Lets say you are given the authority to "clean up" the basketball hall of fame......

[Kblaze8855]

And remove names you feel shouldnt have made it to keep the standards high.....and to bar people from making it in the future for the same reason....


You are given a list of people drafted in the last 40 years to make it in(people before that given eternal "pioneer" status so they are safe)....

The Hall wants you to pick 16 people to cut from those they deem mostly NBA career inductees. They arent cutting internationals, coaches, college greats, or contributors yet. Thats for another time. You have 36 modern NBA based hall of famers and they want to cut to not more than 20. They feel 20 for 40 years is a good number to make it a real tough cut to make like it is in baseball and football(Art Monk was the all time receptions leader for like 20 years and didnt make it till 2008).


You are also given a list of 25 presumed HOF finalists in the future who have been drafted the last 30 years and played at least 10 seasons. You need to keep that list to 12 to leave room for the up and comers like Giannis, Leonard, and Kyrie...so 13 have to go. You are removing them from all future consideration in advance.


Make the required cuts.





16 have to go from:


Steve Nash
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Mo Cheeks
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
Mcgrady
Tmac
Iverson
Shaq
Yao
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Reggie Miller
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing
Nique
Dumars
Barkley
Drexler
Worthy
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
Mchale








13 forever excluded out of:





Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
Dirk
Paul
Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Steph
Westbrook
Harden
Rose
Ben Wallace
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Tony Parker
Blake
Webber
KG
Wade
Durant



Make your cuts. Nobody will know it was you. You can pretend to be outraged with everyone else. Tony Parker will never know.

[LAVAR BALL]

Second cut seems doable

Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
Dirk
Paul
Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Steph
Westbrook
Harden
Rose
Ben Wallace
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Tony Parker
Blake
Webber
KG
Wade
Durant


Th first one, damn....

[Shogon]

Steve Nash
Grant Hill - cut
Jason Kidd - cut
Mo Cheeks - cut
Sidney Moncrief - cut
Ray Allen - cut
Mcgrady / Tmac - cut
Iverson
Shaq
Yao - cut
Mutombo - cut
Mitch Richmond - cut
Zo - cut
Payton - cut
Bernard King - cut
Reggie Miller - cut
Chris Mullin - cut
Dennis Rodman
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing - cut
Nique - cut
Dumars - cut
Barkley
Drexler - cut
Worthy - cut
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
Mchale - cut

This first list is harder... I had to bring it up to 20 when I was really looking at the top 16 guys who were being cut.



Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
Dirk
Paul - cut
Bosh - cut
Aldridge - cut
Billups - cut
Pierce - cut
Tim Hardaway - cut
Steph
Westbrook
Harden (wish I could cut this ********** mother****er but couldn't)
Rose
Ben Wallace - cut
Dwight - cut
Melo - cut
Vince - cut
Penny - cut
Tony Parker - cut
Blake - cut
Webber - cut
KG
Wade
Durant

Second list was much easier.

[Shogon]

And as much as I have an extreme distaste for arbitrary media awards, I just can't bring myself to cut MVPs otherwise Nash, Harden, Rose, Iverson & etc would have been cut.

I just realized I cut 14 from the second list... oh well... **** Dwight Howard.

[Kblaze8855]

Its tough. We are only two people in and already cuts I expected to make it onto everyones list. But its not easy. And shouldnt be. Baseball and football are stingy with it at times(guys like Art Monk, Roger Maris, Chris Carter and so on fighting for spots they clearly deserved not to mention the cheaters like Bondy and clemens). It feels like a real tough hill to climb.

Basketball? You KNOW Dwight is going....and Bosh....probably even Lamarcus Aldridge. Sounds odd but hes a 7 time all star. Theres exactly one seven time all star not in the hall or going. Larry Foust. And he only made all those teams by being in the era where every team had to have one(like baseball requires) and there being few teams on top of it so more people made it(by percentage).

These cuts would be hard but it would make being a hall of famer mean a lot more.

[Xiao Yao You]

Its tough. We are only two people in and already cuts I expected to make it onto everyones list. But its not easy. And shouldnt be. Baseball and football are stingy with it at times(guys like Art Monk, Roger Maris, Chris Carter and so on fighting for spots they clearly deserved not to mention the cheaters like Bondy and clemens). It feels like a real tough hill to climb.

Basketball? You KNOW Dwight is going....and Bosh....probably even Lamarcus Aldridge. Sounds odd but hes a 7 time all star. Theres exactly one seven time all star not in the hall or going. Larry Foust. And he only made all those teams by being in the era where every team had to have one(like baseball requires) and there being few teams on top of it so more people made it(by percentage).

These cuts would be hard but it would make being a hall of famer mean a lot more.

