Iverson responds to bleacher report leaving him out of their top 50

[JohnMax]

https://www.instagram.com/p/B3AZc-bgfeq/

[BigKobeFan]

https://www.instagram.com/p/B3AZc-bgfeq/

Bran stans on suicide watch

[SpaceJam]

I love how he starts listing BS career achievements because all he really has to hang his hat on is an MVP that belongs to Shaq and all star games

Overrated

[coin24]

List was total bs..

[And1AllDay]

I love how he starts listing BS career achievements because all he really has to hang his hat on is an MVP that belongs to Shaq and all star games

Overrated


i been said iverson is a inefficient chucker volume scorer that never had a good number two to help carry him

[Kblaze8855]

8 or 9 regular season or finals mvps behind guys like Adrian Dantley and Reggie make it hard to say it’s about accomplishments or winning. Have at least 2 MVP with 2 rings not even on the list. Actually I see 3 of them now. Maybe 4 depending on if you count Mikan. Have 5 time champs and mvps behind a guy who only started for 3 seasons and was all nba third team two times?

There’s obviously no set criteria and it’s released just to generate conversations like this. People who hate Iverson will come in here and talk about it being a good decision and them making a good call as if the entire list isn’t garbage

I mean....AI is left off but so is Dave Cowens....

If you can lead 68 win teams, win 2 rings, be nba mvp, a 9 or 10 time all star, finals mvp, be on multiple all d teams, be the ultimate teammate and and hustle player while also scoring well and doing like 21/15 in the playoffs your whole prime and not make it over guys like Dantley and Reggie it’s clear success isn’t really being considered.

Whatever standard you wanna lean on....peak play, or numbers, or individual skills, or winning there’s someone left off to make the list inconsistent.

AI is just one of many weird choices.

[Xiao Yao You]

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]8 or 9 regular season or finals mvps behind guys like Adrian Dantley and Reggie make it hard to say it

[RealSkipBayless]

[quote]I was discouraged when I seen that @kobebryant wasn

[Kblaze8855]

If Carmelo is the superstar everyone seems to think he is than so was A.D.


Who said he wasn

[scuzzy]

The "Don't Forget About Us" Crew




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[SpaceJam]

Good list Scuz, inefficient losers. Pierce got lucky they got a big 3 before the league caught on (FMVP should have gone to Ray)

EDIT: Remembered SJax got carried too

[SouBeachTalents]

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Who said he wasn

[Xiao Yao You]

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Who said he wasn

[Bronbron23]

i been said iverson is a inefficient chucker volume scorer that never had a good number two to help carry him he's absolutely a top 50 player. At his peak he's one of the best scorers ever. How many guys 6 feet or less have won scoring titles or taken a team to the finals with no help?

[SpaceJam]

he's absolutely a top 50 player. At his peak he's one of the best scorers ever. How many guys 6 feet or less have won scoring titles or taken a team to the finals with no help?

The no help narrative is slightly overblown for the 2001 76ers, maybe scoring wise. But defensively they were nice. Also huge asterisk being that the officiating in the 76ers vs Bucks series being bit suspicious. Game 5 had AI bailed out severely had a 5/27 shooting game, Eric Snow and Mutombo brought it that night

[Smoke117]

lol Iverson isn't top 50 all time. That's pretty much a fact. He is basically the weakest MVP before Derrick Rose. Shaq obviously should have repeated in that regard in 2001.

[305Baller]

practice? you talaking about practice?

yaaaaahhaahahahahahah

[LAmbruh]

The league was atrocious during AI's 48 mo ghetto glory stint, teams caught up to him fast

Heck, Kyrie is basically Iverson with an actual jumper And at east Irving atempts to try on defense, even though he gets lost. AI was just flat out lazy saving it for offense. There's 5+ point guards in the league now that are not only better ballers, but better winners than the Canswer.

100 lbs heavier and a foot taller, Zion has arguably identical handles and quickness .

