Why did LeBron only have HCA twice in 9 Finals appearances?

[Dray n Klay]

Discuss

[Duncan21formvp]

Playing in the East. Wasn't that good.:oldlol:

Better question is why did he lose the series with HCA and why was he down 3-2 in the other with it, and had Ray Allen save his life?:oldlol:

[warriorfan]

Why did he lose to Dwight Howard and Rafer Alston with home court advantage?

[knicksman]

Why did he lose to Dwight Howard and Rafer Alston with home court advantage?


yeah. why bother if youre going to lose anyways

[warriorfan]

yeah. why bother if youre going to lose anyways

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[3ball]

Discuss
because he isn't good enough to produce teams that are perennial favorites

his style turns teammates into spot-up shooters, so he can't produce good teams that are very good, regardless of cast...

for example, from 2011-2017, he either lost or was the underdog for 6 of 7 years despite having superteams

heck, he couldn't even win 60 games with kyrie/love, while Curry won 70+ with klay/dray, and kawhi nearly won 70 with no cast

and the few times he's the favorite or it's even money, he loses (2009-2011 and 2014)
.

[FKAri]

yes I gay
.
:biggums:

edit - caught you before the edit nigguh

[3ball]

:biggums:

edit - caught you before the edit nigguh
keep deflecting

lebron isn't good enough to produce teams that are perennial favorites

his style turns teammates into spot-up shooters, so he can't produce good teams that are very good, regardless of cast...

for example, from 2011-2017, he either lost or was the underdog for 6 of 7 years despite having superteams

heck, he couldn't even win 60 games with kyrie/love, while Curry won 70+ with klay/dray, and kawhi nearly won 70 with no cast

and the few times he's the favorite or it's even money, he loses (2009-2011 and 2014)
.

[FKAri]

keep deflecting

lebron isn't good enough to produce teams that are perennial favorites

his style turns teammates into spot-up shooters, so he can't produce good teams that are very good, regardless of cast...

for example, from 2011-2017, he either lost or was the underdog for 6 of 7 years despite having superteams

heck, he couldn't even win 60 games with kyrie/love, while Curry won 70+ with klay/dray, and kawhi nearly won 70 with no cast

and the few times he's the favorite or it's even money, he loses (2009-2011 and 2014)
.
Why was that even in your post doe? Were you copy-pastin on the fly with grindr open or what?

[3ball]

Why was that even in your post doe? Were you copy-pastin on the fly with grindr open or what?
auto type

what do you care. sorry not gay bro

[SouBeachTalents]

:biggums:

edit - caught you before the edit nigguh

auto type

what do you care. sorry not gay bro
Yo, that was real

:roll:

[And1AllDay]

:biggums:

edit - caught you before the edit nigguh

:wtf: :wtf:

3baLLLLLLLLLL is the ghey?

[3ball]

:wtf: :wtf:

3baLLLLLLLLLL is the ghey?
no but my phone is

not that there's anything wrong with that

[And1AllDay]

no but my phone is

not that there's anything wrong with that

someone told me you are bald is this tru

[ImKobe]

Why did he lose to Dwight Howard and Rafer Alston with home court advantage?

:lol

Are we going to ignore that he lost with HCA 3 years in a row from 09-11? Then lose with HCA again in 2014?

[jstern]

Yeah, I still can't believe he lost to Dwight Howard, while being the MVP of the league and having the best record in the league. That was supposed to be his year. And then 2011 happened. That just hit me, he had home court there too, and a super team.

[3ball]

someone told me you are bald is this tru
my cranium was bald in college, so they probably saw college hoops pics that I've posted from my FIU days (Florida International U)

[RoundMoundOfReb]

3ball literally shaved his head so he could be like mike :roll:

[3ball]

3ball literally shaved his head so he could be like mike :roll:
who didn't.. :kobe:

[SouBeachTalents]

:lol

Are we going to ignore that he lost with HCA 3 years in a row from 09-11? Then lose with HCA again in 2014?
Spurs had HCA in 2014

[ImKobe]

Spurs had HCA in 2014

Forgot that happened under the old format. How many times has he choked 3 in a row though?

