We were all lied to...80s and 90s "physicality"

[SpaceJam2]

This is a great video examining the "physicality" of old school basketball. It looks at statistics pre and post "hand checking," it looks at spacing, it looks at zone defense, it looks at all these rules, and it looks at myths that are easily debunked. Enjoy everyone :cheers:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydOUbQqYb30&feature=youtu.be

[warriorfan]

Op gets all his basketball knowledge from either reading box scores on basketball reference or regurgitating nonsense from dweebs on YouTube


Extremely low iq

[SpaceJam2]

Op gets all his basketball knowledge from either reading box scores on basketball reference or regurgitating nonsense from dweebs on YouTube


Extremely low iq

Did you even watch the video ash boy?

[warriorfan]

Did you even watch the video ash boy?

No. You should try to develop your own takes for once instead of copy pasting shit.

[FireDavidKahn]

Op gets all his basketball knowledge from either reading box scores on basketball reference or regurgitating nonsense from dweebs on YouTube


Extremely low iq
Says the guy who does the exact same thing to defend Jordan:lol

[superduper]

Op gets all his basketball knowledge from either reading box scores on basketball reference or regurgitating nonsense from dweebs on YouTube


Extremely low iq

You literally just described every single Bran stan to a tee.

$tats DOE!! :mad: :mad:

[Hey Yo]

Did you even watch the video ash boy?
:roll:

[SpaceJam2]

No. You should try to develop your own takes for once instead of copy pasting shit.

Okay well let me give you a few tips to help prioritize
-clean up your ashy shoe box
-watch the video
-THEN respond

[Da_Realist]

REBUTTAL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nBRV0TKsxo

[FKAri]

REBUTTAL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nBRV0TKsxo
I don't really want to get into this troll war but I'd like to say just one thing. The NBA rule book has been ass since the inception of the league with rules either being poorly defined or impossible to actually implement. One can't judge how a game was being officiated going strictly off of what the rules said at the time.

[SpaceJam2]

In conclusion, the NBA rule book has been ass since the inception of the league with rules either being poorly defined or impossible to actually implement.

I can definitely agree with this. A lot of the rules are very vague.

[superduper]

REBUTTAL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nBRV0TKsxo

:eek: :eek:

[warriorfan]

Okay well let me give you a few tips to help prioritize
-clean up your ashy shoe box
-watch the video
-THEN respond

You have no job and post 60 times a day you are the last person to be talking about prioritization. :oldlol:

[jstern]

I saw that video a few weeks ago. To me it was truly one of the most ignorant videos that I had ever seen in my life. Like pure misleading news. Fake news.

Edit: The best comparison is politics, where the different parties, misleads, take things out of context, completely ignore facts that should be relevant that goes against their argument, puts it all in a nice package, and the sheep eats it completely. Shutting down their brains to obvious facts, like scoring going up and up, and the players themselves who have played in both era constantly talking about how much softer the rules have made the game.

In short, an intelligent person would see that the video does not add up, while a moron would eat it all up.

To me it's not the basketball aspect of the video, it's a disgusting video in the context of how easily it is to manipulate groups of people through the media.

Outside of basketball such manipulation leads to racism, wars, deaths, etc. The guy is basically taking a page out CNN's Fox, etc book.

[ronniec]

If you did watched the actual games in the 80's and 90's, you don't need to watch OP's link at all.

Oldies like me know exactly what it was back in the days.
It was a men's game at that time.
Now, a pu$$y league.

[Dray n Klay]

Did you even watch the video ash boy?
:roll:

[The Iron Fist]

Did you even watch the video ash boy?
Some of us actually were alive then and saw the games. We dont need a youtube video decades later to tell us what we saw.

[LostCause]

I didn't watch 80s ball live, but I did watch lots of 90s ball


So there's no need to watch a certainly biased YouTube video on how physical it was. It was a physical game, period. Which, at the time, only made it more fun to watch imo

That continued up until like 2004 or so. Then it became noticeably less physical, but still far and away better than what it's been the last few years. It's garbage now, quite frankly. Watching previously unprecedented offensive explosions night in/out got old

[iamgine]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTgfB6oJWuI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_n86uuVJpY

Here's a couple of random full playoff game from 1989 & 1990.

[SpaceJam2]

You have no job and post 60 times a day you are the last person to be talking about prioritization. :oldlol:

You silly little ashy shoebox boy. Did you follow the steps I gave you?

Step 1: clean up shoebox ash

Step 2: watch video

Step 3: THEN respond

[SpaceJam2]

I didn't watch 80s ball live, but I did watch lots of 90s ball


So there's no need to watch a certainly biased YouTube video on how physical it was. It was a physical game, period. Which, at the time, only made it more fun to watch imo

That continued up until like 2004 or so. Then it became noticeably less physical, but still far and away better than what it's been the last few years. It's garbage now, quite frankly. Watching previously unprecedented offensive explosions night in/out got old

You're actually the perfect candidate to watch this video. Especially if you think that you shouldn't watch it...

This video was made for people like you, not me. I already knew this stuff, you guys are living in the past with nostalgic bullcrap viewpoints.

[SpaceJam2]

Some of us actually were alive then and saw the games. We dont need a youtube video decades later to tell us what we saw.

Yeahhh...no


You're actually the perfect candidate to watch this video. Especially if you think that you shouldn't watch it...

This video was made for people like you, not me. I already knew this stuff, you guys are living in the past with nostalgic bullcrap viewpoints.

[SpaceJam2]

If you did watched the actual games in the 80's and 90's, you don't need to watch OP's link at all.

Oldies like me know exactly what it was back in the days.
It was a men's game at that time.
Now, a pu$$y league.

You're actually the perfect candidate to watch this video. Especially if you think that you shouldn't watch it...

This video was made for people like you, not me. I already knew this stuff, you guys are living in the past with nostalgic bullcrap viewpoints.

[LostCause]

You're actually the perfect candidate to watch this video. Especially if you think that you shouldn't watch it...

This video was made for people like you, not me. I already knew this stuff, you guys are living in the past with nostalgic bullcrap viewpoints.

Actually, you need the video, because you don't know the information presented in it yourself nor where it applies/where it doesn't.

The first 3-4 minutes of the video says exactly the same thing I just posted. I guess pictures make it easier for you? The game was more physical, and it continued to be physical until the last few years where that aspect of the game is basically being, if not already, taken away. Guy even flat out says the game was "without a doubt" more physical than it is now at about 12:52

The rest is just shit you hear in a typical debate (which doesnt happen here). People will support their side of it with information/data that confirms it, and ignore/dismiss what doesn't. He's countering "exaggerations". People who say players were killed on every possession, or that certain stars couldn't play back then due to the insane physicality etc. No one takes posts like that seriously anyway so the video doesn't do much for reasoned folks

I'd also add that his last points a bit off. Illegal D still exists in the NBA, he's presenting as if it doesn't. It's "Defensive 3 Seconds" (which by definition is Illegal Defense), it prevents zones from being played without limits. Zone with no limiters is what Jordan was referring to in the quote. For one of his examples he states that zone allows 2 bigs to be camping the paint to stop the drive - except Def 3 seconds specifically "stops" this, which is why you see so many drives where the perimeter player stalls until the big has to step out momentarily before making their move, with the big usually being 1 or 2 steps late back to the spot

Lastly, it must be said that many teams were known for blatantly playing zone defense even though it was "illegal" to do so. They got away with it most of the time as well.

[ronniec]

You're actually the perfect candidate to watch this video. Especially if you think that you shouldn't watch it...

This video was made for people like you, not me. I already knew this stuff, you guys are living in the past with nostalgic bullcrap viewpoints.

Dude, you said it.
The video WAS MADE for....

I watched hundreds of games back in the 80's, and hundreds of games in the 90's.
Do I really need a YouTube video to prove something that I already knew??

[The Iron Fist]

Yeahhh...no


You're actually the perfect candidate to watch this video. Especially if you think that you shouldn't watch it...

This video was made for people like you, not me. I already knew this stuff, you guys are living in the past with nostalgic bullcrap viewpoints.
Ive been watching the sport since the 80s. What is a video going to show me about games I seen live?

[305Baller]

we were lied to and now they must pay THE PRICE

[superduper]

Dude, you said it.
The video WAS MADE for....

I watched hundreds of games back in the 80's, and hundreds of games in the 90's.
Do I really need a YouTube video to prove something that I already knew??

You're arguing with someone who was definitely born after '97.

Arguing with the wall might be more productive.

[ronniec]

You're arguing with someone who was definitely born after '97.

Arguing with the wall might be more productive.

True, they need youtube to prove a point

[TheCorporation]

To all the old idiots in this thread that think they know something, watch the video.

Open your eyes, stop living in the past.

[superduper]

To all the old idiots in this thread that think they know something, watch the video.

Open your eyes, stop living in the past.

Bran stans in a fking nutshell :oldlol:

[LAmbruh]

Did you even watch the video ash boy?
:roll: :roll:

[TheCorporation]

Did you even watch the video ash boy?

:roll: :roll:

[Rico2016]

Did you even watch the video ash boy?
Shit

:roll: :roll:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Someone get that dope lasik surgery. If that doesn't work? Shock therapy.

Don't get how you can watch games from the 80s/90s and today but come to that conclusion.

Lied to? By who? Use your eyes. The game was more physical. Better? That's debatable and depends on what you deem "better". But physical? As in what fouls are now weren't fouls then? Handchecking? Packed paint? Less three's and more emphasis in the post and midrange (which means less spacing).

Absolutely.

[Nowoco]

People who make these videos have never played ball, never watched 80s/90s games and dont do any research besides whats on BR.

They bore me to tears.

[superduper]

Someone get that dope lasik surgery. If that doesn't work? Shock therapy.

Don't get how you can watch games from the 80s/90s and today but come to that conclusion.

Lied to? By who? Use your eyes. The game was more physical. Better? That's debatable and depends on what you deem "better". But physical? As in what fouls are now weren't fouls then? Handchecking? Packed paint? Less three's and more emphasis in the post and midrange (which means less spacing).

Absolutely.

If it's not a boxscore, they won't understand it

[egokiller]

People who make these videos have never played ball, never watched 80s/90s games and dont do any research besides whats on BR.

They bore me to tears.

Which is why their opinion only holds any value to someone trying to over compensate for themselves that never watched 80s/90s ball. Cringy lil bastards I tell ya.

[StrongLurk]

The 80's were only more physical based on what was a technical foul and what wasn't...however the 90's definitely had more physical defense then now...however defenses were also more simple in nature and guarded the paint more, leaving a lot of open shots 18 feet and out. Offenses were also a lot more simple and slower as well in the 90's.

The game is faster now due to different skillsets ALONG with how defense is played.

[ArbitraryWater]

I saw that video a few weeks ago. To me it was truly one of the most ignorant videos that I had ever seen in my life. Like pure misleading news. Fake news.

Edit: The best comparison is politics, where the different parties, misleads, take things out of context, completely ignore facts that should be relevant that goes against their argument, puts it all in a nice package, and the sheep eats it completely. Shutting down their brains to obvious facts, like scoring going up and up, and the players themselves who have played in both era constantly talking about how much softer the rules have made the game.

In short, an intelligent person would see that the video does not add up, while a moron would eat it all up.

To me it's not the basketball aspect of the video, it's a disgusting video in the context of how easily it is to manipulate groups of people through the media.

Outside of basketball such manipulation leads to racism, wars, deaths, etc. The guy is basically taking a page out CNN's Fox, etc book.

:roll:

fuming

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

:roll:

fuming

He's got a point.

Its insulting to people who've watched the game...going on decades now.

Think of an American whose never been to Germany. And them telling you what life is "REALLY" like out there. Cringe might not even describe that accurately :oldlol:

[brutalBBQ]

Watched the video
This is the evidence
Peirce and Rose score more points during hand checking era,
Stephen Jackson started 3 years prior to Lebron but talks like a 90s guy,
Picks a random Bulls game vs the Pistons and complains about the fouls on MJ and Pippen ,says they're not hard enough
Poorly attempts to construct an argument that illegal defense removal makes it harder to score and that's why we have so many 3 attempts. Doesn't mention defensive 3 seconds.
Thoroughly convincing, please post more videos that represent your opinions.

[Mr.GOAT2408]

People who make these videos have never played ball, never watched 80s/90s games and dont do any research besides whats on BR.

