Kobe vs Lebron - Who is considered better?

[Duncan21formvp]

Pluses for Kobe - Beat Dwight with HCA and has beaten Duncan a few times.
Negatives for Kobe - Lost to Detroit with HCA and got swept by Dirk


Pluses for Lebron - He joined Wade, Kyrie and now Anthony Davis and beat an old 37+ year old Duncan
Negatives for Lebron - Won bronze medal twice, Lost to 38 year old Duncan and 2nd year Kawhi in massive beating. Got outplayed by Jason Terry, and lost to Dwight Howard in a series.

So who is considered better?

[Sportal]

LeBron. It's really not close either. You would start a franchise with LeBron over Kobe every single day of the week. Especially if the rest of your roster was unknown and you had to make playoff basketball.

[Ainosterhaspie]

Kobe has more sidekick rings which makes sense since LeBron was never a sidekick. LeBron tops Kobe in everything else.

[sdot_thadon]

Lebron for years now, before Kobe's prime even ended.

[Vino24]

Lebron is consensus top 3. Kobe is just outside the top 10. Not even a comparison.

[SouBeachTalents]

Both better than Duncan

https://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2818167/duncanmiss.gif

[BigKobeFan]

Le11th

[superduper]

To be quite honest with everyone here I have Kobe 10th and Bran 11th.
-Manny

[Duncan21formvp]

Both better than Duncan

https://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2818167/duncanmiss.gif
Duncan has more rings than either with the same franchise as the man. All of which having to win 4 series a year.

[SpaceJam]

Kobe got outplayed by JET that same playoff season bro

[Vino24]

16-6

[stalkerforlife]

Kobe has more sidekick rings which makes sense since LeBron was never a sidekick. LeBron tops Kobe in everything else.

Bran was a sidekick and he failed miserably.

He wasn't even a top two scorer on his team in the finals in his prime.

So you're right, he wasn't a sidekick in a way...

He was third fiddle.

[andgar923]

Bron is the better 'player'
Kobe is the more 'skilled'

There are differences and it doesn't have to do with stats or accomplishments.

As to who I'd take completely depends on the team's needs and team's personnel.

[Bronbron23]

Duncan has more rings than either with the same franchise as the man. All of which having to win 4 series a year.
How? Duncan wasn't "the man" in 07 or 14. He has three as the man just like lebron

[SouBeachTalents]

How? Duncan wasn't "the man" in 07 or 14. He has three as the man just like lebron
Duncan was EASILY the Spurs best player in '07 and unquestionably better than Parker, it's honestly not even remotely close. A 4 game sample size against one of the worst Finals teams of all time doesn't change that. He'd also have a strong argument in 2014 as well

[tpols]

Kobe pretty easily.

LeBron doesn't play a winning style.

Old Duncan, dirk and curry handed him his ass in the playoffs imagine Kobe.

[Mr Feeny]

Kobe pretty easily.

LeBron doesn't play a winning style.

Old Duncan, dirk and curry handed him his ass in the playoffs imagine Kobe.

He's not playing them 1 on 1 though. Curry was on a better team in 2017 and 2018.

If you want to criticize him, Miami should have beaten the old spurs and definitely shouldn't have beaten Dallas. Lebron also choked away game games 4-6 against the warriors in 2015. But I wouldn't hold 2017 and 2018 against him.

[Bronbron23]

Duncan was EASILY the Spurs best player in '07 and unquestionably better than Parker, it's honestly not even remotely close. A 4 game sample size against one of the worst Finals teams of all time doesn't change that. He'd also have a strong argument in 2014 as well
Yes Duncan was better in 07 for most of the season. I was talking specifically about the finals where Duncan was still really good but Tony was insane that finals.

[stalkerforlife]

Almost impossible for Kobe to win a poll because he's so hated here and many other places. Zero objectivity.

Shocking he's leading right now with all the haters.

[DoctorP]

Kobe had more skill but LeBron is more effective overall due to athleticism and court awareness.

[TheMan]

LeBron's body plus Kobe's mentality is the GOAT...

As of now I have them ranked just like Manny98, Kobe at 10 and Bran at 11.

[bullettooth]

LeBron's body plus Kobe's mentality is the GOAT...

As of now I have them ranked just like Manny98, Kobe at 10 and Bran at 11.

Manny98 and the right call with LeBron at #11. :applause:

[Ainosterhaspie]

MVPs? LeBron
FMVPs? LeBron
1st Team All NBA? LeBron
Points/Rebounds/Assists/Steals/Blocks per game? LeBron
Playoff Points/Rebounds/Assists/Steals/Blocks per game? LeBron
TS%? LeBron.
Playoff TS%? LeBron
Playoff Buzzer Beaters, winners with 5, 24 seconds left? LeBron
Head to head? LeBron 16-6
Virtually every statistical measure points to LeBron usually by a comfortable margin, but young Kobe had prime Shaq while young LeBron had Ilgauskas so Kobe is better because he picked up those sidekick rings.

[DoctorP]

LA has the most fans in the world, including the billions in the Asian market. Popularity for Kobe and the Lakers will always distort opinion on message boards, etc.

I can see a time where people will believe Kobe was better than Jordan off pure psychological dissonance. Of course, they would be wrong.

[sportjames23]

To be quite honest with everyone here I have Kobe 10th and Bran 11th.
-Manny

Sounds about right. :cheers:

[CeltsGarlic]

I hate how every thread derails to become about Duncan

[Session]

Kobe has been better defender, better scorer and has won more rings in the same franchise:bowdown:

[red1]

just voted lebron thanks.

[Manny98]

LeBron is the GOAT

I have Kobe 11th

[Leviathon1121]

LeBron. It's really not close either. You would start a franchise with LeBron over Kobe every single day of the week. Especially if the rest of your roster was unknown and you had to make playoff basketball.
Honest question, why? Chances are LeBron is going to leave your team after a short period of time, so why would you pick him?

[Vino24]

[SpaceJam]

Almost impossible for Kobe to win a poll because he's so hated here and many other places. Zero objectivity.

Shocking he's leading right now with all the haters.

Gifted an all star appearances whilst coming off the bench doing nothing special
Gifted a sympathy MVP in 2008
Gifted constant all defense teams off name alone
Gifted a FMVP in 2010
Gifted all star appearances despite playing like trash post 2013

Really having a hard time agreeing with your point seeing as Kobe has been the leagues golden boy for quite some time

I mean Bron can

[PickernRoller]

Kobe by a fair margin.

I don't think there is any debate anymore tbh. All the narratives propping Bran have fallen. ALL OF THEM.

[AirTupac]

[QUOTE=Vino24]

[Mr Feeny]

Shows how much IQ you have if you even consider LeBron to be in the same realm as Kobe as a scorer :roll: :roll: :roll:

You're right . Lebron is on another tier entirely. A better scorer in the playoffs, regular season, and finals.

[ClipperRevival]

Gotta go with Manny here. Kobe 10th, LeBron 11th. Guys so smart.

[baudkarma]

Yes Duncan was better in 07 for most of the season. I was talking specifically about the finals where Duncan was still really good but Tony was insane that finals.

Parker went insane that finals because the Cavs were putrid at the PG position. Larry Hughes was the starter, Daniel Gibson his backup, and neither of them could stay anywhere close to Parker. When Hughes went down with an injury after game 2, the Cavs PG position was even thinner. The Spurs identified the biggest weakness in the Cavs lineup and attacked it relentlessly. That allowed Parker to shine, though Duncan was still the best player on the team and their best player throughout the playoffs.

[stalkerforlife]

24-24.

But when you factor in LeBron alts...

[Young X]

Kobe pretty easily.

LeBron doesn't play a winning style.

Old Duncan, dirk and curry handed him his ass in the playoffs imagine Kobe.And Billups, Nash, Garnett handed Kobe his ass in the playoffs. You can do better than that.

[kawhileonard2]

Still Kobe for sure according to most.

[Lebron23]

Still Kobe for sure according to most.

Can you please ban this douchebag??

[kawhileonard2]

Poll indicates how close it is.

[Lebron23]

Poll indicates how close it is.

You are a retarded Kobetard.

[Hey Yo]

Duncan with the 48TS% in the 2007 Finals.

Locked up by Big mediocre Z.

[Gudo]

Kobe owns lebron. Everyone knows that.

[kawhileonard2]

You are a retarded Kobetard.

Why the name calling? I didn't call you any names.

[Orange_Cassidy]

lebron is the more dominant player Ala shaq/wilt type physical advantages giving him most of his worth

but kobe is the better player. more polished. more skilled. more talented on both ends and is more respected by his piers because of it

only kobe has rings you can't knock (at least 2 out of his 5), and 2 out of the 3 that have asterisks are at least great performances in real seasons without some fake collusion from a sh*t era. and the 1 hes a definite #2 he saved shaqs butt twice.


so kobe has the more impressive career. but lebron has the more impressive individual accomplishments that are mostly due to him using hgh and steroids to extend his career long enough to pass kobe in most categories. truthfully his career ended in 2015. the Miami clinic and his 2 million dollar yearly expenses on maintaining his hulk like frame is why he passed kobe in points, all nba 1st teams and finals mvps


so kobe is considered better still. to everyone not named Jeff, Steve, 1987_lakers, a few realgm posters,, Henry Abbott from espn. nick Wright and Shannon Sharpe. Isiah and Dr J... other than these people I think its a landslide in favor of kobe among the hundreds of other big name people in and around the league. and fans worldwide definitely pick kobe over lebron

hes just lucky to have minions controlling media outlets and message boards. it's the only thing protecting him from being exposed as a cheater like Barry bonds and banished for life

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

lebron is the more dominant player Ala shaq/wilt type physical advantages giving him most of his worth

but kobe is the better player. more polished. more skilled. more talented on both ends and is more respected by his piers because of it

only kobe has rings you can't knock (at least 2 out of his 5), and 2 out of the 3 that have asterisks are at least great performances in real seasons without some fake collusion from a sh*t era. and the 1 hes a definite #2 he saved shaqs butt twice.


so kobe has the more impressive career. but lebron has the more impressive individual accomplishments that are mostly due to him using hgh and steroids to extend his career long enough to pass kobe in most categories. truthfully his career ended in 2015. the Miami clinic and his 2 million dollar yearly expenses on maintaining his hulk like frame is why he passed kobe in points, all nba 1st teams and finals mvps


so kobe is considered better still. to everyone not named Jeff, Steve, 1987_lakers, a few realgm posters,, Henry Abbott from espn. nick Wright and Shannon Sharpe. Isiah and Dr J... other than these people I think its a landslide in favor of kobe among the hundreds of other big name people in and around the league. and fans worldwide definitely pick kobe over lebron

hes just lucky to have minions controlling media outlets and message boards. it's the only thing protecting him from being exposed as a cheater like Barry bonds and banished for life

There are more than a few posters who have Bron > Kobe. Not just Jeff and that Lakers fan.

More players like Big O and Giannis. More media members too like Stephen A and Max Kellerman. I believe Skip also has Lebron over Kobe, as crazy as that sounds.

Disagree with just about everything in your post, but do agree with there being media propaganda.The Bron shills over at RealGm are comedy. If you're overly critical of him, you'll be debated by a few mods who think REAL criticism is trolling. You do it long enough, and there's a good chance you'll be banned. Reminds me of ESPN a few years back. When you couldn't say NOTHING about Bron. :lol He was untouchable over there up until recently. His move to LA kind of lulled even his most ardent supporters ... for whatever reason.

[RRR3]

There are more than a few posters who have Bron > Kobe. Not just Jeff and that Lakers fan.

More players like Big O and Giannis. More media members too like Stephen A and Max Kellerman. I believe Skip also has Lebron over Kobe, as crazy as that sounds.

Disagree with just about everything in your post, but do agree with there being media propaganda.The Bron shills over at RealGm are comedy. If you're overly critical of him, you'll be debated by a few mods who think REAL criticism is trolling. You do it long enough, and there's a good chance you'll be banned. Reminds me of ESPN a few years back, when you couldn't say NOTHING about Bron. :lol He was untouchable over there up until recently. His move to LA kind of lulled even his most ardent supporters.
You realize that’s Kenneth right? He knows LeBron is better. Throwing tantrums about it helps him sleep at night I guess.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

You realize that’s Kenneth right? He knows LeBron is better. Throwing tantrums about it helps him sleep at night I guess.

Yea I gathered that, hah

Ken's been saying the same crap for years tho. At this point, I don't even think its trolling.

[Atlantis]

Why is Kobe polling ahead of LeBron and here of all places? Thought Lebron was the clear cut better player...

[RRR3]

Why is Kobe polling ahead of LeBron and here of all places? Thought Lebron was the clear cut better player...
What do you mean “here of all places”? LeBron lost a poll to Dirk on this board lmao.

[Orange_Cassidy]

What do you mean “here of all places”? LeBron lost a poll to Dirk on this board lmao.

now imagine if Jeff and Steve didn't have dozens of alts each


then you would pick up and retire from posting about a guy literally nobody respects aside from a few psychotic people that somehow managed to go in full denial and never accept how embarrassing lebron has become..

like how much cringe can a person take. I hated kobes fake black guy phase. then his zen master white washed know it all c.e.o artist phase was even worse. but neither one even comes close to lebrons race baiting uneducated self promotion and childish antics. his taco Tuesday and midlife crises forever young old man with man weave hairlines, lady suits and purses. social media addiction and insecurities. its all too much. and I don't even rip him for any of this stuff like I do his on the court decisions. it shames me when kobe lost a finals. but with lebron fans they're celebrated. kobe outperformed pierce in 2008. who f*ckin gives a shit. the Lakers lost. I wanna forget about that series. how any of you people can look up a box score and feel good about that sh*t is just f*cking embarrassing. it's like you sold your souls to boost lebron. especially if you're white, conservative or a real fan of a team that lebron went to and you abandoned because he left. if kobe went to the cavs and said he wants to follow in lebrons footsteps and carry on his great legacy and imitate his dunks etc... I would absolutely vomit blood and deny ever being a kobe fan

[Rysio]

Hard to compare LeBron is more like pippen kobe is more like Jordan. Obviously LeBron has better stats but he clearly plays for stats kobe didn't. 5-2 > 4-6

[SATAN]

Hard to compare LeBron is more like pippen kobe is more like Jordan. Obviously LeBron has better stats but he clearly plays for stats kobe didn't. 5-2 > 4-6

:facepalm

[Orange_Cassidy]

:facepalm

don't really understand why you're face palming that dude.

1. lebrons a beta male like pippen

2. lebrons definitely more of a set up guy if he can't drive ...like pippen

3. lebron needs guys to bail him out in the clutch.... like pippen

4. lebron is an insecure race baiting clown.... like pippen


he just dominates the ball more than pippen did and eventually ends up with more points than his batman cause he goes into stat pad mode when it's garbage time and racks up 10 quick ones on mostly easy layups

the only thing lebron doesn't measure up to pippen at is p*nis size and on ball defense

as for the lebron gunning for stats and kobe caring more about wins its more than obvious since kobe really only went off the 2 years he had kwame and smush in the starting lineup. every other year he dialed it back. he even gifted Durant a scoring title one year. lebrons never dialed it back. if anything the more help he gets the more he feels the need to lead both teams in every category just so you know who's the top guy on his team. so insecure... how many times have we seen him check the stat sheet during a game. how many times has lebron been in the game late padding while kobe would be going out early and icing his knees.

and his math is correct on the finals records as well

[ImKobe]

Hard to compare LeBron is more like pippen kobe is more like Jordan. Obviously LeBron has better stats but he clearly plays for stats kobe didn't. 5-2 > 4-6

This.

[8Ball]

There is just nothing Kobe does that LeBron doesn't do better.

4x the amount MVPs
Double the finals MVP

More all time points, rebounds, assists, playoff points.

More longevity.

Everything Kobe has a claim on LEBRON has already surpassed him.

[tpols]

What do you mean “here of all places”? LeBron lost a poll to Dirk on this board lmao.

Well we all saw an old Dirk whoop peak Lebron on live television so its not that far fetched.

[8Ball]

Well we all saw an old Dirk whoop peak Lebron on live television so its not that far fetched.

We saw Dirk sweep peak Kobe on live television in 2011.

We saw Nash dumpster Kobe after being down 1-3 and Kobe quit game 7.

We saw Kobe get carried by Shaq 3 years in a row.

We saw Kobe waste many years of Shaq's prime.

[tpols]

We saw Dirk sweep peak Kobe on live television in 2011.

We saw Nash dumpster Kobe after being down 1-3 and Kobe quit game 7.

We saw Kobe get carried by Shaq 3 years in a row.

We saw Kobe waste many years of Shaq's prime.

You just told a bunch of lies. 2011 was peak Kobe? Good one kid.

Dirk with Jason Terry was able to beat peak Lebron with prime Wade. If we saw the ass kicking why do you think people would not think Dirk was better? He simply played with less help and didn't team hop to the Spurs, Lakers, and Heat.

[8Ball]

2010 Kobe won the championship.
2011 Kobe got swept by Jason Terry. Didn't even win 1 game.

LeBron did better vs Dirk than Kobe ever did.
Kobe had peak Shaq for 8 years. The only person "gifted" more stacked teams was Magic Johnson.

Deal with it kid.

[8Ball]

Kobe averaged 23/3/2 vs Jason Terry 20/4/2

Kobe did worst vs Jason Terry since he got swept.

Kobe tards should never bring up 2011. Kobe was 32 and got swept.

In 2011 Kobe was 1st team all-nba and 1st team all-defensive.

2011 was Peak Kobe.

[ImKobe]

Kobe averaged 23/3/2 vs Jason Terry 20/4/2

Kobe did worst vs Jason Terry since he got swept.

Kobe tards should never bring up 2011.

Kobe scored 5.5 more pts a game in ~7 less mpg than peak Lebron, who was outscored by Jason Terry.

Yikes.

[8Ball]

Kobe had 3 rebounds and 2 assists per game. Basically doing nothing on the court if he didn't have the ball, which is basically Kobe's career. Letting Shaq and Gasol do the big man work, let someone else distribute the ball, and just shoot.

LeBron had 7 rebounds and 7 assists.

[ImKobe]

Kobe had 3 rebounds and 2 assists per game. Basically doing nothing on the court if he didn't have the ball, which is basically Kobe's career. Letting Shaq and Gasol do the big man work, let someone else distribute the ball, and just shoot.

LeBron had 7 rebounds and 7 assists.

Lebron couldn't do anything WITH the ball in his hands :kobe:

Bran had a 13.7 GmSc to Kobe's 13.6, so their performance was essentially the same, though Kobe played much less minutes due to playing on one leg so he had less possessions to pad his stats. He certainly didn't have a pathetic 8 pt performance like Lebron and he didn't go scoreless in 4th quarters.

[8Ball]

Kobe got swept in 2011.

Anything else we need to discuss about in 2011 when it comes to Bron vs Kobe? Thought so.

