Not sure I've sen a more talented basketball orchestrator than Doncic, ever.

[elementally morale]

Just pure talent as in knowing the game, seeing things, making decisions and taking shots if needed. He is not the best in the NBA yet... but at this pace he can be next year.

Who had more talent than this guy? Magic? Bird? Kidd? Isiah? Nash? Young LeBron may have had similar talent but he unfortunately went into a totally diferent direction. So.. Who? I don't know.

[LoneyROY7]

Spooky Luka.

That boy scary.

[warriorfan]

LD

[highwhey]

if we're talking about playmaking and high offense IQ, Nash was better,

the man could survey the land quicker than the defense and feed you the ball before the defense has an opportunity to react. go listen to the knucklehead podcast, quentin richardson tells how it was playing with Nash "if you wanted a bucket, you had to keep up with #13 and he'd find you". he also said Nash was invited to the BBQ.

[Draz]

Definitely Nash but Luka is young and can do better

[tontoz]

Lebron is the closest comparison. I remember watching Lebron's first game. They started him at the point and you could tell even straight out of high school that he had great court awareness.

Luka isn't as athletic as Lebron but is probably a better athlete than he gets credit for. The advantages he has over a young Lebron are his shot and professional experience.

Fun guy to watch.

[FKAri]

Golden haired, blue eyed, Aryan God.

[AlternativeAcc.]

He's a mixture of LeBron, Bird, and Peter North.

[imdaman99]

He whines to the refs nonstop even on clean strips. No thank you.

I did enjoy Knicks beating him twice though. Half their wins are against them :oldlol:

[kentatm]

if we're talking about playmaking and high offense IQ, Nash was better,


Luka age 20 >>>>> Nash age 20

[cotdt]

Is he good?

Can the Lakers get him?

[highwhey]

Luka age 20 >>>>> Nash age 20
:roll:

i mean, i've seen some ridiculous statements on ISH, but this...

:roll:

[AlternativeAcc.]

:roll:

i mean, i've seen some ridiculous statements on ISH, but this...

:roll:
What's remotely funny about that?

[highwhey]

What's remotely funny about that?
had acouple drinks. i read that as luka at 20 vs nash

oops.

my bad.

[warriorfan]

Steve Nash was low key gifted 2 MVP

[stalkerforlife]

:roll:

i mean, i've seen some ridiculous statements on ISH, but this...

:roll:

:biggums:

[DMAVS41]

had acouple drinks. i read that as luka at 20 vs nash

oops.

my bad.

If Luka were to finish the year playing at close to this level...it would be better than any version of Nash imo.

Luka's defense / rebounding is already way better than what Nash provided on that end...

And if Luka ends the season at something like 26/9/9 60% TS while getting this team to an elite offense...

I mean...I love Nash, but that shit would just be better.

[FKAri]

[QUOTE=warriorfan]Steve Nash was low key gifted 2 MVP

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

If Luka were to finish the year playing at close to this level...it would be better than any version of Nash imo.

Luka's defense / rebounding is already way better than what Nash provided on that end...

And if Luka ends the season at something like 26/9/9 60% TS while getting this team to an elite offense...

I mean...I love Nash, but that shit would just be better.

Lukas a bad defender right now and Nash was better than perceived. He was unfortunate to be playing small with Amare who was a much bigger defensive issue at the 5. Suns defense was fine and even great when they had Kurt Thomas playing instead of Amare

KP, Kleber, DFS, Powell are all great defenders too.

Luka def has a clear rebounding edge but the defensive one isnt anywhere near as big as ur making it out.

Nash is much better offball too and is a more diverse talent offensively.

Lukas already one of the best in pickandroll but hes mostly an onball player like Harden. Nash kills both offball and is on their level on the ball too

[DMAVS41]

Lukas a bad defender right now and Nash was better than perceived. He was unfortunate to be playing small with Amare who was a much bigger defensive issue at the 5. Suns defense was fine and even great when they had Kurt Thomas playing instead of Amare

KP, Kleber, DFS, Powell are all great defenders too.

Luka def has a clear rebounding edge but the defensive one isnt anywhere near as big as ur making it out.

Nash is much better offball too and is a more diverse talent offensively.

Lukas already one of the best in pickandroll but hes mostly an onball player like Harden. Nash kills both offball and is on their level on the ball too

Disagree about Nash on defense. He was historically bad...it was a real problem.

With Luka, he's by no means great, but just his size alone and his rebounding already makes him better on that end.

Agree about the offense....give me Nash on that end.

However, if Luka were able to get this group to finish the season with a top 2 or 3 offense...producing like he currently is...just don't see the argument for Nash.

