Lebron's weak mid-range = less timely scorer, so he needs more offensive help than...

[3ball]

guys like Kawhi, Kobe or MJ, whose superior mid-range repertoires could keep the team afloat or give the team a boost whenever needed

(mid-range shots don't need to be open, and can therefore be taken anytime regardless of contest)

Since Lebron can't convert these shots at-will, he needs additional star power to carry some of the timely shot burden and essentially "close" for him

This is why Lebron needed more help than Kawhi, Kobe and MJ to win

[superduper]

William "3ball" Shakespeare :applause:

[Gus Hemmingway]

Jordan needed more rebounding and assisting help than LeBron, hence 4 rebounds and 2 assists

[Marchesk]

So, what I'm getting from this is that Lebron and Shaq wouldn't have won titles together?

[3ball]

Jordan needed more rebounding and assisting help than LeBron, hence 4 rebounds and 2 assists
Wade and Kyrie average more assists than Pippen and are better playmakers, so they're more assisting help than Pippen was

And MJ led the Bulls in playoff assists in 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993, 1997 - that's 6 of 9 playoff runs alongside Pippen

So you're wrong on the assists, and lots of guys won averaging 4 rebs, which is less important than MJ's scoring edge anyway

Finally, you're referencing and only 1 Finals out of 6, and MJ was literally the most timely scorer ever in that Finals - the 1998 Finals is the textbook for timely scoring and clutch, which trumps everything
.

[PP34Deuce]

Work smarter, not harder.

Honestly it's the biggest difference between Gen X and Gen Y.

Players of yesteryear felt working hard was slaving hours upon hours and doing something until it turned out right. it's not a bad mindset

Some guys can do all that work but choose to find ways to work smarter so it creates more time for them to do other things.

You can copy and paste all your Lebron hate as much as you want and it's losing effectiveness because even Lebron fans don't rate him above MJ. The facts and eye test all lend to MJ being the GOAT.

What else is there to complain about? Kobe I guess.

[3ball]

Work smarter, not harder.

Honestly it's the biggest difference between Gen X and Gen Y.

Players of yesteryear felt working hard was slaving hours upon hours and doing something until it turned out right. it's not a bad mindset

Some guys can do all that work but choose to find ways to work smarter so it creates more time for them to do other things.


Developing teammates and teamwork results in better, more sustainable teams - these organic teams (Spurs, Mavs, Warriors) literally destroy Lebron's hodge-podge of mercenary teamwork nearly every year

So you don't know what ur talking about - lebron took a shortcut to achieve something less (weaker basketball teams).. that isn't working smarter fool; it's a cheat code and obviously the gamer that beats all the levels > cheat code winner

[ImKobe]

Work smarter, not harder.

Honestly it's the biggest difference between Gen X and Gen Y.

Players of yesteryear felt working hard was slaving hours upon hours and doing something until it turned out right. it's not a bad mindset

Some guys can do all that work but choose to find ways to work smarter so it creates more time for them to do other things.

You can copy and paste all your Lebron hate as much as you want and it's losing effectiveness because even Lebron fans don't rate him above MJ. The facts and eye test all lend to MJ being the GOAT.

What else is there to complain about? Kobe I guess.

Didn't know Cowherd posted on ISH.

[PP34Deuce]

Developing teammates and teamwork results in better, more sustainable teams - these organic teams (Spurs, Mavs, Warriors) literally destroy Lebron's hodge-podge of mercenary teamwork nearly every year

So you don't know what ur talking about - lebron took a shortcut to achieve something less (weaker basketball teams).. that's isn't working smarter fool; it's a cheat code and we know the gamer that beats all the levels > cheat code winner

Basketball isn't everything to some of these players. Some guys work smarter to still be competitive and put in a position to win and still win at life in other areas.

You work smart by copy and pasting your recycled statements in everyone's threads. So I agree that you know what you are talking about with working smarter.

[PP34Deuce]

Didn't know Cowherd posted on ISH.

Colin is entertaining.

[RealSkipBayless]

Colin is entertaining.
Silicon Valley, apple, google, divorce analogy, player mobility nick saban, Belichick, Darly Morley, Lebron good Westbrook bad, Sam Darnold

Rinse repeat. I enjoy it too

[3ball]

Basketball isn't everything to some of these players. Some guys work smarter to still be competitive and put in a position to win and still win at life in other areas.

