2016/2017 NBA MVP Race

[ArbitraryWater]

BR's MVP Tracker:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/friv/mvp.cgi

[ArbitraryWater]

NBA's Week 5 Report:
global.nba.com/news/kia-race-to-the-mvp-ladder-anthony-davis-crafting-a-future-bid-for-hardware/

How the fck is Westbrook still at 1 with an 8-8 record? I'm not even blaming him for the record, but he's not doing enough to be the damn MVP, and will never get it with a .500 record... just a matter of time until they drop him.

[Uncle Drew]

What would be considered ''doing enough'' in Westbrook's case then?

[ArbitraryWater]

What would be considered ''doing enough'' in Westbrook's case then?

Tone down the TO's, smarter late game execution and shot selection, stop taking 6 3's a game at 30% (:facepalm), shoot 45+%, step up defensively.

So far, this isn't quite MVP level play.

[CTbasketball92]

Tone down the TO's, smarter late game execution and shot selection, stop taking 6 3's a game at 30% (:facepalm), shoot 45+%, step up defensively.

So far, this isn't quite MVP level play.

He's kept them in a lot of close games with random barrages of three pointers. I say let him do it. His usage rate is the highest ever, if he kept his turnovers below 4 it'd be so astounding I'm pretty sure even cp3 couldn't do that.

[JebronLames]

BR's MVP Tracker:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/friv/mvp.cgi
Lmao Kevin love at 10

[Dray n Klay]

LeBron



Cavs 11-1 with him



0-1 without him

[MrFonzworth]

LeBron



Cavs 11-1 with him



0-1 without him

They would be 0-82 without him :bowdown:

[ArbitraryWater]

He's kept them in a lot of close games with random barrages of three pointers. I say let him do it. His usage rate is the highest ever, if he kept his turnovers below 4 it'd be so astounding I'm pretty sure even cp3 couldn't do that.

The IND game, but besides that? Not really

[Poetry]

Lmao Kevin love at 10

He's nearly averaging 22/11, and he's second in win shares on the Cavs :confusedshrug:

[Heavincent]

Harden is easily the MVP right now.

[ShawkFactory]

He's nearly averaging 22/11, and he's second in win shares on the Cavs :confusedshrug:
People don't really seem to notice how well he's playing.

Top 10 in MVP? I'm not sure id go that far but he's been really good.

I'd probably put at least:

Harden
Westbrook
Lebron
CP3
Kawhi
Kemba
Kyrie
AD (I know they're 6-10 but damn)
Lillard
KD
Curry

After that you can probably start arguing him in there TBH. There's probably a few others above him but he's playing well for sure

[spidey102279]

KIA Race To MVP Week 3

1. Russell Westbrook, Oklahoma City Thunder
(Last week: No. 1)

2. LeBron James, Cleveland Cavaliers
(Last week: No. 2)

3. Kevin Durant, Golden State Warriors
(Last week: No. 3)

4. James Harden, Houston Rockets
(Last week: No. 5)

5. Kawhi Leonard, San Antonio Spurs
(Last week: No. 7)

6. Blake Griffin, Los Angeles Clippers
(Last week: No. 4)

7. Stephen Curry, Golden State Warriors
(Last week: No. 6)

8. Jimmy Butler, Chicago Bulls
(Last week: Not ranked)

9. Anthony Davis, New Orleans Pelicans
(Last week: Not ranked)

10. Kemba Walker, Charlotte Hornets
(Last week: No. 9)

http://www.nba.com/article/2016/11/25/mvp-ladder-week-3-anthony-davis-case-mvp

[imdaman99]

I agree, if OKC does not have a good record at the end of the season he will not win MVP. But the numbers he's putting up right now are too ridiculous to ignore even though they are only .500.

[spidey102279]

I agree, if OKC does not have a good record at the end of the season he will not win MVP. But the numbers he's putting up right now are too ridiculous to ignore even though they are only .500.

Maybe it's time to give a guy not in the top teams the mvp this time if he continue his average the whole season. I think they already gave a MVP to a lower seeded team in the past because of superior numbers.

[SpaceJam]

Jimmy G. Buckets! :bowdown:

[Doranku]

It'll be LeBron or KD, unless the criteria drastically changes and team record gets thrown out the window.

