What's the need for a super-team with Durant out? What was the need in 2011?

[3ball]

Once again, Lebron is attempting to create the only super-team in the league, like he had in 2011

Shameless

[RealSkipBayless]

Luckily for the league it seems to have around only a 30% success rate.

[3ball]

Luckily for the league it seems to have around only a 30% success rate.
Boom

[NBASTATMAN]

A Davis played with Cousins, Holiday and Rondo and they were barely making the playoffs.. All of a sudden MJstans bitching about OLD BRon playing with a great big for the first time in his career.

ADavis is a great player but dont be a biatch and compare him to KD or even Kawhi.. He isnt on that level..

Funny how Kobe stans forget that the 2000 Lakers team had a SUPERTEAM.. Shaq, jkobe and Glen Rice.. BTW Glen Rice has as many all NBA nominations as BOSH AND LOVE combined.. :roll:

Dont get me started on Rodman , Pippen, MJ, Kukoc, and BISON DALE. Meanwhile their best competition was Malone and Stockton.. A team that could never get over the hump whether MJ played or not

[bullettooth]

A Davis played with Cousins, Holiday and Rondo and they were barely making the playoffs.. All of a sudden MJstans bitching about OLD BRon playing with a great big for the first time in his career.

ADavis is a great player but dont be a biatch and compare him to KD or even Kawhi.. He isnt on that level..

Funny how Kobe stans forget that the 2000 Lakers team had a SUPERTEAM.. Shaq, jkobe and Glen Rice.. BTW Glen Rice has as many all NBA nominations as BOSH AND LOVE combined.. :roll:

Dont get me started on Rodman , Pippen, MJ, Kukoc, and BISON DALE. Meanwhile their best competition was Malone and Stockton.. A team that could never get over the hump whether MJ played or not

Oh OK, perhaps LeBron should get Kemba and Kawhi as well then?

[Vino24]

A Davis played with Cousins, Holiday and Rondo and they were barely making the playoffs.. All of a sudden MJstans bitching about OLD BRon playing with a great big for the first time in his career.

ADavis is a great player but dont be a biatch and compare him to KD or even Kawhi.. He isnt on that level..

Funny how Kobe stans forget that the 2000 Lakers team had a SUPERTEAM.. Shaq, jkobe and Glen Rice.. BTW Glen Rice has as many all NBA nominations as BOSH AND LOVE combined.. :roll:

Dont get me started on Rodman , Pippen, MJ, Kukoc, and BISON DALE. Meanwhile their best competition was Malone and Stockton.. A team that could never get over the hump whether MJ played or not
op literally shitted on than shitted on again :eek:

[Vino24]

Oh OK, perhaps LeBron should get Kemba and Kawhi as well then?
oh ok maybe the league should expand and LeBron's toughest competition should be a car mechanic. stfu.

[FKAri]

Shock and awe

[3ball]

Funny how Kobe stans forget that the 2000 Lakers team had a SUPERTEAM.. Shaq, jkobe and Glen Rice.. BTW Glen Rice has as many all NBA nominations as BOSH AND LOVE combined.. :roll:


Rice was 32 and well past his prime, so that's a desperate attempt to overrate the Laker cast

Now if you want to call the Lakers a superteam because of just Shaq and Kobe (2 top 10 all-time players), then that's fine, but lebron has something similar with AD (#3 all-time PER behind MJ and Bran)

Most importantly, Kobe won with just Gasol - only Kobe and MJ won multiple rings with one all-star teammate, except Shaq (who had Kobe) and Hakeem (when MJ was out of the league).. :confusedshrug:




Pop
Dont get me started on Rodman , Pippen, MJ, Kukoc, and BISON DALE.


Wtf? Kukoc and Dele were role players - why do you guys cite role players to counter lebron's star teammates?.. :biggums:

That alone shows how much the bulls lacked star power because you must cite role players

The reality is that the Bulls had the #1 offense in the league despite playing 4 on 5 with Rodman, and a weak-scoring Pippen - how did that happen???.. the bulls had the goat offensive player, that's how






Meanwhile their best competition was Malone and Stockton.. A team that could never get over the hump whether MJ played or not


Actually their best comp was the b2b champion Pistons, who had 3x all-stars at every starting spot - lebron never beat b2b champs, nor did he face a 1 to 4 deficit in all-star teammates like MJ did vs Isiah - MJ beat the Pistons' 5 all-stars with 1 all-star teammate

Secondly, the KD-less Warriors are 8-10 in the Finals and lost to everyone - this includes Kawhi, and also bran twice (if not for injuries in 15') - they're infact 0-3 in the Finals if not for injuries in 15'.. every Finals opponent that MJ faced would destroy them..

i.e. the 98' jazz swept shaq's 4 all-star Lakers and Popovich/Duncan/Robinson's Spurs, so they would crush the Warriors

[StrongLurk]

Rice was 32 and well past his prime, so that's a desperate attempt to overrate the Laker cast

Now if you want to call the Lakers a superteam because of just Shaq and Kobe (2 top 10 all-time players), then that's fine, but lebron has something similar with AD (#3 all-time PER behind MJ and Bran)

Most importantly, Kobe won with just Gasol - only Kobe and MJ won multiple rings with one all-star teammate, except Shaq (who had Kobe) and Hakeem (when MJ was out of the league).. :confusedshrug:



Wtf? Kukoc and Dele were role players - why do you guys cite role players to counter lebron's star teammates?.. :biggums:

That alone shows how much the bulls lacked star power because you must cite role players

The reality is that the Bulls had the #1 offense in the league despite playing 4 on 5 with Rodman, and a weak-scoring Pippen - how did that happen???.. the bulls had the goat offensive player, that's how




Actually their best comp was the b2b champion Pistons, who had 3x all-stars at every starting spot - lebron never beat b2b champs, nor did he face a 1 to 4 deficit in all-star teammates like MJ did vs Isiah - MJ beat the Pistons' 5 all-stars with 1 all-star teammate

Secondly, the KD-less Warriors are 8-10 in the Finals and lost to everyone - this includes Kawhi, and also bran twice (if not for injuries in 15') - they're infact 0-3 in the Finals if not for injuries in 15'.. every Finals opponent that MJ faced would destroy them..

i.e. the 98' jazz swept shaq's 4 all-star Lakers and Popovich/Duncan/Robinson's Spurs, so they would crush the Warriors

Glad to see you admit that Lebron actually has FOUR RINGS/FMVPS.

Clearly the 2nd best player of all time.

[Hey Yo]

Rice was 32 and well past his prime, so that's a desperate attempt to overrate the Laker cast
Yet, 34yr old / 56,0000+ career minutes LeBron is still in his prime??

[3ball]

Glad to see you admit that Lebron actually has FOUR RINGS/FMVPS.

Clearly the 2nd best player of all time.
4 rings < 5 rings

4 rings < 6 rings

And

- 2011 choke
- 3 straight losses as the favorite from 09-11
- Record defeat in 14' despite even odds
- worst-ever Finals performance in 07'
- mental breakdowns in 10' ECSF, 11' Finals, and 18' Finals Game 1 OT
- only 51 wins and underdog status in 17' despite prime kyrie and love.. unable to win 60+ like Kawhi and have better odds

[LostCause]

ADavis is a great player but dont be a biatch and compare him to KD or even Kawhi.. He isnt on that level

Yes he is


Dont get me started on Rodman , Pippen, MJ, Kukoc, and BISON DALE. Meanwhile their best competition was Malone and Stockton.. A team that could never get over the hump whether MJ played or not

:biggums:

Utah was obviously getting over the hump in 97 and 98 if Jordan didn

[bigkingsfan]

Durant was the super team.
Westbrook
Harden
Ibaka

Oh my.

