Who would you take in the current NBA : Shaq or Kareem ?

[Duderonomy]

Nobody would be prepared to hang and bang with Shaq but he wouldn't be effective against a center with 3 point range. Kareem would be formative because of his mid-range sky hook which is unguardable.

Who would you draft assuming both are 20 years old

[kells333]

Nobody would be prepared to hang and bang with Shaq but he wouldn't be effective against a center with 3 point range. Kareem would be formative because of his mid-range sky hook which is unguardable.

Who would you draft assuming both are 20 years old

There are alot of players id take over them. People have known for years now that dumping the ball in the post every possession isnt a efficient way to play. Makes it worse that neither is switchable on defense.

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

Both would own Wilt and Russell.

I'll take KAJ though!

35 points on 57%/17 rebounds/5 assists in the '71-'72 season. Sick!

He'd be giving Gobert/Davis/Giannis fits with the skyhook!

Adams and Zion may try to bully KAJ, but he can just outmaneuvre them and drill a nice jumper on them too!

[Rolando]

I'll take Kareem. He was simply better than Shaq. He is either the GOAT or number 2. You got to go with that guy.

[Pushxx]

Shaq is easily top 10 all time but no way in hell is the NBA letting him dominate like he used to. The rules are different.

[GimmeThat]

well Shaq can't really play Power Forward, and Center is a position that is prohibited.

[iamgine]

Shaq had a few glaring weakness. Like his FT, which would be abused to death. And they'll try to switch to him every single time on defense.

I think Kareem is the safer pick here.

[Mr Feeny]

For all the problems that big men like Shaq and Kareem would face when being asked to play perimeter defense and switching, who's going to stop them in the post?

Freaking Embiid is a superstar big man in today's league and he isn't 1/50th of what either guy was. How exactly are you going to stop Shaq down low? Putting Harden on him the way Houston put him on Davis a week ago? He would get 70.

[LostCause]

For all the problems that big men like Shaq and Kareem would face when being asked to play perimeter defense and switching, who's going to stop them in the post?

Freaking Embiid is a superstar big man in today's league and he isn't 1/50th of what either guy was. How exactly are you going to stop Shaq down low? Putting Harden on him the way Houston put him on Davis a week ago? He would get 70.

Yeah I don’t know what these nephews are talking about

Prime Shaq today would be unstoppable and routinely getting his opponents into foul trouble. Teams WILL go out and get size to match up with him, just like they did when he actually played. Players that dominant control the pace of the game and no team is going to just let Shaq go to work on undersized bigs

[FKAri]

For all the problems that big men like Shaq and Kareem would face when being asked to play perimeter defense and switching, who's going to stop them in the post?

Freaking Embiid is a superstar big man in today's league and he isn't 1/50th of what either guy was. How exactly are you going to stop Shaq down low? Putting Harden on him the way Houston put him on Davis a week ago? He would get 70.
lol. You're underrating Embiid's talent. He is right there with Hakeem as a talent and that guy held his own against Shaq if I recall. The reality is that the league would decide if they want Shaq to be a superstar or not. It is entirely in the refs' control. He'd pick up ticky tack fouls even easier than AI did on him in 2001 if he tried guarding Harden in space. And the refs will dictate to what extent they limit him in this regard. They can go the other way too and let Shaq clear out the block for quick catch, drop step dunks and make him the GOAT.

[Celtics 1825]

Kareem, everyone keeps saying Shaq would dominate today but you gotta remember how fast the pace is now, his big ass would be totally gassed by halftime

[Reggie43]

Kids thinking Shaq was always fat and slow should try to watch clips of younger Shaq when he was faster and quicker than most centers in the league. Defense wise it all boils down to him being motivated enough to guard the perimeter which he could do if it helps his teams win.

[Soundwave]

You can't really go wrong either way. Either in their prime would be the best player in the league right now by a wide margin.

