Why did Nikos Galis never play for the Boston Celtics?

[R.I.P.]

Why? While checking the Sabonis/DRob stuff at youtube, I stumbled over his European Championship finals game in 87, where he singlehandidly put Greece over Sabonis/Russia with 40 pts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93qc8EzsohM

That was some awesome stuff and then I found out he was born in Jersey and a college star, who got drafted by the Celtics in 79 (??). Could have helped the Celtics a bit against the Lakers I guess. :confusedshrug: :confusedshrug:

[Put Back Dunk]

Thanks, Mr Manon: In the spring of 1979 Galis realised that the time had come for him to try and play in the NBA. But this big plan was ruined by the whims of his manager, Bill Manon, who may have ruined Galis' career but surely all Greeks are now grateful to him. Bill Manon was the agent of a few basketball players but mostly actors and artists, etc. Among those was the famous Diana Ross who had just launched her solo career away from her band "The Supremes". 'Upside Down' became a big hit and the agent started making money hand over fist, neglecting his then 22 year old Greek basketball player. So, from the first round of drafts, Galis found himself in the fourth with the number 68 and was picked by the Boston Celtics who had already chosen Larry Bird and wanted Galis just to make up the numbers. Galis tried to stay in the NBA but at the worst possible moment an injury left him out for 2 weeks and on his return, he found his place had been taken by Henderson.
LINK (http://www.interbasket.net/players/galis.htm)

[elementally morale]

One of those players that were VERY good by FIBA rules but would absolutely have been killed in the NBA. It was good both for him and the league he never had to embarrass himself. He was not like Drazen Petrovic. Different kid of player.

Imagine a very small Jordan with half the scoring, no defense, no passing, no rebounding, nothing. If there ever was a selfish ballhog, it was Gallis.

[Psileas]

Galis was drafted by the Celtics, but broke his leg during about the same period. He still was the last guy to get cut in the camp and Dan Peterson, who had signed for his cut admitted he was wrong a few years later, when he repeatedly torched his team (Tracer Milan) in the late 80's.


Imagine a very small Jordan with half the scoring, no defense, no passing, no rebounding, nothing. If there ever was a selfish ballhog, it was Gallis.

Ehmm, Galis was actually a very skilled passer, but as a matter of fact, he didn't pass as much as he could because he could shoot consistantly at a 60+% FG rate. Much like Jordan in the NBA. He did however lead the Greek Championship in assists 4 years in a row and holds the European Championship record with more assists in a game, with 23 or 25. His defense was not there, I agree, but let's not pretend that guys like Drazen or Oscar Schmidt knew what defense was. :)
Now, as far as rebounding goes, he was absent in defensive boards, but was actually quite a good offensive rebounder for his height (6'0''). Actually, he's grabbed about twice as many offensive rebounds as defensive.

[elementally morale]

I was very young when I saw Gallis play and his style of play disgusted me a lot. But I didn't like Petrovic either. I loved Kukoc and Divac, Marciulonis, Iowisha and to a lesser extent sabonis who was very good but a whiner.

On those Greek teams I enyojed Yannakis and Fasoulas. Gallis was the best player obviously but I hated his style. He was a razy volume shooter.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and Tkatchenko was a bum. He was as big as Mark Eaton with much of the same skillset. But much worse.

[xxxSuperStar]

I have two questions.

Is there a game today?
Did Larry Bird have any other nicknames other than "Legend?"

[gsafier]

Gallis wouldn't have made it in the NBA.
He was the kind of player that needs to be the star and he wouldn't have gotten it in the NBA, particularily not in the Celtics.
He wasn't really a PG and was too short to be a SG.
In the Greek team and Aris, as the star and with a super PG next to him in Yanakis, he thrived because the entire team was working for him (and he excecuted as good as any). But there is no way it would have worked like that in the NBA.

[Psileas]

I was very young when I saw Gallis play and his style of play disgusted me a lot. But I didn't like Petrovic either. I loved Kukoc and Divac, Marciulonis, Iowisha and to a lesser extent sabonis who was very good but a whiner.

Understood. As far as I know, you generally prefer players who did a little from everything than players who were excellent only in specific roles. I still don't know what Jovaisha is doing in this list, though.


On those Greek teams I enyojed Yannakis and Fasoulas. Gallis was the best player obviously but I hated his style. He was a razy volume shooter.

Same thing. But each one, like Galis, had his own weaknesses. Giannakis at times was taking some out-of-logic shots and was a bit too emotional. Fassoulas was long, but a little raw offensively (didn't have a shot, couldn't dribble more than once and rarely passed).

[Psileas]

EDIT: Oh yeah, and Tkatchenko was a bum. He was as big as Mark Eaton with much of the same skillset. But much worse.

Kind of. But he was out of his prime. In 1979 he was voted player of the year and was pretty reliable.


In the Greek team and Aris, as the start and with a super PG next to him in Yanakis, he thrived because the entire team was working for him (and he excecuted as good as any).

Galis played without Giannakis from 1980 to 1983 and in 1993. He averaged close to 38 ppg in the first 4 years and 23.7 in 1993, at the age of 35-36, while leading the league in assists.

[gsafier]

Galis played without Giannakis from 1980 to 1983 and in 1993. He averaged close to 38 ppg in the first 4 years and 23.7 in 1993, at the age of 35-36, while leading the league in assists.[/QUOTE]

He was averaging 38 ppg in Eurpean early 80's game? I would like to see the source for these stats.