I'm assuming he can't keep this up, but you aren't realizing just how absurdly good his level currently is. He keeps that up for a season and it would be historic.

[Celtics 1825]

had acouple drinks. i read that as luka at 20 vs nash

oops.

my bad.
You hanging out with Smoke or something rn? :lol

[bizil]

Luka FOR SURE is cut from the cloth of guys like Magic, Bird, Bron, and Oscar. The way he sees the game (IQ and passing ability) while ALSO being a walking triple double and dominant scorer all in one is like those guys. THAT RIGHT THERE says it all! If there was ever a 6'7-6'8 guard version of Bird, Luka is the closest thing to it. Not the pure shooter Larry was. But in so many other areas he is similar to Bird.

[Norcaliblunt]

He

[Phoenix]

[QUOTE=Norcaliblunt]He

[ImKobe]

I recall half of ISH shitting on him just over a year ago because he was white.. "he's too slow". Now the same guys who hated on him are trying to "claim" him :lol .

He's not the most talented orchestrator ever but he's obviously the best young talent in the league.

[brain drain]

With regards to Nash, one should remember that he wasn't that great while he was at Dallas.

When he left Dallas, he was 29 years old. He'd had 3 seasons with 7.x apg and 1 season withh 8.8 apg.
He'd been scoring between 14.5 and 18 ppg those last few years.

He'd had major problems containing offensive juggernaut Mike Bibby in the Playoff duels with SAC, he'd struggled pretty badly in this matchup (to be fair, his bad back probably contributed to this as well).

He'd been a 2 times all star at this point. He was good, but not great.

Then he walked into Phoenix with super athletic guys like Amare and Shawn Marion, QRich, Joe Johnson, and with D'Antony's system and it all clicked.

----------------

What I'm trying to say: Nash didn't become NASH until he was put into the perfect situation for him.

In contrast, Luka walked into an at best mediocre Team in Dallas, and one year later, while his best team mate is still struggling, Dallas has one of the best offenses in the league. No super fitting team needed to make him stand out.

I'd really like to know how this comparison would look if you gave Luka that kind of offensive all star fire power that the Suns had in 2004.

[elementally morale]

I'm not agenda driven, I think. I just like great basketball players. Sure, I root for the Lakers... but my all-time favorite players are non-Laker players, like Hakeem, Bird and Nash.

That being said, I'm quite sure the only comparisons I can make with 20-year-olds for Luka are Magic and LeBron. I wouldn't yet say Doncic is better than both but it is a valid comparison. I think he can become better than both though which is scary. I also think LeBron went into the wrong direction after his first couple of years. He would've been much better as an orchestrator (like he plays this season). At least he did have Luka-like talent. So had Magic and Bird (but Bird came into the NBA 3 years older). The is always Jordan... but his playing style was much different so I can't compare him to Luka. Nor can I compare centers.

There are some hard workers with average to good talent who became great players. Like Stockton or Kobe or Kidd... even Nash. But as much talent as Doncic? I don't know man. Maybe Magic, Bird and young LeBron. I really can't think of anyone else.

[highwhey]

With regards to Nash, one should remember that he wasn't that great while he was at Dallas.

When he left Dallas, he was 29 years old. He'd had 3 seasons with 7.x apg and 1 season withh 8.8 apg.
He'd been scoring between 14.5 and 18 ppg those last few years.

He'd had major problems containing offensive juggernaut Mike Bibby in the Playoff duels with SAC, he'd struggled pretty badly in this matchup (to be fair, his bad back probably contributed to this as well).

He'd been a 2 times all star at this point. He was good, but not great.

Then he walked into Phoenix with super athletic guys like Amare and Shawn Marion, QRich, Joe Johnson, and with D'Antony's system and it all clicked.

----------------

What I'm trying to say: Nash didn't become NASH until he was put into the perfect situation for him.

In contrast, Luka walked into an at best mediocre Team in Dallas, and one year later, while his best team mate is still struggling, Dallas has one of the best offenses in the league. No super fitting team needed to make him stand out.

I'd really like to know how this comparison would look if you gave Luka that kind of offensive all star fire power that the Suns had in 2004.
Yeah but nash benefited from the 7 seconds or less system that dantoni instilled. High pace offense.

Sound familiar?

Well thats bc the entire nba is fast paced now. Nash would be even better now with this style of play that suits him perfectly. Not saying Luka can't be better than him, but a prime Nash was a much better shooter and playmaker for his team. He also sustained a title contending team after iso Joe and Qrich left the suns. Even after Amare was out an entire year, Nash led the team to finish 1st in their division with 54 wins. :eek:

[brain drain]

Yeah but nash benefited from the 7 seconds or less system that dantoni instilled. High pace offense.