[Mr Feeny]

[QUOTE=LostCause]Yes he is



:biggums:

Utah was obviously getting over the hump in 97 and 98 if Jordan didn

[RealSkipBayless]

And

- 2011 choke
- 3 straight losses as the favorite from 09-11
- Record defeat in 14' despite even odds
- worst-ever Finals performance in 07'
- mental breakdowns in 10' ECSF, 11' Finals, and 18' Finals Game 1 OT
- only 51 wins and underdog status in 17' despite prime kyrie and love.. unable to win 60+ like Kawhi and have better odds
-Missed playoffs in West
-Opposing position players collect FMVP off him
-Da Real Lambo/Delonte West

-Getting roasted by Charles Barkley for collusion.
[QUOTE=Charles Barkley]The Cleveland Cavaliers, they have given him everything he wanted. They have the highest payroll in NBA history. He wanted J.R. Smith last summer, they paid him. He wanted (Iman) Shumpert last summer. They brought in Kyle Korver.

[3ball]

Durant was the super team.
Westbrook
Harden
Ibaka

Oh my.
bran formed the super-team because he couldn't make the Finals in 09/10 - Durant had nothing to do with it and his bench-playing cast wasn't on the radar back then

Look, it's one thing to form a super-team in the West where the conference is tough and requires a great team to make the Finals... But Bran formed a super-team in a conference where Dwight was dragging a weak cast to the Finals, so his Finals runs were complete manufactured - the 00's East had many weak casts make the Finals.. so lebron forming a strong cast is like a golf pro getting a handicap against an amateur

[MaxPlayer]

The whole premise of the thread is ****ed.

The fact that GSW will presumably be down next year opens up a window. There's more need than ever to create a super-team to try to capitalize.

[bigkingsfan]

bran formed the super-team because he couldn't make the Finals in 09/10 - Durant had nothing to do with it and his bench-playing cast wasn't on the radar back then

Look, it's one thing to form a super-team in the West where the conference is tough and requires a great team to make the Finals... But Bran formed a super-team in a conference where Dwight was dragging a weak cast to the Finals, so his Finals runs were complete manufactured - the 00's East had many weak casts make the Finals.. so lebron forming a strong cast is like a golf pro getting a handicap against an amateur
Three MVP
Defensive player of the year nominee.

Oh my.

[3ball]

Three MVP
Defensive player of the year nominee.

Oh my.
Lebron lost with a top 5 all-time player - Shaq in 2010.. and a league MVP in 2018 (Rose)

Oh my

[bigkingsfan]

Lebron lost with a top 5 all-time player - Shaq in 2010.. and a league MVP in 2018 (Rose)

Oh my
He beat three mvp.

73 win team

Duncan/Leonard GOAT duo

Oh my.

[Cleverness]

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/c8/4a/1d/c84a1d730aa20b05a8404cb2142e6b05.jpg

Photoshop with Lakers jerseys :lol

[Hey Yo]

Utah were expected to take out the Bulls in 1998. Going into the finals, a lot of pundits were sceptical about the Bulls' chances. They then proceeded to lose game 1 in overtime and the writing appeared to be on the wall.
Instead, they reeled off 3 straight wins including a 96-54 destruction in game 3 before taking game 6 after narrowly losing their first close out game.
Yeah due to all that offensive fire power they added in the off season. :rolleyes:

Utah was the same team offensively that they were the year before. Don't know how the fvck people (and the Jazz themselves) thought they could get over the hump by doubling Adam Keefe's minutes and cutting Osterstiff's in half from the year before.

I'm not saying you're wrong about the Jazz' expectations, but not sure why people thought that. It's not like Utah got younger and better on offense. It's was quite the opposite.

[3ball]

Yeah due to all that offensive fire power they added in the off season. :rolleyes:

Utah was the same team offensively that they were the year before. Don't know how the fvck they thought they could get over the hump by doubling Adam Keefe's minutes and cutting Osterstiff's in half from the year before.

I'm not saying you're wrong about the Jazz' expectations, but not sure why people thought that. It's not like Utah got younger and better on offense. It's was quite the opposite.
Bulls were tired from the 3-peat and vulnerable from getting all-but-beaten in the ECF?

Sounds about right... Like, the Warriors get babied for being banged up but the Bulls don't??... MJ was the only one NOT banged up and playing well - a testament to his goatness - no excuses - he won with a banged up team due to goat clutch and offensive carry-job (a record 38% of team points and record 34 ppg in 82 pace series)

[TheCorporation]

Replace MJ with Caruso on the 80s Bulls team and people would be wearing Air Caruso's right now.

https://i.postimg.cc/jjMqQsp2/Air-Caruso.jpg

[sdot_thadon]

Op is beside himself at the prospect of Lebron actually having a decent team while the Warriors have had their voltron lineup for the last 3 years. What superduper team are you expecting? According to most throughout the season Davis was just a soft stat padding loser. Lebron was finally in decline and was never gonna be anything in the west. And who else you think they'll get? Jesus? You looking pretty shook up over this pal. More than usual for you.

[bigkingsfan]

Photoshop with Lakers jerseys :lol
"Magic Johnson would have returned to Michigan State rather than play for the Chicago Bulls.

"I'd have stayed in school," he said here Tuesday, standing alone outside Gate 3 1/2 of Chicago Stadium, the house that could have been his. "A coin toss changed the course of my whole life."

Chicago called heads in a 1979 coin flip with Los Angeles for the No. 1 pick in the NBA college draft. It came up tails.

Johnson signed with the Lakers after his sophomore year of college and proceeded to win five championships. The Bulls picked second, took UCLA's David Greenwood and have won no championships.

"I wouldn't have played here," Johnson said on the eve of Game 2 of the NBA finals between his team and the team that could have been his. "The only reason I came out was to play with Kareem and the Lakers."

[Ne 1]

Yes, a super-team was needed to beat KG/Pierce/Allen/Rondo in 2011. To beat the Warriors, a team who has been to 5 straight Finals, yes a super team needs to be formed. FYI, these moves were being worked before the Finals when KD went down. Wasn

[Hey Yo]

Bulls were tired from the 3-peat and vulnerable from getting all-but-beaten in the ECF?

Sounds about right... Like, the Warriors get babied for being banged up but the Bulls don't??... MJ was the only one NOT banged up and playing well - a testament to his goatness - no excuses - he won with a banged up team due to goat clutch
Utah went 7gms in the WCF in 1996 and then went to B2B Finals. Jazz were just as tired.

[3ball]

"Magic Johnson would have returned to Michigan State rather than play for the Chicago Bulls.

"I'd have stayed in school," he said here Tuesday, standing alone outside Gate 3 1/2 of Chicago Stadium, the house that could have been his. "A coin toss changed the course of my whole life."

Chicago called heads in a 1979 coin flip with Los Angeles for the No. 1 pick in the NBA college draft. It came up tails.

Johnson signed with the Lakers after his sophomore year of college and proceeded to win five championships. The Bulls picked second, took UCLA's David Greenwood and have won no championships.