They bore me to tears.
Pretty sure this guy actually did, maybe even college. I've seen his stuff, he's a good content maker but this video was poorly researched and he ended up apologizing on the response video someone posted earlier in this thread

It literally defies logic the lengths these kids go to prop up this era. There were freak athletes like Wilkins and Dawkins, Kemp and Malone, Robinson and Pippen, etc. so the better athlete argument is weak especially when some of the top players (Harden and Curry mainly) aren't even known for their athleticism. They like to use "better athletes" and while some of these recent dudes are something else (Giannis, Embiid, Zion) it's literally always been like this.

Handchecking allowed = more physical defense. Less 3s = less spacing. There weren't as many spot up shooters in those days (3ball was recent and seen as gimmicky) so it was often congested. They can point to no zone defense but teams don't implement zone all that much (I think the Heat led in like 10% and most teams used it 5% of the time) and thanks to almost every player in the lineup being a threat to shoot 3s there's enough space to where any shot creator can iso and still face only 1 defender, 2 max.

The fact that free throw % - the purest stat we have - has remained roughly the same throughout history is telling. Hovering at 75-77% since 1970 and only being below 70% before the 50s. That's despite better training

[SpaceJam2]

:roll:

fuming

Facts always hurt these guys to the core. All you have to do is post facts and they get hurt.

[egokiller]

Facts always hurt these guys to the core. All you have to do is post facts and they get hurt.

I see you finally wiped the tears away after watching the apologetic response video to build up enough confidence to shit post once again.

Your era sucks for basketball but it

[aj1987]

[QUOTE=Straight_Retard]I see you finally wiped the tears away after watching the apologetic response video to build up enough confidence to shit post once again.

Your era sucks for basketball but it

[LAmbruh]

And this **** keeps crying. :oldlol: :roll:

This era sucks for basketball, but yet, you have a dozen alts with tens of thousands of posts dedicated to it.
:roll: :roll:

[egokiller]

And this **** keeps crying. :oldlol: :roll:

This era sucks for basketball, but yet, you have a dozen alts with tens of thousands of posts dedicated to it.

No alts here, and the one account that I do have which is this one can be found posting in the lounge much more than in the NBA forum. :applause:

[warriorfan]

No alts here, and the one account that I do have which is this one can be found posting in the lounge much more than in the NBA forum. :applause:

:cheers:

[TheCorporation]

And this **** keeps crying. :oldlol: :roll:

This era sucks for basketball, but yet, you have a dozen alts with tens of thousands of posts dedicated to it.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[SpaceJam2]

And this **** keeps crying. :oldlol: :roll:

This era sucks for basketball, but yet, you have a dozen alts with tens of thousands of posts dedicated to it.

:roll: :roll:

[Manny98]

Oldheads are fuming :roll:

[SpaceJam2]

Oldheads are fuming :roll:

:lol YEP!

*State facts

Old heads: :rant :mad:

[ballinhun8]

To anyone who hasn't watched this video.



Its just a guys opinion
There's no stats brought up. No information. No data. No research.
Just a guy who spent 20 mins picking a random game from the early 90s.


Clickbait.

[Vino24]

imagine Ron Artest in the 80's and 90's. Jordan would get his ass whooped

[TheCorporation]

To anyone who hasn't watched this video.



Its just a guys opinion
There's no stats brought up. No information. No data. No research.
Just a guy who spent 20 mins picking a random game from the early 90s.


Clickbait.

So clearly you didn't watch the video :lol

He talks about stats and what the actual NBA rules are/were, which is information and data.

He compares the before and after effects of the hand checking rule by comparing before and after player production from every single all-star player in the league...

He gets actual quotes from players who talked about legal zone defense.

Watch the video this time and stop trying to guess what it's about or else you'll end up looking like a retard again.

[ballinhun8]

So clearly you didn't watch the video :lol

He talks about stats and what the actual NBA rules are/were, which is information and data.

He compares the before and after effects of the hand checking rule by comparing before and after player production from every single all-star player in the league...

He gets actual quotes from players who talked about legal zone defense.

Watch the video this time and stop trying to guess what it's about or else you'll end up looking like a retard again.



I watched the video moron.


Stop lying to people to try to get more views for this guy. His quotes are all over the place, he retrieves them and splices them from different interviews in which the answer wasn't even to the topic he created. There are players he left out purposely that didn't fit his narrative.

