James frauden wouldn't even be a top 10 in the 90's

[Bronbron23]

Dude is such a manufactured fraud. Kemp, Ewing, drexler, Barkley, Shaq, pip, Malone, Robinson, Hakeem and mj we're all better. This will sound stupid to this generations stat geeks but I'd even take Stockton over him as well as penny and hill. Throw in some defensive cats like rodman and Payton and harden may not even be a top 15.

How anyone can be a fan of this dude is beyond me :facepalm

[Proctor]

His only fans are the contrarian types. :oldlol:

He's a bum and a loser.

[Nashty]

Yeah sure, he would not be better than poor mans Hakim Warrick, Jahlil Okafor, Gerald Green, DeJuan Blair, Boban, Iguodala, JJJ, Adebayo, Thabeet, Waiters, Tristan Thompson and Dejounte Murray.

[Bronbron23]

Yeah sure, he would not be better than poor mans Hakim Warrick, Jahlil Okafor, Gerald Green, DeJuan Blair, Boban, Iguodala, JJJ, Adebayo, Thabeet, Waiters, Tristan Thompson and Dejounte Murray.
Ahhh I'm gonna give u the benefit of the dought and assume your either joking or your a mentally challenged person thats been given internet access.

[Smook A.]

Ahhh I'm gonna give u the benefit of the dought and assume your either joking or your a mentally challenged person thats been given internet access.
You can't really be calling someone else a mentally challenged person when you can't even use the correct your/you're.

Also, what the hell is "benefit of the dought" :roll: You mean DOUBT? Sit down, fool :oldlol:

[RRR3]

OP, stop. You’re embarrassing yourself.

[stalkerforlife]

Of course he wouldn't.

You think he's getting all those fouls in the 90s?

Not happening.

[Bronbron23]

You can't really be calling someone else a mentally challenged person when you can't even use the correct your/you're.

Also, what the hell is "benefit of the dought" :roll: You mean DOUBT? Sit down, fool :oldlol:
It's just my phone it's messed up and I don't spell check what I write on a forum because I could care less. I may be a little drunk also but way to deflect and ignore the fact that you have no idea what your talking about when it comes to ball. Anyone who compares the players you did to the top players in the 90's is either a troll or dosnt know ball at all.

[Bawkish]

Harden's skillset is definitely a factory made for this era

His cheap tactics of getting contact won't work efficiently in 90s or he'll be getting a dose of Artest elbows on regular basis

[TommyGriffin]

OP's micropenis today, would still be a micropenis in the 90s.

[Spurs m8]

Lol he wouldn't even be a top 200 player

[Bronbron23]

OP's micropenis today, would still be a micropenis in the 90s.
Well your mom and your girl found it ok so there is that :roll:

[TommyGriffin]

Well your mom and your girl found it ok so there is that :roll:

Nah, that's the problem. They couldn't find it.

[Bronbron23]

Nah, that's the problem. They couldn't find it.
Good comeback buddy. You just admitted your whore girl and mom tried to f*ck me. Anyway enough of this kid talk. Put your money where mouth is homeboy. Show me your bet history so far this season and I'll show u mine.

I'll wait for your excuses :facepalm

[knicksman]

Lebron is the same as harden. Lebron just lucky hes the golden boy.

[aj1987]

Dude is such a manufactured fraud. Kemp, Ewing, drexler, Barkley, Shaq, pip, Malone, Robinson, Hakeem and mj we're all better. This will sound stupid to this generations stat geeks but I'd even take Stockton over him as well as penny and hill. Throw in some defensive cats like rodman and Payton and harden may not even be a top 15.

How anyone can be a fan of this dude is beyond me :facepalm
Nope.

As for taking Stockton and Rodman over Harden, you'd have to be an idiot of the highest order to do that.

I'm not even close to being a Harden fan, but he's taking what the refs are giving him. If anything, blame Silver and the refs.

Also, since Harden became a starter, he's averaging 29/6/8/2/1. Even if you get rid of ALL his FT's, he's still averaging 20/6/8/2/1 over 7 straight seasons. With ZERO FT's. Dude would EASILY be a top 5-7 player in the '90's.

[Bawkish]

Nope.