[Doranku]

The league was atrocious during AI's 48 mo, the league caught up to him fast

Heck, Kyrie is basically Iverson with an actual jumper And at east Irving atempts to try on defense, even though he gets lost. AI was just flat out . There's 5+ point guards in the league now that are not only better ballers, but better winners than the Canswer.

100 lbs heavier and a foot taller, Zion has arguably identical handles and quickness .

Imagine saying someone who led the league in steals 3 seasons in a row didn't try on defense. :lol

[LAmbruh]

Imagine saying someone who led the league in steals 3 seasons in a row didn't try on defense. :lol
Roaming, gambling, playing passing lanes, out of position. Yup that's AI

Quick guards scooping a loose ball twice a game =/= defense

https://youtu.be/cAqi4o3055E?t=127

[MrFonzworth]

The league was atrocious during AI's 48 mo ghetto glory stint, teams caught up to him fast

Heck, Kyrie is basically Iverson with an actual jumper And at east Irving atempts to try on defense, even though he gets lost. AI was just flat out lazy saving it for offense. There's 5+ point guards in the league now that are not only better ballers, but better winners than the Canswer.

100 lbs heavier and a foot taller, Zion has arguably identical handles and quickness .
Might be the worst post of all time on any forum ever. BIG yikes.

[MrFonzworth]

Roaming, gambling, playing passing lanes, out of position. Yup that's AI

Quick guards scooping a loose ball twice a game =/= defense

https://youtu.be/cAqi4o3055E?t=127
Imagine referencing a joke made on the Herd as an argument:lol

[SpaceJam]

The league was atrocious during AI's 48 mo ghetto glory stint, teams caught up to him fast

Heck, Kyrie is basically Iverson with an actual jumper And at east Irving atempts to try on defense, even though he gets lost. AI was just flat out lazy saving it for offense. There's 5+ point guards in the league now that are not only better ballers, but better winners than the Canswer.

100 lbs heavier and a foot taller, Zion has arguably identical handles and quickness .

I have never heard that nickname before, clever :roll:

[MrFonzworth]

https://youtu.be/KwkZqMLv3ng

Definitely looks like a lazy player who saved it all for offense:hammerhead:

[Kblaze8855]

lol Iverson isn't top 50 all time. That's pretty much a fact. He is basically the weakest MVP before Derrick Rose. Shaq obviously should have repeated in that regard in 2001.

Id bet my life if you asked the surviving members of the First list who should be added to it he would get that vote. He was unanimous when NBA TV did it with every voter being a player and several being on the original.

[305Baller]

Spam chucker

Zero rings

[Andrei89]

Iverson with Shaq threepeats 2000, 2001 and 2002

[LostCause]

100 lbs heavier and a foot taller, Zion has arguably identical handles .

If that

[Bronbron23]

Id bet my life if you asked the surviving members of the First list who should be added to it he would get that vote. He was unanimous when NBA TV did it with every voter being a player and several being on the original.
Yeah some of these dudes are way off on this one. A.I is one of the best scorers the game has ever seen which is crazy given his size. In his peak there were experts and players saying he was a better scorer than mj. That might of been a bit of a stretch but that shows how bad the boy was. That combined with his cultural influence in the game should definitely put him in the top 50.

[Bronbron23]

The no help narrative is slightly overblown for the 2001 76ers, maybe scoring wise. But defensively they were nice. Also huge asterisk being that the officiating in the 76ers vs Bucks series being bit suspicious. Game 5 had AI bailed out severely had a 5/27 shooting game, Eric Snow and Mutombo brought it that night
I don't think it's overblown at all. He didn't have another offensive all star. You take almost any great player and take away there all star second option and they don't win any chips. There's a couple exceptions but it's hard to win without a great team especially at Iverson's size.

And yeah there were some questionable calls but that happens with everybody. Kobe and mj both got some favorable calls on there way to there chips.

