Which player changes Lebron

[Big164]

For example: Karl Malone

[PeroAntic]

Without Kyrie he doesnt bring Cleveland a title after a gazillion years beating a 73 win team in the process coming down from 3-1. thats his legacy and he doesnt have it without Kyrie

[Big164]

Without Kyrie he doesnt bring Cleveland a title after a gazillion years beating a 73 win team in the process coming down from 3-1. thats his legacy and he doesnt have it without Kyrie
Kyrie is Huge for sure. Kyrie almost offsets the loss to Dirk in 2011. I think Kyrie and and Dirk have an equal but opposit affect.

[SouBeachTalents]

Klay's Game 6 in OKC literally affected the entire conclusion of LeBron's career. Without that, the entire basketball landscape is completely different. Durant & Kyrie more than likely are on different teams than they are now, and there's a very good chance LeBron himself might be somewhere else now too. I think I'd honestly go with Klay

[sbw19]

Wade.

[NBASTATMAN]

KD for sure.. If he doesnt join GSW .. Lebron has more titles and Kyrie is still in Cleveland with Bron..

Kyrie is like MJ's Pip or Kobe to Shaq.. Kyrie and Lebron fit very well together. He wont ever find another player like Kyrie to fit along side his set of skills.. Well beside KD..

[MrFonzworth]

The obvious answer here is LeBron James.

[And1AllDay]

Scottie Pippen

because then Jordan would still be trying to make it out of the first round and LeBron would be the clear-cut consensus goat even 3baLLLLLLwould not be able to deny it

2ez

[jstern]

Tim Duncan, Steph Curry, Kevin Durant and Dirk don't really affect Lebron's legacy, because with the East being so weak, the real NBA championship is the Western Conference Finals. So chances are that Lebron still would lose regardless of who came out of the West. If the Rockets beat the Warriors last year, same outcome for the Cavs.

Ray Allen pretty much stole a sure championship a few seconds away from the Spurs winning it all after a Lebron miss. The outcome of that would had been terrible for Lebron.

Kyrie, hmm, that's a good one too. But the Cavs also got a lot of help from suspensions, injuries, so it wasn't a full force Golden State team. Though without Kyrie they would not have beaten Golden State, and it gives Lebron a big boost because the more casual, less knowledgeable fans, and the media will give him full credit.

Then again, Wade is one of the greatest shooting guards of all time. Without the colluding Lebron might not even have one championship. In a sense, with how lucky his team was with Kyrie and Ray, he could have easily, very easily been 1 for 9, take Wade out and he could have possibly been like 0 for 3.

[Rico2016]

Scottie Pippen

because then Jordan would still be trying to make it out of the first round and LeBron would be the clear-cut consensus goat even 3baLLLLLLwould not be able to deny it

2ez

:eek:

/THREAD

[sportjames23]

Duncan. He dropkicked Bron so hard, he made that nikka leave Miami and go back to Cleveland.

[Overdrive]

Klay's Game 6 in OKC literally affected the entire conclusion of LeBron's career. Without that, the entire basketball landscape is completely different. Durant & Kyrie more than likely are on different teams than they are now, and there's a very good chance LeBron himself might be somewhere else now too. I think I'd honestly go with Klay

This, posted it in the Klaythread already.

This is the single performance that changed the NBA for years.

[TheCorporation]

Scottie Pippen

because then Jordan would still be trying to make it out of the first round and LeBron would be the clear-cut consensus goat even 3baLLLLLLwould not be able to deny it

2ez


:roll: :roll:

[Mr.GOAT2408]

If it weren't for Kevin Durant then LeBron would probably be a lock to finish as the best SF of his era

He gets the slight nod now due to longevity but KD is right there and should be easily ahead when it's all said and done, so KD is my pick

He's also beat LeBron at his own game :lol didn't choke either, actually made it clear to objective basketball observers who the best player in the league was during their last 2 finals matchups

[TheCorporation]

If it weren't for Kevin Durant then LeBron would probably be a lock to finish as the best SF of his era