As for taking Stockton and Rodman over Harden, you'd have to be an idiot of the highest order to do that.

I'm not even close to being a Harden fan, but he's taking what the refs are giving him. If anything, blame Silver and the refs.

Also, since Harden became a starter, he's averaging 29/6/8/2/1. Even if you get rid of ALL his FT's, he's still averaging 20/6/8/2/1 over 7 straight seasons. With ZERO FT's. Dude would EASILY be a top 5-7 player in the '90's.

you have to factor in a lot of turnovers because he's not gonna get away with those blatant travels & step back moves

also his own brand of Harden ball will get him nowhere from the way coaches view of the offenses that time. His 20 3pt attempts per game would be ridiculously unacceptable

[aj1987]

you have to factor in a lot of turnovers because he's not gonna get away with those blatant travels & step back moves

also his own brand of Harden ball will get him nowhere from the way coaches view of the offenses that time. His 20 3pt attempts per game would be ridiculously unacceptable
As I said, he's taking what the refs and defenses are giving him. His game, when he was with the Thunder, was completely different from what it is today. Harden is a flat out beast (even though he's a massive flopping idiot). Dude would be a top 5-7 player in the '90's without question.

[Bawkish]

As I said, he's taking what the refs and defenses are giving him. His game, when he was with the Thunder, was completely different from what it is today. Harden is a flat out beast (even though he's a massive flopping idiot). Dude would be a top 5-7 player in the '90's without question.

Refs won't give him that step back 3 and most of the defenses in the 90s were more physical, also handchecking

Thunder Harden wouldn't even put him inside top 15 in the 90s

[aj1987]

Refs won't give him that step back 3 and most of the defenses in the 90s were more physical, also handchecking

:biggums: :biggums:

Yeah, handcheck him all you want, Harden would still be a top 5-7 player in the '90's.



Thunder Harden wouldn't even put him inside top 15 in the 90s
Imagine a bench player from the 2010's being a top 15-20 player in the '90's. Weak AF era. :cheers:

[Bawkish]

:biggums: :biggums:

Yeah, handcheck him all you want, Harden would still be a top 5-7 player in the '90's.

based on what? Rocket Harden would be a benchwarmer because coaches wouldn't want him jacking 3s. Thunder Harden would be a poor man's Mitch Richmond

[aj1987]

based on what? Rocket Harden would be a benchwarmer because coaches wouldn't want him jacking 3s. Thunder Harden would be a poor man's Mitch Richmond
No wonder the league was full of low IQ coaches and players. Imagine thinking a contested fadeaway jumpshot over 2 defenders is better than an open 3 point shot. Mitch Richmond? You do know that Mitch was jacking up like 6 3's a game, right? Thunder Harden was taking like 5 3's a game and putting up 17/4/4 in only 30 minutes of playing time. All this while playing BEHIND KD and WB.

Top 5-7 in the '90's. Imagine being shook by James freaking Harden. :roll:

[Bawkish]

No wonder the league was full of low IQ coaches and players. Imagine thinking a contested fadeaway jumpshot over 2 defenders is better than an open 3 point shot. Mitch Richmond? You do know that Mitch was jacking up like 6 3's a game, right? Thunder Harden was taking like 5 3's a game and putting up 17/4/4 in only 30 minutes of playing time. All this while playing BEHIND KD and WB.

Top 5-7 in the '90's. Imagine being shook by James freaking Harden. :roll:

17/4/4 in 30 mins doesn't make you top 10 player in any era

imagine a leading scorer in today's league would be relegated in a bench in 90s :lol

[brutalBBQ]

the '90's. Weak AF era.
Just like the East for the last 2 decades.

[Kblaze8855]

I guess it depends on the season. Lets say its 1996.....

In no order....an ISH at the time would consider most of these people....

Jordan
Hakeem
Hill
Pippen
David Robinson
Shaq
Ewing
Karl Malone
Payton
Barkley
Penny

You might not take all of them over Harden but there would be plenty who did. It would force some consideration of defense. Then you have to acknowledge you cant do a direct one to one stat comparison for a number of reasons.

And it goes both ways.

Harden with a shorter line....but facing much more physical defense....less spacing(unless he took his whole team and coach with 2019 tactics which is an interesting thought). I dont know.

