Reminder: Pippen played all 82 games in 1991

[3ball]

So he didn't miss the all-star game because he didn't play or was hurt - he just missed it because people didn't think he was good enough and he wasn't in his prime yet

His rep was still suffering from his legendary choke in the prior year's game 7.

So MJ did infact win the 91' ring with a young, still-developing team, and of course, no all-stars.. NBA.com reported that the Bulls were consensus underdogs in the media (http://insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=13720437&postcount=36) heading into the 91' Finals versus the 5-time dynasty.

Even in the 91' Finals, people were shocked that Pippen was assigned spot duty on Magic and didn't get destroyed - Pippen guarded Magic for 30% of possessions to Jordan's 70%, or 6 of 20 quarters (2nd, 3rd, and 4th quarters of Game 2... 2nd and 3rd quarters of Game 3.. last 4 minutes of Game 4... nothing in Games 1 and 5)
.

[Manny98]

Reminder

MJ was 1/9 in the playoffs before Pippen came along

[3ball]

Reminder

MJ was 1/9 in the playoffs before Pippen came along
Why did Pippen miss the all-star game in 1991?

[Gus Hemmingway]

Reminder, he was an allstar in 1990 and 1995 and MJ still lost

[SouBeachTalents]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBXeqtmJlmU

[Manny98]

Why did Pippen miss the all-star game in 1991?
Because MJ held him back

We saw what Pippen did in 94

Guy was literally a instant MVP candidate his 1st season without Jordan :roll:

[3ball]

Because MJ held him back

We saw what Pippen did in 94

Guy was literally a instant MVP candidate his 1st season without Jordan :roll:
Pippen averaged 22.0 ppg in 1994

Nothing special

Nothing he didn't do alongside Mike - Pippen averaged 21.0 and 7.0 apg in 1992, versus 22.0 ppg and 5.6 apg in 94'.. so better in 92'.. :confusedshrug:

[Vino24]

3ball straight up getting bullied :eek:

[LostCause]

Because MJ held him back


So why

[TheCorporation]

Reminder

MJ was 1-9 in the playoffs before Pippen came along

[TheCorporation]

Reminder, he was an allstar in 1990 and 1995 and MJ still lost

[3ball]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBXeqtmJlmU
^^^ Not a single possession guarding Magic in that game (closeout game) - MJ guarded Magic for all Game 5

And all Game 1..

Pippen only guarded Magic for 30% of possessions to Jordan's 70%, or 6 of 20 quarters (2nd, 3rd, and 4th quarters of Game 2... 2nd and 3rd quarters of Game 3.. last 4 minutes of Game 4... nothing in Games 1 and 5)

So for a Finals - MJ carried the goat defensive burden, along with the goat scoring and assist burden...

Btw, in the critical game 3, Pippen fouled out in regulation, so MJ hit the game-tying shot and then dominated the OT while locking Magic down completely
.

[TheCorporation]

3ball straight up getting bullied :eek:


This one is bad :(

Someone throw the towel for god's sake

[NBAGOAT]

Pippen shouldnt have been an all star in 90 but he should have in 91. There are like a handful of guys he's better than on that all star team

[3ball]

Pippen shouldnt have been an all star in 90 but he should have in 91. There are like a handful of guys he's better than on that all star team
If Pippen wasn't a real all-star in 90', then MJ beat the champs in 1990 with no all-stars (if not for Pippen's choke)

No one else won more than a game off the champs that year, yet MJ takes them 7 (basically beats them) with no all-stars.. :bowdown:

[TheCorporation]

If Pippen wasn't a real all-star in 90', then MJ beat the champs in 1990 with no all-stars (if not for Pippen's choke)

No one else won more than a game off the champs that year, yet MJ takes them 7 (basically beats them) with no all-stars.. :bowdown:

Basically beat them? :lol

Let's not deal in make believe, let's deal in FACTS, shall we?

•1-9 before Pippen
•Lost to Pistons 3 years in a row
•Losing record to Isiah, Bird, and Hakeem
•Losing record (under .500) for 5 seasons...
•Faced weakest Finals competition ever
•Faced #1 worst 10.7 ppg Horrnacek as a #2 option
•Pippen did EVERYTHING more than MJ scoring aside
•Terrible 3 point shooter once line was back to normal distance (last 3 years from 3: 25%, 18%, 27%)

Want some more?

[3ball]

•1-9 before Pippen


What's better:

lebron's 8 seed Lakers getting swept by the Warriors this year, or missing the playoffs like he is now?