He gets the slight nod now due to longevity but KD is right there and should be easily ahead when it's all said and done, so KD is my pick

He's also beat LeBron at his own game :lol didn't choke either, actually made it clear to objective basketball observers who the best player in the league was during their last 2 finals matchups

Go to bed Kenny

[Phoenix]

Klay's Game 6 in OKC literally affected the entire conclusion of LeBron's career. Without that, the entire basketball landscape is completely different. Durant & Kyrie more than likely are on different teams than they are now, and there's a very good chance LeBron himself might be somewhere else now too. I think I'd honestly go with Klay

So you believe Durant still leaves the Thunder if they beat the Warriors and regardless of what happens in the finals?

[TheCorporation]

I vote Scottie Pippen for obvious reasons :roll:

[SamuraiSWISH]

Wade

Big brothered LeBron, taught him how to win, helped him win quick easy rings.

And KD, taking the same cheap easy route to rings but on steroids and forever kept LeBron from getting to the mountain top.

Reap what you sow I guess. Basketball karma.

[Objectivity]

:coleman:

How come so many players either prevented Lebrown from winning or saved him with impossible clutch shots :confusedshrug:

[FKAri]

:coleman:

How come so many players either prevented Lebrown from winning or saved him with impossible clutch shots :confusedshrug:
Because he plays against professional competitive ballers and makes his teammates better. :applause:

[Overdrive]

By saying Pippen you Lebron tards admit that Jordan is the GOAT, else Pippen's existence wouldn't affect him.

[sdot_thadon]

Michael Jordan. He wouldn't have all these imaginary finish lines he needs to cross to be appreciated for what he is.

2nd Kd. Obvious reasons. Without Kd going to the Warriors they probably split the finals series vs. Gs.

[Nikola_]

Walter Ray Allen

[TheCorporation]

By saying Pippen you Lebron tards admit that Jordan is the GOAT, else Pippen's existence wouldn't affect him.

I'm pretty sure you know why we choose Pippen.

Jordan would be still be stuck in the 1st round :lol

[Doranku]

Nobody has voted for Dirk? 2011 is far and away the biggest black mark on Bron's career.

[MJistheGOAT]

Negative: Dirk, KD, KG/Pierce
Positive: Wade, Allen, Kyrie

[Overdrive]

I'm pretty sure you know why we choose Pippen.

Jordan would be still be stuck in the 1st round :lol

Doesn't take away from the fact that you guys admitted Jordan being the GOAT.

[TheCorporation]

Doesn't take away from the fact that you guys admitted Jordan being the GOAT.

When did I say that? I can just as easily say to you

Doesn't take away from the fact that you guys admitted LeBron being the GOAT.

[Overdrive]

When did I say that? I can just as easily say to you

Doesn't take away from the fact that you guys admitted LeBron being the GOAT.

If Pippen's nonexistence changes Lebron's legacy, it means Jordan is infront of Lebron. Without Pippen he'd fall behind in the rankings. That hard to grasp?

Nothing in this thread indicates that anyone believes that Lebron is the GOAT.

[TheCorporation]

If Pippen's nonexistence changes Lebron's legacy, it means Jordan is infront of Lebron. Without Pippen he'd fall behind in the rankings. That hard to grasp?

Nothing in this thread indicates that anyone believes that Lebron is the GOAT.

Literally the only thing that saved Jordan's career is Pippen.

That does not mean he is the goat, are you just randomly trying to piece things together?

No one is ahead of LeBron (duh), but MJ is the closest thing.

[Overdrive]

Literally the only thing that saved Jordan's career is Pippen.

That does not mean he is the goat, are you just randomly trying to piece things together?

No one is ahead of LeBron (duh), but MJ is the closest thing.

If Jordan is behind Lebron, how does the absence of Pippen change Lebron's all time rank?

Logical explanation, please.