In a league that allows his defense to be played the way it was I think I take GP over Harden. There were times GP was utterly removing other star guards from games. Also times he got scored on but...thats the nature of guarding stars.

Today? GPs post game would be wasted and his man to man D would be somewhat countered by the rules so Harden may be more useful.

Its hard to say.

It wouldnt be an inarguable thing that hes top 10 in some years...but I think the general opinion would be that he is.

But its just as fair to ask....whats Reggie Miller given 12-13 threes a game and nobody to tell him hes taking bad shots?

Everyone here for a while knows im not really pro Miller....but you cant tell me he doesnt put in more work today than he did then. You cant hold prime Reggie to 19-21ppg given all these looks....

He still wouldnt have Hardens handles or passing obviously but I dont know if hes THAT much less effective considering what ive seen out of Harden inthe playoffs when he attempts to carry his style over.

To be clear...

Harden is better than Reggie.

But does Reggie close the gap given modern advantages that suit his game? Sure. I just dont know how much.

Lot to consider.

[Lebron23]

Don't hate the player. Hate the game. Harden is just abusing the current rules.

[GreatHILL]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DuWURbrUUAAayf0.jpg

[juju151111]

Refs won't give him that step back 3 and most of the defenses in the 90s were more physical, also handchecking

Thunder Harden wouldn't even put him inside top 15 in the 90s
The stepback 3 is not a travel. He only travels on the stepback when someone guess right and he tries to be sneaky and steps back again.

[aj1987]

Just like the East for the last 2 decades.
And?


17/4/4 in 30 mins doesn't make you top 10 player in any era

imagine a leading scorer in today's league would be relegated in a bench in 90s :lol
Imagine a dude who 3peat'd twice in the '90's being no better than players like Rudy Gay or being a poor man's Demar today. :oldlol:

[Bronbron23]

And?


Imagine a dude who 3peat'd twice in the '90's being no better than players like Rudy Gay or being a poor man's Demar today. :oldlol:
Imagine being so clueless at basketball to actually believe this :facepalm

[aj1987]

Imagine being so clueless at basketball to actually believe this :facepalm
And yet, you're the dumbass who thinks Harden wouldn't be a top 10 player in the '90's. All because.. feelings!!1

[Bronbron23]

And yet, you're the dumbass who thinks Harden wouldn't be a top 10 player in the '90's. All because.. feelings!!1
Nah has nothing to do with feelings. Just common sense. One guy Monopolizing the ball dosnt work unless your insanely talented on both ends like LeBron. Even than its not the best path to success. As good as LeBron is he should have more than 3 chips.

You could take alot of players in the history of the game and throw them in Dantoni's system and they'll have crazy stats. They'll win mvp's but They won't win a chip though. Harden is good. I'm not saying he sucks or anything. He's just wouldn't be a top 10 player in the 90's is all.

[Showtime80']

LOL, this "modern era" argument goes down the crapper when you realize that one of the lowest IQ inneficient chuckers in history by the name of Russell Dumbrook won an MVP, averaged a triple double for three seasons and led his team to 50+ wins in the supposed "strong conference" all in the last 5 seasons.

Steve Nash would've also not even sniffed the top 10 from 1980 to 1998.

See a pattern here. The NBA rules committee is directly responsible for the rise of players like Harden, Curry and Dumbrook. Here's Steve Kerr talking about it a few years ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHoD9UCBgcs

Haven't even talked how the centers and PF's of that time period would've demolished the perimeter oriented twinners of the present.

Giannis in the 80's or 90's?!?! LOL!!!! No spacing, physical defenses, defensive and offensive low post stalwarts at every turn. Another bum in that era as well.

[juju151111]

LOL, this "modern era" argument goes down the crapper when you realize that one of the lowest IQ inneficient chuckers in history by the name of Russell Dumbrook won an MVP, averaged a triple double for three seasons and led his team to 50+ wins in the supposed "strong conference" all in the last 5 seasons.

Steve Nash would've also not even sniffed the top 10 from 1980 to 1998.

See a pattern here. The NBA rules committee is directly responsible for the rise of players like Harden, Curry and Dumbrook. Here's Steve Kerr talking about it a few years ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHoD9UCBgcs

Haven't even talked how the centers and PF's of that time period would've demolished the perimeter oriented twinners of the present.