[Psileas]

He was averaging 38 ppg in Eurpean early 80's game? I would like to see the source for these stats

http://www.geocities.com/nikosgalis/stats.html

(It has some mistakes , but the 1st years' stats are correct, except maybe in 1980)

In Greece he scored

1980: 692 in 19 games (other sources say 742 in 26), not sure which is correct.
1981: 1143 in 26
1982: 828 in 22
1983: 869 in 24 (missed 2 due to suspension).

As far as Europe goes, I based my numbers only on books I've read: In 1980, he wasn't allowed to play. In 1981, he played 6 games and had 2 50+ point games, the second against Spencer Haywood's Caserta. In 1982, he played 6 games and had 42 and 48 against Limoges. In 1983 he played 4 games and one of them was a 42-point game against Roma and Larry Wright (played for the NBA Champions, Bullets).

[elementally morale]

Understood. As far as I know, you generally prefer players who did a little from everything than players who were excellent only in specific roles. I still don't know what Jovaisha is doing in this list, though.



Same thing. But each one, like Galis, had his own weaknesses. Giannakis at times was taking some out-of-logic shots and was a bit too emotional. Fassoulas was long, but a little raw offensively (didn't have a shot, couldn't dribble more than once and rarely passed).

They all had weaknesses. I don't think that Greek team had very good players. They were a great, emotional team. Fasoulas actually was crap, but I like how goofy he looked on the court. Giannakis (also known as Yannakis... the Greek alphabet is strange...) was also funny looking with his nose 5 times the size if Manu Ginobili's. Wasn't a great player but a warrior, clutch, heart... and great from the distance. Like Christodoulu. Old times.

Iowaisha wasn't that good but... I don't know. Back then I liked funny looking players. :oldlol:

[elementally morale]

Kind of. But he was out of his prime. In 1979 he was voted player of the year and was pretty reliable.

I was 5-6 years old in 1979 and didn't watch TV other than cartoons. :oldlol: I started watching basketball in 1980.

Do you know what happened to Tkatchenko later on? Sad story.

[Psileas]

Do you know what happened to Tkatchenko later on? Sad story.

If you imply that he died, you're probably wrong. I think you are mistaking him with Pankrashkin (not sure about the spelling) here, because they were both 7-footers and had a mustache. I think Pankrashkin died due to a disease (tuberculosis?).


They all had weaknesses. I don't think that Greek team had very good players. They were a great, emotional team. Fasoulas actually was crap, but I like how goofy he looked on the court. Giannakis (also known as Yannakis... the Greek alphabet is strange...) was also funny looking with his nose 5 times the size if Manu Ginobili's. Wasn't a great player but a warrior, clutch, heart... and great from the distance. Like Christodoulu. Old times.

The Greek team lacked depth these days. These 4 guys were the only good players they had and it wasn't rare for them to play 40 minutes in multiple games. No bench though and no PF in general.

[elementally morale]

He didn't die. Make a google search on him. You'll see pictures, too.

[Psileas]

What's the sad story you were talking about?

EDIT: Talking about deaths: Is Bob Morse (the Varese legend) dead? Some friend told me so, but I haven't found any info to confirm this.

[gsafier]

http://www.geocities.com/nikosgalis/stats.html

(It has some mistakes , but the 1st years' stats are correct, except maybe in 1980)

In Greece he scored

1980: 692 in 19 games (other sources say 742 in 26), not sure which is correct.
1981: 1143 in 26
1982: 828 in 22
1983: 869 in 24 (missed 2 due to suspension).

As far as Europe goes, I based my numbers only on books I've read: In 1980, he wasn't allowed to play. In 1981, he played 6 games and had 2 50+ point games, the second against Spencer Haywood's Caserta. In 1982, he played 6 games and had 42 and 48 against Limoges. In 1983 he played 4 games and one of them was a 42-point game against Roma and Larry Wright (played for the NBA Champions, Bullets).

I didn't know that. I remembered Galis as a shoot-first-and-pass-never player.
But if he put up these stats (and apparently could pass to) then too bad for the Celtics, he would have made a great instant offence from the bench.

Thinking about it Galis could be one of the best 3 who never played in the NBA (together with Oscar Schmidt and Deja Bodiroga).

[elementally morale]

I didn't know that. I remembered Galis as a shoot-first-and-pass-never player.

Same here. He could pass if he tried, but he actually never tried, not even when triple-teamed. I've never seen anyone that selfish.

[Psileas]

Thinking about it Galis could be one of the best 3 who never played in the NBA (together with Oscar Schmidt and Deja Bodiroga).

Yeah, and among the older guys, I also think Sergei Belov could have some success, along with Krezimir Cosic (who was drafted by the Lakers, I think). Cosic was really smart, like a previous generation's Divac. But he wouldn't play much for Kareem's Lakers obviously.
And finally, I want to mention Drazen Dalipagic. He made some practices with the Celtics and his shooting touch impressed Red Auerbach so much that he introduced him to John Havlicek and presented him as his successor! I don't know how well he would have fared, but he didn't play for a simple reason: If he became professional, he'd lose the right to play for Yugoslavia National Team (according to the FIBA rules back then).


Same here. He could pass if he tried, but he actually never tried, not even when triple-teamed. I've never seen anyone that selfish.

Not even #24? :D

[elementally morale]

Not even #24? :D

Kobe in his worst quarters is like Gallis was his whole life. But Gallis is even more like a hyperbole of Iverson on his worst days.

[Psileas]

Kobe in his worst quarters is like Gallis was his whole life. But Gallis is even more like a hyperbole of Iverson on his worst days.

