LeBron is the best player ever.

[Real14]

MJ who? Without Pippen, Jordan would be nothing but a Prime T-mac. Don't even mention Kobe to me either (absolutely overrated) who piggybacked Shaq for 3 rings. King James' rings are rightfully earned especially his last one where he led to cavs in every stat. Give the man the respect, nobody can do it better. Who agrees??

[BigKAT]

MJ who? Without Pippen, Jordan would be nothing but a Prime T-mac. Don't even mention Kobe to me either (absolutely overrated) who piggybacked Shaq for 3 rings. King James' rings are rightfully earned especially his last one where he led to cavs in every stat. Give the man the respect, nobody can do it better. Who agrees??

Lebron James is an amazing player.
One of the greatest of all time.

But he's not number one yet.
Say what you will about Jordan,
The guy has 2 3-peats in his career,

That's amazing domination.
And Basketball is a team sport, of course you need a good coach/2nd option to do that.

Can Lebron eventually be recognized as the consensus goat?
Yeah, for sure. Anything can happen the guy is not even 32 yet and he is smart enough to adjust his game with the gradual loss of his athleticism. He's losing his jump, but he's still going to be one hell of a post player/creator.

But not just yet.

[Nilocon165]

Hey! You finally made an entire post without spelling or grammatical errors! :applause:

[aj1987]

Cecil... :facepalm

[Real14]

Lebron James is an amazing player.
One of the greatest of all time.

But he's not number one yet.
Say what you will about Jordan,
The guy has 2 3-peats in his career,

That's amazing domination.
And Basketball is a team sport, of course you need a good coach/2nd option to do that.

Can Lebron eventually be recognized as the consensus goat?
Yeah, for sure. Anything can happen the guy is not even 32 yet and he is smart enough to adjust his game with the gradual loss of his athleticism. He's losing his jump, but he's still going to be one hell of a post player/creator.

But not just yet.

Jordan had more help. Jordan wouldn't do shit with that 07 cavs team.

[Real14]

Cecil... :facepalm
What's your problem Aaron Jonathan?

[KnittingRyu]

OP needs banned for stupidity.

[lilandywiggins]

To be fair, OP overrates Melo too.

[aj1987]

What's your problem Aaron Jonathan?
I'm an Indian Hindu, Cecil, you dumb****. Not an American poet.

[GimmeThat]

there's nothing wrong with the word fountain

but when you put that word with youth together..

[raprap]

there's nothing wrong with the word fountain

but when you put that word with youth together..
:biggums:


:roll:

[SouBeachTalents]

there's nothing wrong with the word fountain

but when you put that word with youth together..

Is he trolling or just autistic?

[Real14]

I'm an Indian Hindu, Cecil, you dumb****. Not an American poet.
Calm the hell down Wade stan. You don't agree that LeBron is the greatest?

[aj1987]

Calm the hell down Wade stan. You don't agree that LeBron is the greatest?
No, I do not, Cecil.

[NumberSix]

Jordan did more with worse PEDs.

[Real14]

To be fair, OP overrates Melo too.
Melo is a loser. Couldn't even get to the finals one damn time.

[AirBonner]

Op has seen the light :applause:

[AirBonner]

Trying not to get banned...I understand.

Sad damn day when you have to form the same opinion as the moderators or you're banned.

These cowards would hate to be on a jury with me...i'd never budge and i'd knock their asses out if they ever got in my face.
You would never be on a jury. You would be the one on trial. :oldlol:

[sekachu]

MJ who? Without Pippen, Jordan would be nothing but a Prime T-mac. Don't even mention Kobe to me either (absolutely overrated) who piggybacked Shaq for 3 rings. King James' rings are rightfully earned especially his last one where he led to cavs in every stat. Give the man the respect, nobody can do it better. Who agrees??



MJ's success due to his killer instinct.

Lebron's success due to colluding.

Who should be more respect? You tell me

[Smoke117]

I can't take OP seriously without a couple tha's and z's thrown in.