Iverson was a knuckle headed nucka sometimes but his skill and Hart were up there with anyone. That with his influence on the game and culture I just don't know how he dosnt make the list

[ImKobe]

I love how he starts listing BS career achievements because all he really has to hang his hat on is an MVP that belongs to Shaq and all star games

Overrated

2001 MVP belongs to Shaq? Him and Kobe averaged 28.7 and 28.5 points per game, they won the same amount of games as the Sixers while the Sixers were #1 in their Conference. AI's 2nd option averaged 12 points a game :lol

AI not being top 50 is ridiculous.

[LostCause]

The no help narrative is slightly overblown for the 2001 76ers, maybe scoring wise. But defensively they were nice

By this logic, the "no help" narrative also doesn't apply to the 07 Cavs. The relative defensive ratings of these particular teams:

01 Sixers: -4.1
07 Cavs: -5.2

In fact the 07 Cavs lost the last 2 games by a combined 4 points, which was largely because of their strong defense (Which LeBron wasn't very impactful on at this point in his career)

[warriorfan]

i been said iverson is a inefficient chucker volume scorer that never had a good number two to help carry him

When Lebron put up Allen Iverson percentages in the 2015 Finals I didn

[Mr Feeny]

[QUOTE=warriorfan]When Lebron put up Allen Iverson percentages in the 2015 Finals I didn

[warriorfan]

It was an inefficient series. Awful, in fact. But his career percentage in finals is relatively high. I don't know why we are nitpicking series here.

We have seen tons of posters give bron in 2015 a pass for his inefficient chuck fest yet they will go on about how AI was a bum because of shooting percentages

[Mr Feeny]

We have seen tons of posters give bron in 2015 a pass for his inefficient chuck fest yet they will go on about how AI was a bum because of shooting percentages

Then hold them accountable for the double standard. But the criticism isn't fair.

[3ball]

38. Ewing

19. Pippen


^^^ that's a re-writing of history... Would be preposterous in the 90's

[fourkicks44]

Manu ahead of AI?

:yaohappy:

[90sgoat]

38. Ewing

19. Pippen


^^^ that's a re-writing of history... Would be preposterous in the 90's

:roll:

Absolutely absurd.

[Smoke117]

Yeah some of these dudes are way off on this one. A.I is one of the best scorers the game has ever seen which is crazy given his size. In his peak there were experts and players saying he was a better scorer than mj. That might of been a bit of a stretch but that shows how bad the boy was. That combined with his cultural influence in the game should definitely put him in the top 50.

Yeah, if you disregard efficiency, then sure he's one of the best scorers the game has eve rseen. :rolleyes: Iverson was a high volume scorer. He had to take a shit load of shots to get his points.

[FireDavidKahn]

What's the problem? That's accurate.

[superduper]

Imagine thinking Zion and AI have the same handles :wtf: :roll:

[FireDavidKahn]

I don't think it's overblown at all. He didn't have another offensive all star. You take almost any great player and take away there all star second option and they don't win any chips. There's a couple exceptions but it's hard to win without a great team especially at Iverson's size.

And yeah there were some questionable calls but that happens with everybody. Kobe and mj both got some favorable calls on there way to there chips.

Iverson was a knuckle headed nucka sometimes but his skill and Hart were up there with anyone. That with his influence on the game and culture I just don't know how he dosnt make the list
Imagine having the current COY, DPOY and 6MOY on your team and calling that "no help".

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[ImKobe]

Yeah, if you disregard efficiency, then sure he's one of the best scorers the game has eve rseen. :rolleyes: Iverson was a high volume scorer. He had to take a shit load of shots to get his points.

As did every other perimeter star in the early 2000s. AI however played on teams with little offensive help that needed him to score all those points.

Now look what happens when we ban hand-checking

05-08 - 29/3/7 ~55%TS

He had no trouble scoring efficiently in 08 when he was playing next to Melo and JR in Denver, averaging 26/3/7 on ~57%TS at age 32.

