LeBron has an unprecedented opportunity this season

[AussieSteve]

To be the GOAT at two different positions.

I think that Magic's 1986-87 would be the consensus greatest season ever by a PG.

His stats were an ATG 24 / 6 / 12 on 60%ts, with a 27.0.PER. But more importantly he led the lakers to 65 wins and the title, with both RS and Finals MVP honors.

For LeBron this season, there's every chance his stats will be better. His defense is much better. There's a good chance the Lakers win more than 65 games. If LeBron can lead them to the championship with an FMVP, what would be the case against it being the greatest season ever by a PG?

[elementally morale]

LeBron is not the floor general Magic was. But I think he could've been. He abandoned this style of play a long time ago. He started out playing like this and he could've become the greatest PG ever, I think. That ship has sailed as he decided to go a different route. It was a successful but for me less entertaining, often times boring one.

That said, it is refreshing to see LeBron play the way he does this season. It's not only the position it is also the effect he has on the team. A lot diferent from last year. So different having Davis is not enough an explanation. I think LeBron is at a stage in his career when he is not about those all around stats any more. At least not when he is playing (let's forget the social media self-marketing for a minute).

If anything, this season will show us what could've been. Magic 2.0 is what could've been. Instead we saw great all around stats and the beauty of the game sacrificed for some (actually, a lot of) individual greatness. On the other hand, LeBron is in fairly good physical shape so there is no reason he can't play the PG position at a very high level for years. Let's see how he will respond in the playoffs when there come some serious tests... let's see if he will revert to LeBron ball which he has so far this season abandoned for the better.

If he can do that he is more than fine as far as I'm concerned.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

AD has been as valuable as Lebron this season.

So I don't know about the GOAT pg stuff. Maybe in raw stats but those are just numbers.

Will say this though. Now that Lebron's shown to be a top 5 player, at the very least, and LAL is title or bust, this year is an important one in his career. Not winning a title with AD? While playing at the level he is? Humiliating.

[AussieSteve]

AD has been as valuable as Lebron this season.

So I don't know about the GOAT pg stuff. Maybe in raw stats but those are just stats.

Will say this though. Now that Lebron's shown to be a top 5 player, at the very least, and LAL is title or bust, this year is an important one in his career. Not winning a title with AD? While playing at the level he is? Humiliating.

Nah. Kawhi and PG are a top 5 and top 10 players in the league, and the clips also have one of the deepest teams I have ever seen. Probably have both the #1 and #2 candidate for 6th Man award.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Nah. Kawhi and PG are a top 5 and top 10 players in the league, and the clips also have one of the deepest teams I have ever seen. Probably have both the #1 and #2 candidate for 6th Man award.

That series will be close regardless.

Especially with the "GOAT PG" and the best PF alive.

[AussieSteve]

That series will be close regardless.

Especially with the "GOAT PG" and the best PF alive.

Sure. But to say the Lakers losing would be humiliating is ridiculous... Unless they get swept, which I agree would be humiliating.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Sure. But to say the Lakers losing would be humiliating is ridiculous... Unless they get swept, which I agree would be humiliating.

They both play @ Staples Center. Both teams are in LA. Both are in the same division and conference. Both are 1 and 2 favorites to win it all.

And Lebron losing to Kawhi? The guy who people think has usurped LeBron? Get real. It would definitely be humiliating.

[Indian guy]

AD has been as valuable as Lebron this season.

This is a dubious opinion. LeBron's impact stats dwarf AD's. He's the team's MVP by a very big margin. No Laker fan would argue otherwise.

[3ball]

In 2010, wade was #2 in PER, VORP, WS, and BPM - so he was the #2 player in the league (the best help), yet Lebron lost or was an underdog for 3 of 4 years (after teaming up with the best help in the league)

So Lebron will never impress me because he teams up with the best help in the league, yet this teams are perennial underdogs and losers - he was only 3/7 with super-teams from 11-17'

A title should be automatic this year with AD - if he doesn't win, it will add to his history of losing after teaming up with the best help in the league.. his legacy is vastly overrated because he does less with more

[Indian guy]

And Lebron losing to Kawhi? The guy who people think has usurped LeBron? Get real. It would definitely be humiliating.