"I wouldn't have played here," Johnson said on the eve of Game 2 of the NBA finals between his team and the team that could have been his. "The only reason I came out was to play with Kareem and the Lakers."
Magic knew he couldn't win in Chicago and needed the goat center to win

Meanwhile, the goat happily joins Chicago and wins 6 rings in his first 11 full seasons... :bowdown:

[Mr Feeny]

Yeah due to all that offensive fire power they added in the off season. :rolleyes:

Utah was the same team offensively that they were the year before. Don't know how the fvck people (and the Jazz themselves) thought they could get over the hump by doubling Adam Keefe's minutes and cutting Osterstiff's in half from the year before.

I'm not saying you're wrong about the Jazz' expectations, but not sure why people thought that. It's not like Utah got younger and better on offense. It's was quite the opposite.

How many wins did they get in 97? How many in 98?
Chicago weren't the same team in 1998 either. Jordan dragged then to that title with Rodman averaging 3ppg and 8 rpg and Pippen"a back going out, resulting in consecutive single digit scoring games in games 5 and 6.

[Mr Feeny]

Utah went 7gms in the WCF in 1996 and then went to B2B Finals. Jazz were just as tired.

In other words, they didnt make 3 consecutive finals. Great.
A 35 year old Jordan with a damaged index finger had to carry the Bulls playing 82 regular season games because Pippen got hurt and missed half the season. As did multiple players. They were hobbled and both mentally fatigued and physically compromised.

But Jordan was Jordan.

[Hey Yo]

How many wins did they get in 97? How many in 98?
Chicago weren't the same team in 1998 either. Jordan dragged then to that title with Rodman averaging 3ppg and 8 rpg and Pippen"a back going out, resulting in consecutive single digit scoring games in games 5 and 6.
And after all of that, Utah scored only 54 points in one game and their 2nd leading scorer avg. 10ppg for the series. That's fvcking pathetic.

Like I said, nobody should have expected Utah to win cause they didn't address their offensive needs from the year prior.

What a shit era.

[bigkingsfan]

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/633671/Neither-Bulls-nor-Jazz-care-to-be-favored.html

"Las Vegas oddsmakers have the Bulls the favorites to win the series"

[PP34Deuce]

I believe the Lakers are in a tough position.

High level role players available are on restricted contracts and playoff teams see a window to compete with 2 of Golden states top players out.

You put in an offer sheet for a restricted player and watch GM's take the full number of days to match it. It will mess up plans.

Seems like the fastest way is if Kemba is available... you take him and build out the roster out with vets and hustle guys.

[3ball]

-Missed playoffs in West
-Opposing position players collect FMVP off him
-Da Real Lambo/Delonte West

-Getting roasted by Charles Barkley for collusion.



The Barkley dispute where lebron got personal shows what a weak bitch Lebron is, and that Barkley touched a nerve/hit the truth... That's why lebron got sensitive

Barkley:. damn Lebron, you want all the good players?

Lebron:. **** you c***.. you spat on a kid and are a horrible person


What a p****.. a non-competitive bitch.. MJ would wipe the floor with him and make him tap out like the old Spurs in 14'

[sdot_thadon]

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/633671/Neither-Bulls-nor-Jazz-care-to-be-favored.html

"Las Vegas oddsmakers have the Bulls the favorites to win the series"
Well, there's that.

[SamuraiSWISH]

There wasn't a need in 2011. That Celtics Big 3 from 2008 and 2009 that destroyed LeBron / Wade / Kobe before KG's injury weren't the same. Rondo emerged. But KG was never the same. He was like 75% of the player he was at best pre injury, and the rest of the guys PP / Ray aged rapidly.

It really was out of: desperation, insecurity, failure, mental weakness, competitive cowardice, and ultimately SEVERE overkill.

And it destroyed the league. It instituted this AAU team up, super friend mind set that has made competitive balance, and competitive nature amongst the league's top players all but vanished.

Kobe truly was the last of the Mohicans in that regard. With that old school, I'm good enough to prove myself even without Shaq, want my own team vs YOUR TEAM level of competitiveness we as a basketball audience were accustomed to out of the world's best players. Not this, I need more HALP BS.

[Mr Feeny]

And after all of that, Utah scored only 54 points in one game and their 2nd leading scorer avg. 10ppg for the series. That's fvcking pathetic.

Like I said, nobody should have expected Utah to win cause they didn't address their offensive needs from the year prior.

What a shit era.

Agree that the Bulls' defense was incredible. Part of what made them the greatest team of all time.

[bigkingsfan]

Kobe truly was the last of the Mohicans in that regard. With that old school, I'm good enough to prove myself even without Shaq, want my own team vs YOUR TEAM level of competitiveness we as a basketball audience were accustomed to out of the world's best players. Not this, I need more HALP BS.
Nah, he demanded a trade as soonest it got hard. He would be gone if not for his no trade clause.

"A source with knowledge of the trade talks said Deng has been included in proposals swapped between the teams, but Bryant has continually threatened to veto almost any deal in which Deng would be included. Bryant wants to be sure that the team he joins has enough talent remaining to compete for the NBA title."

[3ball]

There wasn't a need in 2011. That Celtics Big 3 from 2008 and 2009 that destroyed LeBron / Wade / Kobe before KG's injury weren't the same. Rondo emerged. But KG was never the same. He was like 75% of the player he was at best pre injury, and the rest of the guys PP / Ray aged rapidly.

It really was out of: desperation, insecurity, failure, mental weakness, competitive cowardice, and ultimately SEVERE overkill.

And it destroyed the league. It instituted this AAU team up, super friend mind set that has made competitive balance, and competitive nature amongst the league's top players all but vanished.

Kobe truly was the last of the Mohicans in that regard. With that old school, I'm good enough to prove myself even without Shaq, want my own team vs YOUR TEAM level of competitiveness we as a basketball audience were accustomed to out of the world's best players. Not this, I need more HALP BS.
Precisely

And the team-up mindset has killed organic teamwork.. these temporary super-teams are a hodge-podge of mercenaries that would get destroyed by the organic teamwork of prior eras

[Hey Yo]

Agree that the Bulls' defense was incredible. Part of what made them the greatest team of all time.
So Pippen's back was completely fried, but still could play amazing defense? Rodman was so bad in 1998 (your words) he still played amazing defense?

:oldlol:

Nice try, Chico. Utah was shit and so was that era.

[NBASTATMAN]

Rice was 32 and well past his prime, so that's a desperate attempt to overrate the Laker cast

Now if you want to call the Lakers a superteam because of just Shaq and Kobe (2 top 10 all-time players), then that's fine, but lebron has something similar with AD (#3 all-time PER behind MJ and Bran)

Most importantly, Kobe won with just Gasol - only Kobe and MJ won multiple rings with one all-star teammate, except Shaq (who had Kobe) and Hakeem (when MJ was out of the league).. :confusedshrug:



Wtf? Kukoc and Dele were role players - why do you guys cite role players to counter lebron's star teammates?.. :biggums:

That alone shows how much the bulls lacked star power because you must cite role players

The reality is that the Bulls had the #1 offense in the league despite playing 4 on 5 with Rodman, and a weak-scoring Pippen - how did that happen???.. the bulls had the goat offensive player, that's how




Actually their best comp was the b2b champion Pistons, who had 3x all-stars at every starting spot - lebron never beat b2b champs, nor did he face a 1 to 4 deficit in all-star teammates like MJ did vs Isiah - MJ beat the Pistons' 5 all-stars with 1 all-star teammate

Secondly, the KD-less Warriors are 8-10 in the Finals and lost to everyone - this includes Kawhi, and also bran twice (if not for injuries in 15') - they're infact 0-3 in the Finals if not for injuries in 15'.. every Finals opponent that MJ faced would destroy them..

i.e. the 98' jazz swept shaq's 4 all-star Lakers and Popovich/Duncan/Robinson's Spurs, so they would crush the Warriors


dude the BULLS would have won 60 games without MJ if Pippen wasnt injured.. The Bulls would have gone to the NBA FINALS if THE BULLS werent STERNED so that MJ could keep his legacy.. :lol

[NBASTATMAN]

Yet, 34yr old / 56,0000+ career minutes LeBron is still in his prime??