I found his FG numbers in the Greek Championship from 1986-87 and on (before then, they weren't available). The 1st number represents 2-pointers, the 2nd 3-pointers and the number in parenthesis is games played:

1987: 277-395, 12-28 (18)
1988: 253-401, 3-13 (18)
1989: 227-373, 15-35 (17)
1990: 334-496, 9-31 (22)
1991: 286-431, 14-29 (26)
1992: 130-206, 16-33 (15)
1993: 210-352, 6-18 (26)
1994: 207-340, 5-17 (26)
1995: 3-3, 0-0 (1)

The NBA is obviously a much different level, but Iverson never was among the most efficient scorers in the game. Galis was always among the FG% (and FT%) leaders. So, they're not really analogous.

[elementally morale]

I meant the number of shots compared to his teammates' # of shots. Not the efficiency.

[artificial]

Do you know what happened to Tkatchenko later on? Sad story.
I'm curious on what happened. Did a quick google but apparently Tkatchenko is a pretty common last name, even in basketball. And for some reason it even gave me images of melo when image searching "Tkatchenko basketball".

[Psileas]

His name was Vladimir.
I'm not sure what Morale had in mind.

[Nikos1982]

Psileas

Do you have ARIS Team Stats during the Galis years by any chance? Like Team PPG, %'s etc...?

I can't seem to find any stats on Greek League history, even the ones you posted I cannot seem to locate.

Any ideas?

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Psileas

Do you have ARIS Team Stats during the Galis years by any chance? Like Team PPG, %'s etc...?

I can't seem to find any stats on Greek League history, even the ones you posted I cannot seem to locate.

Any ideas?

I know Galis was averaging around 37-40 points per game during his prime years. That's really something since the games are 40 minutes.

[Nikos1982]

Year PPG 2ptFG% FG% FG Attempts Per Game
1987 39.7 0.701 .683 23.5
1988 37.4 0.6300 .618 23
1989 37.7 0.608 .593 24
1990 38.8 0.673 0.651 23.95
1991 35.3 0.663 0.652 17.69
1992 32.1 0.631 0.611 15.93

Yeah these were his PPG while at Aris during the listed seasons.

I just can't seem to find what Areis Team PPG for these and surrounding seasons when Galis played for them.

At Seton Hall his Senior year he averaged 27.5ppg on 57% shooting, while his team only averaged 77.5ppg.

That's nearly 36% of his teams total PPG! Not to mention the rest of his team shot 43% combined without factoring in his shooting percentage.

I sort of want to see if he was as dominant at Aris as he was Seton Hall. I bet he was probably a little bit more dominant, but I want to know statistically how much.

[Nikos1982]

I checked most of Goggle and can't seem to find any other meaningful stats other than these.

It does seem the competition was weak in the early 80's, but even as it got better Galis always put up great numbers efficiently. Even against excellent International competition like 1987 and 1989. It seems he did better against International Teams then against Euroleague teams -- but it could be coincidence. Not like the Euroleague playoffs and Final four in his days were played in terms of best of 5 or 7 series.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

I checked most of Goggle and can't seem to find any other meaningful stats other than these.

It does seem the competition was weak in the early 80's, but even as it got better Galis always put up great numbers efficiently. Even against excellent International competition like 1987 and 1989. It seems he did better against International Teams then against Euroleague teams -- but it could be coincidence. Not like the Euroleague playoffs and Final four in his days were played in terms of best of 5 or 7 series.

The Greek League was the best domestic league in Europe during the era when Galis played in Panathinaikos. And even then in his mid 30s he put up about 12-15 points per game more than Dominique Wilkins did playing at the same team, and around the same age and era, when the league was the best domestic one in Europe.

And NBA fans always make the claim the Wilkins was "completely washed up" and "could no longer play in the NBA" when he played with Panathinaikos. That's not true because after he left Panathinaikos he averaged 18 points per game in the NBA. And Galis was averaging a lot more points in Greece than Wilkins was.

[Nikos1982]

The Greek League was the best domestic league in Europe during the era when Galis played in Panathinaikos. And even then in his mid 30s he put up about 12-15 points per game more than Dominique Wilkins did playing at the same team, and around the same age and era, when the league was the best domestic one in Europe.

And NBA fans always make the claim the Wilkins was "completely washed up" and "could no longer play in the NBA" when he played with Panathinaikos. That's not true because after he left Panathinaikos he averaged 18 points per game in the NBA. And Galis was averaging a lot more points in Greece than Wilkins was.

Which year was this?

http://www.geocities.com/nikosgalis/pao1.html

1992-1993: 21.8ppg

1993-1994: 18,8ppg

In 1993-1994 season, he was once again the tournaments top scorer, averaging 23,9 ppg and also was first in passing, dishing 5,9 assists per game. We led Panathinaikos in in the final four, that was meant to be his last one, where he scored 8 points against Olympiacos in a bad night for him and his team, and 30 points against Barcelona, in the third place game. Galis' stats in Europe with Panathinaikos: 1993-1994: Games 19, Points 454, ppg 23,9

[Nikos1982]

Wasn't the Greek League weak though back in the 80s? And Galis teams could never win a Euroleague Title.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Wasn't the Greek League weak though back in the 80s? And Galis teams could never win a Euroleague Title.

No. It was not weak in the late 80s. Before that it was but it was decent by the late 80s.