[Cali Syndicate]

If Ray Allen doesn't hit that 3, lebron's future IMO is vastly different. That final 5 minute stretch by Lebron was really bad and not sure mentally he overcomes letting that series slip through his hands, which was followed by the 2011 loss. The scrunity wouldve been huge.

[AirFederer]

Delonte West :cheers:

[Hey Yo]

Tim Duncan, Steph Curry, Kevin Durant and Dirk don't really affect Lebron's legacy, because with the East being so weak, the real NBA championship is the Western Conference Finals. So chances are that Lebron still would lose regardless of who came out of the West. If the Rockets beat the Warriors last year, same outcome for the Cavs.

Ray Allen pretty much stole a sure championship a few seconds away from the Spurs winning it all after a Lebron miss. The outcome of that would had been terrible for Lebron.

Kyrie, hmm, that's a good one too. But the Cavs also got a lot of help from suspensions, injuries, so it wasn't a full force Golden State team. Though without Kyrie they would not have beaten Golden State, and it gives Lebron a big boost because the more casual, less knowledgeable fans, and the media will give him full credit.

Then again, Wade is one of the greatest shooting guards of all time. Without the colluding Lebron might not even have one championship. In a sense, with how lucky his team was with Kyrie and Ray, he could have easily, very easily been 1 for 9, take Wade out and he could have possibly been like 0 for 3.
Typical Kobe kid response due to shooting a career 41% in the Finals against that weak East.

[Hey Yo]

Wade

Big brothered LeBron, taught him how to win, helped him win quick easy rings.

And KD, taking the same cheap easy route to rings but on steroids and forever kept LeBron from getting to the mountain top.

Reap what you sow I guess. Basketball karma.
How did Wade teach LeBron how to win by losing in 2011??

[Indian guy]

Nobody has voted for Dirk? 2011 is far and away the biggest black mark on Bron's career.

True, but LeBron didn't lose that Finals because Dirk had some amazing series. LeBron lost because of his own shockingly ordinary play.

The winner of this poll should be Ray Allen. Not only is LeBron guaranteed to have 1 less ring if not for Ray's shot, but LeBron also had a brutal last minute in that Game 6 that nobody would've forgotten had Miami lost.

None of the other options in this poll is the difference between having a ring and not having a ring.

Kyrie misses that shot and it's still a tie game with a minute left.

If Wade didn't exist LeBron would simply join a different talented team and win rings.

LeBron already had 3 rings and a consensus spot in the top 5 prior to KD joining GS.

Curry and TD had fine series' in '07, '14, '15, '17 and '18, but majority of these are lopsided series' where LeBron never really had a shot.

[the mesiah]

http://media.thehoopdoctors.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/mcclellan.jpg

[SouBeachTalents]

So you believe Durant still leaves the Thunder if they beat the Warriors and regardless of what happens in the finals?
Honestly bro, who the fck knows for sure :lol I didn't EVER think he'd go to the Warriors, even after the rumors started I thought it was bullshit, so just goes to show you never know for sure. My instinct is, if he does beat the Warriors, that decreases the odds he signs with them. If he stays in OKC, that's another question. They lose the Finals, I think he dips. They win the Finals, I think there's a good chance he still dips, he did not seem to enjoy having to share the rock with Westbrook. Which team he goes too, that's hard to say. He could still go to the Warriors, but he could've gone elsewhere like Boston or D.C.

Nobody has voted for Dirk? 2011 is far and away the biggest black mark on Bron's career.
Yeah, but 2011 honestly falls mostly on LeBron. Dirk deserves full credit for being a 4th quarter assassin, but that was far from some great performance he had in the Finals. LeBron being inconceivably passive and unassertive is why the Heat lost that series

[Overdrive]

True, but LeBron didn't lose that Finals because Dirk had some amazing series. LeBron lost because of his own shockingly ordinary play.

The winner of this poll should be Ray Allen. Not only is LeBron guaranteed to have 1 less ring if not for Ray's shot, but LeBron also had a brutal last minute in that Game 6 that nobody would've forgotten had Miami lost.

None of the other options in this poll is the difference between having a ring and not having a ring.