Obviously, MJ making the playoffs his first few years > lebron missing it his first few years





Lost to Pistons 3 years in a row


with young, developing players and low seeds, while lebron lost 6 times with veteran super-teams and high seeds to Mavs/Spurs/Warriors





•Losing record to Isiah, Bird, and Hakeem


^^^ only 3 guys and MJ had no all-star teammate?

Lebron has a losing record to many more guys despite having MULTIPLE all-star teammates

Ultimately, MJ has the best record ever with an all-star teammate (6-2), while lebron is 3-7 with an all-star teammate





Losing record (under .500) for 5 seasons...



The 85-89' Bulls had ZERO accolades, so



- no 2-time all-star Jamison
- no 2-time all-star Zydrunas
- no all-star Mo Williams
- no all-defenders Varejao/Hughes
- no all-star MVP Shaq (09') to play 4th option in 2010


The 85-89' Bulls had worse casts than any team lebron ever had





•Faced weakest Finals competition ever


The pre-Durant Warriors weren't championship caliber (lost in 16' and won injury ring in 15') - so every Finals team MJ faced > pre-durant Warriors..

and even worse - the b2b champion Bad Boys with five 3x all-stars > 16' Warriors





•Faced #1 worst 10.7 ppg Horrnacek as a #2 option -


Stockton was 2nd option and a top 20 all-time player





•Pippen did EVERYTHING more than MJ scoring aside -


MJ tied him in assists, while maintaining the biggest scoring gap over a 2nd option ever





Terrible 3 point shooter once line was back to normal distance (last 3 years from 3: 25%, 18%, 27%)



MJ was a good 3-point shooter:



anytime it mattered - 43% on 3.3 attempts in 91-93' Finals, and 35.2% on 2.2 attempts in 85-93' playoffs

anytime he tried - he averaged 1.5 attempts every year except 90' & 93' where he attempted 3+ at 38% and 35%
.

[Uncle Drew]

Scottie Pippen got 286,072 votes. More than Dominique Wilkins, who made the team. More than Ricky Pierce, who made the team. More than Hersey Hawkins, who made the team. More than Kevin Mchale, who made the team. More than Brad Daugherty, who made the team. More than Alvin Robertson, who made the team.

[Manny98]

Pippen averaged 22.0 ppg in 1994

Nothing special

Nothing he didn't do alongside Mike - Pippen averaged 21.0 and 7.0 apg in 1992, versus 22.0 ppg and 5.6 apg in 94'.. so better in 92'.. :confusedshrug:
He got more MVP votes than Shaq and Prime Patrick Ewing in 94 :roll:

LeBron never had a teammate that was that good

[Manny98]

[QUOTE=LostCause]So why

[Phoenix]

LeBron never had a teammate that was that good

Fukk outta here with this retarded BS. 2011 Wade was better than Scottie ever was, as was 2012. At the time Lebron went to Miami, teaming up with Wade would have been roughly equal to MJ teaming up with Barkley in 90.

[Phoenix]

Because the media recognized how good Pippen is after he shut down Magic in the 91 finals

The media? Scottie was voted in as a starter in 93, 96 and 97 BY the fans, not the media. More evidence that you were swimming around in your dads n*tsack when this was happening.

[tpols]

The fact he made it before 91 means he was an all star talent period.

youre arguing on a bullshit premise.

[SouBeachTalents]

Fukk outta here with this retarded BS. 2011 Wade was better than Scottie ever was, as was 2012. At the time Lebron went to Miami, teaming up with Wade would have been roughly equal to MJ teaming up with Barkley in 90.
Idk bruh, he's at least debatable with first 3peat Pippen imo

[Manny98]

Fukk outta here with this retarded BS. 2011 Wade was better than Scottie ever was, as was 2012. At the time Lebron went to Miami, teaming up with Wade would have been roughly equal to MJ teaming up with Barkley in 90.
Did Wade ever lead a team to 55 wins?

Was Wade ever seriously in the MVP conversation?

No i rest my case

[Phoenix]

Idk bruh, he's at least debatable with first 3peat Pippen imo

Maybe because Wade scaled back in 2012, but I don't think he was really any worse of a player than 2011. Injuries really kicked in during the 2013 season and hampered him during some playoff rounds, but he was still able to turn in some vintage play in high leverage moments. That said, there's really no argument for Pippen ever being better than 2011 Wade, and Lebron fukked up that chance to win a ring right out the gate. The Heat *should * have won 3 titles during their run.

[Phoenix]

Did Wade ever lead a team to 55 wins?