Italy
Soviet Union
Yugoslavia
Greece

those were the good leagues in that era

In the 1992 to about 2002 era the Greek League was clearly the best in Europe. So even around 1992-1993 it was the best league and Galis in his mid 30s was still dominating the league.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Which year was this?

http://www.geocities.com/nikosgalis/pao1.html

1992-1993: 21.8ppg

1993-1994: 18,8ppg

In 1993-1994 season, he was once again the tournaments top scorer, averaging 23,9 ppg and also was first in passing, dishing 5,9 assists per game. We led Panathinaikos in in the final four, that was meant to be his last one, where he scored 8 points against Olympiacos in a bad night for him and his team, and 30 points against Barcelona, in the third place game. Galis' stats in Europe with Panathinaikos: 1993-1994: Games 19, Points 454, ppg 23,9

You are right. It was his last season with Aris I am talking about. But still the point stands he was averaging over 30 when the Greek League was the best in Europe and he was in his mid 30s.

For comparison in 1994 19 per game at age 37 for Galis with PAO in the Greek League. Dominique Wilkins at age 36 averaged on the same team 18 per game in A1. Byron Scott on the same team at age 37 averaged 16 a game in A1.

I'm not sure on those numbers exactly but that's what I remember. All 3 of those seasons it was in the time when A1 was the premiere European domestic league. Galis was on another level as a scorer. The only guy comparable was Jordan. NBA fans are just totally ignorant on him, actually most fans outside Greece are. Europeans still try to argue Drazen was better but Galis was the best player of all times in Europe bar none.

He just played in Greece and really got zero exposure.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Nick Galis scoring stats

Greek A1 League

1980 28.5
1981 43.9
1982 37.6
1983 36.2
1984 41.2
1985 37.1
1986 39.3
1987 39.7
1988 37.4
1989 37.7
1990 38.8
1991 35.3
1992 32.1
1993 23.6
1994 19.0
1995 12.8

Greek Cup career

35.2 points per game

European cup

1992 32.3
1993
1994 23.9

European cup career

34.2 points per game

Greek National Team

1983 FIBA European Championship 33.0
1986 FIBA World Championship 33.7
1987 FIBA European Championship 37.0
1989 FIBA European Championship 35.6
1991 FIBA European Championship 32.4

I can't find the other stats for the Euroleague. But he led the Euroleague in scoring 7 straight years.

In all of the listings above he was the leading scorer of the tournament. Yeah today if you lead the World Championship or European Championship in scoring NBA teams are all over you, not to mention leading the Euroleague in scoring 7 times in a row.

He is the all time leading scorer in the FIBA World Championship, the FIBA European Championship, the Euroleague, the Greek League, and the Greek Cup.

Oh and for those NBA fans that say he could not play in the NBA he scored 50 points against Jordan. Jordan was guarding him and Galis dropped 50 points on him.

[Nikos1982]

Yeah I know of those stats at the individual level, but I wanted to know what his teams were scoring back then. Cause at Seton Hall this guy scored 27.5ppg and his team was only getting 77.4PPG, and he was shooting 57% from the field, while the rest of his team was a combined 43% from the floor.

Thats an offensive scoring machine.

Galis must have been a better scorer then even a prime Byron Scott. Not that Byron was a slouch, but I can't imagine him as being as creative as Galis. Dominique in his prime is another story. Although he wasn't super creative off the dribble, he still was a dominant scorer who could run an offense. Galis seems like he had those characteristics.

Someone posted on the Seton Hall Forum that he outplayed Tiny Archibald in the 1979 Training Camp -- but a day before the cuts fractured his ankle. And the rest was history. Supposedly the Nets offered him a tryout, but he refused.

I'm thinking he could have been an excellent scorer with decent assist and playmaking skills. Maybe he could have been a better scoring version of Vinnie Johnson or something like an Isiah Thomas?

He had to have been an above average scoring talent even by NBA standards.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Yeah I know of those stats at the individual level, but I wanted to know what his teams were scoring back then. Cause at Seton Hall this guy scored 27.5ppg and his team was only getting 77.4PPG, and he was shooting 57% from the field, while the rest of his team was a combined 43% from the floor.

Thats an offensive scoring machine.

Galis must have been a better scorer then even a prime Byron Scott. Not that Byron was a slouch, but I can't imagine him as being as creative as Galis. Dominique in his prime is another story. Although he wasn't super creative off the dribble, he still was a dominant scorer who could run an offense. Galis seems like he had those characteristics.

Someone posted on the Seton Hall Forum that he outplayed Tiny Archibald in the 1979 Training Camp -- but a day before the cuts fractured his ankle. And the rest was history. Supposedly the Nets offered him a tryout, but he refused.

I'm thinking he could have been an excellent scorer with decent assist and playmaking skills. Maybe he could have been a better scoring version of Vinnie Johnson or something like an Isiah Thomas?

He had to have been an above average scoring talent even by NBA standards.

I saw prime Galis. The only other guy in history that compares is Jordan. And like I said Galis even scored 50 against Jordan when they played and Jordan was guarding him.

Galis was the leading scorer in the World Championship and Oscar Schmidt is 2nd. Galis could have averaged 30 in the NBA.

[Nikos1982]

I saw prime Galis. The only other guy in history that compares is Jordan. And like I said Galis even scored 50 against Jordan when they played and Jordan was guarding him.

Galis was the leading scorer in the World Championship and Oscar Schmidt is 2nd. Galis could have averaged 30 in the NBA.

I REALLY WISH I could see that game or at least a box score. I keep reading the same quote by Jordan rehashed, saying how he was surprised Greece had such a great scorer etc...