Kyrie misses that shot and it's still a tie game with a minute left.

If Wade didn't exist LeBron would simply join a different talented team and win rings.

LeBron already had 3 rings and a consensus spot in the top 5 prior to KD joining GS.

Curry and TD had fine series' in '07, '14, '15, '17 and '18, but majority of these are lopsided series' where LeBron never really had a shot.

If Kyrie doesn't exist the don't make it to G7. See 2015 for reference.

I thought about TD not existing before and I believe it would've given Lebron a bigger shot winning in '07. I think the Suns would've made it and they couldn't have held Lebron to 22 on 35%. If he had won in '07, '11 would've never happened.

So Duncan is a strong candidate.

[SamuraiSWISH]

Michael Jordan. He wouldn't have all these imaginary finish lines he needs to cross to be appreciated for what he is.

2nd Kd. Obvious reasons. Without Kd going to the Warriors they probably split the finals series vs. Gs.
Who isn’t appreciating LeBron? What are you crying about now?

The media had been static cling to his jock up until fairly recently. He could do no wrong. We all appreciate LeBron as a top 10 and for some top 5 all time great.

What else are we not grasping the level of appreciation for? :oldlol: him being lottery bound and destroying the Lakers young core?


How did Wade teach LeBron how to win by losing in 2011??
You know they answer to this, LeBron quit on the team because he was pouting not being the focal point or the best player on the floor. They should’ve won in 2011 ... it was Bron’s fault.

[Indian guy]

If Kyrie doesn't exist the don't make it to G7. See 2015 for reference.

But it's not that simple. If Kyrie didn't exist LeBron would've never been back in Cleveland to begin with.

[Phoenix]

Honestly bro, who the fck knows for sure :lol I didn't EVER think he'd go to the Warriors, even after the rumors started I thought it was bullshit, so just goes to show you never know for sure. My instinct is, if he does beat the Warriors, that decreases the odds he signs with them. If he stays in OKC, that's another question. They lose the Finals, I think he dips. They win the Finals, I think there's a good chance he still dips, he did not seem to enjoy having to share the rock with Westbrook. Which team he goes too, that's hard to say. He could still go to the Warriors, but he could've gone elsewhere like Boston or D.C.



True true. My guess is KD knew it was a flawed pairing but winning a championships may have bound them together. After what, 8 years together or whatever, he figured that was enough time to see what the ceiling of that partnership was. I have my doubts he joins the Warriors if he had beaten them but yeah, who really knows?

[Phoenix]

Hypothetical: Lebron stays in Miami and they retool on the fly. Wade has a bounceback of sorts( remember that team *nearly* went to the ECFs in 2016) and have Whiteside, Deng, Dragic surrounding the main core. Possible they compete for the 2015 title at least, considering the Cavs basically made it through the east with Love/Kyrie injured and took 2 games off the Warriors?

[Hey Yo]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]You know they answer to this, LeBron quit on the team because he was pouting not being the focal point or the best player on the floor. They should

[sdot_thadon]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]Who isn

[SamuraiSWISH]

I'm not sure you're totally appreciating the irony of a Mj groupie making the statement you did there. Mj had just as much if not more media adulation in a time where the media was a fraction of what it's grown to currently. There wasn't anything to destroy the Lakers sucked before he got there and continued to suck once injuries and all the drama took it's toll. They looked like they could make some noise just before he got injured, shit happens. And make no mistake buddy I don't cry about anything i just call it like i see it.
Aye Gloria ... you didn

[sdot_thadon]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]Aye Gloria ... you didn

[jstern]

Typical Kobe kid response due to shooting a career 41% in the Finals against that weak East.

But I'm not a Kobe kid.

Does it not make sense that the two best teams generally play in the Western Conference Finals?

Look at the 2009 Eastern Conference Finals. Not only did Cleveland lose, but they lost to freaking Dwight Howard and the Orlando Magics. What kind of a joke conference is that?

[TheCorporation]

You didn't answer my question about what you claimed, fake coach.