LeBron: 23.8 / 8.5 / 9.3 / 1.2 / 0.6 on 50/37/72
KD: 27.0 / 8.1 / 4.5 / 1.7 / 1.3 on 57/43/84

KD > as of now.

[SAKOTXA]

It'll be LeBron or KD, unless the criteria drastically changes and team record gets thrown out the window.

LeBron: 23.8 / 8.5 / 9.3 / 1.2 / 0.6 on 50/37/72
KD: 27.0 / 8.1 / 4.5 / 1.7 / 1.3 on 57/43/84

KD > as of now.

KD should be nowhere near the MVP discussion, wtf? Without him +Barnes this team is 73-9

[JebronLames]

It'll be LeBron or KD, unless the criteria drastically changes and team record gets thrown out the window.

LeBron: 23.8 / 8.5 / 9.3 / 1.2 / 0.6 on 50/37/72
KD: 27.0 / 8.1 / 4.5 / 1.7 / 1.3 on 57/43/84

KD > as of now.
If the season ended today, harden would win.

[ArbitraryWater]

Maybe it's time to give a guy not in the top teams the mvp this time if he continue his average the whole season. I think they already gave a MVP to a lower seeded team in the past because of superior numbers.

Westbrook is awesome, but he's not MVP good right now... shooting too bad, too many TO's.


It'll be LeBron or KD, unless the criteria drastically changes and team record gets thrown out the window.

LeBron: 23.8 / 8.5 / 9.3 / 1.2 / 0.6 on 50/37/72
KD: 27.0 / 8.1 / 4.5 / 1.7 / 1.3 on 57/43/84

KD > as of now.

Does Harden not exist anymore?

[Im Still Ballin]

I'm thinking Houston finishes around 47-50 wins.. Will it be enough for Harden?

The stats will be there.

I feel like LeCruise will slowly take the lead as the season progresses

Still banking on Curry and KD cancelling eachother out

[Big Cheese]

KD should be nowhere near the MVP discussion, wtf? Without him +Barnes this team is 73-9

MVP never worked like that. :no:

Its who puts up the best stats on the top team. The amount of talent on the team is usually irrelevant.

[Doranku]

I'm thinking Houston finishes around 47-50 wins.. Will it be enough for Harden?

The stats will be there.

I feel like LeCruise will slowly take the lead as the season progresses

Still banking on Curry and KD cancelling eachother out

No. That hasn't been enough for an MVP winner in decades. Like I said, it's KD or LeBron's unless the criteria dramatically shifts from recent years past.

[Doranku]

Does Harden not exist anymore?

He's in the same boat as Westbrook, I just don't think he'll have the team record to receive the award.

[Orlando Magic]

If the Warriors don't lose another game all season long, maybe Durant will get MVP.

0% chance that the voters put him in if they get 73-9 or worse.

He just joined a team that has the only unanimous MVP in NBA HISTORY... FROM LAST SEASON... and he's going to get MVP? **** outta here with that kinda stupid ass thought process. The voters WILL NOT put him in.

This is coming down to Westbrook, Harden or LeBron. And honestly? LeBron deserves the award. We all know how many he's gotten ****ed out of. Dude is clearly the best player in the league. The second best player isn't even close and it hasn't been close for years. That's not an exaggeration. LeBron is a mentally weak bitch but he is clearly the MVP. He's not the best scorer nor no where close, which is what a lot of you simple minded buffoons base MVP on, but it really is astounding how much of a positive impact he has on the teams around him. Whether it's attempting to score or making the correct pass via spotting the open man or spotting the mismatch, LeBron is an absolute offensive genius. His defense is good too, though I think quite a bit overrated.

LeBron is that once in a generation player... Since the late 80s, it's been Jordan --> Shaq --> LeBron --> Unidentified. Shaq got ****ed outta SO MANY MVPs too. And Jordan was only MVP 6 times? **** outta here with that shit.