You work smart by copy and pasting your recycled statements in everyone's threads. So I agree that you know what you are talking about with working smarter.
Previous eras did both - goat basketball achievements AND outside interests:

MJ is the first billionaire athlete, team owner, and had the ORIGINAL space jam, along with the goat shoe empire

Magic Johnson has a goat business empire too.. Isiah owned the CBA, Raptors and has a big business empire

So the only difference between today and previous eras is that things are HYPED in today era, whereas they were considered standard in prior eras and not hyped

[3ball]

So, what I'm getting from this is that Lebron and Shaq wouldn't have won titles together?


Maybe, but Lebron would never win with Pau

Or Pippen or Siakam

But yeah, anyone wins with Shaq... Ask Kobe or Wade, and we all know Penny would've won with him too..

of course, Shaq only had a dynasty with Kobe . Lebron couldn't have a dynasty with anyone - his style of play prevents the necessary teamwork or brand of ball (he'd never accept the triangle or Princeton offense, i.e. Blatt).

[PP34Deuce]

Previous eras did both - goat basketball achievements AND outside interests:

MJ is the first billionaire athlete, team owner, and had the ORIGINAL space jam, along with the goat shoe empire

Magic Johnson has a goat business empire too.. Isiah owned the CBA, Raptors and has a big business empire

So the only difference between today and previous eras is that things are HYPED in today era, whereas they were considered standard in prior eras and not hyped


Yup it took Jordan a longer time to hit that net worth. Magic as well. But those two men are outliers...

But by mentioning those men you basically affirmed lebron is a top 5-7 all time great.

Discussion is over. Thanks for your view point. Nothing else left to be said unless you are prepared with another copy and paste post.

Working smarter.

[SpaceJam2]

Doesn't Westbrook have a good midrange and couldn't win with Snake Durant? :lol

Doesn't John Wall have agood mid range, too?

Seems like they were only missing...Scottie Pippen :pimp:

[SpaceJam2]

Yup it took Jordan a longer time to hit that net worth. Magic as well. But those two men are outliers...

But by mentioning those men you basically affirmed lebron is a top 5-7 all time great.

Discussion is over. Thanks for your view point. Nothing else left to be said unless you are prepared with another copy and paste post.

Working smarter.

The truth with...


https://media1.giphy.com/media/Jm9LkLvAN5KUg/giphy.gif

The truth

[Manny98]

MJ needed more defensive help than anyone ever

He needed to be surrounded with at least 2 all time great defenders for all of his rings

What all time great defender did LeBron ever play with?

[3ball]

Yup it took Jordan a longer time to hit that net worth. Magic as well. But those two men are outliers...

But by mentioning those men you basically affirmed lebron is a top 5-7 all time great.

Discussion is over. Thanks for your view point. Nothing else left to be said unless you are prepared with another copy and paste post.

Working smarter.
Outside interests don't elevate your on-court play - ur conflating basketball with non-basketball, which makes no sense

Btw, most rings are still won organically - the Warriors/Mavs/Spurs destroy Lebron's hodge-podge of mercenary teamwork nearly every year - so ur just making excuses for a handful of top guys that can team-hop - ur hanging on the nut sack of the priviledged, which is the biggest sign of a bitch..

So you don't know what ur talking about - lebron took a shortcut to achieve something less (weaker basketball teams).. that isn't working smarter fool; it's a cheat code and obviously the gamer that beats all the levels > cheat code winner

[Vino24]

80's Bulls struggled for success even though MJ had nearly 4 - 20ppg scorers on his team :biggums:

[3ball]

80's Bulls struggled for success even though MJ had nearly 4 - 20ppg scorers on his team :biggums:
He had one 20-pt scorer (Woolridge)

But Cokeridge was nowhere near a top 3 player at his position in the conference (all-star), whereas Lebron had the East all-star center on his team in 05' but missed playoffs

But then Lebron added a new coach and a 1st team all-nba defender to his team, which allowed him go from 9 seed in 05', to 2-seeded Finals in 07', despite lesser personal stats from Lebron himself

[Vino24]

He had one 20-pt scorer (Woolridge)

But Cokeridge was nowhere near a top 3 player at his position in the conference (all-star), whereas Lebron had the East all-star center on his team in 05' but missed playoffs

But then Lebron added a new coach and a 1st team all-nba defender to his team, which allowed him go from 9 seed in 05', to 2-seeded Finals in 07', despite lesser personal stats from Lebron himselfBulls were stacked but they didn't have Pippen to elevate MJ past the 1st round

[3ball]

Bulls were stacked but they didn't have Pippen to elevate MJ past the 1st round
What was the difference between the 9-seeded Cavs in 05', and the 4-seeded Cavs in 06'??

Apparently, Lebron needed Mike Brown and a 22/5/5 first team defender to make the playoffs

:dancin:

[SpaceJam2]

Bulls were stacked but they didn't have Pippen to elevate MJ past the 1st round

Shit

:roll: :roll:

ITS OVA

[3ball]

MJ needed more defensive help than anyone ever


Not true for 2 reasons:

1) MJ had zero rim protection, while Lebron had tons.. Dave Corzine averaged 0.8 blocks, otherwise MJ never had anyone get more than 0.5... Otoh, Lebron had 3 guys getting 1.5+ blocks (Mosgov, Shaq, Zydrunas), plus McGee and Chandler.. So not close

2) MJ played with Pippen/Grant and Pippen/Rodman, but that's only 3 guys.. Lebron played with MORE decorated defenders - Wade, Battier, Hughes, Varejao - and more other good defenders like Bosh, Shumpert, Birdman, Haslem, Tristan, Crowder, and many more


So Lebron had more help on both ends of the floor, but had inferior leadership and culture on both ends, so his teams weren't known as juggernauts on either end... :confusedshrug:

[sdot_thadon]

Mj needed people to do everything else pretty much. Lebron just needed guys to help score. :oldlol:

[PP34Deuce]

Outside interests don't elevate your on-court play - ur conflating basketball with non-basketball, which makes no sense

Btw, most rings are still won organically - the Warriors/Mavs/Spurs destroy Lebron's hodge-podge of mercenary teamwork nearly every year - so ur just making excuses for a handful of top guys that can team-hop - ur hanging on the nut sack of the priviledged, which is the biggest sign of a bitch..

So you don't know what ur talking about - lebron took a shortcut to achieve something less (weaker basketball teams).. that isn't working smarter fool; it's a cheat code and obviously the gamer that beats all the levels > cheat code winner

The fact you got out your masculine frame by calling me a bitch kinda proves what I've been saying. You have no argument which is why you couldnt address my statements head on. You copy and paste statements because like I said in the post you aim to work smarter just like others. You're no different than the people you call out.

It's over. You're a legendary troll/MJ lover who will be replaced by another emotional overzealous fan any minute now. Feel free to copy and paste another couple statements..this is my last time paying attention to you 3Ball.

[3ball]

The fact you got out your masculine frame by calling me a bitch kinda proves what I've been saying. You have no argument which is why you couldnt address my statements head on. You copy and paste statements because like I said in the post you aim to work smarter just like others. You're no different than the people you call out.

It's over. You're a legendary troll/MJ lover who will be replaced by another emotional overzealous fan any minute now. Feel free to copy and paste another couple statements..this is my last time paying attention to you 3Ball.
Yeah you can't respond to the facts.. be gone.. ur defeated.. what else did you expect quoting Colin cowheard

[SamuraiSWISH]

guys like Kawhi, Kobe or MJ, whose superior mid-range repertoires could keep the team afloat or give the team a boost whenever needed

(mid-range shots don't need to be open, and can therefore be taken anytime regardless of contest)

Since Lebron can't convert these shots at-will, he needs additional star power to carry some of the timely shot burden and essentially "close" for him

This is why Lebron needed more help than Kawhi, Kobe and MJ to win
Well, exactly

[And1AllDay]

MJ needed more defensive help than anyone ever

He needed to be surrounded with at least 2 all time great defenders for all of his rings

What all time great defender did LeBron ever play with?

Another comment ignored by 2baLLLLLLLLLL

obv

[And1AllDay]

Mj needed people to do everything else pretty much. Lebron just needed guys to help score. :oldlol:

:oldlol: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Defend: Pippen
Rebound: Pippen/Rodman
Score: Kerr/Paxson/Pippen/Kukoc

[3ball]

Another comment ignored by 2baLLLLLLLLLL

obv
Responded to in post #24