[SouBeachTalents]

Since OP asked who we draft, Kareem

[Phoenix]

Orlando Shaq would have been a better fit for today's game. Lakers Shaq was more cerebral but wasn't as quick or explosive. Alot of people forget how agile Shaq was when he came into the league, because they mostly remember his Lakers peak when his weight was see-sawing.

Neither version is suitable for switching defenses, but Shaq would be too dominant on offense for any team to not live with that. The post game isn't what it once was, but I see Zion coming in at 6'7 285 and he's already proving to be a load around the rim. Extrapolate from that what 1995 Shaq would be doing. Surround him with shooters on either wing and there's not a thing you could do with him.

All that said, these questions often assume you're just taking the player we know and dumping them into environments their games were never tailored to be in. I don't imagine Shaq has it in his DNA to ever go out and hit a couple 3s a game like KAT, but Kareem was a more skilled-based player so it may be easier to translate his skills within a 2020 context as far as what he could adapt. The skyhook is a timeless weapon though, especially since he had range on it.

[ImKobe]

Shaq is easily top 10 all time but no way in hell is the NBA letting him dominate like he used to. The rules are different.

I'd go the opposite way. The NBA favors the offensive player more than ever. Zion's basically Shaq but 7 inches shorter and he's bullying 7-footers. If Zion can bully Centers at 6-6 285, Shaq would be as dominant, if not more, at 7-1 & 350.

Kareem was perfect for his era & I think he would still be an all-time great today, but it feels like he would be a worse fit for this era. Shaq's the better athlete and he's harder to stop inside.

[Phoenix]

Good luck containing Shaq in a defensive environment where most defenders are more concerned now with protecting the 3point line. The court is so spaced out now that anyone capable of getting deep paint position with any kind of physical edge is going to dominate. If Giannis gets within 5 feet, forget about it. The aforementioned Zion, in essence a baby Shaq physically, is bullying guys around the rim as a rookie. Shaq's going to invert the 3>2 argument because his at-rim numbers are likely to be well north of 75% and I don't think that's an exaggeration. Give him some 3 and D guys and they're instant contenders.

[Lebron23]

Both of the would dominate in this era.

[Kblaze8855]

I’ve Always hated how much footage of the sky hook has tainted idea of what Kareem was. He wasn’t a stationary post scorer. Kareem was a scorer period.

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/VictoriousNegligibleCobra-size_restricted.gif

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/BitesizedRawAyeaye-size_restricted.gif




Every time he’s shown it’s a skyhook when he’s like 37 and bald. You never see clips of that guy and he was that guy way longer than he was stuck to one spot shooting hooks. Even old Kareem was way more mobile than the same stale 5 clips ESPN shows people.

[tontoz]

Both of the would dominate in this era.

Correct. Shaq played against a lot of great centers and dominated. He would surely dominate today.

As Kblaze mention KAJ was more athletic than he gets credit for. He actually did a fight scene with Bruce Lee in a movie lol.

[15yearmagicfan]

Correct. Shaq played against a lot of great centers and dominated. He would surely dominate today.

As Kblaze mention KAJ was more athletic than he gets credit for. He actually did a fight scene with Bruce Lee in a movie lol.



I would take Shaquille 'the real deal' O'Neal.

[Manny98]

Shaq

But I would take David Robinson over both in todays NBA

[Darius]

Wow a legit good question on ISH? What's happened to this board?

It's actually really hard to say because the players wouldn't develop the same in this era. Young Shaq might be Zion-like. He was so athletic, strong and had skills. He could dribble... pass... and - who knows - if he was in an era where people encouraged him to develop a shot, he might have been a passable shooter.

He became big, heavy Shaq because that's the way the league wanted him to be.

Kareem, I didn't watch in person but with his size, agility and skill set, why couldn't he be a much better version of Karl Towns?

[sportjames23]

I can't believe Shaq is getting such blatant disrespect here. But, this is ISH, so I shouldn't be surprised.


Shaq is more suited for today's game, but both he and Kareem would still dominate if they were playing now.

[TheMan]

Shaq would be unstoppable today, as a coach, I would give no fukks if the big Shaq was covering was planted behind the three point line, my bet is that Shaq would annihilate his defensive cover in the post more so than the big taking uncontested threes and hitting them.

[TheMan]

I can't believe Shaq is getting such blatant disrespect here. But, this is ISH, so I shouldn't be surprised.


Shaq is more suited for today's game, but both he and Kareem would still dominate if they were playing now.
I know right. Kids today have no idea how unstoppable Shaq was, one guy couldn't stop Shaq from getting an easy dunk every time, you'd have to double him or he's getting easy looks every time he gets the ball down low. SMH

[Phoenix]

It's actually really hard to say because the players wouldn't develop the same in this era. Young Shaq might be Zion-like. He was so athletic, strong and had skills. He could dribble... pass... and - who knows - if he was in an era where people encouraged him to develop a shot, he might have been a passable shooter.

He became big, heavy Shaq because that's the way the league wanted him to be.



Shaq didn't have the work ethic to stay in shape, don't know about it being a league desire as you suggest. Frankly if Shaq maintained his Orlando physique through 20006 you're probably looking at 6 rings and 4-5 MVPs. He would have been a legitimate challenger to MJ for GOAT. Hell, his 2000-2002 peak might have been better, if you can somehow imagine that.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Kareem for longevity and durability. Shaq was more dominant at his peak but his prime was short, also his body was more injury-prone than Kareem, especially at the current NBA's fast tempo.

[Phoenix]

Kareem for longevity and durability. Shaq was more dominant at his peak but his prime was short, also his body was more injury-prone than Kareem, especially at the current NBA's fast tempo.

Shaq was elite the moment he stepped on the court though. 1992 certainly wasn't his 'prime' but it should be considered in the context of how many seasons he was an elite player, which is 14.

[superduper]

Shaq

But I would take David Robinson over both in todays NBA

:roll::roll::roll:

[superduper]

Wow a legit good question on ISH? What's happened to this board?

It's actually really hard to say because the players wouldn't develop the same in this era. Young Shaq might be Zion-like. He was so athletic, strong and had skills. He could dribble... pass... and - who knows - if he was in an era where people encouraged him to develop a shot, he might have been a passable shooter.

He became big, heavy Shaq because that's the way the league wanted him to be.

Kareem, I didn't watch in person but with his size, agility and skill set, why couldn't he be a much better version of Karl Towns?

A concept 98% of basketball fans can't fathom.

[The Iron Fist]

Shaq was elite the moment he stepped on the court though. 1992 certainly wasn't his 'prime' but it should be considered in the context of how many seasons he was an elite player, which is 14.

Kareem wasn’t elite the moment he stepped on the court? Who turned around their team more in their very first season? Kareem or Shaq?

[Phoenix]

Kareem wasn’t elite the moment he stepped on the court? Who turned around their team more in their very first season? Kareem or Shaq?

How are you interpreting what you quoted as me comparing Shaq and Kareem? I made no reference to Kareem whatsoever. The poster I replied to said that Shaq's prime was short, and I countered that Shaq was elite the moment he stepped on the floor and enjoyed 14 seasons of dominant play.

[The Iron Fist]

How are you interpreting what you quoted as me comparing Shaq and Kareem? I made no reference to Kareem whatsoever. The poster I replied to said that Shaq's prime was short, and I countered that Shaq was elite the moment he stepped on the floor and enjoyed 14 seasons of dominant play.

This is a Kareem Shaq thread. At least it says so in the title. My mistake, I got it completely wrong.

[Phoenix]

This is a Kareem Shaq thread. At least it says so in the title. My mistake, I got it completely wrong.

Yes it is, and I've already spoken to Shaq AND Kareem earlier in the thread. In the post you quoted, I was specifically talking about Shaq. If I wanted to compare Shaq and Kareem directly I would have been very clear in doing so. But no worries on the misunderstanding...