[3ball]

King James' rings are rightfully earned especially his last one where he led to cavs in every stat


Lebron 2016V Finals:. 30/11/9 with 4.5 turnovers
Jordan 91-93' Finals:. i36/7/8i with 3.4 turnovers


Jordan's 1.1 fewer turnovers erases his 1 fewer assist, so the comparison boils down to Lebron's 4 defensive rebounds versus Jordan's 6 more points on better efficiency.

Obviously, Jordan's 6 points on better efficiency is more important - Lebron would be on another level if he averaged 6 more points with better efficiency.

Also, Jordan scored 15 ppg more than his 2nd option, compared to only 1 ppg for Lebron - so Jordan faced greater defensive attention, yet he still made all the game-winning plays for Pippen, whereas Kyrie made several for Lebron.






Without Pippen, Jordan would be nothing but a Prime T-mac.


Without team-hopping to play with 2 superstars (Wade/Bosh and Kyrie/Love), Lebron would have zero rings.

Lebron's 2 superstars represent MORE help than Jordan's 3-peat with just 1 superstar (Pippen), which is why Jordan's first 3 rings required 30% more scoring and more assists than Lebron's 3 rings:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=416369
.

[BedroomBully]

Trying not to get banned...I understand.

Sad damn day when you have to form the same opinion as the moderators or you're banned.

These cowards would hate to be on a jury with me...i'd never budge and i'd knock their asses out if they ever got in my face.
Why dont you try and knock out a job application kid?

[3ball]

Can Lebron eventually be recognized as the consensus goat?
Yeah, for sure. Anything can happen the guy is not even 32 yet


The ship has sailed because Lebron can never match Jordan's 6 rings in 13 seasons with higher PER.

Longevity can never match DEGREE OF GREATNESS (6 rings in 13 seasons).

So Lebron fans can have their longevity award, while Jordan takes the degree of greatness award (GOAT)






and he is smart enough to adjust his game with the gradual loss of his athleticism.


The reason Jordan aged so well is because he relied on his goat midrange JUMPSHOT as his athleticism declined.

Unfortunately, Lebron's can't rely on his jumper because it's broke, from both 3-point and midrange.. He shot below 40% from midrange for 10 of 13 (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=12389794&postcount=17) seasons, while shooting a pedestrian 33% on threes for his career.





He's losing his jump, but he's still going to be one hell of a creator.


As Lebron's quickness and speed declines, he won't be able to beat his man and penetrate/create as well - he'll use the forearm and look clumsier more often.





He's losing his jump, but he's still going to be one hell of a post player.


Lebron is a horrible post player - he has no moves and just uses bully-ball - that's why he posted up less than Durant (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1) in the playoffs, and only posts up between 6-10% of his possessions in any given year, with middle-of-the-pack efficiency.

The notion that Lebron is a good post player is a joke - he's a BAD post player compared to guys like Jordan or Hakeem, who posted up more often and had actual MOVES

[AirBonner]

You can't exclude ordan's wizards years. Horrys 7 rings in 16 years with 3 different teams is more impressive.

[Lebronxrings]

OPs a fakkit

[aj1987]

Lebron is a horrible post player - he has no moves and just uses bully-ball - that's why he posted up less than Durant (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1) in the playoffs, and only posts up between 6-10% of his possessions in any given year, with middle-of-the-pack efficiency.
Go jump off a cliff. Look at LeBron's post efficiency numbers from '12-'14 (those numbers are the only ones I sorta remember).

Why did you run away from this thread, you turd faced retard?

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=417086

[3ball]

Go jump off a cliff. Look at LeBron's post efficiency numbers from '12-'14 (those numbers are the only ones I sorta remember).


Lebron's post efficiency was in the 56th percentile (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1) in the 2016 playoffs (middle of the pack) and he posted up

less often than Durant (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1)

less often than Durant (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1)

less often than Durant (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1)

less often than Durant (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1)





Why did you run away from this thread, you turd faced retard?

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=417086


Because I proved the logic already and no one responded - Jordan played a team with LESS than 50-wins only 8 times in 37 playoff series, compared to 18 of 37 for Lebron.

So Jordan played far better comp, and also had a weaker supporting cast throughout his career - when Jordan arrived with the Bulls, he never had a 2-time all-star center or a 15 ppg all-defensive wing like Lebron got with the Cavs... And once both guys started winning rings, Lebron needed 2 superstars, while Jordan 3-peated with just 1.. :shouldershrug:

[Lebron23]

The best there is the best there was, and the best there will be.

[aj1987]

Lebron's post efficiency was in the 56th percentile (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Playoffs&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1) in the 2016 playoffs (middle of the pack) and he posted up
Great a 7 game sample. :applause:

I'll try that as well. Ordan is a horrendous shooter in the Finals, because he shot 40% in the '96 Finals.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/1996-nba-finals-supersonics-vs-bulls.html


Because I proved the logic already and no one responded - Jordan played a team with LESS than 50-wins only 8 times in 37 playoff series, compared to 18 of 37 for Lebron.
MJ's and LeBron's teams faced pretty much the the same level of competition, when you factor in win percentage.

You got caught making up numbers and you ran away like the bitch you are.


So played played far better comp, and also had a weaker supporting cast throughout his career - when Ordan arrived with the Bulls, he never had a 2-time all-star center or a 15 ppg all-defensive wing like Lebron got with the Cavs... And once both guys started winning rings, Lebron needed 2 superstars, while Jordan 3-peated with just 1.. :shouldershrug:
Nah, Ordan was just playing with scrubs names Woolridge and Dailey, who were putting up 23/6/2/1/1 on 55% and 16/3/2/1 on 47%. Lets also forget about the All-Star/All-Def Oakley, who played with Ordan. I heard that Paxon was an absolute scrub as well. :rolleyes:

The only thing you're good for is making gifs. You haven't EVER seen a single game of basketball in your life, nor have you ever even touched a basketball IRL. ISH is considered to the home for trolls. Even in this place, you make stalkerforlife look like West, when it comes to basketball discussion. If I was Obama and an Isis ****tard blew you up, I'd pardon him in a heartbeat. :facepalm

[3ball]

Great a 7 game sample of Lebron's post-up ability.. :applause:


The playoffs was a 20-game sample (not 7 games), and the regular season was 80 games, where Lebron was only at 67.7 (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1) percentile in post-up efficiency.. And again - he only posts up 6-10% of the time and less than Durant in 2016 playoffs.

So Lebron's post up efficiency and frequency is average at best.. But is name is "lebron", so people pay more attention to his post-ups and overrate his ability - he's a bully-ball post player with zero moves and zero shooting touch.





MJ's and LeBron's teams faced pretty much the the same level of competition, when you factor in win percentage.


That data showed that the average win total of MJ's Eastern Conference playoff opponents was 52.1, compared to 48.7 for Lebron.

That's a significant gap

Nearly all of Jordan's playoff opponents won more than 50 games - 30 of 37 opponents won over 50 games, compared to only 19 of 37 for Lebron.





woolridge and Dailey, who were putting up 23/6/2/1/1 on 55% and 16/3/2/1 on 47%. Lets also forget about the All-Star/All-Def Oakley, who played with Ordan. I heard that Paxon was an absolute scrub as well. :rolleyes:


None of those guys were anywhere NEAR being a top 3 player in the conference alongside Jordan (all-star), whereas Zydrunas was an all-star alongside young Lebron..

Infact, before 1990, Jordan's 2nd options were comparable to Lebron's THIRD option Larry Hughes - he was 1st team all-nba defense and the NBA steals leader in the season before joining Lebron, and averaged 15 ppg alongside Lebron.. That's better than 2nd year Pippen's 14/6/3 in 1989, with no all-nba defense.





Great a 7 game sample. :applause:


If young Lebron had today's Sixers cast and played in a tough conference like the West, he would be in the same situation that young Jordan was in (no-talent supporting cast in a tough conference).. But instead, Lebron's early casts had a 2-time all-star center, a 15 ppg all-defensive wing, and he played in a weak conference - so his path was far easier than MJ's, even before he started team-hopping.

In the end, Lebron won 3 rings by team-hopping to play with 2 superstars - otoh, Jordan 3-peated with just 1 superstar, which is why his first 3-peat required 30% more scoring and more assists than Lebron's 3 rings (stats shown here (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=416369)).
.