Was Wade ever seriously in the MVP conversation?

No i rest my case

No, but he led a team with the remains of Jermaine Oneal and Chalmers/Beasely to 47 wins. LOL at acting like that's somehow analogous to Pippen leading a team that had a championship system built up for 5 years leading to 1994. The 94 Bulls cast around Pippen was lightyears ahead of what Wade was working with before Lebron got there.

Wade was 3rd in MVP voting in 2009 and alot of people thought he could have won the MVP that year so yes, he was seriously in the conversation you inbreed.

Lol at you thinking you made some great case to rest. Try again.

[bigkingsfan]

Why did BJ Armstrong became an all star starter the instant Ordan retired. Horace too.

[And1AllDay]

Why did BJ Armstrong became an all star starter the instant Ordan retired. Horace too.

:eek: :eek:

[3ball]

Why did BJ Armstrong became an all star starter the instant Ordan retired. Horace too.
Armstrong and his 14/4 production was a 1-time all-star in 94' because everyone was surprised how good the Bulls were doing - it was like a token of respect to the 3-time champs to elect 3 nembers to the all-star game that year

But he was < George Hill... Ditto Horace, who was much less than Ibaka

[3ball]

Was Wade ever seriously in the MVP conversation?


Wade was FMVP without Lebron

And Pippen wasn't in the MVP conversation..

he was 4th in voting but never in the running to win it..

no one ever said, "we're in the middle of the MVP race and it's Pippen, Hakeem and Robinson"....... EVER.... that would be ridiculous..

A lot of guys at their peak have a couple 4th or 5th MVP voting seasons, but are never the actual talked-about contenders to win it.. I think Love and Bosh had top 10 finishes, and Love actually WAS talked about to win it.. Let alone Wade or Kyrie
.

[Manny98]

No, but he led a team with the remains of Jermaine Oneal and Chalmers/Beasely to 47 wins. LOL at acting like that's somehow analogous to Pippen leading a team that had a championship system built up for 5 years leading to 1994. The 94 Bulls cast around Pippen was lightyears ahead of what Wade was working with before Lebron got there.

Wade was 3rd in MVP voting in 2009 and alot of people thought he could have won the MVP that year so yes, he was seriously in the conversation you inbreed.

Lol at you thinking you made some great case to rest. Try again.
Wade just didn't have what it takes to carry a team to 55 wins like Pippen did :(

[TheCorporation]

Pippen wasn't in the MVP conversation..

he was 4th in voting but never in the running to win it..

no one ever said, "we're in the middle of the MVP race and it's Pippen, Hakeem and Robinson"....... EVER.... that would be ridiculous..


WRONG

He was 3rd in 94

:facepalm

[Phoenix]

Wade just didn't have what it takes to carry a team to 55 wins like Pippen did :(

Weak ass comeback.

[Manny98]

WRONG

He was 3rd in 94

:facepalm
He got more votes than Shaq and Ewing that year :eek:

Its crazy how Pippen instantly became a top 3 player in the league when MJ wasn't holding him back

[TheCorporation]

He got more votes than Shaq and Ewing that year :eek:

Its crazy how Pippen instantly became a top 3 player in the league when MJ wasn't holding him back

2ball is either lying out his ass as usual or really is a troll account who doesnt know these basics things

[Manny98]

Weak ass comeback.
Pippen was MVP candidate, Wade was not

If you think Wade is better than Pippen then your basically admitting that Wade played in a tougher era since he couldn't lead a team to 55 wins

Which one is it?

Pippen > Wade or the 90s was a weak era :confusedshrug:

[TheCorporation]

Pippen was MVP candidate, Wade was not

If you think Wade is better than Pippen then your basically admitting that Wade played in a tougher era since he couldn't lead a team to 55 wins

Which one is it?

Wade > Pippen or the 90s was a weak era :confusedshrug:

:eek: :eek:

Jordan stans in shambles

[3ball]

He got more votes than Shaq and Ewing that year :eek:

Its crazy how Pippen instantly became a top 3 player in the league when MJ wasn't holding him back
You're talking about Pippen getting 3rd without MJ, but Wade 3rd in 2009, won FMVP in 06, and has more MVP finishes than Pippen

Love was once 6th for MVP, Bosh 7th... A lot of guys at their peak have a couple high MVP voting seasons, but are never the actual talked-about contenders to win it.. Pippen is no different

[TheCorporation]

You're talking about Pippen getting 3rd without MJ, but Wade 3rd in 2009, won FMVP in 06, and has more MVP finishes than Pippen

Love was once 6th for MVP, Bosh 7th... A lot of guys at their peak have a couple high MVP voting seasons, but are never the actual talked-about contenders to win it.. Pippen is no different

How many players did LeBron play with that made top 3 in MVP voting? And for how many prime years?