LeBron, Jordan and Shaq have a COMBINED 10 MVP awards... out of... A POTENTIAL 47(well maybe not quite because some of their seasons overlap honestly but you get the point) MVP awards. They have 10. That means that these 3 guys, who were CLEARLY the best players in the league for YEARS AND YEARS, only get an average of 1 out of 5 MVP awards. The voters are stupid assholes that honestly deserve to burn in hell. They just give it to whoever the hell they want in any given season. You guys can talk about team records and supporting casts and all that shit but get the **** outta here with it. Look... LeBron, Jordan & Shaq are batting .200 on MVP awards... rofl rofl **** outta here!

[hold this L]

lol Westbrook and Harden have no chance. You're delusional. :lol You have to go back 2 decades for the GOAT to get an instance when a players wins MVP from a non top 2 team. Even a decade further for another instance. OKC isn't finishing higher than 6th this season and Rockets aren't finishing higher than 4th. How do people not get this?

Lebron is likely favorite for 3 reasons
- Curry won it last year which will make it harder for him to win, and KD joined his team that already had the best reg season of all time
- Lebron had a monster finals and they will want to give it to him for his legacy.
- Clippers will likely do what they always do, choke it away. They look real good already, but their D has started cracking already and is leaking a lot more points than 2 weeks ago

Lebron hasn't even player like a top 5 player this year IMO and he's already being seen as top 1-2. He will ramp up his game by March and play like a beast which will put him over the edge of everyone.

[ArbitraryWater]

Nash, albeit wrongly, won MVP as 3rd seed.

But it doesnt say anywhere that an MVP has to be a 56+ wins / top 2 seed team. It just happened to be, that all-time greats, around the prime/peak of their career (in the middle of their career most of the time), were on a solid team, because you could see their evolution coming... So by then they were on a solid team, able to add alot of W's, making it a great team..

Kobe '06-'07 and current Harden are few of the exceptions (Dirk and Bron as well but they had bigger impact, making MVP's still possible), but Harden might do more than Kobe, might do enough, to add sufficient W's to the team.

It will be between him and Bron. Bron takes it, IMO.

[ArbitraryWater]

lol Westbrook and Harden have no chance. You're delusional. :lol You have to go back 2 decades for the GOAT to get an instance when a players wins MVP from a non top 2 team. Even a decade further for another instance. OKC isn't finishing higher than 6th this season and Rockets aren't finishing higher than 4th. How do people not get this?

Lebron is likely favorite for 3 reasons
- Curry won it last year which will make it harder for him to win, and KD joined his team that already had the best reg season of all time
- Lebron had a monster finals and they will want to give it to him for his legacy.
- Clippers will likely do what they always do, choke it away. They look real good already, but their D has started cracking already and is leaking a lot more points than 2 weeks ago

Lebron hasn't even player like a top 5 player this year IMO and he's already being seen as top 1-2. He will ramp up his game by March and play like a beast which will put him over the edge of everyone.

It wont be about anyone wanting to give LeBron anything.... if that were the case, they would have done it in 2015, when even I expected it, with the 'home coming' and all... and honestly his play and team record after his two week back injury was good enough, but they still didnt do it.

[Orlando Magic]

Lebron hasn't even player like a top 5 player this year IMO

That's because YOUR OPINION is dog shit. LeBron is still playing like he's the best player in the league even though he's not as good as HE once was. He is starting to come off of his peak obviously and within 2-3 years it's improbable he's going to resemble anything that he once did... but for now... he IS still the best.

[ArbitraryWater]

If the Warriors don't lose another game all season long, maybe Durant will get MVP.

0% chance that the voters put him in if they get 73-9 or worse.

He just joined a team that has the only unanimous MVP in NBA HISTORY... FROM LAST SEASON... and he's going to get MVP? **** outta here with that kinda stupid ass thought process. The voters WILL NOT put him in.

This is coming down to Westbrook, Harden or LeBron. And honestly? LeBron deserves the award. We all know how many he's gotten ****ed out of. Dude is clearly the best player in the league. The second best player isn't even close and it hasn't been close for years. That's not an exaggeration. LeBron is a mentally weak bitch but he is clearly the MVP. He's not the best scorer nor no where close, which is what a lot of you simple minded buffoons base MVP on, but it really is astounding how much of a positive impact he has on the teams around him. Whether it's attempting to score or making the correct pass via spotting the open man or spotting the mismatch, LeBron is an absolute offensive genius. His defense is good too, though I think quite a bit overrated.

LeBron is that once in a generation player... Since the late 80s, it's been Jordan --> Shaq --> LeBron --> Unidentified. Shaq got ****ed outta SO MANY MVPs too. And Jordan was only MVP 6 times? **** outta here with that shit.

LeBron, Jordan and Shaq have a COMBINED 10 MVP awards... out of... A POTENTIAL 47(well maybe not quite because some of their seasons overlap honestly but you get the point) MVP awards. They have 10. That means that these 3 guys, who were CLEARLY the best players in the league for YEARS AND YEARS, only get an average of 1 out of 5 MVP awards. The voters are stupid assholes that honestly deserve to burn in hell. They just give it to whoever the hell they want in any given season. You guys can talk about team records and supporting casts and all that shit but get the **** outta here with it. Look... LeBron, Jordan & Shaq are batting .200 on MVP awards... rofl rofl **** outta here!

How are you gonna group 3 guys, where two won 4+ times (both soon to be 5) and the other only won once? lol. Adding up all their seasons is so dumb as well.... AND you are melting down.

[Doranku]

That's because YOUR OPINION is dog shit. LeBron is still playing like he's the best player in the league.

LeBron stan logic: Playing worse than Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Davis = playing like he's the best player in the league.

[ArbitraryWater]

LeBron stan logic: Playing worse than Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Davis = playing like he's the best player in the league.

He's not really playing worse than Westbrook, is he? But he's clearly not playing the best basketball in the league right now.. dont call him a Bron stan.

[jrjim]

Nobodies getting the MVP on a 4th seed team, so Westbrook/Harden are out. Paul wont have the gaudy numbers, no matter how nice they look advanced, 18/9 aint chit. Durant is gonna suffer from GSW being too good when he joined them. This is Lebron or Kawhi's, imo.

[Orlando Magic]

How are you gonna group 3 guys, where two won 4+ times (both soon to be 5) and the other only won once? lol. Adding up all their seasons is so dumb as well.... AND you are melting down.

Well I think the biggest injustice in the history of the MVP award is that Shaq only got one. But Jordan only got 5? Really? lol. LeBron only has 4 outta 14 years? What the ****? Was he really only the best in the league for 4 years? Bullshit.

Don't tell me how the award is given or any of that nonsense. I'm aware... moreso than you. It's that I just think it's ****ing stupid. Sympathetic MVPs or voter fatigue result in someone getting it that doesn't actually deserve it.

The fact is and will continue to be that IT IS THE TOP INDIVIDUAL AWARD IN THE SPORT. There are no other INDIVIDUAL awards given to INDIVIDUALS that are a higher honor. None. How it doesn't always go to the TOP INDIVIDUAL is beyond me. These people are stupid. Just because something has been traditionally been done a certain way for 30-40+ years doesn't mean that it should continue or that it is correct. Because it's not correct. It's ****ing stupid.

[ArbitraryWater]

Nobodies getting the MVP on a 4th seed team, so Westbrook/Harden are out. Paul wont have the gaudy numbers, no matter how nice they look advanced, 18/9 aint chit. Durant is gonna suffer from GSW being too good when he joined them. This is Lebron or Kawhi's, imo.

Shit, I totally forgot about KL just now.. its between Bron/Leonard/Harden.

[ArbitraryWater]

Well I think the biggest injustice in the history of the MVP award is that Shaq only got one. But Jordan only got 5? Really? lol. LeBron only has 4 outta 14 years? What the ****? Was he really only the best in the league for 4 years? Bullshit.

Don't tell me how the award is given or any of that nonsense. I'm aware... moreso than you. It's that I just think it's ****ing stupid. Sympathetic MVPs or voter fatigue result in someone getting it that doesn't actually deserve it.

The fact is and will continue to be that IT IS THE TOP INDIVIDUAL AWARD IN THE SPORT. How it doesn't always go to the TOP INDIVIDUAL is beyond me. These people are stupid. Just because something has been traditionally been done a certain way for 30-40+ years doesn't mean that it should continue or that it is correct. Because it's not correct. It's ****ing stupid.