3BALLS A JOKE:roll:

[NBASTATMAN]

[QUOTE=LostCause]Yes he is



:biggums:

Utah was obviously getting over the hump in 97 and 98 if Jordan didn

[bullettooth]

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/c8/4a/1d/c84a1d730aa20b05a8404cb2142e6b05.jpg

Photoshop with Lakers jerseys :lol

https://media.giphy.com/media/L0ex6wdl4iRi5EsiEs/giphy.gif

[NBASTATMAN]

Lebron lost with a top 5 all-time player - Shaq in 2010.. and a league MVP in 2018 (Rose)

Oh my


:lol .. KOBE WAS PLAYING WITH A GOAT level player in his prime and only won 3 titles in 8 SEASONS AS THE ROBIN. Oh wait he was playing with 3 OTHER HOF's in 2004 and still got his arse kicked in by RIP HAMILTON.. :roll:

meanwhile Shaq avg 20 minutes a game with Lebron.. SHAQ and Bron would have done some nice work if SNAQ didnt get hurt and come back out of shape for the playoffs..

[StrongLurk]

4 rings, 4 ELITE finals MVPS, 4 regular season MVPS, and the all time leader in all kinds of playoff individual stats.

Lebron Jaime, the 2nd best player of all time. :bowdown:

[3ball]

So Pippen's back was completely fried, but still could play amazing defense? Rodman was so bad in 1998 (your words) he still played amazing defense?

:oldlol:

Nice try, Chico. Utah was shit and so was that era.
It shows that great team defense is about teamwork, system, culture, and effort, more than any 1 perimeter defender

That's why Pippen is overrated - people prop him up because they figure "well, MJ must've had SOMEBODY to win 6 rings"... But they can't consider Pippen's offense to be that great, so they overrate his defense like no one else's

But the reality is that the bulls closed out the 98' Finals without him, and won 6 rings while pippen's man mostly got his - Xavier McDaniel, Worthy, Schrempf, Jerome Kersey, Penny, and many more

Pip was an all-time defender, but his impact has been overblown as time has gone on, and new fans needed to find reasons for the Bulls' ridiculous 6 rings.. they'd look at the roster and be like "gosh, for 6 rings, I don't see a stacked roster".. then they proceed to overrate everyone on the roster and underrate the goat.. :facepalm

[Mr Feeny]

4 rings, 4 ELITE finals MVPS, 4 regular season MVPS, and the all time leader in all kinds of playoff individual stats.

Lebron Jaime, the 2nd best player of all time. :bowdown:

4?

[Mr Feeny]

So Pippen's back was completely fried, but still could play amazing defense? Rodman was so bad in 1998 (your words) he still played amazing defense?

:oldlol:

Nice try, Chico. Utah was shit and so was that era.

Jordan was incredible,wasnt he?

[StrongLurk]

4?

OP said the Warriors essentially lost to the Cavs in 2015...so that means Leyouknowwho now has 4 rings/4fmvps.

That bumps Lebron over Kareem for the number 2 spawt.

[Mr Feeny]

OP said the Warriors essentially lost to the Cavs in 2015...so that means Leyouknowwho now has 4 rings/4fmvps.

That bumps Lebron over Kareem for the number 2 spawt.

Hmm. Not sure what to make of that. The warriors obviously won. Not ifs or buts. Maybe he meant that the Cavs would have won had they had everyone healthy (in his opinion).

[StrongLurk]

Hmm. Not sure what to make of that. The warriors obviously won. Not ifs or buts. Maybe he meant that the Cavs would have won had they had everyone healthy (in his opinion).

Most people agree 2015 and 2019 are asterisk rings due to massive injuries to star players on ONE of the finals teams.

It's not a subjective thing.

[Mr Feeny]

Most people agree 2015 and 2019 are asterisk rings due to massive injuries to star players on ONE of the finals teams.

It's not a subjective thing.

If 2019 is an asterisk ring, then so was 2016. A member of the original trio missed 4 quarters in 2016, and missed 5 quarters in 2019. Durant's addition here for 1 quarter made up for Klay missing an extra quarter. I dont normally agree with 3ball, but there is no asterisk here.

You're sounding like Steven A Smith who constantly cries about the 2016 Cavaliers title being bs because "that damn suspension was a joke".

[StrongLurk]

If 2019 is an asterisk ring, then so was 2016. A member of the original trio missed 4 quarters in 2016, and missed 5 quarters in 2019. Durant's addition here for 1 quarter made up for Klay missing an extra quarter. I dont normally agree with 3ball, but there is no asterisk here.

You're sounding like Steven A Smith who constantly cries about the 2016 Cavaliers title being bs because "that damn suspension was a joke".

2016 is NOT an asterisk, not even close. Draymond was suspended one game through his own actions (too many playoff technicals, through MULTIPLE series) and was NOT INJURED. Meanwhile Kevin Love missed game 3 and played with concussion symptoms the rest of the finals. That series was clearly an even playing field.

MEANWHILE, Kevin Durant, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game...on top of that Klay missed clearly enough time to negatively effect the Warriors.

KD playing 12 minutes does NOT offset Klay missing the 4th quarter of game 6. Read this again by the way: KD, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game.

We all know the Warriors with KD and Klay not missing games would beat the Raptors. This statement is NOT saying the Raptors weren't a good team...just clearly that they won because of injuries.

How are you trying to get away with forgetting KD?

The Warriors team we saw in the finals was the worst iteration of them over this entire finals fun.

[NBASTATMAN]

If 2019 is an asterisk ring, then so was 2016. A member of the original trio missed 4 quarters in 2016, and missed 5 quarters in 2019. Durant's addition here for 1 quarter made up for Klay missing an extra quarter. I dont normally agree with 3ball, but there is no asterisk here.

You're sounding like Steven A Smith who constantly cries about the 2016 Cavaliers title being bs because "that damn suspension was a joke".


LOVE missed 4 quarters too in 2016.. So its even..

[Hey Yo]

It shows that great team defense is about teamwork, system, culture, and effort, more than any 1 perimeter defender

That's why Pippen is overrated - people prop him up because they figure "well, MJ must've had SOMEBODY to win 6 rings"... But they can't consider Pippen's offense to be that great, so they overrate his defense like no one else's

But the reality is that the bulls closed out the 98' Finals without him, and won 6 rings while pippen's man mostly got his - Xavier McDaniel, Worthy, Schrempf, Jerome Kersey, Penny, and many more

Pip was an all-time defender, but his impact has been overblown as time has gone on, and new fans needed to find reasons for the Bulls' ridiculous 6 rings.. they'd look at the roster and be like "gosh, for 6 rings, I don't see a stacked roster".. then they proceed to overrate everyone on the roster and underrate the goat.. :facepalm
"MJ made Pippen"

3ball

[Mr Feeny]

2016 is NOT an asterisk, not even close. Draymond was suspended one game through his own actions (too many playoff technicals, through MULTIPLE series) and was NOT INJURED. Meanwhile Kevin Love missed game 3 and played with concussion symptoms the rest of the finals. That series was clearly an even playing field.