Giannis in the 80's or 90's?!?! LOL!!!! No spacing, physical defenses, defensive and offensive low post stalwarts at every turn. Another bum in that era as well.
They all would be stars in any era. You sound like the idiots who the 80s and 90s wouldn't be stars today

[DoctorP]

He would be on the bench in the 90s cause coaches would have thought he was nuts. Antoine Walker was hated..

[LoneyROY7]

Nah has nothing to do with feelings. Just common sense. One guy Monopolizing the ball dosnt work unless your insanely talented on both ends like LeBron. Even than its not the best path to success. As good as LeBron is he should have more than 3 chips.

You could take alot of players in the history of the game and throw them in Dantoni's system and they'll have crazy stats. They'll win mvp's but They won't win a chip though. Harden is good. I'm not saying he sucks or anything. He's just wouldn't be a top 10 player in the 90's is all.

Hey dipshit, if it's b/c of D'Antoni's system, how did Harden place 2nd in MVP voting and win the Players MVP while being coached by the genius known as Kevin Mchale?

Oops, hate to destroy your stupid narrative so easily.

[DoctorP]

Hey dipshit, if it's b/c of D'Antoni's system, how did Harden place 2nd in MVP voting and win the Players MVP while being coached by the genius known as Kevin Mchale?

Oops, hate to destroy your stupid narrative so easily.
:lol

[Bronbron23]

Hey dipshit, if it's b/c of D'Antoni's system, how did Harden place 2nd in MVP voting and win the Players MVP while being coached by the genius known as Kevin Mchale?

Oops, hate to destroy your stupid narrative so easily.
He didn't have one 30 point season until Dantoni and almost winning a MVP isn't winning. His assists went up and his points went Amway up. He almost scores ten more points a game under Dantoni. Went from 25 to 35. That's a huge jump. What the hell are you talking about :facepalm

[sdot_thadon]

Too good of a shooter to not be. Not even up for discussion, he'd be an alien in the 90s.

[LoneyROY7]

He didn't have one 30 point season until Dantoni and almost winning a MVP isn't winning. His assists went up and his points went Amway up. He almost scores ten more points a game under Dantoni. Went from 25 to 35. That's a huge jump. What the hell are you talking about :facepalm

He averaged 29/8/6 the year before D'Antoni came you stupid b*tch. :oldlol: :oldlol:

[superduper]

Neither would Bran.

OP has a point tbh, however cringey it may be.

[aj1987]

Nah has nothing to do with feelings. Just common sense. One guy Monopolizing the ball dosnt work unless your insanely talented on both ends like LeBron. Even than its not the best path to success. As good as LeBron is he should have more than 3 chips.

You could take alot of players in the history of the game and throw them in Dantoni's system and they'll have crazy stats. They'll win mvp's but They won't win a chip though. Harden is good. I'm not saying he sucks or anything. He's just wouldn't be a top 10 player in the 90's is all.
Come on, dude. You're letting your hate cloud your judgement.

Harden was a beast WAY before D'antoni.

[ImKobe]

Too good of a shooter to not be. Not even up for discussion, he'd be an alien in the 90s.

He wouldn't be. He'd be a Reggie Miller at best, and Reggie wasn't top 10 in the league for most his career.

[aj1987]

He wouldn't be. He'd be a Reggie Miller at best, and Reggie wasn't top 10 in the league for most his career.
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Exposing your retardation every single time you type something and hit "Submit Reply".

[ImKobe]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Exposing your retardation every single time you type something and hit "Submit Reply".

?

Reggie Miller was a 3-point chucker and a mid-range shooter, Harden was never known for his mid-range game and wouldn't develop into anything more than a dominant shooter in that era. Prove me wrong.

[Bronbron23]

He averaged 29/8/6 the year before D'Antoni came you stupid b*tch. :oldlol: :oldlol:
Yup that's pretty damn good. It's not 36 though. 7 points a game is still a big difference.

[Smook A.]

He averaged 29/8/6 the year before D'Antoni came you stupid b*tch. :oldlol: :oldlol:
How do people forget he was averaging that before D'Antoni came into the picture? Also, no one takes into account that Harden was JUST entering his prime when D'Antoni became coach, so of course there's already going to be some improvement even if there was no coaching change

[Smook A.]

