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View Full Version : Trading Ben Simmons instead of Joel Embiid is a mistake



Ben Simmons 25
05-08-2019, 07:43 PM
First of all, let it be known... I am one of the biggest big men homers on the entire board, if not the biggest. kblaze knows this... those of you that have been around a really long time know this.

Secondly, it's pretty clear that Joel Embiid is a better player than Ben Simmons right now and it's not particularly close. Embiid is a monster on both ends of the floor in literally all aspects except for decision making around shooting too many threes... which he's gotten better at. But the right coach would fix that with the snap of his fingers.

That being said, if I am of the mindset that I *HAVE* to trade one or the other to get the most out of the guy I keep, I'm trading Embiid 10 times out of 10 because of health reasons. I was really hopeful... and he's been able to stay mostly healthy (for his standards) for the past two seasons, but he's just out too many games, and for him to consistently have sore knees at this young of an age, it's only a matter of time before he gets a career ending injury because his body isn't cut out for 82 games.

And it is pretty clear to me that currently, their games aren't complimentary, because Simmons can't shoot. However...

If you force me to pick one guy or the other, Embiid is headed out for health reasons. I don't trust that he's going to stay healthy for a 10-15 year career. No way. Not any longer. The problems are just far too consistent.

I wish I knew the inner workings of the Sixers organization, because then I could tell you whether or not to trade Ben Simmons also. If there is nobody in his ear consistently telling him he needs to start shooting with his dominant hand instead of his off hand, then I can't blame him for that... and he just needs to be surrounded by a better coaching staff and organization. If someone *IS* in his ear consistently telling him he needs to switch to his primary hand when shooting, and he's ignoring them out of apathy, stubbornness, pride... whatever... then you probably have to trade him also. But this is an unanswered question, afaik.

Ben Simmons has everything you could possibly want in a player except a jumper. And while that is no small deal, I am confident that the right mentor could change his NBA game forever... but I could be wrong... he could just be a prideful moron.

Oh well, either way... I think Embiid needs to go. This guy is one of the most immature players I've ever seen at 25. He still acts like everything is a joke. He has that competitive fire in him, but at the same time... it's like... on some level, I feel he doesn't take any of this that seriously and he just feels himself way too much.

MrFonzworth
05-08-2019, 07:48 PM
Should've kept Fultz.

Kblaze8855
05-08-2019, 07:51 PM
I got this in a text a little while ago and feel it

Ben Simmons 25
05-08-2019, 07:52 PM
Damn.

Loco 50
05-08-2019, 08:14 PM
Simmons will never change. This is his true nature. He is a distributor that will never be an aggressive scorer.

I've seen the same arguments for:

Derrick Mckey - Sonics wished he'd score more to take pressure off Kemp and GP
Hedo Turkoglu - Spurs wished he'd be more aggressive looking for his shot
Lamar Odom - every team he ever played for wished he looked and took more shots
Rasheed Wallace - Pistons and Blazers wished he'd be more aggressive putting up shots

and many other players I've forgotten.

Each of the teams that played these players spent years wistfully dreaming about the lost scoring potential and each of these teams is still waiting for that to happen.

He's a great player, but I'd argue this is the worst case I've ever seen in Simmons.

If you expect him to be able to change you're a failure as a gm and coach.

Despite having the physical tools, you can't make a Panda bear a Grizzly. Period.

To your other point about trading Embiid. If I'm a GM there's no way I'm investing in that medical case. No way.

That's a 100 million dollar time bomb waiting to explode in your face despite having all the talent in the world.

Ben Simmons 25
05-08-2019, 08:17 PM
Well, if you're right, then you have to get rid of them both.

Someone will take Embiid and give you at least 80-90 cents on the dollar. Same for Simmons.

Loco 50
05-08-2019, 08:23 PM
Well, if you're right, then you have to get rid of them both.

Someone will take Embiid and give you at least 80-90 cents on the dollar. Same for Simmons.
Someone will, but do they have what you want or need in return?

Philly holds the value of Embiid and Simmons as what they could be, not what they are. The majority of the rest of the league will not have that problem.

There will always be a Knicks team to fleece, so there is that.

And yes, Philly has a lot of roster problems. They can't win it all with this roster. They can be a top team, but that's their cap.

bigkingsfan
05-08-2019, 08:25 PM
Trade both, Pelicans might do for Jrue/Davis

LeCola
05-08-2019, 08:26 PM
Trading any of them would be a big mistake unless they keep Butler and Harris this summer.

Simmons is 23 and Embiid is 25. So, It promises a 10+ years contender team.

PP34Deuce
05-08-2019, 08:27 PM
I think embiids propensity to get injured influences his decision to camp at 3.

I also dont think he takes care of his body like he should. He gets winded easily.

PP34Deuce
05-08-2019, 08:28 PM
If philly had Klay a lot of problems would go away

tontoz
05-08-2019, 08:51 PM
OP makes a legit point. Even with his health issues Embid would bring back a lot in a trade.

Embid for Davis is risky but does make some sense. Davis is more comfortable on the perimeter and better equipped to deal with Giannis who will be the dominant player in the east for awhile. AD can also run the break with Simmons.

Make that trade and resign Butler , who has shown his value in the playoffs, then fill out the roster with some shooting. Might work

Embid has a lot of talent but is a ball stopper who prefers a slower paced game which doesn't fit with Simmons.

Brand has some tough decisions this summer.

NBAGOAT
05-08-2019, 09:15 PM
OP makes a legit point. Even with his health issues Embid would bring back a lot in a trade.

Embid for Davis is risky but does make some sense. Davis is more comfortable on the perimeter and better equipped to deal with Giannis who will be the dominant player in the east for awhile. AD can also run the break with Simmons.

Make that trade and resign Butler , who has shown his value in the playoffs, then fill out the roster with some shooting. Might work

Embid has a lot of talent but is a ball stopper who prefers a slower paced game which doesn't fit with Simmons.

Brand has some tough decisions this summer.

I like embiid for davis. He's the best counter you can find out there for Giannis. Last few years he's played on the 1st and 3rd fastest teams in the league which means he's capable of playing in a system where simmons thrives. The question ofc is the risk involved, ad leaves in a year and it's a disaster.

imdaman99
05-08-2019, 10:18 PM
I think embiids propensity to get injured influences his decision to camp at 3.

I also dont think he takes care of his body like he should. He gets winded easily.
Someone had a thread on r/nba about Embiid's diet being terrible as well.

Who is taking care of this guy? He needs to mature up. Fine you're making millions and prob getting any girl you want. But there's more to life than just having fun when you're that gifted. Dude needs to smarten up.

And I agree with you, dudes that take 3s when they aren't supposed to are usually trying to stay healthy or conserve energy or because they are tired. He might fit in all of those narratives.