[Manny98]

:roll::roll::roll:
Df are you laughing at

Shaq and Kareem are post scorers which are awful for today's NBA.

Robinson is perfect for today's era as he's athletic af and a best on the pick and roll + Admiral is a better defender than both Shaq and Kareem

[andgar923]

People talking bout "but they can't switch on the perimeter" urr... nobody really can anyway. The rules don't allow bigs to camp and protect the lanes. The rules don't allow them to be physical. The rules don't allow them to do many things defensively.

Which is why they'd dominate even more so today.

I'll take their pure offensive dominance in the paint over switching to a 3pt shooter any day.

They can have their .340% shot, I'll take the .560% one any day. I'll foul out your team by the half or Im averaging .650% and getting bucket after bucket after bucket.

Cause you can't shoot 3s if you're not not he floor due to foul troubles.

Either way, I'd still play my big in the middle and dare refs call anything. They'll eventually stop calling shit and let the game go, while my bigs stay camped and protect the paint. My wing defenders will close out forcing them into my big where they'll alter and block shots repeatedly.

[andgar923]

Wow a legit good question on ISH? What's happened to this board?

It's actually really hard to say because the players wouldn't develop the same in this era. Young Shaq might be Zion-like. He was so athletic, strong and had skills. He could dribble... pass... and - who knows - if he was in an era where people encouraged him to develop a shot, he might have been a passable shooter.

He became big, heavy Shaq because that's the way the league wanted him to be.

Kareem, I didn't watch in person but with his size, agility and skill set, why couldn't he be a much better version of Karl Towns?

This.

[AirBonner]

Shaq would effectively end small ball. Kareem would adapt to small ball. That is the difference

[SouBeachTalents]

Shaq was elite the moment he stepped on the court though. 1992 certainly wasn't his 'prime' but it should be considered in the context of how many seasons he was an elite player, which is 14.
Shaq having poor longevity is legitimately one of the biggest myths surrounding an ATG player. Shaq was elite from his rookie year through roughly '06, a 14 year span, a time frame that literally all but a handful of players were able to match or surpass

[tpols]

Shaq having poor longevity is legitimately one of the biggest myths surrounding an ATG player. Shaq was elite from his rookie year through roughly '06, a 14 year span, a time frame that literally all but a handful of players were able to match or surpass


and it couldve been far longer.

Shaq with a kobe discipline couldve had a 20 year prime.

Hes a true freak of nature... a bulky wilt the likes of which has never been seen before or after.

[AirBonner]

and it couldve been far longer.

Shaq with a kobe discipline couldve had a 20 year prime.

Hes a true freak of nature... a bulky wilt the likes of which has never been seen before or after.

Prime is taking the best years from a career. No player has or never will have 20 “best” years

[tpols]

Prime is taking the best years from a career. No player has or never will have 20 “best” years

shaq couldve.

He put up 14 years of straight dominance without giving a ****.

[SouBeachTalents]

and it couldve been far longer.

Shaq with a kobe discipline couldve had a 20 year prime.

Hes a true freak of nature... a bulky wilt the likes of which has never been seen before or after.
Lol, I doubt anyone is gonna argue he wasn't a lazy bastard, or that he maximized his full potential. But even without dieting or working out all summer, he still managed to have really impressive longevity, especially considering how massive the guy was

[Turbo Slayer]

https://media.giphy.com/media/hDA4U9LK8KXv2/giphy.gif

https://media.giphy.com/media/HAyposFtiQhaM/giphy.gif

Absolute Legends. Salute!

Insanity.

One of the greatest duos of all-time!

I pick Shaq.

[tpols]

https://media.giphy.com/media/hDA4U9LK8KXv2/giphy.gif

https://media.giphy.com/media/HAyposFtiQhaM/giphy.gif

Absolute Legends. Salute!

Insanity.

One of the greatest duos of all-time!

I pick Shaq.



its crazy how kobe crossed up mother****ing scottie pippen in that iconic moment. what a G.

[Phoenix]

Shaq having poor longevity is legitimately one of the biggest myths surrounding an ATG player. Shaq was elite from his rookie year through roughly '06, a 14 year span, a time frame that literally all but a handful of players were able to match or surpass

Exactly. Shaq was more or less a top ten player as a rookie, at a point when MJ, Barkley, Malone, Hakeem, Ewing, Robinson were in their peaks/primes and maintained that status through 2006, with several seasons of being top 3 and a few seasons of being a clear number 1. Immediately boosted the Magic by 20 wins and just lost out on the 8th seed to the Pacers ( same record, I'm guessing their head to head or some other criteria swung it to Indiana).

I maintain that if Shaq had stayed in Orlando shape he would have challenged MJ for the GOAT title, or people would have been debating him with Kareem at #2. It's insane to think he only has one MVP award.

[iamgine]

The thing is after Hakeem/Robinson/Ewing got old, Shaq kind of had no competition at his position while the game was still big man friendly.

[ClipperRevival]

Exactly. Shaq was more or less a top ten player as a rookie, at a point when MJ, Barkley, Malone, Hakeem, Ewing, Robinson were in their peaks/primes and maintained that status through 2006, with several seasons of being top 3 and a few seasons of being a clear number 1. Immediately boosted the Magic by 20 wins and just lost out on the 8th seed to the Pacers ( same record, I'm guessing their head to head or some other criteria swung it to Indiana).

I maintain that if Shaq had stayed in Orlando shape he would have challenged MJ for the GOAT title, or people would have been debating him with Kareem at #2. It's insane to think he only has one MVP award.

I agree with almost everything you say but gotta disagree about the Shaq thing. It would've been impossible for Shaq to be at his Orlando playing days for most of his career for obvious reasons: he didn't fill into his man bones yet when he was in Orlando.

Just like LeBron had a more slender body when he first came in the league and hadn't filled out yet as a man. Yeah, Shaq could've been more disciplined but at his best, ideal weight during his peak/prime, he was still going to be 300+ lbs no matter what. The issue was, he got up to like 320-335 lbs.

[ClipperRevival]

To answer the question, for today's NBA, i would take KAJ. Most people think of KAJ when he was a Laker, when he was way past his prime. Younger KAJ was mobile and athletic as hell. So he would be better able to change ends, defend the P&R, be better at playing the P&R on the offensive end and have a much higher chance of developing a legit 3 point shot as he already had great touch for a big man.

[Phoenix]

I agree with almost everything you say but gotta disagree about the Shaq thing. It would've been impossible for Shaq to be at his Orlando playing days for most of his career for obvious reasons: he didn't fill into his man bones yet when he was in Orlando.

Just like LeBron had a more slender body when he first came in the league and hadn't filled out yet as a man. Yeah, Shaq could've been more disciplined but at his best, ideal weight during his peak/prime, he was still going to be 300+ lbs no matter what. The issue was, he got up to like 320-335 lbs.

2000 was the happy median between his Orlando days and what he ballooned up to. Not coincidentally that's the season most consider his outright peak as a player. The following seasons he started getting too heavy and had to work his way into shape during the year, which drove Kobe nuts. As you said, he could have taken care of himself better than he did.

[ClipperRevival]

2000 was the happy median between his Orlando days and what he ballooned up to. Not coincidentally that's the season most consider his outright peak as a player. The following seasons he started getting too heavy and had to work his way into shape during the year, which drove Kobe nuts. As you said, he could have taken care of himself better than he did.

Yeah, if Shaq had the mindset of an MJ/Kobe out of the womb, he very well might've been the GOAT but he just didn't have it.

[FKAri]

If Shaq could be as serious as Kareem about managing his weight and health, I'd go with him.

I'd want to emphasize his explosive and open court play rather than the bruising low post aspect.