How did Wade teach LeBron how to win by losing in 2011?

:eek:

[sdot_thadon]

How did Wade teach LeBron how to win by losing in 2011??
lowkey brilliant question. Inquiring minds would like an answer coach.

[TheCorporation]

lowkey brilliant question. Inquiring minds would like an answer coach.

Coach is too busy YouTubing MJ dunk highlights over 6'3 guards :lol

[sdot_thadon]

Coach is too busy YouTubing MJ dunk highlights over 6'3 guards :lol
I've observed that he's pretty good at ducking well aimed responses and pretending not to see them.:lol

[TheCorporation]

You of all people don't want to take a conversation off the tracks :oldlol: don't go where yoh don't want to be seen fella.

:roll:


Oh coach...Stick to Jordan hype posts :lol

hE gOt sIx rInGs dOe


Cool, Russel has 11. Anything else?

[sportjames23]

LOL the meltdown continues. :oldlol:

[TheCorporation]

LOL the meltdown continues. :oldlol:

Scottie Pippen

[red1]

dwade and kyrie.



there's no team without teammates and going from mo williams and wally szcerbiak to dwade and kyrie irving -


there is such thing as a god. :applause:

[TheCorporation]

dwade and kyrie.



there's no team without teammates and going from mo williams and wally szcerbiak to dwade and kyrie irving -


there is such thing as a god. :applause:

:cheers:

[pauk]

Player? lol... but team? Yes, yeeep...

[Elosha]

True, but LeBron didn't lose that Finals because Dirk had some amazing series. LeBron lost because of his own shockingly ordinary play.

The winner of this poll should be Ray Allen. Not only is LeBron guaranteed to have 1 less ring if not for Ray's shot, but LeBron also had a brutal last minute in that Game 6 that nobody would've forgotten had Miami lost.

None of the other options in this poll is the difference between having a ring and not having a ring.

Kyrie misses that shot and it's still a tie game with a minute left.

If Wade didn't exist LeBron would simply join a different talented team and win rings.

LeBron already had 3 rings and a consensus spot in the top 5 prior to KD joining GS.

Curry and TD had fine series' in '07, '14, '15, '17 and '18, but majority of these are lopsided series' where LeBron never really had a shot.

This is the correct answer. Ray Allen's shot came down to deciding Lebron's fate in 2013, and it was decided by a fraction of a second. LeBron had not played well in the first four games of the series. To his credit he played much better in Game 5, and before his late fourth quarter failings in Game 6, he had put Miami on his back earlier in the fourth and pulled them close to even with the Spurs, who looked like they were running away with the game and the series going into the fourth quarter. And of course, we must give LeBron huge credit for a very strong OT in game 6, and his great Game 7. (To be fair, I think the Spurs were shellshocked after Ray Allen's shot, despite their veteran experience). LeBron was deservedly the Finals MVP in 2013.

Even still, all of that would have never come to fruition without Ray Allen's shot. Then the narrative would have been LeBron's failing to win again, his late fourth quarter mistakes, and his decidedly lesser overall stats (had they lost in game 6).

Of course Ray Allen's shot was itself not in isolation. It took the inexplicable decision from Gregg Popovich to take out his best interior defender/rebounder/best player, Tim Duncan, (in fact he took Duncan out twice in the last minute) when the Spurs absolutely needed a crucial rebound after LeBron's missed three. (Popovich is a all time great coach, but that boneheaded decision will forever be a black mark on his resume). And it also took Chris Bosh to still make a great rebound, and heads up pass to Ray Allen.

So perhaps Popovich and Bosh get second and third place for this inquiry...

[hiphopanonymous]

Tried to find Delonte on that list?

[imdaman99]

Scottie Pippen

because then Jordan would still be trying to make it out of the first round and LeBron would be the clear-cut consensus goat even 3baLLLLLLwould not be able to deny it

2ez
:roll: :roll: :roll:

This is why we stick around even though this forum is full of trolls, for entertainment.