Did you actually see this game? Did you watch Aris in the early to mid 80s?

What was your appraisal of his game and his physical profile?

[Grinder]

I saw prime Galis. The only other guy in history that compares is Jordan. And like I said Galis even scored 50 against Jordan when they played and Jordan was guarding him.

Galis was the leading scorer in the World Championship and Oscar Schmidt is 2nd. Galis could have averaged 30 in the NBA.

Galis was great, but comparing him to Michael Jordan is laughable. Never again.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Galis was great, but comparing him to Michael Jordan is laughable. Never again.

Yeah right. Bob McAdoo and Audie Norris said he was one of the 2 or 3 best players they ever saw. I didn't compare him to Jordan either. I am saying the only other perimeter guy that could score like him was Jordan.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

I REALLY WISH I could see that game or at least a box score. I keep reading the same quote by Jordan rehashed, saying how he was surprised Greece had such a great scorer etc...

Did you actually see this game? Did you watch Aris in the early to mid 80s?

What was your appraisal of his game and his physical profile?

Galis was unstoppable. If you triple teamed him all game he could drop 40. His game was something like a combo of Stockton and Chris Paul but with a lot more ability to score the basketball.

[Nikos1982]

Galis was unstoppable. If you triple teamed him all game he could drop 40. His game was something like a combo of Stockton and Chris Paul but with a lot more ability to score the basketball.

He does sort of remind me of Chris Paul in terms of speed, size, and mannerisms on his drives.

Galis seems to me like a better athlete than Stockton, but I'm not sure he was as good as Chris Paul -- at least in terms of North/South Speed. Maybe Galis had better elevation on his J and could change speeds nearly as well as CP3?

I can't imagine that Galis could be as dominant a PG in the NBA as Paul is today. Paul is like a 6 foot Magic right now. Scoring and Passing as well as could be expected from a PG.

[Jinxed]

I saw prime Galis. The only other guy in history that compares is Jordan. And like I said Galis even scored 50 against Jordan when they played and Jordan was guarding him.


You love to twist the truth don't you. You're such a Euro homer and that's fine, but don't tell these little white lies, it just makes you look bad.

Galis in his prime scored 50 in losing effort. A blowout actually in an exhibition game against UNC. I can't find any other info on the game. So If Jordan really guarded him I don't know, if the game was taken seriously I don't know. But Jordan wasn't Michael Jordan then. He was 19.

[Grinder]

Yeah right. Bob McAdoo and Audie Norris said he was one of the 2 or 3 best players they ever saw. I didn't compare him to Jordan either. I am saying the only other perimeter guy that could score like him was Jordan.

Uh no. Kobe Bryant > Galis. Kobe is my last favorite player.


You love to twist the truth don't you. You're such a Euro homer and that's fine, but don't tell these little white lies, it just makes you look bad.

Galis in his prime scored 50 in losing effort. A blowout actually in an exhibition game against UNC. I can't find any other info on the game. So If Jordan really guarded him I don't know, if the game was taken seriously I don't know. But Jordan wasn't Michael Jordan then. He was 19.

Lmao, I didn't know it was against MJ's UNC team. Thanks for posting that. :oldlol:

Pretty much any substance in the MJ argument has been destroyed.

[Nikos1982]

Wasn't UNC pretty stacked in those days? With Worthy and Daughtery?

Just as an aside, Greek Basketball (at least there national team) was HORRIBLE in the 80s before Galis came to the scene. He alone revolutionized the country's basketball landscape.

Not much shame in losing to UNC considering how untalented the Greek team was back then.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

He does sort of remind me of Chris Paul in terms of speed, size, and mannerisms on his drives.

Galis seems to me like a better athlete than Stockton, but I'm not sure he was as good as Chris Paul -- at least in terms of North/South Speed. Maybe Galis had better elevation on his J and could change speeds nearly as well as CP3?

I can't imagine that Galis could be as dominant a PG in the NBA as Paul is today. Paul is like a 6 foot Magic right now. Scoring and Passing as well as could be expected from a PG.

Galis was more athletic than Paul and a better scorer. But they are very, very similar players.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

You love to twist the truth don't you. You're such a Euro homer and that's fine, but don't tell these little white lies, it just makes you look bad.

Galis in his prime scored 50 in losing effort. A blowout actually in an exhibition game against UNC. I can't find any other info on the game. So If Jordan really guarded him I don't know, if the game was taken seriously I don't know. But Jordan wasn't Michael Jordan then. He was 19.

Jordan was 20. And yes Jordan guarded him. They played against each other the year before. Galis scored I think about 25-30 against Jordan. After the game Jordan told Galis he was not good and could not play in the NBA.

So Galis remembered that. The next year, Jordan (age 20) played him again and guarded him again. Galis scored 50 on him. After the game Jordan stated that Galis was a complete player that could do everything on the court and that he was a superb level talent.

But of course YOU know more than Jordan does. The only homer here is you.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Wasn't UNC pretty stacked in those days? With Worthy and Daughtery?

Just as an aside, Greek Basketball (at least there national team) was HORRIBLE in the 80s before Galis came to the scene. He alone revolutionized the country's basketball landscape.

Not much shame in losing to UNC considering how untalented the Greek team was back then.

Ignore those guys. They think scoring 50 points in a 40 minute game on a college team of that level is laughable. They are probably THE definition of why NBA fans have a bad name everywhere in the world outside the US.

Players on that UNC team that played in the NBA included:

Michael Jordan
Kenny Smith
Joe Wolf
Sam Perkins
Brad Daugherty
Dave Popson

Scoring 50 points on that UNC team in a 40 minute game is something only a very handful of players could do.

[Jinxed]

Lakers fan,

do you have a link with more info about the game?

[Nikos1982]

I really wish there was more info on that Galis vs UNC games. I really wanted to see the boxscore or highlights.

As for the Chris Paul, it seems Galis has a better vertical on his jumpshot. But Paul probably has the quicker hands and superior playmaking skills to go along with his excellent scoring. He has developed into an out of this world PG. He is an elite NBA player who can score, pass, assist, and create turnovers. I have a hard time imagining Galis would be better than CP3 is now, but I do think he had all star type of talent.

Then again I think Chris Paul is better than any PG not named Magic Johnson in recent NBA history.

It does seem that Galis could have an excellent scorer even in the NBA. I am thinking he would be something like a more efficient and better passing Gilbert Arenas if he played in todays game? Maybe not considered a superstar, but an allstar who can score with the best of them.

Had he played in the 80s? Who knows, he might be at Isiah Thomas type of level? Isiah played great when the playoffs came and wasn't really a dominant regular season player. So Galis might have had a chance at being a multiple all star caliber PG.

I have searched all over for info on Galis, but I can only seem to find the stats in the link I posted earlier in this thread. Along with the same quotes from Norris, Mcadoo and MJ at UNC.

I wonder if he was turnover prone for Seton Hall or Aris. If he wasn't that speaks even more volumes about the dominance of his game his Senior year at Seton Hall and in Greece.

Doesn't seem to be too much info though.

[Nikos1982]

BTW where is Psileas, the guy who posted earlier in this thread. He seemed to know a lot about him and I can't PM him or get him to rejoin this thread. Maybe he has more stats and info?

[Nikos1982]

Lakas I noticed some of the boxscores in the Euroleague Semis and Galis seemed to do relatively poorly. Why is that? Poor supporting cast? His stats in his career are ridiculously good in terms of output AND %'s.

Just bad games?

[Nikos1982]

Just realized on Youtube the other day after watching some Retro NBA highlights.

If I had to compare Nick Galis to any successful NBA player in terms of style it would have to be Kevin Johnson.

Strong Penetrator, Strong Scorer, Good Elevation on Jumper, Good at Creating for Others and For Self.

Kevin Johnson had more of a vertical than Galis and was faster -- but Galis might have been a more crafty scorer and had better change of speed and hesitation moves to score with one on one.

Both were about 6 feet tall and were able to elevate suddenly and shoot over the defender.

[Nikos1982]

Whatya think Lakas? Good comparison?

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Whatya think Lakas? Good comparison?

Sure it's pretty good. But Galis had a 40 inch vertical so I'm not sure about KJ jumping higher.

[Nikos1982]

Sure it's pretty good. But Galis had a 40 inch vertical so I'm not sure about KJ jumping higher.

Was it really that high? I guess it could have been, but I have only seen his games from 1987 and on -- maybe it was more apparent in his earlier playing days for which their seems to be little highlights of.

I guess watching KJ dunk over Olajuwon made it seem like he had more HOPS than Galis, although he was hardly a slouch in that department. One jumper I saw from Galis the other day reminded me of KJ's when he went off the dribble and went really high, and was even somewhat off balance, but still in control.

BTW

How tall was Galis? Was he closer to 5-11 then 6-1? It listed him as 185Ibs, but he looks heavier than that. He seemed to have big legs and shoulders (similiar build to Vinnie Johnson). I would guess he was closer to 200Ibs and probably 5-11ish barefoot. Seem accurate?

[Lakas Fan Yo]

http://www.arisbc.gr/index.php?SCREEN=page&PageID=927&menu=6&submenu=52&LangID=2

As you can see, the games were very low scoring just like now. So that is a total MYTH that his stats were inflated.

[chitownsfinest]

Jordan was 20. And yes Jordan guarded him. They played against each other the year before. Galis scored I think about 25-30 against Jordan. After the game Jordan told Galis he was not good and could not play in the NBA.

So Galis remembered that. The next year, Jordan (age 20) played him again and guarded him again. Galis scored 50 on him. After the game Jordan stated that Galis was a complete player that could do everything on the court and that he was a superb level talent.

But of course YOU know more than Jordan does. The only homer here is you.
Link?

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Was it really that high? I guess it could have been, but I have only seen his games from 1987 and on -- maybe it was more apparent in his earlier playing days for which their seems to be little highlights of.

I guess watching KJ dunk over Olajuwon made it seem like he had more HOPS than Galis, although he was hardly a slouch in that department. One jumper I saw from Galis the other day reminded me of KJ's when he went off the dribble and went really high, and was even somewhat off balance, but still in control.

BTW

How tall was Galis? Was he closer to 5-11 then 6-1? It listed him as 185Ibs, but he looks heavier than that. He seemed to have big legs and shoulders (similiar build to Vinnie Johnson). I would guess he was closer to 200Ibs and probably 5-11ish barefoot. Seem accurate?

Galis was 6-0 barefoot and 6-1 in shoes. I am not sure about his weight, but he was known for being incredibly strong for his size, being able to bench press 400 pounds.