MEANWHILE, Kevin Durant, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game...on top of that Klay missed clearly enough time to negatively effect the Warriors.

KD playing 12 minutes does NOT offset Klay missing the 4th quarter of game 6. Read this again by the way: KD, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game.

We all know the Warriors with KD and Klay not missing games would beat the Raptors. This statement is NOT saying the Raptors weren't a good team...just clearly that they won because of injuries.

How are you trying to get away with forgetting KD?

Clearly this Warriors team even without KD weren't as good depth/defensive wise as they were in 2016. The Warriors team we say in the finals was the worst iteration of them over this entire finals fun.

I'm not forgetting KD. But why is he relevant. The trio from 2016 were still there and they are the ones who were heralded as the "superteam" in 2016.

I agree about the depth issue so I think they're a little behind the previous iteration.

Draymond getting suspended or injured isnt thah relevant. That delineation doesn't change the fact that an important member missed 4 quarters which is why a lot of people (wrongly) imo say that's an asterisk ring.

You're trying to have it both ways. Say that 2016 was legitimate but this one wasnt. In my opinion, it's either that they're both legit or that they have asterisk.

I'm one of the ones who dont think they are. Injuries take place. Suspensions take place. I dont think there's THAT much of a difference between the team that was playing the Raptors this year and the one that played Celevaland in 2016. Steph was hobbled then but healthy here. Klay was hobbled here but healthy there. Draymond was fine.

I agree about the depth.

[StrongLurk]

OP when talking about the Bulls:
They are the greatest team ever, every player was unstoppable and would destroy this era.

OP when talking about MJ: Pippen and Rodman are extremely overrated and MJ carried more burden then anyone.

Face it, OP is just a massive troll. He hides behind MJ since he is the easiest player to stan and just uses MJ as a catalyst to get his daily fix of trolling :facepalm

[Mr Feeny]

LOVE missed 4 quarters too in 2016.. So its even..

Err....why?
Love was a superstar (even though he might not have played like it with Lebron - an argument that is usually used by Lebron detractors. That his top players diminish with him)

Kawhi doesnt have anyone as good as Kyrie or Love. So why do I care if Love missed a game?

[sdot_thadon]

"MJ made Pippen"

3ball
If Mj "made" Pippen, why'd he only make one of them m'fers. And why couldn't he make one in Washington? Or Charlotte?

[StrongLurk]

I'm not forgetting KD. But why is he relevant. The trio from 2016 were still there and they are the ones who were heralded as the "superteam" in 2016.

I agree about the depth issue so I think they're a little behind the previous iteration.

Draymond getting suspended or injured isnt thah relevant. That delineation doesn't change the fact that an important member missed 4 quarters which is why a lot of people (wrongly) imo say that's an asterisk ring.

You're trying to have it both ways. Say that 2016 was legitimate but this one wasnt. In my opinion, it's either that they're both legit or that they have asterisk.

I'm one of the ones who dont think they are. Injuries take place. Suspensions take place. I dont think there's THAT much of a difference between the team that was playing the Raptors this year and the one that played Celevaland in 2016. Steph was hobbled then but healthy here. Klay was hobbled here but healthy there. Draymond was fine.

I agree about the depth.

Dude, are you not capable of nuance?

You are telling me that Draymond missing 4 quarters in 2016 is the same as Love missing the entire 2015 finals and Kyrie missing games 2-6 of the 2015 finals?

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

2016 is NOT an asterisk, not even close. Draymond was suspended one game through his own actions (too many playoff technicals, through MULTIPLE series) and was NOT INJURED. Meanwhile Kevin Love missed game 3 and played with concussion symptoms the rest of the finals. That series was clearly an even playing field.

MEANWHILE, Kevin Durant, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game...on top of that Klay missed clearly enough time to negatively effect the Warriors.

KD playing 12 minutes does NOT offset Klay missing the 4th quarter of game 6. Read this again by the way: KD, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game.

We all know the Warriors with KD and Klay not missing games would beat the Raptors. This statement is NOT saying the Raptors weren't a good team...just clearly that they won because of injuries.

2016 is clearly asterisked if we're counting players MIA.

Suspended or injured is arbitrary. You say Draymond was suspended by his actions? I'd argue officials were trigger happy with their whistle, single-handedly compromising that series.

People forget that Draymond was arguably the best player in the finals. On the Warriors end anyway. But that Bogut also went down and Iguodala got hurt and played thru injury.

So again...if 2015 is "asterisked"? So are 2016 AND 2019.

[1987_Lakers]

2016 is NOT an asterisk, not even close. Draymond was suspended one game through his own actions (too many playoff technicals, through MULTIPLE series) and was NOT INJURED. Meanwhile Kevin Love missed game 3 and played with concussion symptoms the rest of the finals. That series was clearly an even playing field.

MEANWHILE, Kevin Durant, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game...on top of that Klay missed clearly enough time to negatively effect the Warriors.

KD playing 12 minutes does NOT offset Klay missing the 4th quarter of game 6. Read this again by the way: KD, the best player in the world, played 12 minutes in one finals game.

We all know the Warriors with KD and Klay not missing games would beat the Raptors. This statement is NOT saying the Raptors weren't a good team...just clearly that they won because of injuries.

How are you trying to get away with forgetting KD?

The Warriors team we saw in the finals was the worst iteration of them over this entire finals fun.

Spot on.

[NBASTATMAN]

Err....why?
Love was a superstar (even though he might not have played like it with Lebron - an argument that is usually used by Lebron detractors. That his top players diminish with him)

Kawhi doesnt have anyone as good as Kyrie or Love. So why do I care if Love missed a game?


I would take Lowry over Love any day.. He plays offense and defense.. A 6 time all star and the RAPTROS went 17-5 without Kawhi.. Something like 30 -11 when either Lowry or Kawhi missed games...

Meanswhile the 2016 Cavs went something like 1-5 without Bron that season.. Kyrie hasnt shown he is an impactful player besides when he played with Bron.. Lowry could have done the same exact thing Kyrie did this season..

Matter of fact Kyrie has made his teams worse on most occasions.. Obviously the guy is talented but he hasnt shown he can make a team better in terms of winning games.

[Mr Feeny]

Dude, are you not capable of nuance?

You are telling me that Draymond missing 4 quarters in 2016 is the same as Love missing the entire 2015 finals and Kyrie missing games 2-6 of the 2015 finals?

What the..?
What does any of that have to do with what I said?

I never mentioned 2015.

[Mr Feeny]

2016 is clearly asterisked if we're counting players MIA. Suspended or injured is arbitrary. You say Draymond was suspended by his actions? I'd argue the ref was trigger happy with his whistle,single-handedly compromising the series.

People forget that Draymond was arguably the best player in that series. On the Warriors end anyway. But that Bogut also went down and Iguodala gets injured and plays hampered.

So again...if 2015 is "asterisked"? So are 2016 AND 2019.

I'd argue that it isnt. And that 2019 isnt either.
I agree with your overall point. People need to be consistent. We cant be selective.

