and advanced), all-star and all-NBA, better defense, and comparable playoff production.
It was 1a and 1b. LeBron slightly in RS and Wade slightly in the Playoffs. I said that specifically to rile up the OP. But judging from Bankaii's response, at least I got one of these LeBron stans goats.

[ClipperRevival]

It's hard to rank Kyrie because Kobe/Wade brought an all-around, impactful game that Kyrie couldn't match but none of them were involved in a situation like Kyrie where they were pushed to the brink and had to go OFF like Kyrie in 3 straight elimination games AND hit the title clinching shot.

So all around performance, that's subjective. But sheer, put my foot down when it matters most and score when it's needed series, Kyrie is #1for me. His scoring in the finals can be compared to lead dogs, not limited to 2nd fiddles.

[SamuraiSWISH]

His scoring in the finals can be compared to lead dogs, not limited to 2nd fiddles.
Kobe and Wade were too.

[Smoke117]

been rewatching deadwood...and I don't swim in this shit.

Only a ****ing idiot (like op) who has no understanding of basketball thinks it's as easy as this.

[CTbasketball92]

Beginning in 2012, DWade stopped being all that reliable as a scorer at pivotal moments where they needed straight buckets and not really "all around play." I never got the sense that LeBron could legitimately take his foot off the gas and the Heat would still win. For that reason, I take 2016 Kyrie to play next to LeBron, though I definitely wouldn't necessarily do that in any other circumstance. We'll see how Ky does this year and I guess, revisit that.

2000-2002 Kobe is really interesting. On one hand, he was still such a great defender and scorer I'm not sure he starts off the first two games of the finals as poorly as Kyrie did. I feel like he could will his way to buckets more easily because he was an elite 6'6" athlete who would just straight up overwhelm Klay Thompson and the Warriors defense after a while. With that said, at that time, Kobe shot only about 37% on his jumpshots overall, and shot only about 42% on his midrange jumpers, where as Kyrie shoots like 50% on his midrange and 42% on his jumper overall. I think against GSW you need to be able to stick those tough midrange jumpers, and I don't really see any reason why Kobe would do any better than 6'10" prime KD did. Still, i my order would be

1.2001-2002 Kobe
2. 2016 Kyrie
3. 2012 Dwade

Edit: Basically, 2012 DWade is NOT torching that Warriors defense in the same way that Kyrie just did. At no point after 2011 did DWade showcase that ability.

[aj1987]

Edit: Basically, 2012 DWade is NOT torching that Warriors defense in the same way that Kyrie just did. At no point after 2011 did DWade showcase that ability.
2012 ECSF with PG guarding him. Miami was down 1-2 and Wade averaged 33/7/4/2/1 on 64% TS in 3 straight wins. Murdered the Pacers and their "verticality".

[lilandywiggins]

kyrie should be much higher tbbh...
Agreed. Otherwise the list looks right.

[CTbasketball92]

2012 ECSF with PG guarding him. Miami was down 1-2 and Wade averaged 33/7/4/2/1 on 64% TS in 3 straight wins. Murdered the Pacers and their "verticality".

Idk if PG was as good a defender then as he is now, but yeah, DWade balled tf out against the pacers. I just remember that he was somewhat pedestrian in the two series after that, whereas I think Kyrie would've kept it going. More consistent shooter.

[Mr Feeny]

As a scorer in the finals, 2016 Kyrie is better than either of Wade or Kobe in their runs as sidekicks.
The guy just averaged 26 ppg on 48%fg while putting up 41 points on 70%fg in an elimination game and scoring the championship winning 3 point shot right in the grill of the defending back to back mvp.

It doesnt get any more clutch than that.

[SexSymbol]

1) Kobe 2001 29/7/6
2) Kobe 2002 27/6/5

I can see the debate between these two

3) Wade 2012 23/5/4 (defense)
4) Kyrie 2016 25/3/5

5) LeBron 2011 24/8/6 (defense)

?

1. Kobe 01
2. Kobe 02
3. Kyrie 16
4. Wade 12
5. Kobe 00
6. Wade 13
7. LeBron 11

These are just for the finals

[Hey Yo]

It was 1a and 1b. LeBron slightly in RS and Wade slightly in the Playoffs. I said that specifically to rile up the OP. But judging from Bankaii's response, at least I got one of these LeBron stans goats.
You got Bankaii's goats??? What the hell does that mean?

He's a goat herder??

[Bankaii]

?

1. Kobe 01
2. Kobe 02
3. Kyrie 16
4. Wade 12
5. Kobe 00
6. Wade 13
7. LeBron 11

These are just for the finals
Kobe in the 2000 Finals is infinitely worse than 2013 Wade.
He worse than 2011 Lebron too slightly.

[CTbasketball92]

2000 Kobe played great until he hurt his ankle.

[Bankaii]

2000 Kobe played great until he hurt his ankle.
14/3/5 on 6/13 shooting is great?:roll:

[SexSymbol]

Kobe in the 2000 Finals is infinitely worse than 2013 Wade.
He worse than 2011 Lebron too slightly.
That's just stupid.
Rewatch 2000 finals please. Or watch them for the first time, coz you either forgot or haven't seen a moment from them.

[Mr Feeny]

That's just stupid.
Rewatch 2000 finals please. Or watch them for the first time, coz you either forgot or haven't seen a moment from them.

We all did. In full. Kobe was abysmal.

Within the context of the OP's question, Kobe in 2000 was by far worse than any version of Wade of this year's Kyrie.

[Bankaii]

That's just stupid.
Rewatch 2000 finals please. Or watch them for the first time, coz you either forgot or haven't seen a moment from them.
Rewatch it for what? We all know what happened quit trying to revise history:oldlol:
Aside from game 4(even then he scored 28 points on 27 shots) it was by far the worst Finals of all time. Kobe was an absolute role player that series.

[aj1987]

Are people seriously trying to say that Kobe in '00 was better than Wade in '13? :facepalm

[Doranku]

Kobe in '00 is weird to rank, because he was (intentionally, as per Jalen Rose's own admittance) injured for half the series, but he also completely took over game 4 when Shaq fouled out, making the series 3-1 instead of 2-2.

Tbh, that was at least as impactful as anything Wade's broken down ass achieved in the 2013 finals.

[aj1987]

Kobe in '00 is weird to rank, because he was (intentionally, as per Jalen Rose's own admittance) injured for half the series, but he also completely took over game 4 when Shaq fouled out, making the series 3-1 instead of 2-2.

Tbh, that was at least as impactful as anything Wade's broken down ass achieved in the 2013 finals.
Games 4 and 7, bitch. Heck, Wade's game 4 is better than almost 95% of Chokebe's Finals games. That production form a "broken down" Wade. :oldlol:

Dude got carried to a ring averaging 15 on 36%. :oldlol:

[Bankaii]

Are people seriously trying to say that Kobe in '00 was better than Wade in '13? :facepalm
Seriously, Kobetards have completely lost it:oldlol:

[Doranku]

Games 4 and 7, bitch. Heck, Wade's game 4 is better than almost 95% of Chokebe's Finals games. That production form a "broken down" Wade. :oldlol:

Dude got carried to a ring averaging 15 on 36%. :oldlol:

Okay okay, you're probably right. Wade 2013 > Kobe 2000. But still, Kobe's game 4 pretty much omits him from getting "carried" to a ring when he was the singular reason that the series was 3-1 rather than 2-2 in the first place.

[aj1987]

Okay okay, you're probably right. Wade 2013 > Kobe 2000. But still, Kobe's game 4 pretty much omits him from getting "carried" to a ring when he was the singular reason that the series was 3-1 rather than 2-2 in the first place.
You don't think Shaq could've taken them to a title if the series was 2-2? The guy averaged 38/17/2/1/3 on 61%. Probably the GOAT Finals numbers.

[Mr Feeny]

Okay okay, you're probably right. Wade 2013 > Kobe 2000. But still, Kobe's game 4 pretty much omits him from getting "carried" to a ring when he was the singular reason that the series was 3-1 rather than 2-2 in the first place.


Your hero scored 15 ppg on 36%
Shaq averaged 38 and 17 on 60+%fg

That's the definition of being carried.

[Doranku]

You don't think Shaq could've taken them to a title if the series was 2-2? The guy averaged 38/17/2/1/3 on 61%. Probably the GOAT Finals numbers.

Probably, but you never know. What happens if Shaq fouls out again, which he was obviously more than capable of? No Kobe, and then going against one of the most clutch players of all-time in Reggie Miller.

I'm not saying the Lakers would have lost, but you have to give Kobe credit for what he did in Game 4, especially considering the magnitude of the game (3-1 vs 2-2).

[Hey Yo]

Kobe in '00 is weird to rank, because he was (intentionally, as per Jalen Rose's own admittance) injured for half the series, but he also completely took over game 4 when Shaq fouled out, making the series 3-1 instead of 2-2.

Tbh, that was at least as impactful as anything Wade's broken down ass achieved in the 2013 finals.
Shaq fouled out with 2:33 left in OT with the score 112-109 Lakers.

Kobe scored 6pts after Shaq fouled out. While he was the leading scorer after the 2:33 mark, it's still not really enough to warrant the term "completely took over"

[aj1987]

Shaq fouled out with 2:33 left in OT with the score 112-109 Lakers.

Kobe scored 6pts after Shaq fouled out. While he was the leading scorer after the 2:33 mark, it's still not really enough to warrant the term "completely took over"
Watch the game bro. The Lakers do not win without Kobe.

[ArbitraryWater]

Kobe 2001
Kobe 2002
Kyrie 2016
Wade 2012
Irving 2015
Kobe 2000
Wade 2013
Wade 2014

There ya go

[Hey Yo]

Watch the game bro. The Lakers do not win without Kobe.
I didn't say they wouldn't have, but it's not like others were taking and missing shots after Shaq fouled out. Kobe was the one taking the shots, outside of Shaw's miss at the very end followed by Kobe's put back put them up by 3.

Just saying that going 3-3 after Shaq fouled out really doesn't warrant the expression........... "completely took over"

Horry went 2-2 and LA had a 3pt lead when Shaq fouled out. Does that mean Rob was completely taking the game over? I would say no.

[Klay 3D]

Wade with a Kyrie sidekick would've beat the Mavs in 2011.

[aj1987]

Wade with a Kyrie sidekick would've beat the Mavs in 2011.
They wouldn't have gotten past the Bulls.