MJ had prime Pippen for his career (7.5 years)
LBJ had prime Wade for 1.5 years

[bigkingsfan]

Armstrong and his 14/4 production was a 1-time all-star in 94' because everyone was surprised how good the Bulls were doing - it was like a token of respect to the 3-time champs to elect 3 nembers to the all-star game that year

But he was < George Hill... Ditto Horace, who was much less than Ibaka
Pippen took them under his wings and turned them into all stars, something Ordan never did.

[TheCorporation]

Pippen took them under his wings and turned them into all stars, something Ordan never did.
:applause: :applause:

[3ball]

How many players did LeBron play with that made top 3 in MVP voting? And for how many prime years?

MJ had prime Pippen for his career (7.5 years)
LBJ had prime Wade for 1.5 year


Sure but outside of Wade..

lebron had 3 other guys with mvp award shares (Bosh, Love, Kyrie).... to MJ's zero...

and 3 other all-stars (Zydrunas, Jamison, Mo).... to MJ's zero

and 4 all-defenders (Varejao/Wade/Hughes/Battier), to MJ's Pippen/Grant/Rodman



Basically, lebron played with many more decorated, high-caliber players

Btw, Wade from 2013-2014 had the same stats and production as prime Pippen - people complain about 13/14 Wade because his prime-Pippen production was a letdown from prime Wade.
.

[Phoenix]

Pippen was MVP candidate, Wade was not

If you think Wade is better than Pippen then your basically admitting that Wade played in a tougher era since he couldn't lead a team to 55 wins

Which one is it?

Pippen > Wade or the 90s was a weak era :confusedshrug:

What's your argument for Pippen being one and not Wade if they both finished 3rd in their best individual season? Your existence proves why siblings shouldn't procreate.

Regular season records are the shittiest way to try and make this comparison. You're the same asshole who would say the 66 wins Cavaliers in 2009 are as good as the 2013 Heat with 66 wins on account of record. Wade was playing with table scraps in 2010 and led them to 47 wins. Pippen was playing with a team that had been through the grinder for 5 years developing championship poise. The situations aren't comparable to make that analogy, but kudos to you on thinking you stumbled on some irrefutable logic. You're a fukking idiot.

[3ball]

Did Wade ever lead a team to 55 wins?


Only 55 wins??... :biggums: .. Wade led a team to a championship and had an MJ type performance in the Finals - a top 5 all-time Finals

Also, you're forgetting the 47-win bulls would've missed the 45-win playoff cut without jordan's 33/8/8 in 1989 (lottery team without jordan)

That exact same lottery cast from 89' executed a three-peat from 91-93' - so Pippen's 94' cast wasn't based on talent - it was a lottery cast that developed the teamwork, know-how, and goat brand of ball required of all dynasties.

It's the most organic dynasty of all time that beat the lakers/celtic killers to become the king... otoh, who did the Warriors topple? Their only comp was a perennial Finals loser - the "clippers" of the Finals.... a 3/9 brand of easily-beatable basketball
.

[paksat]

You're talking about Pippen getting 3rd without MJ, but Wade 3rd in 2009, won FMVP in 06, and has more MVP finishes than Pippen

Love was once 6th for MVP, Bosh 7th... A lot of guys at their peak have a couple high MVP voting seasons, but are never the actual talked-about contenders to win it.. Pippen is no different


It's just sad

all they can say is "meltdown" "in shambles" or some other retard level shit because they can't even make up stuff properly

wade should have won mvp in 09, look at his $tats that year and who his teammates were

he also posted far better $tats in his title run where he actually BEAT dirk without some other clown holding him down


also:





2004 - missed playoffs

2005 - missed playoffs despite the East all-star center on his team

2006 - 2nd round elimination

2007 - 2-seeded Cavs beat 1-seeded Pistons to make Finals (lebron averaged 21 on 41% outside of game 5; 25 on 45% overall)..... then 22 on 36% in Finals sweep loss

2008 - 26 on 35% in ecsf loss

2009 - loses with 60-win 1 seed

2010 - loses with 60-win 1 seed (record - no one ever lost with 60-win 1 seed for two straight yrs)

Then said "fck this, I can't handle being such a loser" and teamed up with the #2 and #4 players in PER aka the best small forward and shooting guard in the league