Sound familiar?

Well thats bc the entire nba is fast paced now. Nash would be even better now with this style of play that suits him perfectly. Not saying Luka can't be better than him, but a prime Nash was a much better shooter and playmaker for his team. He also sustained a title contending team after iso Joe and Qrich left the suns. Even after Amare was out an entire year, Nash led the team to finish 1st in their division with 54 wins. :eek:

Don Nelson's Mavs were also a run & gun team, their pace between 1999/2000 and 2004 was between 92.5 and 94.5.

The first three D'Antoni years all had a pace between 95 and 96.

So, it was a bit faster, but not that much.

[DMAVS41]

With regards to Nash, one should remember that he wasn't that great while he was at Dallas.

When he left Dallas, he was 29 years old. He'd had 3 seasons with 7.x apg and 1 season withh 8.8 apg.
He'd been scoring between 14.5 and 18 ppg those last few years.

He'd had major problems containing offensive juggernaut Mike Bibby in the Playoff duels with SAC, he'd struggled pretty badly in this matchup (to be fair, his bad back probably contributed to this as well).

He'd been a 2 times all star at this point. He was good, but not great.

Then he walked into Phoenix with super athletic guys like Amare and Shawn Marion, QRich, Joe Johnson, and with D'Antony's system and it all clicked.

----------------

What I'm trying to say: Nash didn't become NASH until he was put into the perfect situation for him.

In contrast, Luka walked into an at best mediocre Team in Dallas, and one year later, while his best team mate is still struggling, Dallas has one of the best offenses in the league. No super fitting team needed to make him stand out.

I'd really like to know how this comparison would look if you gave Luka that kind of offensive all star fire power that the Suns had in 2004.

I do agree with this to an extent, but in fairness to Nash, he was running some of the best offenses of all-time in Dallas relative to competition...and that was in one of the toughest defesive eras in NBA history.

Now, you are right to point out that he had Dirk and way more offensive help, but really it was just injuries and the physical game during his time in Dallas that hurt him.

Then the rules changed, he got healthy, and got into the perfect situation.

I think it is fair to say that Nash at his best was better than Luka offensively currently. However, that assumes that Luka can't keep this up for an entire season. Like I said above, if the kid averages something like 30/10/10 61% TS like he is now or whatever it actually is...while also generating an elite offense...it is tough to over-rate just how amazing that would be.

Now, I don't think this level will continue...and the team has played way better than expected without Luka on the floor so far that is also elevating the offense.

But, and I loved Nash even though he did have some flaws that prevented playoff winning imo...Luka has a much higher ceiling as a player imo...and he might be reaching something close to that ceiling already...which is just insane.

[juju151111]

Luka in no way have the offensive firepower of those Suns team.

[StrongLurk]

Lebron and Magic should not be questioned as the best basketball orchestrators lol.

[elementally morale]

Lebron and Magic should not be questioned as the best basketball orchestrators lol.

Questioning? Perhaps... why not? Newton was quite good... but then came Maxwell, Boltzmann, Dirac, Heisenberg and Einstein. So... why not?

Luka at 20 is up just there. Among the very best ever. Magic and young LeBron? A touch of Bird? Yes. Exactly.

[Norcaliblunt]

The firepower of those Suns teams is how many hall of famers??

[brooks_thompson]

I hope he cuts the prissy whining out ASAP. He acts like a 14 year old, not a 20 year old, out there a lot of times. And looks like a sissy doing it. Love everything else he brings. Don't love this era where the entire load of an offense falls on the team's best player, Harden/LBJ style, but that's something I'll have to adapt to because it's not gonna change.

[NBAGOAT]

yea people dont like to acknowledge it but he has a lot of harden in his game with the foul drawing and contested 3's. magic bird and bron are logical mentions however

[tontoz]

I agree that he does whine too much. I would like to see him cut down on those step back 3s. Other than that, love his game.

[tpols]

The mavs somehow have the 1st ranked offense in the entire league... yet only 17th ranked in assists.

That's a losing formula.

This aint football and one player cant be QB and expect to beat other great teams with multiple QBs that play together.

[FireDavidKahn]

[QUOTE=warriorfan]Steve Nash was low key gifted 2 MVP

[tontoz]

Gifted?

Say what you want about his second one but his first one was 100% deserved. Might be one of the few times an MVP was awarded based on impact vs. the best stats on whatever top 4 team.

I thought he played better for the 2nd MVP. If i remember right that was the year they lost Amare for the season. They didn't have Joe Johnson either (traded him) yet made the WCF with Boris Diaw at center. Diaw was just a scrub guard with the Hawks.