So Cousins is a HOFer because of his all star berths despite being an obvious negative on the court?

[Kblaze8855]

Not yet. Plenty of four-time all stars don

[HoopologyPhD]

Michael Jeffrey Jordan shouldn't be on your list he has done too much for the game. Even diehard mj haters that aren't idiots admit he is top 5 at worst.

[Kblaze8855]

Obviously he wouldn

[FKAri]

Why is there a comfortable size in everyone's head regarding the Hall of Fame. I never understood it. Like how do you decide enough is enough? And is it a Hall of Fame or a Hall of excellence? It's all so arbitrary anyway that the idea of cleaning it up seems equally arbitrary.

[sdot_thadon]

Yeah this is a tough one, my cuts are in red:

Steve Nash
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Mo Cheeks
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
Mcgrady
Tmac
Iverson
Shaq
Yao
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Reggie Miller
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing
Nique
Dumars
Barkley
Drexler
Worthy
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
Mchale

So I immediately decide I'm not cutting any MVP's or Stars that lead champions out of my hof. (i stil ended up with several questionable calls) It left me with some painful decisions like whom to cut out of Tmac, Ewing, Drexler, King, Deke, and Nique. With this list it will be impossible to make the cuts without contradiction so some of them end up being personal choice.

Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
Dirk
Paul
Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Steph
Westbrook
Harden
Rose
Ben Wallace
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Parker
Blake
Webber
KG
Wade
Durant

If i were to kick any Mvp out of my hall, it would be Rose, with Nash being fair game to a lesser extent. Kblaze this feels dirty to say some of these guys aren't hall of famers....and I'm not a fan of being unable to apply even standards but this was a hard one.

[Ainosterhaspie]

16 have to go from:

Zero question for these guys:
Bird
Shaq
Jordan
Magic
Hakeem

Next Group:
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Barkley
Drob
Isiah
Moses

Getting Tough:
Drexler
Jason Kidd
Nique
Mchale
Dennis Rodman
Reggie Miller
Steve Nash
Ray Allen

Dropped:
Sidney Moncrief
Bernard King
Mo Cheeks
Grant Hill
Iverson
Mitch Richmond
Chris Mullin
Dumars
Zo
McGrady?
Tmac?
Yao
Mutombo
Payton
Ewing
Worthy

13 forever excluded out of:

Zero Question:
Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
KG
Steph
Durant

Next Group:
Dirk
Wade
Harden
Paul

Tough Call:
Ben Wallace
Dwight

Cut:
Tim Hardaway
Penny
Rose
Aldridge
Melo
Blake
Tony Parker
Webber
Billups
Pierce
Vince
Bosh
Westbrook

[SouBeachTalents]

Bolded are getting cut

The 16 from this list, a nearly impossible list with multiple players I'd never exclude from the HOF

Steve Nash
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Mo Cheeks
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
Mcgrady
Iverson
Shaq
Yao
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Reggie Miller
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing
Nique
Dumars
Barkley
Drexler
Worthy
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
Mchale

The 13 from this list, this was actually really easy to narrow down

Kobe
Lebron
Dirk
Paul
Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Steph
Westbrook
Harden
Rose
Ben Wallace
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Tony Parker
Blake
Webber
KG
Wade
Durant

[PickernRoller]

16 have to go from:

Steve Nash
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Mo Cheeks
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
Tmac
Iverson
Shaq
Yao
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Reggie Miller
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing
Nique
Dumars
Barkley
Drexler
Worthy
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
Mchale

13 forever excluded out of:

Duncan
Kobe
Lebron (pending guaranteed PED scandal)
Dirk
Paul
Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Steph
Westbrook
Harden
Rose
Ben Wallace
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Tony Parker
Blake
Webber
KG
Wade
Durant

[Rocket]

Yao never did anywhere close to enough on the court to deserve to be there. That is not to say I did not like Yao. He was a good player who exposed the NBA to billions of people but his career was cut short and he was never a "superstar" type player. His biggest contribution to the game was all the Asian fans he brought to the NBA.

[Xiao Yao You]

Yao never did anywhere close to enough on the court to deserve to be there. That is not to say I did not like Yao. He was a good player who exposed the NBA to billions of people but his career was cut short and he was never a "superstar" type player. His biggest contribution to the game was all the Asian fans he brought to the NBA.

big fan of Yao but he isn't a HOFer based on his play. Shouldn't have been an all-star a lot of years but got that Chinese vote

[sdot_thadon]

big fan of Yao but he isn't a HOFer based on his play. Shouldn't have been an all-star a lot of years but got that Chinese vote
Well to be fair I think guys like Yao and Deke were inducted as contributors to the game and not for their playing careers, could be wrong however.