I know a few volume scorers from this era who would see their efficiency drop in the early 2000s :rolleyes: .


Imagine having the current COY, DPOY and 6MOY on your team and calling that "no help".

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

What does that have to do with his 2nd option being Aaron McKie in 2001?

You do realize he led a team to 56 wins with two of his starters missing 30+ games and Mutombo only playing 26 because they traded for him later in the season? Guess what, they were 7-15 without him the next season when he was injured and missed 22 games.

[MrFonzworth]

Imagine having the current COY, DPOY and 6MOY on your team and calling that "no help".

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Coach of the year is a joke accolade, why are people acting like it matters. Take Iverson off the team and there is no COY, no 6MOY, and no DPOY. They wouldn't have the record to even be considered.

[Smoke117]

As did every other perimeter star in the early 2000s. AI however played on teams with little offensive help that needed him to score all those points.

Now look what happens when we ban hand-checking

05-08 - 29/3/7 ~55%TS

He had no trouble scoring efficiently in 08 when he was playing next to Melo and JR in Denver, averaging 26/3/7 on ~57%TS at age 32.

I know a few volume scorers from this era who would see their efficiency drop in the early 2000s :rolleyes: .


You do realize he led a team to 56 wins with two of his starters missing 30+ games and Mutombo only playing 26 because they traded for him later in the season? Guess what, they were 7-15 without him the next season when he was injured and missed 22 games.

And you realize Devin Stern screwed over the Bucks to get the Sixers into the finals...right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkwJ8tFsArs

Ray isn't alone. We all know that bullshit was fixed. Devin Stern wanted the MVP in the finals and didn't want to see the Bucks (who had owned the Lakers in the regular season) to match up against the Lakers. He didn't want to hurt his golden goose.

[fourkicks44]

And you realize Devin Stern screwed over the Bucks to get the Sixers into the finals...right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkwJ8tFsArs

Ray isn't alone. We all know that bullshit was fixed. Devin Stern wanted the MVP in the finals and didn't want to see the Bucks (who had owned the Lakers in the regular season) to match up against the Lakers. He didn't want to hurt his golden goose.

George Karl publicly insulted and embarrassed the refs.

Then expected to get calls :roll:

[ILLsmak]

Manu ahead of AI?

:yaohappy:

ahaha. I didn't even notice that at first. I mean putting Pau on there is a joke first of all, but so is Manu, and I love Manu, but you're saying that he's top 50, get the **** out of here.

He might be top 10-20 in terms of bball mind and he was a really amazing player that could change the flow of a game in the way most people can't, but he's still not top 50.

Everyone who says shit like "So and so can only do x" about people like Iverson... first of all, that's not true... second of all, you have to be able to measure the value of that one thing properly. So that means that, shockingly, someone who does one thing at an ATG level can be better than a well rounded all-star.

For instance... Manu v Ivo. Ivo would cook Manu every time. No team would take Manu over Ivo not even ****ing SA when they had a championship team.

Things you have to consider: how well someone can do something, how effective that thing is, who they can do it against, and how hard it is to stop them from doing it. That's why AI is top 50. Nobody can stop him from attacking.

-Smak

[paksat]

go watch game 2 sixers vs lakers 01 and you'll see why the refs hated this little diva

several times he acts like fisher rapes him and I don't think fisher even touched him. On top of that after every time out he goes over to the ref whining trying to make him look like a fool to the fans.

I used to be ok with AI, but he's like a way worse version of chris paul/lebron james when it comes to this.

[warriorfan]

go watch game 2 sixers vs lakers 01 and you'll see why the refs hated this little diva

several times he acts like fisher rapes him and I don't think fisher even touched him. On top of that after every time out he goes over to the ref whining trying to make him look like a fool to the fans.

I used to be ok with AI, but he's like a way worse version of chris paul/lebron james when it comes to this.

Low iq post

[paksat]

Low iq post

low iq post

[ImKobe]

And you realize Devin Stern screwed over the Bucks to get the Sixers into the finals...right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkwJ8tFsArs

Ray isn't alone. We all know that bullshit was fixed. Devin Stern wanted the MVP in the finals and didn't want to see the Bucks (who had owned the Lakers in the regular season) to match up against the Lakers. He didn't want to hurt his golden goose.

Ok Bucks got screwed, that doesn't take anything away from Iverson's MVP season or him being a great player. He just happened to be playing in the toughest defensive era for perimeter players and still carried a team to a #1 seed without a legitimate 2nd or 3rd option on offense. He's still a top 50 player all-time because he did prove he could play at an MVP level and you couldn't name 40, let alone 50 players with better individual accolades than him.

11x All-Star
7x All-NBA
2001 MVP
1997 ROY
4x Scoring Champ
3x Steal Champ

Is not top 50 all-time?

[SpaceJam2]

14be :eek:

[scuzzy]

Is 14be official 2020 ranking?

[LostCause]

If it’s the 50 GREATEST players, there’s no question Iverson should be on it. He was too good and accomplished too much to not be.

Yes, we’re in an age where there’s all sorts of data available that changes how the game is played and viewed, and some of these analytics don’t paint the best picture of Iversons game. However, when you’re talking about GREATNESS you’re talking about way more than just the current flavor of the month analytics.

There are not 50 players overall more accomplished than Iverson. There are not 20 players who had a bigger impact on the game and influenced generations like Iverson. There were not 50 players as culturally relevant as Iverson, nor as popular. Lastly, there weren’t 50 players more important to the game of basketball than Iverson

[superduper]

ahaha. I didn't even notice that at first. I mean putting Pau on there is a joke first of all, but so is Manu, and I love Manu, but you're saying that he's top 50, get the **** out of here.

He might be top 10-20 in terms of bball mind and he was a really amazing player that could change the flow of a game in the way most people can't, but he's still not top 50.

Everyone who says shit like "So and so can only do x" about people like Iverson... first of all, that's not true... second of all, you have to be able to measure the value of that one thing properly. So that means that, shockingly, someone who does one thing at an ATG level can be better than a well rounded all-star.

For instance... Manu v Ivo. Ivo would cook Manu every time. No team would take Manu over Ivo not even ****ing SA when they had a championship team.

Things you have to consider: how well someone can do something, how effective that thing is, who they can do it against, and how hard it is to stop them from doing it. That's why AI is top 50. Nobody can stop him from attacking.

-Smak

Sorry but my low Bran stan IQ says that FG% is the sole thing that dictates whether someone is good or bad :hammerhead:
Great post btw

[ILLsmak]

Sorry but my low Bran stan IQ says that FG% is the sole thing that dictates whether someone is good or bad :hammerhead:
Great post btw

Haha well there are good bad shots and bad bad shots.

Like that clip posted of Ai chasing the ball and diving for it, I feel like that was ais game even on offense. Just a force unlike the nba ever saw even if he shot 40% at times. I mean he'd start games 0-10 and end up getting 40. Obviously the percentage didn't matter that much. I dunno of many people who could put so much pressure on a d though. Dribbling, off ball, on the break.

Really wish he could have got a chance to win a ring. He's probably one of the only dudes I am like damn. Cuz guys like Barkley. Malone, Stockton still get mad respect. Iverson is seen as a career loser and cancer by way too many people.

If they had an analytic for how far people played off their man in an attempt to stop a player from scoring, Ai would be up there. Haha. People are way too focused on stuff like per and ts%.


-Smak

[GimmeThat]

Iverson is one of those example that because younger players don't study the history of the game and stunt their growth, he ends up suffering even after his personal life being affected

[34-24 Footwork]

[QUOTE=LostCause]If that