There are no credible statistics he puts up. Just his own word of mouth.


Stop trying to steal viewership from ISH to support this guy and his opinion. Its a conflict of interest and you will be reported! :mad:

[LostCause]

Wait, did the guy actually apologize for the video?

I mean given how garbage those stats he showed were, its the least he could do

[TheCorporation]

Why did the old heads lie to us? :(

[madmax]

lmao, so supposedly those ruthless and super physical 80's Pistons were called for a fouls by simply breathing on Jordan and every single touch foul was called in his favour afterall...:wtf: So much for the fake GOAT having to endure a beatdown after beatdown in the "real" era of basketball lmao:applause:

[SpaceJam2]

lmao, so supposedly those ruthless and super physical 80's Pistons were called for a fouls by simply breathing on Jordan and every single touch foul was called in his favour afterall...:wtf: So much for the fake GOAT having to endure a beatdown after beatdown in the "real" era of basketball lmao:applause:

:rockon: MJ fans are in complete shambles

[SpaceJam2]

Why did the old heads lie to us? :(

They're always trying to prop up their shit era :facepalm

[ballinhun8]

Thread was dead.


So what do you do? Bump it back up cuz you have nothing better to do.

[SpaceJam2]

Thread was dead.


So what do you do? Bump it back up cuz you have nothing better to do.

Weren't you the guy that didn't know the 2018-2019 season is considered the "2019" season :oldlol: :oldlol:

Keep up, I'm here to teach you more each day.

[GimmeThat]

and the fade away shot is a bad shot, but it helps maintain the rebounding position your front court secured

[brutalBBQ]

Special Jimmies 2 exposure come backs, even though the guy who made the video he's trying to base his opinion on made an apology video


They're always trying to prop up their shit era :facepalm

Meltdown

Fumming



Funny how you're begging for a response to debate but all you can comeback with is rubbish. Just take the L and move on.

[TheCorporation]

Special Jimmies 2 exposure come backs, even though the guy who made the video he's trying to base his opinion on made an apology video



Funny how you're begging for a response to debate but all you can comeback with is rubbish. Just take the L and move on.

Why do facts hurt?

[3ball]

.
No lies:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/4-20-2019/7nUFru.gif

https://i.makeagif.com/media/4-20-2019/Yqgljb.gif

https://i.makeagif.com/media/4-20-2019/bZ_Chf.gif

https://i.makeagif.com/media/4-20-2019/wckG3y.gif



Patrick Beverly defense was 100% legal and the STANDARD:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/4-20-2019/gPyYaV.gif

[TheCorporation]

This video tarnishes MJ myths once more :eek:

[eurobum]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nBRV0TKsxo

[brutalBBQ]

Why do facts hurt?

So opinions are facts now, I'll take that as a comment.

Seems the only ones hurting are the in the Bran Stan Klan.

[Phenith]

REBUTTAL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nBRV0TKsxo

It's not really a rebuttal so much as a clarification of the video posted by the OP, some points were shot down, but a lot of it was confirmed with more in-depth and detailed analysis.

This is definitely the video that should have been in the OP, a lot of good points on things that changed, the intentions behind the changes and how today's game compares to the "old" days when the rules encouraged a different style of play, as well as the things that haven't really changed despite perceptions.

[aj1987]

No alts here, and the one account that I do have which is this one can be found posting in the lounge much more than in the NBA forum. :applause:
Imagine being so much of a cowardly shit that you abandon an account on an anonymous message board, after LeBron won his 3rd. :oldlol:

[egokiller]

Imagine being so much of a cowardly shit that you abandon an account on an anonymous message board, after LeBron won his 3rd. :oldlol:

No one is abandoning an account for a guy that only won 3 rings. :facepalm
Makes no sense. That myth was already debunked. :sleeping

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=13649330&postcount=17

[aj1987]

No one is abandoning an account for a guy that only won 3 rings. :facepalm
Makes no sense. That myth was already debunked. :sleeping

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=13649330&postcount=17
The denial just makes it that much more worse. Do you shit your pants IRL, when a person just looks at you, coward?

[SpaceJam2]

The denial just makes it that much more worse. Do you shit your pants IRL, when a person just looks at you, coward?

:eek: :rockon: