The John Wall situation. Any chance it impacts future negotiations?

[Kblaze8855]

This guy was supposed to go to the hall of fame. You may disagree but hes a 5 time all star, all NBA, all D team last healthy season 23/11, 49 wins, game 7 of the second round. Minus injury hed be a 7-8 time all star at least and still in his prime.

But?

2 years of injury.

Ruptured achilles.

Out this whole year as well.

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They signed the deal that starts now....more than 2 years ago...and best case is they get him back in declined form in the second year of that deal....and hes not back to his old self till the 3rd....when hes 32 and starting to decline anyway.

I wonder if the teams will try to work in a change to the extension format next CBA. On one hand...being able to sign it early locks in the guys on possible team friendly deals before they fully break out....on the other...you tie up the next 7-8 years with one guy who could fall off before the deal even begins.

Id be so afraid signing those years off extensions but im not sure what choice you have. Any hesitation and your star just walks right?


Can

[ralph_i_el]

Issues like this led to the amnesty clause being put in the last CBA. I bet another one will be in the next negotiation.

You should be able to take a player off your salary cap if they can't play. Pay them, but it shouldn't stop you from putting together a good team if you are willing to spend the money.

Basically at this point, the wizards have 1/3rd of their money going to someone who may not play again, and definitely won't play this year. Impossible to construct a good team in this situation.

[DMAVS41]

Just the cost of doing business honestly.

The contract certainly wasn't stupid at the time and it is almost impossible to prepare for situations like this.

All I would say and have said about stuff like this...it depends on the true goal of the franchise. If the main goal of the franchise was to challenge for titles...then you have to trade a player like Wall when his value is the highest...which was back when he signed the extension essentially. Because he's not a championship first option level player. So once you pay him like one...you are done on that front unless you get super lucky.

But, that doesn't seem to be the goal of the Wizards and honestly hard to blame them given how hard it is to actually compete for titles...and how hard it is to fill seats with a shit team.

They just had essentially the same question with Beal and they decided to keep him and almost for sure not even contend for playoff series wins anytime soon.

Again, stupid if the only goal is building a long-term title contender, but that clearly isn't the goal there.

Does it impact other teams? I'd say yes for sure. I think more teams probably pass on giving out a contract like that to Wall type player on a non-contending team. There is no universe in which what has happened doesn't impact the thought process of other franchises. However, how many instances of situations like this actually come up remains to be seen.

[keep-itreal]

John Wall? Hall of Fame? :roll: :roll:

The Hall of Fame is becoming a joke because any f*cking scrub can get in right now. It's so saturated with career losers who never achieved anything. :lol

[DMAVS41]

John Wall? Hall of Fame? :roll: :roll:

The Hall of Fame is becoming a joke because any f*cking scrub can get in right now. It's so saturated with career losers who never achieved anything. :lol

Wall has always been over-rated imo, but at the same time...he was really damn good as well. Both can be true.

[tontoz]

Wall isn't a scrub, but his HOF credentials are pretty weak. He really hasn't improved much either. He still makes the same obvious mistakes he was making 5 years ago:

- too many jumpers, especially early in the clock
- out of control drives
- careless turnovers
- lazy on defense most of the time, unless he has a chance for a chase down block or steal.

If it was my call i wouldnt have given him a supermax deal. He has too many issues.

Beal on the other hand has made great progression. He has improved tremendously from his rookie deal years.

[DMAVS41]

Wall isn't a scrub, but his HOF credentials are pretty weak. He really hasn't improved much either. He still makes the same obvious mistakes he was making 5 years ago:

- too many jumpers, especially early in the clock
- out of control drives
- careless turnovers
- lazy on defense most of the time, unless he has a chance for a chase down block or steal.

If it was my call i wouldnt have given him a supermax deal. He has too many issues.

Beal on the other hand has made great progression. He has improved tremendously from his rookie deal years.

The Beal deal is obviously much better because he maintains his high trade value even with the higher incoming salary as he's worth his number...which is way less than what Wall got anyway.

However, trading Beal last year would have netted the Wizards a huge trade package that they likely don't get now.

Definitely don't hate them keeping Beal, but there could be a huge opportunity cost to not moving him unless the Wizards really get some big breaks.

[PP34Deuce]

injuries and bad luck are part of the game.

[Kblaze8855]

John Wall? Hall of Fame? :roll: :roll:

The Hall of Fame is becoming a joke because any f*cking scrub can get in right now. It's so saturated with career losers who never achieved anything. :lol

Believe it or not....John Wall has already had more playoff success than some hall of famers ever had on teams they were leading.

We are just waaaaay more harsh on guys in front of us than we are to established legends. John Wall is a scrub but Dave Bing is already in when he only played 4 playoff series in his life(and lost them all) before he won one as a 7 mpg role player in his final season. And he played with another top 50 all time list guy for all but 1 year of his career.

The HOF is what it always was. People just don

[DoctorP]

overpaid, onelegged scrub.

[ralph_i_el]

Last time we had a season of healthy Wall, the Wiz were one quarter away from the ECF. Kelly Olynyk went insane in the 4th quarter and killed us.

They win that game, and Wall's reputation is way different.

The wiz also had a good run going in 2013-14, until Wall broke 11 bones in his hand against the Hawks in the second round. He was looking dominant in that series.

The Wiz swept Lowry and DeRozan's Raptors in the playoffs.

He's been hurt. He's ****ing Achilles came apart. Not an excuse to re-write history.

[Boogaboog]

Wall was a consensus top 5 PG in the league, who at like 75% was doing something like 26 and 10 in the playoffs, and was nearly in the ECF the year before with arguably the worst bench in the league. No way were the Wizards going to keep him if they lowballed him. He'd have just left for a better team, and Beal would never have gotten a co-star remotely as good. :oldlol: So effectively the Wizards would have imploded. The disrespect against Wall is ridiculous. It's an unfortunate situation, but it couldn't really have been avoided strategically.

[Boogaboog]

Wall isn't a scrub, but his HOF credentials are pretty weak. He really hasn't improved much either. He still makes the same obvious mistakes he was making 5 years ago:

- too many jumpers, especially early in the clock
- out of control drives
- careless turnovers
- lazy on defense most of the time, unless he has a chance for a chase down block or steal.

If it was my call i wouldnt have given him a supermax deal. He has too many issues.

Beal on the other hand has made great progression. He has improved tremendously from his rookie deal years.

What are your thoughts on Westbrook?

[tontoz]

There is no getting around the fact that Wall takes a ton of midrange shots and shoots them horribly. He takes a lot of these shots early in the clock and that really hurts his effectiveness. He also averages almost 4 turnovers per game.


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[DMAVS41]

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Believe it or not....John Wall has already had more playoff success than some hall of famers ever had on teams they were leading.

We are just waaaaay more harsh on guys in front of us than we are to established legends. John Wall is a scrub but Dave Bing is already in when he only played 4 playoff series in his life(and lost them all) before he won one as a 7 mpg role player in his final season. And he played with another top 50 all time list guy for all but 1 year of his career.

The HOF is what it always was. People just don

[tontoz]

What are your thoughts on Westbrook?


He has good points and bad points. On one hand he plays with great intensity every night which overcomes his flaws somewhat but in the playoffs his poor decisions and weak shooting get exposed every year.