?

Reggie Miller was a 3-point chucker and a mid-range shooter, Harden was never known for his mid-range game and wouldn't develop into anything more than a dominant shooter in that era. Prove me wrong.
Harden can drive in the paint much better than Reggie ever could. He's much stronger, quicker, and has way better handles. Not only that, but he's easily a better playmaker as well. You're an idiot for thinking Harden would just be Reggie Miller at best in 90s. For ****s sake, Harden career average without free throws since he became a starter still beats Reggie's career ppg WITH free throws.

[Bronbron23]

Come on, dude. You're letting your hate cloud your judgement.

Harden was a beast WAY before D'antoni.
Yeah he was I never said he wasn't. He had amazing stats actually but with Dantoni's it's even crazier it's like stats on steroids. Me saying he wouldn't be a top 10 in the 90's wasn't me saying he sucks. It was more of a testament to how good the 90's were and how overrated stats can be sometimes

[aj1987]

?

Reggie Miller was a 3-point chucker and a mid-range shooter, Harden was never known for his mid-range game and wouldn't develop into anything more than a dominant shooter in that era. Prove me wrong.
Harden is a significantly better at finishing at rim and miles ahead as a passer. They're not even remotely similar.


Yeah he was I never said he wasn't. He had amazing stats actually but with Dantoni's it's even crazier it's like stats on steroids. Me saying he wouldn't be a top 10 in the 90's wasn't me saying he sucks. It was more of a testament to how good the 90's were and how overrated stats can be sometimes
He was one CP3 injury and one bad shooting night away from beating the KD-Curry-Klay-Green Warriors.

Also, you're acting like Harden was averaging 20 PPG with McHale. Dude averaged 27/5/7/2/1 over 3 seasons with him. Also, his assists went up significantly because D'antoni made him full time PG.

https://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=17647116

How is he not a top 10 player in the '90's? A 30 PPG scorer, who can shoot, is a terrific finisher at the rim, and an elite passer.

[RealSkipBayless]

In the 90's?

You'd probably be looking at a Doug Christie type of player.

[Bronbron23]

Harden is a significantly better at finishing at rim and miles ahead as a passer. They're not even remotely similar.


He was one CP3 injury and one bad shooting night away from beating the KD-Curry-Klay-Green Warriors.

Also, you're acting like Harden was averaging 20 PPG with McHale. Dude averaged 27/5/7/2/1 over 3 seasons with him. Also, his assists went up significantly because D'antoni made him full time PG.

https://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=17647116

How is he not a top 10 player in the '90's? A 30 PPG scorer, who can shoot, is a terrific finisher at the rim, and an elite passer.
You act like he'd score 30 a game in the 90's though. He wouldn't for a variety of reasons. He'd still be good though. Probably average around 25 or so. His defence would still suck though. Me saying he wouldn't be a top 10 was more for debating purposes but it's not a given. Let's look at the players.

He wasn't better than drob, Hakeem, Shaq, Malone, Barkley, Jordan or pip. That's 7. Ewing, drexler, penny and hill are debatable.

[Rocket]

Stupid hater thread. Beard would be top 5 in ANY decade. No he would not get the foul calls but his game has much more to it than getting to the line. If he was not in a Daryl Morey / D'Antoni system he would not be jacking so many threes. He is one of the best at driving to the hoop ever. In the 90's he would easily average 25/8/6 and most likely would be a the best backcourt player not named Jordan.

[Bronbron23]

Stupid hater thread. Beard would be top 5 in ANY decade. No he would not get the foul calls but his game has much more to it than getting to the line. If he was not in a Daryl Morey / D'Antoni system he would not be jacking so many threes. He is one of the best at driving to the hoop ever. In the 90's he would easily average 25/8/6 and most likely would be a the best backcourt player not named Jordan.
Top 5? How? So your saying harden is better than Robinson, Hakeem, mj, Shaq, Barkley and Malone?

[aj1987]

You act like he'd score 30 a game in the 90's though. He wouldn't for a variety of reasons. He'd still be good though. Probably average around 25 or so. His defence would still suck though. Me saying he wouldn't be a top 10 was more for debating purposes but it's not a given. Let's look at the players.

He wasn't better than drob, Hakeem, Shaq, Malone, Barkley, Jordan or pip. That's 7. Ewing, drexler, penny and hill are debatable.
Dude is averaging 40 a night. He would easily average ~30 on a good team in the '90's. If you think otherwise, you have never actually watched Harden play.

I agree with D-Rob, Hakeem, Shaq, Barkley, and Jordan. Pippen's defense is not enough to offset the massive gap in offense. Malone is arguable as well. Lets not forget that as good as D-Rob was, he routinely choked in the PO's as well.

Also, even if you reduce Harden's stats by 25% and cut his FT's made by 5 a game, he'd still be averaging 25/4/6. :roll:

[ImKobe]

Stupid hater thread. Beard would be top 5 in ANY decade. No he would not get the foul calls but his game has much more to it than getting to the line. If he was not in a Daryl Morey / D'Antoni system he would not be jacking so many threes. He is one of the best at driving to the hoop ever. In the 90's he would easily average 25/8/6 and most likely would be a the best backcourt player not named Jordan.

You allow the defenders to hand-check him and this magical driving ability goes away. He would probably be an all-star with his all-around game but the reason he gets to the hoop so consistently is because defenders are trying to avoid fouling him because it's so easy for him to get these calls, that wouldn't be the case pre-2005. I wouldn't be saying this if he didn't disappear in almost every big Playoff game in his career, where refs don't give him those calls and he goes like 2/13 from three with 10 TOs.

[red1]

harden is a bitch. no doubt he'd get locked up by pippen in the 90s.

[Kblaze8855]

He wouldn't be. He'd be a Reggie Miller at best, and Reggie wasn't top 10 in the league for most his career.

Reggie at best?


That

[ImKobe]

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Reggie at best?


That

[LoneyROY7]

You allow the defenders to hand-check him and this magical driving ability goes away. He would probably be an all-star with his all-around game but the reason he gets to the hoop so consistently is because defenders are trying to avoid fouling him because it's so easy for him to get these calls, that wouldn't be the case pre-2005. I wouldn't be saying this if he didn't disappear in almost every big Playoff game in his career, where refs don't give him those calls and he goes like 2/13 from three with 10 TOs.

:facepalm :facepalm

The magical thing about Harden's driving ability? It's simply talent.

His combination of first-step, handles, and strength is something the guard position has never seen before. If you think hand-checking is stopping that, you really don't get it.

And comparing him to Reggie Miller is quite possibly one of the dumbest takes possible.

[ImKobe]

:facepalm :facepalm

The magical thing about Harden's driving ability? It's simply talent.

His combination of first-step, handles, and strength is something the guard position has never seen before. If you think hand-checking is stopping that, you really don't get it.

And comparing him to Reggie Miller is quite possibly one of the dumbest takes possible.

Allow defenders to guide him with their hand and allow bigs to stay in the paint, take away all that spacing and tell me that he'd be just as efficient...

Let's be ****ing real here ok. Guys like Kobe, Vince Carter, Iverson, Bron, Pierce were not as efficient prior to the rule changes, not many guards/forwards really were before the rules changed.. Harden would be a different player in the 90s.

[LoneyROY7]

Let's take a look at Rodney Hood here:

https://media.giphy.com/media/WqLZkwaTNVAzHoNIvr/giphy.gif

I'm sure handchecking woud've helped him not get shifted and blitzed past for lay-up. :oldlol: :oldlol:

How about Lonzo?

https://media.giphy.com/media/iH7p7sFTwQNNUeBE41/giphy.gif

I'm sure handchecking would've saved him from getting shifted, blown past, and put on his back.

And how about just a clip of Harden's straight speed for kicks:

https://media.giphy.com/media/USbPtO8jyTRhtkqghf/giphy.gif

Harden's physical talents are overwhelming, he's not getting stopped by any era or rule changes.

[LostCause]

He’d be “different “ but his talent is still elite enough that he’d be great. His coaches wouldn’t allow him to jack so many 3s up though and they’d convince him to take a couple more midrange shots. It’ll hurt his efficiency but I can still see him scoring a ton