Up 2 - 1 on the Celtics in '10, up 2 - 1 on the Mavs in '11, tied 1 - 1 with the Spurs with 3 straight losses at home in '14, up 2 - 1 on the Warriors in '15...

It's not HCA that's the issue here. He's been up or has had at least 3 games left at home with 3 wins needed to win the series.

[SpaceJam2]

Forgot that happened under the old format. How many times has he choked 3 in a row though?

Up 2 - 1 on the Celtics in '10, up 2 - 1 on the Mavs in '11, tied 1 - 1 with the Spurs with 3 straight losses at home in '14, up 2 - 1 on the Warriors in '15...

It's not HCA that's the issue here. He's been up or has had at least 3 games left at home with 3 wins needed to win the series.


2011 aside which series was he supposed to win? :lol

Which series should he have even been up to begin with?

Dont forget all his sweeps and backdoor sweeps too.

4-1 back door swept 2012 Thunder and 2011 MVP Rose Bulls

4-0 swept 4-all star Hawks
4-0 swept Raptors numerous times

The list goes on

[SouBeachTalents]

Forgot that happened under the old format. How many times has he choked 3 in a row though?

Up 2 - 1 on the Celtics in '10, up 2 - 1 on the Mavs in '11, tied 1 - 1 with the Spurs with 3 straight losses at home in '14, up 2 - 1 on the Warriors in '15...

It's not HCA that's the issue here. He's been up or has had at least 3 games left at home with 3 wins needed to win the series.
2015 is always a ridiculous criticism to me. He had a bad Game 4, but his team was so laughably overmatched it's remarkable he took a team minus Kyrie/Love up 2-1 against a team as talented as the Warriors.

It's honestly why I don't even give Kobe too much shit for losing a 3-1 lead in '06, He did his part, dropped 50 in Game 6 and it wasn't enough. The only thing I'd criticize him for is his effort in the 2nd half of Game 7

[3ball]

which series was he supposed to win? :lol


he was expected to win from 09-11' and the odds were even in 2014 - it was the same team they'd beaten the prior year, so there's no excuse for losing by record amount, especially to a much older core

he didn't face a talent deficit in any of those series except a small one in 2010 when Garnett/Allen/Pierce were 34/35/32..

and why can't lebron be expected to overcome a talent deficit? Dirk did in 2011 and the Spurs did too in 14', and by record amount





4-0 swept 4-all star Hawks
4-0 swept Raptors numerous times


his wins over the raptors and hawks are worth the same as Kobe's wins over Melo's Nuggets... so nothing

[sportjames23]

2011 aside which series was he supposed to win? :lol

Which series should he have even been up to begin with?

Dont forget all his sweeps and backdoor sweeps too.

4-1 back door swept 2012 Thunder and 2011 MVP Rose Bulls

4-0 swept 4-all star Hawks
4-0 swept Raptors numerous times

The list goes on


You really bragging about those matches? :oldlol:

[warriorfan]

2015 is always a ridiculous criticism to me. He had a bad Game 4, but his team was so laughably overmatched it's remarkable he took a team minus Kyrie/Love up 2-1 against a team as talented as the Warriors.

It's honestly why I don't even give Kobe too much shit for losing a 3-1 lead in '06, He did his part, dropped 50 in Game 6 and it wasn't enough. The only thing I'd criticize him for is his effort in the 2nd half of Game 7

The Cavs actually had a great strategy for that series. Slow the pace as much as possible while mucking it up. You have to remember the style of play in the 2015 series. The Cavs lost their second and third best players and the refs were there making it a close series. There was hand checking, bumping, jersey holding, it was anything goes. It did turn it into a somewhat entertaining series instead of a complete sweep but it is what it is. The officiating didn

[ImKobe]