[Kblaze8855]

I

[sdot_thadon]

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]I

[iamgine]

In:

Iverson
Shaq
Yao
Malone
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
Pippen
Barkley
Stockton
Steve Nash

Out:

Grant Hill
Mo Cheeks
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Worthy
Reggie Miller
Mchale
Dumars
Mcgrady
Jason Kidd
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Nique
Drexler

[Smoke117]

This first list is harder... I had to bring it up to 20 when I was really looking at the top 16 guys who were being cut.




Second list was much easier.

lol. Ewing was a far superior overall player to Rodman. Cutting him while leaving Rodman in is a joke. Same goes for Drexler and Ray Allen.

[EllEffEll]

Definitely tough, and subjective based on what I value.

Steve Nash
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Mo Cheeks
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
McGrady
Tmac
Iverson
Shaq
Yao
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Reggie Miller
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing
Nique
Dumars
Barkley
Drexler
Worthy
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
McHale


Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
Dirk
Paul
Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Steph
Westbrook
Harden
Rose
Ben Wallace
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Tony Parker
Blake
Webber
KG
Wade

[Smoke117]

Definitely tough, and subjective based on what I value.

Steve Nash
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Mo Cheeks
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
McGrady
Tmac
Iverson
Shaq
Yao
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Reggie Miller
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Pippen
Malone
Stockton
Drob
Hakeem
Jordan
Ewing
Nique
Dumars
Barkley
Drexler
Worthy
Magic
Moses
Bird
Isiah
McHale


Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
Dirk
Paul
Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Steph
Westbrook
Harden
Rose
Ben Wallace
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Tony Parker
Blake
Webber
KG
Wade


An actual decent list besides having Penny Hardawaqy over Chris Paul, Dwight, and Pierce (who I think is overrated). Seriously, though, how is Penny Hardaway over Chris Paul whe CP3 was a an all star for about 10+ years and Penny like 5? That's just cringe worthy. That's beside the point that CP3 doesn't just have longevity, but he was a far superior player in 08, 09 than Penny ever was at his peak. There is literally no intelligent argument to make for Penny Hardaway in the HOF over Chris Paul.

[EllEffEll]

An actual decent list besides having Penny Hardawaqy over Chris Paul, Dwight, and Pierce (who I think is overrated). Seriously, though, how is Penny Hardaway over Chris Paul whe CP3 was a an all star for about 10+ years and Penny like 5? That's just cringe worthy. That's beside the point that CP3 doesn't just have longevity, but he was a far superior player in 08, 09 than Penny ever was at his peak. There is literally no intelligent argument to make for Penny Hardaway in the HOF over Chris Paul.

Now that I look closer, you're absolutely right :pimp:

[Kblaze8855]

Missed this...



Why is there a comfortable size in everyone's head regarding the Hall of Fame. I never understood it. Like how do you decide enough is enough? And is it a Hall of Fame or a Hall of excellence? It's all so arbitrary anyway that the idea of cleaning it up seems equally arbitrary.

Of course its arbitrary. But the idea of a great honor being reserved for the best.....but someone like Antawn Jamison gets it? Would just seem kinda pointless to me.

Theres a cutoff....somewhere. Hard to say where it should be but there is one.

[brooks_thompson]

As a tangent, I think for every inductee, one person should be kicked out of the Hall of Fame. There shouldn't be a quota to fill every year, and that way voters would have to be much more careful about who they let in. It would be easy for the first few years since there are several iffy enshrinees, but after a while it would take a lot of careful consideration to let a guy in, especially since you're dissing another guy by dropping him.

The only big problem with this (aside from the awful PR from kicking guys out which makes this unrealistic to start), is the oldest players would eventually be replaced by newer and we wouldn't have as much representation from the early days. Maybe just do it for a set period just to tidy up the HOF a bit and get rid of some of the weeds.

[Overdrive]

Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Mo Cheeks
Sidney Moncrief
Ray Allen
Tmac
Yao
Mutombo
Mitch Richmond
Zo
Payton
Bernard King
Reggie Miller
Chris Mullin
Dennis Rodman
Nique
Worthy
Mchale

Bosh
Aldridge
Billups
Pierce
Tim Hardaway
Rose
Dwight
Melo
Vince
Penny
Tony Parker
Blake
Webber

I'd take Ben Wallace over Rose, Billups and Parker.

Imo he was the most important player on the very well balanced Pistons team. Rose good an MVP, but his career was cut to short. You take away that one season that wasn't much better than any of Westbrook's after and he doesn't make the HOF. Parker like others had a HOF worthy career international play included in the current HOF, but in this condensed HOF? No way.