[StrongLurk]

2016 is clearly asterisked if we're counting players MIA. Suspended or injured is arbitrary. You say Draymond was suspended by his actions? I'd argue the ref was trigger happy with his whistle,single-handedly compromising the series.

People forget that Draymond was arguably the best player in that series. On the Warriors end anyway. But that Bogut also went down and Iguodala gets injured and plays hampered.

So again...if 2015 is "asterisked"? So are 2016 AND 2019.

Except Love ALSO missed a game (game 3) and played with concussion symptoms the rest of the series.

You are telling me that Draymond missing 4 quarters in 2016 is the same as Love missing the entire 2015 finals and Kyrie missing games 2-6 of the 2015 finals?

Did Curry miss the whole 2016 finals series except 12 minutes? If that happened, then it would be an asterisk. Did Lebron miss the whole 2016 finals series except 12 minutes? If that happened, then it would be an asterisk.

[Hey Yo]

If Mj "made" Pippen, why'd he only make one of them m'fers. And why couldn't he make one in Washington? Or Charlotte?
:oldlol:

[Mr Feeny]

I would take Lowry over Love any day.. He plays offense and defense.. A 6 time all star and the RAPTROS went 17-5 without Kawhi.. Something like 30 -11 when either Lowry or Kawhi missed games...

Meanswhile the 2016 Cavs went something like 1-5 without Bron that season.. Kyrie hasnt shown he is an impactful player besides when he played with Bron..

If so, then that's an indictment of Lebron. Love was a 26 and 14 player before he joined and turned awful overnight. Bosh was one of the best big men in the league and turned crap overnight.

You're just making my point with your 2nd paragraph.

You're never convincing me that Lowry is a better player than Love.


And as I said, Kawhi doesnt have anyone as good as Kyrie. So even that argument is puerile.

[Mr Feeny]

Except Love ALSO missed a game (game 3) and played with concussion symptoms the rest of the series.

You are telling me that Draymond missing 4 quarters in 2016 is the same as Love missing the entire 2015 finals and Kyrie missing games 2-6 of the 2015 finals?

I think that 2015 was an extreme case.
I think that there isnt much between 2016 and 2019.

[NBASTATMAN]

OP when talking about the Bulls:
They are the greatest team ever, every player was unstoppable and would destroy this era.

OP when talking about MJ: Pippen and Rodman are extremely overrated and MJ carried more burden then anyone.

Face it, OP is just a massive troll. He hides behind MJ since he is the easiest player to stan and just uses MJ as a catalyst to get his daily fix of trolling :facepalm
:applause:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

I'd argue that it isnt. And that 2019 isnt either.
I agree with your overall point. People need to be consistent. We cant be selective.

I don't think 2019 is asterisked...but I also felt GSW was incredibly unlucky.

Durant comes back for that quarter...bam...tears his achilles

Next game Klay is balling..Warriors look like they have Toronto on the ropes...bam...he tears his ACL.

Just a strange, bittersweet finals...

[NBASTATMAN]

I think that 2015 was an extreme case.
I think that there isnt much between 2016 and 2019.
:facepalm

[StrongLurk]

I think that 2015 was an extreme case.
I think that there isnt much between 2016 and 2019.

I see what you are trying to do...but you can't just ignore KD missing basically the whole series and make an argument for 2016 vs 2019...

You want to TRY to compare 2016 and 2019 without KD...but KD was on the team is 2019. It's a fact.

Which makes 2019 an asterisk.

[Mr Feeny]

I don't think 2019 is asterisked...but I also felt they were incredibly unlucky.

Durant comes back for that quarter...bam...tears his achilles

Next game Klay is balling..Warriors look like they have Toronto on the ropes...bam...he tears his ACL.

Just a strange, bittersweet finals...

Completely agree. Injuries happen. Bad luck occurs. But I'm not about to asterisk an NBA title because of that. The Warriors still had an incredible team out on the court.

[Mr Feeny]

I see what you are trying to do...but you can't just ignore KD missing basically the whole series.

You want to TRY to compare 2016 and 2019 without KD...but KD was on the team is 2019. It's a fact.

Which makes 2019 an asterisk.

Sure I can. Curry, Klay, and Draymond were there. If you beat that trio, it isnt an asterisk.

[NBASTATMAN]

SHIT EVERY RING IS ASTERISKED for the lakers since 2000

2000 LAKERS win title with Duncan injured
2001 LAKERS WIN TITLE with SPURS second best scorer injured never played
2002 LAKERS win title with Snow and Mckie both playing with broken ankles, Peja injured for Kings , Refs cheat the kings as well
2009 lakers win title when KGarnett gets hurt
2010 LAKERS win title when Celtics lose their best rebounder for game 7



:roll:

[StrongLurk]

Sure I can. Curry, Klay, and Draymond were there. If you beat that trio, it isnt an asterisk.

Except Klay missed 5 quarters while no one of the Raptors missed games.

The Raptors CLEARLY lose any of their games if Lowry or Siakam don't play and Klay does.

Also, the rest of the Warriors team in 2016 was superior to the rest of the 2019 Warriors team.

[Mr Feeny]

SHIT EVERY RING IS ASTERISKED for the lakers since 2000

2000 LAKERS win title with Duncan injured
2001 LAKERS WIN TITLE with SPURS second best scorer injured never played
2002 LAKERS win title with Snow and Mckie both playing with broken ankles, Peja injured for Kings , Refs cheat the kings as well
2009 lakers win title when KGarnett gets hurt
2010 LAKERS win title when Celtics lose their best rebounder for game 7



:roll:

That's what I mean. If we start claiming "asterisk", we would never stop. The demarcation is subjective you can claim asterisk for every single ring.

[NBASTATMAN]

That's what I mean. If we start claiming "asterisk", we would never stop. The demarcation is subjective you can claim asterisk for every single ring.


So Rings should nt be looked at when judging players.. Some players and teams get lucky and face weaker teams than others..


Lakers benefited the most since 2000. And it may happen again

[StrongLurk]

That's what I mean. If we start claiming "asterisk", we would never stop. The demarcation is subjective you can claim asterisk for every single ring.

So if MJ misses an entire finals due to injury and the Bulls lose...then it's just ehh, bad luck, whatever, full credit to the opposing team...

[Mr Feeny]

Except Klay missed 5 quarters while no one of the Raptors missed games.

The Raptors CLEARLY lose any of their games if Lowry or Siakam don't play and Klay does.

Also, the rest of the Warriors team in 2016 was superior to the rest of the 2019 Warriors team.

And Draymond missed 4 quarters in 2016. And in 2016, the Cavs didnt have to face Dursnt for a quarter (to balance out the extra quarter missed by an inferior player).

We are going around in circles. Kawhi doesnt have anyone as good as Kyrie and Love. So, no. It isnt similar. When love misses a game there, Lebron had a 27 ppg scorer in Kyrie (in the finals) to help him out

Agree about the depth but in my opinion it isnt enough to make this one an asterisk any more than 2016.

Either neither is. Or both are.

[Mr Feeny]

So if MJ misses an entire finals due to injury and the Bulls lose...then it's just ehh, bad luck, whatever, full credit to the opposing team...

That's not exactly what I said, is it?

[Mr Feeny]

So Rings should nt be looked at when judging players.. Some players and teams get lucky and face weaker teams than others..


Lakers benefited the most since 2000. And it may happen again

Yeah, agree. Rings are not the determining factor.
And yes, the lakers had help.

[StrongLurk]

That's not exactly what I said, is it?

The raptors would not have a chip if KD and Klay are healthy. Simple.