[QUOTE=warriorfan]The Cavs actually had a great strategy for that series. Slow the pace as much as possible while mucking it up. You have to remember the style of play in the 2015 series. The Cavs lost their second and third best players and the refs were there making it a close series. There was hand checking, bumping, jersey holding, it was anything goes. It did turn it into a somewhat entertaining series instead of a complete sweep but it is what it is. The officiating didn

[warriorfan]

Didn't he go like 4/21 in the 2nd half of Game 2 and they still won? :lol

I

[SouBeachTalents]

The Cavs actually had a great strategy for that series. Slow the pace as much as possible while mucking it up. You have to remember the style of play in the 2015 series. The Cavs lost their second and third best players and the refs were there making it a close series. There was hand checking, bumping, jersey holding, it was anything goes. It did turn it into a somewhat entertaining series instead of a complete sweep but it is what it is. The officiating didn’t let Golden State play their game, it was over the top even for being a Finals series. Meanwhile LeBron shot Allen Iverson numbers as he put on one of the ugliest performances in Finals history.
I give credit LeBron due to the fact that he did something he was always criticized for not doing previously. People always said he was out protecting his shooting percentages, not emptying the clip, wasn't aggressive enough etc. But he did exactly the opposite in that Finals, shot with absolutely no conscience :lol His jumper, for whatever reason, just happened to be especially broke that season. If LeBron had his efficiency from his Miami years or the rest of his Cleveland stint, he very well could've stolen that series. So yes, his very poor efficiency is definitely a valid criticism

Didn't he go like 4/21 in the 2nd half of Game 2 and they still won? :lol
Like how someone went 6/24 in Game 7 and still won :oldlol:

[bullettooth]

yeah. why bother if youre going to lose anyways

Oh shit. :lol

[SpaceJam2]

Didn't he go like 4/21 in the 2nd half of Game 2 and they still won? :lol

Uh 6-24

Game 7

Failure

:lol

[bullettooth]

who didn't.. :kobe:

LeBron. Dude's hanging on to those last few hairs... his head looking like a sad scalp with a few scattered pubes.

[3ball]

I give credit LeBron due to the fact that he did something he was always criticized for not doing previously. People always said he was out protecting his shooting percentages, not emptying the clip, wasn't aggressive enough etc. But he did exactly the opposite in that Finals, shot with absolutely no conscience :lol His jumper, for whatever reason, just happened to be especially broke that season. If LeBron had his efficiency from his Miami years or the rest of his Cleveland stint, he very well could've stolen that series. So yes, his very poor efficiency is definitely a valid criticism

Like how someone went 6/24 in Game 7 and still won :oldlol:
lebron only has 2 series wins while averaging over 35 ppg - both were meaningless early round series

he simply can't beat good teams with scoring - when he scores a lot, it's one long dribble foray after another, which defenses prefer and get good at defending on the championship level

furthermore, lebron's weak jumpshooting prevents good efficiency at high volume (more mid-range jumpers needed at high volume), and prevents the need to double-team/get the ball out his hands (he rarely gets "hot")

enjoy that fact sandwich

[SouBeachTalents]

lebron only has 2 series wins while averaging over 35 ppg - both were meaningless early round series

he simply can't beat good teams with scoring - when he scores a lot, it's one long dribble foray after another, which defenses prefer and get good at defending on the championship level

furthermore, lebron's weak jumpshooting prevents good efficiency at high volume (more mid-range jumpers needed at high volume), and prevents the need to double-team/get the ball out his hands (he rarely gets "hot")

enjoy that fact sandwich
But literally nobody else in history has more series wins averaging 35 than LeBron does besides Jordan. It's just weird you hold a player you claim to think so lowly of to a standard that no other player in history besides your idol has ever achieved.