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe scored 5.5 more pts a game in ~7 less mpg than peak Lebron, who was outscored by Jason Terry.

Yikes.
This

[kawhileonard2]

Also Lebron lost with HCA to Dwight while Kobe beat Dwight with HCA.

[LeCola]

Why there is no 3rd option for tie?

[8Ball]

Also Lebron lost with HCA to Dwight while Kobe beat Dwight with HCA.

Also Kobe lost to 2012 OKC while LeBron beat 2012 3 MVP OKC.

[Code Breaker]

Back in HS I had Lebron> Kobe when it was 1 v 5. Literally all they had against me was the ring argument not stats, MVPs :lol Now that you include Stats, MVPs, FMVPs and rings it’s literally not a contest anymore :oldlol:

[RogueBorg]

How? Duncan wasn't "the man" in 07 or 14. He has three as the man just like lebron

Who do you feel was the man in 2007?

[Carbine]

You can tell someone's age or low IQ when they say Duncan wasn't the man in '07

Litmus test. I guess it was almost 15 years ago. Still, it's an incredibly false narrative to put out there.

[Hey Yo]

Hard to compare LeBron is more like pippen kobe is more like Jordan. Obviously LeBron has better stats but he clearly plays for stats kobe didn't. 5-2 > 4-6

4-6 >>>>> 2-1

[3ba11]

Kobe is the goat pure scorer with a live dribble.

Kobe has all-time jumpshooting skill

Kobe has two "carry-job" rings where he averaged 10+ more than his sidekick in playoffs and Finals, while also leading the team in assists

Kobe's didn't have to team-hop like KD or Lebron and therefore learned to WIN (organic), which requires the superior skills of fitting with teammates (on-ball/off-ball), learning championship strategy/brand of ball, and perseverance (lebron bailed a year early and ceded the 1-star organic ring that he thought was impossible to Dirk)

[FKAri]

Kobe is the goat pure scorer with a live dribble.

Kobe has all-time jumpshooting skill

Kobe has two "carry-job" rings where he averaged 10+ more than his sidekick in playoffs and Finals, while also leading the team in assists

Kobe's didn't have to team-hop like KD or Lebron and therefore learned to WIN (organic), which requires the superior skills of fitting with teammates (on-ball/off-ball), learning championship strategy/brand of ball, and perseverance (lebron bailed a year early and ceded the 1-star organic ring that he thought was impossible to Dirk)

Team hopping requires more skill since you need to fit in with new teammates and management. Need a better understanding of human psychology and how to lead different kinds of people. LeGM'ing also requires a knowledge of how to build teams, acquire talent and lead an organization. Sitting on your ass and hoping daddy(management) helps you out is for sackless cucks who take no initiative and don't want to work so they can focus on playing a child's ball game.

[tpols]

Kobe is the goat pure scorer with a live dribble.

Kobe has all-time jumpshooting skill

Kobe has two "carry-job" rings where he averaged 10+ more than his sidekick in playoffs and Finals, while also leading the team in assists

Kobe's didn't have to team-hop like KD or Lebron and therefore learned to WIN (organic), which requires the superior skills of fitting with teammates (on-ball/off-ball), learning championship strategy/brand of ball, and perseverance (lebron bailed a year early and ceded the 1-star organic ring that he thought was impossible to Dirk)

Kobe was first to practice and last to leave. Teammates have testified he worked worked worked with everybody to mentor and make the most out of them. True leader.

Kobe repeated with just Bosh (Pau). Imagine if the Lakers had Wade. And STILL lost. :oldlol: That's Miami Lebron.

[3ba11]

Team hopping requires more skill since you need to fit in with new teammates and management. Need a better understanding of human psychology and how to lead different kinds of people. LeGM'ing also requires a knowledge of how to build teams, acquire talent and lead an organization. Sitting on your ass and hoping daddy(management) helps you out is for sackless cucks who take no initiative and don't want to work so they can focus on playing a child's ball game.


Team-hopping doesn't have time to develop championship strategy/brand, so they achieve favorite status in Year 1 via talent accumulation, namely a star scorer at 3rd option that organic teams don't have..

The talent deficit (no 3rd star) forces organic teams to achieve favorite status after many years by developing strategy/brand, which requires superior skill (fitting with teammates and learning/implementing the superior strategy).

Btw, organic teams refers to weak teams that developed into champions, not teams that were good right away like Bird's Celtics or Magic's collusion with Kareem.

[kawhileonard2]

Also Kobe lost to 2012 OKC while LeBron beat 2012 3 MVP OKC.

Lebron lost to Boston with HCA while Kobe beat them with it in 2010 as well.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Scoring - Kobe

Passing - LeBron

Handles - Kobe

Work Ethic - Kobe

Defense - Kobe

Rebounding - LeBron

Athleticism - LeBron

Post Moves - Kobe

Slashing - LeBron

Leadership - Kobe

Shooting - Kobe

Heart - Kobe

[SATAN]

don't really understand why you're face palming that dude.

1. lebrons a beta

Stopped reading there. Typical low IQ Kobe tard. User ignore function engaged.

[RRR3]

There isn’t a single intelligent person who thinks this is still a debate. Not one.

[3ba11]

There isn’t a single intelligent person who thinks this is still a debate. Not one.


Most players have Kobe ahead of Lebron and Kobe leads the voting itt

Kobe didn't need equal-scoring partners to win, while Lebron did - he barely averaged more than his sidekicks when he won the Finals and always had a 3rd star (super-team), except for when AD was outproducing him

[FKAri]

Scoring - Kobe

Passing - LeBron

Handles - Kobe

Work Ethic - Kobe

Defense - Kobe

Rebounding - LeBron

Athleticism - LeBron

Post Moves - Kobe

Slashing - LeBron

Leadership - Kobe

Shooting - Kobe

Heart - Kobe

Kobe a better LEADER than Lebron? Kobe was a horrendous leader.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Kobe a better LEADER than Lebron? Kobe was a horrendous leader.

There's no way in hell LeBron is a better leader or even close to being the greatest leader,the guy traded away half a team in the middle of a season including Isaiah Thomas after saying the team don't practice,gets literally shoved by a teammate to play defense,and was found sitting at the end of the Lakers bench at one point.Team hopping and joining up with multiple hall of famers don't make you a better leader.

[3ba11]

Kobe a better LEADER than Lebron? Kobe was a horrendous leader.


How is Lebron a leader? He just team-hopped around and plays with the league's best talent. he can't actually lead a team to a title - he can only team-hop... It's a joke what he does, yet people somehow laud teaming up as "making guys better" and "leadership"..... Nope - it's just teaming up with ready-made stars and getting instant favorite status.

[Hey Yo]

Team hopping to lottery teams..... leads them to a title in his 2nd year in both cases.

GOAT

[kawhileonard2]

There isn’t a single intelligent person who thinks this is still a debate. Not one.

How not?

[FKAri]

There's no way in hell LeBron is a better leader or even close to being the greatest leader,the guy traded away half a team in the middle of a season including Isaiah Thomas after saying the team don't practice,gets literally shoved by a teammate to play defense,and was found sitting at the end of the Lakers bench at one point.Team hopping and joining up with multiple hall of famers don't make you a better leader.

Yes he did all those things and he's still a better leader than Kobe. Kobe's thrown more teammates under the bus than any star in NBA history that I can think of. The difference is Kobe was willing to stick with the Lakers and Lebron wasn't. Loyalty to your city has nothing to do with leadership. How you lead your group of guys and motivate them to play their best is leadership. Kobe's lack of social skills and lack of affability also hurt him as a leader. Though, I credit Kobe a lot for his leadership in the 08-11 era. But before and after then there were a lot of issues.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Yes he did all those things and he's still a better leader than Kobe. Kobe's thrown more teammates under the bus than any star in NBA history that I can think of.The difference is Kobe was willing to stick with the Lakers and Lebron wasn't. Loyalty to your city has nothing to do with leadership. How you lead your group of guys and motivate them to play their best is leadership. Kobe's lack of social skills and lack of affability also hurt him as a leader. Though, I credit Kobe a lot for his leadership in the 08-11 era. But before and after then there were a lot of issues.LeBron may have been more social and "motivated" teammates but at the same time his style of play has hindered his teammates to the point of them having to change their game.LeBron the only one unwilling to make sacrifices.

Also there's no one he teamed up with to win championships that he made into better players they were already good prior.Kuzma,Wade,Bosh and Love either suffered or had to change their game.Ingram and Randle got better playing away from LeBron.I'd take Kobe's leadership from the 08-11 era over Lebron's leadership from any of his championship runs.

[rmt]

How? Duncan wasn't "the man" in 07 or 14. He has three as the man just like lebron

Do you mean Duncan wasn't "the man" for 4 games of 2006-07?

2006-07 Regular Season
Duncan 20 pts 10.6 rebs 3.4 asst 2.4 blks 54.6%FG 1st All-NBA team, 1st All-Defensive team, All-Star
Parker 18.6 pts 3.2 rebs 5.5 asst 1.1 stl 52%FG All-Star

2007 Playoffs
Duncan 22.2 pts 11.5 rebs 3.3 assts 3.1 blks 52.1%FG
Parker 20.8 pts 3.4 rebs 5.8 assts 1.1 stl 48%FG FMVP

Or 3 games (especially when considering DEFENSE - as in keeping Lebron out of the paint and forcing him to take jumpshots)?
2007 Finals game 1
Duncan 24 pts 13 rebs 1 asst 5 blks 2 stl 58.8%FG
Parker 27 pts 4 rebs 7 asst 2 stls 52.2%FG

[3ba11]

LeBron may have been more social and "motivated" teammates but at the same time his style of play has hindered his teammates to the point of them having to change their game.LeBron the only one unwilling to make sacrifices.

Also there's no one he teamed up with to win championships that he made into better players they were already good prior.I'd take Kobe's leadership from the 08-11 era over Lebron's leadership from any of his championship runs.


Indeed.. players were led by kobe, even if they didn't like how he did it.

otoh, lebron failed to lead cleveland in 09' or 10' as the heavy favorite, thus ceding the easy conference to other 1-star teams or underdogs.. Then he failed in Miami in 2011 with less leadership than the head of hopskotch in kindergarten.. Then he ran off Kyrie in 2017 and cratered Ingram in 2019, with record "give-up" losses sprinkled in 14' and 18'.. All this and his style reduces teammates to spot-up role... Lebron literally can't lead, so he team-hops.. Now he's trying to add Lillard because the playoff scoring champ in 2020 (AD) isn't enough help.

[Axe]

Indeed.. players were led by kobe, even if they didn't like how he did it.

otoh, lebron failed to lead cleveland in 09' or 10' as the heavy favorite, thus ceding the easy conference to other 1-star teams or underdogs.. Then he failed in Miami in 2011 with less leadership than the head of hopskotch in kindergarten.. Then he ran off Kyrie in 2017 and cratered Ingram in 2019, with record "give-up" losses sprinkled in 14' and 18'.. All this and his style reduces teammates to spot-up role... Lebron literally can't lead, so he team-hops.. Now he's trying to add Lillard because the playoff scoring champ in 2020 (AD) isn't enough help.
1-9

[RRR3]

LeBron may have been more social and "motivated" teammates but at the same time his style of play has hindered his teammates to the point of them having to change their game.LeBron the only one unwilling to make sacrifices.

Also there's no one he teamed up with to win championships that he made into better players they were already good prior.Kuzma,Wade,Bosh and Love either suffered or had to change their game.Ingram and Randle got better playing away from LeBron.I'd take Kobe's leadership from the 08-11 era over Lebron's leadership from any of his championship runs.
How did Randle get better playing away from LeBron when he never played WITH LeBron?

Cant take you seriously if you have so little clue what you’re talking about.

[Lebron23]

That orlandomagicguy is arguably the dumbest poster in this forum. LeBron never played with Julius Randle.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

How did Randle get better playing away from LeBron when he never played WITH LeBron?

Cant take you seriously if you have so little clue what you’re talking about.

LeBron troll tries to act rational and nitpicks from my post about Randle not being with the Lakers after 2018 .But if he stayed in L.A. more than likely his growth would've suffered.If you can't take me seriously like you claim do yourself a favor and put me on your ignore list like all the other old NBA snobs on here would logically do I don't give a shit.But we all know you won't do that.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

That orlandomagicguy is arguably the dumbest poster in this forum. LeBron never played with Julius Randle.

Yeah I'm the dumbest poster on here,coming from a LeBron troll.Eat shit mother ****er.

[Lebron23]

Yeah I'm the dumbest poster on here,coming from a LeBron troll.Eat shit mother ****er.

Yes you are dumb go **** yourseof and suck my ****.

[Axe]

Yes you are dumb go **** yourseof and suck my ****.
:roll:

Makes me wonder if he's also one of coach's dups itb.

[FKAri]

LeBron may have been more social and "motivated" teammates but at the same time his style of play has hindered his teammates to the point of them having to change their game.LeBron the only one unwilling to make sacrifices.

Also there's no one he teamed up with to win championships that he made into better players they were already good prior.Kuzma,Wade,Bosh and Love either suffered or had to change their game.Ingram and Randle got better playing away from LeBron.I'd take Kobe's leadership from the 08-11 era over Lebron's leadership from any of his championship runs.

Ray Allen had to change his game due to Pierce and KG despite the 3 of them being an almost perfect fit for each other. That is simply the nature of being on a team. You need to adapt. Some more than others. Now, Lebron's style of play makes him a hard player to fit with. Kobe's style of play makes him a much easier fit. This has nothing to do with leadership. But despite the difference in their playstyles far more of Kobe's teammates were hindered by him than Lebron's. That alone speaks volumes. We don't even need to get into what former teammates say about both as a teammate. The nail's already in the coffin.

[deathawaitu]

General consensus is Kobe better than Lebron. Not even debatable in the real world

Over 1 billion people have Kobe better

Only a few thousand Lebron stans has Lebron better

Ain’t even close

[Chick Stern]

With very few exceptions, any teammate who played two years or more with Kobe, played their best while playing with Kobe.

[MadDog]

Its a tossup. From a basketball and skill perspective, the argument for Kobe seems logical. Kobe could play in any system. Didn't have to form superteams to win, either. All Kobe needed was Pau Gasol who was a Chris Bosh equivalent. LeBron had Bosh AND Wade, yet still lost in 2011. :oldlol: LeBron's longevity is better. His overall numbers are too depending on what you look at. Like I said, its pretty close. Would ultimately depend on how you build your team.

[kawhileonard2]

Yes you are dumb go **** yourseof and suck my ****.

You getting too worked up over this.

[tanibanana]

LeBron is debated as GOAT over Jordan.
Kobe is debated if he is top-8.

Kobe is just more appreciated...
but without bias and just pure fairness, LeBron is top-2, while Kobe is arguably 8-10.

[ImKobe]

LeBron is debated as GOAT over Jordan.
Kobe is debated if he is top-8.

Kobe is just more appreciated...
but without bias and just pure fairness, LeBron is top-2, while Kobe is arguably 8-10.

Absolute horseshit. If we're being honest, both have top 5 ATG resumes but not enough wins on the big stage to be ahead of MJ. Difference is that Lebron is an active player, so he'll have more people riding for him with the media machine still promoting him as the next GOAT as well. This was the case with Kobe in 2010 but once he had injuries & declined, the media went the other way and started bashing every bad moment in his career to prop up Lebron as the next guy. Give it a year or two and you'll see the same start happening with Lebron.

[deathawaitu]

Yes you are dumb go **** yourseof and suck my ****.

McDonald boy having a meltdown :roll:

Go back flipping those burgers boy. The lineup is getting long son

[BlakFrankWhite]

Usually I'd say LeBron but watching kobe playing defense videos on YouTube, its much closer than people think. The guy was a demon on D.

12x All-D has to count.

[kawhileonard2]

LeBron is debated as GOAT over Jordan.
Kobe is debated if he is top-8.

Kobe is just more appreciated...
but without bias and just pure fairness, LeBron is top-2, while Kobe is arguably 8-10.

Kobe is more in the GOAT debate than Lebron by most.

[kennygriffin]

Kobe is more in the GOAT debate than Lebron by most.

if you polled the entire planet i think it would shake out like this

75% Jordan
10% Kobe
5% lebron
3% wilt
3% kareem
1% russell
1% magic
1% bird
1% shaq

[SATAN]

if you polled the entire planet i think it would shake out like this

75% Jordan
10% Kobe
5% lebron
3% wilt
3% kareem
1% russell
1% magic
1% bird
1% shaq

If you excluded casuals it would be more like:

100% LeBron

[DevBooker'sMask]

LeBron is debated as GOAT over Jordan.
Kobe is debated if he is top-8.

Kobe is just more appreciated...
but without bias and just pure fairness, LeBron is top-2, while Kobe is arguably 8-10.

Without needing to read 48 pages of smoke and mirrors I can protest that this is the best post of this thread. No skewing, no agenda, just the message everyone knows but who wants to admit it.

[FKAri]

Kobe is more in the GOAT debate than Lebron by most.

Neither are in the GOAT debate in a few years. Though Lebron could remain in the debate due to his absurd longevity the same way Kareem is. But MJ is fairly comfortably the best to ever do it. And quite frankly that is a more meaningful title than GOAT. Longevity and "resumes" don't play into it too much for me.


LeBron is debated as GOAT over Jordan.
Kobe is debated if he is top-8.

Kobe is just more appreciated...
but without bias and just pure fairness, LeBron is top-2, while Kobe is arguably 8-10.

I wouldn't say the two are that far apart but I'd agree that Lebron's been the better player. Those who say the opposite are often approaching it from an emotional POV.

[Axe]

Depends if they're being judged by their career. But if that's out of the equation, then kong is a better player by a considerable margin because he is bigger, more versatile and can play or guard any position decently.

[kawhileonard2]

if you polled the entire planet i think it would shake out like this

75% Jordan
10% Kobe
5% lebron
3% wilt
3% kareem
1% russell
1% magic
1% bird
1% shaq

Yep. Also Kobe did it for the franchise he played with his entire career.

[kawhileonard2]

Depends if they're being judged by their career. But if that's out of the equation, then kong is a better player by a considerable margin because he is bigger, more versatile and can play or guard any position decently.

Kobe played in an era of bigs. Lebron did not and when he did play against legit bigs he always lost to them.

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe averaged 23/3/2 vs Jason Terry 20/4/2

Kobe did worst vs Jason Terry since he got swept.

Kobe tards should never bring up 2011. Kobe was 32 and got swept.

In 2011 Kobe was 1st team all-nba and 1st team all-defensive.

2011 was Peak Kobe.

Lebron averaged 17 ppl against Terry and then shot 35% against Bruce Bowen who Kobe destroyed

[SouBeachTalents]

Both MUCH better than Kawhi

[3ba11]

Both MUCH better than Kawhi


I'd argue peak Kawhi is right there with peak Kobe and I'd almost take Kawhi to start a team if I had the guarantee of good health (which I never would)..

Think about what Kawhi did on that 2019 run - destroyed goat Giannis and goat threesome Curry/Klay/Dray... no suspsension needed.. no comeback needed.. no equal-scoring partner needed (defeated max defensive attention)

Kobe's peak was just a lot longer - 2000-2010

[SouBeachTalents]

I'd argue peak Kawhi is right there with peak Kobe and I'd almost take Kawhi to start a team if I had the guarantee of good health (which I never would)..

Think about what Kawhi did on that 2019 run - destroyed goat Giannis and goat threesome Curry/Klay/Dray... no suspsension needed.. no comeback needed.. no equal-scoring partner needed (defeated max defensive attention)

Kobe's peak was just a lot longer - 2000-2010
Only injuries to Durant & Klay needed

[3ba11]

Only injuries to Durant & Klay needed


Klay missing 1 game was offset by the Dray suspension - Kawhi otherwise beat a dominant Klay/Curry (26 & 31 ppg), while Lebron beat an inexperienced, bed-wetting Klay/Curry.

And KD played a quarter (12 points), which won one of the games.

[SouBeachTalents]

Klay missing 1 game was offset by the Dray suspension - Kawhi otherwise beat a dominant Klay/Curry (26 & 31 ppg), while Lebron beat an inexperienced, bed-wetting Klay/Curry.

And KD played a quarter (12 points), which won one of the games.
Klay missed a game AND two separate 4th quarters, including the 4th in Game 6 when he was clearly best player on the floor before he got injured.

[3ba11]

Klay missed a game AND two separate 4th quarters, including the 4th in Game 6 when he was clearly best player on the floor before he got injured.


splitting hairs now

Kawhi's goat win over the goat threesome of Curry/Klay/Dray is confirmed by him teaching Giannis how it's done in the previous round.. True goats have guys that cut their teeth on them.. I guess Lebron has Derozan, lol....

[SouBeachTalents]

splitting hairs now

Kawhi's goat win over the goat threesome of Curry/Klay/Dray is confirmed by him teaching Giannis how it's done in the previous round.. True goats have guys that cut their teeth on them.. I guess Lebron has Derozan, lol....
You want to bring up Dray missing one game then brag about Giannis' title run with legitimately every contender facing significant injuries :lol

[3ba11]

You want to bring up Dray missing one game then brag about Giannis' title run with legitimately every contender facing significant injuries :lol


I brought up dray missing 1 game because you brought up klay missing 1 game

As for Giannis - that's a talent level and performance that Lebron never reached, so not sure why you'd bring him up... A guy MORE powerful and superior to Lebron in pretty much every way (and no, we don't like high APG players/ball-dominators)

[SouBeachTalents]

I brought up dray missing 1 game because you brought up klay missing 1 game

As for Giannis - that's a talent level and performance that Lebron never reached, so not sure why you'd bring him up... A guy MORE powerful and superior to Lebron in pretty much every way (and no, we don't like high APG players/ball-dominators)
Superior to LeBron huh :lol

https://i.ibb.co/tMGnRnJ/Screenshot-2021-07-20-180658.png

[Axe]

Greek freak was big scottie pippen before the 2021 finals but soon enough that immediately changed after he went in it. Krazy. :biggums:

[kawhileonard2]

Greek freak was big scottie pippen before the 2021 finals but soon enough that immediately changed after he went in it. Krazy. :biggums:

He was never a Scottie not with back to back MVP’s. He was maybe like a David Robinson or something like that.

[kawhileonard2]

Only injuries to Durant & Klay needed

Same thing in 2016 except got someone suspended on purpose. And then they had more injuries after that with Iggy, Bogut, Curry was already hurt.

[kawhileonard2]

Most players felt Kobe was better.

[SouBeachTalents]

No players feel Kawhi's better.

[kawhileonard2]

No players feel Kawhi's better.

https://theundefeated.com/features/kawhi-leonard-is-the-best-player-on-the-planet/

Also Max Kellerman

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe also head to head used to destroy Lebron as well and this before Lebron switched teams.

[kawhileonard2]

The debate will end up being Kobe vs Giannis.

[kawhileonard2]

The debate will end up being Kobe vs Giannis.

Looking that way now

[Cold soul]

I love Kobe but Lebron is the better more impactful player out of the two just better all around brings more to the table

[3ba11]

You would start a franchise with LeBron over Kobe





Lebron ties a coach's hands into playing 1 way and has the worst teammate fits and chemistry ever, so he needs a lot more help than Kobe and has lower team ceilings/Finals records.. Finals record is a measure of team ceiling and Lebron's is lower

So no - Kobe is much easier to build around because his goat scoring versatility fits with everyone and allows the best brand of ball, so he has better teams with less help

[Gohan]

Lebron ties a coach's hands into playing 1 way and has the worst teammate fits and chemistry ever, so he needs a lot more help than Kobe and has lower team ceilings/Finals records.. Finals record is a measure of team ceiling and Lebron's is lower

So no - Kobe is much easier to build around because his goat scoring versatility fits with everyone and allows the best brand of ball, so he has better teams with less help

Say what you will about 3ball but hes telling the truth here. Spot on kobe fits better

[Johnny32]

the heat and cavs played similar. the lakers didn't play anything like those championship teams. 3tard and gotard both dumb af.

[Gohan]

the heat and cavs played similar. the lakers didn't play anything like those championship teams. 3tard and gotard both dumb af.

Why are you breathing?

[Johnny32]

Why are you breathing?

fatboy got shit on with facts and now he's mad.

[Gohan]

fatboy got shit on with facts and now he's mad.

Fat? Rofl yo momma got crabs

[ClipperRevival]

The initial instinct is Bron with his superior efficiency numbers but considering TRUE alpha mentality, defense and overall skill? Peak for peak, I lean towards Kobe. As 3ball has said many times, Kobe fosters a superior brand of ball. He mastered the triangle just like MJ. That means he can play off ball, within a system, with more flow.

[kawhileonard2]

Lebron ties a coach's hands into playing 1 way and has the worst teammate fits and chemistry ever, so he needs a lot more help than Kobe and has lower team ceilings/Finals records.. Finals record is a measure of team ceiling and Lebron's is lower

So no - Kobe is much easier to build around because his goat scoring versatility fits with everyone and allows the best brand of ball, so he has better teams with less help

Yep Kobe is a much better fit.

[ImKobe]

The initial instinct is Bron with his superior efficiency numbers but considering TRUE alpha mentality, defense and overall skill? Peak for peak, I lean towards Kobe. As 3ball has said many times, Kobe fosters a superior brand of ball. He mastered the triangle just like MJ. That means he can play off ball, within a system, with more flow.

:applause:

[Westbrook_Fan]

Kobe missed the playoffs with Prime Dwight, LeBron won a championship with a washed up Dwight

case closed...

[1987_Lakers]

The initial instinct is Bron with his superior efficiency numbers but considering TRUE alpha mentality, defense and overall skill? Peak for peak, I lean towards Kobe. As 3ball has said many times, Kobe fosters a superior brand of ball. He mastered the triangle just like MJ. That means he can play off ball, within a system, with more flow.

Is this the alpha mentality you speak of???


Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS


:roll:

[ImKobe]

Bran can barely win a poll on ISH, and that's with 10+ alts voting for him on the same poll. If even ISH thinks that Kobe's better.

[1987_Lakers]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS


:roll:

[ImKobe]

You can post averages across eras and pretend like it's better to get swept while padding stats, but the smart ones know that Kobe played a superior brand of basketball, which is why he won more with less help. Keep trying though, maybe you'll win someone over. You've been trying for over a decade.

[1987_Lakers]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS


:roll: :roll:

[HighFlyer23]

LeBron eclipsed Kobe a while ago

[8Ball]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS


:roll: :roll:

Superior brand of basketball my ass.

[ArbitraryWater]

You can post averages across eras and pretend like it's better to get swept while padding stats, but the smart ones know that Kobe played a superior brand of basketball, which is why he won more with less help. Keep trying though, maybe you'll win someone over. You've been trying for over a decade.

Lolol, I still remember when you posted selective clutchtime stats for the playoffs, when I asked you to show them for 06-18 for LeBron compared to 01-12 for Kobe you were a goner :lol

[SouBeachTalents]

I don’t even know if Kobe’s gonna be able to hold off Curry & Giannis at this point.

[ImKobe]

Lolol, I still remember when you posted selective clutchtime stats for the playoffs, when I asked you to show them for 06-18 for LeBron compared to 01-12 for Kobe you were a goner :lol

What? I think I quoted a post that had the Playoff clutch stats for their entire career. It might not have included the '18 run as I think the post I referenced was made prior to that season, but it wouldn't change the data that much based on how many Playoff games Bran already played at that point.

Here's the post I quoted which was made 5 years ago


"Clutch" is 2 minutes left with margin of 3 in playoffs,

I will be only talking about Lebron and Kobe, considering these two were heads and shoulders beyond everyone else for their efficiency and volume.

Playoffs:

Lebron

He is 40/106 in clutch situation

His free throw shooting is 49/67

True Shooting is, 49.8%

Assist per 36: 4.2 assists

Turnovers per 36: 4.2 turnovers

Kobe

He is 40/96 in clutch situations.

His free throw shooting is 67/79

His true shooting is 58 %

Assists per 36: 4.3 assists

Turnovers per 36: 1.7 turnovers

Finals: Last 2 minutes, margin of 3.

Lebron

He is 4/23 in clutch situations

His free throw shooting is 10/14

His true shooting is 31%

Assists per 36: 3.7 assists

TO per 36: 3.7 TO

Kobe

He is 10/20 in clutch situations

His free throw shooting is 4/5

His true shooting is 56.4%

Assists per 36: 7.5 assists

TO per 36: 1.5 TO

Finals: Last 5 minutes, margin of 5.

Lebron

17/62 in clutch situations in the finals.

32% EFG

43% TS.

Assists per 36: 4.26

TO per 36: 3.1

Kobe

28/63 in clutch situations in the finals.

46% EFG

53% TS.

Assists per 36: 3.6

TO per 36: 1.08

Tbh, I wasn't surprised about the field goals considering Kobe is the much better shooter in the playoffs, but I was shocked to see Kobe as the better playmaker and distributor in crunch time.

Thoughts?

Edit: all sources are from NBA.com

No need to be butthurt about it tho.

[Cold soul]

I don’t even know if Kobe’s gonna be able to hold off Curry & Giannis at this point.

Easily Curry especially if he never wins FMVP but Giannis is up for debate atm.

[Cold soul]

Kobe missed the playoffs with Prime Dwight, LeBron won a championship with a washed up Dwight

case closed...

2012 Dwight wasn’t prime Dwight especially after back surgery 2011 was Dwight at his peak.

[3ba11]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS


:roll: :roll:


Based on the scoring and efficiency stats that you posted above, Lebron's Finals from 2007, 2011, 2013 and 2014 are worse than Kobe's 2000-2004..

And we should really only look at the last 3 Finals where Kobe was top dog - the other Finals were deferring and elevating Shaq - Shaq was a guy that got swept repeatedly until Kobe came of age to close games for him.

Of course, Kobe had elite jumpshooting skill, so his scoring was partially-assisted, which elevates teammate role, while Lebron's scoring reduces teammates to spot-up roles - this reduction of teammates and brand requires more help to win much LESS.. Of course Kobe's elite jumpshooting skill also allows him to defeat maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load in Finals), which requires less help than the juggernaut scoring help that Lebron needs

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe missed the playoffs with Prime Dwight, LeBron won a championship with a washed up Dwight

case closed...

Kobe beat Prime Dwight while Lebron lost to Prime Dwight with HCA.

[Taurus]

Easily Curry especially if he never wins FMVP but Giannis is up for debate atm.

Wouldn't be too sure about that. If the Warriors win this year + Curry gets FMVP, then I think there can at least be a debate. Granted I would still probably have Kobe higher.

[John8204]

1 on 1 - Kobe (might be the greatest 1 on 1 player in NBA history)
Legacy, team, accomplishments and versatility - Lebron

[ImKobe]

Wouldn't be too sure about that. If the Warriors win this year + Curry gets FMVP, then I think there can at least be a debate. Granted I would still probably have Kobe higher.

KB is a much better defensive player while Curry has an edge with his 3PT ability, but what we've seen is that the 3PT shot is really volatile and even Steph is prone to bad shooting stretches. No one's hunting prime Kobe on defense like they do with Steph.

[kawhileonard2]

LeBron eclipsed Kobe a while ago

How so?

[Cold soul]

Wouldn't be too sure about that. If the Warriors win this year + Curry gets FMVP, then I think there can at least be a debate. Granted I would still probably have Kobe higher.

Kobe is much better all around player than Curry is especially when you factor in defense side of the ball Curry has always been average defender at best while Kobe was lock down defender at his peak.

[Cold soul]

1 on 1 - Kobe (might be the greatest 1 on 1 player in NBA history)
Legacy, team, accomplishments and versatility - Lebron

Well said. :applause:

[kawhileonard2]

1 on 1 - Kobe (might be the greatest 1 on 1 player in NBA history)
Legacy, team, accomplishments and versatility - Lebron

Legacy, Team, Accomplishments and Versatility is Kobe as well. He won 5 titles for the franchise he originally played for. He also beat Dwight Howard and KG while Lebron had to change teams to beat KG. Also Kobe has more all defensive first teams.

[ImKobe]

Legacy, Team, Accomplishments and Versatility is Kobe as well. He won 5 titles for the franchise he originally played for. He also beat Dwight Howard and KG while Lebron had to change teams to beat KG. Also Kobe has more all defensive first teams.

Absolutely. It's dumb to say that Bran has better team accomplishments when he won less rings and never 3-Peated and never had a dominant 15 - 1 Playoff run like KB.

[1987_Lakers]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS

:lol

[kawhileonard2]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS

:lol

Lebron never 3 peated and he lost with Shaq in round 2 and only won 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that he originally played for.

Legacy, Team, Accomplishments and Versatility is Kobe as well. He won 5 titles for the franchise he originally played for. He also beat Dwight Howard and KG while Lebron had to change teams to beat KG. Also Kobe has more all defensive first teams

[1987_Lakers]

Lebron never 3 peated and he lost with Shaq in round 2.


Kobe didn't win FMVP during that 3 peat. :lol

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe didn't win FMVP during that 3 peat. :lol

He won more titles for the franchise that he originally played for than Lebron did. He also lost less series with HCA than Lebron and Kobe also didn't ever win bronze medal for USA.

[Cold soul]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS

:lol

For so called "Lakers fan" you sure have a lot of hate for Kobe it's really odd and strange to say the least. :wtf:

[Cold soul]

Kobe didn't win FMVP during that 3 peat. :lol

The majority of players are taking a back set to peak Shaq including Lebron just saying.

[ImKobe]

Kobe didn't win FMVP during that 3 peat. :lol

So I guess it's worse to win a title not be the MVP than to put up empty stats in historic blowout losses? Kobe was the best player in the toughest series/games in those runs, but I guess him not being the MVP against weak EC opponents devalues his championships, right? Imagine doing the same boring shtick for 15 years.

[Cold soul]

So I guess it's worse to win a title not be the MVP than to put up empty stats in historic blowout losses? Kobe was the best player in the toughest series/games in those runs, but I guess him not being the MVP against weak EC opponents devalues his championships, right? Imagine doing the same boring shtick for 15 years.

The sad thing is he pretends to be a Lakers fan. No way in hell he is one. :facepalm

[Shooter]

Basketball = LeBron
Rape = Kobe

[Shooter]

Here are Kobe's finals stats

2000 - 15.6 ppg | 39 fg%

2001 - 24 ppg | 41.5 fg% | 50 TS%

2002 - 27 ppg | 51 fg% | 62 TS%

2004 - 23 ppg | 38 fg% | 46 TS%

2008 - 26 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 50.5 TS%

2009 - 32 ppg | 43 fg% | 52.5 TS%

2010 - 29 ppg | 40.1 fg% | 52.8 TS%



Here are Kobe's game seven stats.

44.2 MPG

22.2 points

FG 38.9%

FT 67.3%

8 RPG

5 APG

1 SPG

1.3 BPG





Here are Kobe's stats when facing elimination.



22.3 PPG

5.8 RPG


3.5 APG

1.3 SPG

1.3 BPG

on a 50.3 TS

:lol

SHUT it DOWN

[ImKobe]

The sad thing is he pretends to be a Lakers fan. No way in hell he is one. :facepalm

He's just a Bran stan who gets off on trolling on ISH with one of his many accounts.

[Cold soul]

He's just a Bran stan who gets off on trolling on ISH with one of his many accounts.

So many alts and trolls on here which is why ISH has declined so fast.

[1987_Lakers]

SHUT it DOWN

:cheers:

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe won more titles and lost less series with HCA and beat Dwight Howard with HCA while Lebron lost to Dwight with HCA. Also Kobe won 3 titles with Shaq and Lebron lost in round 2 with Shaq with HCA.

[red1]

I dont troll kobe fans anymore. Kobe was a G.

[TheMan]

Kobe is winning this poll considering that most of LeBron votes are basically coming from like 3 trolls.

[TheMan]

For so called "Lakers fan" you sure have a lot of hate for Kobe it's really odd and strange to say the least. :wtf:

That's because he's not, he says he's a late 20's Latino guy from LA but in reality he's a fat pasty white middle aged dude from Boston.

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe is winning this poll considering that most of LeBron votes are basically coming from like 3 trolls.

Agreed!

[kawhileonard2]

:cheers:

You not a Lakers fan.

[Axe]

You not a Lakers fan.
And you're none other than the op. ;)

[Full Court]

Both are fringe top ten. Personally, I have Bronie ranked ahead of Kobe, since he does have double the amount of FMVP, which to me is the highest achievement you can get in the sport. Also, Lebron didn't rape anybody. That I know of.

[Hey Yo]

LOL @ full knowledge alts getting exposed

[kawhileonard2]

Both are fringe top ten. Personally, I have Bronie ranked ahead of Kobe, since he does have double the amount of FMVP, which to me is the highest achievement you can get in the sport. Also, Lebron didn't rape anybody. That I know of.

Ouch

[FKAri]

Kobe is winning this poll considering that most of LeBron votes are basically coming from like 3 trolls.

Exposes the low level of basketball understanding on the board. People are voting with their hearts as always when it comes to sports. Kobe's flashier and more entertaining but Lebron's the better player. Though it's close.

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe won mulitple titles for LA, Lebron didn't do that.

[eliteballer]

Do not compare juicer lebron to Kobe. Also his votes are all from the one dude who has 50 accounts and spends his life on the boards.

[kawhileonard2]

Do not compare juicer lebron to Kobe. Also his votes are all from the one dude who has 50 accounts and spends his life on the boards.

Even Jennie Buss admitted Kobe was better.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Kobe three-peated playing next to Shaq and then went and got 2 more chips out the mud as the #1 guy without Shaq.

You mean to tell me with all this help LeFraud acquired throughout his career while jumping from team to team he still hasn't three-peated?

Kobe > LeBron

[Hey Yo]

Kobe three-peated playing next to Shaq and then went and got 2 more chips out the mud as the #1 guy without Shaq.

You mean to tell me with all this help LeFraud acquired throughout his career while jumping from team to team he still hasn't three-peated?

Kobe > LeBron

4 rings and 4 FMVP >>>>> 2 rings and 2 FMVP

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

4 rings and 4 FMVP >>>>> 2 rings and 2 FMVP

4 rings that LeFraud bought he didn't win those organically and that last FMVP that he won his teammate AD had to blatantly hold back so he could win the award.

Kobe got his 2 chips out the mud,beat the Big 3 Celitics and a Magic team that LeFraud couldn't overcome even with HCA.

Dwight Howard
Rashard Lewis
Hedo Turkoglu
Jameer Nelson
Rafer Alston
Courtney Lee
JJ Redick
Mickael Pietrus

[FKAri]

and that last FMVP that he won his teammate AD had to blatantly hold back so he could win the award.
Damn. To have the power and influence to get a teammate to do that? It's better than winning the award outright. Impressive. Very nice.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Damn. To have the power and influence to get a teammate to do that? It's better than winning the award outright. Impressive. Very nice.
Yeah especially when that very teammate is a fan of that player and refuses to be a true leader.

[Hey Yo]

4 rings that LeFraud bought he didn't win those organically and that last FMVP that he won his teammate AD had to blatantly hold back so he could win the award.

Kobe got his 2 chips out the mud,beat the Big 3 Celitics and a Magic team that LeFraud couldn't overcome even with HCA.

Dwight Howard
Rashard Lewis
Hedo Turkoglu
Jameer Nelson
Rafer Alston
Courtney Lee
JJ Redick
Mickael Pietrus
2016 ring >>>>> Kobe's 2 combined.

[Lebron23]

4 rings that LeFraud bought he didn't win those organically and that last FMVP that he won his teammate AD had to blatantly hold back so he could win the award.

Kobe got his 2 chips out the mud,beat the Big 3 Celitics and a Magic team that LeFraud couldn't overcome even with HCA.

Dwight Howard
Rashard Lewis
Hedo Turkoglu
Jameer Nelson
Rafer Alston
Courtney Lee
JJ Redick
Mickael Pietrus

Where are my cheese burger and fries??

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

2016 ring >>>>> Kobe's 2 combined.
Kobe's 2 combined w/ Gasol as 2nd option >>>>> 2016 manufactured ring w/ Kyrie as 2nd option

[ShawkFactory]

Kobe's 2 combined w/ Gasol as 2nd option >>>>> 2016 manufactured ring w/ Kyrie as 2nd option

Maybe if they played the same teams.

[ImKobe]

Kobe's 2 combined w/ Gasol as 2nd option >>>>> 2016 manufactured ring w/ Kyrie as 2nd option

Yep. KB carried that '09 squad offensively, Bran and Kyrie were both essentially #1 options on that team in that PO run as Bran averaged 26 and Kyrie put up 25 a game.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

Maybe if they played the same teams.

Kobe killed the Spurs on more than one occasion during the playoffs.LeBron on the other hand didn't come close to defeating them in 07 Finals,was afraid to take wide open jumpers and got bailed out by Ray in 13 Finals,had cramps and decided to stat pad in 14 Finals.Let's also not forget all the other teams Kobe had to go through in the wild wild west.

Where are my cheese burger and fries??
With just a click of a button you can make a McDonald's cheeseburger and fries in confines of your own home (or your parent's)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETTyVQrUZt8


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvOx7tA_Cv8

[ShawkFactory]

Kobe killed the Spurs on more than one occasion during the playoffs.LeBron on the other hand didn't come close to defeating them in 07 Finals,was afraid to take wide open jumpers and got bailed out by Ray in 13 Finals,had cramps and decided to stat pad in 14 Finals.Let's also not forget all the other teams Kobe had to go through in the wild wild west.

With just a click of a button you can make a McDonald's cheeseburger and fries in confines of your own home (or your parent's)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETTyVQrUZt8


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvOx7tA_Cv8

Completely irrelevant to the “conversation”. I’m sure it made you feel great though so go for it :cheers:

[Foster5k]

As much as I like Kobe, I'll have to say Lebron is overall better.

Kobe had Shaq.

When Kobe didn't have Shaq, he couldn't win until he got a better team around him. He threatened to go to Chicago if the team didn't get better.

LeBron had Dwade(past his prime) and won rings versus the mighty Spurs who hadn't loss a Finals.

LeBron had a headcase named Kyrie that no other player or team could make work and beat one of the best teams in NBA history the 73 win Warriors(the best regular season record in NBA history).

Lebron also won a chip for his hometown as he promised he would. He delivered the goods.

And when everyone was crying over the death of Kobe Bryant himself, LeBron promised to bring a championship to the Lakers in honor of Kobe. Again... he delivered the goods.

Say what you want about Lebron James. One can hate him, like him, or love him. No matter the emotion, you must respect what he has accomplished in the league. He truly embodies what it means to be one of the greatest of all time and will go down as one of the best to ever do it if not the best. I still got Jordan ahead of Lebron but only slightly. Lebron still could top Jordan if he wins more, etc.

[Axe]

How many mvps does kobe have?

[red1]

Kobe is winning this poll considering that most of LeBron votes are basically coming from like 3 trolls.

kobe is actually getting smoked in a landslide in this poll if we consider the fact that it was created when kobe had 2 finals MVPs and lebron had 3.


lebron now has 4 finals MVPs - literally double what kobe had - and now has 3 MVPs more than kobe plus every single other record in the record book including the only finals MVP over a 70+win team in NBA history.



this debate was over in 2013 and now it is just pointless. kobe himself would grudgingly say lebron had a better career.

[1987_Lakers]

This debate ended years ago, I don't know why OP keeps bumping this thread.

[ImKobe]

kobe is actually getting smoked in a landslide in this poll if we consider the fact that it was created when kobe had 2 finals MVPs and lebron had 3.


lebron now has 4 finals MVPs - literally double what kobe had - and now has 3 MVPs more than kobe plus every single other record in the record book including the only finals MVP over a 70+win team in NBA history.



this debate was over in 2013 and now it is just pointless. kobe himself would grudgingly say lebron had a better career.

The debate was over in 2013 when Bran had 2 rings and won a title averaging 26 ppg with 25 ppg on mediocre efficiency in the Finals w/Spurs gifting him a ring? Keep exposing yourself.

[red1]

The debate was over in 2013 when Bran had 2 rings and won a title averaging 26 ppg with 25 ppg on mediocre efficiency in the Finals w/Spurs gifting him a ring? Keep exposing yourself.

You're mentally retarded if you think otherwise. I said it then and Steve Kerr all these years later actually agrees with me. To a tee.


Steve Kerr won multiple rings with jordan. Just an FYI.

[ImKobe]

You're mentally retarded if you think otherwise. I said it then and Steve Kerr all these years later actually agrees with me. To a tee.


Steve Kerr won multiple rings with jordan. Just an FYI.

Ok, and you're going to disregard Kobe's all-time position or his impact despite Shaq, Magic, West etc all claiming otherwise. I can give you Lebron himself putting Kobe over him at his supposed peak ('09) but you'd never put Kobe over Bran that year, right?

[red1]

The debate was over in 2013 when Bran had 2 rings and won a title averaging 26 ppg with 25 ppg on mediocre efficiency in the Finals w/Spurs gifting him a ring? Keep exposing yourself.

rest in piss bitch :oldlol:


https://youtu.be/7MG8wjJNdf4?t=62

[red1]

Ok, and you're going to disregard Kobe's all-time position or his impact despite Shaq, Magic, West etc all claiming otherwise. I can give you Lebron himself putting Kobe over him at his supposed peak ('09) but you'd never put Kobe over Bran that year, right?

dude. just stop.



I dont even know what you're aiming at. lebron was better than kobe in 2009 but I have no problem saying kobe had the better year.

[ImKobe]

dude. just stop.



I dont even know what you're aiming at. lebron was better than kobe in 2009 but I have no problem saying kobe had the better year.

Except he wasn't and Bran himself admitted that. :kobe:

[red1]

Except he wasn't and Bran himself admitted that. :kobe:

how come steve kerr said lebron was already top-5 after two rings? (and 4 MVPs, and being the best player of all-time for every age group up to that point....)?


why were you even surprised when I posted such an obvious fact?

[red1]

The debate was over in 2013 when Bran had 2 rings and won a title averaging 26 ppg with 25 ppg on mediocre efficiency in the Finals w/Spurs gifting him a ring? Keep exposing yourself.

thats exactly what I'm saying.



https://youtu.be/7MG8wjJNdf4?t=62

[ImKobe]

how come steve kerr said lebron was already top-5 after two rings? (and 4 MVPs, and being the best player of all-time for every age group up to that point....)?


why were you even surprised when I posted such an obvious fact?

He didn't, that quote you posted is from 2018 :kobe: . We've seen players like Morant light GS small-ball lineups for 47 in the POs. Ja averaged 38 ppg against GS and he couldn't even finish his last game.. Luka put up 32/9/6 and most of y'all thought he underachieved, Warriors aren't that great on D if we're keeping it real.

[red1]

He didn't, that quote you posted is from 2018 :kobe: . We've seen players like Morant light GS small-ball lineups for 47 in the POs. Ja averaged 38 ppg against GS and he couldn't even finish his last game.. Luka put up 32/9/6 and most of y'all thought he underachieved, Warriors aren't that great on D if we're keeping it real.

he said that after beating the cavs 2 years in a row... said lebron was already top-5 after 2013... watch the video again you moron...


he had every reason to praise kd or curry after his own stars won 2 rings in a row... but he went ahead and said lebron is the GOAT...



yeah I'd believe him... he only has 9 rings between the bulls, spurs and warriors....

[1987_Lakers]

He didn't, that quote you posted is from 2018 :kobe: . We've seen players like Morant light GS small-ball lineups for 47 in the POs. Ja averaged 38 ppg against GS and he couldn't even finish his last game.. Luka put up 32/9/6 and most of y'all thought he underachieved, Warriors aren't that great on D if we're keeping it real.

lol, Kerr said in the vid which takes place in 2018 that 5 years ago he had him as a top 5 player ever (2013).

I think he is referring to peak play. By 2012, pretty much everyone would agree that LeBron reached a level Kobe NEVER did.

[red1]

lol, Kerr said in the vid which takes place in 2018 that 5 years ago he had him as a top 5 player ever (2013).

I think he is referring to peak play. By 2012, pretty much everyone would agree that LeBron reached a level Kobe NEVER did.

its undeniable.


we already forget - lebron and kd were setting all-time efficiency records in 2013 and 2014.



lebron for all 4 of his MVP seasons was already better than kobe ever was (2009,2010,2012,2013)



lebron in any of these 4 seasons is undoubtedly better than any version of kobe.

[kawhileonard2]

kobe is actually getting smoked in a landslide in this poll if we consider the fact that it was created when kobe had 2 finals MVPs and lebron had 3.


lebron now has 4 finals MVPs - literally double what kobe had - and now has 3 MVPs more than kobe plus every single other record in the record book including the only finals MVP over a 70+win team in NBA history.



this debate was over in 2013 and now it is just pointless. kobe himself would grudgingly say lebron had a better career.

Jennie Buss already said Kobe was better than Lebron.

[red1]

Jennie Buss already said Kobe was better than Lebron.

dunno who that is.

[kawhileonard2]

dunno who that is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeanie_Buss

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe three-peated playing next to Shaq and then went and got 2 more chips out the mud as the #1 guy without Shaq.

You mean to tell me with all this help LeFraud acquired throughout his career while jumping from team to team he still hasn't three-peated?

Kobe > LeBron

This!

Lebron hasn’t even won a playoff series with the lakers when fans were around. He can’t handle the pressure like Kobe could.

[Hey Yo]

dunno who that is.

It's Jenny Buss from the block whose phone number was 867-5309

[bullettooth]

Both better than Duncan

https://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2818167/duncanmiss.gif

The next year Duncan would come back and pistol whip LeBron so hard he gave him the biggest margin of NBA finals loss EVER.

[HighFlyer23]

Kobe was a more special player I’d say.

Nobody in basketball history had more moves and overall basketball skill than Kobe Bryant. He absorbed more basketball than anyone. Aside from a few years in the beginning of his career, he was not an athletic marvel. He was completely fearless on the court and never held back.

It’s like what Dwyane Wade said, Kobe was a master of the game.

Lebron is the most physically gifted player ever and probably ranks higher overall.

But one on one, I am taking Kobe Bryant over Lebron James.

Lebron is bigger, stronger, faster, more athletic …. But he is not as diehard of a competitor as Kobe … I’m sure we all have played with guys who were probably better overall than other players but there’s always that one guy who is a monster on the court in terms of intangibles, desire and will to win and dominate. And the latter player will always command more respect than the former.

[kawhileonard2]

The next year Duncan would come back and pistol whip LeBron so hard he gave him the biggest margin of NBA finals loss EVER.

And make him switch teams again.

[kawhileonard2]

Kobe was a more special player I’d say.

Nobody in basketball history had more moves and overall basketball skill than Kobe Bryant. He absorbed more basketball than anyone. Aside from a few years in the beginning of his career, he was not an athletic marvel. He was completely fearless on the court and never held back.

It’s like what Dwyane Wade said, Kobe was a master of the game.

Lebron is the most physically gifted player ever and probably ranks higher overall.

But one on one, I am taking Kobe Bryant over Lebron James.

Lebron is bigger, stronger, faster, more athletic …. But he is not as diehard of a competitor as Kobe … I’m sure we all have played with guys who were probably better overall than other players but there’s always that one guy who is a monster on the court in terms of intangibles, desire and will to win and dominate. And the latter player will always command more respect than the former.
Devin Booker a lesser version of Kobe broke Lebron what do you think would have done to him?

[light]

LeBron is universally considered a top 2 all time player. Kobe is not in that conversation.

[light]

The next year Duncan would come back and pistol whip LeBron so hard he gave him the biggest margin of NBA finals loss EVER.

Bron was still excellent in those finals. There was no issue with him. The issue was Wade's knee and that he was burnt out and Bosh was Bosh. Bosh would be out of the league just two seasons later.

So it was basically LeBron vs the Spurs again just like in 2007.

Check out the PER leaders for the 2014 finals:

1 LeBron James - 32.6
2 Patty Mills - 28.4
3 Kawhi Leonard - 25.2
4 Tiago Splitter - 20.1
5 Manu Ginobili - 20.0
6 Tim Duncan - 19.9
7 Danny Green - 19.1
8 Chris Bosh - 16.2
9 Tony Parker - 15.9
10 Rashard Lewis - 13.7
11 Marco Belinelli - 12.9
12 Boris Diaw - 12.3
13 Ray Allen - 12.2
14 Dwyane Wade - 11.7
15 Chris Andersen - 6.7
16 Mario Chalmers - 5.0
17 Norris Cole - 3.4

[8Ball]

Both better than Duncan

https://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2818167/duncanmiss.gif

2013 finals broke lots of fans.

[8Ball]

Bron was still excellent in those finals. There was no issue with him. The issue was Wade's knee and that he was burnt out and Bosh was Bosh. Bosh would be out of the league just two seasons later.

So it was basically LeBron vs the Spurs again just like in 2007.

Check out the PER leaders for the 2014 finals:

1 LeBron James - 32.6
2 Patty Mills - 28.4
3 Kawhi Leonard - 25.2
4 Tiago Splitter - 20.1
5 Manu Ginobili - 20.0
6 Tim Duncan - 19.9
7 Danny Green - 19.1
8 Chris Bosh - 16.2
9 Tony Parker - 15.9
10 Rashard Lewis - 13.7
11 Marco Belinelli - 12.9
12 Boris Diaw - 12.3
13 Ray Allen - 12.2
14 Dwyane Wade - 11.7
15 Chris Andersen - 6.7
16 Mario Chalmers - 5.0
17 Norris Cole - 3.4

There is a price to pay physically for going to 4 straight finals.

Bron went to 8. GOAT shit.

[Johnny32]

Bron was still excellent in those finals. There was no issue with him. The issue was Wade's knee and that he was burnt out and Bosh was Bosh. Bosh would be out of the league just two seasons later.

So it was basically LeBron vs the Spurs again just like in 2007.

Check out the PER leaders for the 2014 finals:

1 LeBron James - 32.6
2 Patty Mills - 28.4
3 Kawhi Leonard - 25.2
4 Tiago Splitter - 20.1
5 Manu Ginobili - 20.0
6 Tim Duncan - 19.9
7 Danny Green - 19.1
8 Chris Bosh - 16.2
9 Tony Parker - 15.9
10 Rashard Lewis - 13.7
11 Marco Belinelli - 12.9
12 Boris Diaw - 12.3
13 Ray Allen - 12.2
14 Dwyane Wade - 11.7
15 Chris Andersen - 6.7
16 Mario Chalmers - 5.0
17 Norris Cole - 3.4

LeDAMN.

[bison]

As a huge Lebron stan it pains me to say that Kobe is miles ahead of Lebron on the all time list, but I must give respect where it’s due. It what Lebron would want :applause:

[Full Court]

As a massive Lebron fan, it is with great chagrin that I must admit that Lebron is on the verge of slipping out of the top ten.

[kawhileonard2]

As a massive Lebron fan, it is with great chagrin that I must admit that Lebron is on the verge of slipping out of the top ten.

Yep

[RRR3]

Hilarious that for all OP’s desperation LeBron is still winning the poll.

[TheMan]

It's close, take away Wheel's alts and Kobe would be leading...

[TheMan]

As a massive Lebron fan, it is with great chagrin that I must admit that Lebron is on the verge of slipping out of the top ten.

Yep, I really thought we would all be witnesses to greatness but too many black marks, man :( LeBron is fringe top 10

[kawhileonard2]

It's close, take away Wheel's alts and Kobe would be leading...

This!

[kawhileonard2]

Yep, I really thought we would all be witnesses to greatness but too many black marks, man :( LeBron is fringe top 10

And Curry destroyed him and came in the league after him.

[kawhileonard2]

How we know Kobe was greater than Lebron is that when both had stacked teams Lebron struggled or got destroyed by Duncan while kobe would destroy Duncan. Lebron knew this fact and thus avoided Kobe.

[Nowitness]

How we know Kobe was greater than Lebron is that when both had stacked teams Lebron struggled or got destroyed by Duncan while kobe would destroy Duncan. Lebron knew this fact and thus avoided Kobe.

3 of Kobes 4 playoff wins v Duncan came as a 2nd option, but okay then.

[OrlandoMagicGuy]

3 of Kobes 4 playoff wins v Duncan came as a 2nd option, but okay then.

Who led the Lakers in scoring for the 01,02,04,08 playoff series vs Duncan's Spurs?

[bison]

Remove the alts and Godbe is winning by a HUGE margin :bowdown: