Tim Duncan has won with the least amount of help of any ATG in NBA history...

[Gunslinger]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.


Michael Jordan

1991 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1998 - No other All-Star.


Hakeem Olajuwon

1994 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1995 - No other All-Star.


No one else worth mentioning. Looked up Kobe's help since 3ball is intellectually dishonest and found that he had an All-NBA and All-Star on every single one of his chips.

:oldlol:

[SouBeachTalents]

Robinson, Parker, Manu, Kawhi and having Pop as your coach for your entire career is a pretty solid supporting cast bro :lol

[StrongLurk]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.


Michael Jordan

1991 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1998 - No other All-Star.


Hakeem Olajuwon

1994 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1995 - No other All-Star.


No one else worth mentioning. Looked up Kobe's help since 3ball is intellectually dishonest and found that he had an All-NBA and All-Star on every single one of his chips.

:oldlol:

How many current allstar/all nba players on the teams played against in the finals Gunslinger?

[Gunslinger]

Robinson, Parker, Manu, Kawhi and having Pop as your coach for your entire career is a pretty solid supporting cast bro :lol

He had all those guys for his entire career, including all his rings and in their prime?

:roll:


1999 Finals

Duncan: 27/14/2/1/2 on 54/80
Robinson: 16/12/2/1/3 on 42/70


2003 Finals

Duncan: 24/17/5/1/5 on 50/69
Parker: 14/3/4 on 38/43/61
Robinson: 11/7/1/1/2 on 61/70
Manu: 8/4/2/2 on 35/21/81

[Gunslinger]

How many current allstar/all nba players on the teams played against in the finals Gunslinger?

Why does that matter when he had to go through Kobe/Shaq for the first two rings, Malone/Stockton the first ring, Dirk/Nash/Finley/Van Exel second ring, 4 all-star defending champ Detroit Pistons team that had just rekt the Shaq/Kobe/Malone/Payton superteam the previous season and Wade/Shaq that same playoffs, Amar'e/Nash/Marion for 4th ring, Aldridge/Lilliard, Durant/Westbrook and LeBron/Wade/Bosh/Allen superteam back to back champs for 5th ring?

Everyone knows that the WCF was the real finals for a lot of the chips back then and Duncan is top 3 for most 50-win teams defeated in the post-season.

[StrongLurk]

Why does that matter when he had to go through Kobe/Shaq for the first two rings, Malone/Stockton the first ring, Dirk/Nash/Finley/Van Exel second ring, 4 all-star defending champ Detroit Pistons team that had just rekt the Shaq/Kobe/Malone/Payton superteam the previous season and Wade/Shaq that same playoffs, Amar'e/Nash/Marion for 4th ring, Aldridge/Lilliard, Durant/Westbrook and LeBron/Wade/Bosh/Allen superteam back to back champs for 5th ring?

Everyone knows that the WCF was the real finals for a lot of the chips back then and Duncan is top 3 for most 50-win teams defeated in the post-season.

Finals comp?

Or how about WCF comp as well?

[CoastalRyan]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.


Michael Jordan

1991 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1998 - No other All-Star.


Hakeem Olajuwon

1994 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1995 - No other All-Star.


No one else worth mentioning. Looked up Kobe's help since 3ball is intellectually dishonest and found that he had an All-NBA and All-Star on every single one of his chips.

:oldlol:I'm a Duncan fan so not to take away from your point but this speaks way more to Parker and Ginobili not getting the credit they deserved in those years.

If Manu would have left SA in his prime and jacked up as many shots as a Harden or Russell he'd be in the conversation for top 20 all time. There are a a number of teams that could have easily run their offense through him.

Parker on the other hand had some stellar years and probably would have had way more assists had he not been on a team built around half court ball movement. Even the years where they played up tempo... they still worked the ball a lot in the half court.

[SamuraiSWISH]

He actually had a stronger cast top to bottom than any of those guys. 1994 Hakeem didn’t play with another all star but he had a really great cast as well.

[Marchesk]

inb4 3Ball

[Locked_Up_Tonight]

https://fivethirtyeight.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/paine-datalab-lebron-cast-2.png?w=575

[Marchesk]

https://fivethirtyeight.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/paine-datalab-lebron-cast-2.png?w=575

So from that, the 1996 Sonics had the third most talented team in finals history?

[warriorfan]

Duncan sometimes doesn’t get a lot of hype because of a not very flashy game and the fact he never went back to back. They had a Dynasty though, 03,05,07, and in the hunt all the other years. He was a great player and they were a great team.

[Locked_Up_Tonight]

So from that, the 1996 Sonics had the third most talented team in finals history?

Talented? May not be the right word.

[Hey Yo]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.


Michael Jordan

1991 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1998 - No other All-Star.


Hakeem Olajuwon

1994 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1995 - No other All-Star.


No one else worth mentioning. Looked up Kobe's help since 3ball is intellectually dishonest and found that he had an All-NBA and All-Star on every single one of his chips.

:oldlol:
Pippen made All-defensive team in 1991

[The Iron Fist]

Does this mean guys who aren

[AussieSteve]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.



DRob was AS and All-NBA in 98, 00 and 01. There was no AS game in 99.

In 2003 TD had 3 other guys who were all AS either 2 years prior or 2 years after.

In 2005, manu was an AS and Parker was AS for 3 out of the next 4 years

In 2007, TD wasn't even FMVP.

TD also had one of the GOAT coaches who continues to take average rosters 50 wins each year.

This thread is analogous to saying lebron won in 2016 without any all stars

[MoBe1Kanobi]

Ok let me be honest

I don't really know what this thread is about other than Tim Duncan

So let me just say this

As someone who watched Timmy in his prime all the time as a fan of the Kings and Kobe..

NOBODY feared Tim Duncan.

At least nobody I knew.

When the Kings/Kobe played the Spurs I was like eh, CWebb/Shaq will handle em fine...

When we played KEVIN GARNETT

Schhit.

I just prayed my bigs made it out the game safely that night.

Timmy D :roll:

[TheCorporation]

Now do LeBron's all NBA teammates

These results may shock you

[TheCorporation]

Imagine listing Duncan and forgetting he didn't win FMVP in 2007 and he lost as a ONE seed to an EIGHT seed in 2011


Just. Imagine. It.

[Loco 50]

Ok let me be honest

I don't really know what this thread is about other than Tim Duncan

So let me just say this

As someone who watched Timmy in his prime all the time as a fan of the Kings and Kobe..

NOBODY feared Tim Duncan.

At least nobody I knew.

When the Kings/Kobe played the Spurs I was like eh, CWebb/Shaq will handle em fine...

When we played KEVIN GARNETT

Schhit.

I just prayed my bigs made it out the game safely that night.

Timmy D :roll:
:roll: :roll: Back at you Kings fan.

Maybe if your team were good enough to make it to the big time you'd know Duncan a bit better.

Here's some numbers for you:

Regular season: 120 Wins for them Spurs
58 Wins for them Kangs

Playoffs: Only 4-2 Spurs because your team has been historically awful.

Most of that work being done by Tim and the crew over his 19 year career.

:yaohappy:

Fears Garnett will hurt his players :wtf: ......turn in your mancard cause you're a candy ass.

[Gunslinger]

Does this mean guys who aren’t all stars are bad players? Or is too much stock put into being an all star?

The latter is true, but it's not that they are bad players necessarily, more that they are role-players. They can be solid role-players that play their role well.

I think you have to look at what they did in the post-season those years rather than whether they made an all-star or all nba squad as well.

Someone might reference Parker being an all-star in 2007, but forget that in 2003 he was a rookie who put up 14 points on 38%. But someone like 3ball will consider that being "all-star help" because he eventually became an all-star at a later point in his career. This is called intellectual dishonesty. The same applies to counting Iggy as all-star help for Curry this post-season or Shaq as all-star help for LeBron when they played together.

[Loco 50]

Imagine listing Duncan and forgetting he didn't win FMVP in 2007 and he lost as a ONE seed to an EIGHT seed in 2011


Just. Imagine. It.
Trying to imagine Timmy missing the playoffs, but I can't cause it never happened.

:yaohappy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAmM1F175DM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNGv-GSwOV0

[Loco 50]

Someone might reference Parker being an all-star in 2007, but forget that in 2003 he was a rookie who put up 14 points on 38%. But someone like 3ball will consider that being "all-star help" because he eventually became an all-star at a later point in his career. This is called intellectual dishonesty. The same applies to counting Iggy as all-star help for Curry this post-season or Shaq as all-star help for LeBron when they played together.

Nevermind the fact that Pop had to bench Parker for the legendary Speedy Claxton because he was doing his damndest to lose to Jersey of all teams.

[1987_Lakers]

People lack context, from 2003-2007 there were no super teams, unless you want to include the 2004 Lakers with ancient Malone and Payton. You had the Mavs winning 67 games with Dirk and role players, relative to their competition the Spurs had elite talent, maybe the Suns were more talented, but they didn't have Popovich.

[MoBe1Kanobi]

:roll: :roll: Back at you Kings fan.

Maybe if your team were good enough to make it to the big time you'd know Duncan a bit better.

Here's some numbers for you:

Regular season: 120 Wins for them Spurs
58 Wins for them Kangs

Playoffs: Only 4-2 Spurs because your team has been historically awful.

Most of that work being done by Tim and the crew over his 19 year career.

:yaohappy:

Fears Garnett will hurt his players :wtf: ......turn in your mancard cause you're a candy ass.

Tell me the record of the two teams against each other head to head from 99-06

[Loco 50]

Tell me the record of the two teams against each other head to head from 99-06
:oldlol: The other years mean nothing. We only need your snapshot, huh. :oldlol:

FOH, Kings fan. Talk shit when your team actually accomplishes something.

The shame of it all is I've never had any animosity towards your team until you started chirping.

[houston]

No team haven't won without 2 all-star quality talents.

[3ball]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.


Michael Jordan

1991 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1998 - No other All-Star.


Hakeem Olajuwon

1994 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1995 - No other All-Star.


No one else worth mentioning. Looked up Kobe's help since 3ball is intellectually dishonest and found that he had an All-NBA and All-Star on every single one of his chips.

:oldlol:
Only Kobe & MJ won multiple rings with 1 all-star teammate, except Shaq (who had Kobe), and Hakeem (when MJ was out of the league)

Where's the intellectual dishonesty

[MoBe1Kanobi]

:oldlol: The other years mean nothing. We only need your snapshot, huh. :oldlol:

FOH, Kings fan. Talk shit when your team actually accomplishes something.

The shame of it all is I've never had any animosity towards your team until you started chirping.

I'm a Kobe fan first

So

Please address me from that standpoint when it comes to talking about the Spurs

[Loco 50]

I'm a Kobe fan first

So

Please address me from that standpoint when it comes to talking about the Spurs
Now it all makes sense. Timmy made your boy cry and you took that shit hard.

[Loco 50]

Only Kobe & MJ won multiple rings with 1 all-star teammate, except Shaq (who had Kobe), and Hakeem (when MJ was out of the league)

Where's the intellectual dishonesty
Richmond, Rice and Odom. Definitely not all-star level talent. Definitely.

[houston]

Otis Thorpe was all-star in 92 and by far the Rockets second best player in 94. Once you been selected to an all-star game you are forever all-star quality player. Coaches do have bias and agendas when they select players and it is a such thing call all-star snubs. Even this year Finals Raptors won but Leonard,Gasol, and Lowery been in multi all-star games.

[SouBeachTalents]

Otis Thorpe was all-star in 92 and by far the Rockets second best player in 94. Once you been selected to an all-star game you are forever all-star quality player. Coaches do have bias and agendas when they select players and it is a such thing call all-star snubs. Even this year Finals Raptors won but Leonard,Gasol, and Lowery been in multi all-star games.
Absolutely wrong :lol Injuries happen and players eventually get old & decline

[Mr Feeny]

Absolutely wrong :lol Injuries happen and players eventually get old & decline

Even then, all star appearances dont mean you're quality. It's a popularity contest at times.

[houston]

Absolutely wrong :lol Injuries happen and players eventually get old & decline


if you still providing something vital to team success. An all-star is an all-star man. No team haven't won without 2 all-star quality players.

[Mr Feeny]

if you still providing something vital to team success. An all-star is an all-star man. No team haven't won without 2 all-star quality players.

But that's the thing. If "an all star is an all star", then logic dictates than someone who wasnt selected to the all star game must not be all star calibre, according to that statement.

It's a silly one because the 1991 and 1998 Bulls didnt have another all star besides Michael Jordan. But it doesnt mean that some of the players on the Bulls weren't great.

[houston]

But that's the thing. If "an all star is an all star", then logic dictates than someone who wasnt selected to the all star game must not be all star calibre, according to that statement.

It's a silly one because the 1991 and 1998 Bulls didnt have another all star besides Michael Jordan. But it doesnt mean that some of the players on the Bulls weren't great.


Pippen was all-nba 3rd team 98. Pip was all-star 90 my thing is coaches select the players. It snubs and all that go along with that but it all balance out at the end. That why no team never won without 2 allstar quality players. All-star just mean your stats and play on the court is valued by your peers.

That why players are refer alot times as former all-star such and such.

[Mr Feeny]

Pippen was all-nba 3rd team 98. Pip was all-star 90 my thing is coaches select the players. It snubs and all that go along with that but it all balance out at the end. That why no team never won without 2 allstar quality players. All-star just mean your stats and play on the court is valued by your peers.

That why players are refer alot times as former all-star such and such.

Yeah but we we are now shifting goalposts. All star quality is subjective, which is my point precisely. I dont need an all star selection to tell me that someone is a great player.

I think I know what you mean but we've got to stop with the "all stat" labels, unless we are going to be consistent and only put stock in all star selections.

[Loco 50]

Yeah but we we are now shifting goalposts. All star quality is subjective, which is my point precisely. I dont need an all star selection to tell me that someone is a great player.

I think I know what you mean but we've got to stop with the "all stat" labels, unless we are going to be consistent and only put stock in all star selections.
Are you trying to tell us that non all-star Lamar Odom was better than all-star Tyrone Hill or all-star Chris Gatling, because I'm sure 3ball can come up with some asinine 3 page dissertation on the subject that changes absolutely nobody else's mind.

[Mr Feeny]

Are you trying to tell us that non all-star Lamar Odom was better than all-star Tyrone Hill or all-star Chris Gatling, because I'm sure 3ball can come up with some asinine 3 page dissertation on the subject that changes absolutely nobody else's mind.

:lol what on earth? No. I dont want 3ball in here with a disquisition.

[houston]

Yeah but we we are now shifting goalposts. All star quality is subjective, which is my point precisely. I dont need an all star selection to tell me that someone is a great player.

I think I know what you mean but we've got to stop with the "all stat" labels, unless we are going to be consistent and only put stock in all star selections.


nah that separate the good very good great. all-star just validate the player

[iamgine]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.


Michael Jordan

1991 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1998 - No other All-Star.


Hakeem Olajuwon

1994 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1995 - No other All-Star.


No one else worth mentioning. Looked up Kobe's help since 3ball is intellectually dishonest and found that he had an All-NBA and All-Star on every single one of his chips.

:oldlol:
If you are judging help only by how many all nba/all star teammate then that is the conclusion.

However, in the real world, it's not that simple.

[ninephive]

Tim Duncan

1999 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2003 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
2005 - No other All-NBA.
2007 - No other All-NBA.


Michael Jordan

1991 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1998 - No other All-Star.


Hakeem Olajuwon

1994 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.
1995 - No other All-Star.


No one else worth mentioning. Looked up Kobe's help since 3ball is intellectually dishonest and found that he had an All-NBA and All-Star on every single one of his chips.

:oldlol:
Tony Parker:

2014 - No other All-NBA or All-Star.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

His own teammate, David Robinson, played with less help throughout the 90s.

You give him guys like Tony Parker and Ginobili? Kawhi? Wont argue he'd be as successful but ringing isn't off the table.

[Gunslinger]

Only Kobe & MJ won multiple rings with 1 all-star teammate, except Shaq (who had Kobe), and Hakeem (when MJ was out of the league)

Where's the intellectual dishonesty

*cracks knuckles*

Well, first off, it's cherry-picking. Why go by all-star and not all-nba? Oh, because it makes your guy look better and is in line with your agenda.

Second off, Pippen was clearly all-star caliber for all 6 rings. He played DPOY defense and put up all-star numbers in the playoffs, outplaying many first options of the competition in the playoffs. Show me where Parker outplayed any first options in 2003. Jordan had more help, simple as that.

Third off, Duncan didn't have an all-star teammate for '99 and '03 anyways, so you're outright lying even by your cherry-picked conditions.

[sdot_thadon]

Nobody won with less than dream did in 94.