[Carter_17]

I am tired of all those European people that think top players from their leagues could be star player for an NBA team. I am from Greece and i have heard lots of times that Galis and other famous Greek players could easily play on NBA. But all those people cant understand that all star NBA players except from their clutch,passing, shooting , etc skills are great athletes too. I will tell u some of reasons that most of those european stars couldn't be more than a bench warmer for any NBA team (of course there are expectetions like Dirk,Gasol,Divac etc:

1. NBA teams play at least 82 (48 minutes game) games per season while european players are ultra tired and easily injured after 30-40 40 minutes games ( Some of them deny to play with their National team too ). And when an NBA team goes to playoffs they train for 8-10 hours per day . Not to mention big shooters like R.Allen of G.Arenas who train their shooting 1-2 hours after the team training

2.90% NBA players are taller,stronger,faster than European. So yes Dirk or Gasol or Divac who are 6.10-7.2 and strong enough can compete Shaq , Howard and other big athletes. But Galis ... come on . Wasnt as fast and as other star playmakers like Stockton or Payton or as great shooter as them

3. You see those "great" defensive teams like Panathinaikos and say : "European defense is way better than any NBA defense" and you dont mention that European leagues aint use the 3 sec defense rule and the referies wishl rediculous fouls. T.Duncan played for USA team once and he had 3 fouls on like 2 minutes or something

So think about them the next time u say that galis or somebody else could be as good as M.J or Kobe... Maybe he would bring them the water or clap them for playing good from the bench

P.S as i said before i am European citizen but still think that European basketball is some classes below NBA mostly cause of people that manage it and take decisions about it

[Lakas Fan Yo]

I am tired of all those European people that think top players from their leagues could be star player for an NBA team. I am from Greece and i have heard lots of times that Galis and other famous Greek players could easily play on NBA. But all those people cant understand that all star NBA players except from their clutch,passing, shooting , etc skills are great athletes too. I will tell u some of reasons that most of those european stars couldn't be more than a bench warmer for any NBA team (of course there are expectetions like Dirk,Gasol,Divac etc:

1. NBA teams play at least 82 (48 minutes game) games per season while european players are ultra tired and easily injured after 30-40 40 minutes games ( Some of them deny to play with their National team too ). And when an NBA team goes to playoffs they train for 8-10 hours per day . Not to mention big shooters like R.Allen of G.Arenas who train their shooting 1-2 hours after the team training

2.90% NBA players are taller,stronger,faster than European. So yes Dirk or Gasol or Divac who are 6.10-7.2 and strong enough can compete Shaq , Howard and other big athletes. But Galis ... come on . Wasnt as fast and as other star playmakers like Stockton or Payton or as great shooter as them

3. You see those "great" defensive teams like Panathinaikos and say : "European defense is way better than any NBA defense" and you dont mention that European leagues aint use the 3 sec defense rule and the referies wishl rediculous fouls. T.Duncan played for USA team once and he had 3 fouls on like 2 minutes or something

So think about them the next time u say that galis or somebody else could be as good as M.J or Kobe... Maybe he would bring them the water or clap them for playing good from the bench

P.S as i said before i am European citizen but still think that European basketball is some classes below NBA mostly cause of people that manage it and take decisions about it


Galis always played the entire 40 minutes of every game. You clearly have never seen Galis play.

[Nikos1982]

Where do you get this info from Lakas? 400 pounds bench press is very good for his size assuming he was about 190-200Ibs. In his book it says he squatted 360 kilos? But that can't be right, Ronnie Coleman can do that for 2 reps , thats over 750Ibs! Do you think the book meant 360Ibs, because it said he looked like he could have done more.....

I actually own a book with Galis but its in Greek and although I understand some Greek, it is a bit advanced for me considering I didn't grow up speaking Greek in my house.

Galis to me looks like a better scorer than Stockton Carter_17. Stockton might have been a better defender and playmaker for his teamattes, but I would have to think Galis was simply a better scorer on ANY level than Stockton. In terms of speed I would say Galis was faster. Although Galis was not the fastest player in a straight line -- he changed speeds very well and had strength and enough craftiness to score at a high level against any competition. But Im not sure he could compete with Stockton in the assist department, because his best strength was scoring.

Although Bob Mcadoo did dominate as well in the International game, he was still a solid contributor for a title Laker team in the 80s. So even though many rotational NBA players came over and dominated overseas, they didn't do so at the same level of Galis. And that alone makes me think Galis could be an excellent NBA player. Maybe not elite or a an all star every year, but with the right luck he could make a few all star games and be rated very highly as an NBA guard.

He clearly was on a similiar or better level then guys like Petrovic and Sarunas Marcilonis, who were clearly above average 2 guards in the league. Petrovic was third team all NBA and probably had room for improvement had he not tragically died.

Although I don't think he could have make a Chris Paul like impact, he could probably have gotten 20ppg+ 6apg+ if he landed on the right team and was given a chance to shine......

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Where do you get this info from Lakas? 400 pounds bench press is very good for his size assuming he was about 190-200Ibs. In his book it says he squatted 360 kilos? But that can't be right, Ronnie Coleman can do that for 2 reps , thats over 750Ibs! Do you think the book meant 360Ibs, because it said he looked like he could have done more.....

I actually own a book with Galis but its in Greek and although I understand some Greek, it is a bit advanced for me considering I didn't grow up speaking Greek in my house.

Galis to me looks like a better scorer than Stockton Carter_17. Stockton might have been a better defender and playmaker for his teamattes, but I would have to think Galis was simply a better scorer on ANY level than Stockton. In terms of speed I would say Galis was faster. Although Galis was not the fastest player in a straight line -- he changed speeds very well and had strength and enough craftiness to score at a high level against any competition. But Im not sure he could compete with Stockton in the assist department, because his best strength was scoring.

