2009 for fun

[SpaceJam2]

LeBron vs D12
39-8-8 on 49%

Kobe vs D12
32-6-7 on 43%

Not even close...

LeBron's #2 and #3 option vs D12
Williams: 18-4-4 on 37%
West: 14-3-4 on 45%

Kobe's #2 and #3 option vs D12
Gasol: 19-9-2 on 60%
Odom: 13-8-1 on 54%

Imagine Delonte West as your 3rd option :lol

[superduper]

No matter how insecure you are 90% of people who have touched an NBA court will always have Kobe over Bran because the fake stats won't fool them.

[3ball]

LeBron vs D12
39-8-8 on 49%

Kobe vs D12
32-6-7 on 43%

Not even close...

LeBron's #2 and #3 option vs D12
Williams: 18-4-4 on 37%
West: 14-3-4 on 45%

Kobe's #2 and #3 option vs D12
Gasol: 19-9-2 on 60%
Odom: 13-8-1 on 54%

Imagine Delonte West as your 3rd option :lol

Stan Van Gundy on 2009 ECF



we let Lebron go 1-on-1 and didn't double-team so we could stay on his teammates and prevent the ball from moving

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=466601




ESPN on the 2009 Finals:



"The Magic were forced to double Kobe constantly and take their chances that Ariza, Odom and Fisher wouldn't kill them from deep. What happened? Those three guys made 21 of 45 3-pointers (44 percent)."

http://www.espn.com/espn/page2/story/_/page/simmons%2F090616/sportCat/nba



Defenses have always met penetrators at the rim with multiple bodies, and only need to double potentially hot jumpshooters, who can hit 2-3 jumpers in a row and juice the whole team to win the quarter going away..

So Kobe's quick-hitter, catch-fire style must be doubled, which freed up teammates... Otoh, SVG was the first to figure out that it's better to let non-shooter Lebron score via his long dribble forays than double him and see the ball move.. The Warriors later figured out not to double Lebron as well (stats here (https://i.makeagif.com/media/3-22-2019/6e5aBZ.gif))..
.

[SouBeachTalents]

Stan Van Gundy on 2009 ECF



we let Lebron go 1-on-1 and didn't double-team so we could stay on his teammates and prevent the ball from moving

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=466601




ESPN on the 2009 Finals:



"The Magic were forced to double Kobe constantly and take their chances that Ariza, Odom and Fisher wouldn't kill them from deep. What happened? Those three guys made 21 of 45 3-pointers (44 percent)."

http://www.espn.com/espn/page2/story/_/page/simmons%2F090616/sportCat/nba



Defenses have always met penetrators at the rim with multiple bodies, and only need to double potentially hot jumpshooters, who can hit 2-3 jumpers in a row and juice the whole team to win the quarter going away..

So Kobe's quick-hitter, catch-fire style must be doubled, which freed up teammates... Otoh, SVG was the first to figure out that it's better to let non-shooter Lebron score via his long dribble forays than double him and see the ball move.. The Warriors later figured out not to double Lebron as well (stats here (https://i.makeagif.com/media/3-22-2019/6e5aBZ.gif))..
.
A couple more quotes from Simmons & SVG

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BABwZwvJ5Kc&feature=youtu.be&t=271

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S1Gp2iwos0&t (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S1Gp2iwos0&t=)

[3ball]

A couple more quotes from Simmons & SVG

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BABwZwvJ5Kc&feature=youtu.be&t=271

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S1Gp2iwos0&t (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S1Gp2iwos0&t=)
Lebron not getting doubled is historical record, whereas their opinion on the goat is their opinion and meaningless..

the evidence they provided to the contrary (historical record of Lebron not getting doubled) is more valuable than their opinion

[ClipperRevival]

LeBron vs D12
39-8-8 on 49%

Kobe vs D12
32-6-7 on 43%

Not even close...

LeBron's #2 and #3 option vs D12
Williams: 18-4-4 on 37%
West: 14-3-4 on 45%

Kobe's #2 and #3 option vs D12
Gasol: 19-9-2 on 60%
Odom: 13-8-1 on 54%

Imagine Delonte West as your 3rd option :lol

Excellent research OP. :applause:

So what you're saying is that Bran is an empty stat padder while the Kobester sacrificed his stats and elevated his teammates' level of play to win chips.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Lebron had better raw numbers.

Kobe's impact to his teams success was right up there, if not greater.

https://basketball-analytics.gitlab.io/rapm-data/season/2008-09/playoffs/

Same thing with 2010

https://basketball-analytics.gitlab.io/rapm-data/season/2009-10/playoffs/

Not saying Kobe was better. Been telling Lebron fans to use x/y/z numbers carefully though. They're not everything. And definitely not the best measure of impact.

[RRR3]

Lebron had better raw numbers.

Kobe's impact to his teams success was right up there, if not greater.

https://basketball-analytics.gitlab.io/rapm-data/season/2008-09/playoffs/

Same thing with 2010

https://basketball-analytics.gitlab.io/rapm-data/season/2009-10/playoffs/

Not saying Kobe was better. Been telling Lebron fans to use x/y/z numbers carefully though. They're not everything. And definitely not the best measure of impact.
LeBron was better than Kobe in the 06, 07 and 08 playoffs by this metric.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

LeBron was better than Kobe in the 06, 07 and 08 playoffs by this metric.

Not surprised about 2006 and 2007. Kobe played one round.

2008 is interesting though. But again my point wasn't about who was better. Only that raw numbers are often misleading.

[3ball]

LeBron was better than Kobe in the 06, 07 and 08 playoffs by this metric.
We know 07' Lebron is nowhere near 08' Kobe because Lebron averaged 22 on 36% versus the Spurs, while Kobe was at 33 on 50% vs the Spurs in 08'.

I might have the numbers slightly off, but it was a big gap between the 2 performances... night and day..

ultimately, kobe's superior performances against the spurs FOR HIS ENTIRE CAREER in tougher defensive environments prove that he's superior to Lebron.

[SpaceJam2]

A couple more quotes from Simmons & SVG

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BABwZwvJ5Kc&feature=youtu.be&t=271

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S1Gp2iwos0&t (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S1Gp2iwos0&t=)

Ouch

[Nashty]

Anyone who knows anything about basketball knows that the only reason Lakers won in 2009 was because Gasol was destroying 4th guy in MVP voting, DPOY and 1st Team All NBA center Dwight Howard while Kobe was statpadding, shooting 43% from the field against role players like Courtney Lee, Pietrus, Redick.

[SpaceJam2]

Lebron not getting doubled is historical record, whereas their opinion on the goat is their opinion and meaningless..

the evidence they provided to the contrary (historical record of Lebron not getting doubled) is more valuable than their opinion

OR

He has the highest bball IQ ever and is the league's greatest playmaker and passer of all time and will make you pay if you double often.

Sorry MJ couldn't do the same. He was just an OKAY passer with OKAY bball IQ.

[PP34Deuce]

Some of you guys pick sides like a female who hitches on to a man to "Save" her.

Difference is, none of these players know or care about you. Can't you be a fan of both players and call out their inconsistency.

I'd imagine a prime Kobe would be better than a 24-25 year old Lebron who was figuring things out.

Kinda like how a younger Kawhi and KD were better than Lebron James at 33-35.

People get old.... People peak around the right time and they can re-write their story.

Jordan and the bulls peaked in 92. He left. Came back, they lost playoff (No one ever talks about that) had an undefeated season with great new depth and then were on fumes in 98.

[RRR3]

duh hyuk hyuk hyuk
Quiet, spammer.