Yea, he probably should have had 5 or 6.. '08, '11, '15 being the other options.. but Bron wasn't straight up robbed or anything any of those years. I can see how it would be hard to give it to him in 2011 with the massive anti LeBron epidemic going on.

Shaq could have had 2-3, but he always missed too many games, leading to his poor diet, and healing his injuries in the regular season... so its explainable.

We know he was the best more often... thats why he had the full package come playoff time.

[Orlando Magic]

Shit, I totally forgot about KI just now.. its between Bron/Leonard/Harden.

Yes, Leonard and James were the favorites heading into the season because Curry/Durant cancel out, and Westbrook wouldn't get enough wins.

Kawhi is a damn great player. Don't get it twisted. But he's not the MVP. If he wins it'll be yet another sympathetic MVP going to some guy that's on one of the best TEAMS. TEAMS... TEAMS.

Kawhi is not top 10 in any major statistical category league wide. How the **** is he the MVP? **** outta here. He might win it... but he certainly doesn't deserve it unless his play picks up in a big way. Obviously this isn't just stats based but people have to be on rocks to think his impact is that of LeBron's.

[Doranku]

He's not really playing worse than Westbrook, is he? But he's clearly not playing the best basketball in the league right now.. dont call him a Bron stan.

It's hard to compare the two since they're in such drastically different situations. LeBron is obviously the better player, but Westbrook is putting up numbers that are unprecedented in the modern era. 32/10/10 on 56% TS. That is absolutely nuts.

[Orlando Magic]

It's hard to compare the two since they're in such drastically different situations. LeBron is obviously the better player, but Westbrook is putting up numbers that are unprecedented in the modern era. 32/10/10 on 56% TS. That is absolutely nuts.

Agreed.

[hold this L]

That's because YOUR OPINION is dog shit. LeBron is still playing like he's the best player in the league even though he's not as good as HE once was. He is starting to come off of his peak obviously and within 2-3 years it's improbable he's going to resemble anything that he once did... but for now... he IS still the best.
I didn't say he is not the best, he is. I'm saying he isn't playing like it to save himself. I fully expect him to go beast mode come March.



Yes, Leonard and James were the favorites heading into the season because Curry/Durant cancel out, and Westbrook wouldn't get enough wins.

Kawhi is a damn great player. Don't get it twisted. But he's not the MVP. If he wins it'll be yet another sympathetic MVP going to some guy that's on one of the best TEAMS. TEAMS... TEAMS.

Kawhi is not top 10 in any major statistical category league wide. How the **** is he the MVP? **** outta here. He might win it... but he certainly doesn't deserve it unless his play picks up in a big way. Obviously this isn't just stats based but people have to be on rocks to think his impact is that of LeBron's.
Leonard is the most overrated player in the league. He is scoring 4ppg more than last year taking 2 more shots and 2 more FTs. Other than .5apg improvement and not even half a steal% improving, he is down on everything. His shot % are all down. He is also playing noticeably worse defense than last year. The good thing about him is that when he chokes in the playoffs again this year, no one actually cares. When Lebron, Steph, KD, or Westbrook do it, everything gets over-analyzed. A convenient difference between superstars.

[kshutts1]

Well I think the biggest injustice in the history of the MVP award is that Shaq only got one. But Jordan only got 5? Really? lol. LeBron only has 4 outta 14 years? What the ****? Was he really only the best in the league for 4 years? Bullshit.

Don't tell me how the award is given or any of that nonsense. I'm aware... moreso than you. It's that I just think it's ****ing stupid. Sympathetic MVPs or voter fatigue result in someone getting it that doesn't actually deserve it.

The fact is and will continue to be that IT IS THE TOP INDIVIDUAL AWARD IN THE SPORT. There are no other INDIVIDUAL awards given to INDIVIDUALS that are a higher honor. None. How it doesn't always go to the TOP INDIVIDUAL is beyond me. These people are stupid. Just because something has been traditionally been done a certain way for 30-40+ years doesn't mean that it should continue or that it is correct. Because it's not correct. It's ****ing stupid.
If you're aware of how it's done, why not accept how stupid it is?

Moreso, if the MVP were supposed to go to the best player, wouldn't they just call it that?

Most Valuable and Best are not synonyms.

[game3524]

Durant is going to win if he continues to play at this level and the Warriors finish with the best record.

