Judging different types of passers

[insidehoops]

DISCUSS:

The difficulty of judging how good a passer is in

1) an offense where the other four guys are constantly just standing in the same spots out on the perimeter

vs

2) an offense where teammates actually cut/move.

[RRR3]

Oh boy this gonna be good. Incoming 3ball essays.

[Xiao Yao You]

What about someone like Rubio who is called a great passer but makes some of the stupidest and worst passes I've seen

[Manny98]

The 2016 & 2017 Cavs had statistically the greatest offense of any team ever

They're ball movement especially in 2017 was a joy to watch

And LeBron was obviously the main facilitator on that offense :applause:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erQl3K7NRnc

The best passers are the guys that can elevate the entire teams offense (LeBron & Nash()

Guys like Rondo are overrated as passers as they don't make the offense better and force assists

[Manny98]

What about someone like Rubio who is called a great passer but makes some of the stupidest and worst passes I've seen
Rubio falls into the Rondo category

Guys that get a lot of assists but don't elevate the entire offense or make anyone better

[Im so nba'd out]

LeBron is a much better passer than Jokic no matter how simple you try to make the way lebron plays seem OP.

going 1 on 5 with all of your useless teams spotting up > hitting someone on backdoor cuts because their defender fell asleep

its not close and anyone who ever played the game knows this. :oldlol:


a brain dead moron can hit someone cutting back door.


a brain dead moron cannot collapse a whole defense, then make the correct pass even with 4 defenders stunting,blitzing,trapping,stripping at,ect him

[Im so nba'd out]

Thishttps://thumbs.gfycat.com/PessimisticGenerousCockatiel-size_restricted.gifhttps://thumbs.gfycat.com/PleasedHighGoldfinch-size_restricted.gif
is not = to this in difficulty
https://media3.giphy.com/media/cEYFeDInNuHzdGMFjag/giphy.gifhttps://media.giphy.com/media/3o72FbBe8ZxeSLoDJe/giphy.gif

There are levels to this man

btw he can make those"amazing incredible wow how did he do that" Jokic type passes too https://i.gifer.com/AOUt.gif

[GimmeThat]

I think you're talking play maker and passing skills

one of the key component contributing to Magic Johnson who was 6-9 and played the point has something to do with the shot clock

according to wik: the NBA has had a 24 shot clock since 1954, The American Basketball League used a 30-second shot clock for its two years in existence (1961

[LAmbruh]

most call it luck


but I call it a work of art and aesthetic


-[I]The Kobe Assist

[iamgine]

DISCUSS:

The difficulty of judging how good a passer is in

1) an offense where the other four guys are constantly just standing in the same spots out on the perimeter

vs

2) an offense where teammates actually cut/move.
It's different, not one pass is better. Depending on the situation. i.e what defense the opponent excels at, do they have strong man defender, etc. If the other four guys are just standing in the same spots, then the opponent can easily anticipate the pass. Both take timing, skill and precision but different challenges.

[superduper]

Bran devolves all of his teammates to spot up shooters that just stand around with zero ball/player movement. The only one allowed to get stats in Bran ball is.... you guessed it, Bran.

Meanwhile the Triangle is designed to REDUCE individual statpadding and maximizes player and ball movement at the whim of the wing player orchestrating it all.

[brooks_thompson]

All's I know is I think Manu Ginobili is the best passer ever, at least since I started watching in '93. Jokic is rapidly on the rise. I tend to forget how good Lebron can be because it seems like these days it's mostly just ho-hum drive to the middle of the lane, jump, use hangtime and hit the open man for 3 at the last available millisecond. There was more variety in the Miami offense, and he had off the charts chemistry with Wade.

[DoctorP]

https://media3.giphy.com/media/cEYFeDInNuHzdGMFjag/giphy.gif

sick

[brooks_thompson]

https://media3.giphy.com/media/cEYFeDInNuHzdGMFjag/giphy.gif

sick

It's solid, but that's his strength on display more than anything. He's got hundreds of passes that top that. He almost always puts em right on the money though.

[DoctorP]

It's solid, but that's his strength on display more than anything. He's got hundreds of passes that top that. He almost always puts em right on the money though.

Oh, for sure. LeBron can pass, he doesn't have the crazy passes of a White CHocolate, Magic or Maravich but he makes solid passes on cuts. Better than most at his size.

He's like a hybrid of Stockton and Webber when it come to his passing game.

I'm intrigued to see him start at PG. It's about time, really. Maybe too late, actually. Not sure his footspeed will be there.

[Manny98]

https://media3.giphy.com/media/cEYFeDInNuHzdGMFjag/giphy.gif

sick
:bowdown: :bowdown:

[Manny98]

Bran devolves all of his teammates to spot up shooters that just stand around with zero ball/player movement. The only one allowed to get stats in Bran ball is.... you guessed it, Bran.

Meanwhile the Triangle is designed to REDUCE individual statpadding and maximizes player and ball movement at the whim of the wing player orchestrating it all.
What's this then?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erQl3K7NRnc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fNKEjMIyr0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYXYYaSruYw

[LAmbruh]

What's this then?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erQl3K7NRnc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fNKEjMIyr0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYXYYaSruYw
crazy, and to think under a wide magnitude of systems LBJ flourishes as an elite passer among them all. :bowdown:

similarly under the same non-triangle system, Kobe also hits usual quota

(less dimes, less boards, less steals, less blocks, less points, most shots :( )
https://i.postimg.cc/zB2jXqjk/ghkghkghjk.png

[pauk]

None of those....

The difficulty of judging how good a passer is has nothing to do with how your players are located, if they are making cuts or camping.... not entirely on assist numbers / stats either... its mostly visual, something you have to see for yourself:

an offense where the ball distributor consistently, efficiently in volumes displays an array of difficult & creative passes successfully with mostly good outcome... accurate on target passes (to the shooting pocket), off-hand, behind the back, handoffs, lobs, hooks, bounce passes, between the legs (between even defenders legs), no-look, long distance, wrist flicks, crosscourt, threading the needle, passes from/to weirdest angles, curving it around, lazer sniper beams, speed on those passes aswell, fooling the defense, punishing the defense... creating something out of nothing, sometimes even before the teammate knows he would be open totally surprising him..... vision... iq...

TL;DR: See Magic, Lebron, Bird, Kidd, Nash etc.

[MoBe1Kanobi]

Often the best, and most overlooked and underrated passer, isnt the guy who can get drive and kick like LeBron or the guy who does wrap around behind the back passes after splitting a defense like Kobe...

It's actually the guy who understands the pass before the pass. The guy who makes a simple pass to the next man running up court way earlier than would count for an official assist and allowing a man who's already open to make a decision that is much easier since you gave him 3-5 more dribbles to assess a full array of options on a fast break and allowing him to read a much less prepared defense. The kind of passer who not only passes the ball through narrow spaces but the kind of passer who might moreso purposely pass the ball to a lesser player early in the shot clock in order to LET him iso and build up his confidence over the course of a season. These guys are truly selfless and an absolute rarity in professional sports. It truly takes a man of God and proper maturity to be this kind of passer.

The only passers I can seem to remember off the top of my head in the league right now who play like this is Iman Shumpert, Alex Caruso, Patrick Beverly, Kevin Durant, and Kawhi Leonard.

These guys might have the highest BBIQ in the NBA right now, seriously.