[aj1987]

The playoffs was a 20-game sample (not 7 games), and the regular season was 80 games, where Lebron was only at 67.7 (http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/playtype/post-up/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PerMode=Totals&sort=Time&dir=1) percentile in post-up efficiency.. And again - he only posts up 6-10% of the time and less than Durant in 2016 playoffs.

So Lebron's post up efficiency and frequency is average at best.. But is name is "lebron", so people pay more attention to his post-ups and overrate his ability - he's a bully-ball post player with zero moves and zero shooting touch.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1751682-evolution-of-lebron-james-post-game
http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/news/east-scout-lebron-james-is-best-post-up-player-in-the-league/v4lz7kbfyvoa1rmf5uk17yj9k
http://bballbreakdown.com/2015/05/27/how-lebron-james-dominates-with-the-post-up/
http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2012/6/20/3099027/lebron-james-heat-vs-thunder-nba-finals-2012

That's just four of dozens of different articles.



That data showed that the average win total of MJ's Eastern Conference playoff opponents was 52.1, compared to 48.7 for Lebron.

That's a significant gap
MJ's opponents won 3 more games than LeBron's. 3 games over 82 games is not even close to being significant. Maybe that's what they teach you in your hick town though. 3.6% win percentage difference.


Nearly all of Jordan's playoff opponents won more than 50 games - 30 of 37 opponents won over 50 games, compared to only 19 of 37 for Lebron.
And you still keep pulling stats out of your ass.

Compared to this post though...


My stats show that the win % of Jordan's eastern conference opponent's was 64% to lebron's 55, which is a massive gap

That's you shtick, I guess. Blatant lying, cherry picking, and making up stats.


None of those guys were anywhere NEAR being a top 3 player in the conference alongside Jordan (all-star), whereas Zydrunas was an all-star alongside young Lebron..
Big Z was never a top 3 player. EVER. Again, you would know that if you actually watch basketball, instead of going over numbers.


Infact, before 1990, Jordan's 2nd options were comparable to Lebron's THIRD option Larry Hughes - he was 1st team all-nba defense and the NBA steals leader in the season before joining Lebron, and averaged 15 ppg alongside Lebron.. That's better than 2nd year Pippen's 14/6/3 in 1989, with no all-nba defense.
Nah, Ordan was just playing with scrubs names Woolridge and Dailey, who were putting up 23/6/2/1/1 on 55% and 16/3/2/1 on 47%. Lets also forget about the All-Star/All-Def Oakley, who played with Ordan. I heard that Paxon was an absolute scrub as well. :rolleyes:


If young Lebron had today's Sixers cast and played in a tough conference like the West, he would be in the same situation that young Jordan was in (no-talent supporting cast in a tough conference).. But instead, Lebron's early casts had a 2-time all-star center, a 15 ppg all-defensive wing, and he played in a weak conference - so his path was far easier than MJ's, even before he started team-hopping.
Nah, Ordan was just playing with scrubs names Woolridge and Dailey, who were putting up 23/6/2/1/1 on 55% and 16/3/2/1 on 47%. Lets also forget about the All-Star/All-Def Oakley, who played with Ordan. I heard that Paxon was an absolute scrub as well. :rolleyes:

The only thing you're good for is making gifs. You haven't EVER seen a single game of basketball in your life, nor have you ever even touched a basketball IRL. ISH is considered to the home for trolls. Even in this place, you make stalkerforlife look like West, when it comes to basketball discussion. If I was Obama and an Isis ****tard blew you up, I'd pardon him in a heartbeat.


In the end, Ordan won 6 rings by having GOAT level stacked teams and playing in a garbage ass dumpster fire of an era.
.

Agreed.

LeBron also never had 2 All-Def first team players, 6th MOY, COY, rebounding champ, and an All-NBA First team player on his team in the SAME season. He had to BEAT a similar team though.

[Gileraracer]

Lebron needed the refs for 2 of his 3 rings and 2 superstar collusions to win 3 overall.


He's a manufactured star