Why would losing to a team and player that is universally considered better be humiliating? You are not making sense.

[3ball]

Why would losing to a team and player that is universally considered better be humiliating? You are not making sense.
Lebron should have the best team because he has AD

period

and he does - he's 16-2

so why are you scared that the so-called goat can't win with the best team and help in the league?

the fact that many people fear he'll lose, shows he's nowhere near goat

give Jordan AD, and it's a wrap... rings every single year, as the prohibitive favorite.. the standard for Lebron is so much lower

[warriorfan]

To go 3/10 while stacking the deck multiple times

[AussieSteve]

In 2010, wade was #2 in PER, VORP, WS, and BPM - so he was the #2 player in the league (the best help), yet Lebron lost or was an underdog for 3 of 4 years (after teaming up with the best help in the league)

So Lebron will never impress me because he teams up with the best help in the league, yet this teams are perennial underdogs and losers - he was only 3/7 with super-teams from 11-17'

A title should be automatic this year with AD - if he doesn't win, it will add to his history of losing after teaming up with the best help in the league.. his legacy is vastly overrated because he does less with more

Ok. Thanks for the completely off topic post.

This thread is about how lebron has an opportunity this season to produce perhaps the greatest season ever by a point guard. Which would be impressive, given he is already established as the greatest small forward ever.

[LAmbruh]

Mr. 1 through 5 :applause:

[DMAVS41]

Lebron should have the best team because he has AD

period

and he does - he's 16-2

so why are you scared that the so-called goat can't win with the best team and help in the league?

the fact that many people fear he'll lose, shows he's nowhere near goat

give Jordan AD, and it's a wrap... rings every single year, as the prohibitive favorite.. the standard for Lebron is so much lower

Who here in this thread is arguing that Lebron is the GOAT? As has been mentioned, most people on this board think Leonard is better...especially in a playoff series. You think so as well. So, again, you aren't being consistent.

What does Jordan have to do with anything in this thread?

Automatic title in year 17 with a player that is great, but hasn't ever made a conference finals...with a team that is really good, but hardly the best or complete?

Nah, losing this year would be nothing like losing in 11 when Lebron fell apart...to argue it would be similar is just ignorant.

[knicksman]

yet kobe still more respected. Those stats, MVPs, rings really means nothing if you dont earn the respect. Thats the purpose of winning - to gain respect. And taking shortcuts defeats that purpose.

[AussieSteve]

It's amazing to me the over rating of AD this season.

Last year it was all about him being bird fed and overrated. Now every lebron hater calls him an MVP candidate and screams out DPOY every time an opponent misses a shot over him.

Also, no one is speaking about PG in the same way regarding the help his is for Kawhi. Last season PG was 3rd in MVP voting, All NBA 1st and All D first team. Hes one of the best scorers and defenders in the league. Kawhi hit the jackpot with PG just as much as LeBron did with AD. If not more because PG can score at will, without needing plays drawn up for him to get the ball in his spots. I'd go as far as saying that it's not even clear who the best player on the clippers is.

Why The double standard?

[3ball]

lebron has an opportunity this season to produce perhaps the greatest season ever by a point guard.


Magic dominated a big man era and had the best stats, while Lebron is one of many perimeter players dominating the perimeter era, and doesn't have the best stats.. a 20-year old euro is outplaying him, along with numerous other players

So the main reason that this season won't compare to Magic's 1987 is because of era... Magic was literally changing the game at the time, whereas Lebron is living off the fat of the land (today's perimeter-friendly era)





Lebron the greatest small forward ever.