If Kawhi missed the whole finals minus 12 minutes and the Warriors won, you wouldn't think it's an asterisk?

[stalkerforlife]

Just when we thought the super teams were slowing down, the NBA and Bran does it again.

Zero competitive drive.

All smoke and mirrors.

[Mr Feeny]

The raptors would not have a chip if KD and Klay are healthy. Simple.

If Kawhi missed the whole finals minus 12 minutes and the Warriors won, you wouldn't think it's an asterisk?

I dont care about Durant.
The 2016 Cavs would not have a chip if Draymond didnt miss game 5.

Same flawed logic.

[StrongLurk]

I dont care about Durant.
The 2016 Cavs would not have a chip if Draymond didnt miss game 5.

Same flawed logic.

How is Durant missing an entire series due to injury the same as Draymond missing one game due to technicals?

Please elaborate.

[Mr Feeny]

How is Durant missing an entire series due to injury the same as Draymond missing one game due to technicals?

Please elaborate.

I'm not repeating myself for the 10th time because you're having trouble with the idea that other people dont consider 2019 more of an asterisk than 2016.

Durant doesnt define whether this was or wasnt an asterisk. Steph, Klay, and Draymond were all there. Green missed 4 quarters in 2016. Klay missed 5 here but Dursnt (a superior player) played a quarter to offset than extra missed quarter by an inferior player.

Steph was 100% healthy in 2019 but was hobbled in 2016. The 2016 squad had better depth but I dont think it makes enough of a difference for their to be a demarcation.

We cant have the same conversation 20 times. If you think that this deserves an asterisk and 2016 doesnt, that's fine. I dont. And many people dont. A lot of people treat 2016 and 2019 equally. Either both or neither is an asterisk.

[ArbitraryWater]

how do ppl still refer to '98 as a bulls win with the multiple massive game swinging game 6 calls

utah robbed big tiem

[ArbitraryWater]

I'm not repeating myself for the 10th time because you're having trouble with the idea that other people dont consider 2019 more of an asterisk than 2016.

Durant doesnt define whether this was or wasnt an asterisk. Steph, Klay, and Draymond were all there. Green missed 4 quarters in 2016. Klay missed 5 here but Dursnt (a superior player) played a quarter to offset than extra missed quarter by an inferior player.

Steph was 100% healthy in 2019 but was hobbled in 2016. The 2016 squad had better depth but I dont think it makes enough of a difference for their to be a demarcation.

We cant have the same conversation 20 times. If you think that this deserves an asterisk and 2016 doesnt, that's fine. I dont. And many people dont. A lot of people treat 2016 and 2019 equally. Either both or neither is an asterisk.

https://www.gifvideo.net/files/photos/2017/11/that-time-he-questioned-your-sanity-22-times-when-harry-potters-bitch-face-was-better-than-yours.gif

[Mr Feeny]

https://www.gifvideo.net/files/photos/2017/11/that-time-he-questioned-your-sanity-22-times-when-harry-potters-bitch-face-was-better-than-yours.gif

We know you know nothing about basketball but I would have assumed you were watching then. Apparently not. No surprise. Stick to watching Iraqi TV.

[LostCause]

BISON dele was a 16 pt 8 reb type of player in 32 minutes a game..

Stop trolling


Yep THE BULLS were gifted 1998 title like the LAKERS were gifted 2002 and 2010

Like the Cavs in 2016 with the fake tech on Draymond leading to suspension?

[RealSkipBayless]

2015 and 2019 are asterisk rings.

2016 is not. Suspension might have switched momentum but it

[Mr Feeny]

[QUOTE=RealSkipBayless]2015 and 2019 are asterisk rings.

2016 is not. Suspension might have switched momentum but it

[StrongLurk]

2015 and 2019 are asterisk rings.

2016 is not. Suspension might have switched momentum but it’s a 3rd fiddle gone ONE game.

Kevin Love ALSO missed game 3, played with concussion symptoms game 4-7.

2016 is not even close to the level of 2015/2019.

Feeny is clearly having trouble with context/nuance.

[Mr Feeny]

Kevin Love ALSO missed game 3, played with concussion symptoms game 4-7.

2016 is not even close to the level of 2015/2019.

Feeny is clearly having trouble with context/nuance.

I'd say that you're in denial. Or obdurate.

It's a matter of opinion but a lot of people see 2016 and 2019 the same. The Lebron fans are going to disagree, naturally.

[StrongLurk]

I'd say that you're in denial. Or obdurate.

It's a matter of opinion but a lot of people see 2016 and 2019 the same. The Lebron fans are going to disagree, naturally.

RealSkipBayless is a Kobe stan.

[SamuraiSWISH]

Precisely

And the team-up mindset has killed organic teamwork.. these temporary super-teams are a hodge-podge of mercenaries that would get destroyed by the organic teamwork of prior eras
Kind of a microcosm of what happened in international play pre-redeem team when inferior talent was playing much better team ball and absolutely destroying team USA in 2002, and 2004.


how do ppl still refer to '98 as a bulls win with the multiple massive game swinging game 6 calls

utah robbed big tiem
:oldlol:

You’re the only one who tried to perpetuate this myth. Do you consider the ‘12, and ‘16 rings as being asterisked as well?

[ArbitraryWater]

2016 was just as much of an asterisk ring as 2019 was. Either both are or neither is.

Err, in 2016 its not even clear which side had more injuries. Lol.



I'd say that you're in denial. Or obdurate.

It's a matter of opinion but a lot of people see 2016 and 2019 the same. The Lebron fans are going to disagree, naturally.

ew, once you enter the real world, you'll be in a shock surprise

[ArbitraryWater]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]You

[1987_Lakers]

I'd say that you're in denial. Or obdurate.

It's a matter of opinion but a lot of people see 2016 and 2019 the same. The Lebron fans are going to disagree, naturally.
:roll:

This is beyond dumb, since when does losing Draymond for one game compare to losing Durant pretty much the entire series and Klay for over a game.

2015 and 2019 are the same, not 2016.

[SamuraiSWISH]

no

what happened there? officiating wise?

all I know about '12 is refs saving KD from fouling out in g2 when he ran over battier
Are you kidding me? You’re delusional about the game six in Utah.

But you can’t see the poor officiating in 2012? Heat literally won a game off an absolutely ridiculous poor call. Not to mention it was a lockout shortened season that massively benefited younger teams?

And then not only that, the officiating in the 2016 finals?

Where Curry was blistering hot in Cleveland game 6 and then was saddled with ticky-tacky fouls in order to get him out of the game as quickly as possible.

Thus causing Curry to have a meltdown and throw a tantrum and his mouthpiece into the stands? They were going to win that game. The league wanted it to go seven.

This is besides the fact they suspended Draymond Green for what really wasn’t a technical foul. Where LeBron was instigating the whole thing.

[RealSkipBayless]

2016 was just as much of an asterisk ring as 2019 was. Either both are or neither is.
Bro there is too much a difference to call it the same.
Most of the key players for the Warriors were playing hurt. Durant basically did not play, Thompson missed a game and left the crucial game 6. 2016 was Draymond being gone for a single game. I can't tell if you disagree based on the fact that you view Draymond as a superstar or because you actually believe a depleted squad is on the same level as one person being gone a game.