Although Bob Mcadoo did dominate as well in the International game, he was still a solid contributor for a title Laker team in the 80s. So even though many rotational NBA players came over and dominated overseas, they didn't do so at the same level of Galis. And that alone makes me think Galis could be an excellent NBA player. Maybe not elite or a an all star every year, but with the right luck he could make a few all star games and be rated very highly as an NBA guard.

He clearly was on a similiar or better level then guys like Petrovic and Sarunas Marcilonis, who were clearly above average 2 guards in the league. Petrovic was third team all NBA and probably had room for improvement had he not tragically died.

Although I don't think he could have make a Chris Paul like impact, he could probably have gotten 20ppg+ 6apg+ if he landed on the right team and was given a chance to shine......

No, he meant 800 pounds. His squat was about 800 and his bench press was about 400. BTW, I looked at some old Greek stuff and it seems his weight at that time I am talking about when he was lifting those amounts was about 195 pounds. He was a work out fanatic. That was what allowed him to jump high, hang in the air, drive in the lane, take contact, and finish the play. He was 6-0 barefoot but he was stronger than the 7 footers of the other teams and that was how he stayed playing inside all game long.

It was also how he played all those years and avoided injury problems. He also did insane amounts cardio training and running which allowed him to play 40 minutes in almost every game.

I think Galis could have had numbers very good numbers in the NBA. Petrovic and Marcuilionis both had very nice NBA numbers and Galis was an even better scorer than they were.

[Nikos1982]

Ronnie Coleman did 2 reps of 800lbs squats, I highly doubt Galis could do the same thing as Ronnie Coleman whos over 300 pounds of steroid induced muscle.

You sure this wasn't an exaggeration or misprint? I beleive Galis could do 400 pounds on the bench, but 800 pounds on the squat? Maybe 600 or 650, but 800 just doesn't sound right.

Even World Class Power Lifters can barely do 900lbs on the squat.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Ronnie Coleman did 2 reps of 800lbs squats, I highly doubt Galis could do the same thing as Ronnie Coleman whos over 300 pounds of steroid induced muscle.

You sure this wasn't an exaggeration or misprint? I beleive Galis could do 400 pounds on the bench, but 800 pounds on the squat? Maybe 600 or 650, but 800 just doesn't sound right.

Even World Class Power Lifters can barely do 900lbs on the squat.

Not only did his biography book state that was the weight, but his video biography which aired in Greece also stated it and even showed him lifting the weights. It was 2 reps of 400 on the bench and 6 reps of 750 on the squat. 800 was his max on the squat.

It was stated that Galis trained for 16 hours a day every day from 1979 to 1993. It was also said that this was led to his demise as he became a recluse and could not get along in social settings.

Keep in mind that Galis was named the 10th best athlete in the world in 1987, he was named the best European basketball player of the 1980s, and he was named the best athlete in the history of the Hellenic Republic, which has existed since 1821.

[Nikos1982]

Not only did his biography book state that was the weight, but his video biography which aired in Greece also stated it and even showed him lifting the weights. It was 2 reps of 400 on the bench and 6 reps of 750 on the squat. 800 was his max on the squat.

It was stated that Galis trained for 16 hours a day every day from 1979 to 1993. It was also said that this was led to his demise as he became a recluse and could not get along in social settings.

Keep in mind that Galis was named the 10th best athlete in the world in 1987, he was named the best European basketball player of the 1980s, and he was named the best athlete in the history of the Hellenic Republic, which has existed since 1821.

Lakas what is your email address, I would like to ask you some questions regarding Galis. I can't seem to Private Message anyone and Inside Hoops hasn't responded on this.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Lakas what is your email address, I would like to ask you some questions regarding Galis. I can't seem to Private Message anyone and Inside Hoops hasn't responded on this.

I'm not sure I want to give out my email address in a post on the board though........

[Nikos1982]

I'm not sure I want to give out my email address in a post on the board though........

Can you PM me?

[Nikos1982]

My email is

nikosgalis2009@yahoo.com

can you email me?

[Nikos1982]

Here is slightly more specific information on Galis not playing for the Celtics on The Draft Review


Nick Galis - But who is Nick Galis? If you're about to access your mental library in attempt to recall his the NBA career, I'll spare you the reference check. Galis didn’t play a minute in the league, but he is counted among the notables due to his legendary play in Greece. Galis is to Greece what Sabonis is to Lithuania and what Jordan is to America - the best player ever. He was born in New Jersey to Greek parents, but he was not an overnight prodigy. Galis developed through countless hours of practice. As a senior at Seton Hall he finished third in scoring in the nation, and is considered one of the school's best players. Yet despite his talent, Galis signed with an inexperienced agent who didn’t even have the player workout for any NBA teams. Given the opportunity for workouts, he more than likely would have seen late-first to mid-second round. After being selected by the Celtics, Galis was injured in training camp and limited him for two weeks. Celtics' GM Red Auerbach decided to cut Galis which opened up the opportunity for him to play overseas. The next 14 seasons were spent carving out a tremendous career highlighted by 5 Greek MVP awards, 8 Greek League Championships and 2 medals as a member of the Greek National team. Lastly, one has to take the word of the late Red Auerbach, one the best ever evaluators of talent in the business of basketball. He mentioned cutting Galis as one of his biggest mistakes.

http://www.thedraftreview.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=6035&Itemid=115

By Matt Maurer



PS LAKAS can you email me?

[Nick Young]

He was drafted 68th overall