You're speaking in generalities that gloss over the real truth

Bird's SF skills were superior because he didn't need to play PG to get basically equal career assists (he didn't need a live/existing dribble) - Lebron does - so the reality is that Lebron isn't a better SF than Bird because his actual SF skills are inferior

Ultimately, Lebron isn't a better passer as an actual SF (without a live dribble), and he isn't a better rebounder, shooter, leader or clutch player, while many people already feel that Bird's peak is >>>

So even though you feel that Lebron is a better SF, he was never really a pure SF like Bird, and didn't use SF skills.. Bird is infact the greatest SF because he used SF skills, while Lebron mostly played PG despite starting at SF

So Lebron isn't the best SF... He's always been a PG to me, and an inferior one to Magic

[DMAVS41]

It's amazing to me the over rating of AD this season.

Last year it was all about him being bird fed and overrated. Now every lebron hater calls him an MVP candidate and screams out DPOY every time an opponent misses a shot over him.

Also, no one is speaking about PG in the same way regarding the help his is for Kawhi. Last season PG was 3rd in MVP voting, All NBA 1st and All D first team. Hes one of the best scorers and defenders in the league. Kawhi hit the jackpot with PG just as much as LeBron did with AD. If not more because PG can score at will, without needing plays drawn up for him to get the ball in his spots. I'd go as far as saying that it's not even clear who the best player on the clippers is.

Why The double standard?

George missed some time.

I can't speak to the over-rating...Davis is one of the 5 or so best players in the league. Who is arguing Davis to be something much better than that?

I agree Lebron has been the best player so far on the Lakers, but that doesn't change that Davis is elite.

[AussieSteve]

George missed some time.

I can't speak to the over-rating...Davis is one of the 5 or so best players in the league. Who is arguing Davis to be something much better than that?

I agree Lebron has been the best player so far on the Lakers, but that doesn't change that Davis is elite.

No doubt AD is an automatic All NBA selection.

I'm more making reference to a lot of the sentiments expressed on here over he last year or two. Specifically about him being bird fed on offence. I'm not seeing those threads any more.

[3ball]

No doubt AD is an automatic All NBA selection.

I'm more making reference to a lot of the sentiments expressed on here over he last year or two.

Specifically about him being bird fed on offence. I'm not seeing those threads any more.


^^^ that's because his bird-fed style is a perfect match for Lebron

even more reason Lebron should win

a title should be automatic this year if Lebron is as good as everyone claims

but he isn't - he's been overrated his entire career due to his stat-padding style that inflates his value - the historical record speaks for itself

[ArbitraryWater]

They both play @ Staples Center. Both teams are in LA. Both are in the same division and conference. Both are 1 and 2 favorites to win it all.

And Lebron losing to Kawhi? The guy who people think has usurped LeBron? Get real. It would definitely be humiliating.

you're back to not making any sense.

if both teams can win, it won't be humiliating for either.

kawhi has the far better squad and is facing a 17-th year man, this can only be humiliating for one party.

[knicksman]

LOL GOAT but doesnt have high expectations. But then again, bron stans are known to have low standards. :lol

[sdot_thadon]

To be the GOAT at two different positions.

I think that Magic's 1986-87 would be the consensus greatest season ever by a PG.

His stats were an ATG 24 / 6 / 12 on 60%ts, with a 27.0.PER. But more importantly he led the lakers to 65 wins and the title, with both RS and Finals MVP honors.

For LeBron this season, there's every chance his stats will be better. His defense is much better. There's a good chance the Lakers win more than 65 games. If LeBron can lead them to the championship with an FMVP, what would be the case against it being the greatest season ever by a PG?
That's an interesting take op, I'd agree it would be impressive as long as we're speaking in a single season sense.

Reading through this thread what impresses me most is i don't think I've ever seen such importance given to a player's 17th season before, definitely uncharted territory for a great......

[Jasper]

Lebron is a SF (.)

not a PG /