[Vino24]

why is Draymond being out one game viewed as more crucial than KLove being out one game and being injured? Either LeBron had help or he didn't which is it? :lol

[Cleverness]

2016 was just as much of an asterisk ring as 2019 was. Either both are or neither is.

yep

been sayin' it for years

only way teams beat Warriors is when they're injured/suspended

Curry's never lost a playoff series when his team is healthy

[Vino24]

yep

been sayin' it for years

only way teams beat Warriors is when they're injured/suspended

Curry's never lost a playoff series when his team is healthy
KLove was out one game and suffered concussion symptoms the rest of the series. Is he a good player or did LeBron pull some miracle shit?

[tpols]

So the lakers have two top 10 players right now... some might say top 5.

that means they should be title favorites or bust.

[RRR3]

So the lakers have two top 10 players right now... some might say top 5.

that means they should be title favorites or bust.
The Lakers had two top 10 players going into 2012-2013. What happened?

[tpols]

The Lakers had two top 10 players going into 2012-2013. What happened?


current AD is way better than post back injury dwight.

plus young talent like kuzma.. kobe had retirement folk by comparison.

no comparison...

[3ball]

Bro there is too much a difference to call it the same.
Most of the key players for the Warriors were playing hurt. Durant basically did not play, Thompson missed a game and left the crucial game 6. 2016 was Draymond being gone for a single game. I can't tell if you disagree based on the fact that you view Draymond as a superstar or because you actually believe a depleted squad is on the same level as one person being gone a game.
Compare Curry and Klay's 2016 and 2019 Finals stats - now how can you say Kawhi didn't beat a much better and more experienced team?.. it's not even close

And durant's 1 quarter boost in Game 5 offset klay's missed quarter in game 6 - so Klay only missed one game just like Draymond in 16'... Boogie (9/6) and Looney (5/5) were upgrades over Bogut in 16' (3/3), and the remaining players are essentially a wash

Curry/Klay/Dray are the driving factors, and they were WAY better in 2019 than 16'... You have no case - Kawhi superceded lebron's accomplishment by winning in less games

[RealSkipBayless]

Compare Curry and Klay's 2016 and 2019 Finals stats - now how can you say Kawhi didn't beat a much better and more experienced team?.. it's not even close

And durant's 1 quarter boost in Game 5 offset klay's missed quarter in game 6 - so Klay only missed one game just like Draymond in 16'... Boogie (9/6) and Looney (5/5) were upgrades over Bogut in 16' (3/3), and the remaining players are essentially a wash

Curry/Klay/Dray are the driving factors, and they were WAY better in 2019 than 16'... You have no case - Kawhi superceded lebron's accomplishment by winning in less games
I'm the last person to say anything positive about Lebron but this asinine. I can shit all over lebron for being a flopping ***** that choked and colluded non stop but his 2016 accomplishment was legit. This finals saw Curry injured his finger in the previous round, Klay, Boogie, Iggy, Looney were all playing at like 60%. Durant barely played there is no offsetting at all. It is a depleted squad that the Raptors got to feast on. Compare that to Lebron leading in every category and beating the greatest team ever, it's not even close.

Lebron is not better than Jordan. Everyone knows this. You can still give him his due.

[3ball]

I'm the last person to say anything positive about Lebron but this asinine. I can shit all over lebron for being a flopping ***** that choked and colluded non stop but his 2016 accomplishment was legit. This finals saw Curry injured his finger in the previous round, Klay, Boogie, Iggy, Looney were all playing at like 60%. Durant barely played there is no offsetting at all. It is a depleted squad that the Raptors got to feast on. Compare that to Lebron leading in every category and beating the greatest team ever, it's not even close.

Lebron is not better than Jordan. Everyone knows this. You can still give him his due.
You missed my point - no one said lebron's 16' accomplishment wasn't legit

But Kawhi's was too, and in many ways more legit, as I described

And yes, Kawhi beating the KD-less Warriors takes the shine off Lebron's 16' - it's absolutely legit, but obviously not a goat accomplishment or anything.. :confusedshrug: .. that's the bs narrative that Kawhi single-handedly destroyed

And kawhi didn't diminish lebron, but he exposed the kd-less Warriors - they're now 8-10 in the Finals without lebron and 0-3 in the series overall, if not for injuries in 15'
.

[RealSkipBayless]

Let me get this straight.

So 3ball thinks that because Durant did not play in both the 2016 and 2019 finals and each had a player miss a game it somehow makes them equal? Does he not think the salary Durant took up when he joined was not used for other players in the 16 squad? I guess all those reports of Looney, Boogie, Iggy, and Klay being hurt were all fake according to 3ball.

He actually believes that Kawhi Leonard beating an injury riddled Warriors team is more impressive than what Lebron did. Well today I learned that there is not liking Lebron and then there is obsessively hating him into delusion.

[3ball]

Let me get this straight.

So 3ball thinks that because Durant did not play in both the 2016 and 2019 finals and each had a player miss a game it somehow makes them equal? Does he not think the salary Durant took up when he joined was not used for other players in the 16 squad? I guess all those reports of Looney, Boogie, Iggy, and Klay being hurt were all fake according to 3ball.

He actually believes that Kawhi Leonard beating an injury riddled Warriors team is more impressive than what Lebron did. Well today I learned that there is not liking Lebron and then there is obsessively hating him into delusion.
the fact that the team's best player/league MVP was banged up and underperformed in 16' makes my case, even without considering Iggy/Bogut's injuries or Dray's suspension...

Obviously, if curry played the 19' Finals like he played the 16' Finals, the Warriors get swept easily... :confusedshrug: ... Same goes for Klay, who sucked in 16' compared to 19'

And the guys I bolded above in your post (boogie, looney, Iggy) all played and played better than their 16' counterparts, who were injured or played similarly/worse

Essentially, both the 16' and 19' Warriors were banged up, and that was the narrative at the time (that the 16' Warriors were banged up) - you're simply revising common knowledge history, just like the media, because you want to believe the Warriors are a juggernaut without KD and lebron's win was all-time great.. but the kd-less Warriors are 8-10 without KD and essentially 0-3 in Finals series if not for injuries in 15'

Again, the fact that the team's best player/league MVP was banged up and underperformed in 16' (curry) makes the case even without considering all the other injuries and suspensions that the Warriors were burdened with in 16'

[Mr Feeny]

Bro there is too much a difference to call it the same.
Most of the key players for the Warriors were playing hurt. Durant basically did not play, Thompson missed a game and left the crucial game 6. 2016 was Draymond being gone for a single game. I can't tell if you disagree based on the fact that you view Draymond as a superstar or because you actually believe a depleted squad is on the same level as one person being gone a game.

Who was playing hurt in 2019? I dont want to hear about Durant because he wasnt on the 2016 team. Steph was perfectly healthy, as was Draymond. Klay might have been slightly debilitated had he played the game that he was a game-time decision for, but didnt. By the next game, he certainly looked fine to me and most people who watched the series.

Conversely, Curry was clearly hobbled in 2016 as he was recovering from his MCL. He couldnt even get past Kevin Love on isolations. That's how badly he was hobbled.

Thompson missed 5 quarters here and Durant played a quarter to offer that, while Darymond missed a game in 2016.

There definitely isnt "too much of a difference" to anything. If 2019 is an asterisk, then 1016 definitely was.

[Mr Feeny]

why is Draymond being out one game viewed as more crucial than KLove being out one game and being injured? Either LeBron had help or he didn't which is it? :lolklay was fine when he came back. Curry was more hurt in 2016 than Klay was here, so you're not winning that argument.