27/5/8 with a TS% of 68%! I don't care who he is playing with those numbers are insane.

[ninephive]

He's kept them in a lot of close games with random barrages of three pointers. I say let him do it. His usage rate is the highest ever, if he kept his turnovers below 4 it'd be so astounding I'm pretty sure even cp3 couldn't do that.
How is he keeping them in games when he's shooting worse than almost everyone else on the team?

[ArbitraryWater]

I didn't say he is not the best, he is. I'm saying he isn't playing like it to save himself. I fully expect him to go beast mode come March.


Leonard is the most overrated player in the league. He is scoring 4ppg more than last year taking 2 more shots and 2 more FTs. Other than .5apg improvement and not even half a steal% improving, he is down on everything. His shot % are all down. He is also playing noticeably worse defense than last year. The good thing about him is that when he chokes in the playoffs again this year, no one actually cares. When Lebron, Steph, KD, or Westbrook do it, everything gets over-analyzed. A convenient difference between superstars.

Youre totally looking at it from the wrong way :oldlol: That just shows he was underrated last year... I already said 2015 was the year he made the jump, steady improvements since.

Duncan was also a superstar but didnt get much flak... its because they play for the Spurs, not because hes not a superstar :facepalm

[ArbitraryWater]

How is he keeping them in games when he's shooting worse than almost everyone else on the team?

Because everyone's else's FG% would plummet to much worse levels if taking so many shots... thats why you take the entirety of efficiency he gives you for his shots, because for a single individual on that type of volume, you cant just replace it by the collective bunch, on that type of talent missing team.

[ballinhun8]

Bulls finish with a top 3 seed in the East and a top 6 overall record, you will see Jimmy G Buckets getting votes.


But I don't see him winning if he's not the best in his position in his own conference. Unless he outplays Bron and Bulls win season series versus Cleveland.

[game3524]

He's not really playing worse than Westbrook, is he? But he's clearly not playing the best basketball in the league right now.. dont call him a Bron stan.

He is.

It is early, but Lebron hasn't been playing like a top 5 player. Russ, KD, AD, Harden, CP3 have all been better.

[hold this L]

Youre totally looking at it from the wrong way :oldlol: That just shows he was underrated last year... I already said 2015 was the year he made the jump, steady improvements since.

Duncan was also a superstar but didnt get much flak... its because they play for the Spurs, not because hes not a superstar :facepalm
He is a superstar, he's just the worst one out of them the 6 in the league at the moment. I agree he's improved over the last few years as well, I'm not saying he isn't. But his offensive game improving a little bit this year while his defense has nosedived below, I don't see him overall better when he was the best defensive player in the league with a pretty good O. If he goes back to his D from last year while maintaining this O, that's another story. The way Kawhi is playing atm, it will be easier to down the Spurs from the Clipper's or Warrior's perspective.

I just find it hilarious that people say he's underrated when the guy rarely gets flak when he fails, unlike the shitstorm that brews whenever any other superstar loses a series. Can't be underrated when every fcking journo says it, since clearly they rate him. I also don't see fans keeping him out of top 5-7 lists this year or top 3-4 last year. Whose he underrated by?

[Rocketswin2013]

I would go with:

1. Paul
2. Durant
3. LeBron
4. Harden
5. Curry

Top 5 so far IMO. But if things keep going in this direction, KD will win in a landslide. Paul has been super dominant but no one is giving him an MVP award over Durant doing 27/5/8 on 68 TS%.

[ShawkFactory]

LeBron stan logic: Playing worse than Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Davis = playing like he's the best player in the league.
Lebron isn't playing "worse" than anyone

[ArbitraryWater]

He is.

It is early, but Lebron hasn't been playing like a top 5 player. Russ, KD, AD, Harden, CP3 have all been better.

So now Paul has been better as well? Shut up, you troll

[Im Still Ballin]

Durant's not putting up 27/5/8

[game3524]

So now Paul has been better as well? Shut up, you troll

Paul has a higher TS%, PER, Winshare, and RAPM.

He has played like a top 5 player, you ****ing useless stan.:lol

[KiiiiNG]

Durant's not putting up 27/5/8
Good, because those rebounding numbers would be pathetic