Iirc, of the 3 point era, which you love to talk about, only Shaq & Hakeem have managed to accomplish that as many times as LeBron, two players who imho peaked higher than Jordan did, so not bad company to be in :applause:

[warriorfan]

I give credit LeBron due to the fact that he did something he was always criticized for not doing previously. People always said he was out protecting his shooting percentages, not emptying the clip, wasn't aggressive enough etc. But he did exactly the opposite in that Finals, shot with absolutely no conscience :lol His jumper, for whatever reason, just happened to be especially broke that season. If LeBron had his efficiency from his Miami years or the rest of his Cleveland stint, he very well could've stolen that series. So yes, his very poor efficiency is definitely a valid criticism

Like how someone went 6/24 in Game 7 and still won :oldlol:

He emptied the clip and missed every shot. I

[3ball]

.
Peak vs Peak

Jordan 91-93' vs Shaq 00'-02'


REGULAR SEASON

MJ...... 31.4 ppg.. 58.2% ts.. 122 ORtg.. 0.288 WS/48.. 3 All-Defense 1st Team, 2 MVP
Shaq... 28.6 ppg.. 58.0% ts.. 115 ORtg.. 0.264 WS/48.. 2 All-Defense 2nd Team.. 1 MVP


PLAYOFFS

MJ...... 33.7 ppg.. 57.2% ts.. 120 ORtg.. 0.267 WS/48
Shaq... 29.9 ppg.. 56.2% ts.. 113 ORtg.. 0.238 WS/48


FINALS

MJ...... 36.3 ppg.. 52.6% fg.. 84.3% ft.. played #5, #3, #9 def.. beat Magic-Drexler-Barkley
Shaq... 35.9 ppg.. 59.5% fg.. 50.6% ft.. played #13, #5, #1 def.. beat Miller-Iverson-Kidd


(steals and blocks cancel out, along with rebounds and assists)



.........Percentage of team points scored while player was on floor


.........................RS.....RS 4th.... PO....PO 4th....Finals.. Finals 4th


JORDAN 1997... 36.0 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 40.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 37.7 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 46.3 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 40.9 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 50.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1996-97&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&PORound=4) <---- these are links to nba.com data
JORDAN 1998... 36.3 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 42.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 39.7 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 48.8 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 43.6 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 49.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/893/stats/usage/?Season=1997-98&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&PORound=4)


SHAQ 2000....... 35.0 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=1999-00&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 38.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=1999-00&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 34.0 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=1999-00&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 39.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=1999-00&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 38.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=1999-00&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 43.9 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=1999-00&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4&Period=4)
SHAQ 2001....... 33.9 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2000-01&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 38.0 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2000-01&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 33.9 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2000-01&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 34.0 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2000-01&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 35.4 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2000-01&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 26.2 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2000-01&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4&Period=4)
SHAQ 2002....... 33.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2001-02&SeasonType=Regular%20Season)..... 35.3 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2001-02&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Period=4)..... 33.5 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2001-02&SeasonType=Playoffs)..... 25.7 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2001-02&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4)...... 38.1 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2001-02&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)...... 28.2 (http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/406/stats/usage/?Season=2001-02&SeasonType=Playoffs&PORound=4)



MJ had the higher peak and burden hands down ... :confusedshrug:




But literally nobody else in history has more series wins averaging 35 than LeBron does besides Jordan. It's just weird you hold a player you claim to think so lowly of to a standard that no other player in history besides your idol has ever achieved.

Iirc, of the 3 point era, which you love to talk about, only Shaq & Hakeem have managed to accomplish that as many times as LeBron, two players who imho peaked higher than Jordan did, so not bad company to be in :applause:
mj won with 35+ in 12 different series compared to 2 for Shaq and LeBron.. that shows how much better mj was.. and at least Shaq and MJ's came in big series, while lebron's were in meaningless early round series - he can't win with scoring against a good team

and Hakeem peaked higher than mj? preposterous.. lol

and see the stats for mj/shaq above... there's no argument for Shaq - nothing tops Jordan's stats from 88-93' playoffs, and nothing tops his stats and winning in 91-93' playoffs and Finals (better than shaq's 00-02')

[Manny98]

:biggums:

edit - caught you before the edit nigguh
:roll:

[Manny98]

3ball literally shaved his head so he could be like mike :roll:
:roll: :roll: :roll: